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Take Obama’s Word On It: Bradley Manning Is Totally Fine

“I have asked the Pentagon whether or not the the procedures that have been taken in terms of his condition are appropriate and are meeting our basic standards,” President Obama told reporters yesterday about accusations that Bradley Manning is being tortured and refused even underwear at night. “They assure me that they are.” Oh good, because the Pentagon never makes shit up when it comes to the detainment and punishment of people it deems to be the enemy. And we should completely ignore what PJ Crowley, the assistant secretary of state for public affairs (i.e. Hillary Clinton‘s flack), said at a MIT seminar in what he may have thought was off the record: that Manning’s treatment is “ridiculous and counterproductive and stupid on the part of the department of defense.”

By:           JD
On:           Mar 12, 2011
Tagged: , , , , , ,
  • 50 Comments
    • Paul A.
      Paul A.

      Well, solitary confinement is torture. Obama states torture is appropriate.

      Mar 12, 2011 at 4:16 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Sam
      Sam

      Yes, we should believe Oball-less when he tells us something–look at all of the broken promises he made when campaigning.

      Mar 12, 2011 at 8:33 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Roman
      Roman

      That poor young man.

      Mar 12, 2011 at 9:40 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • AmericanPatriot
      AmericanPatriot

      Hey, if Brocko Bomba says it’s true, it must be, right? After all, he’s the same pres who closed Gitmo, right? Right?? Oh wait a minute . . .

      Mar 12, 2011 at 10:02 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Raza
      Raza

      Geez, I understand why people are interested in Bradley Manning, but I don’t get the concern. The guy is a TRAITOR!!!!

      And for those of you who say,” Well, he did it out of frustration at the conditions, the homophobic nature of DADT,” I agree that those are horrible working conditions, but there’s no excuse for his act of backstabbing treachery. There isn’t. One of my best friends is in the Air-Force, and his boyfriend was always concerned about him, and they couldn’t always communicate, etc. So he got his boyfriend to join! That way, at least, they felt they were in it together- on the same fight. ( obviously not literally)

      So while there should be concern that he is not undergoing excruciating torture and inhumane living conditions, the guy had a lot of choices- he wasn’t forced to do what he did… And frankly, someone who says his act was in defiance to DADT, and it’s not his fault, IS an enemy of gay rights. Because we stand for community inclusion and diversity and LOYALTY and the chance to say ” I’m every bit as proud and protective country as you are.” the chance to stand on our own two feet and determine our future without anybody harming us- thats what equality is about.

      So – why get all worried about Brad Manning?

      Mar 12, 2011 at 10:19 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Lefty
      Lefty

      @AmericanPatriot: Is “patriot” a euphemism for right-wing, by any chance?

      Mar 12, 2011 at 10:33 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • OrchidIslander
      OrchidIslander

      @Lefty: “Is “patriot” a euphemism for right-wing, by any chance?”

      You got it. Think GOProud Lite.

      Mar 12, 2011 at 10:40 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Steve
      Steve

      We have laws that are supposed to apply to things like this. And, we have little things called “rights”, including the right to trial. Taking a US Citizen to Guantanamo, torturing him for many months, and then throwing away the key to his cell, is a clear human rights violation.

      The officers that order such treatment, or even know about it and fail to stop it, are committing crimes. I am sure this announcement is for one purpose — so that President Obama can plausibly say that he didn’t know about it.

      If Manning committed a crime, the government should be able to prove it in court. That court can be a Court Martial, but it must be convened. Until a court reaches a vertict, he has a “right” to be presumed innocent.

      Mar 12, 2011 at 10:43 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Riker
      Riker

      @Raza: The thing is, we don’t even know that he actually did it. The available evidence is flimsy. Because of security flaws in SIPRnet, there is likely to be no physical evidence. I’m assuming the CDs he allegedly used were destroyed or are kept in a secure location outside the US, so no luck there. All that we have is the word of Adrian Lamos, a notorious computer cracker convicted of breaking into secure networks owned by The New York Times, Microsoft, Yahoo and MCI Worldcom. Consider his words with a grain of salt.

