Ken Mehlman, who was the 2004 campaign manager for President George W. Bush and former chairman of the Republican National Committee, is coming out. Oh, and now he wants to be a gay marriage advocate. The same guy who helped spearhead the Republicans’ horrific assault on gay Americans? Yep, that guy.
It’s a new realization, says Mehlman to The Atlatnic Mark Ambinder, and not something he’s been purposefully hiding. “It’s taken me 43 years to get comfortable with this part of my life. Everybody has their own path to travel, their own journey, and for me, over the past few months, I’ve told my family, friends, former colleagues, and current colleagues, and they’ve been wonderful and supportive. The process has been something that’s made me a happier and better person. It’s something I wish I had done years ago.” Plenty of folks are rolling their eyes at the comment, knowing Mehlman himself knew for years he’s gay.
Mehlman, who headed the RNC from 2005-07 after the Bush campaign, and who previously served as White House political director during Bush’s first term, is arguably the highest profile Republican to ever come out. He is also arguably America’s most heinous homosexual, actively participating in and driving the demonization of his own community in exchange for political applause and cold hard cash.
It’s a strange albeit not unheard of revelation from a guy whose boss was put in office by rallying conservative voters with anti-gay fear tactics. But Bush “was no homophobe,” Mehlman insists. (He is might be technically correct: Bush might not fear gays, but he certainly doesn’t like them.)
And that’s where the never-married lifelong Republican says he regrets not coming out sooner.
Mehlman’s leadership positions in the GOP came at a time when the party was stepping up its anti-gay activities — such as the distribution in West Virginia in 2006 of literature linking homosexuality to atheism, or the less-than-subtle, coded language in the party’s platform (“Attempts to redefine marriage in a single state or city could have serious consequences throughout the country…”). Mehlman said at the time that he could not, as an individual Republican, go against the party consensus. He was aware that Karl Rove, President Bush’s chief strategic adviser, had been working with Republicans to make sure that anti-gay initiatives and referenda would appear on November ballots in 2004 and 2006 to help Republicans.
Mehlman acknowledges that if he had publicly declared his sexuality sooner, he might have played a role in keeping the party from pushing an anti-gay agenda. “It’s a legitimate question and one I understand,” Mehlman said. “I can’t change the fact that I wasn’t in this place personally when I was in politics, and I genuinely regret that. It was very hard, personally.” He asks of those who doubt his sincerity: “If they can’t offer support, at least offer understanding.” “What I do regret, and think a lot about, is that one of the things I talked a lot about in politics was how I tried to expand the party into neighborhoods where the message wasn’t always heard. I didn’t do this in the gay community at all.”
Might have? Heh.
Not that professional outer Mike Rogers didn’t try to force him out earlier, and not that Bill Maher didn’t out him on national television.
But let’s gussy up the story now, so Mehlner looks better than he should.
Because his tenure as RNC chairman and his time at the center of the Bush political machine coincided with the Republican Party’s attempts to exploit anti-gay prejudices and cement the allegiance of social conservatives, his declaration to the world is at once a personal act and an act of political speech. “I wish I was where I am today 20 years ago. The process of not being able to say who I am in public life was very difficult. No one else knew this except me. My family didn’t know. My friends didn’t know. Anyone who watched me knew I was a guy who was clearly uncomfortable with the topic,” he said.
During the Rogers crusades, many news organizations made attempts to confirm rumors and stories about Mehlman’s sexuality. Republicans close to Mehlman either said they did not know, or that it did not matter, or that the question was offensive. Mehlman once joked in public that although he was not gay, the rumors put a crimp on his social life. He admits to having mislead several people who asked him directly.
And what does he plan to do now that he’s come out? Get behind your equality mission within the GOP: “What I will try to do is to persuade people, when I have conversations with them, that it is consistent with our party’s philosophy, whether it’s the principle of individual freedom, or limited government, or encouraging adults who love each other and who want to make a lifelong committment to each other to get married. I hope that we, as a party, would welcome gay and lesbian supporters. I also think there needs to be, in the gay community, robust and bipartisan support [for] marriage rights.”
