If anyone should know that what tabloids report do not necessarily mean truths are being told, it is 1990s gossip staple Roseanne Barr, who last week took to her blog to slam Marie Osmond and her Mormon (anti-gay) beliefs for her son Michael Blosil’s suicide. Predictably, a few days have passed, and she’s sorry she said anything at all.
“I saw on the front page of a tabloid that he had killed himself because he could not handle being gay, and I wrote about how angry that made me, after seeing it hundreds of times, growing up as I did in Utah,” Barr writes. “I don’t know the Osmonds, but was always offended at their constant defense of the indefensible things that their church does, the way it promotes hatred and racism and sexism, tax free. I have known so many gay people who killed themselves, or suffered and that is why I put myself on the line to bring TV’s first gay characters to America. I never intended for my comments to be picked up and broadcast on sleazy gossip TV shows, or on other blogs. That was done without my consent or knowledge.”
Oh please, Roseanne. You posted your diatribe ON YOUR OWN BLOG. Using websites known as www.google.com and www.blogger.com, it is very easy to find those remarks and post them elsewhere. This isn’t your first day at the mud-slinging rodeo, lady, and it won’t be your last. But let’s not pretend you’re innocent in trafficking in “sleazy gossip,” shall we?
So much criticism has been thrown her way, Barr says she’s done speaking out for the gays: “I will leave this up for a while, and then I am just done. I appreciate the letters from gay people who thank me for speaking out on their behalf, but y’all are just going to have to take up the slack I will be leaving behind me. I am old now and tired, and not really feeling up to being the only person who says things that no one else will say.”
How about we take this to the next level?
Our newsletter is like a refreshing cocktail (or mocktail) of LGBTQ+ entertainment and pop culture, served up with a side of eye-candy.
Which is sad. She doesn’t need to stop speaking out for the gays. She’s a fantastic, loudmouthed ally. But choose your words wisely. Or at least, wiser. Make the conversation about Michael, his legacy, and how young people and parents can learn from it.
terrwill
Her message is still 100% accurate. Simply substitute “one of the thousands of Gay teens who commit suicide each year” with “Micharl Blosil” and “fanatical religous parents who value their religion more than their children” for “Marie Osmond” Anyone still want to disagree with her statement???
TaylorS
I agree Terrwill. Her point is still valid and very necessary. And I doubt she will stop speaking her mind. Thank the stars for that.
Dionte
When I heard that he had killed himself I had a feeling it was because he was gay, this saddens me so much. I agree with some of the things Roseanne said.
Does anything good come out of churches?
Cam
There was nothing wrong with what she said.
TampaZeke
Rosanne was 100% RIGHT! And she’s right that she is too often the ONLY one who will speak out and say what needs to be said. I would like for the author to explain how he/she thinks Barr could have chosen her words more wisely. WHAT exactly did she say wrong? It was ugly, yes, but so was what she was talking about. Ugly needs to be exposed in the ugliest way possible, otherwise too many people, as they have always done and will continue to do without people like Rosanne, will FIND a way to ignore it, or poo poo it or minimize it. Say it LOUD, say it PROUD Rosanne. NEVER shut up or hold back when you are filled with righteous anger.
Brian En Guarde
One of the must unjust aspects of gay suicide is that the bigots get to speak out loudly in front of children, and then as gay kids grow up around mormons their self-esteem gets more and more crushed as they grow older — in silence. Then when they kill themselves, everyone is left to speculate as to why. The mormons get their hate cake and get to eat it too. They get to spew brain-damaging bigotry, then when the poor closted kids are gone the mormons get to scurry back under their rock. “Why did then do it? I dunno.”
So Roseanne was really onto something. We can’t just let the church be so loud and anti-gay, and then let them run and hide when kids start flying off buildings. The onus needs to be on them to stop hurting gay children.
Forrest
While Roseanne is correct and has firsthand knowledge, timing is everything. I mean come on….the boy just killed himself and she goes after his mother? Reprehensible. Right sentiment. Bad timing on the delivery.
terrwill
@Forrest: However if she did it after a “proper amount of time” the message would have been lost……I am sorry there are way too many things about Michael that causes me to check the Gay box. Maybe Marie did attempt to reach out to him and help. But if she did I am sure others she may have turned to in her hatefilled church would have expressed strong disapproval. Roseanne has never been one to use pleasantries in her delivery. She put something out there that needed to be said. If just one Parent hears her message and decides their kid is more important than following the hatefull poo spewed by their religion her words were well worth any “hurt” she may have caused the Osmonds. Their kid is already dead, let his situation be used to possibly save others……
strumpetwindsock
We are going to have to “take up the slack [she] will be leaving behind her”?
I thought this was supposed to be an apology, not an essay on self-importance.
She’s right about being the only person who will say things others won’t though, and I don’t mean the criticism which the Mormon Church greatly deserves.
If she bothered to look around she might notice there are people challenging the Mormon church in more concrete ways than posting on a blog.
strumpetwindsock
And I notice she qualified her apology. She said she was sorry IF she was mistaken about him being gay.
DR
She got her info from the front page of a grocery store checkout rag, gets pissy because people find what she wrote on her public blog, makes a half-hearted apology to the family, and then storms off into the sunset claiming she’ll never speak for the gays again…what a shame, really. /sarcasm.
Please, we need to be careful picking our allies and our battles, and there was no way I was supporting this one.
TaylorS
She stormed off because she got a shit-load of flack (like from some people on this blog, but I’m sure many did it in person as well) for speaking her mind, and the truth.
Homo-hating religious cults depress, and sometimes kill, young people coming into their gay sexuality. Roseanne was right. And nothing she could say could make Marie Osmond feel any worse than she already does. Terrwill is right, this is about saving others.
Cam
No. 10 · DR
She got her info from the front page of a grocery store checkout rag,
______________
The same rag that also broke and was right about the John Edwards story. His defense at that time was “Who believes anything in that paper?” With liable laws the way they are, those papers just can’t print something totally untrue without getting dragged into court, having an injunction slapped on their print run and losing possibly millions of dollars.
terrwill
@DR: She has always been pro Gay. Her show back in the day was one of the first to portray Gays as normal human beings in long term stable relationships, not as stereotypical queens and whorebags. And someone who makes a statement that needs to be made is clearly one of our allies and needs to be supported
How many of our “allies” spoke out like this:
http://www.cnsnews.com/news/print/39192
One of the reasons we have so few straight allies is everytime someone sticks their neck out in support its usually some bitter old queens who wants to be the first with an ax to chop it………
Rikard
What a self agrandizing twat. She has some perception that the Osmonds were in “constant defense” of something? Not a fan of the O’s, but I’m the age and in the location to remember the crap their fellow mormons heaped on them for NOT speaking out. They cared very much that their image was squeaky clean, but would never jepordize broad appeal by speaking on controversial topics. Marie’s statement when her daughter came out was almost the exact statement Cher made a decade or so ago. “I love my daughter and support her”. Rosanne’s lack of compassion for a mother who has lost a child makes it obvious why her first husband got custody of her kids. If she wants to examine a failed family she should examine her own bio.
Blake
I grew up gay and Mormon… There is no validity to what she says. Rosanne has not seen young gay men kill themselves hundreds of time. What an opportunistic over dramatic beast. I really wish she would stop medaling in Utah GLBT affairs. Her interest is not out of the good of her heart but out of revenge because she was not accepted as a person growing up in Utah. Not because she is a lesbian, or Jewish, but because she is a fat, loud mouth obnoxious beast, who would have been treated like scum no matter where she grew up; because she is hard to not hate with her strong unfounded opinions and lack of ability to shut the hell up.
BUSSY
Oh please..
This woman is a cold fool. She knew damn well wat she was doing when she posted that rubbish.
Get your facts straight next time
terrwill
Very interesting there are such strongly worded defenses of the Moron church who spend millions of dollars denying Gays equal rights in a vicious hatefull campaign and pretty strong attacks on a very vocal supporter of the Gays here It’s interesting because the church hierarchy definatley know about Queerty. Because they attempted to purchase banner ads, and due to an overwhelming vote “NO” by the posters said ad was disallowed. Posssibly some minions of the moron church making their elders proud?????
strumpetwindsock
@ Terrwill
Not sure what you’re reading, because I haven’t seen one word in defense of the mormon church. You won’t see me defending them.
Just because Roseanne happens to hold the same opinion about Mormonism doesn’t mean I’m not going to call her on callous false accusations, and talking like us poor queers will be completely helpless without her.
DR
@Terwill:
With “allies” like her, we don’t need enemies, she’ll make them for us. Now that she’s been humiliated by firing off her mouth about things she knows squat about (and not even CLOSE to the way she humiliated Marie Osmond), she’s crawling back to her home crying “oh, poor me, what a victim I am”?!? And I’m supposed to feel sympathy because her comments were ill-timed and ill-informed? She’s not a “victim” of anything but her own poor judgment and self-importance, and she’s mad because she got called on it.
She does not *need* to be supported until she gets her facts right. I’m not going to support her for attacking the mother of a son who killed himself (and attacking with barely credible allegations), especially when that woman has publicly spoken out against some of LDS’s policies. There is absolutely no justification for that in my mind.
@Cam:
Even a broken clock is right twice a day.
terrwill
@strumpetwindsock: Look at the venom that is being spewed at her….she has been a consistant ally of the Gays………sorry there is way too much vitrol in the posts about her without some kind of agenda………….
Jaroslaw
#18 Strump – I can see why you make the comments you do about her; delicacy and tact were never Roseanne’s strong suits. But I do think there is something to opposing points of view – what is she getting out of helping us? She doesn’t have to say anything at all in our favor.
I wonder too if interpretations of remarks like “others will have to take up the slack..” depend on your pre existing opinion of her; good or at least ok if you like her; self aggrandizing twat if you don’t?”
axos
So what are the straight facts? Michael was not gay and the Mormon church celebrates its gay members?
strumpetwindsock
@Jaroslaw:
Yes, you are right. I don’t deny I have a preexisting opinion, though it is one based on evidence.
Aside from voicing my opinion, I haven’t actually told anyone they should not support her. I just object to being called a supporter of the Mormon Church because I happen to think her comments were way out of line.
Good to see you again, BTW.
Cam
No. 15 · Blake
I grew up gay and Mormon… There is no validity to what she says. Rosanne has not seen young gay men kill themselves hundreds of time. What an opportunistic over dramatic beast. I really wish she would stop medaling in Utah GLBT affairs. Her interest is not out of the good of her heart but out of revenge because she was not accepted as a person growing up in Utah.
_________________________________
Thats interesting because ever single gay Mormon/Ex Mormon I know either has friends they grew up with who killed themselves or tried to because they were gay and the church made it very explicit that they were evil and would be cast out, or they infact thought about it themselves. Interesting that you had such a different experience from all of them.
Jonathan
Roseanne never said terrible things about Marie Osmond. She said terrible things about her church. This publication is inaccurate!
Plus, Roseanne’s big-picture point still holds true! The mormon church causes a lot of gay mormons to commit suicide. I’m glad she has the balls to speak out and tell the truth!!!
ewe
Marie Osmond is our enemy.
Tackle
@BLAKE & DR:
Great points!
First of all, i doubt if she seen “hundres” of gay youths kill themselves hundreds of times. Mybey It’s just a figure of speech.
And she absolutely did not bring TV’s first gay characters to America. Roseanne aired her “first” gay character in 1990. There were gay characters, often times recurring on, the Bob Newhart show, Soap, The Mary Hartman show, The Nancy Walker show, St Elsewhare,Barney Miller, Prisoner Cellblock H, Dynasty, Hill ST Blues, and L.A. Law.
She’s speaking once again without knowing the facts.
Gays and Lesbians can definately do without this DELUSIONAL womem speaking for them. To Roseanne, i say GOODBYE and GOOD RIDDANCE!!!
Tom Delane
The religious lobby wins again.
terrwill
@Tom Delane: Of course! someone speaks out for us, and is immediatley ripped to shreds. I am geting more and more convinced that there are many who post here with very specific agendas………….
Taylor Siluwé
No. 27 · Tackle
I can’t speak for all the gay characters you speak of, but the ones I do remember where caricatures, mostly tortured and on the verge of – you guessed it – suicide.
I say good riddance to people who don’t speak truth to power, even when its inconvenient.
Roseanne always has and always will hold a place in my heart.
Carol
Roseanne was right when she said that she nothing about Marie Osmond. At that point she should have shut her foul bigoted mouth up — because from that moment onward she started being WRONG.
What kind of EVIL person says such things to a person whose son has just killed himself…? There is no greater pain in the world.
That’s a lot of compassion you’ve got Roseanne! That offer to be every gay kid’s mom…? I think they would do far better with a compassionate mother, not the queen of mean.
Roseanne has projected all the hatred and ignorance and bigotry that she claims to be opposed to. What a total creep. Get some class, Roseanne. Why don’t you ask the Osmonds for some lessons…?
alan brickman
I still agree with Roseanne..the Morman church and the parents who support it basically push their gays kids off of apartment buildings themselves…
Eric
Marie Osmond has a lesbian daughter and has long supported gay marriage. So Roseanne Barr is full of crap — like she has always been.
