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Claim: Heroes of Newerth‘s Flamboyant Voice Pack Created Intentionally To Sound ‘Faggoty’

The creators of the computer sci-fi adventure game Heroes of Newerth tried playing off their “flamboyant pack” — which replaces the announcer’s voice with a stereotypically queeny one that flashes text in rainbow colors and squeals things like “cherry popper” — as a nod to the gay community, because hey, some gay gamers might want to hear a fey fella calling the shots. But as a former employee of S2 Games explains, that’s not why they released this voice pack. In fact, it was precisely to introduce a harrowing faggot element to game play.

Pu Liu, a senior game designer at the company, tells Gay-Nerds.com that although he’s a straight guy, he plays under the handle “DivA” because “I’m a freaking diva. I’m loud to the border of obnoxious, and I like to sing- poorly, but often and boisterously- anything and everything from Shania to Disney.” He “find[s] the Flamboyant pack to be hilarious, and I select it for use because when I get a ‘Legendary’ streak (5 kills in a row) and it says ‘DIIIIIVA!’ I can go, ‘YES I AM!'”

So that should make things all better, right? Because straight guys act queeny too!

Not so fast. A former S2 Games staffer who was involved in the development of Heroes of Newerth‘s voice packs, says the company’s founder is the one who wanted the queeny voice made available to players. For awful reasons. The anonymous programmer writes:

The “flamboyant” announcer pack was first conceived while I was still at the company, probably around late June/early August. We had been brainstorming ideas for extra content that could be sold in the upcoming store, one of which was the alternate announcers. The direction for this particular one came directly from the owner of the company, which in addition to the obvious baggage was coming shortly after an angry email about how the development team was always rejecting his ideas. Being a programmer, this wasn’t really in my realm of responsibility, but being one of the most senior employees and also just having a deep personal attachment to the project, I tended to get at least a little peek into everything that was going on. I can say that the intent of the “flamboyant” announcer was absolutely unambiguous. The terms “faggoty” and “queer” were used to describe what he wanted the announcer to sound like. Expectedly, this was met with varying degrees of discomfort, but unfortunately nobody was feeling ready to jump on that grenade at the time. The shop was still a long way from actually being implemented, so I personally wrote it off as a battle for another day. Incidentally, at the same time there was direction for another announcer pack that was themed as an even more macho over-the-top sort than the standard one which was to include as one of its phrases “Rape and Pillage!”. Fortunately that line met with a universal disgust and the artist in charge of making the text effects to go with it said there was no way he would be putting that into the game, so hopefully that one is not on the horizon.

Knowing what I do about the origin, I obviously can’t divorce the intent from product and believe that it is “all in good fun” or “has nothing to do with being gay”. Even putting that aside, I can’t feel good about this sort of thing though because this a broadcast to thousands of people that I don’t know. I won’t make any claims to being saint, I certainly push the boundaries of taste sometimes and despite my best efforts I’m sure that my words and actions have offended people. I do make an effort though and a large part of that effort is knowing your audience. It’s not hard to understand that something that might be a hilarious inside joke with my close friends won’t come across the same way to a random stranger. So what this comes down to is essentially creating the gay version of a minstrel show, which is way, way beyond what feels like a suitable “joke” to share with hundreds of thousands of people I have never met and know nothing about. Having this associated with something that I spent so many hours of my life developing is huge bummer.

When making a game for mass audiences — or even just a few people on the web — it’s just common sense to consider how each audience will interpret the elements of your game. And for game makers to ignore the gay demographic (or, worse, acknowledge and then purposefully insult them) isn’t just offensive. It’s bad business. Now as Gay-Nerds notes, the “flamboyant pack is by no means the worst thing to happen to gay people or the gay rights movement. No one is saying that. It is, however, the most recent and one of the most blatant in a long list of the gaming industry’s and gaming culture’s swipes at gay people.” They’re right.

(NB: I’d love a discussion about how you folks feel about games that introduce otherwise stereotypical voices to mimic other minorities, such as blacks and Latinos, using slang to match their characters. Offensive, or true to life? Both?)

So what should S2 Games do? Yank the pack from being available. And apologize. And promise not to do it again. And if the company wants to offer users more customization moving forward, it can either continue releasing packs that aren’t apt to demean an entire community, or let game players record their own soundbites for personal use.

