Religion. Masculinity. Civil rights. How many other ways can we ignite debate about being gay in the black community? (That’s a different debate from being black in the gay community.) Cleo Manago, the founder of Black Men’s Xchange and AmASSI Health & Cultural Centers, submits this taping from the Al Sharpton’s National Action Network 2009 Summer Conference in Atlanta last month. It’s a fantastic, if inconclusive, conversation and we encourage you to watch the whole clip. (In fact, we ask you to not even leave a comment on this post until you do so.)
Much of the public dialogue about “the black community” — an umbrella term as nefarious and over-encompassing as “the gay community” — comes from religious leaders, and that means conservative voices dominate the debate. That’s too bad, in the same way The Gay Agenda is most often put forth by middle-aged white men: because these people don’t represent all of us.
Their views, however, are given national pedestals. That’s mostly thanks to aggressive public relations campaigns, and the media’s need to have just a couple immediate go-to talking heads. And while (often homophobic) black religious leaders certainly have their supporters, they maintain an unhealthy dominance on public perception of black views.
Which is why we’re happy to see Mr. Manago — who does not compare the black civil rights struggle to that of gays, but supports their rights — leading such an engrossing conversation, challenging prejudice against black men in same-gender-loving relationships. Particularly when it comes to tired anti-gay arguments.
How about we take this to the next level?
Our newsletter is like a refreshing cocktail (or mocktail) of LGBTQ+ entertainment and pop culture, served up with a side of eye-candy.
Says Manago, who does not consider himself a gay rights advocate: “If you care about black people, and black life, and black human beings, and black humanity, [if] it’s important to you, we’ve got to change our ways and do whatever it takes to be healthy, powerful, decent, productive human beings.”
J. Clarence
Uhm…I’m kind of speechless. Thanks Queerty. You hit the nail on the head with this one.
Anthony in Nashville
I met Cleo Manago back in the mid 90s. He gave me a copy of a book he was writing at the time. I had not heard much from him since. Good to see he’s still out there doing his thing.
dgz
nice work, queerty!
Chitown Kev
Uh, uh…what J. Clarence said.
Rasa
Amazing! What a dialogue was happening in this gathering– dealing with complex issues in a respectful and intelligent way. It “raises the bar” for Queerty– I’m glad that you can include this thoughtful piece among the variety of other concerns that appear on this site. Thank you for posting this.
Brian
“Black” and “Masculine” don’t make homosexuality wrong – Religion does.
Distingué Traces
What about ideas of what’s “natural” or “healthy” or “meant to be”?
Can we still use those ideas to marginalize people if we make their basis biological or abstract rather than tying it to a personal deity?
I’m just curious.
Lloyd Baltazar
GOOD JOB QUEERTY. THIS IS THE KIND OF WORK YOU GUYS SHOULD BE DOING.
NOT SNARKY, JUST 100% UNBIASED JOURNALISM.
TikiHead
Wait, men and women ‘come together’ to make babies? This is news to many.
Brian
@Distingué Traces: “What about ideas of what’s “natural” or “healthy” or “meant to be”?
Can we still use those ideas to marginalize people if we make their basis biological or abstract rather than tying it to a personal deity?”
Nothing in nature or science or even art makes homosexuals “wrong.” Only religion does. Especially Christians. I can only imagine being a young Black kid hearing the rants against homosexuality by a loud Black Preacher. It is clearly hard to overcome.
Trey
this. exactly.
cheesus
ok fine black dudes, you’re MEN. stop believing the Jive Davis’ of the world who tell you you’re not.
Then maybe we wont have pussy hypocrisy in that (my) community.
Lex
@Brian: Um…loud white preachers preach the same thing.
I still don’t see what race has to do with homophobia or why anyone makes it a racial issue. It’s a religious issue as you yourself pointed out.
Christianity is the largest religion in America. It should come to no surprise that many Americans are still homophobic because most of us are taught as children that homosexuality is wrong. Regardless of race.
Lets wake up and stop pretending it’s a black issue. I mean if you want to keep that going, that’s fine, but you’re only hurting that one white kid who’s afraid to come out because he’s being ignored since only blacks are homophobic.
