A number of gay groups are banding together to fight for Brandon McInerney, the 14-year old who shot teenaged homo Lawrence King to death. While prosecutors want to try McInerney as an adult, activists are pushing for a juvenile consideration. “We are saddened and outraged by the murder of junior high school student Lawrence King… At the same time, we call on prosecutors not to compound this tragedy with another wrong. We call on them to treat the suspect as a juvenile, not as an adult.” [365 Gay]
Juvenile.
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CitizenGeek
I don’t buy it. My sister is 14, and if she’s knows very well exactly what happens when you take a gun and fire it at someone. So do all of her friends. Even my 7-year-old next door neighbor knows it.
Brandon McInerny should be tried as an adult.
Ishmael
On the one hand, I agree that the heavy-handed way some prosecutors charge and incarcerate young people needs to be reigned in. Some youths are simply too young to comprehend the nature of their acts.
However, here is a guy that actually went home, having sufficient time to be away from the scene and cool down, but still got his gun and went back to school and shot a classmate in the head–twice. Clearly he had formed a mental state to kill and he carried out that intent by shooting twice in the head. Is this the type of heinous murder that should be the poster child against prosecuting youths as adults? I don’t think so.
As for these groups, other than now pushing for the killer to receive leniency, what have these groups done in the memory of the victim or for the grieving family members? I doubt they even contacted the family members to let them know that they were submitting the letter. Where were these groups at the victim’s vigil and funeral? My understanding from other posts here, these groups were absent.
Don’t get me wrong. I am opposed to the police state mentality of locking everyone up and ignoring the human qualities we all have. However, this was a premeditated, callous and deliberate act of murder of an innocent boy who expressed his love and who died on February 14, 2008. Don’t let this be our Valentine’s Day massacre by letting the murderer escape full punishment.
Leland Frances
SHAME!!! These goddamn “Love Us We’re Liberals” groups are murdering Lawrence King all over again!
Such pussy feelings and actions are the EXACT reason gays are still groveling for first class citizenship over half-a-century after the first enduring gay groups were formed in the US. Brandon McInerney isn’t the “child” here—they are!
They have done virtually NOTHING to combat hate crimes, to prevent them from happening except periodically cry crocodile tears or use pictures of such victims to fund raise to perpetuate their existence—and now they claim to be the experts about them?
The nature of trials and sentencing is as much, if not more, about sending a message to others that such crimes won’t be tolerated, than it is “punishment” of a specific offender. We have gone from a society in which kids having access to, let alone using, guns was virtually unheard of to this—PRIMARILY BECAUSE of the Pollyanna attitudes of such groups as these.
At least SIX LGBTS have been murdered in the last year—TEN YEARS after the world was outraged about the murder of Matthew Shepard and such groups as these were saying No More!
NGLTF, NCLR, et al., have blood on their hands and anyone who sends them another dime will, too!
hells kitchen guy
It seems there are other areas where they should be exerting their energy. Let justice take its course. He’s not going to get the maximum anyway – 1st offense never does. Probably 15-20. He’ll barely be 30 when he gets out – hardly the end of his life.
Ishmael
Here is the statement issued by the groups.
http://data.lambdalegal.org/publications/downloads/lawrence-king_joint-statement_juvenile-suspect.pdf
Send them an email or call and let them know how you feel…I did.
degan22
I cannot believe I support and have volunteered for some of the organizations that signed this.
This is so sad.
tb
Good for those groups for not giving in to the easy desire to be vindictive and seek vengeance. 8th graders aren’t adults; if you’re not sure, sit on a public bus sometime and observe. Particularly when it comes to impulse control and decision making, the brains of young teenagers are less well developed.
Regardless, what exactly is accomplished by locking the kid up until he’s in his 30’s 40’s or longer? You won’t bring the victim back to life. You can hope to rehabilitate the kid, especially when someone is so young. It’s not like people are set in their ways when they’re 8th graders.
Anyway, one life has been destroyed already, but there’s no need to destroy two lives. If you spend all of your formative years in an adult prison, you’re going to be one fucked up grown up.
Ozma
It is Brandon’s parents who should be on trial here, at the very least they should be sterilised.
