The New York Post‘s David Benkof ain’t about the gay marriage battle: “The Human Rights Cam paign, America’s largest gay-rights group, recently announced plans to spend at least a half-million dollars to defeat the California Marriage Protection Act. What a waste; gays and lesbians have far more urgent needs. The Golden State constitutional amendment poses no substantive threat to them – it will take nothing away from same-sex couples but the word “marriage.” Even if HRC wants Californians to vote no on the initiative, $500,000 is a lot to spend on a struggle to retain an unpopular court victory that’s only semantic and symbolic.” [NY Post]
Biting.
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John Santos
Here’s something else he’s written:
“Of course I’m opposed to redefining marriage, now and forever. I think same-sex marriage is bad for children, bad for marriage, and bad for society. But it isn’t necessarily bad for gay people.”
Why do homocons hate gay people so much?
John Santos
From his blog http://www.gaysdefendmarriage.com
“David Benkof is openly bisexual, but as an Orthodox Jew he is guided by Jewish law in the areas of sexuality and family life.”
Nuff said.
John Santos
One more nugget from this troubled lad:
“Bisexual doesn’t mean one needs to be in a relationship with two people, or even with anyone. I am attracted to both women and men, but more to men. I have not had sex with anyone in more than seven years, and do not plan to until I am married.”
Ha! Brilliant. He won’t have sex until he’s married, but he’s not interested enough to women to marry one, so he’ll wait until he can marry a man, yet opposes marriage equality that would allow him to marry and be intimate with a man. Fucked. In. The. Head
todd
And of course, the New York Post gives him his platform on which to speak…why should I be surprised? While I have issues with the HRC, I completely get why they’re spending the $$ in CA: Anything less than MARRIAGE will put same-sex couples in the backseat, if only psychologically.
When are people going to realize that we deserve this? M-A-R-R-I-A-G-E. Nothing more and nothing less.
Qjersey
Okay, if you can overlook the fact that he is an ass, he does have a valid point. The LGBT movement cast aside AIDS to focus on marriage. HRC and others are spending vast amounts on marriage, when gay men make up a steady 50% of all HIV cases…and our government only allocates 20% of HIV prevention money for gay/bi/MSM. Of course HRC get as hopped up over that.
Qjersey
arrgh, proofreading…
of course HRC DOES NOT get hopped up over the fact that only 20% of HIV prevention money gets targeted to gay/bi/msm. AND there are restrictions on that money on top of that…e.g., ABC. Abstinence, Be Faithful, Consistent Condom Use are REQUIRED components of all HIV interventions.
Progression
>>yet opposes marriage equality that
>>would allow him to marry and be intimate
>>with a man.
I don’t see this necessarily as a stalemate. He may oppose gay marriage, but if despite his opposition it happens anyway, then he could get married to another man, if reluctantly. He could then have sex but fret that he’s redefining tradition – until years later, gay marriage becomes the tradition.
John Santos
“And of course, the New York Post gives him his platform on which to speak”
Contary to what he claims, most of his “published articles” are actually leters to the editor. So although he has been given a platform by the reprehensible NY Post to spread his nonsense, it’s in the same vane as a bitter loser who rants about life, rather than living it.
John Santos
“The LGBT movement cast aside AIDS to focus on marriage…when gay men make up a steady 50% of all HIV cases…and our government only allocates 20% of HIV prevention money for gay/bi/MSM.”
Do you know who I blame for this? Us. We spent so many years and so much money trying to convince the world that AIDS is not just a gay disease, that the world eventually listened–and subsequently ignored our plight. We should have dedicated more time resources to protecting and educating ourselves, than trying to save the world. And this comes back to the question fo whether LGBTQ activists should concentrate on LGBTQ rights and issues effecting our lives, or worry about eveything else under the sun
John Santos
“I don’t see this necessarily as a stalemate.”
Well, considering he said this in 2003:
“In 2003, he announced that he was going to stop having sex with men for religious reasons, and that he was shedding the label gay, preferring not to label his sexuality…”
“I believe that within a couple years I’m probably going to be married with a growing family.”
Well, here it is 2008 and he is still alone and celibate; not married to a woman and without children; now identifies as bisexual and admits he prefers men more than women.
http://lukeford.net/blog/?p=2904
Like I wrote: fucked in the head.