Anyone who would blame another person for causing a suicide is the lowest of the low. Did the person who committed suicide have no free will or something? Like, does EVERYONE who gets divorced kill themselves? Does everyone who goes through a break-up kill themselves? Does everyone who has financial problems kill themselves? Does everyone who is gay and who thinks other people disapprove kill themselves? No…? you mean they weren’t “made” to commit suicide…?
Roseanne Barr is a poor excuse for a human being. Nauseating.
ewe
@Eric: stop making excuses and at the very least detail your source she supports gay marriage. Just because a family member accepts their own gay child means NOTHING for many others who suffer the consequences of indoctrinated ignorance.
Mary
The boy was not homosexual, just depressed. The Osmonds are good people …… and this is just another instance of the HOMONAZI’S and their liberals friends (like Roseanne) trying to exploit tragedy to advance their agenda.
ewe
@Mary: How do you know the Osmonds are good people? They are Mormons and mormons are discriminatory. The gay agenda is equality dopey. It does not surprise me you do not know that.
mark
There are thousands of young adults who commit suicide and were never raised with any religious upbringing and millions of young adults that were raised in religions that are not tolerant of alternative lifestyles that lead productive healthy lives. Depression is a tricky thing. Give it a rest and stop blaming.
ewe
@mark: Mark: I am not nor do i lead an alternative lifestyle. I live my life as myself. It is genuinely authentic and it is not alternative to any other way of life. It is mine. Saying “alternative” means that you support “heterosexuality” as the pinnacle of where to begin the definition. That is just plain stupid. I am not gay because i am not straight. I am gay because that is who and what i am. Period. It is not an alternative for me.
Eric
Ewe:
Want sources…? Google it yourself. It only takes a second. You’ll have a hundred choices.
Are you Roseanne Barr in disguise or something? Because you are spouting the same ignorant bigotry — assuming that another person (Marie Osmond) supports a certain position that you don’t like solely based upon their religious upbringing or place of birth….
I would have thought a gay person would have been offended by Barr’s presumption that all gay people are the same. Like, if a man is going to a fashion merchandizing school he MUST be gay — and Barr of course already knows every detail about his life — including the attitudes of his parents and their parenting skills — because all gay people have the same life story, don’t they?
alex0770
Thanks, Roseanne! You said it loudly and clearly and stood up for all the gay Morman kids who are thinking of killing themselves.
doug
What a self-important idiot! Another person who “dreams” of being wise.
How long till the fat lady sings for this idiot?
terrwill
@Mary: Hey was that speech written by your Elders??? Or did you and your other Moron minons conjure that post all by yourseves???? Take your Moron hatefull crap and infect another blog. There are plenty of right wing sites that welcome your vile poo with welcome arms…..
Marie Osmond stated in an interview very clearly she supported “civil rights, not Gay marriage” The hate spewed towards Roseanne is nothinig more than an orchestrated effort by the Moron church…………….
mike
roseanne bar is a loser i dont understand why people listen to her,look at obamas pastor a guy that teaches more hate than i ever seen, why doesnt this crazy liberal talk about our president obama said his pastor is his mentor and father figure,but of coarse the dumb rich liberal actors like to pick there battles and talk about a women that she doesnt even know,god i hate hollywood people they have no idea about the real world
mike
Thank God Roseanne gonna stop speaking, she needs to STFU!
She was insensitive and offensive with that comment. maybe it wasn’t the church fault that he killed himself, maybe it was being GAY! so hundreds of gay people die because they can’t bear the burden of coming out? what’s wrong with being gay that they have to kill themselves; it’s practically cool to be gay in today’s society. the poor guy has been dealing with depression all his life, it was neither being gay or his religion, it was him not being able to deal with life anymore. if he was fully out of the closet, he would had still killed himself.
ewe
@Eric: Keep your dismissiveness to yourself. You come on here and ejaculate your hate against Roseanne Barr cause she calls the Mormons for what they are. You, on the other hand, make it about her and the orientation of some dead kid. Yes you. Making sure that he is not gay. That is your goal. You can dress your hate up any way you choose. The issue still remains about the Osmonds and their willingness to participate in a hateful discriminatory religion. Google that one and look it up. Religious upbringing and place of birth is not an entitlement to hate people that are different. Just another tired and mindless convenient and irresponsible out for you. Your last paragraph is all about your essence and not worthy of addressing other than to say, “don’t you know all gay people know each other?” Fly away on your broomstick.
Bill
All the Good work that is done by Church’s worldwide is overlooked by people like you because it doesn’t fit with the liberal agenda you push on the rest of society.
Kathy
Roseanne Barr is an idiot and everybody knows it. She has no morals. What’s wrong with being anti-gay when that is what the Bible calls a sin? I don’t have gays (sinners) but I do hate the sin of homosexuality. I am not a Mormon. I am a born-again Christian and my heart goes out to Marie and her entire family.
mike
it’s Bush fault!
ewe
@mike:Thanks for your unwarranted psychiatric analysis about someone you don’t know but are so fast to say he would have killed himself no matter what. That is the height of hypocrisy coming right after you ridicule Roseanne for doing exactly what you just did. The topic is the Osmonds and their horrific religion. The topic is the Mormons satanic behavior disguising themselves as godly.
Ann
when family members die people should just shut up.
ewe
@Kathy: Your tired bible book and your grotesque idol worship of a 2000 year old dead body on a cross you won’t bury is a fantasy in your own tiny delusional world. Go push your wares elsewhere.
ewe
@Ann: When hateful homophobes speak, people should put them in their place so they shut their mouths.
Steve
I can’t believe the people that are defending this obvious hate speach. R. Barr is nothing but trailor trash and when ever she opens her mouth that’s all that comes out, trash talk… But at the same time only in America where people dumb as dirt can make a lot of money; speak their mind, but only if you are on the left wing fringe and get away with it.
Irene
Why doesn’t everyone let this poor boy rest in peace. In all actuality it is noone’s business if he was gay or if his family is mormon. And it definitely isn’t Roseann’s business, these comments from a woman who spit on the American flag? She should try working on herself before pointing a finger at someone else’s heartaches.
Irene
@Steve: Very well said….Thank you.
ewe
@Irene: It most certainly is the business of gay people to confront MORMON HATE.
Taylor Siluwé
No. 47 · Kathy
Everyones heart goes out to ANYONE who loses a child. Do you have kids, Kathy? Any of them gay? Of course, if they were you’d be the very last person they’d confide in.
So many born again Christians; so many frightened children hanging in their closets.
Let’s hope you never have to experience what so many parents have, whose kids were twisted by archaic religion dogma to believe they were better off dead.
ewe
@Steve: I think the religious right have been alerted about this blog post. GONG!!!!! You could not be more incorrect.
Irene
@ewe: Shame on you!
ewe
@Taylor Siluwé: BRAVO!!!!!!!! The truth rings so loud, it cannot be denied. These zealots are completely out of their minds.
ewe
@Irene: Piss off Irene. go bother someone who never questions your childish ignorance. You are a stupid woman.
terrwill
The Elders of the Moron church are spitting out talking points quicker than their minions can post them on this thread…..slow down guys!!!! We sinner Gays need some time to absorb all the bullshit you are posting about a person who dared make a public statement about your hate filled church who’s organization poured millions of dollars into the Prop H8e campaign………..
Irene
@ewe: Sorry, but I’m not familiar with Morman beliefs, but a mother is a mother and I am a Christian mother who would go to the end of the earth for my children, whether they are gay or not. No parent should bury a child, no matter what beliefs come in to play. Sorry, but Roseann is a piece of garbage in my book. She’s anti everything.
strumpetwindsock
@ewe:
Actually no, the topic is not the Mormon Church; I think most of us agree it has done terrible things to us, so please stop trying to use it as a red herring.
The topic is Roseanne’s false accusations about Marie Osmond and her son Michael Blosil – something she has admitted herself.
It also concerns her latest statement that we queers will have to work hard to make up for all the wonderful things she has done for us.
Irene
@ewe: Well that answers it. Your response to my comment shows who is the childish one here. You’re not only childish but an idiot & your comments are off the wall. Take another hit on that pipe so you can hide behind your computer screen longer.
mike
@EWE- the topic is Roseanne Barr and her disgusting mouth. the timing was wrong, Marie Just lost her son and Roseanne goes on a ugly diatribe, so yes i am not tolerant of her choice of words.
ewe
@strumpetwindsock: wrong. this post is the second installment of one mormon mother and her church. Roseanne did not put down Marie Osmond. She put down the mormon belief system within Marie Osmond and she did not retract that at all.
ewe
@mike: the topic is Michael Blosil who made a permanent decision to a temporary problem. The temporary problem was and continues to be his mormon family.
mike
@ EWE, if you start to feel a burning sensation, don’t panic. it’s us praying for your dumb soul, not because you are Gay.
stay on topic! this is about Roseanne’s wrong choice of words.
ewe
@Irene: oh such lofty dismissiveness from someone who dictates how everyone should act. Not one bit of your own experience is probably guided without some manipulative hateful homophobic religion. Words coming from someone like you are not at all important to me.
mike
whatever “tolerant” EWES. Jesus loves you.
ewe
@mike: another fantasy in your head of how important what you say and think is to others who dont know or care for you.
ewe
@mike: when all else fails, just scream god. It works for you most other places. you are an idiot.
ewe
@mike: Jesus is dead but his spirit certainly does love me. He was an openly gay man who was crucified for it by people like you. Prove otherwise.
mike
@ EWEs, well then what did jesus preach? love, tolerance, forgiveness, speak kindly to other, do not judge, love one another. ROseanne was not being loving with her comments. you are not being tolerant, or Jesus like, with your rabid hatred for religion.
strumpetwindsock
@ewe:
Maybe you should read her original post again, and these words from her current post:
“I don’t know the Osmonds, but was always offended at their constant defense of the indefensible things that their church does, the way it promotes hatred and racism and sexism, tax free…
“I am sorry to have hurt Marie Osmond, who is the most open minded person in her whole family. I really apologize to her.”
But beyond that clear acknowledgement, I’m kind of pissed off at Roseannes’ self-importance and her implication that we will be in trouble without her here to defend us.
Taylor Siluwé
No. 62 · terrwill
Don’t you love their lock-step talking points – and we’re all Hollywood LIBRULS, doncha know. Which Oscar after party did you go to last night, Terrwill? I went out for a burger with Sandra; she even let me hold her Oscar. It was hard, and cold.
I don’t know why these people are wasting their time. We know, they know, and everyone knows this post is not about bashing a mother who lost a son. Roseanne didn’t do that. She did however attack the Mormon (gays will get married over our cold dead magic-undies-wearing bodies) Church.
And she was right. And, most sadly of all, they know it.
ewe
@mike: Jesus was a rebel who would smack you and your simple folly down like a house of cards.
ewe
@strumpetwindsock: Thats right. She said she does not know the Osmonds. As if that really had to be reitterated. Most people grasped that already. She then goes on to the topic which is the MORMON RELIGION. She does not apologize or retract anything she said against the mormons and Marie osmond is pretty much front row and center in the mormon dens. And who exactly is “we”? I never was left with the impression Roseanne was speaking for an entire group of people.
ewe
@Taylor Siluwé: thank you. you are a moment of clarity on this post right now.
Irene
@mike: I wouldn’t bother with this nut anymore Mike. He is a very angry gay person and from experience, the gay friends & family I have never ever spoke this way about Jesus. AND YES EWE, I HAD GAY FAMILY WHO HAVE LEFT US & STILL HAVE GAY FRIENDS. I dont look down upon anyone, no matter what religion or sexual preference they may have. Ewe needs to get real & accept people for who they are not what he wants them to be.
strumpetwindsock
@ewe:
Again, it’s right there in her blog. All you need to do is read it:
“I appreciate the letters from gay people who thank me for speaking out on their behalf, but y’all are just going to have to take up the slack I will be leaving behind me. I am old now and tired, and not really feeling up to being the only person who says things that no one else will say.”
ewe
@Irene: irene and her dismissiveness. It appears it is the only thing you have to hold onto your misplaced superiority. The problem with you and people like you is that you have suspended your god given ability to think and replaced it with lies that were fed to you and yours, passed down and willingly accepted without any thought to common sense. You damn right gay people are angry and no one is making space for your dysfunction. I heard it earlier that people like you should be forced to produce the “gays” you say you know. It probably is as valid as your “many black friends”. I will never accept the judgement and hate that comes out of people like you toward people like me. The sooner you accept that is the moment you realize that gay people are not going to stop until we shut you down. You are every bit as dangerous as ignorance itself.
ewe
@strumpetwindsock: Excuse me but i am unaware of which tangent you are reeling on about now.
ewe
Nobody wants to talk about the real issue. They just want to give a pass to more mormon hate all disguised as protecting the little woman named Marie osmond. Smiles and pig tails and everything little girls are made of. ladeda. Meanwhile gay youth are being oppressed and have no sense of dignity because of their diabolical hate. STEP ASIDE MORmONS. THERE IS A MOVEMENT AND IT IS COMING AFTER YOUR HYPOCRISY.
ewe
Well apparently all the godnuts retired to bed by 10pm. There is something to thank god about after all. They no doubt will awake again as the morning dew ready to repeat their abuse all over again.
terrwill
@Taylor Siluwé: I went to the Flaming Burn in Hell Homosexaull Party!!!
