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Meet Britain’s ‘Pregnant Man': Trans Scott Moore Will Give Birth to a Baby Boy Next Month

It’s too bad Thomas Beatie beat ‘em to the punch, otherwise British “pregnant man” (do we hate that term yet?) couple Thomas and Scott Moore would be appearing on Oprah and working on a book deal and a reality show.

Scott, who is a British trans man, is set to give birth next month, relays the Daily Mail. And religious conservatives don’t even need to freak out — thanks to his birth certificate still listing him as a woman, Scott is legally married to Thomas. “Heterosexual” marriage is good for raising a family! It’s a boy, and his name will be Miles. Meanwhile, Thomas has two tweenage sons from a previous relationship with a woman,

So why is Scott carrying the baby, and not Thomas? Because the latter — who met his future partner at a trans therapy group — had a hysterectomy and gender reassignment surgery last year.

But Scott better keep cranking them out if he wants to keep up with the Beaties: Thomas already gave birth to two.

By:           editor editor
On:           Jan 27, 2010
Tagged: , , , , , ,

  • 56 Comments
    • Fitz
      Fitz

      This picture of the fat lesbian needs a cut– I don’t need to be seeing this crap during morning coffee.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 9:58 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Kieran
      Kieran

      Why do I get the feeling ‘Focus on The Family’ will be using that picture to rake in the donations?

      Jan 27, 2010 at 10:15 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • james
      james

      looks like a man, talks like a man, has a vag does not make a man. this is a pregnant women.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 10:34 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • T
      T

      The transphobia on the site makes me sick. Biology does not define gender, it is hard to believe that such ignorance is coming from the gay community.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 10:46 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Fitz
      Fitz

      @T: No, physiology alone does not make the man. But behavior does. getting pregnant is a womanly behavior, in the extreme.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 10:50 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • romeo
      romeo

      I’m confused. Are these both post-op transpeople? How did Thomas have two children with a woman if HE is a former woman? And what is their relationship now? Two gay men? I’m not being facetious here. This is very confusing. I’m assuming if Scott is post-op, he’s going to have to have a caesarian.

      You know what, I don’t want to think about this anymore.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 10:54 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • David
      David

      What does this freak show have to do with gay people? Why is the gay blogosphere so eager and willing to swallow the lie that gay is in the same “community” or category as transgender. Most “transgenders” are not gay. Many have a disorder that is listed in the DSM IV. Many seek surgery to correct their problem. By contrast, gays do not have a disorder and one of the greatest triumphs of the gay movement was to remove homosexuality as a disorder. Gays do not seek “corrective” surgery, and in fact have been the victims of medical abuse. In many ways, gays are the opposite of “trans” people.

      Gay kids coming to this site will be misled into thinking that the circus depicted above has something to do with their lives. Stop promoting hurtful lies, Queerty.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 12:10 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Tina
      Tina

      I don’t have a ‘disorder’, I’m perfectly healthy. I have a very annoying birth defect that insurance companies refuse to fix.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 12:20 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • romeo
      romeo

      David, you make an interesting point. I kind of think this is a separate issue from us, though no less important. But if you change yourself physically to conform to your mind’s image of a “real” woman or man, then you become part of the straight world for all intent and purposes. The issues aren’t gay issues anymore. Gay and lesbian issues are about same sex orientation. Having said that, I absolutely don’t get what’s up with the two in the article.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 12:20 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Anthony in Nashville
      Anthony in Nashville

      Men don’t have the ability to have children!

      Jan 27, 2010 at 1:02 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Fitz
      Fitz

      @Tina: And I wish you luck in getting it treated.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 1:08 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • THOMAS MOORE
      THOMAS MOORE

      @romeo: HI MY NAME IS THOMAS MOORE. I AM THE HUSBAND OF SCOTT MOORE. WE ADOPTED OUR KIDS. THE INFO ONLINE IS VERY INCORRECT.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 1:08 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Andrew
      Andrew

      I have to admit that while I fully support elimination of any discrimination against trans gendered people I really cannot relate/sympathise to issues such as this reported here by Queerty. It is all a little too much for me and in my humble and I am sure bigoted opinion, I wonder how their children are coping with all this change.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 1:08 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Mike L
      Mike L

      Aparently none of you have seen the documentary with the Govinator when he gets preggers.

