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Salvation Army Media Director: Gays Should Be Put To Death

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By:           Dan Avery
On:           Jun 25, 2012
Tagged: , , , , ,
  • 44 Comments
    • R.A.
      R.A.

      The clearest way to apologize would be to demote Major Craibe.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 6:12 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Belize
      Belize

      LOL. I love how these religious nutjobs always end up making God look so petty and childish. I wouldn’t be surprised if even God is laughing at their blind allegiance to a self-effacing, demoralizing, hypocritical and ignorant collection of words from a bunch of cowardly and stupid men.

      I hate to sound so self-aggrandizing but I would actually like to thank God for not making me THAT moronic.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 6:26 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Belize
      Belize

      Also, if I may add, the statement of this man is kind of like saying “we are the ones created in God’s image because he’s just as dumb as we are.” Bravo. Way to stick up for your “beliefs” Craibe.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 6:28 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Ruhlmann
      Ruhlmann

      I remember back in 1975-76 going into SA looking for cool and funky stuff you would find nowhere else. For years people just would not go into a thrift store because it implied you were poor. It would in fact be where poor people shopped but also the LGBT community. Whithin ten years it became fashionable to go into SA. We did that, we put those fu**ers on the map.

      I don’t go there anymore for their position on our issues and for other reasons. There is a mens shelter close to where I live and in the dead of winter they will turn a person away if they are drunk. There was a huge thrift shop across the street from the shelter that had a roof that leaked for years. They would put pots and pans all over the floor to catch the rain. When the staff unionized and became the only SA to have a union they closed it down citing the leaky roof, then they fixed the roof and sold the building. They were the loudest voice against Marriage Equality in Canada.

      Donate to and shop at Goodwill or St. Vincent de Paul or any of the newer social assistance focused organizations if you do the thrift thing. Don’t support these clowns who haven’t changed from the old time religion of the twenties and thirties. This is not a good organization for many reasons.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 7:03 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Tommy
      Tommy

      Notice they use that part of the first chapter but they don’t read the next one. Also Romans 18-32 has to do with being a temple prostitute not being gay or lesbian. If your going to quote the bible read that damn thing.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 7:06 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • gppm1103
      gppm1103

      Another reason to just boycott them. As long as people believe in these fairy tales called the bible, this BS will not go away.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 7:39 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Danny
      Danny

      Major hypocrites the SA. The bible says a lot of things, like working on Sunday is punishable by death – when’s the last time you saw the Salvation Army attack the real military for working on Sundays?! Hypocrites.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 7:49 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Andrew Shontz
      Andrew Shontz

      They also say in the Bible if you plant two different plants in the same field, you will be stoned to death, also if you get cheat on your wife/husband, you will be stoned to death, i haven’t seen any stoning in Australia or the US, they better get started, and if this Andrew Craibe, is not a closet case, I’m not gay.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 8:23 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jaroslaw
      Jaroslaw

      Ruhlman – your points are well taken and I don’t doubt they were union busting etc. But turning away a drunks at the shelter? I don’t know – drunks can be very violent and hard to deal with.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 8:44 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • MisterTwister
      MisterTwister

      I’m Shocked. Well not really, I’ve seen many stories like this on this site where people like him have called for the death of homosexuals. Their culture is very homophobic.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 9:01 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Andrew Shontz
      Andrew Shontz

      Do they really think God, wants them to hide behind him, with their hate?

      Jun 25, 2012 at 9:19 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Stuart
      Stuart

      I struggle with this as i see the good they do in the world, including the good they do for queers, but its hard to accept help from someone that wants you dead

      Jun 25, 2012 at 10:14 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Joe
      Joe

      Salvation Army bell ringers should be put to death.
      People asking for donations should be put to death.
      People that need the Salvation Army should just be left to die.
      It’s a dog eat dog world out there.
      Survival of the fittest.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 10:44 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • foulmouthgandhi
      foulmouthgandhi

      First, god is a man made concept anything borne from it including the exclusionary message & hatred spewed by followers is nonsense and not at all based in reality. It is about as valid as backing up your argument with morality gleaned from Mother Goose.

