Caitlyn Jenner’s appearance on the season premiere of The Ellen DeGeneres Show yesterday has many people talking about the self-described traditionalist’s views on same-sex marriage. Although Jenner admitted that in the past she didn’t understand the desire for marriage equality, she has since evolved…sort of.
“If that word marriage is really, really that important to you, then I can go with it,” Jenner stated as she made air quotes with her hand while saying the word marriage during the sit-down with Ellen.
While the 65-year-old Republican chose her words carefully in an effort to be as diplomatic as possible, DeGeneres was not buying it. The talk show host made the observation during their chat that Jenner still didn’t seem on board with the topic. She elaborated further during yesterday’s edition of The Howard Stern Show.
“She still has a judgment about gay marriage,” a baffled DeGeneres told Stern. The comedienne noted that Jenner wants people to understand and accept her while she still has a judgment about gay people and marriage.
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Stern and his co-host Robin Quivers considered it remarkable that Jenner, after hiding for most of her life, wants to be herself and does not want to be ridiculed, yet would state she doesn’t understand gay marriage.
Even though Caitlyn might be a traditionalist at heart, there was one tradition she did not want to uphold during her time with Ellen. DeGeneres revealed that Jenner didn’t dance with her, a routine gesture that many of her guests engage in while on her show. “Maybe she didn’t want to dance with me because I’m a lesbian,” deadpanned the comedic host.
The interview with Ellen might have some people scratching their heads as the former Olympian continues to stand by her traditional and conservative belief system; however, Ellen provided some brilliant insight when she joked, “She’s Republican and conservative, and I think a lot of Republicans are wishing she wasn’t Republican.”
Watch the clip of Caitlyn Jenner explaining her position on gay marriage onThe Ellen DeGeneres Show below:
AtticusBennett
she’s a republican, and still seeks the approval of the republican establishment. it’s the whole conservative “i only care about what i think pertains to me” thing. it’s nuts.
Jonathon Popphan
This is why I never got on board with all of the Caitlyn-worship. #bigot
Masc Pride
Lol @ the air quotes. How telling! Let’s hear what song all the militant “Caitlyn” fans are singing now.
Billy Budd
Completely insane and conflicted. I feel sorry for her.
Bauhaus
Jenner is a complete turn off. Yuck. Yep, there are idiotic assholes in all walks of life, LGBT included.
Mercurical Memo
The real idiots are LGBT who canonized this dope as some kind of hero just because she transitioned. It’s always been mesmerizing how reactionary gay men especially are, radical queer trans activists just as dumb. When gay men didn’t reflect that when blacks experience state sanctioned violence, they didn’t for minute THINK that it was only a matter of time till a Kim Davis would come around? Jesus it’s baffling how myopic and stupid gay men are sometimes.
Continue salivating over that hetero like dogs fellas.
Just the same, that Jenner was a republican was no secret. And yet there were all the LGBT crying crocodile tears over her moving speech at the SPNY. And heaven forbid someone said anything against this attention whore because oh
My GAWD! To speak against St. Caitlyn you transphobic!
Octavio Roca
Nothing baffling here, the bitch is a Republican first, human being second.
Blackout
@Bauhaus:
Yep, there is nothing “new” about this!
I’ve talked to a lot of gay men who don’t give a flyning f**k about gay marriage/are against gay marriage! Some were Republican and some just don’t like the idea of “Marriage”!
Wasn’t Elton John against gay marriage? Back in the day!
Bauhaus
@Mercurical Memo:
There has been plenty of criticism regarding her politics. Much of the praise has been in support of her openly transitioning and living life on her own terms (admirable), not her odious political positions. Her speech was moving, which is why her views on marriage is baffling. Some of what was said about her on here WAS transphobic, and had nothing to do with her idiotic position on marriage equality.