Ozma
(I may not know how to spell sterilised, but give me the McInerneys and I’ll show you how its done.)
Jojo
Good on Lambda Legal.
Trying a 14 year old as an adult is a stretch.
Bad 14 year old or no, we shouldn’t let our anger interfere with justice. Trying him as an adult would be overkill, and it won’t stop further crimes.
Revenge much?
foofyjim
Revenge is never a good basis for judgment and the way to keep our movement for inclusion and understanding going forward is for us to also be understanding of those who oppress and fear us.
Brandon McInerney comes from what seems like a very abusive home life for one, and he is only 14 years old. To expect him to go home, cool down, and rationally decide how to deal with his situation is just too much. Especially in today’s world of mobile technology and text messaging. School yard fights and juvenile insults don’t just flare up and then fade away anymore.
These type of events aren’t just gossiped about in the bathroom and at lunch time, the talk goes on and on all day and into the evening through the use of mobile technology. This occurs a lot in Chicago high schools, resulting in a lot of teen on teen violence. Stuff just isn’t allowed to die down, it just keeps getting stirred up and stirred up.
Don’t ruin his life because of a mistake and an indoctrination of homophobia that he never had a chance to learn how to rid himself of. Certainly punish him, but treat him as the adolescent he is.
emb
I’m all for ruining this little bastard’s life and scarring him psychologically, emotionally, or physically: he hatefully ended the life of an innocent boy, and there are no excuses. I don’t care if he was abused, indoctrinated, or haunted by personal demons: he killed an innocent child for the most spiteful and cold-blooded of reasons.
That said, he’s 14: if that’s not “juvenile” then what, pray tell, is? 4-7 years is utterly inadequate, obviously, but we live in a nation of laws, not raw emotion, and no punishment, in my mind, would be “adequate” to the crime or bring Lawrence King back.
If GLBTs demand equal protection of the law in our personal and public lives, we should support the application of those laws. The impulse to demand blood atonement (or the next best thing) is powerful and understandable, but we need to look to the law.
kevin57
Just a question for the sake of clarity and consistency: if the victim had been blond, blue eyed, white and the perp had been a black gangbanger, would their position have been the same?
_____
Good point there, Kevin57. I was thinking the same thing.
Ishmael
If the killer had pushed the victim down and he hit his head and died, then you could safely argue that he should be tried as a juvenile because it was a childish reaction to the situation.
But this little monster went home, loaded his gun, hunted Lawrence down like an animal and then shot him twice in the head. Do any of you know a 14 year old that reacts that way? I don’t know where something like that comes from and it scares me.
I think he should go to juvenile prison until he is 18 and then adult prison until he is in his 30s. A minimum 20 year sentence.
This is not revenge, it is punishment that sends a message that killing someone because they are gay will not be tolerated and it gives the little monster 20 years to think about and try to seek penance for his murderous act.
Leland Frances
The option to try any juvenile as an adult IS a part of existing law, you pussy retards! Most of the community is calling for adding LGBTs to federal hate crime laws. Is it any less hate-filled when the killer is a teenager? Is his/her victim any less DEAD?
Again, the point ISN’T the punishment of the kid who shot him TWICE in the head as much as it is to say to others that such acts will get THEM punished appropriately. “Juvenile sentencing” is no more than the proverbial slap of the wrist when the crime is PREMEDITATED MURDER!
“Two of the top three reasons students say their peers are harassed in school are actual or perceived sexual orientation and gender expression, according to From Teasing to Torment: School Climate in America, a 2005 Harris Interactive report commissioned by GLSEN. What begins as bullying and harassment too often escalates to violence. In GLSEN’s 2005 National School Climate Survey, nearly a fifth (17.6%) of LGBT students reported being physically assaulted at school in the past school year because of their sexual orientation and over a tenth (11.8%) because of their gender expression.
California is one of only 10 states that [tries to] protect students from bullying and harassment based on sexual orientation and one of only five that [tries to] protect students from bullying and harassment based on gender.” – GLSEN identity/expression.