John Santos
Something elese he’s said about himself, which a poster points out on GAY:
“As for Mr. Benkof’s identity, he previously said that he had “changed sexual identity” and was now a bisexual looking for a “woman with whom I can bring pleasure and joy, and with whom I can have a nice-if-not-spectacular bedroom life and create a beautiful Jewish family.” While he does not define himself as “ex-gay”, it would be difficult to distinguish his self-identity (bisexually attracted seeking a heterosexual family model and hostile to gay equality) from that of many ex-gays.”
http://www.goodasyou.org/good_as_you/2008/05/some-gays-are-d.htm
Progression
>>Well, here it is 2008 and he is
>>still alone and celibate; not married
>>to a woman and without children; now
>>identifies as bisexual and admits he
>>prefers men more than women.
If he waits long enough, gay marriage will be a reality and tradition and he won’t feel religious conflict in marrying a man. Or he can marry a woman he doesn’t love, have children and negotiate a relationship with a man outside the marriage. I was just watching a biopic about Ayn Rand on Showtime and she did exactly that. Ayn married a man she loved but didn’t feel sexually passionate for, so she negotiated with her husband to have weekly sessions of sex with one of her young and handsome followers.
Progression
>>While he does not define himself as “ex-gayâ€,
>>it would be difficult to distinguish his
>> self-identity (bisexually attracted seeking a
>>heterosexual family model and hostile to gay
>>equality) from that of many ex-gays.â€
The religious right use bisexuality and “sliding scale” sexuality as tools, leveraging them to block the progress of rights.
chandler in lasvegas
Hmmmm, one thing we have learned is that HIV is a preventable disease. For gays to STILL be 50% of the infected is a reflection on gays not the society at large. Own it.
As for gay marriage trumping preventable disease, marriage is a whole basket of relationship rights in one fell swoop. HIV debases our relationships and marriage reinforces them.
Did you think it was that complicated a decision?
John Santos
“…one thing we have learned is that HIV is a preventable disease.”
We’ve also learned that it’s easier for gays to aquire the HIV virus through anal sex, than for straights to aquire it through vaginal sex.
Jaroslaw
I have no problem at all with HRC spending money on California. First class citizenchip is worth it.
What I do wonder about is if David Benkof type articles hurt or help. I used to think people, over time, using just a particle or two of brainpower, would come to their senses and say “gee, I’ve thought this over and even if I’m not Gay myself, I don’t see why it is the government’s or even my business who anyone else marries.”
The idea here being in a democracy, all sides are presented for consideration. But it seems on this issue of same sex marriage people such as Benkof are insane and others have no reservations about often just lying.
A sad state of affairs.
CitizenGeek
I think he’s mischaracterising the ruling; it’s hardly ‘unpopular’, the story was the most dugg on Digg.com for 3 days. One poll shows the striking down of the ban has a significant amount of support. Most people really, really don’t care. Even Bill O’Reilly didn’t freak out over it.
Charley
I didn’t know he was an orthodox Jew. As an open bi=sexual looks like he erased Leviticus out of the Torah.
nikko
Benkof is as anti-gay as you get. He converted to orthodox Judaism (that draconian religion before christianity that advocates death penalty for homosexual acts)and believes gay is wrong, period. Nuff said. As with all religious people, he insists on you agreeing with him-or else.
Progression
“He converted to orthodox Judaism….”
Such people convert themselves into an intransigently fixed world view, which is most compatible with their personalities. It’s the nature of the world that progress occurs when we’re able to break free of the hold of traditions to touch new ground. Fundies rush to catch up and the dance for progress begins again.
Charles J. Mueller
A homophobe is a homophobe, whether str8, bi or gay. They come in all flavors and colors.
Jaroslaw
Nikko – let’s not go overboard. If he has a problem with the USA prohibiting HIV pos people coming into the country and a bunch of other stuff per his Blog, then he is hardly as “anti-gay” as it gets.
David Benkof
It’s very interesting that most of your criticisms are ad hominem and do not address the points in my New York Post op-ed – which does not cite a single Biblical verse or argue that children need both mothers and fathers. Every reason I give in that piece for not wasting a half million dollars on the California battle is related to gay and lesbian needs, some of them urgent, all of them more important than the word “marriage.” Ignoring my substantive points and calling me all kinds of names is not a very savvy debating tactic.
John Santos and Progression- You really misunderstood me. I have no interest in “marrying” a man. I believe that no matter what the Supreme Court says, a man can “marry” another man no more than a hamster can E-mail a watermelon. If I marry, which I hope to someday, I will marry a woman.
Todd- Thanks for pointing out something I have felt for a long time. The lack of marriage rights in California hurts gays and lesbians, as you put it, “only psychologically.” I acknowledge that given how hard it is to grow up gay, LGBT self-esteem is a real issue that I would like to see addressed both by the gay community and by the society at large. To try to address that problem by changing marriage laws in a way that will hurt many, many people is a terrible idea. Let’s find ways to help boost LGBT self-esteem that doesn’t victimize other segments of society.
