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Meet Your Revolutionaries: Mark Oshiro

Photo: Tom Andrews

We first learned about Mark Oshiro while following his Twitter updates as he marched on the Mormon Temple in Los Angeles last week. Under the name Panasonicyouth, he provided other protesters and interested folks with a play by play of what was happening. Then an update appeared: “Holy shit some asshole in a truck” and he went silent. In a sign of how much the internet is shaping the protests, Twitter users spread news that something had happened to Oshiro and even ABC7 got involved in the story.

Hours later, another update: “pacific station. arrested. help”. Oshiro, who along with his co-worker Richard Flores, was released later that night and are facing charges from the LAPD.  Queerty asked him about the experience, what happens now and his advice to future protesters.

QUEERTY: I know you can’t talk about the events leading up to your arrest, but can you tell me what happened after?

Mark Oshiro: Richard and I were both arrested after trying to help Maurice Carriere (the protester assaulted by the guy in the truck with the Yes on 8 poster). For what? We didn’t know, as we weren’t told (definitively) what our charges were going to be for over two and a half hours. We spent a lot of time handcuffed to a bench with our heads against a wall. My blog entry on the ordeal goes into detail more about the whole experience, but suffice to say it was pretty traumatizing, especially when you learn you’re charged with battery on a peace officer. I mean, really, I couldn’t imagine a worse charge.

My brother thankfully bailed me out around 11:30pm and my best friend Ramon was kind enough to bail Richard out (literally) right before midnight. If he had been 5 minutes later, Richard would have had to stay in jail all night.

Why were you protesting? I know that sounds like an obvious question, but I think it’s one people want to know.

Both gay rights and civil rights are important issues to me, so I’ve been protesting various causes since I was in high school. I had learned of the protest outside the Mormon temple at the rally the night before in West Hollywood. I felt there was nothing more symbolic than protesting outside of a church that told its followers to pass a proposition that didn’t affect them, but affected those they were voting against. I’d met gay couples who had become married since our state Supreme Court had overturned Prop 22 and saw how destroyed they were that their marriage license might be dissolved because of a popular vote. It seemed, to me, to be imperative that, as a gay man and as an activist, I show up and give my support and my voice to those who didn’t have it or who it needed it in unison with theirs.

You were Twittering while protesting and while you were arrested, people started talking about what was happening to you via Twitter. When did you find out you’d become an internet sensation? How did you feel?

Oh man, thank the LORD for Twitter. I don’t know if anyone would have even known Rich and I were in jail if it wasn’t for that godsend. I had no idea if anyone knew what happened to us, so while I was being booked in, I asked for my phone to get phone numbers out to call my brother and my mom. (This wasn’t actually a lie; I seriously didn’t know their numbers.) While the officer was talking to the booking officer, I tried to send a Twitter; my service went out immediately after I hit send. So I opened my web browser and tried sending one that way. I got the numbers out of my phone in the meantime and was then ordered to shut off my phone. And that’s when my infamous Twitter was sent out to the world: “pacific station. arrested. help.” Even when I Twitter, I’m melodramatic. Awesome.

It wasn’t until I was bailed out and turned on my phone that I realized the full scope of the last 11 hours. I literally had so many text messages my SIM card on my Sidekick went haywire. I had so many emails, it exceeded the capacity on my phone. Then my friends in the lobby all told me about the liveblog on Buzznet and the ridiculous Twitter strings and the existence of a video they described as “disturbing” and “horrifying.”

What’s going on with your case now?

I wish I knew! Richard and I spoke with the LA Gay and Lesbian Center’s legal department yesterday and set up a consultation meeting; we have an appointment with a Lambda Legal lawyer later this afternoon. So, as far as we know, we’re still charged with battery on a peace officer. Our court date is December 3rd.

All we’re doing is trying to spread the word about what happened to us and the importance of this issue, both here in California and in the rest of the country. Richard’s not too keen on the spotlight, but I myself am terrified of seeing this swept under the rug. I know how often cases like this fall off the radar so quickly and perhaps because I’m personally involved, I really don’t want to see this happen.