“Karen Franklin [is] a forensic psychologist whose dual interests in psychology and the law brought her to question the roots of anti-gay hate crimes. Her interviews with perpetrators and with San Francisco Bay Area college students provide badly needed empirical data on the nature and extent of negative reactions to gays. Franklin does not find one motive for anti-gay violence, but many, with ideological opposition to, and plain hatred of homosexuality, only one among them. In Franklin’s view, the focus should be on cultural norms—an attitude that society gives permission for anti-gay violence—rather than on individual psychology.” – “Assault on Gay America,” Frontline, PBS.
Ryan Keith Skipper, 25, stabbed twenty times before dying March 14, 2007
Sean W. Kennedy, 20, killed May 16, 2007
Satendar Singh, 26, killed July 1, 2007
Talib Stewart, 25, stabbed multiple times in the chest and throat before dying February 9, 2008
Lawrence King, 15, killed February 12, 2008
Simmie Williams, 17, shot to death February, 22, 2008
NEXT
NEXT
NEXT
NEXT
NEXT
NEXT
NEXT
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NEXT
…
l
I do not believe a 14 year old should be tried as an adult. Period. It is the humane, rational decision that is in accord with most western democracies. It is the only policy that recognizes science that says that a juvenile’s brain is not fully developed. Any other reaction is just that – an emotional, subjective response to a particular situation. And that is just a bad way to make legal decisions.
Bill Perdue
GLBT groups who call for leniency for this racist homophobic killer are as wrong headed as they can get. The ideas of non-violence, turning the other cheek and forgiving ones enemies are a betrayal of our struggle and particularly so in the midst of a growing campaign of violence inspired by political and religious leaders against us.
Adopting positions like that gives a green light to the thugs. This call for clemency sends a mistaken message, that it’s we, not the bigots who should bear the cost of their bigotry. We are NOT going to get any sort of justice in matters like these until comprehensive Federal Hate Crimes and Hate Speech laws with harsh penalties are in place. That’s not going to happen with Democrats and/or Republicans controlling the government. As the election campaign progresses it’s becoming clearer that, irrespective of fantasy and wishful thinking, both major parties are cesspools of bigotry.
A little rough justice will be served by harshly punishing McInerney but to be honest the only punishment that fits his crime is the death sentence. No matter how much time he gets or whether it’s in the adult or juvenile systems, the little sack of shit is going to discover ‘God’, get ‘reborn’ and ask for parole. If he gets an indeterminate sentence he’ll be out before we know it. Nationally the average time served for murder is 5.5 years and in California it averages a little less than 3.5 years.
Phoenix
There are some people who are not salvageable, I believe that Brandon McInerney is one of those people. At 14 yrs old a person is capable of understanding that bullying is wrong, taking a gun to school is wrong, loading the gun is wrong, shooting the classmate is wrong, and above all else MURDER is WRONG! If he hasn’t learned that by age 14, he’ll probably never learn it.
My view of the death penalty is this, it is more cruel to keep somebody in a cage their whole lives than quietly put them down. We are humane enough to extend this mercy to animals at the humane society so we should be humane enough to extend it to our own species.
Brandon McInerney is an animal, which is parents failing. It is our job (societies) to see that he never kills again.
leomoore
It is wrong to use law as an instrument of simple vengence. This is kid who killed another kid. It’s horrible. Treating a 14 year old as an adult is just wrong. Destroying any remaining potential for good in his life does no good for Lawrence King. It means his life meant nothing and cannot spur Brandon McInearny to become something better. No, he has to be punished and punished hard. Make him hurt.
That is not so different from the pain and embarrassment that triggered Brandon to strike out.
Mr C
I have to disagree with that LeoMoore.
Regardless of race, and class status these young kids are OUT OF CONTROL! From this incident to the “You Tube chicks” in Florida that beat that girl crazy.
If you are Man, or Woman enough to do something so BARBARIC then you need to Man-up and handle the consequences. PERIOD
No sympathy. Sit your ass down and get your education and walk the right road to a bright future. Not make the wrong turn and now headed down DESTRUCTION alley!