      I long for the day that the voices in the social and political narrative of those who use superstition & supernatural forces as the basis for their arguments, that have no connection to objective reality, become as audible as the buzzing of a flea… it is about as relevant.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 11:22 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Tommy
      Tommy

      Government is a man made concept, so is philosophy, and rhetoric. People will flock to whatever supports their opinion. Take away religion and they will turn to other sources to promote their ideals. The USSR was known for anti-gay persecution China also these are states in which religion has no say in politics because those governments view all religion as a parasite.

      Instead of blaming religion we should see all bigotry as equal no matter the source. Watch it, counter it, and chase it down no matter what little filthy hidey hole it decides to crawl into.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 11:32 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Cam
      Cam

      It is a bigoted organization.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 11:33 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Roxorz
      Roxorz

      Any “straight” man who comments on gay not being natural must be fighting off their homosexual tendencies I swear. Otherwise why speak on something you can’t feel? O well there’s still the good will store?

      Jun 25, 2012 at 11:36 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Some Random Guy
      Some Random Guy

      Funny – when I see “SA” in print, I think immediately of the Nazi group, the “Brown Shirts” (Sturmabteilung, whose leader, Ernst Rohm, was gay), the street thugs who helped Hitler gain power, but who after they outlived their usefulness to him, Hitler exterminated in the “Night of the Long Knives” (June 1934).

      But Wikipedia reminds me that SA can also refer to Something Awful, a comedy website. Or Sexaholics Anonymous, a 12-step group. Ha ha ha.

      Agree about Goodwill thrift stores. Avoid “Salivation” Army – Goodwill rocks!

      Jun 25, 2012 at 12:45 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Clockwork
      Clockwork

      The radio host gave him plenty of ways to climb out of the quicksand.

      Terrible for a media director. Yes, he does need to be demoted or at the very least reassigned to where no one can hear his words.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 12:48 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Baba Booey
      Baba Booey

      The Purple Heart is who you should donate to.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 12:51 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Dave
      Dave

      Was a store manager at Goodwill in NYC, Goodwill’s mission is to help people find jobs and train those that can’t. It also has an excellent record of using its finances for this and not wasting Anything, everything gets recycled. If you want a place to donate this in my opinion is the place. They do not discriminate against any group.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 1:19 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Nicholas Gile-Petefish
      Nicholas Gile-Petefish

      I am at heart a Salvationist. I DO NOT believe as this Major Craibe believes and I agree with the first comment from R.A., that the best way for The Salvation Army to apologize would be to demote Major Craibe. Unfortunately, that is probably not what will happen. They will probably remove him from his current position and move him somewhere far away to get him out of the lime light. It is rather unfortunate, but that is what they do. I would personally like to apologize as I have many friends who are Salvation Army officers and would never wish harm of any sort on any person regardless of their own personal beliefs or lifestyle. As far as the scripture quoted and printed, I believe that to be Old Testament and believe my God to be a loving God and welcoming into Him.

      Shame on you Major Craibe to quote a belief on my behalf as a Salvationist! You should seriously consider submitting your resignation and sincerely apologizing to the communities you have offended.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 4:39 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jay
      Jay

      I don’t believe in the militarization of religion, or the religion-ization of the military, for that matter. The SA never gets a penny of mine, although unfortunately we have to subsidize the haters with our tax dollars while they are free to discriminate against us who help pay their salaries. I donate to animal shelter thrift stores and real civil rights organizations.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 5:20 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Silverngold
      Silverngold

      I think this year around Christmas when those SA volunteers stand in the cold ringing their bells, that I’ll pass by, or drop a note in the bucket that my donation for the season has gone to more queer friendly organizations.