Homophobia is colorblind and a problem for all of us.
Chance
@Lex: Hey Lex – I think you’re very right, except about Brian. From all the other threads I’ve seen, he’s just as ready to go after white preacher as a black, a Jew as a gentile.
Because the issue here is that horrific headline, Queerty. No longer be an excuse? Jeebus (and Yahweh and Allah… let’s just call it religion) is the only thing that gives us any problem. It’s what inspires the politician who votes against us, the employer who fires us, and the bigot who murders us. And now we’re supposed to…uh…stop talking about Jeebus? That seems counterproductive, at best, and more realistically, downright harmful to our cause. If we’re unwilling to talk about the problem, we don’t stand much of a chance of finding a solution.
getreal
Can we put a moratorium on Queerty’s constant attack of black people on their web page? Statistically hispanics,straight white men, republicans, and the elderly vote in the exact same numbers as black people on equality issues. Look at how many negative articles there are on this site right now with a black face attached. This site has become a race and religion baiting forum not much else.
shelby
@getreal: I agree that this site is the gay ‘drudge report’.The sad part is that we are not making any friends with this minority group by constantly ‘slapping ‘them. They don’t need us on their side, they don’t need to be friends with us, but we do need them on our side because we need their votes next time America has to vote for our rights! Thats the unfortunate truth!.I think that even AA who otherwise support us get turned off by these kinds of attacks. But hey, I think it’s just psychology, attacking or beating down someone else makes us feel a little superior or better.Mast Americans despise gay people way more than they despise minorities and this may not change soon and they use religious scriptures are backup for hating us!.It shocks me how racism is frowned upon and even little kids know that it is ‘not cool’ to be racist,on the other hand homophobia is widely acceptable and it’s cool to laugh at a gay person.
Cecile Veillard
I agree that dialogue among people fighting for equality (whatever limited definition of equality they may be starting with, at the beginning of the dialogue) is the fastest way to acheive progress in our understanding of and respect for each other.
I agree with Lex’s response to this post, however, that we need to stop pretending that homophobia is a “black issue”–I think this assumption is racist, and will be harmful to our community (and by our community I mean everybody we share solidarity with in our fights for equality for ALL people–LGBT or not, black, white or other) and struggle for LGBT rights and the fight for the rights of all people.
The binder poll that came out right after Prop 8’s passage was quickly discredited in favor of the FACTS that the majority of Yes on 8 voters were impacted by their AGE and frequency of attendence to CHURCH.
When I worked the polls w/the No on 8 campaign on election day, the people who I noticed wouldn’t make eye contact with me (and had Yes on 8 bumber stickers attached to their family cars/minivans) were people who I would categorize as appearing conservative (dress suits, pearl jewelry for women, shiny hair that looked like it took an hour to do in the morning… Read More) and who were more likely to be the kind of person who was told by their church to be frightened of any change in law that represented the endorsement of a “gay lifestyle.” This description does NOT describe a black person or latino person any more than a white person. If anything, it could be the contrary.
Contrary to the disturbingly widely-held belief that people of color are the group that most critically need to be “converted” to “yes on equality” votes before we go back to the ballot, a report-back from an ME USA field director in my local area reflected that their recent canvasses in POC/poor communities have shown that POC of color/people in poor communities are showing MORE sensitivity to marriage equality as a basic human rights issue than is the case for people in less economically-impacted communities. And this makes sense. Of course people who have been impacted by discrimination (whether they are LGBT or not) are more likely to be sensitive to issues OF discrimination (whether they believe they are directly impacted by it or not) than people who have been less impacted personally by discrimination in their lifetimes.
My wanting to clarify that it is not people of color who most need to be “coverted” from Yes on 8 votrs to LGBT allies, does NOT mean that the issue of a MANDATE for the INCLUSION of people of color in the LEADERSHIP of a civil rights movement for LGBT people (and that includes the movement to repeal Prop 8 in 2010–which I support) is any less critical, however. But the need for reflective diversity in the leadership of our LGBT movement is critical NOT because it is the black votes, or latino votes, or whatever, that we most need to win to repeal Prop 8 in 2010. It is critical because ANY civil rights movement should not expect the full respect of the community, nor be successful in its aims, without diversity in its leadership reflective of its community. LGBT people come in every color, and so therefore so should he leadership of its movement. Period.