      I think it’s cool that he decided to retain his uterues and other reproductive organs incase he’d want to have bio children.

      It really astounds me at the transphobia that many in the gay community spew, like werent some ppl bitching about how black ppl and other minorities should understand us and the discrimination we’re going through and then we have some stupid gay btches here doing the same hateful shit towards trans people, WHAT THE FUCK YOU STUPID IGNORANT BITCHES!

      Talk about Hipocrisy!

      Good luck to the couple :)

      Jan 27, 2010 at 1:15 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Tallskin
      Tallskin

      Mike L -you say: “It really astounds me at the transphobia that many in the gay community spew”

      Honey, it’s not phobia about transsexual issues, it’s that, as gays, we don’t see that these are gay or lesbian issues. As David in his comment above pointed out, most Trans are not gay or lesbian, but are straight.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 1:31 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • $0.02
      $0.02

      @14, would not have put it quite the way you put it but you took the words right out of my mouth. We as Gays cannot expect others to support us if we are unwilling to support others. How do trans men and women fit into the LGBT identification? The fact that they are on the extreme in terms of difference to heterosexual norms for gender and sexuality, the same way we are looked upon from homophobes. Think about it, homophobes think we are all a monolithic group. What do I as gay person have in common with a trans person? Very little besides the fact that there is something about us that we cannot help and cannot change which regards are gender and in turn our sexuality, or vice versa, that bothers some heterosexuals enough that they will deny us the right to live OUR lives as we see fit. If gays try to have an “us vs. them” mentality towards people in our own community just because they are even more different from us we in turn cannot get upset when we get that “us vs. them” mentality in return, espcially since the government feels somehow that our rights, as opposed to everyone elses, should be voted on by the masses… So fo rthose of you in the community who are “transphobic”, when you want to complain about how blacks, hispanics, native americans, need to stand up for us and help out our causes because they went through the same thing, when it comes to trans issues I hope you’ll apply those same social policies to yourselves, I know I do…

      Jan 27, 2010 at 1:31 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Andrew
      Andrew

      @16 – Very good point – you have made me re-think my position on issues relating to the transgendered community.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 1:35 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Mike L
      Mike L

      @Tallskin: You and many in our community may not see it as a g/l/b issue but you know what straight ppl do, when transpple are being attacked what do you always hear that they were called “faggot!” “Dyke!”

      Read what $0.02 said.

      I don’t claim to understand why they belief they were born in the wrong gender-most times since infancy just like most of us knew since infancy-but I understand that like with them there are ppl that don’t understand how we can be interested in ppl of the same sex, so I chose to rather than try to understand or try to figure it out I just accept them as they are b/c that’s how I wanna be accepted, not questioned or made less of or being humiliated just b/c I’m not as the rest.

      Just like there are homosexual animals in nature there are trangender animals in nature for example some species fish among change gender from female to male and back, and there are also intersex animals as there are humans. So for me it is very easy to interpret that hey very likely there are ppl who are born in the wrong gender b/c the way their mind/brain is wired biologically may be the opposite of what their biological gender is. We will probably never learn how genetics play into sexual orientation or gender identity (mainly b/c there arent alo of ppl interested in that heteros and cisgendered ppl) but I know that I’m gay, and that there are transppl that were born in the wrong biogender and I accept that b/c as much as I request respect for who I am I want to give that same respect to someone who may be different than me and is also innocent of the way they were born b/c they didnt chose to be in the wrong biogender.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 1:52 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • sebastien
      sebastien

      Ok, it’s a bit mind blowing for me..but why not? The kids as I saw them in the pictures in Metro this morning seemed OK. Kids don’t really care anyway how or who raised them as long as they’re happy. Kids don’t judge but they know when they feel good. that’s what is the most important.

      I don’t identify with Scott and Thomas. I’m gay , i don’t have any problem with my gender or my sexuality.