Thank you for being one of the few who actually sees the madness going on in this thread…….Funny a consistently Gay supporting celebrity makes a statement against the Moron church and just like that, there are so many new “Gay” posters who have never once before posted on these threads And for some dang if I can figger out why, they are ALL hating on Roseanne, what a VERY STRANGE COICIDENCE!!………I am finding it hard to keep track, what number taking point are we up to??? : p
Irene
@ewe: I have no hate for anyone and don’t have to produce what I know to be true to an idiot like you. You are a very angry person, probably angry at yourself or whoever else you might want to blame. Maybe Roseann Barr can create a new cause and call it “Let’s Help Ewe cause he’s gay & thinks everyone is against him”. Jerk
Steve
@ewe: Gong,that’s your response you are as ignorant as your speach, get a clue and and go to school. Being a 6th grade graduate does not get you a head on our freight train of America…
Steve
@Irene: Irene, America needs moore people like you and God Bless You, and we will prevail and all of America will see what the agenda of the Left Party is, to destroy over 275 years of freedom.
Sincerely,
Steve
Taylor Siluwé
No. 62 · terrwill
Damm, I missed that party. Sounds like it was a hoot.
Sorry for rampant all-bold text, apparently an /b after “Hollywood Librul” got away from me. But it seems you, EWE, and I have withstood the onslaught of stupid. Now I can go back to watching my favorite Lezbo Librul who dares counter the crazy right’s hypocrisy with shameful well-documented facts and truth, Rachel Maddow.
strumpetwindsock
@terrwill:
That’s funny, because I was beginning to wonder if you and ewe were her agent and publicist.
Come on… that “if you don’t agree with me you can’t be gay” line is ridiculous. And I don’t know who the newbies are, but I have been around here for a couple of years.
You two don’t seem to have noticed that I agree with you about the Mormon church and have said so a number of times.
Rosanne’s false accusations, heartless attacks and spotlight-grabbing antics are another matter entirely.
strumpetwindsock
@Steve:
And sorry steve… I’m not with you on that one. But that’s another topic.
mike
Roseane Barr is a classless human being.Typical Hollywood lowlife.
Lori
Hi,
I am not judging anyone. Read the Bible and it plainly says sexual relationships are to be between a man and a woman in marriage.It’s that simple. There’s no other way to look at it. Anything out side of this is disobedience to Gods law which is sin.
ewe
@Lori: listen troll. once and for all, shove that bible up inside your dark ass.
ewe
@mike: you would know about being a classless human being. Class is either something you are born with or you earn. You have failed miserably.
ewe
@strumpetwindsock: Your passive aggressive stance is nauseating.
ewe
@Steve: no it is just to destroy your simple way of thinking. It is stifling and counterproductive. You are a cave man in a different era. I hope that is a simple enough explanation for you bible thumping hands.
ewe
@Irene: Irene, i dismissed you before you got to do it to me. Go play with someone that cares about what you think.
ewe
@Steve: How original.
strumpetwindsock
@Lori:
@ewe:
Actually she should take that Bible and read it because there is nothing in there which says marriage is god’s law. There is not one word in there which says people must be married at all.
Then she should go post someplace else where it is relevant.
@ewe: And yeah. you’re a sweetheart too.
Irene
WHY DOES ANYONE AT ALL, BLACK, WHITE, STRAIT, GAY, SHORT, TALL ETC. ETC. NEED ROSEANN BARR TO SPEAK UP FOR THEM?? THIS I DO NOT UNDERSTAND.
SHE SPIT ON OUR AMERICAN FLAG….DOES ANYONE HERE REMEMBER THAT?
ewe
@strumpetwindsock: thank you. i am glad you finally came around. It is so disgusting that these charlatans twist the tenets of religion to meet their blasphemous agenda.
terrwill
@strumpetwindsock: Guess you got caught in the Moron flood the thread dam burst………..My point is there are waaaay too many justborn today newbies on this particular thread for it not to be an orchestrated effort….Again the Moron church attempted to purchase ad space from David H. and after an overwhelming defeat in voting yea or nay the ads never appeared on Queerts. So they are very well aware of this thread…………There is no way on earth that are people following an agenda to slam the crap out of Roseanne because of her rant against the Moron church. They proved with Prop H8e they are very media savy. I can guaranted you the same behaviour can be found in any Gay blogs where a thread about Roseanne’s rant has been posted…..
terrwill
Make that NOT following an agenda!!
ewe
@Irene: That is called freedom of expression. If you don’t like it, that’s tough. YOU don’t seem to have any problem spitting on me and judging people you have no business to for being homosexual. It’s none of your affair. No one needs your approval. Who cares if you know gay people. I know straight people. So freagin what. You are in the clouds.
ewe
@Steve: listen to the nazi socialist talking about “our freight train of america”. I have no doubt you are a drone but your blind participation in a campaign of terror against minorities is what is dangerous. Stupid yes, but it must be addressed nonetheless. And you have gaul to follow that up with talk about freedom and god. I would spit in your face if it was legal Steve.
ewe
@ewe: censoring me is self defeating for a blog called queerty. No problem. I don’t have much of an investment to further entertain this hateful filth. Adios.
soul_erosion
Long before Marie Osmond supported her lesbian daughter there were accusations from the Osmond family that the “other” girl was a stalker or had a predatory nature when, in fact, it was just another teenage lesbian who she was dating. Marie then turned to the church & put her into one of those Mormon repairative therapy hell holes. When the “look, mommy dearest, I’m not going to change” scenario played out, and whatever other psychological abuse the lesbian daughter endured, Marie had the choice of either embracing her or lose her for good. I can’t even imagine the unbearable pain of a child’s untimely death, but I do know something about the grief of losing a Mormon partner to suicide, excommunicated from the church & shunned by his family. Though years & years ago, that pain has never left me. ProtectMarriage.com and NOM are Mormon front organizations, the greatest threat to my civil rights. I don’t have to dwell on it or contemplate for one second where my sympathies lie.
Betty Nelson
I don’t know if Marie’s son was gay or not, but he killed himself for some kind of pain he was in. I’m sure that Marie loved her son whether he was gay or not and now she and her family are mourning their loss of him. Bashing Marie or The Mormon Church isn’t going to bring him back. We can learn from this though no matter what our religious views are by loving and accepting all people whether they are gay or straight. Jesus didn’t pick and choose who he gave his life for. He gave it for all of us. I happen to be straight but I have someone in my family who is bisexual and many friends who are gay. I accept them and they accept me. We don’t even have to discuss it. We just know that we love and respect and accept each other and most of all, we don’t judge each other.
J
Really? I honestly can not believe how many jackasses still believe in religion and respect it! To each his own, but come on… The human race came up with a Bible to bring comfort to the world in knowing we were here for something more then just to hear the birds chirping in the morning and feel the wind on our faces; it’s all a matter of being scared of what happens next. I am not at all religious, nor gay – but I can understand what gay people have felt to be raised to think how wrong it is of them to be the way that they are. It’s wrong and I feel sympathy for them. Have you own thoughts and view: don’t follow what’s written in (what should be considered) a false text book. Call me what you will, because I know the harsh words are to follow, but think about it, long and hard, not just a quick glance… it’s a little childish, is it not?
Roseanne Barr is pure genius. I plan to watch a very supportive of gays show once I am to put my computer down (that being Roseanne, of course).
CONVERSATION CHAMBER
I’m sorry, but IMO Roseanne just used this news story as a vehicle to get to attention, via an obnoxious/ignorant rant. She knows nothing of the Osmond family, Marie, the boy who committed suicide…or why. She just wanted to be antagonistic, and I can’t believe that people are actually giving her kudos. I was mildly entertained by Roseanne’s bitchy antics in the ’90s, but when she had a TV show and was a relevant star…but today she’s a few gigs short of being a hasbeen, which makes her outbursts now just plain annoying.
CONVERSATION CHAMBER
Furthermore, I’d like to say that I think it’s sad that in death some people are trying to use this boy as a post card for how anti-gay sentiments in the Mormon can destroy a person. We have no idea if he was gay, or not…or if it was his families religion that led to his hopelessness. Instead of trying to make him into a political poster child for gay intolerance, why not just offer a simple “may he rest in peace.” If he weren’t gay would your heart ache for his emotional despair, and tragic end, any less?
Helen
@ewe:
Speaking of “entitlement to hate people that are different,” you pretty much revel in your hatred of Mormons, who are different. Maybe you should follow your own prescription and stop hating people you don’t know.
It’s easier to stop hating people that are different, that you don’t even know, if you stop thinking you are all knowing, all wise…
Carol
@ewe:
No, Ewe, the topic is people who don’t know other people yet think they are qualified to judge everything about them. It started with Roseanne’s abhorrent comments and is turning to your abhorrent comments.
1) We DON”T know if this young man was gay — even if in your prejudicial world you think fashion school equates to being gay.
2) You don’t know Marie Osmond or anything about her personal beliefs on gayness, her religious beliefs, or anything about her relationship with her son.
3) You have never read the Mormon’s church’s stated position on homosexuality. This I know from your many posts.
4) You are not a mental health professional. This I know from your many posts.
5) We don’t know all the factors behind this suicide. You would like to make it simple and blame it on a group you hate because this validates your world-view. Sorry, but even gay people (IF he was gay) have reasons for suicide that don’t involve being gay.
6) We do know this young man became despondent after the divorce of his adoptive parents — and had a legal name change to the name of a biological father that never raised him. See, he struggled with issues that were unrelated to his sexuality….
7) You would not be getting this flak if you were not accusing another human being of causing her son’s death — in her darkest hour, no less. Isn’t it odd how countless numbers of sons in identical circumstances have somehow chosen NOT to commit suicide? See, nobody “made” Michael commit suicide.
8) “He/she made me do it” is the language that irresponsible people use to deflect responsibility away from themselves.
9) Michael is the one who chose to kill himself. He alone is responsible for his own death.
Carol
@J:
People are not objecting to Roseanne Barr’s religious beliefs or lack thereof. Most people couldn’t care less. They are objecting to her abhorrent accusation that Marie Osmond is responsible for the suicide of her own son — premised upon the fact that Marie Osmond belongs to a church that Roseanne Barr doesn’t like.
Now if Marie Osmond were to commit suicide after Roseanne’s totally autistic comments (and I mean no disrespect to autistic people here, only that Roseanne’s comments show a lack of empathy and social intelligence) should we blame Roseanne Barr — especially since many of us don’t like her….?
ewe
@Helen: Wrong. You standards are all screwed up. The mormons are oppressors. That is not the same as being different.
ewe
CAROL:
1) Dont turn anti gay sentiments around on me. That is no different that calling slavery a personal choice.
2)Marie Osmond is a mormon. We certainly do know all about her religious beliefs which are personal beliefs.
3)You have no idea what i have read because we do not know each other. You are nothing short of a self righteous pompous know it all.
4)You have no idea what my career is. However i would not doubt if you are some K-12 teacher. You will have to stick to children with your list of rigid rants. I call people like you for what you are. Bizarre and invasive!
5)We do know many factors behind the reasons for gay youth committing suicide. You will not invalidate anyone with your disregard for a certain group of people. I find your methods monotonous not informative. It is your biased opinion only.
6) How very big of you to acknowledge gay people think about other everyday things besides their orientation.
7)I am accusing the Mormons of leading gay people to their death. You are just a homophobe who wants to dodge the issue and change the subject to avoid responsiblity for your active acquiescence.
8)Blame the victim all you want. Now it is you who obviously knows nothing about mental health.
9)How very noble of you to throw his memory away as fast as toilet tissue but arrogantly defend the Mormons and their celebrity patron Marie Osmond.
AND the shame lies at your feet because you are unable to process it in your mind.
Hattie
The Latter-day Saint religion is one of the few that truly stands behind its beliefs. The truth can be painful, for some, who cannot overcome everyday trails or who feel unworthy to live in a way his/her morals dictate. Other religions conform to the changing tides of society and then chastise the ones who stay unwavering, despite the moral demise of the county.
ewe
@Hattie with the sword if necessary huh Hattie?
Taylor Siluwé
@ Helen & Carol,
Let’s get past Roseanne’s possibly callous words about this tragedy. Let’s talk about the real issue here, the one at the heart of the matter – teen suicide.