There are protests scheduled for tomorrow in New York and across the country. What words of advice do you have for demonstrators?

Don’t be anti-religious bigots, for one. Protest a church’s involvement in an election and protest their contribution to passing Prop 8. But don’t turn it into a free-for-all on that church’s tenets or members. One, it makes absolutely no sense to do that. Why protest the Mormon church’s practice of polygamy, which was outlawed AGES AGO? It’s no longer relevant. Why protest anything else they believe in? Protest what they did, not who they are.

Don’t be racist. While I don’t agree with the number of “70%” when it comes to how many people in the black community voted for Prop 8, there’s no denying the rampant homophobia that runs through that community. But holy fuck, please do not turn this into a racist tirade against black people. Not only is it not the point of the protest, but you’re perpetrating the same hatred and ignorance you’re charging them with. Grow up and be mature about your charges against them. Again, protest what they did, not who they are.

Do you plan on continuing to protest?

Absolutely. I went to the gigantic protest in Silverlake last Saturday; I’ll be attending a rally on the 15th, along with hundreds of thousands of other people around the world. And I’m trying to find a way to Sacramento on the 22nd to (hopefully) be one of a million people there.

I just plan on walking the opposite direction whenever I see riot gear.

By:           Japhy Grant
On:           Nov 11, 2008
Tagged: , , , , ,
  • 56 Comments
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      I’m shallow as hell for saying this now, but dude is very cute. Very.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 1:48 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • waffle twat
      waffle twat

      Hero.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 1:51 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Dubwise
      Dubwise

      @fredo777:I TOTALLY agree.

      The Revolution is my Boyfriend!

      Nov 11, 2008 at 1:52 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      More importantly, I think what he’s doing is beautiful.

      Fight on, mang.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 1:56 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • David Dust
      David Dust

      Another shallow betch here … but Daddy could march on my temple ANY DAY!

      Nov 11, 2008 at 1:56 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • audiored
      audiored

      @fredo777:

      Nah, that’s not shallow. =) He’s not only hot, he’s smart.

      I agree with him regarding the focus of the protests. Keep it about what these zealots do to deny equal protection to other citizens, not all their freaky beliefs.

      And I especially agree to not make this an ethnic/racial wedge. The queer community has done a poor job and making allies and building coalitions with other marginalized communities. About time we learn how to do that.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 2:06 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • panasonicyouth
      panasonicyouth

      Hahahah you guys are flattering. Thanks for the compliments!

      Nov 11, 2008 at 2:11 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • TalonSlayer
      TalonSlayer

      Mark is a class act. I respect the hell out of that guy. And yes, he’s very man-pretty.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 2:14 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • deiXmachinis
      deiXmachinis

      I’ll echo previous comments: hot, smart, cool. I hope you return my follow on twitter! <3

      Nov 11, 2008 at 2:21 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • panasonicyouth
      panasonicyouth

      I hate you Paul.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 2:22 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • RamonDestroys
      RamonDestroys

      HA. DADDY! Amazing.

      I love you, Mark. I know you guys would have bailed me out if it was me. We’ll be there on the 22nd and you know you can ride with us.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 2:25 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Yashiyama
      Yashiyama

      Mark and Rich, You guys are my heroes.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 2:26 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Darth Paul
      Darth Paul

      “I mean, really, I couldn’t imagine a worse charge.”

      Really? Surely he’s not that lacking in imagination. We’re talking LAPD here…

      Nov 11, 2008 at 2:51 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Lee
      Lee

      Awesome=Mark
      And thanks for reminding us that this isn’t an excuse to pull out the racism. I am so glad to see people pulling together from around the world~that is the true beauty of sharing one voice…

      Nov 11, 2008 at 2:53 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      @audiored:

      haha

      True. He’s not only good-looking, but also makes a lot of sense. Talk about a catch.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 2:57 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      @panasonicyouth:

      lol

      Color me embarrassed.

