Queerty is better as a member
Sounds just like the sort of nonsense American rightwing Christian groups put out…
If anyone wants to know the motivation for making this video just look at how Nazi Germany portrayed the Jews. Same old story and the same Nazi players.
We need to be putting out even greater amounts of PR, showcasing the truth about Russia.
Well, this video is definitely scary and kind of puts things into perspective. I used to support the Olympic players going to Russia, but how can I now?
No, I will not be watching the Olympics this year. How a organization that is supposed to represent harmony and unity in the world chose Russia is beyond me. I am torn, though, because I do believe gay players and allies can make a symbolic gesture making an appearance at the games, but if this is how things are…
Sickening, disgusting, scarey.
@fagburn: Considering the christianity at the heart of Russia’s newest pogrom, the orthodox church running the show in Russia show the true face of religion.
Not surprising coming from Neanderthals who show no sign of overcoming their bigotry and ignorance. If you’ve met majority of Russians, you know arguing with them is like arguing with a drunk person (pun intended). And as mentioned before, Putins a former KGB member, they’re completely soulless, his Nazi like regime needs more attention the West, so sickening.
Apparently now they might be firing people for being gay.
@Greg Garavani: How on Earth does one meet a majority of Russians when that’s roughly 150million people?
I wish for a so-called news site, there would be more digging done first about the origins of this video. Googling “Healthy Young Generation – Healthy Russia” brings up four results: this site and three other gay news sites using your copy, including one of the worst gay news sites in the world, Gay Star News.
Googling the Russian, “???????? ????????? – ???????? ??????” brings up more but not a huge amount; and the earliest I can find so far is in March of this year on a gay forum that’s hardly gay-friendly, but seems also to be in some parts quite questioning and even doubts the veracity and the provenance of this video and the group supposedly behind it.
Fagburn’s comment upthread also carries some relevance here, seeing as the video relies on already debunked “research” by some American fool who was funded by far-right religious American interests.
Our priority here is to find out exactly where this is actually from, if this group actually exists and if so where they’re located and when we find out who really are behind it, what are their interests and ultimate goals.
^^ the line of question marks was “Healthy Young Generation – Healthy Russia” in original russian, but I guess it isn’t readable on here.
Easy to work out though and google for yourselves, if you want to look into this some more.
@Cam: Can’t check now as I’m in a hurry, but will do so later – but pretty sure it’s legal to fire teachers on that basis in the US in many states? And I’m sure I’ve read of instances quite recently of that happening over there?
@Cam: “Apparently now they might be firing people for being gay.”
They sack teachers for being gay in America.
Here’s just one from last month – http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2013/08/01/us-catholic-school-teacher-sacked-for-being-gay-days-after-marrying-his-partner/
Sacking someone cause they’re gay is legal in 29 American states.
We need to help out gay brothers and sisters in this world. We, the lucky, NEED to help them get out from the grip of hate and disinformation.
To be gay is to know the hypocrisy, but in that knowledge there is a task.
Hmmm. If you don’t want gays to adopt. Who will adopt all this orphans with fetaile alcohol syndrome coming out of Russia.
my friend’s sister-in-law makes $68/hr on the internet. She has been out of work for seven months but last month her paycheck was $12481 just working on the internet for a few hours. Read Full Report… BAM%32%31%2E%63om
Lefty and Fagburn,
The issue is Russia is moving in the opposit direction. If you look at the majority of stories about teachers being fired over in the U.S. it is Christian and Catholic schools that are doing it.
And Fagburn. I always find it interesting when people pretend that if something is horrible in one area you are not allowed to point it out unless everything is perfect where you are from.
The U.S. has never had a woman as president. Does this mean that Americans can never post up an article about a woman who was arrested for reporting a rape in another country? Of course not, that is silly.
Monstrous. I almost wish I wasn’t part Russian.
@Cam: “The U.S. has never had a woman as president. Does this mean that Americans can never post up an article about a woman who was arrested for reporting a rape in another country? Of course not, that is silly.”
Of course your proposition is silly. It’s reductio ad absurdum. The accurate question would be: The U.S. has never had a woman as president. Does this mean that Americans can never post up an article about how a woman has never reached the highest political position in the land in other counteries… as an example of how backwards – in terms of female equality – other countries are?
And the answer to that is obvious.
“Does this mean that Americans can never post up an article about a woman who was arrested for reporting a rape in another country? Of course not, that is silly.”
Again, women who report rape are sometimes arrested – or more often than not disbelieved and ignored in yours and many other western countries.
It’s the proposition is silly which is silly.
The issue is, Russia is getting worse. We are free to comment on it. I have no problem attacking the bigoted backward U.S. states where gays can be fired legally. That isn’t what this posting is about.