According to SafeYouth.org:
Several state and national studies have found that gay, lesbian, and bisexual teens are more likely to seriously consider and attempt suicide than heterosexual teens.[7,8,9]There are, unfortunately, not sufficient data to determine whether rates of death by suicide are similarly elevated. Why are gay, lesbian, and bisexual teens more likely to attempt suicide? The reasons for this are not entirely clear. Research suggests that discrimination due to the social stigmatization of homosexuality in our culture may have important mental health…”
This is about kids off-ing themselves, whether or not Marie’s kid is one of them.
The Mormon Church is most notable in this (although other religions are equally culpable) because of their documented, orchestrated, boots-on-the-ground, tireless campaign to demonize gay people and prevent them from participating in the institution of marriage. In this respect, the verdict is in and jury has gone home already.
And Helen, hating someone or something that actively persecutes you is a normal human response (unless you’re Gandhi, Jesus, Mother Teresa or Martin Luther King). The rest of us have learned to hit back instead of turning the other cheek.
We are defending our right to share this country and world on an equal footing; to have our families receive the same recognition as other families, and not have our children denied admission to schools and carry the weight of stigma and the self-esteem-crushing burden that accompanies being singled out as different, unworthy, and destined to burn in Hell.
You say Mormons are different. They are. But you don’t see LGBT organizations forming secretive shadow orgs [like NOM] with the sole purpose of oppressing Mormons. That’s their M.O., and that’s why we fight back. We’re fighting for our lives and our children’s lives and that can hardly be seen as hateful, or vicious, and certainly not religious oppression.
In the sixties the Mormon church didn’t think much of Blacks. Any arguments against their separatist policies were deemed religious oppression. Imagine that.
Roseanne poked a [middle] finger into the festering boil of religious dogma, and all you faithful flooded this board to yell “Ouch”. Tend to your own sores and they’ll be nothing to poke.
End of story.
Hattie
It is easy to pin a specific someone or something with blame when tragedy occurs. I can only imagine that if this young man had confusion or misgivings about his lifestyle based on his religious upbringing, he must have felt incredibly alone. That itself is the tragedy. Trying to then identify the trigger is insult to injury. Marie Osmond should be allowed to grieve, without taking moments away from that process to defend herself, and her beliefs.
I feel like we are all truly doing the best we know how to do. Some find strength in excelling in careers or in family. Others find support in faith. We don’t all have to agree on others method of support, even we feel it wrong or a waste of time.
I can only imagine, if religion was the underlying factor, how difficult it must be for that family, or any family with any values contraindicated by a child’s choices, would feel in this circumstance.
ewe
@Taylor Siluwé: Well done. These religious hypocrites don’t want to hear it though. Their hands are over their ears.
ewe
@Hattie: Hattie, you are making this so much more complicated than it is and i believe you may be doing it on purpose. If not, then listen. Stop openly ignoring what LGBTQ people are telling you. It is about religious oppression. Judging people that are different from heterosexuals is not the best that people know how to do. That is such a vile free pass given to them to do nothing but opress minorities. Think!!!!!!!!!!!!
carolyne
wow is rosanne barr out there or what. marie osmond has a child who is gay and loves her. is marie happy with the choices her daughter Jessica made no but supports her.
to be so critical of someone and believe the article in the Enquire… well rosanne should know better. i would suggest if she were to ever do a show it wouldn’t last 5 seconds.
ewe
@carolyne: Cram it with the choices again. Being gay is not some choice all people make. If it was, then you would be able to be a lesbian woman and absolutely love it Carolyne. When that day happens, get back to me.
Kevin
I love Roseanne; and I LOVE what she said! Everything is absolutely true! I know so many Mormons who have been excommunicated from their “church” and ostracized from their families simply for being who they are. The *leading* cause of death for males aged 15-44 in Utah is SUICIDE.
http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/lcod.htm
ewe
@carolyne: And isn’t it remarkable that you are addressing the sexual orientation of Osmonds DAUGHTER as choice when the post is supposedly (not about mormon hate and Marie Osmonds indoctrination) but Roseanne Barr attacking her SON. You have been exposed Carolyn. You can torch that tattered outdated bible book that obviously is the only one you ever read. Have you heard of Shakespeare? He is the latest author. Jeepers. Feel free to come into this orbit sometime in your own lifetime.
ewe
@Kevin: Facts? That means nothing to those with the mormon agenda.
Hattie
@ewe:
The wonderful part about communication is listening to all sides and appreciating view points that might be different than one’s own. Being abrasive, and narrow only suits YOUR agenda. Please own what you are.
Irene
How come nobody has flagged this ewe character. He’s an embarrassment to the human race.
Helen
@Taylor Siluwé:
According to your post it is “normal” to hate someone who persecutes you, so I guess it would be normal for Mormons to hate gays then….
Even though it would be “normal” for Mormons to hate gays, according to your own standard, Mormons DON’T hate gays — and they don’t persecute them either. They merely disagree with the idea of gay marriage and suggest that gays get civil unions instead. Same benefits. Sorry, but making gay marriage legal will not succeed in forcing people to accept gay marriage as normal if they think it is abnormal.
Gays do very well demographically. Their standard of living is high, their education level is high, their job status is high. Yet they still have this major persecution complex What is with that?
Look, even though people treat you fairly in the workplace and such, you can’t “make” them approve of your lifestyle. And you especially can’t “make” people “approve” of your lifestyle by picking a scapegoat (the Mormon Church) to blame for all your woes and then go about vandalizing their churches.
And you especially ESPECIALLY can’t make people approve of the gay lifestyle by viciously attacking a beloved American icon after her son tragically kills himself. I mean, how socially obtuse can some people be? Most Americans would consider that EVILLL…. And if gays don’t think that is evil then no wonder they have PR problems.
Bottom line: It’s not as if gays have been totally accepted by all societies on earth from the dawn of time — until those Mormons came along….
Eric
@Kevin:
Since everyone dies, there always has to be some leading cause of death. Isn’t it curious to note that the leading cause of death among Mormon males is not cancer or heart failure? It’s not diabetes or stroke or being the victim of violent crime. It’s not car accidents from drunken driving.
Maybe you didn’t notice, but Mormon males live an average of 11 years longer than non-Mormon males, and Mormon women are not far behind.
So basically, Mormon males simply aren’t dying from the usual causes. They are surviving. Yet something has to be leading cause of death in that age range. That something is something rare. Funny that you should pick out something rare as the LEADING cause of death.
Bottom line: the Mormon lifestyle leads to increased longevity.
Carol
@ewe:
I do not blame Michael for being depressed. I do insist that he alone is accountable for his choice to take his own life. He had other choices — the same choices that others who have been in his position had, yet who chose otherwise..
He preferred to die than to live with whatever distressed him. That makes his family the victims of his suicide.
Taylor Siluwé
No. 134 · Eric
Rabbits kept in captivity live longer as well. So do lab rats, I imagine, free from all the mishaps and predators of life in the REAL world. So your point was … ?
Eric
@Taylor Siluwé:
Mormons live in the real world Taylor. Not on Mars, not in a lab. They experience all the vicissitudes of life that everyone else does, except most active Mormons decide to take a pass on many of the self-inflicted problems — like alcoholism and other addictions. Making such choices is part of the real world, believe it or not. You’ll find that many non-Mormons in the real world make similar choices.
Taylor Siluwé
No. 133 · Helen
@Taylor Siluwé:
“According to your post it is “normal” to hate someone who persecutes you, so I guess it would be normal for Mormons to hate gays then……”
Whoa. Full stop. Wrong, wrong, almost purposefully, idiotically WRONG. What we hate is the fact that you stick your nose in our business and our bedrooms and our families lives. If we lobbied and gave millions of dollars to FORCE you into same sex marriages, then you could whine. Since we don’t, you’re making a big ol’ fool of yourself.
“…Even though it would be “normal” for Mormons to hate gays, according to your own standard, Mormons DON’T hate gays — and they don’t persecute them either…”
Well, except for the little butting in OUR business thing, and trying to restrict our rights thing, maybe …
“… They merely disagree with the idea of gay marriage and suggest that gays get civil unions instead. Same benefits.”
Well, I disagree with the idea of funny underwear and suggest something by Calvin Klein. Same benefits. Yet, you don’t see me lobbying Congress over it.
“…Sorry, but making gay marriage legal will not succeed in forcing people to accept gay marriage as normal if they think it is abnormal.
It’s fast becoming legal, honey, and we couldn’t care a whit if you like it or thinks it normal. Polygamy isn’t considered normal either but your church had no problem with it until whats-his-face had a “vision” (conveniently in time for statehood).
“…Gays do very well demographically. Their standard of living is high, their education level is high, their job status is high.
Wow. Thanks for giving us props, Helen. I’m feeling a little warm and fuzzy. I might get to like you …
“…Yet they still have this major persecution complex What is with that?”
Oh, lord, I knew it was too good to be true. The P-word again. Now you’re just being silly, or trying to really piss me off.
“…Look, even though people treat you fairly in the workplace and such, you can’t “make” them approve of your lifestyle. And you especially can’t “make” people “approve” of your lifestyle by picking a scapegoat (the Mormon Church) to blame for all your woes and then go about vandalizing their churches.”
We didn’t pick the Mormon Church, it picked US you stupid COW! See, you’ve got to me and made me be rude. That’s so unlike me. And I’m sure you’re not stupid.
” …And you especially ESPECIALLY can’t make people approve of the gay lifestyle by viciously attacking a beloved American icon after her son tragically kills himself. I mean, how socially obtuse can some people be? Most Americans would consider that EVILLL…. And if gays don’t think that is evil then no wonder they have PR problems.”
I wasn’t aware of our PR problem; I have to check with headquarters. And no one is attacking Ms. Osmond, just wondering why Mormon kids so often off themselves. You should wonder to.
“…Bottom line: It’s not as if gays have been totally accepted by all societies on earth from the dawn of time — until those Mormons came along….”
Neither were the Mormons, dearest Helen. Or have you completely forgotten your history. I haven’t. I could fill you in on some horrific things done to (and by) your people. Do you really wanna go there with me?
Taylor Siluwé
No. 137 · Eric
@Taylor Siluwé:
“Mormons live in the real world Taylor. Not on Mars, not in a lab.”
Well, according to your beliefs (which I had no problem with until you brought them to OUR doorstep) and those of your ‘Big Love’ fringies (FLDS – who consider themselves the TRUE Mormons) — you couldn’t kookier if you did. Great show though. Nice going.
“…They experience all the vicissitudes of life that everyone else does, except most active Mormons decide to take a pass on many of the self-inflicted problems — “
Uh, like the re-orientation therapies you put your poor gay kids through ’til they wanna jump off a building? That sort of self-inflicted problem? Or like the problem of vandalized churches by people angry at you for minding other people’s business? Hmmm….
I would suggest you stop lurking in gay blogs trying to defend the indefensible. Same Sex marriage is coming. Live with it, just like you lived with letting those inferior blacks into your little fairytale world — though for the life of me I can’t understand why any self-respecting African American would sink so low. But, alas, even they have that right. God bless ’em, I guess.
And look, we just discovered something else I disapprove of yet refrain from lobbying Congress over. Go away please, you all are boring me now.
ewe
@Hattie: There is nothing to appreciate or respect about religious zealots. Try that on someone else. It is you with the issues. You just don’t like it when you bump into someone that is willing to combat your hateful rhetoric.
ewe
@Irene: Irene is sitting on her throne. Remember to paint your toenails while your there.
ewe
@Helen: Gays do not persecute mormons you moron. We are reacting to them in defense much like minorities react to racism. You are in the dark. Newsflash Bimbo… No one cares if you accept gay marriage. We want equality written into the law. You can rant on till your throat falls out in your temples. Who cares? Feel free. Gays don’t have a persecution complex. Gay people take people like you on when they need to. Gay people are not more wealthy than straight people. Some people just have more disposable income than others. Choke on that next time you have your vicious coffee circle. No one cares if you approve of us in the workplace. Harrassment is illegal in the workplace Cowgirl Jane. The only woe is religion and the evil behavior you are exhibiting. Do you have any idea how utterly ignorant you sound? Marie Osmond is not an American icon. She sells dolls on QVC. Gay people were considered shamans since the dawn of time and most preciously revered until your pathetic controlling Mr. Smith of all people started his own business called the MORmONS. You are rediculous Helen.
ewe
@Eric: Quality of life has nothing to do with insulting people that are different than you and that is the number one Mormon trait.
ewe
@Carol: You have no idea or right to flagrantly define someone who is in such crisis they take their own life. You speak of it like you are discussing what you are going to have for dinner tomorrow. Who is insensitive to anyone left behind? YOU. Stop the denial. The mormon temple is evil and controlling. You will just have to go recruit elsewhere.
ewe
@Eric: lmao. that is laughing my ass off for you in case you don’t know that term. Oh yeah, i never saw a mormon without problems. Hahahahahah. You are flipped out denial junkie, cookie.
Lukas P.
Like the Adam Lambert threads, we have a huge # of posters who we’ve NEVER seen before & who post on NO other topic.
Let’s call those people “single agenda” trolls.
ewe
@Taylor Siluwé: Only one thing to say to you… May the universal god love and protect your bright light forever. You are so precise and correct with your response. The Mormons are dumb as dumb can be and dumber than the dumber ones. ? Crazy loon tunes.