      This is exactly why we have trials *before* punishing someone for their crimes: we need to first establish that they actually did it.

      Mar 12, 2011 at 11:17 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Brian Miller
      Brian Miller

      @Raza: The guy is a TRAITOR!!!!

      For publishing information that had already been published and threatened nobody?

      Please.

      You useful idiots will be the death of all of us.

      Mar 12, 2011 at 11:29 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Cam
      Cam

      He is being held for possible violation of the laws of the United States….

      If they are going to hold him because of those laws, then they should abide by the laws that define how prisoners are treated. You can’t claim to be defending our laws while you are violating them.

      Mar 12, 2011 at 11:50 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • LookingAround
      LookingAround

      ( Incidentally : Far Right = Hitler ; Far-Left = Stalin ; both = mass murder, so no one should be smug about proclaiming himself either )

      Mar 12, 2011 at 12:26 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Lefty
      Lefty

      @LookingAround: You’ll have to point out where anyone smugly proclaimed themselves far-right or far-left, dear. Unless you’ve got confused and posted in the wrong section?

      Mar 12, 2011 at 12:34 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • LookingAround
      LookingAround

      Uhhh….”dear” ( ? ), it was just a reminder for those who do proclaim, whether they’d done so yet under this post or not.

      Mar 12, 2011 at 12:41 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Lefty
      Lefty

      @LookingAround: Oh. OK.

      Back to Bradley Manning…

      Obama says the Pentagon assures him the conditions Manning is being held under are strictly for his own safety, but this is clearly contradicted in the Brig’s observation records where it is shown that between August 3rd 2010 and January 28th 2011 the Brig Psychiatrist recommended on 17 seperate occasions that he be removed from POI (Prevention of Injury) status and this was ignored every time.

      This is the same Obama, incidentally , that once said “Government whistleblowers are part of a healthy democracy and must be protected from reprisal.”

      Mar 12, 2011 at 12:55 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Daez
      Daez

      @Riker: Yes, because the fact that he confessed and attempted to make the media circuit before being locked up is absolutely no reason to believe he actually did it.

      @Lefty: However, this wasn’t a case of government whistle blowing. This was an outright attack on America and its allies in a war time environment. They should have just shot him on sight. He should consider himself lucky he is still alive under any conditions.

      Lets be honest, if he wasn’t gay, none of you would even give a damn about him. Its way past the time that we stop giving everyone a pass just because they are gay. There could be a gay mass murderer and everyone would be here defending him (especially if he only killed straight people).

      Mar 12, 2011 at 5:39 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Oprah
      Oprah

      Who cares! He was a useless gay person anyway. Look at his face, retarded and useless. lol

      Mar 12, 2011 at 6:14 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Lefty
      Lefty

      Bradley Manning Support Network: http://www.bradleymanning.org/

      [img]http://i56.tinypic.com/6t38s6.jpg[/img]

      Mar 12, 2011 at 7:28 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B
      B

      No. 16 · Daez wrote, “@Riker: Yes, because the fact that he confessed and attempted to make the media circuit before being locked up is absolutely no reason to believe he actually did it.”

      His “confession” was apparently some conversation/chat session with some guy named Lamos. The question is whether he was simply BSing Lamos, not knowing that someone else was leaking the documents at about the same time.