Mercurical Memo
@Bauhaus: no. Transitioning makes as much a hero and admirable as it does me for living my life in my own terms by giving men rim jobs. Give a break. Moving speeches mean nothing either. Hitler have moving speeches. They inspired a Jewish lesbian named Gertrude Stein who supported Hitler even in his treatment of the Jews. Glenn Beck gives moving speeches, he even gets weepy. And his legions of fans are certainly inspired by him. Why is St. Caitlyn held in a higher light? Because she transitioned? So Sarah Palin and Megyn Kelly an Ann Coulter are moving examples of women because they live and speak by their own choosing? Give me a break man. Just because one exists outside the norm and counter to mainstream culture does not a hero make. St. Caitlyn takes well after her conservative sisters in that her piece of the pie is that only thing that matters. Republicans came to discover misogyny only when megyn kelly experienced it from trump. So she deserves a medal for her feminist efforts?
Bauhaus
@Mercurical Memo:
Ahem. She’s not a hero. I said, there has been praise of her living life on her terms and transitioning openly. I find that admirable, not heroic. Your rant is ridiculous – I regret engaging with you.
Clark35
This should not be surprising to anyone. A lot of Trans people are extremely homophobic and biphobic, and against anyone that is not trans. It’s time to drop the T.
AtticusBennett
@Clark35: comments like yours are only ever made by broken wimps who hate transgender people in hopes that their shi**y parents will be less ashamed to have a gay son.
drop the T? never. and the good news is, since sickless cowards like you are confined to making anonymous rambles on the internet “dropping the T” will never, ever, happen.
Jeremy Kinser
@Clark35:
Here’s a reminder that I didn’t realize was necessary: If you post transphobic comments on this site, you’ll have your commenting privileges removed without warning. It’s possible to be critical of Jenner, or any other LGBT person, without resorting to transphobic remarks.
Mark Ilvonen
why does anybody care about Jenner’s opinion? Just go away already.
Clark35
@AtticusBennett: LMAO keep assuming all that BS about me that’s not even true, you post the same shit daily. What I wrote is true and I even know trans people who think that the T should be separate from LGB but I’m sure you’ll think they are full of self loathing or whatever other nonsense you troll on about here since you have no life.
Clark35
@Jeremy Kinser: Nothing I have posted is transphobic. It is true however that a lot of trans people and trans-activists hate gays, bisexual people, lesbians, heterosexuals, and anyone that’s not trans.
Mercurical Memo
@Bauhaus: Why? why is my rant ridiculous, because the parallels between her and Megyn Kelly are on par? Because I refuse to bow down to her Holiness St. Caitlyn Patron Saint of Trans Lives? Seriously?
This person does not deserve a shred of ‘admiration’. Megyn kelly suffered quite a sexist lashing when Lou Dobson and Erick Erikson both ganged up on her. Both Lou and Erick suggested that women who work instead of being at home with their children risked having ill-grown children. And there was Megyn Kelly standing up for the WOMAN cause by defending views generally attributed to Feminists. Just like Caitlyn Jenner here, Kelly flat out mention that she is not a feminist. St. Caitlyn couldn’t be bothered with the issues of trans people or gay, lesbian and bisexual people for that matter. And as of recent Megyn kelly was the victim of sexist abuse by Donald Trump. Out came all the Republican crazies -Erick Erickson included- for the anti-sexist cause. Right? The same Republicans that St. Caitlyn here supports.
So pointing that out, that is ridiculous to you? So we should all give her a standing ovation and clap because she cares so much about the poor hapless trans children?
You know what hurts the Transchildren? How about a Police force that commits violence against people of colour indiscriminately, because, I know this might come as a shock, LGBT people, trans included are also Black too. I know right. Mind Blown. You know what else would help the transchildren? How about a redistribution of wealth that does not make transition as easy for some as for others. Especially those who have been living off the avails of a bunch of attention whores with nothing to contribute to society, whose every action is meant to garner headlines and attention. How about the poor transchildren who go hungry in schools, who cannot afford healthcare, whose parents cannot afford the rent. Because in the end those very policies that the republican party endorse that criminalize the poor, the racialized, marginalized, disabled, and so forth, directly affect LGBTRANS people of colour, with disability, working poor, homeless, etc.