Taylor Siluwé
Thanx, EWE …
It’s been a while since I had a fundie dust-up. I kinda missed it. *mental note: annoy more Mormons – they’re such a hoot.* 😉
J
@Carol: I didn’t direct anything to Roseanne… or her personal beliefs… I was talking about everybody forcing all of this “Jesus” crap to Ewe, and just in general.
Lukas P.
@Taylor Siluwé: @ewe: My thanks to both of you for instilling order into chaos, comforting the troubled, and troubling the overly comfortable!
I suspect Queerty has been subject to an onslaught of LDS apologists (aka TROLLS), and until the topic of their faith comes up again, they like the Adam Lambert and Clay Aiken fans will slink back into their own comfy corners, believing that they put us into “our place” and are morally superior.
May whatever fire drives you two not be dimmed. Here, or elsewhere. You have inspired me.
ewe
@Lukas P.: Thank you and ditto to you too. I don’t think these people have ever met well rounded self loving gay people that told them that they are the ones with a problem other than on this site. Who knows? They very well might get an aha moment and realize that it is them putting down people for being gay and that is the only thing requirement they need to obsess and concentrate their efforts on. They don’t even use rationale. It’s all in a book someone else is pushing. They are being horribly used (in this case by the mormons) and they don’t even know it. It’s worse if they do know because that would mean they accept it. No wonder these wankers are oppressing others. They hate themselves. lol All i have to say is they better stay clear of me cause i have spent my life combatting people like that and its just another normal day. EESH!!!!!
jclarke
Why is everyone wasting their time responding to this Ewe thing? Can’t you see he/she is so closed minded and stilted they are never going to get it because they don’t want to. Just the typical name calling, venom filled, immature lout who can’t accept that other people have as much a right to their opinion as they do.
Sanity
From reading most posts, it’s abundantly clear that most of you know absolutely nothing about the Mormon religion.
It is a religion that considers homosexuality immoral (well within their right), but also does NOT condone hatred toward anyone.
I am not of the Mormon faith, but I grew up in Utah, and Roseanne Barr’s comments are preposterous. She is simply trying to get attention, as she always does. There are homosexuals in Utah. There are homosexual Mormons in Utah. Generally members of the Mormon church do not treat them any differently from anyone else. Their homosexual behavior is not accepted as moral by Mormons – just as smoking, drinking, premarital sex, etc. is not accepted as moral by Mormons – but they are not treated any differently.
You all need to step outside of your ignorant & salacious fantacies, and do some legitimate research.
How Dare She?
Is Rosanne Barr outraged with every suicide in America? Or, just a ‘Mormon religion suicide?’ Does she know that there is a suicide in this country every 15 minutes? That suicide surpasses murders? And, it can (really)happen to anyone? Gay-Straight; Male-Female; Young-Old; Religious-or Not? We don’t know if Michaels dispair was real or imagined. It seems to me that the suicide rate is a bigger issue than who one chooses to have sex with. The comments to Marie Osmond, as a MOTHER who just lost her beloved son, is stunning. Losing a child is a pain like no other. I don’t keep up with ‘Hollywood’…Barr or Osmonds, but I doubt Rosanne Barr is more ‘tolerant’ than Marie Osmond. I am a Christian and I could care less where folks find love. I also believe that ‘religion’ in a persons life is better than no religion at all…as long as it makes YOU a better person. Rosanne Barr doesn’t have a clue on how painful, and forever changed, Marie Osmond life has become. Ms. Barr should thank, the God of her choice, for her lucky stars.
Taylor Siluwé
No. 153 · Sanity
You guessed it, I’m not Mormon. I get the willies just thinking about it. However, I was raised Jehovah’s Witness, another Cult of Control, no doubt, but at least they respect the separation of church and state — and do not vote or dabble in politics. I so wish I could say the same for the recently EX-inbred-polygamous Church of the Latter Day Nuts.
However, if you are “not of the Mormon faith”, then:
a) Why do you claim more knowledge of it then the posters here? Is it just an innate Utah thing? As in, do all Utah children toggle between learning the alphabet, Dr. Seuss and the book of Mormon? Please explain your credentials.
b) How do you know (for a fact) that Mormon gays are treated no differently? And – are you referring to ones who were damaged by universally-discredited conversion therapies, or the ones who weren’t? Again, an explanation for your knowledge of these ‘facts’ are in order.
As for “salacious fantasies”, do expound as to which post you’re talking about specifically. This peaks my interest (as salacious things do), and I must have missed it.
Taylor Siluwé
No. 154 · How Dare She?
*sigh*
Please explain to us all how “religion” (and I’d assume you mean ANY religion) in a persons life is better than none at all?
No, I can’t wait. I’ll just assume what your answer will be; I’ll take it on ‘faith’. People like you assume that without religion mankind will descend into chaos, an anarchy and war and rape and murder and all manner of atrocities.
Well, we’ve got tons of religions in the world, and still all of the above. Believe it or not, there are people in the world who do not need a dusty text — written thousands of years ago by men who thought lightning meant God was pissed — to know right from wrong. That’s what your brain is for, when you decide you have the right to use it, of course.
Lukas P.
Once again, the thread is being flooded by people we’ve never heard from before and who don’t post on any other topic.
Clearly they have a strict agenda.
Clearly they don’t respond to logic. They’re very good at questioning but not very good at answering.
Similar tactics are taught to North Koreans. And people living in other delusional, oppressive regimes, like, oh, yeah, the LDS church.
ewe
@jclarke: stop turning it around you ugly hearted spam bot. Other people have no right to put those that are different them then down based on their sexual orientation. Take a mental health class you sap.
ewe
@Sanity: You are insane. The only thing you are saying is that it is ok to hate. FOOL. Evil You are going straight to any hell you believe exists. You are the one who needs to step out of your ugly box. All you are saying is that “we hate because it’s ok to hate since we find it acceptable to hate”. I am sure there is a burglar who wants inside your house with the same sentiments. Go yell your mantra and see how much sense it makes to those kind of intrusive people.
ewe
@How Dare She?: Yes i am sure Roseanne Barr is aware other people have committed suicide. It is ok that you believe religion in your life is better than no religion in your life. The operative word is “YOUR”.
ewe
@How Dare She?: I have a strong feeling you are liar. I know many Christians who find the MORmONS to be twisted people and would not ever come to their aid. Let’s not forget that their founders murdered their own flock not too terribly long ago. BUSTED!!!!!!!!!!!!
ewe
I find no difference between “founders” vs.”prophets”. Brigham Young was a murderer. What was the message he sent?… “Breathren do you duty”. Mormons murder people they don’t want around. Someone should knock some sense into you mormons cause although you may still be breathing, you are already spiritually and morally dead and without light or hope.
taylor siluwe
Yes, EWE, and they named a university after him. Uhg.
“Blood atonement!” Wasn’t that the phrase that set the massacre in motion? Now there’s a man to raise little Mormon rug-rats to revere. Right, Helen?
Ah, the good ol’ days. Roseanne would’ve been toast then. Uhg.
ewe
@taylor siluwe: Yes. I would also like for the MORmONS to inform us of their religious blogs so that we can have the joy of addressing their propaganda. No doubt they censor all opposition UNLIKE THIS BLOG.
Shara
So now Roseanne Barr has annointed herself as “the only person who says things that no one else will say.”
Her egotism is matched only by her ignorance.
I’m not gay, not Mormon and not a fan of the Osmond family but I can’t imagine ANY of those groups of people (or anyone else, for that matter) caring very much about what a publicity starved insensitive former t.v. actress has to say about them.
Jaroslaw
#157 great observation that this post is flooded with comments by people we never heard from before.
FYI, EWE and I got into it on another blog (Mike S) – I actually agree with most of what he says but for someone accusing others of hatred, he’s pretty abrasive himself. Although I certainly can understand how frustrating it is to deal with idealogues and braindead folks like Irene, JClarke etc.
Cam
Look, lets get right down to business here. The Mormons didn’t allow blacks full membership in their church until around 1980 and that was ONLY because of huge public pressure on them as schools were going to stop playing BYU, and other horrible P.R.. They have always had a history of bigotry and their response to ANY questioning of that is to immediatly play the victim. “Gee, why are YOU being so hateful to US?” As if it is an attack to question their bigotry. Well right now the only group left that they can publicly be bigoted towards is the gays. They aren’t going to stop doing that willingly.
Oh, and to all you Mormons coming in here, I have a question. Why do you divide your Wards into Race? Don’t think that we all don’t know that you have Samoan Wards, and Latino Wards etc…. you pretend it’s due to language issues, but even Latinos born here are “Encouraged” to go to the Latino Ward. So again, take your bigotry elsewhere, we know exactly who and what you are.
EWE
@Shara: That’s true what you say about the osmonds and mormons not caring. I am sure they do not care about a gay man killing himself either. It is all for show. The Osmonds have already returned to Sin City to sing the blues next to the gamblers at the casino tables. What a croc of BS this incestuous looking duo are full of. Uh huh. Yeah i said it. Roseanne is not the only one confronting mormon hate.
EWE
@Jaroslaw: I agree and i make no apology.
EWE
@Cam: Bravo. This mormon vermin would be hauled into a court of law and criminally charged if not for the ability to shield and cloak themselves in a false religion with a made up god.
Lukas P.
I predict that excessive religiosity will someday be considered a psych. disorder, similiar to addiction [compulsive behavior with serious negative consequences] and also to psychosis [believing in, hearing/seeing things that others don’t. Whether it will be treatable, I don’t know; will it be in my lifetime, I don’t think so. Whether it will be a positive or negative part of history, that’s not my judgement call.
How Dare She?
I didn’t realize this thread was for the regulars only? Sorry. I heard a blup on TV about a suicide comment Ms. Barr made and this post pulled first in a google search.
My ‘religious’ comment. Most folks in my neighborhood have lived here for 10+ years. We have a very diverse melting-pot and thankfully have become a tight knit group. I personally have never met anyone who didn’t believe in ‘something.’ Sharon has been in AA for 3 years and her ‘religion’ is simply, her higher power. No God-No Jesus-No religious label. She is a better person for her belief in ‘something.’ We all ‘hate’ her because she has a pool. Another neighbor believes in reincarnation. That’s way-off for me, but I adore Diane and she makes a darn good argument! We have a Mormon family and they are lovely. I could go on and on about our great little neighborhood! Do I think there are religious loons in this world….you bet. The human race is vicious.
My agenda to post…to protect survivors of suicide. I was stunned by Ms. Barrs comments. ‘How Dare She’ meaning…most health care professions wouldn’t dare make a blanket statement that they knew WHY someone would take their life. Even with a suicide note…survivors of suicide struggle with the ‘why’ as the one to ask…is no longer here. I lost my brother-in-law to suicide. We loose 30,000+ Americans to suicide every year. For sure, Ms. Barr doesn’t know “why” Michael took his life. If she did, she has a new gift in life and a million family members who would greatly appreciate her services to clarify the suicide ‘why’ in their life.
My youngest daughter passed away and I assumed Ms. Barr is a mother? She may not be? Of course, until a parent looses a child they really do not know how painful it is. Amputation best describes it. No matter what Marie Osmond religious beliefs are my heart goes out to her and her family.
EWE
@How Dare She?:Well you almost had my empathy and full attention until your last line. You say “no matter what Marie Osmond religious beliefs are my heart goes out to her and her family”. Perhaps you need to talk to your “lovely” mormon neighbors about the beliefs. I am sure you may like a few Ugandans that kill gay people in the name of god too. Being a nice person does not mean letting shit heads walk all over you for being gay. That is what many many religious people do to other people today and just because you appear to be fortunate enough not to experience that DOES NOT ALLOW YOU to passively sit by and profess messages of goodness and light about these rotten people, their thoughts and behavior. You could not be more wrong and i only wish your views were true but they aren’t. I will not sink into a pool of oblivious denial about hateful people who twist a god to hate along with them.
strumpetwindsock
@EWE:
Jesus H Christ will you please drop it? You may have some strong opinions, but you do not know everything.
I see a lot of opinions expressed which I disagree with too, but sometimes I let them pass because I realize that others have experience which gives them insight into things which I do not have.
You might be right in some things, but it can’t hurt you to just listen for a change.
Lukas P.
The awful truthiness:
@How
Dare She?: I too have friends who practice religion. I don’t try to convert them, and we don’t stay friends for long if they try to convert me. Same goes for the vegans!
The problem is: I believe in freedom of religion as long as there is freedom from religion. As I’ve posted on a similar thread, Mr Blosil’s death hit a raw nerve among many of us who are GLB, and among those of us who have lost friends, family members and/or patients/clients [for those of us who work in health care.]
It also hit a raw nerve because of the impact of the religious right —including the LDS church, the Catholic church and many evangelical churches, etc — on the Prop 8 passage. Their efforts were seen as an attempt to deny us rights in that case, and symbolic of the ongoing attempts to demonize us, vilify us, and silence us. Many LGBT people have been ostracized from their families and churches, some even have been sent for reparative therapy, and some were convinced they were evil and hell-bound.