David Benkof
John Santos-
I have written no more than four letters to the editor in the last five years, most of which were not published. I have had op-ed pieces on marriage in eight of the top twenty metropolitan dailies. I have been paid for my contributions to publications such as the New York Post, the San Francisco Chronicle, the Chicago Tribune, the Philadelphia Inquirer, the Baltimore Sun, the Philadelphia Daily News, New York Newsday, and the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel. Newspapers *never* pay for letters to the editor. Your claim that I am for all intents and purposes “ex-gay” is wrong on so many levels. I do not believe that therapy to change one’s sexual orientation is a good idea. I find Jewish ex-gays to be particularly reprehensible in their lies about what Judaism believes about homosexuality. There is as much evidence I am “ex-gay” as there is that you are a pedophile. Calling you a NAMBLA supporter (which some gay men are) is the equivalent of your calling me an ex-gay supporter (which some celibate LGBT are). In either case, it’s a reprehensible lie.
Chandler in Las Vegas, your arrogant dismissal of your brothers suffering from HIV is very sad; unfortunately it’s typical in the gay-rights movement, which is the most selfish American movement since the Hippies.
CitizenGeek- If there’s a story about polygamy for three days on Digg.com, does that mean people support polygamy? You’re right about one poll, but the LA Times poll shows the measure leading by 19 points. And in every other state polls have undercounted the support for man-woman marriage; people lie rather than look “bigoted.”
Charley- Orthodox Jews aren’t Biblical Jews. We follow both the written and the oral Torah. Every rabbi I’ve spoken to has said there is no transgression in being openly bisexual as long one channels one’s sexual behavior into the marital bed.
Nikko- I am not a convert. I have been Jewish my entire life. Please provide some evidence for your bizarre assertion that Orthodox Judaism advocates the death penalty for homosexual acts. Can you link me to any Orthodox Jew, in Israel or America, proposing that gay sex be a capital crime? Or are you saying that because of Leviticus 18:22? As mentioned above, Judaism is a rabbinic, not a Biblical, religion. Can you provide evidence that any gay couple was ever executed by a Jewish court? I have never seen any – and I’ve looked. If you can neither show that any Jews have ever executed someone for gay sex, nor show any Orthodox Jew advocating the death penalty for gay sex, your accusation is simply slander and is about as legitimate as the homophobes who blather on about “Gay Bowel Syndrome.”
Nikko claims that people have to agree with me – “or else.” If that were true, how come most of the comments at GaysDefendMarriage.com disagree with me? I have the right as site owner to delete their comments – or even edit them – if I want. I want the smartest people on both sides of this issue to make the best arguments possible. That’s the quickest way to get to the truth.
Jaroslaw is right – I have many pro-gay positions. I’m the most outspoken person the gay community opposing prison rape, which disproportionately affects gay and bi men and trans women. Don’t believe me? Google “prison rape” and “gay issue.” I strongly oppose the FDA’s ban on gay blood and Florida’s ban on gay adoption. As soon as such a thing is legal, I would like to see a nationwide ban on aborting babies because one believes they will grow up to be gay. I am shocked at the sluggish response of LGBT organizations to the dreadful disease syphilis, which is most often contracted through gay sex. So my “gay agenda” doesn’t exactly match that of the Human Rights Campaign, but can you really say my voice doesn’t deserve to be part of the mix?
nikko
David, I appreciate your response-. I met fundie christians in particular when it comes to people being told what to believe, not so much orthodox judaism. However, I’m stil not clear. Are you agains same sex sex-ever? What do you mean by being openly bisexual butmarried and follow the jewish law? So you can never be sexually intimate with another male??! Oh vey!! .Oh, I can just see that delicious picture of King David ans Jonathan….aaah.
David Benkof
Nikko-
Orthodox Judaism believes all males are forbidden to have male-male anal intercourse, and all people are forbidden to enter same-sex marriages. Jewish males are forbidden from any sexual activity that will arouse them with another male, and Jewish females are forbidden from some but not all kinds of erotic behaviors with other women. In addition, most but not all rabbis believe Jewish males must marry and have children. So you are correct, I can never be sexually intimate with another male.
nikko
Then as I have written, you are anti-gay by definition. What’s the point of all this for you, then??!! I reject those teachings as clearly from man, though I value some teachings as being from god,both old and new testament.