By:           Ryan Tedder
On:           Dec 14, 2010
Tagged: , ,
  • 61 Comments
    • Daez
      Daez

      For the love of all that is holy…

      If you don’t like it don’t buy it, but freedom of speech dictates that they have every right to manufacture and promote it.

      I don’t think we really want to start demanding a censorship war now, do we? I don’t think its a war we can win.

      Dec 14, 2010 at 1:40 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Charlie
      Charlie

      It’s an optional pack, let’s not worry.

      Dec 14, 2010 at 2:02 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Michael C
      Michael C

      Well since that’s okay… let’s go ahead and have a “typical nigger-coon voice.” Something like Amos N Andy.

      You noes, deh suh. I done gawn and won dat der roun’.

      *commence shuckin’ and jivin’*

      Dec 14, 2010 at 2:09 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Daez
      Daez

      @Michael C: If they want to have a “typical ** voice” then by all means they should go for it. Besides, I don’t think you can get nearly as inflammatory towards blacks as the rappers themselves have already done over and over.

      Dec 14, 2010 at 2:18 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • cor
      cor

      @Charlie:

      It’s optional to buy, yes. But when you buy it, it plays for everyone in the game whenever you trigger the announcer.

      For Example:

      Player 1 has the normal announcer pack
      Player 2 bought the flamboyant pack
      Players 3,4,5,etc. have the Pudding Pack

      Player 2 kills Player 1 and gets First Blood in the game.

      Player 1,2,3,4,5,etc. will hear “CHERRY POPPER!”

      So yes, optional to use but not optional to hear. It was meant to harrass.

      Dec 14, 2010 at 2:35 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Sam
      Sam

      I wonder why we had to wait to hear that it was meant to be offensive for us to decide that it was offensive. I think that equating gays with cherry popping and threesomes is offensive whether it was intended or not. And while I don’t think that they should be forced to restrict their freedom of speech by not being allowed to do this, it’s our job to let them know that it’s an irresponsible way to use that freedom.

      Dec 14, 2010 at 3:06 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Daez
      Daez [Different person #1 using similar name]

      @Sam: We let them know that its an irresponsible way to use that freedom when we don’t buy the product. See, now wasn’t that difficult!?!

      Dec 14, 2010 at 3:23 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • RomanHans
      RomanHans

      So which straight guy is responsible for the game box looking like Liberace’s bathroom mirror?

      Dec 14, 2010 at 3:34 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Dillons
      Dillons

      @Daez: Stop being so flippant; it doesn’t look good on anyone, especially you. Freedom of speech works both ways; People can make a stupid voice pack for a video game, but people are just as welcome to complain about it and call it out for the crap it is. One’s freedom is not compromised when others openly challenge what one says or does.

      That’s not too dofficult to understand, is it?

      Dec 14, 2010 at 3:44 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Michael C
      Michael C

      @Daez:
      What’s wrong? You can’t write the word “nigger” when discussing these issues? It’s almost as if you think some things shouldn’t be said, no matter what the context or reason. But certainly YOU don’t think such a thing, do you? I thought you were all about freedom of speech and such?

      Dec 14, 2010 at 4:00 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • John
      John

      @Daez: I really could care less about this too. However, freedom of speech isn’t an issue here as nobody is calling for government intervention that I’m aware of. Freedom of speech doesn’t give one the right to not be offended nor to have criticism of one’s speech silenced. Folks are just as free to protest and boycott this game manufacturer as the company is to sell “anti-gay” material.

      Dec 14, 2010 at 4:43 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Greg Garavani
      Greg Garavani

      Am I the only one that finds this comical?

      Dec 14, 2010 at 6:14 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • hephaestion
      hephaestion

      Name names for us. Who is responsible for this? Let me begin to dismantle and destroy his career.

      Dec 14, 2010 at 8:57 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Hilarious
      Hilarious

      Typical racist Queerty commenters once again spitting on blacks. Nevermind black gay people and black allies, we don’t matter right?

      Stomp on us to spew racism because everyone knows it’s black people taking your rights, only black people are homophobic, and being that black people are the majority in the nation it stands to reason that there are more homophobic black people in America than anyone else.

      Oh wait.

      Morons.