      Welcome, Mark.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 2:59 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Othniel
      Othniel

      As a Gay lawyer, I just feel compelled to remind you to listen to yours. I’m in Texas, but I know there are very many good ones in your area, and you have taken the correct steps to find one.

      Next, I am old enough I still dictate my e-mails to my secretary, but the way you used that twittering contraption gives me hope for the future. I’m still trying to find one of those boysenberry phones.

      Also, as a Gay theologian, your words were especially heartenng to me.

      Keep up the good work, but remember only the religious right has a martyr complex. Take care of yourself too.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 3:06 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • michael
      michael

      Hot, smart and sexy. See, we gay people do rock! Please Queerty,
      do your best to keep us abreast of what happens with their case and inform of us of any other venue where we might find info about it. We cannot forget about these guys who have risked their well being to help the cause.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 3:18 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      @Othniel:

      lmao @ boysenberry phone

      That’s adorable.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 3:20 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • ILOVEZ
      ILOVEZ

      Well! What can I say! GREAT JOB MARK!!! Hope!! he can get away with it!

      Nov 11, 2008 at 3:22 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • mark
      mark

      mark

      You are one of the men who will pick up the mantle of the older queers who brought us this far, and like many other posters mentioned, there’s much to admire about you.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 3:27 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • d
      d

      Mark=Hero, ask him about the time he saved someone’s life, when no one would.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 3:30 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • julian
      julian

      Love.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 4:01 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Trenton
      Trenton

      はっぱがいつも目茶かっこういいわ。頭もいいし…

      L.A.è¿„ いけばお酒何杯も挙げたいなあ…

      Ganbatte!

      Nov 11, 2008 at 4:14 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Kelsey
      Kelsey

      I can’t believe how much publicity this is getting. It’s awesome.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 4:31 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jeff
      Jeff

      Hot!

      Nov 11, 2008 at 4:37 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      @Jeff:

      Yes, we’ve established that.

      ; )

      Nov 11, 2008 at 4:51 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Tanya
      Tanya

      I SEE A KELSEY UP THUR.

      I agree with D. Ask him about the time he saved someone’s life. Or the time he biked from San Fransisco to LA for charity. Or the ten thousand other amazing stories he has.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 4:59 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Kirren
      Kirren

      This man is one of my greatest heroes right now, and I can’t even BEGIN to describe how very proud of him I am. We love you Mark!

      (p.s. you are adorable)

      Nov 11, 2008 at 5:03 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • trustno1
      trustno1

      You are a Hero, not only for what happened on that day but by the way you handle yourself ALWAYS.

      much love

      Nov 11, 2008 at 5:14 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • TalonSlayer
      TalonSlayer

      I can fly higher than an eagle, cuz Mark is the wind beneath my wings.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 5:27 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • lexicaljewel
      lexicaljewel

      I’m so glad to see Mark and Rich’s stories getting profiled here. I thought of you all when you were out there, and hoped, Mark and Japhy, that you would meet each other! Didn’t think it would come about THIS way but I’m glad you’ve found each other, nonetheless.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 5:33 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • parisinla
      parisinla

      I guess were getting a morning goods Mark Oshiro soon?

      Nov 11, 2008 at 7:00 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Trenton
      Trenton

      @33 We don’t want to give the prosecution any ammo…so only fully clothed goods.

      Until they are acquitted. ^_^

      Nov 11, 2008 at 7:16 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Miley Crisis
      Miley Crisis

      I want Mark for the Morning Goods! Get someone out there to get some snaps of him in his Anarchy boxers.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 8:07 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • emliy
      emliy

      @trenton
      are you calling mark a “happa”??
      he is wicked cool and smart but… half asian? unless you meant something else with “happa”

      Nov 11, 2008 at 8:09 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • conrad
      conrad

      THERE IS NOTHING REVOLUTIONARY ABOUT GAY MARRIAGE!

      what fucking planet is everyone on?!