      Yes, they seem cliches, yes, they don’t look like Brad and Angelina but that’s not the point.The point is that they are 2 human beings who want to have children and raise them together. Isn’t it what gays claim they want? Te right for a couple whatever is their gender or sexuality to have children?

      Yes, that’s what we want. So we’d better not judge them because they taking the fire for others who stay hidden.

      There is enough misery in this world , enough children left with no one to love, anough children who take the abuse of their parents.

      No, I don’t identify with them, but I accept that they have love to give. And who better than children to receive that.

      Kids don’t have the concept of judgement. they don’t condemn, they don’t hate . Adults stuff their heads with that stuff while they grow up. Hate and resentment is something we learn , we aren’t born with it.

      I don’t think it will be always easy for the kids at one point during their late teenage years , but who had the best time during those years?

      Love is the heart of a family, not the eyes of others.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 1:54 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • romeo
      romeo

      @ Thomas, Thanks for coming in to clear up that detail. Had me totally confused. Best of luck to both of you and congratulations on your son.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 2:05 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • sebastien
      sebastien

      @THOMAS MOORE:

      you gonna see a lot of non sense being said about in the next few days. you story will make the headlines and you won’t like what you see .

      That’s the rules of the game unfortunately.You can not control blogs or other medias to relay what is the truth or what is not.

      If you read those lines, I would like to say I admire your courage to go public.

      I’m a photographer and in photography, you always try to see things with a different angle and to share that view with the world. Some will like the shot, some others won’t.

      It takes courage to try to attract attention on a different angle, especially when this angle is your life.

      Your story won’t change a lot of people’s mind, but it make them think and realise there is other type of love out there. You might not get their love , but just aim for their tolerance and it will be enough.:-)

      Jan 27, 2010 at 2:05 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • BAYonet
      BAYonet

      REPULSIVE.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 4:44 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • David
      David

      2 cents and Mike L:

      Your point is that we should call ourselves “LGBT” because as you put it: “homophobes think we are all a monolithic group.”

      To which I respond: So what? Since when do we define ourselves and our movement based on what homophobes think? We CHALLENGE and OPPOSE what homophobes think. We don’t embrace their erroneous views and, worse, define ourselves based on those views. To take your logic further, homophobes also have seen us as communists, spies, child molesters, mentally unbalanced, predators, and modern day versions of Typhoid Mary. Therefore, we should rename our community the LGBCSCMMUOMDVTM to adopt all of their stereotypes? We should proudly declare ourselves in the same category as these other groups and order our priorities to match theirs? No. Sorry, that makes no sense.

      BTW, in pointing out the illogic of your argument, I am not comparing trans people to any of these other groups and I have no problem with finding common cause with trans people on certain specific issues. But this business of inventing LGBT as an identity and then having blogs like Queerty shove it down our throats has got to stop.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 4:47 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • David
      David

      @Tina:

      “I don’t have a ‘disorder’, I’m perfectly healthy. I have a very annoying birth defect that insurance companies refuse to fix.”

      Um, if you have a birth defect then you are not “perfectly healthy.” Anyway, I am sorry that you have a birth defect and I wish you well in getting it corrected. But your birth defect issues have nothing to do with gay people, who don’t have birth defects. Your birth defect issues should not be the focus of gay blogs and the focus of our political efforts.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 4:54 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • vitaminE
      vitaminE

      David, if this is a strictly gay blog it should be called “Gayty” not “Queerty.” The trans community is a part of the Queer community. The Stonewall riots included trans people and gay people alike. Historically, trans people and gay people congregated together because they understood each other as social outcasts based on characteristics that they couldn’t control but defied social norms in regards to gender. Their struggle is our struggle, our struggle is their struggle. WHY is it so hard for the gay community to empathize with and support the trans community?

      Jan 27, 2010 at 5:28 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • jason
      jason

      Both of them are hypocrites. They elected to be men but they chose to retain their female internals. What inconsistency!!