      Dec 14, 2010 at 8:58 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Kev C
      Kev C

      @Hilarious: They’re not the majority in the US, except in dangerous places like Newerth, New Jerthy.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 12:00 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • AugustLA
      AugustLA

      @Daez: thelove of all that is holy? nothing “holy” your fairy tale make belief religion does not exist. Stop shoving it down our throats, you catholic wack job. EVERY time you comment on a gay related story, you side against the gay side and insert a Biblical touch. Take that Bible and shove it where the sun don’t shine, dear. Because we gays are free thinking and don’t buy the brainwashing we were fed as children, unlike you.

      And folks, ignore the Daez character. He’s a over zealous religious individual who has great disdain for all things gay, and tries to hide it behind one of the amendments, his religion, or highly offensive blanket statements. Look for it and you’ll see exactly what I’m reffering to in his commentary.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 12:31 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Viral
      Viral

      hmmm… funny; there is a whole slew of comments where the resident crowd uses stereotypes to decide which twin is a homo and it’s all fun and games; yet when it’s a literally a game in question, using stereotypes is offensive. That makes sense <_<

      Added irony, 90% of the offended wouldn't even know about the game (considering another stereotype; gays don't play video games) if not for the bitching about the campy voice. Really, the voice is offensive only if you let it be.

      And for the masses not in the know; online gamers are generally assholes (nothing line anonymity to give an otherwise wimp a major set of balls) , whose go-to insult is the oh-so-original "fag". So kicking their asses at the own game and having it announced in a gloriously camp fashion is far more satisfying than you'll ever know. Cherry Popper indeed :D

      Dec 15, 2010 at 1:06 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • SteveAtlanta
      SteveAtlanta

      @AugustLA: Thank you for being one of the few posters to call out Daez today. Their troll activity is rightfully being exposed. I’m actually very keen on his activity and game now. He’s far more conservative leaning than he leads on to believe, has a very calculating agenda of watering down every gay discrimination story with a ploy to get us all to “just move on. get over it. nothing we can do.” He’ll thrown in an amendment tirade, and with a hope and wishful thinking attempt to get us all to not combat ill will, prejudice, injustice, and inequality toward gays. Couple that with constant refrences to his being gay, and you’ve got the perfect formula for a conservative out on an agenda to change minds on a gay blog that is all about activism and seeing change. His notion of change is doing as the hetros say and the hetros are always right. This is a troll. We’ve had plenty before, we’ll have plenty more trolls in the future, but the current resident is Daez.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 2:28 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Ryan
      Ryan

      @ Viral

      I second that.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 4:24 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Michael C
      Michael C

      @Hilarious:

      And you are possibly even stupider than Daez.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 8:51 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Brutus
      Brutus

      @SteveAtlanta: His goal is to encourage you to start thinking critically about your responses to things instead of flying into absolute hysterics at the slightest provocation. Was AugustLA’s screed against religion really necessary just because Daez used a certain turn of phrase? That’s all this blog ever does, is diss on people who aren’t already atheist supporters of absolute equality for gays (and I don’t say LGBT because there’s always a lot of trans-bashing in these threads, about how we’d be “better off” and “farther along” without them and we “don’t have anything in common with them”). That’s not helpful. We need to continue to change people’s minds and convince them that our side is right in order to keep making progress — not just force those we don’t agree with to shut up.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 8:56 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • KATHY
      KATHY

      @Michael C: Using that word makes you feel better about yourself right? Let me piss on another minority group, then I won’t feel so hated by everyone in the world, right?. Guess what Mikey? Bigots hate both groups, and you Mikey, are a BIGOT1

      Dec 15, 2010 at 10:20 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • KATHY
      KATHY

      @Michael C: And you are probably smaller and more stupid than both of them combined

      Dec 15, 2010 at 10:22 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Michael C.
      Michael C.

      @KATHY:
      What a tiresome, thoughtless little person you are. I’m sorry your knee-jerk reaction to one word, “nigger,” while you think the discussion of another word, “faggot,” makes you even more retarded than a Palanite. Please get over your political correctness and patronizing attitude towards black people. If gay people can hear and discuss faggot without melting and falling apart, then blacks can hear and discuss nigger without falling apart. They are the same thing. Get the fuck over it you silly cunt.