Been wanting to get that off my chest for a while.
Cecile Veillard
San Diego
Streering Committee Member of SAME (San Diego Alliance for Marriage Equality)
SAMEalliance.com
Aaron
Thank you QUEERTY for that intelligently stimulating piece. Many kudos to you 😉
Andrew
Thanks for posting this clip. That’s the kind of conversation/dialogue that needs to happen more. In lots of contexts.
Andrew
@getreal:
Did you find this clip negative? To me, it showed black people coming together to have a real dialogue, solid critical thinking, about an important issue that affect them. Why is that negative? (there are other things posted on Qty that are, but just don’t see how this clip is)
Michael vdB
Wow Queerty! That is a very productive and informative clip. It is nice to see people that are willing to sit down and talk even though they may not agree. They see common issues and can work towards a better good. There are a lot of communities out there that need to understand themselves before they can understand the world at large.
AlkeWekJunkie
BRAVO!!!!
Lura
@Andrew-
I don’t think the clip is negative, but I think the headline is.
RainaWeather
@shelby: You are right that AA who support gay rights get turned off by these attacks. It turns me off and I am gay. But I know that many people here don’t care about equality, they just want a scapegoat. And it’s a lot easier to go after the average black person than to go after white lawmakers and powerful political organizations.
Chitown Kev
See, I could answer Lex’s qustion about how homophobia is a race as well as a religious issue. I would say that it is only black LGBT’s that get hit with that kind of “you are a de facto white guy” type of homophobia though; white LGBT’s would know nothing about. Black LGBT’s get hit with “the race card” just as much if not more than white LGBT’s.
Andrew
Religion knows no color (anymore), but It does know “homosexual.”
Religion made us wrong. Until we do – no equality.
Andrew
*Until we do something about it – no equality.
rudy
@Andrew: It’s bad enough having Brian repeat that ridiculous statement like a broken record.
We are NOT wrong.
Some religions condemn us, some spread lies about us, but none of them can make us wrong.
Chris
1:07
we still subscribe to the one drop rule?
raz
i thought Jesus was used in all religious homophobia. glaad to see blacks getting the more hateful end of the stick…
Joseph
As a Queer black man, I am offended by the questions you pose not only regarding African Americans as a community, but about Queer black folk in particular.
How can black folk or black gay folk be blamed for the anti-feminine, patriarchal heterosexism of an essentially white supremacist America?
I am tired of the lie that black folk are more homophobic than white folk, a lie perpetuated by the mainstream media and by Queerty.
I am tired of the lie that Queer black folk are less critical of Obama on LGBT issues than Queer white folk, because of Obama’s skin color. To pose such a question is an attempt to race bait black Queers, and to stoke the flames of paranoia among Queer white folk, already looking for a black scapegoat to blame the lack of Queer Equality on. One gay black commentator willing to give Obama a pass on LGBT rights does not equal the black gay Community. Most Queer blacks are pissed with Obama’s backpedaling, we’re just seldom heard because we seldom occupy white gay male positions of influence.
Notwithstanding all its socio-economic problems, South Africa was the First country in the world to legalize LGBT rights in its national constitution, after the mostly black ANC came to power. Black Gay Communist Bayard Rustin the chief strategist and theorist to guide Martin King in the Civil Rights movement, and the Black Panther Party’s Huey Newton defended Gay Rights back when it was unfashionable to do so, one year after Stonewall, by including Gay rights in the BPP platform.
Stop inciting anger against black people, like the Far Right is doing now by making Obama the scapegoat for America’s ills. Rich gay white men like Geffen helped finance Bill Clinton, and he created DOMA and DADT. Later John Kerry, also financed by rich Gay white men, opposed gay marriage when he ran for president. It’s not black folks fault Queer power can’t get the job done in a rabidly heterosexist America!