Philadelphia isn’t fucking around with the anti-gay Boy Scouts. The city of Brotherly Love canceled the Scouts’ cushy $1 rent because of their refusal to hire openly gay leaders. And it seems they’ve put a price on discrimination: $200,000. The city has decided that the Boy Scouts chapter here must pay fair-market rent of $200,000 a year for its city-owned headquarters because it refuses to permit gay Scouts.
The organization’s Cradle of Liberty Council, which currently pays $1 a year in rent, must pay the increased amount to remain in its downtown building past May 31,
Now that they have to pay up, Scout officials are playing the “think of the children” card. Scout Spokesman Jeff Jubelirer says “[The money] would have to come from programs. That’s 30 new Cub Scout packs, or 800 needy kids going to our summer camp. It’s disappointing, and it’s certainly a threat.” Boo hoo.
Paul Raposo
The Scouts didn’t think of the children when they went on their anti-gay crusade. Gay adults were once gay kids and I’m sure the Scouts must have their statistical share of gay kids who have to deal with anti-gay prejudice in that enviroment.
Rowen
800 needy kids? The Boy Scouts dosen’t take “needy” kids. You have to have *some* form of steady income to afford just the uniforms and books alone. And summer camp? pppft. Again, you gotta PAY for that shit. The poor kids can just go play hoops at the inner city Y.
Josh
Ok….so everyone here is going to sacrefice me for posting this but I dont care. I am a lifescout and have been in the scouts since I was seven. I am gay (only out to a few freinds) and I think that people are wrong in being so mean to the BSA. I can tell you from experience that the scouts consider any fooling around to be “experimentation” until you turn 18. They wont sacrefic kids for this whole thing. The only scouts (youth) who have ever been kicked out have been kids who want to make some public statement in front of the world. I can tell you that I am a gay guy who would stand up for the organization that has helped me become who I am. did anyone ever think that they are trying to protect kids? I know that all gay men are not out to hunt little boys but in their ignorance, they ARE doing what they are doing because they think its right. Ok….so now you can all tear me up. …..god forbid that I should have an opinion.
Josh
By the way…..the boyscout camp that I go to sponsored 7 of our troop members to camp. If it wasnt for that they wouldnt have gone.
Dax
To Josh
I certainly understand your feelings of allegiance towards the BSA, and it’s certainly admirable.
While I do not support BSA’s choice to discriminate against gay individuals based on sexual orientation, I do support freedom of religion; they are a religious organization that stands for a religion which does not condone homosexual activity. Fair enough, and whatever I may feel on the issue, it certainly is their right to feel that way. I completely acknowledge all the good things that have come of kids growing up in the BSA program, and other than its religious affiliation, I think it could be beneficial to a lot of kids in today’s society.
That being said, what they are doing here is discrimination, either way you paint it. While it’s certainly their perogative to discriminate (even if i disagree with it), it is still illegal. Therefore, as a private organization, they are subject to the same laws and regulations as any other private organization that is not non-profit, and therefore, I believe that the decision is an excellent way to balance the scales in terms of the city not supporting their choice.
Remember, part of making choices and having beliefs is being responsible for those choices and beliefs. If they are going to make choices to discriminate based on a belief they hold, it is also their responsibility to comply with the rest of the choice-making, belief-holding world.
Paul Raposo
“Ok….so everyone here is going to sacrefice me for posting this but I dont care.”
I don’t think anyone will dogpile you, Josh. You made a comment and you were nice about it. It’s usually douchebags who get jumped.
“I am a lifescout and have been in the scouts since I was seven. I am gay (only out to a few freinds) and I think that people are wrong in being so mean to the BSA. I can tell you from experience that the scouts consider any fooling around to be ‘experimentation’ until you turn 18. They wont sacrefic kids for this whole thing. The only scouts (youth) who have ever been kicked out have been kids who want to make some public statement in front of the world.”
Therein lines a problem. Truthfulness is one of the Scout oaths:
TRUSTWORTHY
A Scout tells the truth. He keeps his promises. Honesty is part of his code of conduct. People can depend on him.
Those kids are being truthful, as are you. You should not be punished for that.
“I can tell you that I am a gay guy who would stand up for the organization that has helped me become who I am.”
As a Scout and perhaps, as a gay person. Shouldn’t they be proud of the fact that they helped mold a young boy into an upstanding young man, ready to face society? That is something they should be bragging about. His sexuality should not matter, nor be a hindrance.
“did anyone ever think that they are trying to protect kids? I know that all gay men are not out to hunt little boys but in their ignorance, they ARE doing what they are doing because they think its right.”