Mehlman now lives NYC’s Chelsea in a multi-million dollar condo, and makes a fortunte working in private equity for KKR: Kohlberg Kravis & Roberts. But he’s already trying to make amends, hosting an upcoming fundraiser and for the American Foundation for Equal Rights (the group behind the Prop 8 lawsuit), which means you can’t entirely hate the guy, because he’s doing his part to make good for his sins, right?
(AFER head Chad Griffin insists “when we achieve equal equality, he will be one of the people to thank for it.” That is — holy christ — the statement of the year.)
Fearing his coming out would leak, he had already notified his closest confidants, including Bush, before going to the press and arranging his reveal with Ambinder.
Well, welcome to the party, fella. Well, if you can get past Rogers first:
So, how can Ken Mehlman redeem himself? I want to hear from Ken that he is sorry for being the architect of the 2004 Bush reelection campaign. I want to hear from Ken that he is sorry for his role in developing strategy that resulted in George W. Bush threatening to veto ENDA or any bill containing hate crimes laws. I want to hear from Ken that he is sorry for the pressing of two Federal Marriage Amendments as political tools. I want to hear from Ken that he is sorry for developing the 72-hour strategy, using homophobic churches to become political arms of the GOP before Election Day.
And those state marriage amendments. I want to hear him apologize for every one of those, too.
And then there is one other little thing. You see, while you and I had the horrible feelings of being treated so poorly by our President, while teens were receiving the messaging ‘gay is bad’ giving them ‘permission’ to gay bash, while our rights were being stripped state by state, Ken was out there laughing all the way to the bank. So, if Ken is really sorry, and he very well may be, then all he needs to do is sell his condo and donate the funds to the causes he worked against so hard for all those years. He’s done a lot of damage to a lot of organizations, while making a lot of moeny. A LOT of money. It’s time to put his money where his mouth is. Ken Mehlman is sitting in a $3,770,000.00 (that’s $3.77 million) condo in Chelsea while we have lost our right to marry in almost 40 states.
THEN, and only then, should Mehlman be welcomed into our community.
Rogers is right. This is a man who actively participated in ruining the lives of LGBT Americans. That he didn’t know (or so he says) he was gay at the time is of absolutely no importance. It doesn’t excuse his behavior. It does not bring him closer to deserving forgiveness. Mehlman’s attempt at salvation would be akin to a racist white man who railed against blacks only to find out his grandmother is East Africa, or a neo-Nazi who spread filth about Jews only to learn his mother is one — and had a change of heart about their hatred.
This man aided in Republican terrorism of people like you and me. That he now happens to say publicly he is sexually attracted to other men does little to excuse the damage he’s caused. And it’ll take more than raising a million bucks for AFER to ever associate his name with “do-gooder.”
So, who’s gonna be willing to stamp his gay card? Not me. The man is a disgrace — as a human first, as a gay man second.
Ok, congratulations on coming out, hope you’re happy, etc. etc. etc. But, I honestly don’t think I will ever comprehend the whole gay AND republican thing. Just sayin’
“…or encouraging adults who love each other and who want to make a lifelong committment to each other to get married.”
And yet another conservative Republican that supports full marriage equality. How many have we heard about in the past year?
Meanwhile, we wait for Obama…
What a sympathetic portrayal of a guy who really messed up our lives in a palpable and historic way!!! Where’s the snark now Rupert? Typical of the new Queer-in-name-only-ty. Mason has done nothing to us as a group except prove that AIDS/hiv is still an issue of concern for all us and he is put on your site for ridicule. Yet, this guy gets a pretty glossy editorial free expose. YOU SUCK Queer-in-name-only-ty.
Since you’re spilling all kinds of personal secrets, Ken, dear, pray confess how Jeff Gannon, a gay porn star turned hardcore right-wing ideologue, manage to work himself into the White House press corps? Was it, like Vanity Fair & others have said, because he was fucking a very powerful White House insider? Was it you, you treacherous tool? Amazing how y’all Republican psychos “find your true self” and admit what everyone already knows ONLY after you’ve left your position of influence, instead of back when you could have made a huge difference while still in power. Now that no one cares a flying shitball about you and you’re just dying to get that same attention you once had, you find a way to soothe your guilty conscience & come out simultaneously. Fuck you, your former bosses & your disgusting actions (funding anti-gay attacks in every Red State as well as nationally.) It would be one thing if you were a closeted Republican who didn’t open his whore mouth about gays like yourself and simply lived a quite life within your Party but you attacked your own every chance you got to help elect people who hated you and others like you. For what? Money? Power? There is no difference between you and the Jews who cooperated with the Nazis in WWII. You are a fucking ass cunt! Burn in hell bitch!!
