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	<title>Comments on: Advertising Industry Shocked to Learn Gays + Straights Buy The Same Crap</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/</link>
	<description>Free of an agenda. Except that gay one.</description>
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		<title>By: Keith Kimmel</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-232133</link>
		<dc:creator>Keith Kimmel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Nov 2009 21:16:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-232133</guid>
		<description>There are lies, damned lies and then there are statistics. Truer words...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are lies, damned lies and then there are statistics. Truer words&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: hyhybt</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-188462</link>
		<dc:creator>hyhybt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Jul 2009 02:14:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-188462</guid>
		<description>Exactly how would you expect them to include closeted gays?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Exactly how would you expect them to include closeted gays?</p>
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		<title>By: Fitz</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-187354</link>
		<dc:creator>Fitz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 15:18:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-187354</guid>
		<description>We are such a diverse group, I don&#039;t know how they find meaningful interpretations of the data.  Some of us are out, and very comfortable telling people the truth about what we buy.  Some of us are young and are stocking new homes.  Some are raising kids, some are living stereotypes.  Some of us care very much about not buying from sweat shops, or eco- terrorist companies. It&#039;s just all over the map.  The illusion that we are all caucasian DINKs with toy dogs is clearly BS.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We are such a diverse group, I don&#8217;t know how they find meaningful interpretations of the data.  Some of us are out, and very comfortable telling people the truth about what we buy.  Some of us are young and are stocking new homes.  Some are raising kids, some are living stereotypes.  Some of us care very much about not buying from sweat shops, or eco- terrorist companies. It&#8217;s just all over the map.  The illusion that we are all caucasian DINKs with toy dogs is clearly BS.</p>
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		<title>By: scott ny'er</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-187337</link>
		<dc:creator>scott ny'er</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 13:56:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-187337</guid>
		<description>@&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-187333&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;KyleR&lt;/a&gt;: Death threats. That&#039;s a little overly dramatic, no?

Well, you won&#039;t get threats from me. Each to their own but that seems really selfish to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@<a class="atr_link" href="#comment-187333" rel="nofollow">KyleR</a>: Death threats. That&#8217;s a little overly dramatic, no?</p>
<p>Well, you won&#8217;t get threats from me. Each to their own but that seems really selfish to me.</p>
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		<title>By: KyleR</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-187333</link>
		<dc:creator>KyleR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 13:28:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-187333</guid>
		<description>I know this will get me more death threats. But I could care less about the company. If they have a product I want, I&#039;m going to buy it. I really don&#039;t care if it comes from a sweat shop or some robot-lined factory. I really don&#039;t care where when or how they then spend my money. I have what I want and that&#039;s that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I know this will get me more death threats. But I could care less about the company. If they have a product I want, I&#8217;m going to buy it. I really don&#8217;t care if it comes from a sweat shop or some robot-lined factory. I really don&#8217;t care where when or how they then spend my money. I have what I want and that&#8217;s that.</p>
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		<title>By: Topher</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-187325</link>
		<dc:creator>Topher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:59:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-187325</guid>
		<description>I have worked as a consultant in the LGBT market for fifteen years, after working at major mainstream agencies. I am not a marketing consultant who does this just becuase I am gay and purport to know all about the market becuase of it.  My experience is tangible and my results have been exceptional for all my clients.  I consult for gay media outlets, as well as straight, and advise corporations on which product launches make sense for the community.
I
 was also involved in the 1997 Gay and Lesbian Market Study put out by Simmons Media Research Group.  It was the first syndicated study of its kind that provided reputable numbers to media professionals on the self-identified gay consumer.  There was a lot of screeching at the time about that study, too, becuase the numbers skewed affluent and educated.

The problem with so many of these comments I am seeing is that they are looking to these numbers as though it represents them individually. They do not.  They are generalized overviews of a group of people.  You will not match each characteristic perfectly.

Why did they use out people?  Because those are the people we want to market to when we are determining which products will be advertised to the LGBT community.  If they are in the closet, it is generally accepted they have different media habits and purchasing habits and/or power than their out counterparts. It is not beneficial to waste money on experimentation with a consumer who we cannot accurately quantify.

As for the two thirds/one third split of the sample -- there are statistically more gay men in the country than lesbians.  If you want a truly representative sample of the community this is the way it goes.  To analyze lesbian behavior separately than gay male behavior, you would have to have two separate studies.  As it is, you can extrapolate that information from the sample sizes here.