      You can estimate the chance that he’s guilty and know some relevant numbers (I’ll just make some plausible ones up as an example). Suppose 10,000 people had access to the information. A priori, the chances that any one of them is guilty is 1/10000
      (we know one is, but not which one). Let’s say the probability that the guilty guy would confess by telling someone like Lamos for “bragging rights” is 100%, and that the probability that an innocent guy would simply BS Lamos is 1 in 10000. That sounds bad for Manning, but if you go through the calculation, the probability that someone is guilty given that he confessed is only 50 percent. To show that the “confession” to Lamos all by itself proves that Manning is guilty, you have to show that the probability of someone BSing Lamos is much, much smaller than 1 in 10000 (actually, 1 divided by the number of people who had the ability to leak the documents). But from everyday experience, we know that the fraction of BS artists in the world is far higher than 1 in 10000.

      So, I’m not convinced of Manning’s guilt at all by the information currently released – they have a lot more work to do (or if they’ve done that work, it hasn’t been made public).

      Mar 12, 2011 at 7:42 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jeffree
      Jeffree

      @Oprah: Are you about 15 or just mentally backward? Your comment was completely uncalled for. Put your face on line & let us judge it by the same standards.

      Mar 12, 2011 at 7:52 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Riker
      Riker

      @B: In addition, don’t forget that Lamo is a notorious computer hacker. If he could break into secured networks run by The New York Times, Microsoft, NBC and MCI Worldcom, he can probably fake instant messenger logs. We don’t even know if the supposed conversation actually took place, which casts a whole new layer of doubt on Pfc. Manning’s guilt.

      Mar 12, 2011 at 8:32 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Oprah
      Oprah

      Jeffreeloool i am 14 lol

      Mar 12, 2011 at 8:41 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jeffree
      Jeffree

      @Oprah: Put down the crackpipe. Really.

      Mar 12, 2011 at 9:01 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jeffree
      Jeffree

      @Riker: @B: Could Lamo be forced to testify or be charged for anything? I’m trying very hrd to follow this story but we keep getting bogged down by RTAs here[repeated troll attacks]. What’s a good source of info?
      Thanks!

      Mar 12, 2011 at 9:05 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Oprah
      Oprah

      Jeffree@lool

      I dont use drugs. I am just deliriously happy. My nature. lol

      Mar 12, 2011 at 9:06 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • reason
      reason

      Manning is right where he belongs as an enemy of the state, he took an action as a U.S. soldier to harm our country and the people serving beside him. It’s nice to know that some people would chose solidarity with a treacherous coward because of his sexuality over their own country. Manning’s day will come, for now he gets to play the sheep like a fiddle, oh I am gay and DADT is so painful so I am willing to sell out everyone in my country. Give me a break, the Pentagon needs to send a strong message to the other selfish hedonistic traitors that are thinking of crossing the United States, if you have grievances with the actions of our country there are appropriate channels to relay them.

      Gitmo is not closed because the people don’t want it closed, not one area has agreed to house these prisoners. Regardless, the only reason I want to see that place closed is because terrorist are using it as a recruitment tool due to the poor actions exhibited in the past. The truth is that whether the prisoners are housed at Gitmo or elsewhere the only thing that will change about their incarceration is the location. We have a system of laws, and eventually these people will be dealt with, some of the trials have already restarted. War is complicated, we choose as a democracy to engage and we have to deal with the truths and consequences together. I didn’t want to go to Iraq, by we choose and I pay my taxes to reduce the debt that was incurred. That is how the world works, sometimes things don’t happen the way you like, but that gives no one the right to betray our country.

      Mar 12, 2011 at 9:39 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jeffree
      Jeffree

      @Reason: you forgot to include the word
      “suspected” when you said Manning is an “enemy of the state.” He has not been tried or convicted.

      You omitted the word “allegedly” when you said he “took an action…” You have no proof.

      Please don’t confuse facts with suppositions or opinions. That’s a mental faculty that we call “reason,” closely related to the act ofreasoning.

      We can quibble over the etymological roots of “treason” and “traitor” another day.

      Mar 12, 2011 at 9:59 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Soupy
      Soupy

      Oprah, 14 makes sense because only an ignorant child would throw around “retarded” as an adjective. I think that you should be on a more age appropriate site. And I think that you are actually Willow Palin.

