Another holy outing? American Dennis Wine alleges that he had a sexual relationship Anglican Bishop of Horsham Lindsay Urwin.
Lindsay was 37 or so at the time and a good looking man for his age (being 38 myself now that seems like a silly thing to say but it was how I saw things as a 23 year old back then).
We hooked up twice in Holy Week of 1993. I fell for him in one of those puppy dog crushes newly out gay men sometimes have.
My friend warned me that Lindsay had a reputation for “teahouses” (by which he meant frequenting public restrooms). His advice was “don’t fall for Lindsay. He wants to be a bishop”.
Wine explains that he would not usually out someone, but felt compelled to do so after hearing of Urwin’s anti-gay support. For example, Urwin joined his peers in celebrating America’s Dioscese of San Joaquin breaking off to join the anti-gay Province of the Southern Cone.
ee.em.bee
Oh please let there be some conclusive evidence of this, or corroboration, or an undeniable birthmark on the padre’s penis, or something. I totally SO want this to be true!!
Puddy Katz
nice dress honey
Dennis
well, my last name isn’t wine. I spent years in the wine trade so that is where that comes from.
I saw the links coming from here and followed them. I am curious how you found my blog and the post on Lindsay.
I fear that I may have stirred up a hornets nest. I never had any intention of outing him until he started working hard to support the anti-gay bigots. The release of that letter by the bishops yesterday was the last straw.
Last night my partner and I were talking about this for a long time before I posted it. It took a long talk to decide to go public. I sat on this for years, why release it now and such. It is time for honesty, though.
It is a scary thing to throw ones name and history out into the public in this way. Thanks for the link.
ee.em.bee
Very brave, Dennis. But are there polaroids? (Not to question your honesty at all, but polaroids never hurt!) And PLEASE don’t suffer mixed feelings about outing the bastard: These pompous, loudly pious, irreligious hypocrites need to be shown to the world for what they are. Well done!
Meeg
An during holy week no less!? tsk tsk tsk.
Phoenix
Does anybody else think the Padre’s firm hands on those stick shifts are a bit suggestive? Dennis you need to give us details, lad.
ProfessorVP
Hat’s not the only thing that’s hard, if you get my meaning.
MadPriest
I can vouch for the fact that Dennis is a good, honest, Christian man who worries about what he does and says far more than he should do for his own health. If he says something is true, it is true. I completely trust him.
I have known about this matter for some time, it is not something that Dennis decided to do after one too many glasses of red wine.
Also, and this is important, if those in my internet neighbourhood wanted to they could “out” hundreds of Anglican priests. We choose not to because it would be wrong. However, this bishop is a hypocrite, and he is not alone. Of course, we are all hypocrites but the hypocrisy of these self-denying, self-hating and misogynist Anglo-Catholic clergy hurts our Christian brothers and sisters (both gay and straight) throughout the world. The Christian Church is still a powerful voice and its institutionalised homophobia gives permission to evil people, wherever they live, to oppress, attack and even murder, gay people and their friends.
It is understandable that many, if not most, secular gays, despise Christianity. But I would ask you to understand that gay Christians like Dennis are risking far more fighting the battle from inside the Church than you can possibly imagine. Those of us who take Christ’s message of love and inclusiveness seriously may be few in number and have a lot less power and influence than those who oppose us – but we are there and we are fighting and we could do with all the support the enlightened secular world can give us.
Rev. Jonathan Hagger
Newcastle Upon Tyne
England
Raphael
Mother Mary
That queen has had more trade at Walsigham than the local TESCO.
Chicken has been on that lunch for many a year.
As I say if they shout get them out.
John Tee
I find it unbelievable that any one could possibly deny that the Rt Revd Lindsay Urwin was gay. I was a curate with him when he was at St Peter’s Walworth and can vouch for it. Although I am not gay I take great pleasure in exposing this hyppcrite.
He made my life and the life of our rector, now sadly deceased, a nightmare. He was a hugely active gay priest until he got a whiff of a ‘bishop’s hat where he took his bogus vow of celibacy fearing that his disgusting past would catch up with him.
He is one of the most obnoxious and ambitious individuals I have ever had the misforturn to have to deal with.
I did of course put all this on his Wikepedia entry but it was edited out by them and I have now been banned from editing back in.
He came to the parish then in Bishop Mervyn Stockward’s time (Merve the Perve) and was more than friends with the suffragan bishop of Woolwich another notorious batchelor who was going out with a teacher from Westminster School a the time. Woolich patronised a huge number of the homosexual clergy in Southwar in those days. In fact Canon Paul Jobson often joked with me that I was the only straight clergyman this side of the Thames!