The sample size was more than adequate as well.  In all likelihood, it was culled from the major metropolitan areas where the LGBT community congregates.  The only major problem with a study like that is that it will tend to skew more affluent and educated, and perhaps heavier male. (Just so you know, Scarborough research, a locally driven qualitative syndicated survey of the media habits of consumers uses a sample size of about 1800 for the entire NY metropolitan area, which is about 18 million people.  That methodology is accepted as the gold standard by marketers and agencies alike. In no way was this survey a study of over 18 million.)

The bonus of those statistics for those in marketing is that THOSE are the desirable consumers for high end products.  In an economy that is having trouble selling luxury goods or defining new markets, a study like this will help companies identify efficient and opportune new consumers.

IT IS NOT A POLITICAL survey and should not be used in any to lay the numbers over the national gay popoulation.

If there were a way to count and/or identify the closeted consumer, I would love to kno what it is.  I have been working to figure that one out for ages.  Any suggestions?

TL</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have worked as a consultant in the LGBT market for fifteen years, after working at major mainstream agencies. I am not a marketing consultant who does this just becuase I am gay and purport to know all about the market becuase of it.  My experience is tangible and my results have been exceptional for all my clients.  I consult for gay media outlets, as well as straight, and advise corporations on which product launches make sense for the community.<br />
I<br />
 was also involved in the 1997 Gay and Lesbian Market Study put out by Simmons Media Research Group.  It was the first syndicated study of its kind that provided reputable numbers to media professionals on the self-identified gay consumer.  There was a lot of screeching at the time about that study, too, becuase the numbers skewed affluent and educated.</p>
<p>The problem with so many of these comments I am seeing is that they are looking to these numbers as though it represents them individually. They do not.  They are generalized overviews of a group of people.  You will not match each characteristic perfectly.</p>
<p>Why did they use out people?  Because those are the people we want to market to when we are determining which products will be advertised to the LGBT community.  If they are in the closet, it is generally accepted they have different media habits and purchasing habits and/or power than their out counterparts. It is not beneficial to waste money on experimentation with a consumer who we cannot accurately quantify.</p>
<p>As for the two thirds/one third split of the sample &#8212; there are statistically more gay men in the country than lesbians.  If you want a truly representative sample of the community this is the way it goes.  To analyze lesbian behavior separately than gay male behavior, you would have to have two separate studies.  As it is, you can extrapolate that information from the sample sizes here.</p>
<p>The sample size was more than adequate as well.  In all likelihood, it was culled from the major metropolitan areas where the LGBT community congregates.  The only major problem with a study like that is that it will tend to skew more affluent and educated, and perhaps heavier male. (Just so you know, Scarborough research, a locally driven qualitative syndicated survey of the media habits of consumers uses a sample size of about 1800 for the entire NY metropolitan area, which is about 18 million people.  That methodology is accepted as the gold standard by marketers and agencies alike. In no way was this survey a study of over 18 million.)</p>
<p>The bonus of those statistics for those in marketing is that THOSE are the desirable consumers for high end products.  In an economy that is having trouble selling luxury goods or defining new markets, a study like this will help companies identify efficient and opportune new consumers.</p>
<p>IT IS NOT A POLITICAL survey and should not be used in any to lay the numbers over the national gay popoulation.</p>
<p>If there were a way to count and/or identify the closeted consumer, I would love to kno what it is.  I have been working to figure that one out for ages.  Any suggestions?</p>
<p>TL</p>
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		<title>By: galefan2004</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-187324</link>
		<dc:creator>galefan2004</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:58:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-187324</guid>
		<description>@&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-187220&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Bri&lt;/a&gt;: Economics. The only reason a straight company does such a poll is to determine their profit margin with a group, and gay men still have more disposable income than lesbian women.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@<a class="atr_link" href="#comment-187220" rel="nofollow">Bri</a>: Economics. The only reason a straight company does such a poll is to determine their profit margin with a group, and gay men still have more disposable income than lesbian women.</p>
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		<title>By: andy_d</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-187311</link>
		<dc:creator>andy_d</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:31:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-187311</guid>
		<description>&quot;There are lies, damned lies and statistics.&quot;  - Mark Twain</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;There are lies, damned lies and statistics.&#8221;  &#8211; Mark Twain</p>
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		<title>By: TANK</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-187280</link>
		<dc:creator>TANK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 05:51:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-187280</guid>
		<description>And they are.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And they are.</p>
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		<title>By: Swedish Fish</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-187279</link>
		<dc:creator>Swedish Fish</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 05:48:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-187279</guid>
		<description>It wasn&#039;t 50/50? It&#039;s like saying that gay male buying habits are more important than female ones.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It wasn&#8217;t 50/50? It&#8217;s like saying that gay male buying habits are more important than female ones.</p>
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		<title>By: TANK</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-187233</link>
		<dc:creator>TANK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 00:49:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-187233</guid>
		<description>@&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-187231&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;TANK&lt;/a&gt;: 