      Nov 11, 2008 at 8:14 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Trenton
      Trenton

      @Emily.
      Whoops. My mistake. Oshiro is a Japanese surname, and in that picture he could pass. Hell, one (happa) friend of mine could pass for his younger brother.

      lalala. Doesn’t change the rest of what I said. そうして毎日毎日もう少し日本語を忘れて仕舞うので少なくとも伝えましてよかった。ありがとうね。

      Nov 11, 2008 at 8:30 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Trenton
      Trenton

      @Conrad
      Perhaps it isn’t a revolution in the truest sense. And if you are offended by the use of the word, kindly submit your complaint the the Office of Hyperbole Abuse…or just more gently make your point without suggesting that we are delusional.

      You can expect a subpoena from the Department of Buzzkill Control, by the way.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 8:38 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Emily
      Emily

      @Trenton

      Haha, that’s right! I noticed that about his name too  (笑). all makes sense now :)
      あたしももっと練習さなくちゃいけない。マークくんはお酒を飲まない事にしているんだけど、LAにいれば、あたしはトレントン君と一緒に杯を挙げろうね! (日本語で下手ぁぁ)

      Nov 12, 2008 at 1:04 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • panasonicyouth
      panasonicyouth

      I am actually adopted; my dad’s last name was Oshiro. I’m Hispanic, mostly. Maybe something else in there too? WHO KNOWS.

      @Conrad: Would you like to support that comment?

      Nov 12, 2008 at 2:13 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • shaun
      shaun

      After careful consideration, I have decided that our next “Morning Goods” is right here…. he is stunningly sexy, isn’t afraid to stand up for his rights, clearly not lacking in the brains department… oh and did I mention stunningly sexy?!

      Nov 12, 2008 at 9:08 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • conrad
      conrad

      a primer, since it was prompted…

      So, what is wrong with gay marriage?

      In order to answer that question we must first understand what this thing called marriage is. Marriage is essentially a financial and legal contract that allocates the movement of property, power and privilege from one person to another. Historically it has been a way of consolidating family power amongst and between men, through women. In more recent times marriage in the United States has functioned to solidify the American middle class. Marriage does this through concentrating wealth and power through family lines and inheritance (both in terms of money and power). Because of marriage’s ability to discipline class structures it is now, and always has been a primary structure of a capitalist economy. In reality most people marry within their own socioeconomic class. Marriage, earlier through miscegenation laws, and currently through racist “values” also contains wealth through racist ideologies of matrimony. Because of these realities there has been a long history of critique of the institution of marriage launched by feminists of color, white feminists, and queer people among others.

      What about gay marriage? Isn’t gay marriage going to change all of this?

      NO. The current push towards gay marriage is, in fact, not going to subvert the systems of domination we all live through. Ironically, the gay marriage movement is standing on these same legacies of brutality for their slice of the wedding cake. Take for example the “Freedom to Marry” stickers created by the freedom to marry organization. Not only are these stickers falsely equating the intervention of the State into ones life (marriage) with “freedom” (when was the last time the State helped you to become more “free”?) they are trying to work this idea through horrifying star-spangled stickers. Instead of critiquing the ways US imperialism has rendered most transgender people, queer people, people or color etc. as expendable through its countless wars here and abroad, the Freedom To Marry stickers simply disguise these histories and reproduce this red-white-and-blue national theme for every married gay and guilt filled liberal to wear with PRIDE.

      If straight people can marry, why should gay people not have the same privilege?

      What we are calling for is an abolishment of State sanctioned coupling in either the hetero or homo incarnation. We are against any institution that perpetuates the further exploitation of some people for the benefit of others. Why do the fundamental necessities marriage may provide for some (like healthcare) have to be wedded to the State sanctioned ritual of terror known as marriage?

      Won`t gay marriage help couples stay together where one person is not a US citizen?

      The way immigration is being used by the gay marriage movement is not only un-thought-out but also relies on racist notions of the “white man saving his brown lover”. Although it is true that because of the US policies on immigration some lesbian and gay couples may be split, gay marriage does not at all question these systems that allow some people into the country( white) while excluding others (people of color). Where are the gay marriage “activists” when the INS is actively raiding and deporting whole families ?(such as it is currently doing just blocks away from the Castro in San Francisco’s Mission District). Also missing from the picture of immigration that gay marriage advocates are painting is the reality that there are queer couples in the US where neither person is a US citizen. How will gay marriage help them stay in the US if that is what they want to do? Gay marriage will not challenge “citizenship” but simply place some bodies within its grasp while holding others out.