Thank you James for supplying the proper editorial spin this article deserved. What has happened to this site? It stopped being queer and is starting to read like Murdoch’s Post.
Wow – look at the hatred and intolerance in these posts already. It’s only been 30 minutes since this article was posted.
It’s funny how a large group within the gay population will let Democrats get away with just about anything. But, the hatred and intolerance comes out if the person is a conservative.
I remember Bill Maher outing this guy on Larry King years ago.
Well, fuck him. I don’t buy that Ken suddenly had a real emotional or mental transformation after leaving politics. When he was in politics he was fucking over the country and the gay community because it profited himselfand his disgusting cronies. Now that he’s left politics he’s just changing his approach because he has different incentives. He’s probably hoping that he’ll be embraced as a big gay hero and get some fame and hot tail from this.
@CJ: You’re a huge moron. The Republicans are ones whose electoral strategies are completely predicated on demonizing some minority group. One year it’s gays, the next it’s illegals, now it’s muslims. Maybe if hatred and intolerance weren’t written into the Republican/Teahadist platform, they wouldn’t be the object of our scor,
And you moron, name one CURRENT GOP office holder who as come out in favor of Marriage Equality. Olsen is no longer solicitor gen, Cheney, thank ALLAH, is no longer VP, and this fruitcake is no longer the head of the RNC.
Aww. are some gay teabaggers upset over my post? the truth hurts, don’t it?
When I first heard of a Bush insider “coming out” I was thinking, “Okay, I will give him a chance. We all need to come out on our own time and try to reconcile our past positions with where we are now.” But after reading his non-apology justification… and that he regrets not pushing the Rethuglican party further into the gay community??? Mike Rogers hit it on the head. Until he does everything on Rogers’ list, he will always be the right’s little bitch.
@rrr: the only tail he will get is from some sad closet Republican ferrett who is just like him.
Sometimes I have to wonder about the reading comprehension skills of some here. Did you even read everything that JD wrote? Seriously, it’s only a few paragraphs. It shouldn’t take you that long. Now that you have, please tell me that you still think it’s a “sympathetic portrayal”. Changed your mind? Thought so. Jesus Christ.
Another Republican coming out as gay? This is a very dangerous and unsettling development. Imagine what would happen if the Democratic party had to compete with Republicans for the gay vote. Why, they might actually have to DO SOMETHING for us.
Get back in the closet, douchebag. We don’t want you.
a day late and a dollar short, mary…
Self-Hating Queen. I never realized she was in the closet. The minute she stepped into day light you could read her.
PLAYS WELL WITH OTHERS
Fuck this vile reprehensive scumbag and his suddenly Judy Friendly like take on all things Gay…….I realize the path to accepting who you are takes some folks decades. Many people both male and female know they are Gay but because of family or community just cannot utter the words “I am Gay”. To a person they all acknowledge they always knew they were Gay yet could not bring themselves to act upon their feelings. I can offer sympathy towards those people, many of whom become active, happy, satisfied members of the Gay community.
Those whom should recieve no quarter from the Gay community are those mostly republican (sorry thats the way it is) people who suddenly come out after carving a path of hurt and heartache for the Gay community. Those like this little douchefag who activelly pursued, encourged, instigated, and assisted in the persecution and harm of the Gay community. I have no idea why they choose to harm their own kind. And I really don’t want to hear the crock of shit argument that “thats the way the party tilts” There are plenty of republicans who have been elected who haven’t been elected on the platform of wanting to burn everyone of their Gay constitutints at the stake. This scumbag has encouraged fire breathing minsiters to spew vile hatred from the pulpit every week against all things Gay. We have a tremendous battle for Gay marriage because so many states have laws on the books directley because of the actions of this scumbag. Thousands of Gay teens have been cast out of their homes, forced to sell their cocks for cash to survive and even commited suicide because he and his kind perpetuated the evil dogma that being Gay is a sin and wrong and there is no redemption for us……….