      If pointing out to Daez and idiots like you that your love of the First Amendment when it comes to denigrating gays is utter hypocrisy (because you think blacks need special protection that gays don’t) makes me a racist, then so be it. The opinions of morons like you are as irrelevant as the opinions of teabaggers.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 10:57 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Tralala Haha
      Tralala Haha

      @KATHY:
      Jane, you ignorant slut. Get back in the kitchen where you belong and make some pie for the men.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 11:14 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • KATHY
      KATHY

      @Michael C.: My comment stands! Take a Xanax. Or maybe your need to use the N word constantly is your XANAX. Point is all minorities suffer from being discriminated against, so don’t be a bigot, that’s all.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 11:41 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Mike
      Mike

      @Tralala Haha: Be nice.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 11:50 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • James
      James

      @Michael C.: Stop using racial slurs and sexist insults. Not cool man.Interesting point though.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 11:57 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Hilarious
      Hilarious

      @Michael C.: Yeah yeah. Enjoy your internet anonymity, little boy. The only place you can get away with being an ignorant piece of shit.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 11:57 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Daez
      Daez [Different person #2 using similar name]

      @Dillons: I agree. However, the demand was that this product not be made. I’m all for you calling this product crap and refusing to buy it (freedom of speech). I’m not all for you demanding that the product not even be made (trying to stifle the freedom of speech of others). See the difference?

      Dec 15, 2010 at 11:57 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Daez
      Daez [Different person #2 using similar name]

      @Michael C: I am exercising my freedom of speech by choosing not to use such a word. I support your right to say it while I choose not to say it though.

      @Hilarious: Extremely well said!

      @AugustLA: Go ahead and declare war on religion bro. Let me know where that gets you. So far, it has gotten us several anti-gay marriage amendments, prop8, DADT and DOMA. Every single one of those happened because the gay community tried to force its way past the “fairy tales” that had taken power for over 2000+ years.

      Rather you like it or not, rather you want to believe in it or not, religion is needed as part of society and your ability to be an atheist doesn’t mean that you don’t believe in religion, it simply means that you hate religion. If you didn’t believe in religion you wouldn’t be so focused on it at every given turn.

      @SteveAtlanta: YOU GIVE ME TO MUCH CREDIT! Rather you like it or not, we aren’t getting anywhere with a war against the straight community. Keep fighting your war and see how far it gets you.

      @Brutus: Thanks for getting my back. Actually, my main concern is to just keep people talking. I’m sure you can all notice there are certain topics I don’t go near, but most of the stuff posted here is quite easy to play devil’s advocate.

      @Michael C.: The two words are not even close to the same thing. Please tell me how the word FAGGOT brings up centuries of slavery and true inequality. When they kick you out of every business and try to own your ass for being gay you might have something. Till then, STFU!

      Oh and my love of the first amendment applies to ALL situations. Unlike you, I’m not a bloody hypocrite. If this topic was about a game refusing to let a gay friendly dialogue take place, I’d be bitching about that too.

      Is it really that hard to understand that certain ideals such as freedom of speech and expression need to be a two way street.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 12:13 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • KATHY
      KATHY [Different person #1 using similar name]

      @Tralala Haha: YES SIR1

      Dec 15, 2010 at 12:16 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • KATHY
      KATHY [Different person #1 using similar name]

      @Michael C.: Funny you mention teabaggers in your flowery comment.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 12:22 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • justnow
      justnow

      gay has to do with sexuality… so it is impossible to create a gay with a gay character unless she or he has a partner or has a already created personality…. games for ages been putting the ‘flamboyant’ for gay characters in games- – So either read comics and play story-lined games or even erotic games or make your own if you want a gay character. Designers can do such with the evidence shone over the years

      Dec 15, 2010 at 12:26 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Michael C.
      Michael C.

      @KATHY:
      Funny you think you aren’t the same as them. Because you are, Blanche, you are!

      Dec 15, 2010 at 12:33 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Michael C.
      Michael C.

      @Hilarious:
      You ARE hilarious, punk, I’ll give you that.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 12:34 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Michael C.
      Michael C.

