"It's not a sin to have blue eyes, only to look through them."

This from the religion that turned Mark Foly into an internet “Chester”. A very enlightened point of view, very inclusive. If only they practiced what they preach!

I refuse to listen to a Ex-Nazi. Or follow the church SOMETHING MAN MADE!!!! That's like wearing a cheap pair of walmart shoes that are pleather instead of leather. It's man made. Go outside and pray and have your daily rituals. Forget the church and the bible. DO your own thing. God will still love you ur just praying to god outside instead of in a building men made.

The quote used seems mostly correct with my theology. However, I have never heard of the Catholic church urging people to stay in the closet. How can they get any help that way? I notice that part wasin't actually quoted.

Acts of homosexuality will never be part of our religion. That is because we believe sex was given to us solely to combine one man and one woman into the same flesh (children, of course). However, homosexuals, themselves, will always be part of the Catholic church. Otherwise, who else would I sit with during Sunday Mass?

But back to what I was saying before, we believe that sex, when it is not used for its original purpose, does nothing but possible harm to people. Whats the purpose of having sex if all you get out of it is a possible infection and a short burst of sexual pleasure. I know what I say may sound strange, but many of us have seen too much evidence to believe that anything good can come out of this.

No one really needs sex without children. All that does is put sex on the brain in unhuminizing ways. I really think that the media has forced sex on the homosexual community too much. Why, for instance, is there so much useless sexual content on this site? I could easily live my whole life without sex. What would I get out of it? Nothing! If you find yourself receiving instead of giving, then rest assured that something is wrong. With sex, you give your whole self to your partner and to the life of the next generation. Most of my gay friends gave up this lifestyle for the reasons I have listed. None of them have looked back with regret.

However, I shall see what else is posted on this matter...

I am shocked ( well i should'nt be, given that he is an avowed catholic) that in this day and age of scientific enlightenment that this person would espouse such a primitive and ignorant ideology about sex and sexual orientation in general...... but then religion has always been a deterrent and an obstacle to scientific and societal advancement throughout history ( theistic religions in particular ).

To expect everyone to be heterosexual is like to expect everyone to be right handed on right brain dominant...or to expect that all roses are red ( there are blue, yellow and other shades ). God is nature, Nature is God . In Nature you see variability. Not everyone has the same I.Q. or the same height or skin color or eye color. Majority of humans are heterosexual, but a small minority are homosexuals and an even smaller minority are true bisexuals. Addidtionally how one acts out one's innate sexuality ( ie attraction to say the same gender ,resulting in arousal and eroticism etc) is also colored by ones culture , society, religious beliefs etc. etc.. Genetic factors and a myriad of biochemical/hormonal factors during gestation determines in part the sexual orientation of an individual. One simply does not 'choose ' one's sexual orientation as many ignorant religious homophobes declare! One can however voluntarily choose one's religion and one can voluntarily choose to remain ignorant and preach ignorance that contributes to untold misery for millions of gays and lesbians. One can also voluntarily demonize and marginalize millions of totally functional , morally upright and productive citizens merely by making one aspect of their humanity a taboo. Christians and other theists have succeeded for centuries in demonizing Jews ( branding them God/Jesus killer) . Hitler did not carry out his grand design for extermination of a whole group of human beings in a vacuum. He was aided and abetted by religion ! which created an atmosphere of demonizing and marginalization of the 'other' to the point that the german people of his era was so desensitized that Nazi Germany was able to execute the Holocaust successfully and with unbridled conscience. The centuries of stigmatization, demonizing and marginalization of gay and lesbian people and other sexual minrities have resulted in societies uncaring , callous and wanton disregard for people of minority sexual orientation , allowing for persecution, discrimination and violence against them. When ignorant and wicked religious people condemn gay ,lesbian, bisexual and transgender people on faulty scriptural interpretations they embolden bigots and bullies ( who are themselves anything but paragon of virtues and morality LOL) to do violence to persons whose sexual orientations are different from them.

Also regarding Colin's view of sex as primarily for procreation. He should know that if that is the case, humans may as well be rabbits ! Sex between couples serve as a mechanism to bond the male and female together for a long period of time in order to allow them to form a coherent unit to adequately raise the human young which unlike other mammals have a long 'weaning' period ( some men and women still live with mom and dad and do not fly the coop till they are in their late 30's ). Colin should also be aware of the fact that gays and lesbians can in like maner form healthy and functional family units to raise a young one ( an altruistic aspect of homosexuality). The sexual attraction and physical intimacy between the same sex couple serves as a psychosocial bond that maintains coherence of this particular familiar unit to allow for the maturation and nurturing of an offspring ( either thro artificial insemination or adoption).

I suspect all this information may be hard for Colin to swallow since members of his religious ilk are also the very ones that vociferously opposed suffrage (voting rights ) for women only not to many years ago. They are also the very ones that loudly protested against interracial marriages and were also the very ones that gleefuly support slavery based on twisted biblical injunctions.