But you didn’t think that did you. You were just swept up in her beautiful words and her ‘admirable’ open transition. Nevermind how much she’s cashing in by transitioning so openly.
Yeah, you go St. Caitlyn crusading for the trans cause! So admirable.
Bob LaBlah
Thank you Ellen. Thank you for having Bruce on your show. This guy slowly and methodically planned this whole charade and a lot of people are beginning to look back and wonder HOW did they not connect all the dots. Those photos taken of him were planned down to the second. Why would you wear a thong and let the whole world see it at age 65? I mean really. A dress and heels or a full length mink coat with earrings I could have saw but a PINK THONG? Then came the b/s pictures of what appeared to be a bra under the sweater. I said then this guy was full of it and for all to wait and see.
By the way, does ANYONE know where are the transgender activists who had no problem slamming Rupaul about “she mail” but seem to be criminally absent in the case of Jenner and his views?
Mercurical Memo
@Bob LaBlah: “By the way, does ANYONE know where are the transgender activists who had no problem slamming Rupaul about “she mail” but seem to be criminally absent in the case of Jenner and his views?”
Well fucking said! Here was Rupaul, a true trail blazer and he was horrifically crucified, called TRANSPHOBIC because he added a sense of humour to his identity.
Clark35
@Mercurical Memo: Meh, they’re trans activists and this is more the reason why the T should be dropped from LGB.
Jacqueline Paul
In the U.K. quite a few gay intellectuals are not for gay marriage…
Clark35
@AtticusBennett: You just love to project your own issues about yourself and your family onto random strangers when you troll.
Bob LaBlah
@Mercurical Memo: Personally, were I Rupaul, I think I would start asking questions along that line. Their deafening silence on Jenner to me is proof that they amount to nothing more than a group who proved they were motivated more by jealousy and frustration than rights. I still don’t see how the word shemail was offensive. It was an obvious jibe and email. It might be because of embarrassment.
Masc Pride
@Clark35: Jeremy only patrols the site with the zero tolerance threats when comes to trans-related stories. Interesting how Mr. Kinser and the other Queerty editors are always conveniently absent and silent when gay and trans members are bashing bisexuals…and everyone else.
Mercurical Memo
@Clark35: You actually DO have a point. There are many, many, many trans-activists who want nothing to do with LGB issues and who do in fact feel that gay men especially have nothing to relate to their realities/issues. That’s a fact.
Back to Rupaul for a second, I find it quite funny that these trans activists that gave Rupaul a lot of flack over using words like ‘She-Mail’ and ‘Trannie’ were people who just discovered trans-activism. Meanwhile, Rupaul who has been in the trenches for far longer than these people have been born had the audacity to call him a transphobe? And even funnier is that half these people that subscribe to sanctimonious and rigid standards of PC politics had no qualms about showing this black person where their place is. Nothing to say of just how problematic that was.
Transmen such as Max Wolf Valerio, Patrick Califia and even Chaz Bono subscribe to the most reductive definitions of masculinity. Max Wolf Valerio going so far as to suggest that ever since he transitioned to being a man, he sympathizes with the urge to rape. Patrick Califia endorses pedophilia and pederasty.
If cisgendered, straight white men said the things that these transmen writers/activists say we would be neutering them. But somehow espousing those views are ok as far as transmen are concerned. And when the Lesbian community called out the sexism and chauvenism in Max Wolf Valerio they were branded as transphobic by the trans activists that endorse Max Wolf Valerio
Jeremy Kinser
@Masc Pride:
Not true. If you’ll direct me toward any comments that include hate rhetoric toward any LGBT person I’ll gladly investigate whether it’s in violation of our TOS.
Mercurical Memo
@Jacqueline Paul: Yes, gay people were against gay marriage. That’s a prerogative of gay people. Frankly, I WOULD NEVER get married. Already my life is too complicated to even have a boyfriend, or a friend with benefits, nevermind actual marriage. That’s MY PREROGATIVE.