      @James:
      Try to focus on the point. The hysterical reaction to one word and not another, even in the context of a discussion about First Amendment Rights and what kind of speech is acceptable is incredibly telling. You Americans really, really need to get over your fear and learn to talk about these things. Words are just words and the magical taboo you give one over *all* the others is just plain weird.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 12:37 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • James
      James

      @Michael C.: I get your point man and it’s frustrating how Homophobia is not as frowned upon as racism. It’s the height of double standards, if you ask me. I, however wouldn’t just throw around hateful slurs to get my point across,you know.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 12:58 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • ChrisM
      ChrisM

      @James:

      Agreed. But I think Michael C’s frustration comes especially from all of the gay posters who aren’t frowning upon homophobia. Look at the first version of this article. So many people are saying “it’s all in good fun, no harm meant.” Well now a source close to the owner is saying it WAS meant to be homophobic.

      It makes us look stupid and weak when so many people from our community will laugh along with homophobes. They’ll call each other fags. They’ll accuse others of being gay themselves when a homophobic remark is made, as if it were an insult. I want equal treatment and respect, if anybody else does I suggest people stop being so self-loathing and blind.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 2:37 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Eric Cartman
      Eric Cartman

      @KATHY:
      So where’s the pie? All the men here are waiting for it. I hope you didn’t wander out of the kitchen.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 5:29 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Kyle M.
      Kyle M.

      Go Michael C… preach it! NO MORE NICE GAY GUY. It’s time to speak our mind, get EQUALLY as loud as the haters, and stop being seen as weak, spineless, twats. To you weak, spineless, twats who let language like “fag” get by with out having a screaming match, educating and schooling those who think it’s acceptable to be homophobic in our society without any serious backlash…step the F out of our way. You weak bunch of sheep are taking space on our planet and sadly will benefit from the gains made by ACTIVE, LOUD, AND RELENTLESS gays who will *NOTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT* be treated as second class citizens any longer. Hear that Daez. You are nothing more than a self loathing homo here to get your kicks on this site, and don’t think everyone hasn’t seen through your BS.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 5:44 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • KATHY
      KATHY [Different person #2 using similar name]

      @Eric Cartman: Oh it’s cooking. I want to make sure it’s perfect before serving it to my superior REAL MEN like you!I mean I am just some girl. I know how to zip it when a real man speaks. Feel better?

      Dec 15, 2010 at 6:08 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • SteveAtlanta
      SteveAtlanta

      Kathy is Daez folks. This troll is posting under various handles. He is one hilarious, (in his misery, and self loathing) troll who is too insecure in his own thought process to stand on his own two legs so he fabricates various screenames on the comments section here…they all almost always lack any empathy toward the gay cause, are always rationalizing why the other side is in the right, and it’s especially humorous when they loose it and start going bonkers with illogical statements like his latest troll spawn, Kathy above. Do not be alarmed by the number of posts that make you go “huh?”…the writing (and writing style) is on the wall. It’s Daez.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 6:22 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • David
      David

      “That is totally inappropriate for this video.” – Interviewer. Hilariously awkward.

      The game makers are ignorant douche bags.

      Dec 15, 2010 at 7:06 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Dino
      Dino

      @Daez: How is saying, “This is offensive and hurtful, please stop” censorship?

      Dec 16, 2010 at 12:47 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • FreshFit
      FreshFit

      @Dino: You’re just going to go in circles with Daez. I told him in the Lance Bass page that I respect his comments there because he didn’t try to go against the grain for once and was supportive and positive, but this post is the side of him that is not understanding, lacks compassion, and empathy for what it means to be a second class citizen. Acknowledging it is not where it should stop, anger is a natural state of response, and sometime passion fuels fire to get the necessary results. His lack of passion for any and all gay issues makes it hard to not see he’s completely dehumanized to what we speak. I don’t know if I’d call him a troll, because maybe deep down there is a good person, but he seems to have no mind for how others feel.

      Dec 16, 2010 at 3:05 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Hilarious
      Hilarious

      @ChrisM: How exactly is posting racial slurs against black people helping anything?

      He’s frustrated at white nerds who made the game so it’s time to post nigger all over the place?

      Oh and FYI Michael C, those same nerds most likely say nigger all the time like the majority of white gamer geeks.

      So what exactly is your point?

      Racism is alive and well just like homophobia. It didn’t go away. Guess what else gender is still a huge issue too.

      It’s not all about you and there’s absolutely no reason to be attacking black people with slurs. It’s utterly hypocritical and childish as well as unprovoked considering the people who this article is about are WHITE.

      And if you think the gaming industry isn’t well over 95% white you are sadly mistaken.

      I was studying to be a programmer, the racism drove me out. I heard nigger far more than I heard fag.