      As far as I’m concerned, both Thomas and Scott Moore are hypocritical freak shows.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 5:37 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Alexa
      Alexa

      Jason, apparently you are illiterate. Neither of them CHOSE to retain their “female internals,” one had the surgery and the other could not afford it.

      As for the idiots proclaiming they are not part of the gay community, whether you accept that they are men or insist that they are female, they are both the same sex, therefore they are GAY no matter which way you look at it.

      @No. 16 ยท $0.02, well said. We have no right to complain about the black community, etc. not supporting us if we ourselves don’t support others. If we want equal rights we should support equal rights, period. And if we don’t want heterosexuals looking at us as freaks and judging us, we should not look at others as freaks or judge them, either.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 7:03 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • jason
      jason

      Alexa,

      Being gay doesn’t mean anything goes. It’s a huge mistake to assume that it does. The gay rights movement, in its conception, had a very moral basis to it. The only people who deny this are the permissive crowd who latch on to any revolutionary movement to spread their permissive ethos.

      If Thomas and Scott really wanted to be men, why is one of them choosing to have a baby? Men don’t have babies. There’s a contradiction in their position. They hurt themselves with this contradiction of their own standards.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 7:12 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Mike L
      Mike L

      @jason: You’re an idiot, yes due to how we’re built, bio males aren’t able of having babies, but if men had the chance to have a baby I’m sure many would, gay or straight.

      I know that if I could have a child I would def jump to that opportunity and it would NOT make me any less of a man. It’s all in how you identify personally as male, nothing else matters. Reproduction is just a way of having a child, women or men with the built in organs are just able to enjoy and take part in that process.

      Again as a biological male, had I the chance to have a baby with my partner or a donor I would do it and would not feel any less of a man.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 7:30 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Mike L
      Mike L

      @Alexa: You have a great point which I overlooked, they are gay men, lol, I was completely oblivious to that fact omg.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 7:32 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • kyshra
      kyshra

      YOUR NOT A MAN IF YOU STILL HAVE A PUSSY…….AND YOULL NEVER BE ONE STOP ACTING LIKE IT.. GET A DICK, THEN CALL YOUR SELF A MAN.. STUPID PEOPLE

      Jan 27, 2010 at 7:34 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • David
      David

      @VitaminE
      “WHY is it so hard for the gay community to empathize with and support the trans community?”

      Oh, so now we are separate communities? Thanks for agreeing with me. It is hilarious to read folks try to justify “LGBT” when all of their arguments demonstrate that there is no such thing. There are 2 separate communities, with interests that sometimes coincide, sometimes are in conflict, and sometimes have nothing to do with one another. It is no different from the gay community’s relationship with labor unions, the Black civil rights movement, the women’s movement, etc. They are sometime allies but they do NOT define who we are.

      Empathy for trans people? In most instances, sure. Support? Depending on the issue, perhaps. But just because we may have empathy or provide support doesn’t mean we ARE you and you ARE us any more than gays are all members of a union just because we support labor.

      The decision to stick “T” at the end of our name was made by a bunch of unintelligent and unelected “leaders” eager to pursue the latest PC fad. This was a terrible mistake which has fostered the perception of gays as a “third sex” – the very stereotype that we spent most of the 20th century opposing.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 8:11 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Fitz
      Fitz

      The side show aspect of this was all her choice. No one would have known anything about this person, neighbors would have just thought “gee that guy has cushings, or is getting fat”.. so I don’t want to hear any crap about respecting privacy and not treating it like the circus show that it is.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 8:24 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • jason
      jason

      Mike L,

      What you need to understand is that the human body isn’t a grab bag. You just can’t pick and choose the organs you want and the organs you don’t. Regardless of where you stand on gender identity, it’s simply folly to treat the human body in this way.

      What I’d really like to know is whether Thomas and Scott were paid any money for their story. Did they use their chosen contradiction as a marketing ploy? If so, they’ve lost all credibility.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 8:55 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • missanthrope79@yahoo.com
      missanthrope79@yahoo.com

      “If Thomas and Scott really wanted to be men, why is one of them choosing to have a baby? Men don’t have babies. There’s a contradiction in their position. They hurt themselves with this contradiction of their own standards.”