Combine all those things and tempers flare. I can’t speak for others, but I probably said some things in haste or ire that I would like to have NOT said, or said differently.
The nature of the blogosphere is such that we read, react, comment about issues that we don’t have all the facts on, and on matters where the story is still emerging. This happens in a space of anonymity, where the individual nuances of speech, gesture and tone of voice are hard to parse and discern. Sometimes there’s more “talking” than “listening” going on. There are lots of agendas being advanced here, and of course we each have biases and blind spots.
In the real world, I’m a pretty thoughtful and respectful person. On line I’m much quicker to opine and spout off. Maybe others are too.
I hope this helps to clarify somewhat some of the “heat” you’ve experienced and that you’ll continue to chime in when a subject is of interest.
Just don’t hate me because I have a pool though! [g]
EWE
@strumpetwindsock: shut it. I am well aware i do not know everything. I am making sure i tell the religious hypocrites who are giving discrimination a free pass that they do not know everything either. Get one thing straight. I am aware enough to know that there are just as many stupid gay people as there are straight ones. You can buy your own ticket for the trains you know where if you so choose. I am going down fighting like hell just as i did when all the Jerry Fallwells of the world took the cash of the ignorant and shit on the memory of gay people who were ill in the Eighties. You can go elsewhere. I am not interested in any of your dumb logic. It is not insight to bash gay people nor is it acceptable to sit on the sidelines and watch. I AM listening AND i AM responding. If you don’t like it, then continue doing whatever the hell you want. I certainly am going to.
EWE
@Lukas P.: That is very nice and so true what you wrote. But i am gonna say something more blunt. The Mormons would tell “How Dare She?” that if the child she lost was a gay person, then it is just as well that child died.” Those are not my sentiments. Those are the ugly religious who have been hating gay people for being gay for quite a long time. And i for one am making no apology or space for that other than to expose them.
How Dare She?
Ewe…The Mormons I have encountered have not been zealous, nor haters. Are you saying all Mormans hate gays? For sure, all religions have loons!! I definately do not believe people are called to hate one another. Everyone has feelings! At best, we should be polite. We live in a hurting world. I have not experienced what you speak about. But, I believe you. People are insensitive and cruel. Alot of people just don’t care….probably because we live in a hurting world?
Crazy “Morman” memory….My daughter’s best friend, through most of her junior/high school years, was Mormon (as still is). I was divorced then and the family (namely the mother) was **terrified** to let their daughter play with my daughter. Besides being divorced I smoked and she would go home smelling like smoke. I would never smoke in the house today! But, did back then. I did feel bad…and I suppose ashamed…that my life didn’t seem to be as perfect as theirs. I knew I was being judged and I knew the mother was trying her hardest to be tolerant…and she was. But, over the years they did warm up (a tad) to me and of course, shed tears with our family when my daughter passed away. I keep in touch with their daughter and I’m thankful for those crazy school memories!!
As far ‘nailing Marie to the cross’ the only thing I can say is that parents feel mighty sad and guilty when their child dies. We think…surely it’s my fault. I could have ? done something [different]. Better doctors…more money..something…what?! When John Travoltas beloved son, Jet, died it somewhat helped put my daughters death into perspective. Of course, I don’t personally know John Travolta but I’ve always liked his work and admire him as a ‘good’ person. I personally believe he was/is a good father and think the ‘sky’s the limit’ in regard to finances. I believe Jet had the best care money could buy and yet…he died. Wow!! How is that?!? Really?
I think most parents adore their children and raise them the best we know how. Children get our strengths and regretfully, our weakness.
Call me an idiot…am I on a gay site?
How Dare She?
@Lukas P.: LOL! I live in Central Texas….We will probably always ‘hate’ folks who can afford a cement pond!!!
romeo
Yes, HowDareShe, you are on a gay site. However, your post was thoughtful and coherent, so you’re more than welcome here. By the way, we say a lot of things here that may seem extreme because we can’t do it elsewhere. It’s just a reaction to the way we are treated. Also, we’re a bunch of bitches.
EWE
@How Dare She?: I am saying that religious people who hear the discrimination that is being taught in the name of their religion should stand up to it especially if they are not in agreement. And if you are unsuccessful in that then it would be best to abandon the religion and keep your own dignity. I respect what you say about not experiencing homophobia. My example of distorting the memory of your beautiful child gives you only a small bitter taste of what homosexual people face everyday. Not me. I am too much of a loud mouthed bitch. People tend to stay away from me with that crap. I am very happy you have wonderful “crazy school memories” but if you think about it, they have nothing to do with the shallow reactions of your mormon neighbors. It has to do with your love for your child and her spectacular essence. No one can take that away from you nor would any decent human being want to. The mormons are not decent. Abstaining from caffeine, not smoking and eating dried fruit does not define decency. Many people also think John Travolta is a gay man since you brought him up. The rumors in the eighties by those in the hospitatlity industry was that he and his manager would book two rooms and only use the one. My sister grabbed her dead blue infant and went screaming wildly into the streets when she found her lifeless so i have all the empathy for you i can offer but it is the hateful mormons and those like them that not only would say being gay is worthy of being dead… they go even further on about a special place in hell for eternity. AS IF THEY KNOW WHAT THE FUCK THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT. It’s blasphemy and they should be taken to task every day for it. Yes indeed, Your neighbor and countless others! You are on a blog. Why everything must be labeled different at the expense of not ever having to say heterosexual is beyond me. I do not consider being straight the standard to work off of. Good luck to you and don’t defend hate. It is unbecoming.
Lukas P.
@EWE: Thanks. The compliment I paid to you and Mr Siluwe was sincere. My experience with the LDS folks –and other “righteous” religious people — is based on a big portion of my job –which to put it in very blunt terms — is to “undo” the damage that humans inflict on each other. Much of that hurt stems from religion, dogma, orthodoxy, whatever it’s called.
Happy, fulfilled and content people, by definition, don’t seek the help I provide [psychotherapy…..]. So, I recognize that my view is skewed. I have not been endowed with the power to perform miracles [yet!].
I appreciate that “Dare She” comes here and speaks her mind. That’s brave. I admire that.
I also can’t accept the premise that the LDS/Catholic/Evangelical/Fundies are benign in their desire to make us “go away,” Thus, my ‘ rant ‘ on the Prop 8 and the “raw nerves.”
I respect the rights of others UNTIL they violate my own. I personally–for reasons that don’t matter much here–am quite unlikely to join the US military, to marry my guy, face employment discrimation, or to adopt a child –but I will continue to fight against people who seek to silence, muffle, batter, battle –or deny– those rights to my gay/bi/lesbian “family.” I also “fight” for healthcare for the poor and needy, for education, and for “living wage” because, even without a religious background, I +was+, as you were, brought up to think about the rights of others. I often don’t live up to my ideals, but I honestly do care about whether my neighbor can put food on her table, get care in an ER, or get her child a decent education. I’m sure you do, too.
You’re better with words than I am, so I will leave you with the wish that you keep your fire burning , that Ms “Dare She” understands why we’re “on fire and ired” and that I get up on time to catch the dang train to the office!
Be +well+ & +brave+, everyone who’s still awake!. Or awakening….
How Dare She?
@romeo: I hate to admit it but I think most women are a bit too bitchy. Why is that? I try not be but it seems to surface without much effort on my part. Definately a weakness in me that doesn’t make me ‘feel’ better. 2 weeks ago is the first time I ever made a comment on a blog. The blog was local and on the law suit against Sheryl Stack. I’m thankful that the lawsuit filed against her was dropped. The Joe Stack suicide seems to be another hot subject and the blog was taken down and closed fairly quickly as it was crude. What a horrible tradegy!!!I drove by the building earlier this week. It is absolutely amazing that more people were not killed. Anyway…I’m a newbie and ‘go figure’ that I’m posting on your blog. Maybe, I will stick around for awhile? I’m thankful for the clarity for all the strong feelings as I didn’t understand getting knocked around to this degree.
Used to Be Lukas
Queerty has banned me, so my commenting days are over.
Be well, all!
How Dare She?
@EWE: John Travolta may be gay? I’ve never heard that. Doesn’t matter to me. I like him. He has a ‘butt-chin’ and I have a soft spot for ‘butt-chins.’
I know there are a lot of Christians who NOT accept the gay community. I also know there are a lot of Christians who DO. I am traditional in a lot of ways but I try to instill a “live and let live” attitude on many issues. I would never support any ministry that would bash gays. I would never attend a church that bashes gays. I don’t label myself as ‘tolerant’ either. I think we live our lives and hopefully, do good. If I accept people for who they are then I’m tolerant? Please. I prefer to not have that label. If a person is gay and does good, good. If a person is straight and does good, good. If a person would do more good with red hair…color your hair red and do good. Even getting back to suicides,there are many religions that believe suicide results in hell. That thinking drives me crazy. I’ve done a fair amount of research on suicide but the issue of this blog seems to be a Mormon/Gay issue. Yes?
I guess my questions is…are those ‘religious’ groups against the gay community that black-n-white? Meaning…the so called ‘leaders’ might be preaching it but not all will conform? Is it that cookie-cutter to say that all Mormons hate gays? Or, are some Mormons churches, in our communities, liberated?
I’m not as sharp as I used to be. I literally feel like I lost 1/2 of my brain in my grief. Forgive me, if I don’t articulate that well. I really don’t want to stir-up-the-pot. White, Christian, married female. I, too, feel like I struggle with so many groups in society. Christian so I must hate gays. White so I must hate Blacks.
One bad apple in the basket does spoil the whole bushel.
EWE
@How Dare She?: I was under the impression you were a christian. (see message number 154) You most probably do participate in a religion that puts down gay people. Those that lead Christian religions tend to bash gay people. You have to tell me which one you belong to that does not bash gays. MCC? I would really appreciate knowing. That would be wonderful if they did not but i am very skeptical.
You brought John Travolta up and i just added a comment. The fact that he may be gay might not matter to you just like the fact Marie Osmond losing her child who might be gay does not matter to Mormons or any other gay haters. Same thing.
How Dare She?
@EWE: What a horrible comparison! Grew up Lutheran. Non-Denominational as an adult. What is MCC?
How Dare She?
@How Dare She?: Ewe…It doesn’t really matter what my beliefs are. No need to reply. I just read that the Michael was not gay. Most suicides involve: depression/alcohol/drug abuse. I can see now that this blog is a fight…against the Mormons. I personally would like to see awareness to the growing numbers of suicides in this country. Good luck!
EWE
@How Dare She?: good luck
How Dare She?
Yesterday afternoon I make, what I think is my final post, here. “I’m over it” feeling. However, this morning I woke up and those who understand the full impact of grieving will understand when I say…after a few minutes “the fog lifts in my brain,” and I am seething mad. Seething mad at me as my memory is jogged and I “remember” that I am a gay movement supporter! I have actually voted on different issues in their favor. Wow. As I enter back into the land of the living I get these epiphanies every now and then of my then, seemingly “normal” life. I wonder why? Maybe the extremely talented gay hairdresser I once frequented and liked? Realtor’s who were gay and a blast to work with? Basic human instinct to live and let live? A young man is dead, a family has been thrown in chaos, and I stumble unto a blog that seems to be quite giddy about it. Hate for hate? I’m thinking…now what? Count me out? Count me in?
Taylor Siluwé
No. 189 · How Dare She?
I would thing you’ve counted yourself in already. And thanx for looking beyond the reactionary, which we all need to do. It’s so easy to see a story and immediately react from the gut, like most of us did at first.
As for “hate for hate”, you certainly have a point. Again, its reactionary. But you have to understand when you grow up gay in America (and probably everywhere else) — being abused for your perceived gayness even before you’ve excepted it for yourself, and then growing up to see the discrimination and society-approved derogatory remarks from family and even The Church — you carry an open wound for the rest of your life.
Then you see young gay people, sometimes very young —
http://taylorsiluwe.typepad.com/taylor_siluwe/2009/04/when-i-was-eleven-.html
— who just can’t take it and kill themselves – and the rage shoots out like an arterial spurt.
There was no giddy emotions here for what happened. Hate, yes, but its because we’ve lived our lives under the weight of it. The Mormon church and other Christo-Fascist orgs would have us continue that way, living in fear and shame for who we were born to be, 2nd class citizens in our own country.
That’s why we lash out. It’s self defense, pure and simple. Like I said before, Roseanne was right, however tactless. But when has Ms. Barr been known for mincing words? Personally, that’s what I love about her the most.
Keep adding to the dialogue here and everywhere else. Children’s lives are at stake.
merkin
None of us here know Marie Osmond or her son Michael. Roseanne doesnt know them either. We all just assume that because he has a glitzy showbiz mom he must have been gay. Roseanne starts her post with “Marie Osmond’s poor gay son killed himself because he had been told how wrong and how sick he was every day of his life by his church and the people in it.”