      So what exactly drives your supposed tit for tat? You don’t want to be called a racist yet you act like a racist. Get real.

      Dec 16, 2010 at 9:19 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Michael C.
      Michael C.

      @Hilarious:
      Pointing out that there is one standard for homophobic language (it’s bad, but free speech!) vs. racist language (oh noes, you can NEVER use that word even in a discussion about that word) is hardly attack black people. It’s attacking a double-standard. And, please, bitch, don’t use the “fact” that 95% of the gaming industry is white as a distraction. 95% of the hip-hop industry is black and they seem to love, love, love the word faggot. I bet you aren’t so hysterical about that and I bet you don’t feel the need to use a string of asterix to write the word faggot as you expect others to do when writing the word nigger. Oh, jeez, I did it again. I wrote the magical, special word that you are under the delusion is more special and bad than any other word in the language (or any other language.) Sorry, dear, but homophobia is JUST as bad as racism and until you acknowledge that fact, you are just part of the problem.

      Your pathetic hypocrisy is disgusting, but no surprise.

      Dec 16, 2010 at 10:19 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • tjr101
      tjr101

      The announcement sounds stereotypical of a like a white gay guy.

      Dec 16, 2010 at 11:05 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Ceaser in SF
      Ceaser in SF

      @Hilarious: This isn’t the first time I’ve seen people in our community do this. Why do we keep comparing ourselves to them? Truth is most black people, just like other races are homophobic. I learned a long time ago that, just because a black person has experienced discrimination doesn’t make him/her empathetic to us. Most of them think we are choosing our “disgusting lifestyle” and therefore don’t see the similarities in our fights.We are giving them power over us by making them our GOLD standard. If black people don’t want anything to do with us, why should we keep aligning ourself with them. This pisses me off so bad. The N word is such a BIG GIG deal yet the F word is dispensable. Just amazing. Michael C has a point but I get why you see an element of racism in his entry.

      Dec 16, 2010 at 11:12 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Hilarious
      Hilarious

      @Michael C.: There you go being racist yet again.

      I don’t listen to rap. I don’t assume like you to know that all rappers are homophobic and saying “faggot” and unlike you I don’t sweep a group of people up by skin color and claim they’re all homophobic.

      You are in fact racist while playing the victim and crying about homophobia.

      It never occurred to you in your infinite stupidity that I have to deal with both HOMOPHOBIA and RACISM.

      You cannot compare being gay to being of a certain race. Gay people make up all races, all skin colors, all ethnicities.

      Why are you too thick to get that?

      Why do you only harp on blacks and act as if no one else is homophobic?

      You defend white homophobes and distract from the issue on this article by saying “WELL BLACKS.” and then projected it on to me.

      This article is about white homophobes. You changed it to black homophobes(fictional at that based on making up a straw man) as a defense.

      So why are YOU so determined to defend the white homophobes who hate you in this article?

      This article is not about black people, slurs, or tit for tat.

      And please stop pretending you are not racist. You are. Just by claiming that ALL BLACK PEOPLE are homophobic and then hurling a hateful in your so called frustration slur is in fact very racist on both counts.

      What about my frustration in this community I have to fight to be apart of when white gay men so freely hate ME(like you are doing repeatedly) because of my skin color?

      Oh but that doesn’t count right?

      You’re insulting ME, you’re sending slurs to ME. Those homophobes you’re going on and on about aren’t here reading it. Gay black men on the other hand are. So why did you think it was appropriate to call us niggers?

      Why do you think black people are the only homophobes on the planet and why are you constantly defending white homophobes as well as acting as if other homophobes of all races do not exist?

      Everyone with brown skin is not in the music industry. Are you really that thick? You’ve boiled an entire group of people down to a genre of music that you claim not to like but somehow listen to enough to hear them calling you a faggot on more than one occasion.

      Your posts are literally so stupid I can’t even fathom what goes on in your skull. To say an entire group of people based on skin color is homophobic is just plain stupid.

      Anyone agreeing with your posts is just as stupid.

      If saying faggot is ok then why was Isaiah Washington publicly dragged through the mud and defended by no one on staff? Uh probably because it’s not ok.

      So where are you getting this idea that no one cares if you say faggot but raise hell if you say nigger?

      Dog the Bounty Hunter said nigger and still has his job. Did you see him do a PSA about hate, respecting black people, equality, or anything else? No.