      Hmmmm….just women who can’t conceive or men who are infertile are really “real” men or women. Great logic fail on that one. Gender doesn’t depend on how or if a person can conceive a child.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 8:57 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • jason
      jason

      Haven’t transgenders lost the right to be called gay? If a man wants to be a woman and then have boyfriends, he’s effectively becoming heterosexual. He’s lost the right to the noble gay label.

      Such transgenders are effectively saying “I don’t want to be gay”. Think about it.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 8:58 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • missanthrope79@yahoo.com
      missanthrope79@yahoo.com [Different person #1 using similar name]

      Haven’t transgenders lost the right to be called gay? If a man wants to be a woman and then have boyfriends, he’s effectively becoming heterosexual. He’s lost the right to the noble gay label.

      Such transgenders are effectively saying “I don’t want to be gay”. Think about it.”

      It’s about more than sexuality, it’s about who you are fundimentally as a person.

      And oh yeah, this trans women happens to be bi, and about half of the trans women I know are either dykes or bi women.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 9:02 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • jason
      jason

      Stop treating your body as a grab bag. It wasn’t designed to be that way. Some of the trans genders have gone through enormous surgical changes for the sake of a paltry fetish. For example, a straight guy with lesbian fetishes might become a woman so that he can experience that “all woman” feel.

      To me, that’s fetish.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 9:26 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Lukas P.
      Lukas P.

      TRUTH: I will own up to some transphobia — the pictures of the “pregnant man” do cause me some visceral discomfort. Guess what though, that’s GOOD for me because I have then more empathy for the couple and for what they face in “coming out” with their story. I aslo recognize in myself how the same “eww” factor crops up when I hold hands with or plant a sloppy wet kiss on my guy within viewing distance of the hets.

      What that means for me is that I need to deal with my own issue there, and make sure I don’t inadvertantly treat T’s the way I have been treated as a gay man.

      Excluding the transgenders from the big tent that includes the gay/lesbian/bi/questioning communities would be allowing the fundies to divide and conquer. We may not, as Qs, share identical agendas but when those agendas align we sure as hell better support one another or —at a minimum— not work against our tent-mates as they pursue their rights.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 9:29 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • jason
      jason

      I would never discriminate against transgenders. But I think some of them treat the human body as a grab bag. Their transgender ideals are based on fetish rather than anything more substantial.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 9:33 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Fitz
      Fitz

      @Lukas P.: I am not actually reading much transphobia in these comments. I am reading a lot of discomfort with someone who wants attention for getting pregnant after transition. And I share it, and don’t feel at all badly for it. It’s sort of a level of narcissism that I just don’t even know how to understand.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 9:53 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • David
      David

      @ Lukas P:

      “Excluding the transgenders from the big tent that includes the gay/lesbian/bi/questioning communities would be allowing the fundies to divide and conquer.”

      Wait a minute, I thought that “LGBT” was justified because the fundies lump us all together. Now we have to accept it because the fundies are trying to divide and conquer? Please come up with one dishonest excuse and stick with it.

      The truth is that gender identity is simply not the same thing as sexual orientation. There is no divide and conquer because we were never part of one community. Definitionally, we are entirely different. Thus, the vast majority of trans people are straight and the vast majority of gay people are not “trans”. The only reason these 2 distinct groups have been forced together is to satisfy the politically correct dictates of a small group of unelected gay leaders.

      More to the point, this fake concoction called “LGBT” allows trans activists, who are few in number and politically weak, to not only latch onto a larger movement, but to move right into the cockpit and start giving orders. An ally like organized labor or the Democratic Party can only make requests of us; they have no right to make demands. But since the “T” is now officially part of our community, trans activists can demand that gay goals be subordinated to their agenda. That is one reason why ENDA remains in limbo.

      LGBT is a false concept that is essentially covering for a hijacking. It is no more logical than if the teachers’ unions declared themselves a component of the gay community, demanded that opposition to charter schools became our number one issue, and then attacked anyone who objected as a teacher-phobe.