Its one thing to harmlessly speculate about a celebrity’s sexuality. But its disgusting to think we know these people and the circumstances under which they and their family live their lives. Do you idiots think reading US Magazine actually informs you??
Yes the Mormon church is monstrous, but picking this moment to attack it is a clear statement that Marie is to blame for her son’s death, whether its an implicit or implied accusation. Given that she has come out publicly to support her gay daughter, and has been attacked by her church for her divorce, I’d wager she wasnt a Christian gay-basher. But I dont know–none of us do. And we should keep our friggin’ mouths shut.
How Dare She?
@Taylor Siluwé: Taylor..I can relate to posting off-the-cuff! That is exactly what I did. Read Rosannes comments…and off and running I went. I will look over your link this weekend. Children are definately at risk. We live in a hurting world!!
Rosanne Barr. For many years I really liked her and thought she was hilarous!! Loved her sitcom and faithful follower. My parents were big-time Johnny Carson fans and I remember when she debuted on the Tonight Show. For some crazy reason I even remember a joke she told after all these years!! “My husband and I found a new method of birth control. We spend an hour each night with our kids before we go to bed.” I still think this joke is hilarous…LOL
Probably not going to change your mind about her and vise versa…but…put a fork in me I’m done with her. I honestly, can not help but wonder, if she actually hinders your cause?
Thanks for the invite to continue to post here. I really do appreciate hearing that.
EWE
@How Dare She?: I see. Well when there ever comes an issue where gay people are required to vote for or against you then maybe you will see the sense of entitlement you are giving yourself. Let me know when i should be casting my vote to say whether or not I find you to be a valid person worthy of the same rights as me. I will be sure to pat myself on the back too afterward. OK?
How Dare She?
@EWE: Correct me, if I am wrong, but I am reading that the grass is greener on my side of the fence? If so, forgive me, as that memo never made it across my desk.
EWE
You are not forgiven for ignorance and not knowing that the grass is indeed greener for those not oppressed. NOTE TO YOU: Sarcasm and dismissiveness is a quality we all can participate in.
EWE
@How Dare She?: Listen, do you have a point you are trying to make? I certainly am not giddy about a young mans death but i do believe that Candy coated Marie Osmond may be responsible for inflicting her rigid antigay mormon belief system on her children. She should be required to express why her commitment to a religion that oppresses us is a perfectly valid way to spend her time shootin her mouth off about a loving god. That goes for all mormons not just her. Your neighbor is a rotten human being too. You may sit around waiting for such people to give you respect but i don’t. I shit on people who shit on me. Some homophobes label that the gay agenda.
How Dare She?
@Taylor Siluwé: Taylor…Do you find that you almost cannot even grasp young children and suicide? I feel like my brain is searching for some form of sanity when I hear young children are capable of suicide. Are you familiar with American Foundation for Suicide Prevention website?
http://www.afsp.org
I haven’t been to the site in a long time and I should to check what new information may be available. I don’t specifically remember if the statistics were broken down for gay suicides? In 1998 my brother-in-law took his life. 10 years later, his oldest son takes his life, too. We are told that although suicide is not hereditary, depression is. And, multiple suicides in a family are common as ‘the option’ is now on the table. That’s scary information. I do know there is a lot of stigma/shame associated with suicide and a lot of people will not get help for fear of rejection.
My memory escapes me, but I think the stats are 1 in 4 families in America are deeply affected by a suicide? I suppose I should double check that figure prior to posting? Whatever it is, I felt that the number was staggering with the realization of how many hurting people walk among us….and it’s highly possible I just don’t know all (about the people I interact with).
How Dare She?
@EWE: Ewe…Honey…I promise…The grass is SO NOT greener at my house. We each have different forms of grief/loss in our lives but I would NOT wish for ANYONE to walk 2 weeks in my shoes.
And, yes…I AM screaming.
Taylor Siluwé
No. 197 · How Dare She?
Yes. My heart bleeds for them.
In my ‘When I was Eleven’ blog post about the suicides of two eleven-year-olds (Carl Walker-Hoover & Jaheem Herrera) in a short span of time, both bullied for perceived gayness, I tried to recall what my life was like when I was eleven.
Suicide may have been going on with kids then, but the information super-highway was but a dirt country trail then. But the horrible bullying I went through could have sent me down that road, had I known then that other ‘boys like me’ were doing that.
I’m glad I didn’t know.
But Bullycide is a huge problem because kids are a horrid, thoughtless, reactionary reflection of their parents biases — sadly, most are religious based, which is what this post is all about.
Erica
Ewe:
Thank you so much for your posts. I find them very insightful. The next time gay marriage comes up on the ballot in my state I won’t be fooled by the expensive ads depicting gay couples as nice people that you would want as your neighbors.
I’ll remember how hard they work to churn up hatred towards others.
Again, thank you for being honest.
EWE
@Erica: No problem. It takes one to know one. People deserve what they give. I am in complete agreement.
EWE
@Erica: Do i get to vote on what you can put in and take out of your vagina on the next ballot Erica? Don’t forget to make sure you be nice to me now.
Carol
@mike:
Mike, I really think the gay community should take a lot of responsibility for how deeply conflicted young gay people feel — those who have recently or not yet come out. I think it normal that these young people would stress over telling their parents — and that they would fear disappointing or even alientating their parents. This must be especially frightening for young people who are still dependent upon parents for financial support.
But there is an added burden. Simultaneously the gay community is exerting enormous pressure on these young people, telling them if they don’t come out now they are cowards and traitors.
So you have a young person who is not yet financially independent reading a steady stream of demands from the gay community that he venture into the unknown right now and “possibly” lose his own family in addition to his means of survival. He is told to basically sacrifice himself on the altar of a cause that can’t replace his family and isn’t going to come to his financial rescue.
And throughout this process the gay community will be continually drilling into him the message that if he has religious parents they will HATE him and persecute him because they all hate all gay people. He’ll be told repeatedly (as we have seem on this board) that his parents are evil, that they are his enemy, that they have no redeeming qualities.
And we haven’t even talked about fear of getting AIDS.
Thus do many young gays find themselves between a rock and a hard place. Life looks bleak.
That’s a lot of pressure on a young person. The gay community could choose not to exert this pressure, but it feels its power is dependent upon having higher numbers right now, so it keeps the pressure on.
I don’t think that is very nice….
EWE
@Carol: You are so off base. It is the religious hierarchy that the gay community is attempting to address. If one tells their parents that by being silent in the wake of their hateful oppressive leaders is no different than the behavior of passive German citizens during the nazi era, that does not mean that they are attacking someones family. It means that parents are being asked to wake the fuck up. You and your tired example that is nothing short of pumping fear and anxiety into people is a disgrace. And…. “I don’t think that is very nice…”
Taylor Siluwé
Now now, Carol …
Let’s not be kooky. I can say our community should lighten up on pressing some people to “come out” (Johnny Weir) because,
A) It’s silly to think he’s IN
and B) because its my community, so I think I know a thing or two about it (unlike you)
So like EWE said, you are so off base. WAY OFF.
Carol
Look, I have read numerous articles by gays that pressured young gays to come out — that told them they were cowards if they didn’t.
And just go through Ewe’s posts where he/she calls Marie Osmond evil for no other reason than she belongs to a church that disapproves of ALL sex outside of marriage, nobody excluded, that admittedly opposes gay marriage for theological reasons but is OK with civil unions — but does not promote unkindness towards anyone, whomever they are.
It is hardly the Mormon Church’s fault that the most vocal segment of the gay population is low on emotional intelligence. In other words, their limited emotional vocabulary has lead to to a limited ability to conceptualize different emotions. Thus disapproval of a behavior equals hatred of an individual in their minds, which is aviewpoint typical of adolescence. Fortunately, not all gays are emotionally stunted this way — and as a result they tend to be more tolerant of other people.
Taylor Siluwé
Carol,
When you call some gays “low on emotionally intelligence”, is it because they refuse most vehemently to be looked down upon and demoted to groveling for their rights from hetero-privleged people like yourself?
Well good for them. They make me proud. One thing is clear from this thread – you will never understand if you talk more than you listen.
EWE
@Carol: You are rediculous. Who the hell do you think you are talking to anyone as if we are supposed to give a damn what you think? Why don’t i tell you Carol how to live your life? How about that? You are so arrogant! You have no right to spit off about your religion if it involves you doing more than sharing your beliefs because it is quite obvious i don’t care about your view on life for me, according to Carol. The entire point is that i don’t care if you disapprove. You don’t even know me you dumb punk. You are the one being unkind and you are getting it back. Don’t speak about intelligence. You are attempting to control other people as simple stupid Carol and her religion see fit. FUCK YOU CAROL. No one here is telling you to be anything or anyone other than yourself. So what makes you think that your invasive personal intrusion should be viewed as intelligence? You just don’t like it when i give you the same shit you give me. You don’t deserve anything but fuck you in your face cause you are one stupid bitch who can’t figure out that you have no right to tell me anything at all about who and what i am inside. Live your life the way you want Carol. Did you read that last line? That is very very very different than your filthy tyrannical approach toward gay people you are either unable to or refuse to understand. Don’t fret. Nobody gives a shit. Your immature outlook on life makes you nothing more than a sheltered little brat. Don’t talk about tolerance Carol. Gay people are tolerating you when they aren’t telling you to mind your own damn business.
EWE
@Carol: Make sure to call the next idiot on your phone bank who is covering the following shift. We’ll be here.
How Dare She?
I have a message from the site on my screen…like Lucas…I think I’m ‘fix’n’ to get the boot. I can’t help but wonder if I have been tagged as a jerk? For sure, this blog experience has given me something to chew on, and ponder over, what my belief system is.
EWE
@How Dare She?: No. These religious nuts do not respect the rights of others. They desecrate ones spirit and to attack the spirit of a homosexual person is equal to attacking your own teachings of the Holy Spirit. It also is unforgiveable to attack the spirit. No gay person ever attacked anyone on this thread for being heterosexual. You MORmONS are a disgrace to the true blessings and search for a god. On a lighter note, you people should stay in your churches and temples with your vile creed. It has no place for a wider more thoughtful people. It’s your own boots you have on your feet.
How Dare She?
@EWE: Ewe…if the system will allow me I’d like to comment on my “ignorance” for not realizing that I am not “oppressed.” I’m starting to think you are one tough cookie to crack!! Meaning, hells bells…woman!
I looked up the word “oppressed” as I’m pretty sure I know the meaning of the word and I feel I am indeed oppressed, but from a different vanish point. Webster shows: [to] dominate harshly and inflict stress on. Thesaurus: browbeaten, subjugated, broken, demoralized, exploited. Word perfect analogy. These words seem to be slinging from all directions, too.
“Broken” is my word. I don’t know what the date will reflect on my death certificate, but as far as I’m concerned, it may as well be the day my daughter passed. I don’t necessarily feel my “history” was that of oppression (prior to her passing)…even though it has certainly been painful and full of struggles. “Oppressed” for me, is very much aware of my broken future with no “hope” of fixing or changing it….bring her back.
Does “the movement” not have “hope” of a brighter future? I believe I will live to “see the day.” There has been progress made. I “remember when” on some gay issues. I feel like you keep slamming me with a big, Mac truck. Why is that? Because we don’t share the same struggles? Honestly, I can’t wait to hear from you! LOL
EWE
@How Dare She?:
God does not oppress. God presents itself as awareness. Not that i know what god is but neither does anyone else. I certainly don’t want to define it. How self serving that would be.
You seem to be expressing tremendous grief due to your indescribable loss. I have a strong feeling you may always have a sense of “longing”. I think it’s great you can share your emotions so openly and hope you find people to discuss this further with face to face. A sense of “brokenness” can evolve. Don’t give up. I highly doubt your daughter would ever want you forfeit inner fullfillment and/or happiness for a gnawing endless lifetime of grief. That would not honorably serve her memory at all. I am sorry that you feel so alone and i acknowledge hearing you express that.
I don’t think i am part of a “movement” as i get older and i never had a closet to come out of. I am who i am for as long as you are who you have been. My orientation has never ever once been an issue of contention for me personally. Truth be told, my conscious decision to lash back and spit in the faces of those who do it to me first IS my “struggle”. Society is awful to LGBTQ people. And it’s unwarranted as well. So i don’t know what the solutions are regarding “hope”. That’s not what i spend time dwelling on. Most of these religious people are not thinking at all and that is quite sad. I comment on here solely for the purpose of showing gay people who feel fragile that some of us will never let people talk to us with an uninformed mindset and a derogatory attacking tone of heart.
How Dare She?
@EWE: Oh Ewe -Thank you for your warm words. If I could give you a big hug…I would. I know your wisdom comes from your heart – that grief is lonely and hard work. The only thing that separates her grief from mine is that I have more memories. I have attended a few ‘mom’s support group’ meetings and I find I am somewhere between becoming the first lady (Barbara Bush) to wandering the streets with the homeless. A mother, who lost her son in the Iraq war, although she owns a home and has a family, is so grief stricken that she lives on the streets with the homeless for 3 months. It’s going to take time and your insight is correct about honoring our loved ones…by somehow continuing to live.
