If someone thinks that it takes spinelessness and not courage to stand up and assert that I am unique and still deserve, albeit by a different title, rights that other people have, than you are clearly in need of some self respect.
If people want marriage then they shoukld fight with the churches. If you want rights ask for rights.

No. 30 · youcanthandlethetruth : This is an intelligent perspective:
Then why not work on improving civil unions instead of trying to take on the majority of Americans, who don’t want to redefine marriage to accommodate homosexuals?
. . .Unless the homosexuals just want to piss people off?

The reason why so many gay people from foreign secuar countries think thaty we are all nuts. Logistics dictate that if you really want the right involved in marriage and not the fetish or quasirespectability you would’nt go in waving flags that just enrage people senseless as that is it still is what happens. Deal with the facts!

Should they have the right to marry redefined to accommodate their chosen sexual dysfunction?

After all this is the United States and everyone is equal.

Here is some truth. This is the United States. We treat people EQUALLY in this country. There IS NO DEBATING THAT.

You can debate until your little face turns bright red and you will still lose.

Equality is walking into a voting booth and being able to give the SAME RIGHTS to people DIFFERENT than you. If you CANNOT DO THAT YOU DO NOT STAND FOR EQUALITY AND FREEDOM IN THIS COUNTRY.

Imagine having civil unions all over the country, a special contract just for homosexuals. How special would that make you feel?

After all homosexuals have special privileges in employment and property law, and soon they will get their Hate Crime Law passed. So why not a special version of marriage for homosexuals called a civil union?

Unless the homosexuals just want to piss people off?

coming from someody who disagrees with you …A LOT on here.

Well said!!

The domestic partner law in Ca. doesn’t grant all the benefits, of marriage, legal, financial, or with regard to insurance. It doesn’t even come close.

I am solidly, 100% behind you on this issue.

M Shane would do well to take a lesson from History.

And then by shutting his ugly mouth.

The Churches are the ones dragging LGBT people into the War. Not the other way around. Go up to some of your straight married friends and tell them to swap their marriage for a civil union.

Regardless,

This is the United States, if you think its OK to walk into a voting booth and vote “yes” to eliminate given rights, you should check yourself harshly.

It does not matter who is on the chopping block in a voting booth. You don’t elimate rights in this country..and you can fill in the blank for any group.

Obviously, you don’t seem to understand why I want my equal civil rights. A few expamples to spell it out for you: I want to be able to pay the same taxes for the same rights, not more taxes for less rights. I want to cross the border as a family, instead of complete strangers in the eyes of US customs. I want my partner to share in my health care plan and not have to treat that as taxable income unlike my straight working peers. If I die before my partner, I want him to be able to pull off of Social Security that I have paid into for the last 30 years. If I die, I want him to inherit all of our assets 100% tax free like our neighbors instead of paying outrageous inheritance tax gouging rates. Etc., etc..

Did any of this have anything to do with religion? No it doesn’t. It has everything to do with hate. And if you think that just by existing as an ignorant gay person that you seem to be, does not mean that the religious right will not try to fuck up your life at every turn just like they have mine.

Grow up, grow a spine and please open your eyes to the reality around you before you continue to make a complete ass out of yourself everytime you voice your opinion.

Thanks.

Oh, and then there was the by now, classic…

There are enough real issues comment.

It’s like telling a cancer patient that he is being selfish by wanting to know if there have been any recent medical breakthroughs in cancer research and that should he should be concerned with issues like the Environment, the eminent collapse of the economy and other more important stuff like that.

Brother M Shane said…

Instead they want to be housewifes like mom and have the churches blessing at the expense of people who are authentically gay

Wow, Brother Shanes’s disdain for the gay community is so obvious as to be downright painful. I’ve heard some really deprecating statements from M Shane before, but this one really takes the cake. It sounds exactly like something DuttyBarb or SM might have said.

First of all, no one in the LGBT community has called for any kind of recognition from the church, much less their blessings. It would, indeed, be a cold day in hell before that ever happened.

Secondly, he fails to understand that not only do the Mormoms and the church not want us to have same-sex marriage privileges, they do not even want to have any kind of a civil-union or partnership that even suggests a committed relationship with any of the benefits of such a union implied.

Any such relationship, irregardless of what it is called, remains an abomination and a sin according to their bible…and they will stand on that position until hell freezes over.