...........hmmmm and look who is preaching morality in this modern times .....the kkkatholic oops catholic church..the very institution famous for the inquisition and for muzzling and putting under house arrest a genius such as Leonardo da Vinci? hmmmmm as Spiderman would say...'nuf said LOL !

Andreas Mikhailowiscz
a secular homo-sapien

Yay! Someone answered me. Granted, it was a weak argument, but I will respond all the same.

I see I didn't really make myself clear on sex last time. I was half-asleep, I suppose. Yes, I agree with you on that first part. Sex can act as a wonderful bond between two people. However, most of it comes from the fact that you are forming new life. Sex was ment for children. I have no idea what's so wrong with saying that. The act is all about binding two persons into one. It is all about the giving of yourself. Andreas will need to elaboate on what was wrong with what I said beacause, judging from the first comment, he/she is in agreement with me.

As for the abilities of gays as parents, I wonder if Andreas knows what it is like to grow up withought both a mother and a father. In case they don't, it is very difficult. It is much more difficult than being in a traditional family. Everyone who has grown up as such has told me so. Furthermore, there is no proof that gay parents can be good enough role-models for children of a young age. Gay marriage has not been "legal" that long.

As for the last comment...*sigh*. Andreas, you must have had some pretty bad history teachers in your life. Either that or you simply hung on to the words of some Catholic-haters you ran across. I am a Catholic, I am not an extremist protestant. My kind is not allowed in the South where the K.K.K. orgiginated. The K.K.K. hate Catholics and always have because we have always been so opposed to them. Considering how many of my people they killed and threatend, I would ask you to hold your tounge.

I have never heard of any evidence that the Catholic church opposed women sufferage movements. I don't know much about this one. Please enlighten me.

Opposition to interracial marriage was a K.K.K. thing. Don't go there.

Slavery was a ghastly thing. Thankfully, because of faithful Christians everywhere, it was banned. Yes, that's right. Christianity stopped slavery. I know of no historical documents which say otherwise. You see, America was founded on Christianity and so many of the old rulings which came into place were thanks to it.
Slavery existed far before the Protestant country of England accepted it. All over the world it exsisted and still exists today. Whites owned whites, blacks owned blacks, whites owned blacks, and blacks owned whites. What happened in America was a revolutionary thing and it was, as I just said, due to the teacings of good Christians (including, of course, Catholics).

The Inqusition was a political thing more than a religious one. The Mulsims occupied Spain for hundreds of years and, when they finally fell, the Catholics who had been subject to their rule wanted to make sure it didn't happen again. They way they did it was wrong, but it was not the fault of the Catholic Church, in general. This was simply the doings of a country of angry men and women. I think it may also have been a cause for discomfort towards Jews; they had better conditions under Muslim rule.

Hitler, who was mentioned before, did not have Jews as his sole target. Catholics were also one of his enemies. He made a strangledhold on the Vatican so they could not stop him. However, many Catholics still helped Jews escape at the cost of their own lives. Besides, Hitler can not be viewed as much of a religious figure. He didn't really follow a religion so much as an immoral and cultish view. He had many gay lovers and kept pedafiles within his ranks. This was not the behavior of a true Christian.

The last thing mention was Leonardo Da Vinci. I believe Andreas actually ment Galileo. He is the only one known for being "persecuted" by the church. Leonardo was only charged for necromancy. Perhaps he wouldn't have been it he had not gone grave-robbing for his experiments.
Galileo was not actually persecuted by the church either, though. That claim is an exaggeration. Galileo was a hero in Rome and the Vatican praised him for his efforts. You see, the Catholic Church has been one of the leading supporters of science throughout it's history. Why do you think that there was such a scientific and cultural boom in Rome after the Vatican was built. the Pope, himself, even presented and award for Galileo. Galileo, however, did get a house arrest later on. The reason for this was been clouded.
Most of his ideas were never questioned. The theory that the Earth revovled around the sun was generally accepted by people. However, he eventually began supporting a different theory which no one beleived made sense at all. Perhaps it was blind desire or pride from his past exaultations, but Galileo insisted that this theory be accepted as fact. Eventually, he got sent to a cushy house-arrest because of his defiance and impiety. It was, no doubt a bad idea to do this. Of course, he must have become quite annoying. To this day, the theory he presented has not been proven as even plausable by most scientists. If only he would have let it remain a theory...By te way, I cannot remember the actual theory presented (pretty lame of me, huh?), but you can find more information by reading "How the Catholic Church Built Western Civilization" by Thomas E. Woods Jr.

So, how was my post. Let me know if my argument is still bewildering to people. You may not agree with me, but at least you may understand me.

-Colin
a secular franciscan homo-sapian