Why?  &#039;acause hazin cock is teh good.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@<a class="atr_link" href="#comment-187231" rel="nofollow">TANK</a>: </p>
<p>Why?  &#8216;acause hazin cock is teh good.</p>
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		<title>By: TANK</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-187231</link>
		<dc:creator>TANK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 00:44:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-187231</guid>
		<description>@&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-187220&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Bri&lt;/a&gt;: 

&#039;acause stastically, there are more gays than lesbians.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@<a class="atr_link" href="#comment-187220" rel="nofollow">Bri</a>: </p>
<p>&#8216;acause stastically, there are more gays than lesbians.</p>
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		<title>By: Bri</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-187220</link>
		<dc:creator>Bri</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 23:57:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-187220</guid>
		<description>Why poll more men than women? Why not make it half and half?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why poll more men than women? Why not make it half and half?</p>
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		<title>By: echelon</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-187199</link>
		<dc:creator>echelon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 22:47:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-187199</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s great to see a non-gay company conduct a survey on our buying habits. http://www.echelonmagazine.com</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s great to see a non-gay company conduct a survey on our buying habits. <a href="http://www.echelonmagazine.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.echelonmagazine.com</a></p>
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		<title>By: galefan2004</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-187187</link>
		<dc:creator>galefan2004</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 22:24:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-187187</guid>
		<description>@&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-187178&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;BrianZ&lt;/a&gt;: I never said they were correct. I simply stated them. I said implies and you can conclude. That doesn&#039;t mean that it really said anything, I am just commenting on the spin.

Also, unfortunately, I&#039;m willing to bet that 70% of the gay community honestly does care more about price/quality over gay advertising/friendliness.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@<a class="atr_link" href="#comment-187178" rel="nofollow">BrianZ</a>: I never said they were correct. I simply stated them. I said implies and you can conclude. That doesn&#8217;t mean that it really said anything, I am just commenting on the spin.</p>
<p>Also, unfortunately, I&#8217;m willing to bet that 70% of the gay community honestly does care more about price/quality over gay advertising/friendliness.</p>
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		<title>By: BrianZ</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-187178</link>
		<dc:creator>BrianZ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 21:13:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-187178</guid>
		<description>@&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-187157&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;galefan2004&lt;/a&gt;: Such is the danger of presenting statistics without the relevant background and additional data: There will always be someone who wants to make inferences from what the study didn&#039;t say. You can&#039;t assume anything other than that which is explicitly stated. You don&#039;t know the poll answers were from the other 70%, or even what the scope of possible answers was. 

If anything you can conclude that given some yarn there are people who will always be inclined to assert it is really a sock.

And then so you understand now why your assertions regarding the polling sample are quite likely incorrect?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@<a class="atr_link" href="#comment-187157" rel="nofollow">galefan2004</a>: Such is the danger of presenting statistics without the relevant background and additional data: There will always be someone who wants to make inferences from what the study didn&#8217;t say. You can&#8217;t assume anything other than that which is explicitly stated. You don&#8217;t know the poll answers were from the other 70%, or even what the scope of possible answers was. </p>
<p>If anything you can conclude that given some yarn there are people who will always be inclined to assert it is really a sock.</p>
<p>And then so you understand now why your assertions regarding the polling sample are quite likely incorrect?</p>
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		<title>By: galefan2004</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-187157</link>
		<dc:creator>galefan2004</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 19:36:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-187157</guid>
		<description>@&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-187146&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;BrianZ&lt;/a&gt;: That isn&#039;t what the study really said. It said that if you have two very similar products (in price and quality) and one markets to gays then that is most likely the one the gays will take (duh!). 