      I agree with your argument, but isn’t gay marriage a step in the right direction?

      This liberal model of “progression” is one of the primary ways many of us are ideologically trapped into a reformist way of thinking. To understand how gay marriage, like voting, will never lead to liberation we can look to the histories of many “social justice movements” that only address oppressions on a level of the symptomatic. Gay marriage and voting are symbolic gestures that reinforce structures while claiming to reconfigure them. This scheme will undoubtedly become apparent with “marriage equality” advocates. As they have positioned gay marriage as the last great civil rights battle, will they continue to fight after the Honeymoon?

      Won’t gay marriage help get health care to more people?

      It may help some people get healthcare but for the vast majority of Americans with NO healthcare it will do nothing. And within the rhetoric of the gay marriage movement working towards healthcare for all (people and animals) is nowhere to be found. This argument also relies on the false assumption that one person would already have healthcare.

      So if you are against gay marriage then you are allying with the Christian Right and the GOP!

      NO. This is amongst the most troubling aspect of this current epidemic of gay marriage. The way the marriage movement is framing any critique of their precious institution is either you are one of us (gay married) or you are one of them (homophobe). This helps to silence the much needed debate and public discourse around such issues. It seems as if everyone has been shamed into submission and subsequent silence by the marriage movement. Even in allegedly “progressive” circles any mention of the implicit links between marriage, misogyny, and racism in the U.S. gets shutdown by a “gay married”. Ironically, if you look at the rhetoric of the freedom to marry movement and the Republican Party their similarities are frighteningly apparent. In their ideal world we would all be monogamously coupled, instead of rethinking the practice of “coupling”. They want us working our jobs not working towards collective and self-determination, remembering anniversaries not the murder of trans-people, buying wedding rings not smashing capitalism. The vision of the future the republicans and the gay marriage movement has offered will render most of us already in the margins of the picture (trans-people, sex workers, queers of color, HIV positive people, non-monogamous people etc) as the new enemy of the régime of married normalcy they hope to usher in.

      Nov 12, 2008 at 9:42 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Trenton
      Trenton

      What we are calling for is an abolishment of State sanctioned coupling in either the hetero or homo incarnation. We are against any institution that perpetuates the further exploitation of some people for the benefit of others. Why do the fundamental necessities marriage may provide for some (like healthcare) have to be wedded to the State sanctioned ritual of terror known as marriage?

      I can agree with this, as well as your first long paragraph, but the section that begins “The current push towards gay marriage is…” kind of loses me. You seem to be calling for a complete restructuring of the system (I’m thinking Communist or something of that nature), and that’s all well and good. It shines a little light on your being miffed at the use of the word revolution. However, to conflate the desire for recognition and protection under the current law with utter complacency about the atrocities committed by that same larger entity is spurious at best.

      The way immigration is being used by the gay marriage movement is not only un-thought-out but also relies on racist notions of the “white man saving his brown lover”.

      Irate, self-righteous, post-colonial studies at its best, right here. Which is not to say that it is completely accurate. But if you ever wonder, Conrad, why people aren’t taking your opinions seriously, it may just be because you word everything as a personal attack. By alienating your potential audience, it seems that you have played into the hands of this ATROCIOUS patriarchy you so abhor. Bravo?

      But to more directly address the point you make here, these are social issues and civil issues, but they are also (here comes a dirty word for you) economic issues. They are all very complex and they each have various ramifications. It is not negligent to fight for one issue and not simultaneously for the billions of others; it’s necessary. And if you want to recruit people for these other causes…Pro tip: don’t tell them that they are racist/hypocritical for not spreading themselves across every issue known to man. Or do you think that we are already a lost cause, and now you’re just wagging your finger?

