I think the Catholic Church lost the moral high ground when they started shuffling pedophiles from church to church, then denied they ever knew anything about it.

As for the gay issue, all you have to do is substitute the word "Jew", "black" or "inter-racial" in place of the word "gay" and it becomes so clear.

"Church officials also believe that the its seven adoption agencies could be closed if they were required to place children with Jewish couples in defiance of Vatican guidelines."

Wow, that sounds pretty bigoted, doesn't it?

Well, Catholic Charities in the Archdiocese of Boston has stopped doing adoptions due to the Massachusetts law that allows gay adoption - even though the lay board voted unanimously to keep working with gay families. Luckily most adoptions in MA are done through state agencies and not through CC, but still.

Why should the government tell religious people what they can do in their own churches? I'm gay, but come on! Sure they are bigots, but they still should have freedom from government intervention in religion. Who cares, why would a gay person want to get married in a church that was being *forced* to marry you when there are lots of churches that are happy to do it?

I think that the Catholic churches threat to withdraw social services shows them up to be the nasty pieces of work I've always suspected them of being. However, the less contact Catholic Priest have with kids the better!
I agree with Judson also, why would any gay person want anything to do with any aspect of church or religion?
Let them stew in their own vile pond of hatred, have their own backward rules, just don't let them influence government policy or law making.

I agree with Judson...the govt has absolutely no place in telling what churches can and cannot do...it goes against everything that a democracy espouses (including a parliamentary democracy). the church should be left alone to implode on their own by losing public support by promoting hate.

Hey Gays:
The only one that is hateful is you. You HATE the Catholic Church and it shows in your words. And you HATE because they don't agree with your lifestyle. You are the most insecure people on the planet... If we don't agree with your lifestyle and think its wrong, you hate us. You so desperately want to force your way of life into our Churches. Why don't you learn to leave people alone? We have every right to believe your lifestyle is wrong, deal with it. Do you see us at gay rallies trying to force our way in? Nope. So stay out of the Church if you don't agree with it, plain and simple.

As for Jim, how about this one:

"Church officials also believe that the its seven adoption agencies could be closed if they were required to place children with murderers in defiance of Vatican guidelines."

As for the Church imploding, you people and the media are so out of touch with reality. I happen to be a young Catholic who works in the Church and I've been worldwide... Sorry to inform you, it is growing amongst the youth. Ever heard of the new Oxford movement? Scott Hahn? Catholic Answers? Saint Joseph's Communications? What about "Courage"? Courage is the outreach to gay's and many gay Catholic men have gone through and rejected that way of life. Philip Thorson of San Diego is just one of them. Do a google on his name, it might do you some good.

Just to add to my previous post. Stop trying to demonize the Church... you who say such things are scandalous liars.

You post things in your articles that the Church is hateful of gays, disdains gays, bigoted, etc. Use a little logic and think.

Hates gays? You are dead wrong we believe in loving the sinner, hating the sin (i.e. the lifestyle). You could not hold a candle to the Church in the amount of love and outreach it gives to the world. Have you hugged a leper to comfort him? Do you sacrifice your time to visit prisoners on the weekends? Do you walk the streets handing food to the poor? Do you drive down to Mexico to build homes for the less fortunate? Do you live amongst forsaken leper in their colony only to end up dying with them?

By the way, I've had gay friends, they know I don't approve of their lifestyle and they understand that and respect my beliefs. They have shown respect for the Church to hold its beliefs. I thank God that they are honest enough with themselves to remove themselves from Catholicism completely and logical enough to understand people can hold beliefs contrary to their own without the need to demonize them..

The church has been wrong before (remember the crusades?) and is wrong again. Hate begats hate. Religious fundamentalists in America are on par with religous fundementalists in Iran. The saddest part is they yell the loudest and color all Christians in a bad shade or intolerance.

Get religion out of the government game of granting rights with marriage. Create a government program called unions that give all the benefits and anyone who wants a "marriage" can go to church and get one, just don't expect the government to recognize it until you get your "union".

Religion has evolved before and scripture has been manipulated and ignored. Read through Leviticus and find that "lieing with a male as with a woman" is equal to eating shrimp at Red Lobster.

"But all in the seas or in the rivers that do not have fins and scales, all that move in the water or any living thing which is in the water, they are an abomination to you." (Leviticus 11:10)

"They (shellfish) shall be an abomination to you; you shall not eat their flesh, but you shall regard their carcasses as an abomination." (Leviticus 11:11)

"Whatever in the water does not have fins or scales; that shall be an abomination to you." (Leviticus 11:12)

Meanwhile, shrimp eaters can still marry in most churches today...

In Canada, we've solved that problem -- Gay men and women have the right to marry, but religious orgnizations are not forced to marry those whom they feel they cannot because of their moral code. Since marriage, in Canada, is a civil institution, the state has given us the right, while upholding the right of religious groups to marry whom they feel they can. A good compromise, though many in the church are still complaining that the law has gone too far. They can't have it both ways!