      Mar 12, 2011 at 10:00 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Geoff B
      Geoff B

      I’m not a liberal by any strech, except the gay rights issue, and I have no problem with him being charged with the crimes he’s been accused of, but I can’t helped but wonder if the conditions he’s held under are necessday or needlessly nd agressively cruel. I have no sympathy for enimies of the US,but I believe in due process and the 8th amendment. If he’s guilty of what he’s chrared with then punish him, but he deserves a fair trial first, and what he’s gone through before being convicted seems like like punishment before the crime. We’re supposed to be better than this

      Mar 12, 2011 at 10:30 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Oprah
      Oprah

      Soupy,

      Ok fine. I beg your pardon. I will not use the word ‘retarded’ again. How about Mentally challenged or Mentally incapacitated?

      Mar 12, 2011 at 10:39 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • tombaxter
      tombaxter

      @Raza: It is well settled that there must be a war going on to convict anyone of treason, therefore nothing anyone has done since the end of WWII can be treason. But I admit Bradley is accused of committing a crime far worse murder or rape, he is accused of revealing factual evidence of war crimes.

      Mar 12, 2011 at 10:47 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Geoff B
      Geoff B

      Sorry about all my typos, you know, big thumbs. :)

      Mar 12, 2011 at 10:49 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Riker
      Riker

      @Geoff B: i’m also a conservative gay on almost all issues, and I agree with you here. Throw the book at him if he is tried and convicted, but until that happens (and I have a feeling he’s going to be found not guilty) no person shall be deprived of life, liberty or property without due process of law.

      I have a pretty strong feeling that Pfc. Manning’s lawyer will be able to create enough reasonable doubt that no jury would convict him. “Not guilty” is not the same as “innocent”, but I have a feeling he’s going to get off.

      Mar 12, 2011 at 11:54 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Soupy
      Soupy

      No Oprah, none of those are appropriate descriptions of a face. And a 14 year old girl should not be up this late or on this site. Don’t you have other teens to torture on Facebook, Willow?

      Mar 13, 2011 at 12:00 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jeffree
      Jeffree

      @Soupy: Good one! @Riker: I admire your reasoned stance on the Manning case. No matter which blog I go on, it seems people are rushing to see him fry before a single piece of evidence is presented. I also hope you’re right about Manning’s att’y.

      Mar 13, 2011 at 12:07 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Riker
      Riker

      @Jeffree: Yes, Lamo can be forced to testify (and they probably will subpoena him), but he can’t be forced to incriminate himself. If they start asking about the authenticity of the chat logs, Lamo will probably take the fifth.

      Mar 13, 2011 at 12:10 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • McMike
      McMike

      Throughout this whole debacle, I have yet to hear about one piece of information that Manning supposedly released which threatened ANYONE. Sure, our government is caught with it’s pants down, lying to the American public and the world again and bad-mouthing other governments but I am sick of hearing people say he’s a traitor because he put our soldiers’ lives at risk when there hasn’t been one shred of evidence to suggest this is true.

      What’s happening to Manning is unreal. If he’s guilty of a crime he needs to be put on trial but “torturing” him the way they are shows how un-American America has become.

      Mar 13, 2011 at 12:10 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Oprah
      Oprah

      Soupy

      Torture? I do not torture.I am delightful, i delight, not torture. Besides, i think i am bisexual. :)

      Mar 13, 2011 at 12:15 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Soupy
      Soupy

      I’m pretty sure that you are a large teenage girl with a glandular problem and bad acne.

      Mar 13, 2011 at 12:25 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Oprah
      Oprah

      Soupy

      That is very mean of you. LOL I am not a ‘large’ teenage. Not that there is anything wrong with being large, but one must strive to avoid it. As for Acne–Well i cant avoid that, but thanks to a miracle cream called Proactive, my life is not so acnerish. Now,can we get along? Please-puppy eyes please? LOL

      Mar 13, 2011 at 12:41 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • John
      John

      After the various reports of Bradley Manning’s mistreatment while in confinement I’d like to see & hear some video proof to the contrary.