He and his kind have Gay blood on their hands, don’t now come to my community and ask that we accept your bloody hand………..
He is evil. Hits mid-life and figures he can’t make any more money hiding – what an asshole! Roy Cohn must have been his role model.
This is why Mike Rogers gave Mehlman the Roy Cohn Award.
Gay + Republican= Oxymoronic, Self Hating, Disgusting Son of a Whore!
D'oh, The Magnificent
@rrr: You understand correctly. The idiot gay men who so desperately need someone, anyone to give them validation, even an asshole like this are quite sad.
I have very little sympathy for him and his ‘struggle’. Desperate for his Mommy and Daddy’s love he embraced their conservative values. I wonder what Mommy and Daddy will think now.
The only way I could dislike him more is if he aligns himself with GOProud.
Go away, Ken. I hope we never have to see you again.
When will my people realize… THE REPUBLICAN PARTY DOES NOT WANT YOU OR YOUR VOTES.
Mehlman is a self loathing homosexual Republican bigot.
He’ll get no sympathy or forgiveness from us.
Obama is a political hustler who sells out to the highest bidder. He get lots of hugs and kisses from sellout Obots because they support this bigotry, wars, etc.
The history of Obama’s twists and turns regarding same sex marriage
1996: In response to a questionnaire from Outlines newspaper (now part of Windy City Times), Obama, a candidate for the Illinois state senate seat representing the wealthy Hyde Park neighborhood of Chicago, writes, “I favor legalizing same-sex marriages, and would fight efforts to prohibit such marriages.”
1998: Responding to an Illinois State Legislative National Political Awareness Test: “Q: Do you believe that the Illinois government should recognize same-sex marriages? A: Undecided.”
2004: In an interview with Windy City Times, Obama mentions the religious dimension of the gay marriage debate, says he supports civil unions, and indicates that his stance is dictated in large part by political strategy…
2006: In his bestseller, The Audacity of Hope, Obama, now a U.S. senator, explains his support for civil unions, again mentioning religion and noting the strategic problems that the push for gay marriage poses.
2008: At Rick Warrens bigotfest Obama said ” For me as a Christian, it is a sacred union. God’s in the mix…” Barak Obama, bigot
Obama’s position on same-sex marriage is identical to that of “Miss California”, Carrie Prejean, who said “I think that I believe that a marriage should be between a man and a woman. No offense to anybody out there but that’s how I was raised and that’s how I think it should be between a man and a woman…” Carrie Prejean, bigot
Besides Prejean, the Teabaggers agree with Obama’s bigoted stand on same sex marriage [img]http://media.sacbee.com/smedia/2010/01/11/12/GayMarriage10.standalone.prod_affiliate.[/img]
In an interview with MTV, Obama says he opposes Prop 8, but also gay marriage. Civil unions, the candidate says, are sufficient: “I have stated my opposition to [Prop 8]. I think it is unnecessary. I believe that marriage is between a man and woman and I am not in favor of gay marriage…”
2010 : After the Perry decision, which struck down Prop 8, the White House said “The president has spoken out in opposition to Proposition 8 because it is divisive and discriminatory. He will continue to promote equality for LGBT Americans.” Meanwhile, White House senior adviser David Axelrod tells MSNBC that Obama “ does oppose same-sex marriage, but he supports equality for gay and lesbian couples. … He supports civil unions. That’s been his position throughout. So nothing has changed.”
Timeline date from http://www.tnr.com/blog/jonathan-chait/77120/what-does-obama-really-think-about-gay-marriage-telling-timeline and other sources. Emphasis mine.
How predictably quaint it is to see all of the usual angry, ANONYMOUS posters here spewing hot venomous acid over a powerful, high-ranking Republican (Ewww, Republican!! Boo Hiss!!!) deciding to publicly come out as a gay man. Let’s all pretend like there’s no such thing as homophobia in America and be mercilessly judgemental towards one of our own.
Way to encourage other closeted gay Republicans (or whoever else) to come out and join the “welcoming” and “tolerant” gay “community”. LMFAO.
Thanks for adding the proper editorial spin!