      As they have positioned gay marriage as the last great civil rights battle, will they continue to fight after the Honeymoon?

      I do hope so. I agree that this is addressing a symptom and not the cause and that the cause is bigger than homophobia…it’s xenophobia/misogyny/racism a whole cocktail of social ills that we are only very slowly chipping away. But sometimes you have to treat the symptoms first for the body to normalize and fight the underlying infection. In this case that starts with integration…or at least the option to integrate, though many will always exercise their right to abstain and remain separatist. That’s their prerogative, just as some churches will never accept gay marriages “religiously” though they are accepted legally. Whoopty doo to them. The point is that every generation is less biased against gender/race/sexual orientation etc. than the last, and this will progress will accelerate if we see functional gay-parented families.

      That’s all I have time for. Good luck, and stuff…

      Nov 12, 2008 at 5:54 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • panasonicyouth
      panasonicyouth

      I don’t think a single person here expect Conrad to come up with THAT defense. And I applaud him, though I think his anger is misdirected at the wrong party.

      I think Trenton hits the nail on the head:

      “I agree that this is addressing a symptom and not the cause and that the cause is bigger than homophobia…it’s xenophobia/misogyny/racism a whole cocktail of social ills that we are only very slowly chipping away. But sometimes you have to treat the symptoms first for the body to normalize and fight the underlying infection. In this case that starts with integration…or at least the option to integrate, though many will always exercise their right to abstain and remain separatist.”

      I personally have not the slightest desire to get married and neither does my boyfriend. I understand the economic and legal factors associated with it, but marriage has always felt like more of a religious thing to me. I’ve always associated marriages with a church and boy, I don’t like churches.

      However, as most of us agree, this isn’t a religious issue at all. It’s about integration and legal equality. Conrad, I seriously agree with you on a lot of what you say, but you’re essentially saying, “There is bigger fight to fight, so this one is irrelevant.”

      It’s not. It has it’s place and it has it’s time (right now). Stepping stones first.

      Nov 12, 2008 at 6:13 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • panasonicyouth
      panasonicyouth

      Also, what is this “Morning Goods” thing you guys keep talking about? Am I going to be afraid for asking for that?

      Nov 12, 2008 at 6:14 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      @panasonicyouth:

      “Also, what is this “Morning Goods” thing you guys keep talking about?”

      http://www.queerty.com/morning-goods-bryan-thomas-20081112/

      haha

      I don’t think you should be afraid…unless, of course, you mind having some of our more catty posters criticize your half-naked body.

      Nov 12, 2008 at 6:39 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Trenton
      Trenton

      MorninG goods is the daily dose of (often provocative) male model photos to serve as inspiration/thinspiration/targets of hypercritical cattiness posted first thing every day on the blog. In other words, harmless (?)objectifcation…but here only in the most flattering sense.

      Nov 12, 2008 at 6:40 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Trenton
      Trenton

      One edit to my previous post for Conrad:

      “Irate, self-righteous, post-colonial studies at its best, right here. Which is not to say that it is completely accurate”

      I meant to say ‘inaccurate’. As I stated before, I agree with much of what was said, and I think there is some brilliance to this whole Gay Shame movement of which you seem to be a part. I still can’t agree with your method, though I do appreciate your dedication to the long-term fight and recognition that this victory (when it comes) will be only a patch. A patch is still worth something, though.

      And because my meeting was cancelled (YAY)…

      NO. This is amongst the most troubling aspect of this current epidemic of gay marriage. The way the marriage movement is framing any critique of their precious institution is either you are one of us (gay married) or you are one of them (homophobe). This helps to silence the much needed debate and public discourse around such issues.

      Agreed. I know some very good-natured, rational people who for non-bigoted, non-homophobic reasons have problems with gay “marriage”, and nine times out of ten it’s an issue of rhetoric…definitions…sacred words…hocus pocus. Shutting them down with a “bigot” doesn’t serve much. Dialog does…

      However, we are dealing with mobs on both sides, and individuals are rarely capable of civil dialog, let alone mobs. And here you too have used (or pasted) derisive and sensational terminology to attack those who do not support your own cause. So let us just agree that these things will inevitably happen and each do our on part to minimize it in our own language. I will fall short, too, but if we keep each other aware of this tendency we’ll get a lot further.