Am I, as a gay man allowed to say who is and is not allowed to transition? Should I, as a gay man be allowed to call out the morality of another person’s life? Could I as a gay man be allowed to say whether or not trans-people should be able to get married? Could I as a gay man be allowed to say at what age people should start taking hormones?
Think through your words.
A gay academic can be against gay marriage all they want.
All they want.
Can a gay academic be against state funded transition and supplying of hormones?
Think that through.
If your answer is no, then think through why Caitlyn Jenner’s words matter. Why her upper-class voice that can afford amazing plastic surgeons, designer outfits, make-up artists and professional hair stylists matter. Think through, why someone in a bubble espousing the views that affect a group of people under scrutiny that do not necessarily have the financial means and financial protections that she does, matter.
Mercurical Memo
Yup. Here’s St. Caitlyn fighting the good war!!
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/caitlyn-jenner-conservative_55be5945e4b0b23e3ce31979
RiBrad
@Jeremy Kinser: I’m at a loss as to how @Clark35 ‘s comment could be considered transphobic. It is a legitimate discussion about the politics of gay and trans rights. LGB rights are about sexuality, whereas T rights are about gender. Trans activists (both male and female) would probably find their causes more aligned with the Feminist movement. We all want acceptance for all LGBQTI people. To suggest that we sometimes prioritise our issues differently (i.e. same-sex marriage) and therefore perhaps our political movements are veering away from each other is not homophobic or transphobic.
Masc Pride
@Jeremy Kinser: I think it is true. I expressed the same sentiment directly to you in another story about Jenner. But you’ve got yourself a deal, sir. I actually remember some of the stories riddled with very blatant biphobia. How should I contact you? And please don’t refer me to that holla@queerty address that does absolutely nothing at all. The flag option has proven pretty useless as well. We’re either PC warriors for everyone OR it’s anything goes. Trying to do both just winds up seeming like selective outrage.
Mercurical Memo
@RiBrad: Actually no. Trans activists hate feminists. Trans activists feel that feminists attacking ‘femininity’ is anti-trans expression. Recently bell hooks had a conversation with Laverne Cox and bell hooks called out that transwomen often take on very traditional femininity that is in accordance to patriarchy.
Well the trans lost it. All of the sudden bell hooks who has been venerated through her racism and her shallow writings was attacked because the trans people criticizing her felt that cisgendered women are not as scrutinized for their feminine expression as are transwomen. This is not true actually. Cisgendered women that adopt hyper-femininity have to felt a rejection by feminism. Some trans-writing is based on a lot of revision. It comes from the same root as Queer writing which it too is based on a lot of revision and speculation. So bell hooks FINALLY became enemy number one when she would not comply with a docile agreeable stance of trans-issues.
Gloria Steinem and Germaine Greer are other feminists that are also reviled by trans-activists. So no, not all trans-activists writers are fond of feminism as a form of politic. It seems actually trans-activists/writers want their own corner of politic away from LGB and Feminist thought.
If people here actually READ these things then they’d know them for themselves as opposed to accusing people of transphobia.
Jeremy Kinser
@RiBrad:
Clark has continually posted transphobic comments on other articles today. I’m not going to repeat them here as they’re offensive. He reposted them immediately after I deleted them.
Jeremy Kinser
@Masc Pride:
My email is [email protected].
RiBrad
@Jeremy Kinser: Oh okay, sorry I was obviously unaware of the comments that you’d deleted.
LaVada Scarlett
Lol….so does she want to marry a man or a woman? I am so confused.
Carl McClanahan
Why is she not allowed to have her own opinion ?
I know many gay and straight people who are not in favor of marriage.
Brian
Bruce Jenner’s fetish is the least of my concerns. I find it more concerning that Ellen has him on her show.
Also, why is Ellen on the Howard Stern show? Howard has been known to make what I consider to be homophobic comments. Does Ellen approve of homophobia?
