Sometimes things just make perfect sense: “Arizona’s controversial anti-immigrant law was written by a lawyer [Kris Kobach] at the legal arm of the Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR), which the Southern Poverty Law Center has listed as an anti-immigrant hate group since 2007.” [SPLC]
Hate Group Responsible for Arizona’s Hateful Immigration Law
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Jaroslaw
I’m going to look at FAIR’s website to be sure they’re a hate group.
But simply being against illegal immigration does not make one a racists or elitist or whatever. This topic has come up on this site many times and the fact of the matter is there are pluses and minuses to both sides but mostly I think there is a lot of information about immigration that the general public is not aware of.
I’ve said many times I work in the welfare department of my state and the public would be shocked if they knew how much of the “store” was being given away.
james_in_cambrdige
@Jaroslaw: That may very well be. But you don’t know what you’re unleashing by allowing the police to demand papers from every suspicious (read: brown skinned) person they see. This is nothing less than Gestapo tactics, which people would realize if they knew as much history as they do trivia on Lindsay Lohan. Build a wall stretching from California to Texas: refuse welfare (not emergency medical care but monetary welfare) to Illegals: go after those who’ve overstayed their visas: but do not enforce this Arizona bill!! We’re unleashing a nightmare on a specific group, demanding that even those Mexicans born here carry papers with them at all times or face possible interment until proven to be citizens. THIS IS NOT FASCIST ITALY OR GERMANY! WE DON’T ARREST PEOPLE & HOLD THEM BECAUSE THEY DON’T HAVE PAPERS PROVING CITIZENSHIP IN THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA!! Jesus!!!!
Bill Perdue
@Jaroslaw: Maybe this will help -“The Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR) is almost certainly the most-quoted immigration restriction organization in America. … The founder, chief ideologue and long-time funder of FAIR is a racist. Key staff members have ties to white supremacist groups, some are members, and some have spoken at hate group functions. FAIR has accepted more than $1 million from a racist foundation devoted to studies of race and IQ, and to eugenics — the pseudo-science of breeding a better human race that was utterly discredited by the Nazi euthanasia program. It spreads racist conspiracy theories.”
But that won’t help if you think there are two sides to this question. There aren’t. Just as any oppositon to same sex marriage is bigoted any opposition to firness for imported and immigrant workers is racist.
Bubba
Fair is not a hate group!
Jaroslaw
Thanks for the info Bill – I haven’t had time to research FAIR
James & Bill – I said there are a lot of issues regarding illegal immigration – so yes there are two sides. Nowhere did I endorse police stopping every person with brown skin etc.
I’m not going rehash everything with you guys here – if we disagree we disagree. But just for one example, I was reading an article in the Nation and the author referred to them as undocumented workers or something even more nebulous. Sorry, if they are illegal, they are illegal. That is parsing terms and being disengenious.
And Bill, SSM and illegal immigration have nothing to do with each other. Legal citizens should have equal protection under the law. Our Constitution already says that. Period.
Paschal
I have no doubt that there is less than good intention in the passing of this bill but the law isn’t as bad as people say. People have over-reacted hugely. Please read this from CBC.com: http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2010/05/04/f-gollom-arizona-immigration.html
Bill Perdue
@Paschal: The anti-worker, racist Arizona law didn’t occur in a vacuum. It flows directly from the McCarthyism of the anti-democratic Paytriot act, with FISA, and with a foreign policy that actively uses kidnapping, torture, concentration camps and murder as SOP. Add to the mix hundreds of anti-democratic local laws limiting free speech, demonstrations and etc. and you’ve got a sustained rightwing attack on the Constitution.
It’s part of a clear pattern.
The racist anti-worker Arizona law, and all anti-democratic laws are huge if you’re interested in preserving what few rights we retain from the Bill of Rights.
CJ
@Jaroslaw: they make up statistic out of the blue, and hire nuts to make small groups in different cities like “save our state” or “save Arizona now”. And they want to take citizenship away from kids. Also their whole organization is and employees are known to have said racist slurs at one point. They are known to want to get rid of all Latinos and Asians, but they to cover their name by saying they just want to “cut the numbers” of Legal and Illegal immigrants, they don’t have many grounds to get rid of Legal immigrants so they focus on children and try to scapegoat other type of immigrants including undocumented immigrants since they can’t defend themselves. So they have access to mainstream media but they are a big time hate group.
Jaroslaw
CJ – thanks for your response – but even if FAIR is a hate group, does that make every issue they raise illegitimate? Look at this website….I assume the vast majority of people here are Gay or such and yet we have a huge spectrum of opinions on almost everything. Not sure what you mean about “taking citizenship away from kids.” Do you mean that groups are trying to revoke the “if your child is born here, he is automatically a citizen?” From what I’ve read, I’m in favor of that. A number of countries have already done so. Revoking citizenship of children already born under that law would require an act of Congress and it would surely be put to a legal test. So at least for the present, that can’t be done.
Jaroslaw
I should also say that I heard one of the chief sponsors of the bill on the radio last week (Bill?) Cavanaugh – he sounded very reasonable; the host was trying to bait him at every turn and gave up. He was a police officer for 20 years and in the Arizona legislature for several years. People have the option he said of providing papers but they are not required. Also, there are a number of hurdles the police must meet before stopping people. And he said there will be several hours of training for all police before the law goes into effect. He also mentioned another related law was challenged and the state won at SCOTUS.
I want to stress the hurdles a bit – unless you believe all police are crooked and trying to ignore the law; there shouldn’t be any more problems than we already have (ie living in an imperfect world).
And whether or not you think this is all McCarthy inspired, racist etc., does anyone propose going without police? Can we take in every person that wants to come to the USA?