      Mar 13, 2011 at 1:05 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jeffree
      Jeffree

      @Oprah: “thimk bfroe yuo post!” is my motto–would be apt 4 u 2. @John: I am not sure the gov’t has to provide that documentation, but I’d like to see that video as well.

      Mar 13, 2011 at 1:20 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B
      B

      Re: No. 26 · reason – people are arguing (me included) that the evidence made public so far against Manning is not anywhere near conclusive regarding his guilt or innocence. Nobody is defending a “traitor” regardless of that person’s sexuality. Even if you don’t care whether an innocent person gets convicted of a crime, you might consider that convicting an innocent person means the real criminal is still running around and will possibly commit additional crimes.

      Mar 13, 2011 at 3:30 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jeffree
      Jeffree

      P.J.Crowley, StateDept spokesman got sacked due to criticizing Manning’s living conditions. Crowley was speaking at MIT.
      Chèck your fave news-site for details.

      @Riker: thanks for answering re: Lamo. It’s amazing how little press he’s gotten, even by the usual cabal of conspiracy theorists!

      @B: the mere idea that Manning even, allegedly, had access to so many classified documents makes me wonder how many other possible leakers could have been involved, singly or en masse.

      Mar 13, 2011 at 3:57 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B
      B

      No. 43 · Jeffree wrote, “@B: the mere idea that Manning even, allegedly, had access to so many classified documents makes me wonder how many other possible leakers could have been involved, singly or en masse.”

      I had the same thought. If someone else leaked it but kept his mouth shut and Manning was merely BSing Lamos after noting lax security, then you end up with a nicely framed victim all packaged up for the prosecution (one who manged to frame himself).

      According to http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/nov/28/siprnet-america-stores-secret-cables, “Since the terrorist attacks of September 2001, there has been a move in the US to link up separate archives of government information, in the hope that key intelligence no longer gets trapped in information silos or ‘stovepipes’.”

      and

      “There have been suggestions that an alarm system to detect suspicious use of the network was suspended for US military personnel in Iraq after they complained it was inconvenient.”

      If you make information much easier to get and then remove all audit controls for “convenience” (as alleged), it is not surprising that the inevitable happens.

      Mar 13, 2011 at 11:48 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • D Smith
      D Smith

      @B: the only problem with your analysis of the statistical chances of Manning being the guilty party is the fact that more then one person could very well be the individuals that leaked the information. and additionally that Lamos himself could have made it look as if manning had be in contact with him.

      Mar 14, 2011 at 12:19 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B
      B

      No. 45 · D Smith wrote, “@B: the only problem with your analysis of the statistical chances of Manning being the guilty party is the fact that more then one person could very well be the individuals that leaked the information. and additionally that Lamos himself could have made it look as if manning had be in contact with him.”

      Having more than one person (assuming Manning is not involved) leaking it doesn’t change the way you do the analysis. In reality the probability of bragging when you know you are guilty is pretty small, so you still end up with a reasonable doubt regarding Manning’s guilt. I used the simplest case to avoid confusing readers who don’t know about Bayes theorem.

      I presume that they confiscated Manning’s computer, analyzed the hard drive, and found evidence there (or on servers that neither Manning nor Lamos had access to) that showed what Manning had told Lamos.

