Heaven loves ya
The clouds part for ya
Nothing stands in your way
When you’re a boy

Clothes always fit ya
Life is a pop of the cherry
When you’re a boy

When you’re a boy
You can wear a uniform
When you’re a boy
Other boys check you out
You get a girl
These are your favourite things
When you’re a boy

Boys
Boys
Boys keep swinging
Boys always work it out

Uncage the colours
Unfurl the flag
Luck just kissed you hello
When you’re a boy

They’ll never clone ya
You’re always first on the line
When you’re a boy

When you’re a boy
You can buy a home of your own
When you’re a boy
Learn to drive and everything
You’ll get your share
When you’re a boy

Boys
Boys
Boys keep swinging
Boys always work it out
(David Bowie)

Interesting that you purport to be upset at how Caz is disrespecting “God” yet you talk so casually about breaking one of the TEn commandments (Thou Shall not Kill). I guess it’s ok to go against God’s law when it’s all about YOU though isn’t it?

When bashers are beating a person to death in a parking lot, they don’t stop to ask how they identify or who you’re attracted too; we’re all “faggots” to them.

When straight trans women or straight trans guys try to marry in places like Texas or Kansas, where courts have decided that sex is determined by chromosones (surgeries don’t matter to them) then they are subject to DOMA. A couple of people have already had their marriages annulled or disinherited because of this.

I’m bi/queer or whatever you want to call it, if I want to marry a cisgender gay guy or another trans woman, DOMA affects that. Even if I get my birth certificate changed, then I can’t marry a cisgender (non-trans) woman, again DOMA affects.

Yeah, there are differences. But but having both lived as a queer man and now a queer trans woman, I think we have more in common than our differences in the way that we are all on the margins of society and systematically discriminated against.

Also, a good number GLB people are discriminated because of their varient gender expression more than their sexuality (a number of butch dykes have been thrown out of women’s bathrooms because they’re have been read as men), and gay men how have been ejected from places for being “too fruity”.

And also, trans people have to deal a lot with sexuality issues. There no hard numbers, but in my personal experience about a third of trans people I’ve met are straight, a third bi and a third gay, that’s even a bigger ratio of queer people in the trans population than the cisgender population.

Even many of the straight trans people usually live as gay men and women in LGBT community before trnasitioning. So they are dealing with sexuality too, especially if they are visibly trans and people treat them as their birth gender, then people treat them as if they are “etremely gay”.

So there are a lot of point where our subjectivities intersect with homophobia, transphobia and misogyny in our society.

Anyway, why are we focusing so much on our differences? I thought the community was about fostering connections and finding common ground. Gays and Lesbians have very different issues a lot of the time, but nobody ever asks why either of those groups are included.

Caleb:

“What is funny is that trans people actually, in a way, have one advantage because there is a way to live your life openly by changing your gender, both physically and legally and then be able to marry and be, as Chaz pointed out, just another straight person.”

It isn’t so simple as that. First off, not all trans people are straight (I’m an example). And unless you can afford or want surgery (some trans people don’t), then you can’t get your documentation changed. If you can’t get you’re documentation changed, you’ll be outed anytime you apply for a job or have to work with official paper work. And not all trans people pass as the gender they identify with. so please don’t assume that transitioning is an automatic ticket to acceptance or so advantageous.

But yes, luckily if some people’s stars align in the right way, then they do have an advantage in a way, but it’s kinda a illusionary one, because in this age of electronic databases w old records can pop up and out you at any moment, I’ve known some people that this has happened too.

I think Chaz is also a perfect example of the correlation because he describes growing up knowing he was attracted to women and lived as a lesbian, but later realized it was much more about the fact he felt he was male and not female and not that he was a lesbian. I mean if you identify as another gender I can’t imagine there isn’t a time where you don’t question whether you’re gay or what the deal is. Physically you know you are one gender and yet you know you are attracted to another gender. I can’t imagine being able to accept and articulate that the reality is you feel you were born the wrong gender comes instantly.

I don’t always understand it either. That is how I connect the two issues. But I agree in reality they are different issues. But from a political perspective, they are the same. Do not treat anyone differently because of the way they were born. What is funny is that trans people actually, in a way, have one advantage because there is a way to live your life openly by changing your gender, both physically and legally and then be able to marry and be, as Chaz pointed out, just another straight person.

Transfolk? Not so straightforward. Chaz *was* a lesbian and was attracted to girls. *Now* Chaz is a straight man who is attracted to girls. But the only thing that has changed is Chaz’ perception of himself.

And therein lies *my* issue: from what I read on trans-friendly sites, being trans is not so much about coming to terms with one’s own sexuality (as it is with being gay/lesbian.) It seems to be more about rectifying one’s identity within the larger non-trans community and the non-trans community’s perception. To me, this seems like a much different, bigger struggle than coming to terms with your own sexuality. Thus, even though my sexuality falls out of the mainstream, I have a hard time understanding the relationship and correlation between the “T”s and the LGBs.

It smacks of something way beyond ‘who one is attracted TO’ and touches on what one sees one’s self as. And it feels violent as well.”

What’s wrong or violent with becoming yourself? People modify their bodies all the time, they have since the beginning of the human race. I changed my physical self to match my inner self. Would you have rather me live in the closet (dying of suffication) and try to change my inner self so my body can live up to your expectations? That’s ex-gay-like bullshit.

I’d bet you would never ask a queer person to not be themselves to make yourself comfortable.

I would also say in all honesty (and not getting confrontational about it) that this is more about your issues about gender and body modification and not about the lives of transgender people. Just like how some straight people have hang-ups/fears about sex and project them on to gay people, you project those fears on to us.

Just like those hang-ups are nothing really to do with gay people, your issues have nothing really to do with trans people. It’s all about you.

I do not exist for you comfort or discomfort.

My dad…

(who was never one to say much of anything to me on a personal level about sexual politics — I mean, what ‘wondering’ parent of an obviously gay 10 year old child ever is?)

…said “Son, I have decided that the right thing to do is to accept people on their terms. If he wants me to think of him as a she, then that’s just fine, and I will.”

What disturbs me is that 30 years later, I still react to so many (not all) transexuals the way I did as a 10 year old.

There is something about the act of changing your physical self (versus your mental landscape) for the purpose of what (?) that I find hard to empathize with. Its like an old person trying to look like a young person, via plastic surgery.

It smacks of something way beyond ‘who one is attracted TO’ and touches on what one sees one’s self as. And it feels violent as well.

This is how I feel, and I hope the dialogue that results from this level of frankness can be enlightening instead of dull.

CAM: you are correct Chaz was indeed disrespecting the Gay community when Chaz first revealed the propsed plumbing change. There was a quote; “we are now just like any other straight couple” That seems like a pretty definite cutting of ties with the Gay community……………….

“she’s” ???
What is that about? Get your sh*t together!

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11.....8;emc=eta1

Listen to the clips on her website – this trans broad is a genius. GLBTI – we can do anything as well if not better than anybody!

http://www.sarabuechner.com/index.html

I was irritated at some of Chaz’s earlier comments because I felt that he was sticking it to the gay community, but now that he has cleared up “Hey, I’m trans, stop expecting me to be gay, lesbian, etc…” I get where his mindset is. Now HOPEFULLY the press will go to Chaz when they need a perspective from a Trans person and not be shocked when he doesn’t want to be a spokesperson for the lesbian community!

http://queersunited.blogspot.com

“…who notes that although HE’S always been a queer activist…”

There, I fixed that for you, Queerty. You should always refer to trans people using the pronouns that match the gender they identify as.