God. I agree. He is not about oppression. I grew up Lutheran but attend church on the 3 major holidays -Christmas, Thanksgiving and Easter and maybe a few Sunday’s in-between. I think we were labeled, out of the woodwork holiday church goers? For whatever reasons, my mom feels it is important that her children go to Sunday school (and get confirmed) and if she didn’t feel like dropping us off…she’d send us in a cab! Seriously, who does that to their children!?! My siblings and I still razz her for that. Today, it’s a good LOL!
My moms parents and siblings are devout church “goers” and “doers.” And, really are ‘good people.’ Kind and gentle. I never see, hear or learn hate in my basic ‘religious’ upbringing. When my daughter died I felt in my heart for a brief few seconds, that God loves me. Logically, I believe God loves ‘me’ (everyone) but that is the only time I can truly say, with great certainty, that I felt ‘the hand of God.’ Tip: We always allow the bereaved their ‘signs’ to feel better…even if it sounds crazy.
My comments on “remembering when” with gay issues. I attended college in the early 80’s and I befriend a girl who has just lost her brother to AIDS. It’s actually the first time I encounter knowing someone who openly talks about “being gay” and for sure, AIDS. My ‘new’ friend is absolutely crushed with her brothers passing. Her love for him was quite moving. She talks about him all the time and through her, I start to feel as though I have lost a good friend, too. I remember the stigma and fear that surround this family as there isn’t a lot of information available but hysteria. We kept in touch for many years and I wish I knew how to ‘find’ her.
I guess that whole point of that story is that I think today society has been educated and “Hollywood” has been instrumental, at least concerning AIDS hysteria. Taking this thread back to the suicide at hand, I would only hope that over the years that society will find that it’s OK to talk about suicide with education and prevention and maybe “Hollywood” would find this, too, a noble cause? I think the great fear is that if we talk about it…there will be more suicides and I don’t know if this is real or imagined?
FYI: I haven’t yet returned to work and that is another issue at hand. I’m pretty sure I feel that I am 20% oppressed in my corporate job of 10 years because I am a woman. I may spew over that in another post…if I don’t get booted off.
Thanks again Ewe for your post. Very encouraging and finally…I get a glimpse of a softer heart! You lifted my spirits.
EWE
@How Dare She?: I don’t have children and you speak very eloquently about things that i can only imagine. This is your area of expertise. This is the arena that you can be of tremendous support for others. And from what i have been told and experienced myself, it is true that by giving we receive.
God? I know a thing or two about religious headtrips. Some people laugh at that and others search with suspicion.
I am so happy to hear that you felt God “within” you if even for a brief moment.
AIDS was everywhere throughout my 20s and 30s in San Francisco. It defined me. I came out the other side physically unscathed and emotionally traumatized. I felt like the woman you speak of with the homeless. The only difference is that people are not telling that woman she is going to some dreamt up ugly place called hell. (How childish). Those types of messages create anger. Why anyone is surprised that gay people would then close down the Golden Gate Bridge with their bodies when that filthy Pope John Paul came to town should be of no surprise. That is just one of many examples. Today i look back on those memories with pride. It was the gay community that was expressing compassion and love. It was the gay community that hit the streets with candles in search of light. When i discovered that so many other people had not experienced AIDS the way i did, i had both gratitude and rage. But please do not make the mistake that so many people do…and that is that all gay people know of AIDS. That is not true and it is also most unfair and misguided to pair the two as synonymous. That is an ignorance that is still being fought to eradicate. I mean come on, being gay or straight is not something you do, it is what and who you are.
I see nothing controversial with suicide unless it is committed in crisis.
You are correct when you state being a woman is being a minority but please keep in mind that white women benefitted the most from affirmative action. One must ask why? My cynicism says that this occurred because white women are predominantly with white men hence; it’s fixed.
Thanks for the complement. Right back at ya. I would like to say that i feel my heart, soft or not, remains consistent.
Carol
@EWE:
Ewe, no need to have a psychotic break. I don’t happen to care that you don’t care what I think. I merely gave you an opportunity to introspect upon your apparent lack of emotional intelligence — that portion of the intellect that deals with emotional savvy — a recognotion of which would give you the chance to improve your life in this area. But go ahead and keep being an adolescent if that is working for you. Somehow I doubt it….
Carol
Talylor,
You also failed to understand my point on emotional intelligence. The teeny area of emotional intelliegence I was referring to was the ability to understand and correctly apply a broad range of words that relate to emotional experience — instead of referring to vastly different emotional experiences with the same few adjectives.
Namely, I think it shows poor emotional awareness when someone routinely applies the word “hate” to things that are not actually motivated by hate — even if that someone feels upset and angry. Precision would go a long way towards furthering understanding between those who disagree, whereas insisting the other hates them only results in the other saying that no they don’t.
This whole episode with Roseanne Barr is illustrative. On what planet does anyone think it will be considered praiseworthy to attack a grieving mother whose son just took his own life…? This was practically autistic in its emotional obtuseness, not to even mention that her baseless assumptions on the boy’s gayness ended up being entirely wrong. Barr certainly regrets it after the fact, but it was poor functioning in this area that allowed her to say these things in the first place. And those who lauded Barr for being inhumane merely harmed their own cause….
EWE
@Carol: Carol, Jump in the box that you live in. I would also be more than happy to purchase you a coffin so we can shut the lid, put yourself out of your misery and call it a day. No one give a fuck what you think either Koont.
jarvisbearcub
Doesn’t Marie Osmond have a lesbian daughter that she fully accepts as gay? Doesn’t this cast a cloud over things somewhat?
Roseanne Barr has said so many stupid things in her career that I’m surprised she is still paid any attention. Yes, her sitcom was one of the best ever. And yes she is outspokenly an ally, but she has made other comments with no knowledge to back them up, her current stand up acts so blatantly rips off Lisa Lampanelli it’s hard to keep track (I’ve heard her at least once tell the exact same joke as Lisa, even), and the only reason her opinion is considered relevant is because Bill Maher puts her on because she saved his career in the early 90s.
EWE
@jarvisbearcub: Marie Osmond does not accept homosexuality. And no one needs Marie Osmond to accept anything at all. She can remain ignorant if she so chooses. People don’t really care if she stays an ignorant idiot. What is it that people do not understand? No one is looking for the approval of MORmONS and just because one accepts their own child is no great feat. That is expected. It takes a sense of awareness to not put down people by denying them the rights you take for yourself. That is like taking a dump in someones house and not flushing, then telling them to piss off as you sit down at their table and eat their food. Religious right wing nuts are stupid people. They prefer to be like Carol and have someone else tell them what to think.
How Dare She?
@EWE:
Well, crap. I actually may have another bulls-eye on my forehead for being a white woman and I don’t even know it? (Affirmative Action). Somebody…please…pour up some tequila and invite me over!!
I see we had another explosive evening on this thread last night. Double crap.
EWE
@How Dare She?: LMAO. Please whatever you do, don’t go over to Carols. I think she only has this one certain book (we won’t mention) that she isn’t going to be putting down.
Erica
@EWE:
Wow Ewe! Way to go and prove exactly what your arch-nemesis Carol was saying! I’d think under the circumstances you’d want to carefully exercise some of the self-restraint that is “supposed” to come with maturity, but instead you let loose with a full range of obscenities and any other insult that happened to enter your mind.
Having a love-fest with your alter ego does not prove your civility. Anyone can act civilly towards those they agree with. The maturity question is about whether you can act civilized around those you don’t agree with.
BTW, you have no knowledge as to what Marie Osmond accepts or does not accept. Nada. Zip. Zero. Maybe if you get a handle on the cognitive distortions that permeate your thinking you’ll be less of an emotional basket-case.
Erica
@jarvisbearcub:
I agree. Her sitcom used to be really funny.
EWE
@Erica: Untrue. The barrage of insults started with the religious wingnuts who openly put down gay people. I just return the favor. I am well aware i am not being civil It’s on purpose in case you cannot figure that out. You are incorrect about the question on maturity as well. The question is why do religious people think they can denigrate gay people and then turn it around and make themselves the victim. And afterward throw more insults and say it is in response to being attacked. I know Marie Osmond is a MORmON and the MORmON leadership ACTIVELY funds hate against homosexuals. Anyone in any religion that remains silent is my enemy. You get no pass, there is no forgiveness and you can fuck off as well. You can stop with the cognitive analysis and the attacks at my intelligence. It is not true. I find you to be laughable. I also can tell that you are ignorant and want to keep defending hate speech against homosexuals. It is not gonna happen. Too bad. TOUGH. Go elsewhere. You obviously only ever deal with fragile gay people who do not accept themselves or you happen to be one. You are just another bitch.
EWE
@Erica: And her sitcom was a sad and pathetic portrayal of a lower middle class American family. It is the state of many in this country who are indoctrinated by a sinister elite whose only message is to keep holding onto a dream of something better.
EWE
@Erica: And one more thing you uglyhearted displaced witch. Losing thousands of people from a wretched disease and honoring their lives is not a psychotic episode. That is what you are supporting with your blind defense of Carol (not Cawol Channing silly) just carol. Perhaps if you idiots could grasp your disgraceful disregard for gay people who die, little Miss Marie Osmond could be afforded the same courtesy. Until then, let the games continue.
see-AH tuh-BEE-ry
I agree that Roseanne was right to have spoken out against churches which preach intolerance towards persons of the non-heteronormative lives and I believe that it was her right to do so on her blog, but I do not believe that she should have been so shocked at the backlash or even the overall attacks coming back at her. This is the woman who criticized Angelina Jolie and Brad Pitt for not supporting Obama during the 2008 election because they have adopted non-white children and, obviously, the only way they could support these children politically was to base their choice of political support solely upon race. (Of course, this is a simplification of the situation but seldom will we hear the full story.)
While she was not specifically pointing most of these remarks at Marie Osmond, she did say that Michael Blosil was gay in her initial statement (an idea which has not yet been resolved to my own satisfaction) and blamed the church and the Osmond support of their own church for his suicide. There are many other points which probably led to this suicide and there are plenty of small nitpicky things, but I do believe that it is wrong to blame this suicide on any one thing–as most suicides have at least two or three major causes.
I know I’m going to be bashed for this at some point, even though I’m going to point out that I am not Mormon myself nor have I ever been Mormon.
I did, however, grow up Catholic –another group which is popularly considered one of the most hateful towards homosexuals, bisexuals, and transgendered persons– and it might be because of my less rigidly religious upbringing, but it seems to me that it is more important what a family says and does to influence a child than what a specific church or preacher says. If Marie Osmond was supportive of her children and her family showed love towards these children more than anything else, she should not be considered “the one at fault,” nor should her attachment to the religion. A parent or a guide can show children to embrace the openness more than the restrictions in a religion, as my parents have, and it is only natural that Marie would turn to a spiritual counselor after such a horrible thing occurred. And most of the Mormons I’ve known are incredibly accepting and loving above all else, which I’m not saying the Osmonds are as much as I am saying I would like to imagine they are all that kind.
While this is fading into obscurity, I feel that Roseanne did this more for venting and publicity–two things which are not exactly the most honorable reasons to blog and rant. I just hope this does more to help communities than to hurt them.
JustMe123
@Tackle:
Yes, why would anyone want this ranting lunatic as their spokesperson? She is mentally unsound. Once she allows people back on her forums – she’s in the process of “cleaning them up” right now – people should get an account and see what this woman really is like. She is delusional and hateful. But, I guess the ends justify the means, I mean, what would you all be saying if she were so loud mouthed, ill-informed and hateful AND hated the GLBT community. Like I say, after she has cleaned up her forum of her calling people things like whore because of their christian beliefs, join up, she can’t stay “normal” for too long, the horrifying things she says to people will continue and then maybe some of you people will understand that she is not some knight in shining armor, some “ahead of her time” prophetess (which she really believe that she is, magical powers and all). She is a mentally unbalanced hateful person, nothing more.
ewe
@JustMe123: The truth hurts. Too bad. Get over it.
JustMe123
@EWE
What truth? Define any truth that Roseanne has come up with regarding this particular episode and all of her other nonsensical, lunatic rants. Please, show all of us some proof. Just because you like her and you’re gay, doesn’t make her right. Like I said, if she were anti-gay and spouting off all the hat she does, you’d be crying a different tune – the ends, for ETHICAL people, do not justify the means. So, you are right, the truth hurts, Roseanne is a hateful bitch, get over it.
ewe
You don’t have any idea of who and what i am. That explains everything right there. You are the judgemental hate filled ignorant person. Roseanne confronts people like you who protect an evil entity, in this case a homophobic religion. Go burn in your made up hell. You have no idea what the hell you are talking about. The mirror baby, the mirror. You are an ugly hearted bitch after all. God is not on your side.
Mary Mattingly
Gay Folks Wake Up…..It’s not about YOUUUUUUU!!!!
This is about the death of someone’s child.