      You’re making shit up as an excuse to spread hate and intolerance of black people. You sound like a Stormfront lackey.

      Dec 16, 2010 at 11:47 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Hilarious
      Hilarious

      @Michael C.: Actually you know what, I’m done with you anyway.

      It’s clear to me you don’t go outside and interact with real people. The fact that you have to cite rap music as your example of homophobia and think you can claim all black people including gay black people and black allies as being homophobic proves you don’t know any black people at all.

      So you sit on the internet and cry. Cry all day long about people supposedly hating you. In reality most people of any color don’t give a fuck, don’t know you’re gay, and won’t know you’re gay unless you tell them.

      The fact of the matter is most people on the planet think we’re disgusting, but you’re too busy shooting yourself in the foot being hung up on skin color.

      Have fun with that. Hide in your room in front of a computer screen going on and on about how the blacks with all the power in this country are taking away your rights and calling you names.

      You’re so full of shit it’s not even funny anymore. You’re just sad, lonely, desperate, and pathetic. Maybe one day you’ll make some friends of differing “races” and see not everyone “hates you”. And maybe just maybe you’ll think about more people than just yourself. You might even see there’s more hate out there than just homophobia.

      Dec 16, 2010 at 11:55 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • ChrisM
      ChrisM

      @Hilarious:

      I don’t see where in my post I ever talked about racial slurs.

      For what it’s worth, though, I agree with Michael C’s last comment. Racism and homophobia are equally abhorrent – as is anybody hating someone for what they are and not who they are. But there is certainly a difference in the way most of society views the two. Homophobia is often looked on as a valid opinion to have, not just a hateful one. While both racism and homophobia are protected by free speech, there’s a big difference in social approval of the two. Look at how it is a federal offense for employers to discriminate based on race, yet there is still debate going on as to whether or not employers should be allowed to discriminate based on sexual orientation. And our government is giving the homophobes a pulpit to speak at.

      The point that I’m trying to make, and that I think Michael C is trying to make, is that we shouldn’t lie down while people walk over us. The comparison to race is to show how much of a big deal this would be if directed at another minority group, and how idiotic some gays are being for passing this off as good fun. I’m not advocating racism, just like no intelligent person in our community should if they want to be treated as a real citizen some day.

      Dec 16, 2010 at 12:09 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • ChrisM
      ChrisM

      @Hilarious:

      “Cry all day long about people supposedly hating you. In reality most people of any color don’t give a fuck, don’t know you’re gay, and won’t know you’re gay unless you tell them.”

      This is an ignorant comment, you seem to be falling in line with the other self-loathing gays. Yes, gays have it so great because they can hide their sexuality from the world. That is why so many gay children commit suicide – because they’re so excited at the prospect of having to hide who they are from some people in order to be respected.

      Dec 16, 2010 at 12:14 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • KATHY
      KATHY [Different person #3 using similar name]

      @Hilarious: I said this yesterday. I think the guy uses racist and sexist words to make himself not feel so small. He called me all sorts of sexist slurs because I pointed out that obvious fact. He is a coward who types in slurs he can’t say in public! He knows can get his fat ass kicked back to yesterday if he tried that.

      Dec 16, 2010 at 12:21 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Hilarious
      Hilarious

      @KATHY: Exactly. It’s really sad and a desperate cry for attention. I’d love to know who all these black people are rallying against gay people day in and day out are.

      Topping it off with sexism is extremely ugly and childish(as well as hypocritical but that goes without saying.)

      They claim to be fighting for rights but the rights of whom? Only gay white men? The rest of us aren’t welcome?

      @ChrisM: I never even said that. Do you people practice straw man 101 all day long or something?

      I never said hide. I said you are not the center of anyone’s universe. Everyone walking down the street is not instantly paying you attention saying “Ugh, there’s a gay guy.”.

      Believe it or not gay people do exist in the world without everyone they come across hurling a slur or saying something ugly. Most people don’t have enough time in the day to care what you are doing.

      The only time you really hear anything homophobic is in a discussion about homosexuality. Those discussions rarely take place day to day for most people.

      I didn’t say anything ignorant. You’re looking for something to argue about to excuse the blatant racism going on in these comments. That’s ignorant.

      There’s never an excuse for racism just like there’s never an excuse for homophobia. If you agree with him, which you clearly do, you are the one being ignorant.