He gets what he deserves. Lawrence parents can’t see him and kiss him. Brandon’s will at least have the opportunity to do so; even if it’s behind glass they can still see him!
leomoore
At 14, he is not a man. He hasn’t even finished a significant part of his growth including brain development. Research supports that impulse control is one of the last parts of the brain to mature and is at least part of why so many adolescents make so many stupid mistakes. There is a tendency to translate impulse into action without considering consequences. The primary role of parents for adolescents is to modify their impulse response. If the parents either didn’t learn self-control or don’t exert strong influence on their teenage offspring, tragedy often results.
Zoe Brain
When I was 14, I was as adult as I am now at 50.
But I for one could not bring myself to transfer this kid from juvenile detention to an adult jail in 5 years time to serve another decade or so for something he did when he was only 14.
I’ll let those closer to the scene decide whether he is to be tried as an adult. My own opinion is that it would take extremely strong and compelling evidence to the contrary before I’d treat him as anything other than the most serious kind of juvenile offender.
In other words, he’s a kid. He should probably be treated as such.
Ishmael
No. 21 wrote: “many stupid mistakes” and No. 22 wrote “transfer this kid” and “something he did when he was only 14.”
Many of the posts here make it sound like this murderer was charged with skipping class or throwing a rock through a window. I don’t get it.
He is not a “kid.” No kids I know take a loaded gun to class a blow another person’s brains out simply because the other person said “be my valentine’s.”
Would your opinion change if you knew that prior to shooting Lawrence, the murderer researched and factored in his decision to kill that he was a juvenile and he knew what the maximum sentence was going to be and with that knowledge he carried out his plan?
Maybe its just me and my lack of understanding of a culture where violence and guns are glorified.
leomoore
Ishmael, I don’t understand why you feel many of the posts here make it sound as if he was charged with skipping class or throwing a rock through a window. I have not seen information about any research he might have conducted nor do I know what factored into his decision. To me, it is beside the point. He had only been 14 for about three weeks when this occurred. I know what I did at that age. It wasn’t murder, but it was a felony with very serious consequences for an adult. I was not treated as an adult, but I became something better than I had been.
My argument is that we cannot treat children as adults based on things they do. If it was otherwise, children who have been forced into being child soldiers and have participated in massacres and other violent atrocities should be punished as we do the adult participants. Instead, most of us view them with sorrow and believe that attempting to rehabilitate is worth the effort. Could you put a 14 year old child into a place like San Quentin? Could you sentence a 14 year old to death row? Something has gone horribly wrong in this boy’s life. If he is not mature enough to hold a job or sign a contract, how is he mature enough to be tried as an adult for murder? He has to endure consequences, but is he old enough to be subject to adult consequences?
Peabody
I think many of the posters – and the letter sent by HRC / Lambda Legal / et al. – are missing the point: The law doesn’t presume that there is a magical age at which one learns right from wrong and that actions carry consequences, but rather it acknowledges that people mature at different ages. I think the GLBT-friendly groups who signed the letter asking for the defendent to be tried as a juvenile are wrong by forgetting this point.
The law establishes a procedure by which the prosecutor can file a motion to have a 14-year-old tried as an adult. The motion will be subject to a hearing to determine the defendent’s ability to distinguish right from wrong, assist with his own defense, etc., the defendent’s attorneys will have an opportunity to present evidence, and then a judge will rule if the defendent should be tried as an adult. It is presumptuous of us – and the groups that signed the letter – to be making our own conclusions as to the defendent’s fitness to be tried as an adult before hearing whatever evidence each side will present to substantiate its claims.
I don’t believe we should change the law and rule that ‘every’ 14-yr-old who commits a crime be tried as a juvenile. I personally know of many mature 12-yr-olds who are fully responsible for their own actions, as well as immature 17-yr-olds who aren’t. So I support a system that allows for that determination to be made on a case-by-case basis, by an impartial judge, after hearing from both sides.
To do otherwise – to make a judgment about someone based solely on our knowledge about one aspect of their life, such as their age, or their sexual orientation – makes us guilty of the same type of stereotyping bias that has been used against our community.
leomoore
If the law was applied uniformly and all judges viewed the laws through the same lens, I might agree, but that isn’t true. In addition, there is no single law. It varies from state to state. Even within a state, it can depend on where the charge is brought such as rural vs. urban vs. suburban. Here in the South, all that is really required is to be a black juvenile male brought before a judge with a conservative viewpoint combined with a public demand for severe punishment. Some states even allow the imposition of the death penalty on juveniles.