      Jun 25, 2012 at 7:04 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Ruhlmann
      Ruhlmann

      @Jaroslaw: A homeless shelter is the last resort for many people who at times might need protection from themselves. That’s the social in social assistance.
      Yes drunks can be a pain in the ass and potentialy dangerous but that just goes with the territory and they do have security. They are not admitted because of a “moral” stance on alcohol.
      There are churches in this town that have what they call “out of the cold” programme that let people sleep in the basements and provide sleeping bags and a meal but from point A to B anything can happen to someone blind drunk. They can’t even be bothered to detain drunks until the detox wagon gets there.
      They dishonour the Christ in their smug judgemental Christianity.
      Oh yea…and their prices SUCK!

      Jun 25, 2012 at 8:27 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Billysees
      Billysees

      I always found it kind of humorous from Romans 1:30 that — those who disobey their parents are “worthy of death”.

      Actually, that verse should read “children who disobey their parents….” because who else would disobey their parents “but” children.

      And then the cynicism and contempt of that whole chapter becomes evident.

      There is little evidence that “the wrath of God is revealed from heaven….” against anyone unless you’re breaking the law or something like that.

      Paul is responsible for giving us some significant spiritual truths that help make Christianity what it is.

      He has also given us some of his own personal spin that comes from a cultural mindset that we don’t have.

      Could we imagine folks being stoned to death (which I assume would be Paul’s method of death from Rom. 1:30) in our day which I guess was commonplace during his time?

      That can’t happen in Christendom. And thank Jesus for that major change in the culture of His day.

      We’re so much better off if we “think and consider” about the things that are written down instead of quoting raw scripture which benefits few.

      Jesus said, “Thy kingdom come, thy will be done, on earth as it is in heaven”. This is what is really happening down here. And it’s a wonderful work too.

      And we shouldn’t forget that scripture doesn’t tell or dictate to the Holy Spirit what it should or should not do.

      Paul wrote, “the Kingdom of God is NOT in word (scripture) but power (the work of the Holy spirit)……..it’s not food and drink……….but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit.

      This is the essence of “thy Kingdom come, thy will be done…..”

      Jun 26, 2012 at 6:24 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Ethan
      Ethan

      So basically he’s saying…You think you should all die, but sure we’ll take your money!

      Jun 26, 2012 at 10:20 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Ethan
      Ethan

      @Ethan: *we

      Jun 26, 2012 at 10:20 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Mango
      Mango

      @Nicholas Gile-Petefish: Old Testament? Romans is the first Pauline epistle that appears in the New Testament as it’s published – I can’t remember where it fits chronologically, but I’m pretty sure that Paul, as being not one of the original 12, wrote later than most of the other contributing authors.

      What’s the basis for the claims that this passage, or any other passage in the big book of fables, is figurative rather than literal? I’ve never heard of any sort of editorial written by the original authors where they explain which bits should be taken seriously and which bits should be ignored, and it seems to me that anything else is guesswork.

      Jun 27, 2012 at 10:04 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Joe Tatman
      Joe Tatman

      That’s a christian for ya. SO loving and caring. The bible says to stone your children too…so….and says blacks are lesser people than whites…the bible is about the biggest joke ever. I suppose he think a man was swallowed by a whale and a man collected animals by pairs and loaded them on a boat…and water turned to wine. Whatever.

      Jun 27, 2012 at 1:27 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Billysees
      Billysees

      @Joe Tatman: No 30

      But it has many interesting stories and comments.

      And they can make many feel good and comforted.

      Here’s one of my favorites — “I’ll never leave you or forsake you.”

      If one might ever feel lonely or alone, that kind of statement could “perk” somebody up.

      The Book is basically inspiration.

      By why is there such harsh stuff in it also?

      I think because there are many folks in this world that are “naturally” mean spirited and mean spirited comments appeal to mean spirited people.