      Lastly, I agree that there are many who want the sort of utopian/dystopian world of married consumeristic normalcy that you (and I) would disdain…ever fear. The forces propagating such a world are powerful, but they live within the mob more than they do in individual information brokers or conservative cabals. And I see how this symbolic victory, to your eyes, could actually further a hollow, state-suckled state by allowing groups to assimilate rather than keeping erect the barriers from whose parapets notions of a loftier world are launched…I understand that those barriers and the antagonism engender passion and great ideas. I think, however, that it is very pessimisti to think that even once those barriers are eliminated we cannot sustain our passion and continue to strive for a better world, whatever that may be.

      So yea…hooray for gay marriage, but keep on trucking, muh dear.

      Nov 12, 2008 at 7:04 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • tim
      tim

      @conrad: I can’t believe someone said it! Please people, let’s use this instance to think harder and not just try to conform to a way of relating just because it was denied to us in the first place. I agree with people marrying whomever they want but, although extremely idealist, I think marriage should be abolished altogether. What happened to trying to create “new possibilities for relationships beyond
      the ones laid down since antiquity in the form of
      kinship and conjugality” ?

      Nov 13, 2008 at 4:19 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Brian Miller
      Brian Miller

      let’s use this instance to think harder and not just try to conform

      Oh my lord!

      If I had a dime for everytime some barfly gym-bunny twink in Prada and Calvin Klein undies lectured me on “nonconformity” without seeing the irony, I’d be a very wealthy homo.

      People advocating the promiscuous bar-hopping gay ghetto lifestyle (yet complaining about “conformity”) are the ultimate conformists. They’re not offering “liberation,” but rather attempting to impose THEIR views on others by denying gay folks who do want to get married that option.

      Nov 13, 2008 at 8:35 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • conrad
      conrad

      i think the rampant racism coming from the gay marriage movement post-prop 8 really highlights what i’ve been trying to say…

      and no, im not part of gay shame. i live in small town maine. if a country boy from the sticks can have a fierce analysis that questions all the systems that are at work trying to kill us, erase our histories and de-sexual our existence then so can you city boys with all yr cultural access. come on now…

      and please dont bring the anti-intellectual cut downs into this. again if a little faggot like me in the sticks of maine can think critically about “change” so can you. its not my fault yr stupid or unwillingly to question.

      Nov 13, 2008 at 11:51 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Trenton
      Trenton

      Given that your long post was verbatim from a mySpace page from someone who is part of Gay Shame and that you can barely string together two words properly in your follow-up post (not an “anti-intellectual cut down” but the truth), I have to assume that you have no “fierce analysis” of your own…or that you are anything that you say above.

      So yea…aren’t you just the dearest, little disappointment…

      Nov 13, 2008 at 2:14 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Richard
      Richard

      @fredo777: Not at all shallow. Totally hot.

      Nov 15, 2008 at 11:44 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • RyanPower
      RyanPower

      I would beat this handsome man with my nightstick any day of the week. What a hottie.

      Nov 23, 2008 at 4:34 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • DorothyOverTheRainbow
      DorothyOverTheRainbow

      I’m a complete clown so don’t take any offence in my comment, also English isn’t my native tongue but…

      Battery of a peace officer… Does that mean someone with a (taser)gun, nightstick and handcuffs claims to be beat up by gays? Must get him some funny reactions in the office LoL

      Don’t get me wrong, I’m out, proud and all up for gay rights… But this sounds so rediculous I just had to joke. It totally seems like some homophobic excuse to sue human rights protesters.

      Like that’d make us say “oh, hell, I might get sued for something made-up and silly… wel let’s not fight for our rights anymore then!”

      Unless above mentioned peace officer had to seek medical treatment he’s a total ass for makin a case out of it… IF there’s even something to make a case out of.

      Apr 7, 2009 at 4:53 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·

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