I am a Buddhist now and so I dont really get involved in t his debate but I thought that people should know exactly what sort of a creature this Urwin is.
andrew tucker
i can vouch for the fact that bishop urwin, when my parish priest, behaved in an exemplary fashion. his love, energy and faith made the st faiths church a very cool and happy place to be.
it would be nice to think those who are so critical of bishop urwin live precious and perfect lives. thats not really the nature of humanity though, is it?
Lucy
Does it matter what his past was?
Yes, the fact that he is involved in anti gay movements is hypocritical and awful, but the pressures of the anglo catholic church mean that a man cannot be a bishop if he is gay. Yes this is wrong but at this moment in time it is unavoidable.
He is a fantastic bishop and a good man! He’s in a difficult situation! Can any of you honestly say you haven’t done something “wrong” in a previous time!
I know from personal experience that he is absolutely fine with gay men having spend a lot of time around him and other gay men! His attitude did not differ between sexual orientation.
I am aware that his role in the anti gay movement is bad but i understand! I understand that God has called him to something but the pressures of the church have made it difficult and even impossible to do unless he changes certain aspects of his life!
Brian
@Lucy: These guys are what they preach: Bullshit.
Jeannie Armstrong
Bishop Urwin confirmed my little girl in her Christian faith.
Active Homosexual lifestyle is not compatible with the Word of God. You people may be angry with God over this but to out a man who is dedicating his life to the work of God is disgusting.
God will judge you for your treachery.
Father Martin
I think everyone is missing the mark. What happened in the past happened in the past. I am heterosexual and had relations previously outside of wedlock. I eventually went to seminary and subsequently was Ordained making my vow of chastity. Life is hard. But we persevere. I have met bishop Urwin. He’s a passionate and compassionate Anglican pastor. If he was ‘naughty’ in the past, then he’s made his amends with the Creator and now tries very hard to live a life of conversion. All Christians are called to conversion of life.
We are human creatures. We sin. We confess. We promise to make amends and not fall into the same sin. We receive forgiveness and absolution.
Sexual sin is complicated. I still have desires, but dont fulfil them. I can’t as I live a new life in Christ everyday. I hope and pray that the Anglican bishop does the same.
I hope people in charity understand my point. The Church is here for sinners. That we may grow up and live pious Godly lives.
Mike UK
He’s an Anglican bishop, he doesn’t have to be chaste unlike the catholic church the fact that he’s a hypocrite is a totally different matter!
Father Martin
The bishop belongs to a society of celibate clergy. He has made vows before God, as do many men and women in religious life and indeed in Holy Matrimony. I led to believe that he lives these vows out now as a committed Christian should. This is the crux of the matter: That he has been accused of being naughty in the past and now has resolved to live a Godly and Christian life is the real wonderful story here. Maybe the criticism is that he has and continues to be faithful to the Creator and his religious Society, when so many fall short of the ideal…
Ezekiel 34
Bishop Lindsay Urwin took a vow of celibacy in 1991 – this was a primary requirement for membership in The Oratory of The Good Shepherd. Young Dennis Wine’s (23 yr old) early sexual encounters with the 38 year old Father Urwin during Holy Week, when Urwin was already an Anglican Priest who had taken celibacy vows for OGS membership, suggests a high level of hypocrisy on Urwin’s part. Annanias and Sapphira were publicly strictly judged for deception within the Christian Church. “Christian teachers in the Church will incur a stricter judgment”.
As church leaders, the Apostle Paul, the Apostle Peter, King David and others had their sins revealed publicly as an excample – it is fitting that this public parousia is displayed in the community of believers.
Ezekiel 34
Interesting that the 33 Bishops letter opposing homosexuality, with Bishop Urwin’s signature, has a comment from a reader which quotes Bishop Lindsay from Fr Simon’s interview with him in 2008: Part 2 of 3: “… People need to being honest. They’re not very good at being honest …”
Ezekiel34
@Dennis:
So like to talk with you Dennis. Just discovered this website and am presently involved spiritually with this affair. Thanks for the outing …
Ezekiel34
Hi there. Re Bishop John-David Schofield separating his diocese from the Episcopalians who are ‘too soft on the gays’. See the 33 Bishops’ Statement, signed by Bishop Lindsay Urwin. Found Queerty’s article “Anti-Gay Bishop’s Unsavoury Past Biting Back?” very interesting. To quote a young victim: “… I will state my experience with David Scholfield … in court. I know of one other young man (well not young now) who had an almost similar experience to mine. … it was as if he knew part of what happened to me. David propositioned me on two separate occasions, once in Inverness and once in Paso Robies. It would be interesting to track down all those young men … who went on retreats in Inverness from about 1972-1980 …” HOWEVER – Bishop Schofield once gave testimony in a 1995 Newsletter from Voice of Integrity, a pro-gay Episcopalian group, that “he was a cured homosexual.” Do we have another case of deception here, or is it more like that of ‘projection’ or ‘reaction formation’?