      You do not end hate with hate. You do not stereotype an entire group of people as homophobes and use that as a justification for racial slurs.

      It should be common sense.

      It’s cowardly and disgusting to hurl slurs around because you feel one group is supposedly more protected than another. Especially since there’s no special protection for black people.

      I already made the parallel to Dog the Bounty Hunter saying nigger and keeping his job without any public humilatian and Isaiah Washington saying faggot and losing everything on top of being humiliated.

      Micheal’s little crybaby argument has no legs. So what exactly are you agreeing with?

      Why did you choose to ignore the actual topic which is these white programmers who are in fact homophobic, racist, and sexist?

      You defend white homophobes and rage against black homophobes you don’t even see.

      Got any slurs for white people who say faggot? Nope. Because then you’d actually be on the receiving end, something that you feel is ok for black gay commenters in this thread.

      Dec 16, 2010 at 1:15 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • ChrisM
      ChrisM

      @Hilarious:

      Maybe you didn’t say hide, but you said people “won’t know you’re gay unless you tell them,” suggesting this made homophobia less painful. In fact, for kids who hide their sexuality because they are ashamed and scared of ridicule, this has had horrible consequences. Moreover, the statement is completely wrong. Gay bashings (a form of homophobia that does not occur just in “conversation,” as you stupidly claim) happen to people who have not told their sexuality to the attacker.

      Your strawmen are actually a lot more egregious. First of all, Dog the Bounty Hunter’s show was canceled when he was caught on tape saying “nigger.”

      More frustrating is your inability to get my point. I never defended the men who created this game. I’ve been bemoaning all the gays who are defending the package as “good fun.” I’ve gotten that this was a homophobic construction form the start. Moreover, I never said one thing about all black people being homophobic! I agreed with Michael C. that there are double standards about homophobia and racism, and there are. That does not make me racist. That just makes me mad that society is too stupid to not see the parallels, and continues to think that homophobia can be justified.

      For all your spouting of how gays have no real hate to deal with, you seem to be making me into a racist for saying absolutely nothing disparaging about black people. Take a dose of your own medicine, buddy.

      Dec 16, 2010 at 3:04 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Hilarious
      Hilarious

      @ChrisM: Wow you’re a complete idiot.

      You agreed with his posts but clearly didn’t read them.

      If you agree with any part of his comments then you agree with the racism he spewed that went along with it.

      You didn’t speak up, you chose to defend it. That makes you a racist.

      Take a dose of reality, jackass.

      Clearly racism does not bother you. Yet you can cry like a little bitch about homophobia.

      Faggot.

      Dec 16, 2010 at 11:27 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • ChrisM
      ChrisM

      @Hilarious:

      Thank you for telling me what I think. I defended my own comments and beliefs, never defended racism.

      I’d guess that everybody’s a little bit tired of your completely ridiculous and antagonistic remarks, Hilarious. I’m the one who’s a hateful, terrible person, yet you resort to calling me a bitch, a jackass and to cap it all and somehow make yourself feel better, a faggot. You might be the biggest hypocrite I’ve ever met. And good job being an example of the REAL focus of disparagement of my comments, the self-loathing gays.

      Dec 17, 2010 at 6:50 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Ohma
      Ohma

      Wow, uh maybe I’m just not reading these comments correctly but it seems like this is an argument over mostly nothing. Well, not mostly *nothing* per se, but like…uhh…crap

      Like maybe both groups are arguing pretty much the same thing but are assuming that the other is very much opposed to their point of view since it’s easy to do that on the internet. I mean, yeah, it does stymie discussion about bigotry (and by extension, how to respond to/address it in society) if you’re not allowed to mention ways in which it’s spread (language, in this case), but it seems to me that responding to people who would prefer that language not to be used (what with it being offensive due to it usually being used by people who are bigoted as a means to verbally antagonize others) with more of it is uhh…counter productive, to put it politely.

      not to say imply that nobody in these comments has iffed me out, i don’t know how i’m *not* supposed to interpret “blacks are only the majority in dangerous places” as “blacks being the majority makes a place dangerous hurf durf” :/

      Dec 17, 2010 at 11:44 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jonathonz
      Jonathonz

      Kinda who cares? It’s lame anyway…

      Dec 26, 2010 at 10:31 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·

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