      It’s a way for the Book to attract as many people as possible.

      The Book is an attractant.

      Jun 28, 2012 at 2:48 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Ruhlmann
      Ruhlmann

      @Billysees: The bible attracts the fearful and the desperate who combine to resent, judge and condemn those who are neither.

      Jun 28, 2012 at 5:06 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Billysees
      Billysees

      @Ruhlmann: No 32

      Being fearful and desperate is a serious matter to those that find themselves in either of those conditions. I guess that any number of life’s experiences could get some people in a bad “state of affairs”.

      I often wonder why some people have very unpleasant experiences and some do not.

      The Book has some comforting comments to those that wind up in a bad way.

      And then there are those that seem to be “self sufficient” and don’t appear to need “inspirational advice” at any time.

      Good for them. Perhaps their money gets them off the hook when something bad happens.

      As for me, I’m familiar with certain amounts of suffering and my financial state cannot help me through those difficulties. That’s when I need some comforting words from the Book.

      I think it’s unfortunate that those that go to or cling to the Book can become resentful, judgmental and condemnatory, as you say, towards others that appear to be well off.

      That’s immaturity or ignorance on their part and shouldn’t reflect on the benefits that the Book can provide.

      Jun 29, 2012 at 1:28 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Billysees
      Billysees

      @Ruhlmann: No 32

      I couldn’t leave this article and your comment without expressing myself concerning another article here at Queerty.

      So I copy and paste it here, for your interest, as it is a typical illustration of your criticism of the kinds of people the Book attracts.

      ———————————————————————–

      An excellent example why some Christian fundamentalism is a kind of “psychosis”.

      http://www.thefreedictionary.com/psychosis

      He said, “come unto me all who labor and are burdened with something, and I will give you rest.

      But these folks do otherwise —

      http://www.queerty.com/awesome-mom-20120627/

      What a shame…..

      —————————————-

      And while I’m at it, let me copy and paste another “great” comment from another article here at Queerty —

      Author: Karen
      Comment:
      Fundamentalists are very big on the return of Christ. Well, Fundies, get ready – Jesus is coming, and boy is he pissed.
      —————————————-
      That is really a neat way of saying something quite truthful……lol……lol.

      Jun 29, 2012 at 1:54 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Ruhlmann
      Ruhlmann

      @Billysees: The henchmen of ignorance and barbarism always carried a sword in one hand and a bible in the other Billysee. The marginal comfort this superstitious document affords its adherents will never balance the pain, death and misery it has wreaked upon our species for two thousand years.
      This clown who believes the bible calls for our death is not uncommon to Christianity even today. They are fearful and anxious because they can’t reconcile their view of what the world should be against what it is. They want to burn at the stake a Giordano Bruno, destroy the lifes work of a Denis Diderot and vilify a Charles Darwin because these great minds who enoble our species challenge what is increasingly and obviously the hopes, dreams and fears of ancient savages.

      Jun 29, 2012 at 4:23 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • toren123
      toren123

      As The Christmas approaches, you will no doubt have your bell-ringers out panhandling for money. In years past I have responded, but NEVER again!

      Jun 29, 2012 at 11:40 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Queer Supremacist
      Queer Supremacist

      Breeders doing what breeders do best: advocate genocide against innocent people. Surprise, surprise.

      It occurred to me that the first two commandments are “I am the Lord Thy God” and “Thou shalt have no gods before me.” I assume that precludes any alleged illegitimate children from being considered God.