I appreciate that and I would hope that if I had kids and they were Scouts, that the Scouts would do everything in their power to protect him from predators. But as you wrote, they are being ignorant if they believe the threat is coming from gay, or even straight men. The real threat are pedophiles. If they came out and said they won’t tolerate pedos, I’d be all like, cool!
Now, as a Scout and a young gay person, how did you feel about all this happening?
“Ok….so now you can all tear me up. …..god forbid that I should have an opinion.”
I don’t think anyone will tear you up, Josh. If they do, readers will let ’em know they’re being arseholes.
hisurfer
If the Scouts are a religious organization they can meet in a Church. If they want to use public facilities they can follow the law of the land. Or they can pay. Even though I was a Scout (and actually enjoyed it until I was 16 or so – I loved getting out in the wilderness every month), I can’t feel pity for them here.
Bill Perdue
Brotherly love kicks ass!
Lambda Legal, the ACLU and NLCR should be encouraged to sue BSA leaders who make homobigoted statements or have antigay policies.
Gaybashing is not just beatings and murders. In a very real sense those terrorist acts are directly linked to antigay policies and statements. Their segregationist policies imply that we’re ‘sinful’, degenerate’, predatory’,’not quite human’, ‘unclean’ and etc. Such policies and statements promote verbal harassment and violence.
Even when they don’t escalate to violence they can lead to wrecked lives, unhealthy levels of stress and self destructive behavior.
If the BSA leaders are religious that’s no problem. Such disorders are easily and effectively treated with antipsychotic drugs.
Rt. Rev. Dr. RES
The Boy Scouts, started by Lord Baden Powell, spread through the UK and the British Empire, including Canada…..and then the USA.
Boy Scouts in Canada are no longer federally subsidised. More, the United Church of Canada no longer has parochial packs or troops. Of course, the Roman Catholic Church continues to support any anti-gay agenda and the Anglicans are the classic via media. Call the parish.
This is too bad. I was a Life Scout and my brothers were both Eagle with palms. The Scout programme taught me many useful skills used in my lifetime. However, I think of all the gay scouts like I was, and I applaud our condemnation of their actions with federal subsidy removal.
Akula
As an eagle Scout and a gay man I saw how the scouts have changed over the years and I’m afraid to say not for the good. Back in the 80’s when I was making my Eagle we had a purge of leaders who were molesting boys all of them were married and most had kids, so the whole gays being peds is crap as we all know. I find it sad that such an outstanding program has been hijacked by a bunch of head cases.
Peter Reins
BSA has an extensive inner city program funding by United Way and other Government grants. It falls under their ScoutReach and/or Learning for Life Divisions, but of which are blind to sexual orientation or religion. Simply not a part of those programs. The issue fo sexual orientation only applies to the Tradition or uniform division. So the Council is correct that the $200,000 rent would have to come from somewhere and most likely it will be coming out of the innner city budget which is paid for by government money.
Secondly, a boy’s supposed orientation is not a reason for exclusion from membership. That policy only applies to adults, and only if the Adult makes an issue of it. There are many gays serving in BSA leadership, many openly. They respect the policy that Scout Leaders are asked to stay away from discussions regarding sexual matters (We do not teach sex ed) and away from Politics.
Thirdly, BSA asks for nothing from any state, county or city agency that is not also available to other non-profit organizations. BSA has been around a long time, in most cases a lot longer than other groups, so it has some sweet deals that have developed over time, but many other groups have the same deals.
The main reason that the Cradle of Liberty Council cannot change its policy is that when it tried to go against the policy a few years ago (when it tried to complly with the city) 85% of the families submitted transfer applications to adjoining councils. They have no control over things.
What most likely will happen here is that either one of its sponsors will step up and pay the rent, or provide BSA with another facility that is also subsidized. In the meantime, the innner city programs will be reduced. Folks simply do not realize how many things BSA does for children in inner cities.
Matt
The Girl Scouts haven’t imploded over their inclusive policies.
The Boy Scouts could learn a lot from them.
Sabrina
Observe the following statements, made by the same person in the same post:
“Gaybashing is not just beatings and murders. In a very real sense those terrorist acts are directly linked to antigay policies and statements. Their segregationist policies imply that we’re ’sinful’, degenerate’, predatory’,’not quite human’, ‘unclean’ and etc. Such policies and statements promote verbal harassment and violence.”
and
“If the BSA leaders are religious that’s no problem. Such disorders are easily and effectively treated with antipsychotic drugs.”
How can the same person decry verbal harassment in one breath and perpetrate it in the next?
Answer: Hypocrisy is pervasive and the vast majority of people are only blind to its existence in themselves.