      Jan 27, 2010 at 10:40 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rey
      Rey

      Please. I just want gays to be able to get married. Why bring the circus along?

      Jan 28, 2010 at 1:01 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Lukas P.
      Lukas P.

      @David: I was speaking of communities under the “tent.” I avoid lumping us all into one “big happy family” because we aren’t: each contingent may have similar but not always identical agendas. Women, str8 or gay, face virulent sexism. I don’t. Lesbians seek same-sex marriage and adoption rights, plus reversal of DOMA, DADT, and so do I. Bisexuals seek, um, recognition of their relationships with both genders and to have the legal/tax benefits of same-sex and opposite- sex couples.

      Trans folk seek rights to be legally called by whatever gender they see themselves as, and for healthcare benefits to assist their transition from one gender to another.

      We all want to be able to avoid discrimination in terms of housing, employment, etc., but each group may not prioritize the list in the same order.

      @Fitz: “Narcissism” is a loaded term, but, I can understand that Trans folks want to be recognized as people, be considered as extant cases of people whose own gender identity doesn’t match their perceived identity. Like us, they fall outside the norm, get faced with misunderstanding and rejection and deserve protection from Transbashing. But, unlike us, they require a new wardrobe and legal obstacles to changing their name/gender on gov’t paperwork.

      @jason: Define “fetish,” please. Associating a trans person’s gender orientation with a paraphilia [a word you surely have studied] is something that falls outside of any scientific realm of research that I’ve conducted or read about. A straight man’s love of garter belts may be a fetish, but that is in the context of fantasy play. Once he’s jizzed on his Victoria’s Secret mail-order purchases, he has no desire to be viewed as a woman. Someone undergoing sexual reassignment surgery is not just doing it for a sexual thrill. That person is committing to being his/her assigned gender 24/7. Do a little research, but not on the NOM websites y’hear?

      Jan 28, 2010 at 2:05 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CountMeOut
      CountMeOut

      Oh, the circus is in town. Main attraction: Freaks!

      Jan 28, 2010 at 6:41 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Zoe Brain
      Zoe Brain

      @jason:
      I would never discriminate against gays. But I think some of them treat human sexuality as a grab bag. Their gay ideals are based on fetish rather than anything more substantial.

      Jan 28, 2010 at 7:51 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • swarm
      swarm

      So wait. NO comments on the “reality show” component? Again, selective hearing. Oh lemme latch onto this “cause” and ignore the negative. I call bullshit on these two [even though I can't even follow the facts, Queerty. How about explaining it clearly if you CAN]

      @ #44 Lucas P “Bisexuals seek, um, recognition of their relationships with both genders and to have the legal/tax benefits of same-sex and opposite- sex couples.”

      You guys are overcomplicating everything and making it a big [political & social] mess especially for straight people to keep up. WTF.

      Why the “um”? Obvsly because that’s a label searching for a “cause/complaint”. I agree with the posters complaining about the LGBT label. And a certain narcissistic drama.

      I don’t get it. If you’re bi and not in a committed relationship who cares? Why the drama over being bi?

      It undermines gay issues especially marriage. If you’re single it’s irrelevant. If you’re with a same sex person then you get the “benefits” of being “politically gay” [if it ever becomes a politically reality]. If you’re with an opposite gender person then you have no issue. This is narcissism for real. Like you grew up in the “trophy generation” where everything about you needs to be overshared and made into an issue. Bisexuality is as old as anything else and imo the LEAST of anyone’s problems.

      You guys are overcomplicating EVERYTHING into making your sexuality intrinsically tied to the government. That’s a huge strategic error [in loving being Democrats].

      Don’t you get it? If you took a more Libertarian position, you wouldn’t be at the mercy of every whim/extortion of politicians and special interest groups.

      Go back to the KISS principle. Keep It Simple Stupid.

      Bisexuals have no “issues” unless you go to work making your latest paramour a big ass drama.

      Gay people need to focus on the G not the B or T. I never even got the point of the L, sorry girls. Isn’t that sort of passe? Oh wait, no …because everyone needs a unique LABEL.