D'oh, The Magnificent
@Kieran: If those other closeted Republicans were the authors and leadership of those who caused oppression of other gay people, I can safely say I don’t give a shit if you rot. What’s predictable is the Roy Cohn Brigade, which runs into every conversation preaching “openness” when they really mean “just for me.” No one buys the bullshit you are peddling unless they are themselves subject to some serious emotional issues. Sadly, that’s a plurality of the gay community in our society given the assault that it receives from just being gay. BUT, that’s never going to fly with those of us with enough self esteem to not require everyone out there, bigot supporters or not, love us. What’s truly sad is the desperation implicit in the idea of accepting this guy. “We so desperately need them to like us at all cost. Please like us. Please.”
I read it, idiot. I believe he updated the story shortly after the fourth comment. You can go back to your closet now.
Kieran makes me laugh out loud. Oh, the poor closeted Republicans! I feel so sorry for them! oh, how sad. Who will save them? Kiernan, you make me sick.
@Kieran: Republican homohaters, whether ‘homosexual’ or not are just as despicable as their Dem counterparts. What’s so difficult about that?
I believe this is called the Uncle Tom Two-Step.
seriously? we are gonna be all apoplectic over this? isn’t this EXACTLY what we want? enemies becoming ALLIES? i agree he WAS scum….as many pointed out in the other thread as well. BUT, fear of yourself can cause people to do awful things. He DID them. Now, he is trying to right the wrong. We should encourage him to do so. And point to his involement as further proof that we ARE on the right side of history….and this ISN’T a left-right, dem-rep, issue. Everyone has a past. We can either welcome him for a better FUTURE or we can have a tantrum and banish him to his past.
He has much to do to earn our trust, granted. But, WTF is wrong with us if we don’t allow him—and encourage him—to do just that
PLAYS WELL WITH OTHERS
@Kieran: Nothing personal but you are seriously need to run down to the clue store and buy a whole bunch. Because I am afraid you don’t seem to possess a single one……..
How predictably quaint it is to see all of the usual angry, ANONYMOUS posters here spewing hot venomous acid over a powerful, high-ranking Republican (Ewww, Republican!! Boo Hiss!!!) Maybe we need to be ANONYMOUS because of the culture of hate and fear that envelops the Gay community because of the attitutes that this scumbag and his evil cohorts have spewed upon the Gays. Many of us are afraid to come out in public because we can lose our homes, employment and famlies because of the laws enacted with direct support and influence from the likes of this self hating scumbag
“deciding to publicly come out as a gay man. Let’s all pretend like there’s no such thing as homophobia in America” We don’t need to pretend there is homohobia in America. It smacks us in the fucking faces each and every day. Because of the actions of selfloathing scum like him and his kind who encourage and aid those who hate every fiber of our being.
“and be mercilessly judgemental” The Gays thrown out of housing, fired from their jobs, The Gays beaten into comas and killed, the Gay teens tossed out of their homes peddling their cocks for survival, committing suicide because homophobes took their cues and encouragment from republican “leaders” who this scumbag worked hand in hand with. They were shown no mercy because of his evil hands……..
“towards one of our own” I feel zero need to embrace this scumbag as one of my own. Because he represents everything that makes my stomach turn. Someone who thrives upon the hatred of others simply because they live their lives differently. He could have had his struggles with his sexuality and no one would have dammed him. However he adopted the hateful vile ways of those who hate every fiber of our being and furthered their cause….
Please don’t preach we need to be “accepting” of someone like him. I am so fucking tired of being the only accepted second class citizens left in the United States because of the actions like this scumbag. “one of our own”??? I think not……..
Heaven knows I’m again the death penalty.
Yet, the tiniest bit of my brain can’t help but think that this absolute a**wipe, when I achieve absolute rule, will be one of the people I’ll have against a wall.
@cr8nguy: Mehlman’s homophobia is unforgivable – he’s a quisling.
His other problem is that he’s a card carrying member of the ruling rich, the looter class. People like him will always oppose equality because equality for GLBT folks, people of color, women, immigrant workers etc, will cost them money.
He’s no ally and never will be.