There’s such an aggressive opposition to those who try to find out the facts about what is actually going in, In individual stories and in the wider, complex arena of other cultures and their relation to – and often antithesis towards – our own culture, particular in Africa and the Middle East.
Which is related to – and related to their aggression in this other regard – the aggression shown at the very suggestion that it’s the people and activists inside this country who know exactly what’s going on. Instead of many westerners who unquestioningly follow the western media’s line (who have all sorts of vested political interest in these countries)and accept their reports on face-value without any further investigation of their own.
Why not think for yourselves. Find out what’s really going on. Base your judgments on that and then work with those inside in ways that will actually help rather than hinder their considerable work in their own countries to change the current climate.
But then, to do that, one must respect those people inside and then listen to what’s actually happening there first-hand, and find out what they need and want us to do to help.
It’s simple enough and hardly controversial.
Odd that such a logical, compassionate and simple approach is often met with aggressive resistance from many in the West.
I wonder why that is…
@Cam: “The issue is, Russia is getting worse”
It seems to be getting worse, but again, this is entirely because reporting from outside – usually with very little information and almost always reported as “allegedly”, which should at least engender some skepticism about the truth of those claims.
Everything I’ve written on this has resulted in accusations of being a troll or a liar or someone with an agenda.
I seriously believe that none of us commenting on here is not extremely angry about this and wants to do something about it.
But I want to know the truth first.
For instance, if this video is not being produced in Russia – it’s inspired by the debunked research of an American charlatan and funded by the American religious right – then who is producing it? If it’s someone with an ulterior motive, then we have someone who is both propagating homophobic lies and dangerously so, but also implicating the Russians and may be trying to do so to raise the antagonism towards Russia while using us as a pawn.
We – and I mean all of us here – as we’re all on the same side – need to work to find out exactly who this is and what their motives are. For our own sake, no one else’s.
That seems perfectly logical, to me.
what a waste of time! http://getoffmydress.blogspot.com/2013/09/sometimes-ya-feel-like-nutcase.html
@Lefty I’m speaking based on the individuals I’ve met (and my mothers side being Russian/Middle Eastern, I’ve met A LOT), even within my family as they know I’m Gay they continue to mock my sexuality in ways that still hurt, yes I love them but it’s unfortunate they’ve all been brain washed by individuals like Putin. Have you been to Russia lately? I’d encourage you to travel and try to be the person you are in the states to experience just a taste of the cruelty the LGBT community there faces, it really isn’t pretty. I can only speak from my experience here within the states as the first generation of a Russian/Eastern Euro./Middle East. family.
@Greg Garavani: I’m sincerely sorry for what you experience, esp. within your own family. But LGBT people throughout the entire world and even in places like the US and UK, where things are apparently better in all sorts of ways, LGBT people face harrassment, ostracism and violence in public, in their workplace and even, sadly, within their own families.
This anti-gay Russian law is almost exactly worded like the infamous Section 28 that was instigated by the Thatcher government in the UK in the 1980s and that government even used posters attacking Labour and the Lib Dems, as being pro-gay – one disgusting one in particular, plastered all over the country on huge billboards read something like “Labour’s idea of education: including three instances of what they felt was just basis for education and one large addition attacked the very notion that gay children should be proud (rather than ashamed) of what they are/were.
Section 28, very slyly and cynicallly used this same word “promotion of homosexuality”, which could mean any kind of discussion or outward expression being gay (like two men holding hands, for instance). I was in school in the ’90s when Section 28 was still in force and the issue of homosexuality wasn’t mentioned once in all that time.
The cynical and calculating wordingof Section 28 resulted in a fear among teachers that they couldn’t even mention being gay.
@Lefty: I’m glad you pulled up section 28, though your reasoning that nothing should be done because of what happened in my country is a rather stupid one.
Though given your denial of any problem in Russia at all is not surprising.
@2eo: I never said nothing should be done, as you well know. I’m not going to keep repeating myself, 2eo; because despite the aggressive approach you and Cam, in particular, have responded to me on this issue; it seems to me – even if it hasn’t occurred to you – that we are on the same side here.
For others reading this, my point again and again, is that we should not listen to people outside Russia in the US and UK, many of whom have obvious vested interests, but rather we should be listening to ordinary LGBT people and activists inside Russia, because they are not only best placed to judge the situation, the full-context and the best course of action which will help them (after all, it’s these people who are directly affected by this and it’s their ongoing hard work and activism which will ultimately result in the desired outcome for our community there.
The accusation that I’ve said or even believe that nothing should be done is false and as much as I respect you 2eo, and I do, this isn’t the first time you’ve misrepresented what I’ve said. Why do that, please?
Your second point that I deny there’s any problem in Russia is also false, unfair and equally counter to everything I’ve said on this issue.
If I didn’t believe there was a problem, then why have I been arguing again and again that we should listen to the very people this is affecting inside Russia and take their lead, ie. ask what they want and need and whether or not we can help.