      The B and the T is muddying the waters. GAY marriage is the most difficult political challenge and doesn’t need to be made a mess of.

      Trans people need to have a UNIQUE political identity if you’re trying to get the average mainstream straight person to “get it” and certainly not with freak shows – yeah I’ll say it. Like the previous “pregnant man” bullshit where the pregnant person was simply a woman taking hormones. Give me a break.

      Oh I’m really a man in my head so don’t call me a Lesbian and before I actually become one (if ever) I’m having a baby and getting some press while I’m at it. Again, who cares?

      It’s just stupid to lump all sexual variations into one huge label and not helping anyone. You might disagree but you’ll keep disagreeing into future generations until YOU “get it”. Sorry. I agree, it’s so harmful to traditional gay people.

      Ya’ll didn’t invent sexual variations. In the 1960’s my mother had a colleague, a hairdresser, who was a technical hermaphrodite who was living as a man and by today’s standards would appear to be a gay man. I was about 8 years old. We all knew the situation since he was a close friend. He had all the medical help there was available (not much and even like today – complicated) and not a single straight person was mean or hurtful to him even not knowing his technical situation and just thinking he was regular old gay. Why? Because he acted NORMAL like most gay men today. Yeah, it was Philly not some backwater town in Texas, but my point is…Albeit different than being Trans it still illustrates that acting normal goes alot further than whoring yourself out to the National Enquirer and reality tv. Oh, unless you want to use your sexuality for financial gain.

      And don’t complain that this long post makes no sense. I already know that LOL.

      I’m just giving you a straight perspective as someone who grew up in the gay community vis a vis my gay brother and could care less about what other people’s sexual stuff is.

      If I can’t explain “it” or make “it” make sense how do you expect mainstream straight people to have a freaking clue??

      What a mess. I think the only solution is for GAY people to become OUT OUT OUT in the community everywhere- teachers, lawyers, plumbers, chefs, etc… as has been stated over and over. No easy task considering the repercussions. sigh. We’re chasing our tails. And individuals are determined to screw with the movement like these two idiots.

      /derambling now.

      Jan 28, 2010 at 8:08 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Zoe Brain
      Zoe Brain

      Second? Not as such.

      See for example
      http://www.janamarcus.com/docus/TransPresentation/sld015.htm

      They even made a movie a few years ago about the dozens of trans men who have done this before
      http://www.transparentthemovie.com/

      From the IMDB:

      Transparent(2005)…A documentary about 19 female-to-male transsexuals from 14 different states who have given birth and, in most instances, gone on to raise their biological children.

      Jan 28, 2010 at 8:09 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • swarm
      swarm

      ETA “undermine” would have been a better choice of words over “screw with”.

      Jan 28, 2010 at 8:12 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • jason
      jason

      Zoe brain,

      Well, in fact, some so-called gay guys DO have a fetish-based attraction to men. You see it in the guys who only go for men with hairy chests or bald heads, for instance. Their same-sex attraction is based on fetish to a degree that almost supersedes orientation.

      Such fetish-based atttractions do not necessarily indicate a respect for gay rights or the principles of gay rights. Such fetishists couldn’t care less about gay rights.

      Jan 28, 2010 at 8:14 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Zoe Brain
      Zoe Brain

      @CountMeOut:

      Oh, the circus is in town. Main attraction: Perverts!

      You’re channelling Focus on the Family, Concerned Women of Ameroca, MassResistance etc etc.

      See the antics at the Folsom Street Fair! Watch the Leathermen sashay! Thrill to the Dykes on Bikes!

      So… tell me again why straights should give a damn about you?

      Jan 28, 2010 at 8:16 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Zoe Brain
      Zoe Brain

      @jason:

      I’m homophobic. But I have this peculiar respect for Human Rights. Even the Human Rights of people who creep me out. In fact *especially* for them, as if I’m creeped out, odds are a lot of others are too. And they are likely to try to justify their irrational feelings by making up stuff to denigrate those whose existence discomforts them.

      Just as many here are doing.