      Jul 1, 2012 at 4:11 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • EvonCook
      EvonCook

      Whatever the spin doctor apologist wants to say to make this sound acceptable, ALL GAY PEOPLE AND LESBIANS AND ANY ONE WHO VALUES FREEDOM AND LIFE, should not only boycott this horrendous organization, but they should renounce faith in any of the three hateful, hypocritical monotheistic religions who actually preach such disgusting, anti human and sick bigotry. I would like to go so far as to say we should fight them bodily, burn down and destroy their places of worship just as they have done throughout their histories to any who disagreed or competed with them. But because their reign of terror and hatred has been so long, so pathetically successful and so symbolized by the co-opting of the arts (including the work of many gay artists) we should just seek to take their palaces of worship and convert them into public buildings, ideally concert halls, public baths for orgies and maybe even houses of prostitution –all of which would be more noble than their current self-righteous blasphemy against humanity.

      Jul 3, 2012 at 6:07 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Billysees
      Billysees

      @Ruhlmann: No 35

      Sorry I’m late to respond but I have been without “juice” (power) for 85 hours and 15 minutes and it is longer than I’ve ever experienced here and I’ve lived in this same house for 67 years…..lol….lol.

      Your right about the fact that Christianity has brought pain and suffering upon many over the years.
      Christianity has a POOR track record doesn’t it?
      Why just look at the comment from the guy this article is about.
      That’s proof enough that “something’s wrong” with supposed-Christians and their mindset.

      But……our concern and interest should lie in the future and not so much in the present and definitely not the past.

      The New Testament says to “FORGET THE THINGS THAT ARE BEHIND”.

      And so….like I wrote about earlier in this article….we need to think about the future and the “better days” that are ahead of us.

      Don’t forget……Jesus spoke very “futuristically” from the Great Prayer when he said, “Thy kingdom come, thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven”.

      Let’s give that a chance to work before we throw up our hands and give up.

      Jul 4, 2012 at 2:48 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • jack
      jack

      Do you think Major Andrew ever served in the U S Military? I doubt it. Whimps like him hide behind religion to avoid military service. Does he also think that adulterers like Newt Gingrich should be put to death as that vile book, the bible commands? How about children who curse their parents, or people who work on the sabbath or those who worship gods other than yahweh etc? The bible is a vile book that people use as a weapon against their enemies and ignore it when it applies to them or their friends. Trash the whole thing. It is evil.

      Jul 5, 2012 at 1:37 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Billysees
      Billysees

      @jack: No 40

      Jack

      I would say precisely the same things you’ve said, except for just one thing.

      That “one” thing is Jesus the carpenter.
      He is “NOT” represented in the things you spoke of because those attitudes come from old scriptures.

      The real Jesus is best represented by the “newness of the Spirit” which is represented by the new scriptures. You know….the Old Testament versus the New Testament.

      But even with this New Testament, his message is often drowned out by writers from cultures and traditions that make it hard for Him to shine through their inspiration. And in today’s world, His message is tempered by angry and quarrelsome fundamentalists. It’s all a shame.

      Can I interest you in something that may clarify some of these things?

      I went to a good news source a while back and there is this blog where the moderator asked a simple question. He said, “what should we write about next?” That got me all stirred up about some things I learned nearly 40 years ago.

      And so I began to express some of these things and this blog was kind enough to allow me to continue until at some point in time they closed any further comments.

      The site is — http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jaweed-kaleem/faith-shift-what-religion-stories_b_1412331.html

      Start at April 24, 2012 and that’ll be me writing about some very important things. The photo in the logo is my cat Scooty……lol.

      I hope you enjoy my comments and are perhaps persuaded that there “is a better way” to understand this man called Jesus.

      And Bruce Barton does a fantastic job of making this happen.

      Cheers,
      Billw

      Jul 5, 2012 at 11:31 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Ruhlmann
      Ruhlmann

      @Billysees: “Let’s give that a chance to work before we throw up our hands and give up” Are you a pastor? I know you mean well. I lean to the tenets of Lord Guatama Billysees. Dharmic philosophies are in keeping with my nature. It affords me great solace in dark times, of which I have many.

      Jul 6, 2012 at 7:07 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Billysees
      Billysees

      @Ruhlmann: No 42

      No, I’m not a pastor.

      Just a “rank and file guy”….lol.