Evidently, M Shane is also unaware that the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops have refused to back that portion of the UAFA bill for LGBT people in committed, long term, bi-national relationships either. Which means that people like InExile and I cannot sponsor our partners for American Citizenship like straight couples can.

http://www.usccb.org/comm/arch.....-122.shtml

But, that is not M Shane’s problem, is it? M Shane has made it abundantly clear that he resents being “dragged” into a “crackpot religious war” that he feels does not concern him.

Guess M Shane never heard of Pastor Martin Niemoeller’s poem, “First they came…” either.

I don’t give a flying fuck about religion – yours or anyone elses. I want the SAME RIGHTS AS EVERYONE ELSE. Not VIRTUALLY the same. See the difference?

The only reason you could have been “decieved” is by not learning about things for yourself – whose fault is that?

http://www-news.uchicago.edu/r.....vation.pdf
http://www.newscientist.com/ch.....e-sex.html
Gay, Straight Men’s Brain Responses Differ
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,155990,00.html
http://www.livescience.com/hea.....genes.html
http://www.springerlink.com/co.....00k586276/
http://blogs.discovermagazine......06/16/172/

There is overwhelming scientific evidence that homosexuality is not a choice. Sexual orientation is generally a biological trait that is determined pre-natally, although there is no one certain thing that explains all of the cases. “Nurture” may have some effect, but for the most part it is biological.

I’m really happy to have you set out the truth of the “marriage” issue & prop. 8. Had I known that there was a domestic partnership law in effect in California, it would have been clear that the gays making all the fuss are a bunch of religious fanatics themselves.

I don’t appreciate being decieved about that by so many people. If they have virtually got all of the rights of marriage couples their whinning is just stupid. They should go to church and puele instead of wasting everyone elses time with a religious fetish.

If gay people were truly liberated and happy with thier difference from straight people they would bedelighted with getting their oun version of partnership rights. Instead they want to be housewifes like mom and have the churches blessing at the expense of people who are authentically gay

There are enough real issues without dragging the rest of us into a crackpot religious war.

Homosexuality is not a sin according to the Bible. Any educated Christian would know that. Scholars who have studied the Bible in context of the times and in relation to other passages have shown those passages (Leviticus, Corinthians, Romans, etc) have nothing to do with homosexuality. These passages often cherry-picked while ignoring the rest of the Bible. The sins theses passages are referring to are idolatry, prostitution, and rape, not homosexuality.

http://www.soulfoodministry.or.....otASin.htm
http://www.jesus21.com/content.....print.html
http://www.christchapel.com/romans_inter.html
http://www.stjohnsmcc.org/new/.....rences.php
http://www.gaychristian101.com/

We love being married after 33 years together being engaged marry in PA where we two American citizens live.

We pay equal taxes without equal civil marriage rights. Equality is our birthright as Americans.

Don’t be silly.

On the first point – the church bankrolled and actively promoted Prop 8. Sorry, but they are active participants. They are not shy about it either, and admit it openly in their own press releases:
http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnew.....uninformed

And here’s another one of their own press releases referring to themselves as the Mormon Church:
http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnew.....mon-chapel

Mark Leno’s bill is anything but a “cheap shot.” The California Supreme Court said in a footnote that it did not address the issue of out of state marriages, so that left it to the Legislature to fill the gap. The Court also said same-sex couples MUST be afforded the same rights and priviledges as hetero-marriages, but can’t use the name for any marriages into after the effective date of Prop 8. This bill clarifies that post Prop 8 out-of-state marriage will be treated like a domestic partnership (i.e., all the rights but not the marriage name). That’s a cheap shot?

Mike
http://theqtube.com/view/554/mike-andrews-tell-me/

I’m looking forward to meeting them, and their families and friends too.

Kudos to New England and Iowa for supporting civil marriage.

Cheers guys!

Joe Mustich, Justice of the Peace,
Washington, Connecticut USA.

It’s time CA. It’s time America.

What is offensive to me is that straight couples from anywhere else in the world are accepted as married when the come to the USA and we don’t even accept our own states?

I’m sure the legal beagles are waiting for the “right” moment to challenge this nonsense under the “full faith & credit” clause of the Constitution. But it seems clear enough to me the Full Faith clause applies to same sex marriages albeit I admit I’m not a lawyer.