Go away, Ellen.
tomtkent
If caitlyn has always, by her admission, identified as a woman hasn’t she already, at least by her own feelngs of being trapped in the wrong body, been in numerous same sex marriages? Furthermore now that she is supposed to be considered a woman by everyone , (although I don’t get it if someone still has a penis your still a man), and she is attracted to women then dosn’t that make her currently a lesbian? If she doesn’t then do we admit that she is still a man who had some plastic surgery to look feminine and get breasts and not a woman at all? Isn’t that more like a fetish? I am in no way being transphobic or,judgemental , I really don’t care and think more people should adopt that attitude, but I am truly confused.
Uppity
You know you’re not wanted when Ellen of all people disses you. Jenner is now in the uneviable position where most people simply wish she’d go away. She appears to have very little support from the lgbt community, and a sizeable chunk of straight people aren’t impressed either. The Kardashian connection, her Republican politics, and a personality which is basically unlikeable and uncharismatic all have a bearing. It won’t matter if she hires some high-powered PR firm to burnish her image, because once she’s let loose she can’t help but reveal her true self. This is a 65-year-old very set in her ways. Sadly, for us, her desire to be in the public eye coupled with a complicit media machine means she will be foisted on us for many years to come, unless of course she’s jailed for the car crash. I see comparisons with Miley Cyrus, who also appears to have a questionable level of popularity (ratings for the VMAS, which she fronted this year, were 39% down on last year’s) but who is constantly wheeled in front of us, usually for almost baring her breasts. Celebrity culture on the whole has become very tiresome.
Lisbeth Solis
Not surprised; life was always about Bruce’s needs, and now it’s all about Caitlyn’s.
Douglas Schlitz
Hypocrite, media whore, self righteous, seems all,of the above. Sorry she/he has lost credibility completely.
Acting like a spoiled brat !
robho3
Caitlin – publicity whore maybe make another E sitcom about it.
Jacob23
Maybe I am committing thoughtcrime, but I agree 100% with the commenters above who point out the incredible degree of anti-gay hatred and homophobia among transgenders. Anyone who doubts this need only peruse a few popular trans-only blogs and your doubts will be removed. Since the vast majority of transgenders are straight, it really should not be a surprise that, like non-trans straight people, a lot of them harbor anti-gay prejudice. The hatred is magnified, however, by the creation of “LGBT” in the 1990s. This invention created a sense of entitlement among trans activists. They now saw themselves in a position to make non-negotiable demands on LGBs. We were no longer friends who might help, but a labor force to command. When these lofty expectations are not met, they become enraged. And even when LGBs do their bidding, the road to political success is often long and filled with obstacles. When there are delays or failures, they blame us, as if we are their parents or guardians.
I think with Jenner, we are dealing more with the former source of homophobia than the latter. It would be very interesting if, at some point, stories come out about how the athlete Bruce Jenner treated gay people back in the 70s and 80s. And Jenner is by no means the only transgender celeb to oppose marriage equality. The famous trans tennis star, Renee Richards, denounced marriage equality and told the NY Times that it would corrupt the institution. These are the people that “LGBT” forces us to serve. We don’t need to drop the T. We need to acknowledge that T was never legitimately linked with LGB in the first place.
Avery Alvarez
@Masc Pride: Take some Midol, “amiga”. You seem extra-sensitive to this issue. Did your wittle fee-fees get hurt?
DarkZephyr
I don’t think Caitlyn said anything that was so horrifyingly bad, nor do I think that Ellen hates her. Caitlyn has changed her opinion on the issue and I am glad that she has. Hopefully in time she will evolve in other ways as well.
DarkZephyr
@Masc Pride: I noticed that you placed Caitlyn’s name in quotation marks. Why is that?
Jesse Santillano
So tired of this hater.
Bauhaus
@tomtkent:
“If caitlyn has always, by her admission, identified as a woman hasn’t she already, at least by her own feelngs of being trapped in the wrong body, been in numerous same sex marriages?”