However, it also implies that if you have a product that is decent price/quality that just so happens to be made by a homophobic company that it is still most likely the one that 70% of the gay community will take (30% believes that marketing to/accepting the gays is important) over a product that is expensive and lacks quality but is made by a gay friendly company.

If anything, you can conclude from this study that 70% of the gay population doesn&#039;t give a damn about the gay marketing as long as they are getting the product they want for the price they want.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@<a class="atr_link" href="#comment-187146" rel="nofollow">BrianZ</a>: That isn&#8217;t what the study really said. It said that if you have two very similar products (in price and quality) and one markets to gays then that is most likely the one the gays will take (duh!). </p>
<p>However, it also implies that if you have a product that is decent price/quality that just so happens to be made by a homophobic company that it is still most likely the one that 70% of the gay community will take (30% believes that marketing to/accepting the gays is important) over a product that is expensive and lacks quality but is made by a gay friendly company.</p>
<p>If anything, you can conclude from this study that 70% of the gay population doesn&#8217;t give a damn about the gay marketing as long as they are getting the product they want for the price they want.</p>
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		<title>By: BrianZ</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-187156</link>
		<dc:creator>BrianZ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 19:34:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-187156</guid>
		<description>@&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-187145&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;galefan2004&lt;/a&gt;: Now come on ... I don&#039;t want to be taking issue with every post today but I&#039;m guessing your degree program did not require research methods? 

You might be justified in your assumptions about the polling sample but 1) you don&#039;t know how they identifed the respondants 2) we are not told of the geographic data for the sample 3) no statistical reliability data was provided 4)it is possible to ascertain reliable generalizations about a population where those generalizations truly exist. 

And besides, if you are a closet queer, they don&#039;t really care about you in this study anyway as you don&#039;t match the demographic being studied.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@<a class="atr_link" href="#comment-187145" rel="nofollow">galefan2004</a>: Now come on &#8230; I don&#8217;t want to be taking issue with every post today but I&#8217;m guessing your degree program did not require research methods? </p>
<p>You might be justified in your assumptions about the polling sample but 1) you don&#8217;t know how they identifed the respondants 2) we are not told of the geographic data for the sample 3) no statistical reliability data was provided 4)it is possible to ascertain reliable generalizations about a population where those generalizations truly exist. </p>
<p>And besides, if you are a closet queer, they don&#8217;t really care about you in this study anyway as you don&#8217;t match the demographic being studied.</p>
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		<title>By: BrianZ</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-187146</link>
		<dc:creator>BrianZ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 19:25:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-187146</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m queer and I approve of this message.

Anyway, it&#039;s nice to see some statistics support the theory that the queer community does give a damn who markets directly to us. I&#039;m of a belief that as we appear in more commonplace situations, such as regular print ads, commercials, etc. the more acceptance we will see. That and it really makes certain conservative groups foam at the mouth when another company comes out as gay-money friendly.

And I&#039;m slave to noone! The collar chafes me so.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m queer and I approve of this message.</p>
<p>Anyway, it&#8217;s nice to see some statistics support the theory that the queer community does give a damn who markets directly to us. I&#8217;m of a belief that as we appear in more commonplace situations, such as regular print ads, commercials, etc. the more acceptance we will see. That and it really makes certain conservative groups foam at the mouth when another company comes out as gay-money friendly.</p>
<p>And I&#8217;m slave to noone! The collar chafes me so.</p>
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		<title>By: galefan2004</title>
		<link>http://www.queerty.com/advertising-industry-shocked-to-learn-gays-straights-buy-the-same-crap-20090628/#comment-187145</link>
		<dc:creator>galefan2004</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 19:23:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.queerty.com/?p=58923#comment-187145</guid>
		<description>You see the problem here is that they took a poll of 1,452 people that are so open and honest that they have no problem taking such a poll. 

However, that doesn&#039;t represent the vast majority of the gay population across the country. It simply represents the majority in most places where being gay is considered normal (I did not just say that being gay isn&#039;t normal I said that in the vast majority of the regions in this country being gay is very different for people than it is in LA and NYC).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You see the problem here is that they took a poll of 1,452 people that are so open and honest that they have no problem taking such a poll. </p>
<p>However, that doesn&#8217;t represent the vast majority of the gay population across the country. It simply represents the majority in most places where being gay is considered normal (I did not just say that being gay isn&#8217;t normal I said that in the vast majority of the regions in this country being gay is very different for people than it is in LA and NYC).</p>
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