Just proves the selfishness of the people over there, he was trying to bury the community when it aided his ambitious agenda to grab power now that he has lined his pockets, he is ready to settle down and support gay marriage when he is going to benefit from it. For people like him committing evil acts is never wrong so long as your not the one impacted. Same with Dick Cheney since he has a gay daughter he is for marriage rights but killing for profit he has no problem with as long as him and his own aren’t on the chopping block. There are not very many racist in the Republican leadership but they will gleefully brandish race tinged politics for gain regardless of the negative real consequences they have on peoples lives. It makes them worse then the real racist and homophones because they know better. Ken knew better. These people care about no ones well being but their own. This man is sick and should face the same vitriol from the backwoods conservative community that he has incited to commit violence against good everyday gay people. He is responsible for me not being able to go to the park holding hands without nervousness about being attacked. Ken is a monster and so is his party. How can you even look at their ideas when the premise of their party is to turn the country against itself and destroy it from the inside out.
The fact that Mehlman is gay has been an open secret in Washington for over then years.
This guy is an absolute scumbag, he has singlehandedly contributed to designing and backing anti-LGBT laws and LGBT politicians more than almost any other modern Republican. He is truly a modern Roy Cohn. Our community should turn our back on this traitor and denounce him as the turncoat pig he is.
You know, I hate to be shallow, but sweet bejeebus on saltine, he’s busted.
@cr8nguy: This guy is not an enemy becoming an ally. This is a man that has known he was gay for decades but happily poured gasoline on the gay community for his own gain. He is not someone that didn’t know better. He knew exactly what he was doing and did it any way. He is only here now because he has already fulfilled the power hungry money making part of his life and is ready to hop in bed with boys. He is not an enemy turned ally he is a self-serving traitor that used the gay killing homophobes and GBLT community for his own personal gain.
Wastes of human space like this creep should do us all a favor, gays and conservatives alike, and just go blow his brains out and take Roy Ashburn and Larry Craig with him. I bet more than one person has killed him/herself over the behavior of these people.
@Bill Perdue: i suppose time will tell. all i’m saying is people fuck up, as he did. and that he should have the opportunity to redeem himself. or at least TRY to do so.
“Way to encourage other closeted gay Republicans (or whoever else) to come out and join the “welcoming” and “tolerant” gay “community”. LMFAO.”
If your version of tolerance is giving the people who have done everything to make your life as unlivable as possible for their own personal gain a big slap on the back and a high-five at the end of the day, then you can shove it.
Maybe he can redeem himself jumping off a bridge and leaving his wealthy estate to an LGBT charity. Then we can talk forgiveness.
@Kieran: So, now we have to be tolerant…of the intolerant bigots? Wow, you are quite a moron. Tolerance, to paraphrase another famous saying, is not a suicide pact. I DON’T have to tolerate people who hate me & want to kill me, imprison me, force me into ex-gay therapy, make me a third-class citizen or ship my Black half back to Africa. In other words, as a biracial gay, I DO NOT have to be “tolerant” of Republicans, Nazis, Evangelical Christians (& extremist Muslims), respectively. Those are different degrees of hate, granted, but they are all extremist hate organizations. Nobody could possibly be as stupid as you sound so I’m going to just assume you’re another Queerty GOP shill like Bill Perdue or you’re another psychotic Jason alias.
@reason: this is speculation. no one knows this except Ken. i’d like to exact revenge too, but let’s be grown ups here, it won’t help us at all. bitterness is a choice. if he is attempting to redeem himself by working to further our apparently shared interests….we should let him. maybe he has to spend forever redeeming himself…but why not let him.
Closet Gays, our own worst enemies in the Gay community.
In addition to Mike Rogers’ suggestions, I would insist the Mehlman:
Personally meet with the parents of at least some gay teenagers who committed suicide and tell them he is very sorry for having contributed to a climate where their child felt so despondent,
Personally meet with gay couples in long term relationships in Ohio, Virginia, California, and all the other states that have banned gay marriage and apologize for his part in getting those states to ban it.
Get on Fox News with Karl Rove and tell him straight to his face that Rove’s anti-gay policies were a cynical move to insure Bush’s reelection and tell him that he is a fucking scumbag.