      Jan 28, 2010 at 8:21 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Lukas P.
      Lukas P.

      @jasonetta: So, are you still arguing that transgenders are fetishists? If you do want to procede with that “logic,” try this new extension on for size: bisexuality is a form of fetish. Gosh, maybe that one hits too close to home. Otherwise, thank you for your response to my question. It speaks volumes.

      I feared that putting “jizz” and “Victoria’s Secret” so close together in a sentence was going to scare away the bi-phobic and trans-curious and hetero-questioning crowd.

      Jan 28, 2010 at 1:44 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CountMeOut
      CountMeOut [Different person #1 using similar name]

      @no. 51
      Exactly Zoe Brain… With freaks like these, and having us lumped with them, yeah, why should anybody, gay or straight, give a fuck about you, I, us? Sound like you’re way too much in the political correctness bullshit. Wake up darling.

      Jan 28, 2010 at 1:53 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Zoe Brain
      Zoe Brain

      @CountMeOut:
      You make an unfounded assumption.

      You’re speaking to a true Freak. A protandrous dichogamous pseudohermaphrodite. A woman so badly Intersexed that she was diagnosed as male in 1985, and female in 2005 (after she had her puberty). But I look normal, I don’t stand out from the crowd.

      Maybe 1 in 50,000 guys are born looking female: but only one in several million gals are born looking male. Freak? Oh yes. “Metabolically Anomalous” to be PC about it.

      You know, some of my medical team seriously considered whether or not I should be classified as of the species H.Sap? They did come to the conclusion that I should, but the question was serious.

      It may be because I’m one of perhaps a thousand people on the whole planet who are like me, that I see the rest of you as one group. Gay, Straight, Black, White, whatever. All Human. All deserving the same rights. No difference.

      When one sub-group oppresses another, saying “we’re not like *them*…” then demands their own rights… why should I be bothered with them? They’d persecute me too if they knew my medical history. And they use “Freak” as the ultimate insult. Just as some use “Faggot” and others “Nigger” to someone who’s straight and white.

      The Irony is that I’m conservative, straight, white, and fully partake of all the heterosexual, cis-gendered and cis-sexual privilege that the Concerned Women of America do. As long as no-one is aware of my past his-story, I’m fine, compared to say, you.

      Jan 28, 2010 at 8:00 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • lisa
      lisa

      I can’t believe some of the reactions I’m reading, the hatred and the fear and the misconceptions. Guys, ever heard of Stonewall?? It’s ” trannies”, as you still see them, who kicked the whole LGBT pride movement into being. Your ignorance simply amazes me. I am cisgender and bisexual, and oh, am I sick of reading people talking in our names . Being bi I know very well how some lesbians, but mostly gay men ( after all, they’re still men, so what do you expect)cling to their smug feeling of being the pure and superior cast in the LGBTQI community. And what would you do with people whose gender is fluid, lynch them? so many facts you get wrong: a lot of MTF transgender women are lesbians, that’s even one of the main reason not to accept the “transsexual ” definition ( for sexual attraction and gender are two separate aspects of one’s identity) In order to have the new identity so far, French trans were required to be sterilized (rings a bell, anyone?)and heterosexual. Now the government said last month they would revised that very backward law. At least they withdrew the trans from the official list of psychological disorders. Why would the American shrinks and self-designed “experts” who write the DSMIV follow that lead? Now, when have they last lost money by writting off a disease instead of making up new ones? Trans people are the golden goose for them.See how they advertize cures for gays or lesbians in that country!!
      Another very basic point you people ought to get right one day: your biological sex (woman, man or inter) , your sexual orientation ( gay , straight, bi, or panlover), your gender of origin and or your real gender, the one you identify with (cis or trans / male , female, or more…)are very distinct things. I don’t see why cis men should not and would not have babies one day, and what’s their dick has to do with it: in the USA 36% of births are caesarian births nowadays, so it’s not a big stretch of imagination to foresee it might happen in your lifetime. Get a life everyone, stop your wiki “science”, go and ask the transgender associations, you’ll get better info.

      Apr 8, 2010 at 7:28 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·

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