      I searched out Lord Guatama — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddism
      And Dharmic philosophies — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dharma

      I browsed through both and found them interesting, but having much detail and therefore worthy of study for a better understanding.

      I go to Wikipedia for everything and trust the material presented.

      Your personal testimony says it all.
      If you’re comforted by the things that you describe here, how can anything challenge the comfort and help you receive? Only the person can say what is “a help” for them.

      I believe in the work of the Christian “Holy Spirit” because that is all that I’m familiar with, since I can remember, and I can’t possibly suggest it to those who are “comforted already”. Actually, that Holy Spirit may be the very thing that’s comforting you. Who knows?

      I too am familiar with some dark times also, in the way of very painful depression that lasted several years. It was brought about, as I understand it, by Satan, or whoever the enemy was, and their effort of trying to blow me down. Only by much prayer and many of Jesus’ words and also some of Bruce Barton’s comments was I able to withstand this unbelievable assault on my being. The Bible is kinda heavy into the concept and existence of “enemies” and most folks can’t relate here. But I can.

      I always liked the comment Jesus made when he said, “don’t rejoice that you have power over the enemy but rather rejoice that your name is written in the book of life”….lol. I kinda laugh a bit here (it was NOT funny at the time) cause I feel so successful in overcoming those devils that harassed me so much. But….the success was NOT my doing but rather was the result of the “Holy Spirit” that helped me. Thank God for that. I always took great comfort in that simple little comment of His. Also, I think that was a simple way of saying — you’ll be OK cause “I’ll never leave you or forsake you”, He said.

      The depression is mostly gone but the memory of “it all” will always be with me.

      Now that I’ve described briefly how I was comforted, let me provide some words that may comfort you, from the Book.

      I think it’s in proverbs where the comment is made that, “man’s ways are of the Lord, how can we understand our own ways?” That is kind of a profound thing to say and it encompasses a huge landscape of course.

      And I’m pretty sure from what you say you believe that that landscape includes you.

      Jul 7, 2012 at 6:26 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • SSheehan
      SSheehan

      I was recently a member of a panel on Huffington Post Live. The discussion was regarding the SA’s stance on the LGBTQ Community. I had submitted a comment regarding the denial my former partner received, based on her sexuality, when she applied to one of their recovery camps.

      I received an inquiry from a representative of the SA yesterday. Here is my reply to her inquiry.

      “Dear Jennifer,

      Thank you for your email. I truly do appreciate it. As a member of and advocate for the LGBTQ Community, I am very concerned regarding your biased and prejudiced stance towards our Community.

      My former partner related to me that she had applied to participate in what your representative called a ‘boot camp’ for recovery. She was deep in her addiction, and was desperately seeking help. The location of the ‘boot camp’ was only given as somewhere in Central California. She was told that it would be in a ‘women’s only’ camp, and that the program would last anywhere from six to twelve months, depending upon the severity of the addiction.

      During the interview, my former partner disclosed that she is a Lesbian. That is when she was told that she would not be allowed to participate. It was not suggested that she become celibate in order to qualify for the program. Of course, your representative probably suspected my former partners sexuality, since she is quite obviously what one would stereotype as a ‘dyke’.

      The Salvation Army office is located in Vacaville, California, and the incident occurred around April of 2010. I do not know the name of the representative, and chances are that person is no longer with the office located there.

      I have been separated from my partner for some time now. I have no way of contacting her, and the last I heard, she was homeless and still experiencing the trauma associated with her particular addiction.

      Below is a link to a page that supports your recovery program. However, there is a stern admonition to anyone in the Gay Community NOT to apply to the program because they will be ultimately and absolutely denied. There is more discussion regarding your stance to be found on the Internet.
      Free drug rehab at the Salvation Army
      Again, thank you for your time.

      Best Regards,

      Susan Isabella Sheehan”

      Dec 20, 2012 at 11:45 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·

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