      Mar 14, 2011 at 1:06 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Alice
      Alice

      @Raza:

      The death of innocent people is not enough reason for you? How can you be so stupid to regard someone opposing anything done by the goventment, or the army to be a traitor? Have you no oppinion of your own? Maybe you should start using your own brain and not rely on the government to do it for you. Your obviously brain washed. If you were living in germany during the 2nd world war you probably wouldnt oppose the antisemitism and the government killing millions of people right? Cause having a different oppininon than the government/militay forces would make you a traitor right? GET A BRAIN. Manning should be treated as a courageaous hero, not a criminal. And just the fact that pentagon has tried to sweep this “misstake” of killing innocent people, including fireing arms at CHILDREN under the carpet shows that they are highly aware of this event as clear evidence of a lack of respect for civilians, lack of responsibility and also of highly UNQUALIFIED men in the army. Of cource in times of war innocent people get killed and misstakes happen, but the lack of responsibility and respect for these misstakes are of huge, huge concern.

      Apr 2, 2011 at 8:47 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Lefty
      Lefty

      @Alice: Well said!

      If anyone want’s to follow the legal side of things the blog of David E. Coombs who is representing Bradley Manning is here:

      http://www.armycourtmartialdefense.info/

      And here is information about Bradley Manning Support Weekend:

      a call to socially conscious artists and organizers across the country and world to propel Bradley Manning to pop-culture status through artistic expression before he goes to trial.

      Art is the primary tool and cornerstone of our organizing strategy, and we encourage art in all forms including, but not limited to, poetry, music, performance art, gallery exhibitions, and artistic public demonstrations.

      These dynamic displays of creativity have the potential to substantially challenge and reshape Bradley’s narrative in the eyes of the public while simultaneously raising awareness of the conditions under which he is being held and contributing to his legal defense fund. All of which helps him take the steps toward the freedom he deserves.

      Our goal is to put energy into something that will last longer than a protest on a street corner, so get creative! Open mics, concerts, plays, exhibits! Go outdoors! Go public! Go big! Bradley Manning and our country’s future depend on it!

      http://www.bradleymanning.org/take-action/bradley-manning-solidarity-weekend-april-9-10th

      [img]http://i56.tinypic.com/6t38s6.jpg[/img]

      Apr 2, 2011 at 10:32 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Spirit
      Spirit

      Long time I felt the need to say sth I am shocked how some people have just no feelings. Why should Bradley be a traitor for telling the truth? Politics is a dirty business and why is America constantly creating so called enemies? I remember the time after 9/11( and I am leaving it open here to what really happened there) and America went big time after Bin Laden they had no success and I said to my friends just watch the next enemy will be suddenly Saddham Hussein and guess what it did not take long and there it was all over the news Saddham Hussein was the new enemy. Unbelievable. I do not believe anymore anything what any politician says unless he/she comes from enlightenment. Otherwise they are all liars and most of the people are sheeps mmmaaaaa. You people who think Bradley is deserving all this. No it is disgusting. No human being has ever the right to do brutality to others. No one. In my opinion America is doing a lot of damage in this world and all this in 2012 have we not learned from the past? No, opposite , things are getting more brutal and violent by the day. I am glad that very soon things will be changing in this world this planet needs a big cleansing and you watch it will come. The creator God the supreme being is always watching and Karma is Karma no one can run away from it. Sorry no one . Bradley by heart is a good person and this is what counts. It is unimaginable what he has to go through. You people who think he deserves this kind of treatment in my opinion one should do the same treatment to you. Because I am sure you have done things in your life which by others have been judged as not right. And then we will see whether you still think that it is all so good, when You will feel the pain being in chains, naked no free hands, hardly any daylight etc. I really mean it why don’t YOU put yourself voluntarily into this conditions, we will see how long YOU will last. It really gets me about the arrogance of so many human beings, no soft feelings just hardcore attitudes. As Buddha said\: We are born in the shell of ignorance and we don’t know what we are doing! Just think about it a bit and just for one moment just feel how would it be if this is done to you. I remember I read once : Just for one moment close your eyes and imagine that in this moment every human being on this planet is experiencing a moment in their life? Wow, and do we not want that everybody is experiencing a moment of Bliss, rather than torture, violence, brutality.

      Aug 10, 2012 at 9:35 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·

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