If you genuinely care about what’s happening to LGBT people and activists inside Russia, why do you so aggressively oppose any suggestion that we should listen to them first and foremost and support their efforts in ways which will help them in the long term?
Not Dan Savage, who admits only consulting Russians in NY and once speaking to Russians in Moscow in 1990; or, god forbid, Jamie Kirchick, a right-wing goon.
We’re on the same side. All this aggressive crap about me being a troll or whatever is pathetic and adds nothing to this important debate. In fact, it only shuts debate down, as that aggression seems primarily to seek to shut up anyone who has an opposing view.
I remember when you and I were defending Chelsea Manning on here and rightly criticising the US Government.
There’s an awful lot of US government funded interests lining up to muddy the waters of this particular issue, coupled with a majority of right-wing commentators – like Jamie Kirchick (if you still care about Chelsea Manning, as I do; check what Kirchick thinks of her and her heroic act).
All I’ve argued here is that we should not take the simplistic reporting on this issue and find out for ourselves the truth, the sources for so much of this selective information and so on, find out the truth for ourselves, and then make our own balanced moral judgment on what’s really going on – just like we did for Chelsea Manning.
What’s so objectionable about that?
You and I are both English, I think? We don’t automatically accept US propaganda.
With respect x
As an aside, I was once attacked on this site for saying that US politicians and the President only came out to support gay rights after society had changed enough in terms of respecting gay rights. It was only then that they began to “lead” on the issue. My point then was, that society had changed because gay people and activists had spent decades changing the depictions of LGBT people in the media and activists had spent just as much time working extremely hard to change society and political landscape too.
For this reason, I said we owe these politicians little thanks as they were merely jumping on and appropriating the hard work of LGBT people and activists in the US on the ground, as it were.
It wasn’t until their work had gained such momentum and acceptance that the politicians felt comfortable enough to take a calculated risk in supporting us too.
The same can be said of the Tory party in the UK. Labour and the Lib Dems were pro-gay long before it was electorably advantageous for them to do so; seemingly they did so as a matter of principle. But the Tories who instigated a law much like the current Russian one and even campaigned in the late-’80s with despicable adverts about how Labour wanted gay kids to be proud of who they were; clinged to their homophobic policies well into the 2000s. Indeed, our current Prime Minister still supported Section 28 during this time. Again, it wasn’t until public opinion had changed – thanks entirely to the decades of hard work from British gay people and activists – that the Tories realised it would be beneficial to become pro-gay rights.
Again and again, we see it’s the hard work of those inside, directly affected by these laws and prejudice who change everything, but it takes time and we need to support their efforts, rather than thinking we can solve it all by pointless gestures from foreigners who ignore those very people and activists inside and go ahead – rather arrogantly – regardless.
@· Greg Garavani
I agree with you wholeheartedly! The Russia that use to be so cool about gays is a changing but the sad part is the culture of the country is so amazing! But this conservatism is in my opinion worse than the Communists. They let the gays exist and be! The Putin government is againts anything that doesnt fit their religous opinion of whats accetable. I still believe its religous based where this crap is coming from cause Russian big cities use to have gay bars. It use to be a fun place that accepted its gays but now? Its a fucking mess I wouldnt visit for anyone.
I can’t bring myself to watch this video. It’s like something out of Der Stürmer.
To invoke the inimitable Sophia Petrillo, “Picture it: Berlin – 1933.”
I watched the video all the way through, and it easily is one of the most virulently ho*mophobic things I’ve seen in a while. Whoa!
Not sure if anyone else noticed but the video also is an attack on multiculturalism. Totally fits with the Russian orthodox Christian nationalist authoritarian mentality that is underpins the anti-LGBTQ policies.
While what is happening in Russia (and the eastern block in general) is bad, very bad, we can’t let this distract us from the real dangers looming over us here in the US. Yes, we are at this time nowhere near what is happening in Russia, but that has to be prefaced with a huge ‘Yet’
Russian gays need to google this:
This is Gay – ??? ??? (????????? ????????? ??????-????)
Then they will see a truthful representation of gays.
@Bryan: “Russian big cities use to have gay bars”
Russian big cities still have gay bars. I know of several people who’ve been in recent years. Marc Almond was there only a few weeks ago and said the gay scene in Moscow is thriving. I’ve heard the same is true in other major cities.
This law is horrific and there’s no doubt it’s unwise to be open in certain areas and that police protection is not a given there, but to say there are no gay bars in major cities or no gay scene there isn’t true.
@hephaestion: Ha. Did a troll just get rolled.
@Kangol: Before this became an issue that was the last issue. Roving bands of neo nazi’s freely patrolled the streets looking for foreign workers to beat the sh*t out of and sometimes kill. All with the blessing of their churches.
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