If we want to talk about fairly applying the law, we should decide that either a fourteen year-old is a child or an adult. It shouldn’t be based on a subjective exception that appears to have more to do with a desire for vengeance than justice.
Peabody
Leomoore, I can’t agree with you when you say “we should decide that either a fourteen year-old is a child or an adult.” You’re missing the point: People mature at different ages. In our system of justice, those who are old enough to know that their actions are wrong should bear full adult responsibility for their actions, and those too young to understand this concept are deemed to be less responsible, and thus incur a lesser form of juvenile punishment than that imposed on adults.
That’s the problem with trying to establish one yardstick (age) to measure maturity and thus responsibility for one’s actions. Wherever you draw your dividing line in terms of age, there will be people who, in terms of mental development and maturity, will fall on either side of that line, but deserve to be treated as though they are on the other side of that line.
What age would you suggest as an arbitrary age of responsiblity? 12? 14? 16? 18? Or would it depend on the nature of the offense? Personally, I think any 12-yr-old of average mental development for their age should know that killing another person is wrong, whereas I know of college students in their 20’s who demonstrate a naive immaturity about the consequences of violating copyright laws when downloading movies and music from the internet.
I reiterate: the decision must be left to a judge to determine, on a case-by-case basis, depending on the maturity level of the accused. Yes, there may be abuses of the system (I, too, have experienced the peculiarities of “Southern justice”), but groups like the NAACP, ACLU, and Southern Poverty Law Center have made great strides in exposing these abuses on appeal.
I’ve never met Brandon McInerney, the accused in this case, so it would be presumptuous of me to draw conclusions on his mental development and maturity “from afar”. Likewise, it is presumptuous of HRC, Lambda Legal, et al. to make any assumptions, either, in an effort to try to exert moral superiority and look like they’re not seeking revenge against him. They, and I, and you, should leave the determination of McInerney’s responsibility for his alleged actions to the judge hearing the motion.
leomoore
Using your logic, we should remove all age limits on various things. For instance, I’ve known 14 year olds who probably had the maturity to handle alcohol. On the other hand, I know a number of people in their 50s and older who should be banned from using alcohol. I think we would need to remove all concepts of age of consent. I was sexually active at 13, well below the age of consent (it was with a 14 year old). I doubt I was ready for a relationship with a grown man, but maybe some 10, 11, 12, or 13 year old boys are. I have known children who could handle a concealed weapon quite responsibly at school. Of course, there are adults who should not be allowed anywhere near a gun because they have bad tempers and uncertain impulse control. There should be no specific age requirement for children entering into contracts. We should just let a judge decide on a case by case basis using subjective opinions. Even if psychiatrists and clinical psychologists are called in knowing they will do their best, it still boils down to a subjective opinion.
How many posters have thought about what being tried as an adult means. It goes far beyond trying him in regular court rather than a juvenile court. If convicted, he will be sentenced as an adult. Since he is charged with murder with a special circumstance (hate crime), he will be in prison for decades at the very least. I suppose the prosecutor could seek a death penalty. If a 14 year old is mature enough to be tried as an adult, that same 14 year old is quite mature enough to survive in San Quentin without special arrangements. Toss him in and let the gangs rehabilitate him. After all, he’s old enough to be treated as an adult. If he’s ever released from prison, he ought to be well equipped to fit in as a productive member of society.
Ishmael
Interesting debate. I agree with Peabody on this one, primarily because the nature of the murder requires an assessment of McInerney’s mental development to understand his actions.
E.
He should be tried as an adult and given the death penalty.
Make an example of him and people should learn that it is not right to kill your fellow human being. Maybe this way parents will try harder to teach their children to respect life and other people’s rights.