Exactly. She dodges questions regarding her sexual orientation, but I assume she entered all of her marriages to women, as a woman. In other words, she’s been same-sex married many times herself. Yet, she isn’t quite *there* for others to have the same privilege she has had, giving “tradition and her age” as the reason. What bunk. Tradition has never stopped her from her own serial same-sex marriages.
Jenner is full of crap.
Bob LaBlah
@Bauhaus: “Yet, she isn’t quite *there* for others to have the same privilege she has had, giving “tradition and her age” as the reason. What bunk. Tradition has never stopped her from her own serial same-sex marriages.
Jenner is full of crap.”
I am shocked that you were allowed to tell the truth without it being deleted. It is no longer odd in my mind how, when this THING first appeared on the scene, on nearly EVERY social media site (including this one) ANY comments questioning “its” motives were deleted. People are now beginning to realize not only how accurate that last sentence in your comment IS but how did they not see these things before. If he never said he was gay why does the gay media treat him as though he has something to say that benefits the community? I always thought it was suppose to be a two way street but obvious when it comes to this social experiment the rules are bent.
rikard
it’s sad and hilarious by turns. ive been a big fan of Bruce since my crushable closeted gay boyhood. i’m respectful of Cait because i did a lot of soul searching and developed tender feelings for the marginalized and a diva sized rage against injustice. i came out at 40 with no experimentation with men before that and little experience with women. between the whipe male privelidge and my insecurity i was a wreck. i get her clumsiness. i feel for her in her haste to figure everything out NOW. she sadly is a ridiculous narcissist and may never improve much.
Brycedavid
Chaz Bono said Ellen was too gay while Chaz was working as a spokesperson for GLAAD. She was fired. Kelly Malonie has said some pretty disparaging stuff against gays before transitioning. Janet Mock, who’s book was supposed to have been called Fish Parts, said Trans issues are not gay issues and didn’t want any part of it. Caitlyn never lifted a dainty finger for gays as Bruce and was (still is) against marriage equality. There’s a boycott for the upcoming STONEWALL film and the Stonewall statues were defaced, all by Trans activists. Jeff White had to resign from the LGBT group he founded because of Trans bullying. And Queerty’s editor warns us of ‘transphobic’ comments?
Brycedavid
Tras woman writes: Why it’s time to take the T out of LGBT
http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/why-its-time-to-take-the-t-out-of-lgbt-10493352.html
Bob LaBlah
@Brycedavid: Thank you for bringing that incident up. Not only did I not know this happened but I can’t believe how no one in the media took it seriously. It seems (after a google search) the Advocate was the only one who called it what it was, VANDALISM. All the rest of the gay media white washed the incident to the point where you wonder why did they even bother reporting on it.
I do not like the way the media in the ENTIRE country has morphed into a “if it doesn’t suit us, then we will either not print it or report on it in a way where it minimizes the reaction of those effected by it because it will be to embarrassing for some”. That just how I see the media. The NY Times, the NY Post, the NY Daily News all went missing in action on that one. Its a damn shame too.
Cam
In other words, everybody should accept everything Jenner wants them to about herself, but she has no problem belittling and mocking rights for OTHER minorities.
Yep, she’s a republican.
onthemark
@Jeremy Kinser: I can understand your deleting transphobic comments. But (a) it’s confusing if they’re deleted before most readers even see them. And (b) were they flagged?
I’ve understood flagging to be more for viciously personal attacks that violate the comment policy – as with a certain, recently departed poster – although I’ve occasionally used it for instance in the case of “HIV doesn’t exist” remarks, so I can imagine personally flagging a really bad anti-trans comment. But did anyone actually do that? Trans people do not even seem to read this site in any significant numbers, since they hardly ever comment here. (A few months ago we had a parody poster who obviously wasn’t really trans.)
Now I’m curious: does the flag button DO anything? The comment policy itself is great (or would be), it’s just that enforcement seems so totally arbitrary and random.
alanMCclever
and this is who we gave a hero award to… I was against it then and I am still against it, even more so now…