Rob Moore
Goodness. There is the solution. Make examples of them and execute them. It has worked so well everywhere people face the death penalty. Let’s apply that logic to traffic laws. Speeding? Don’t give a fine. Shoot them on the side of the road and leave their bodies as road kill. Or what about shoplifting? Maybe hanging them from the lamppost outside the shop will do the trick. No age exceptions. If a toddler grabs something as the buggy passes by a display without the parent noticing, arrest the child and put it on death row.
I live in a state where one of the most popular penalties is death especially if the defendant is black and poor. We have also had some shown to be innocent after several years on death row and still had prosecutors oppose releasing the innocent party from prison. We have so many on death row and have executed several over the years. We also have one of the highest rates of murder in the country.
The death penalty does not provide a deterrent. Every study I’ve ever read has shown this over and over. It might make you feel moral and upstanding to sanction execution, but do not pretend it is for anything other than a sense of vengeance.
E.
For murders my friend..
In this case definitely premeditated murder.
Who goes home load and carry a gun to school and accidentally shoots his classmate twice in the head.
Having the death penalty is no use unless it is carried out consistently for all murders.
I think a person who can cold-bloodedly murder another is beyond redemption. Death penalty is cruel but don’t you think that sometimes you have to be cruel to be kind. Kind..at least to the other children who could be his future victims.
Rob Moore
E., the logic escapes me. Cruel to be kind? One is either cruel or kind, but not both. I disagree on two counts.
1. “Having the death penalty is no use unless it is carried out consistently for all murders.”
It was a penalty that was applied consistently for millenia, yet, murder rates remained high. Countries that abandoned the death penalty do not have higher murder rates. In fact, because of many factors, these countries often have much lower murder rates. Then there is the whole matter of executing someone who is, in fact, not guilty of the murder for when they were found guilty. The fact that advances in genetic testing have allowed us to identify a significant number of people who were convicted of violent crimes ranging from capital murder to rape but genetic testing shows did not commit the crime. If an innocent person is executed, how can that be rectified? How does one be kind after such a cruelty?
2. “I think a person who can cold-bloodedly murder another is beyond redemption.” I agree that some people are beyond redemption. A child of 12 or 13 is rather young to declared beyond redemption. Children act emotionally and rashly. The fact he went home and brought back a gun does not mean that he did it in cold blood. In fact, I would say quite the opposite. His emotions were roiling and hot. They overwhelmed his still developing sense of restraint. Do you want to be the one who pushes the button to put down a child who is now frightened and wishing with all his might he could change what happened?
I don’t believe in gods or afterlives. I also don’t believe in deliberately killing children. Lawrence King is dead, killed by a child named Brandon McInerny, but killing Brandon will not bring Lawrence back to life nor will execution make society either safer or better. There is no value to the death penalty except to make us all agents of revenge. It will not deter nor has it ever deterred murders. Most murders occur in an explosion of emotion and adrenaline.
Janet
All i want to say is, regardless of the time this monster gets, do you really think that people who go to jail change? Yes some do, but also some dont! So what about when he gets out of jail, gets a job or is just walking down the street? Do you not think that if he did not change, that he will not go and get a gun, and shoot that person also? He will be older, more mature, so now he will probably hide the body, or try and cover it up. Then what will people be saying when he reoffends, we shouldve tried him as an adult? By then it wont matter! I think if you do and adult crime, you should do the adult time! I would also have to agree with another person’s comment, if he were black and shot a white child, of course he would be tried as an adult! I think this is so obviously a hate crime, and he knew what he was doing regardless of age. I have a 14 yr old girl, and she knows the consequences of her actions! He certainly did too, regardless of being beaten at home! I was teased by bullies, beaten by my parents, ridiculed all the time as a young child, and teen, but you did not see me out there shooting people because i couldnt deal with the situation. That is a cop out! He wanted to show a homosexual boy, who was boss! He deserves life in my opinion as an adult! I truly hope justice prevails!
SAM ARTALONA
JUST WANT TO N WHERE R THE PARENTS???????????
AND WHO GAVE HIM THE GUN??????????
WHO CARES GAY OR NOT GAY A SOMEONES BABY IS DEAD
SAM ARTALONA
Isa
Appalling. 14 is plenty old enough to understand the consequences of murdering another human being. Try him as an adult. There is no excuse for this.