I am tired of these opportunists who want their cake and eat it too — they want all the glory of a political success at our expense, then cash in, then think they just have to do a few mea culpas and they can live the carefree gay life they always wanted. Fuck him and any of his friends who continue to support him.
There isn’t enough that he can do to undo the harm he has done to our community and our country.
@Enron: Wrong, Obama is far and away our worst enemy.
@cr8nguy: Hoping that a reactionary piglet like him can undo the damage he’s done is just like trying to train a pig – it can’t be done and it just pisses off the pig.
D'oh, The Magnificent
@cr8nguy: No, see you get one part wrong. We don’t need to give him shit. He earns that by working his way up to respect like you suggest we be open to giving him. If I am reading you correctly, that’s why I keep saying you are all some cheap dates. All someone has to do is the whisper “I am out’ and you are ready to let them fuck you. I am a bit more expensive than that.
@hf2hvit: Suicide might be the ‘honorable’ thing, but these vermin are anything but honorable.
D'oh, The Magnificent
@cr8nguy: Your first line is just embarrassing for you. Are you serious?
So, now the party of hate can blame their 2006 and 2008 loses on the gay guy?!? Seems suspicious to me. Can we give him back? We don’t want you. Gay people who only come out when their careers tank are pretty loathsome creatures. I mean, this man has the Bush record to show for his work. We should bar him from all gyms and health food stores for that alone.
D'oh, The Magnificent
@Chuck: Exactly what I was thinking the right would do with this. Its what Mehlman would do.
what a motherfucker. someone prob clicked a pick of him on his knees at the pool table at the eagle. douchebag.
@james_from_the_great_city_of_cambridge: As a racist islamophobe, pro-war (political) chickenhawk and supporter of of an anti-same sex marriage bigot named Obama I don’t think you have to worry about being extradited anywhere. The rightwing likes you just where you are, trolling at Queerty.
The bigot you fawn over is getting punished in the polls, He’s well into bigot Bush’s territory and his unpopularity is deepening faster than any President since his mentor, Reagan.
So nice, another gay hating faggot. It’s even more lovely that you wasted so much time on what almost everyone in the beltway knew in 2005!!! Old and tired news about someone who doesn’t merit a paragraph. My stepdad had been out of the Government for more than 20 years and he dropped the dime on this self loathing pig before the 2004 election.
@cr8nguy: I just can’t agree with you. If you truly believe that this man is just figuring out he is gay at that age, that is one thing with a very remote possibility. I am all for redemption for individuals that may have believed homosexuals were bad and treated us badly then saw the light. Not this guy, he was the leader that was preaching the vile stuff that has all the people out their believing the stuff that they do. There is also gay staffers all over the place in Washington and Ken knew the stuff he was saying about them was a lie and what he was doing to the community was wrong. He was a leader in the movement therefore he has to take responsibility, it would have been preposterous to let the Nazi leaders escape responsibility, it is no different with Ken.
@james_from_the_great_city_of_cambridge: Thnaks for reminding us of James D. Guckert. I’m sure kenny Boy knows him INTIMATELY.
@D’oh, The Magnificent: which first line?
@Mike Fourth: tHIS IS WHY WE SHOULDN’T TRUST any OF THEM, BILL.
@David Ehrenstein: Agreed
Only white conservatives can get away with writing off being chairman of the federal Republican Party as a “youthful indiscretion.”
@reason: ok, i have no idea what he knew or when he knew it. before i came out (back in 98)…i did everything conceivable to deflect suspicion…including lying and sounding like a homophobe. i know i hurt some people who were gay (although i didn’t know it at the time). when i got to the point where I worked through the bullshit and came out, i apologized to many people. and i helped start a gay-straight alliance at my university.
now, this is nothiing compared to Ken Mehlman. i get that. i knew at some level I was gay….so i am sure he did too. but knowing and believing are different. how many of us slept with women to prove to ourselves we weren’t?? or did whatever we had to do out of fear??
ken, well, no, he was self-loathing and greedy as a motherfucker. his sins are clearly much more damaging.
but, i keep trying to say that everyone deserves a chance to redeem himself. i didn’t say we should all forget his past. simply that we should allow him the chance to DO THE RIGHT thing. no benefit of the doubt. let him prove he is now who he wants us to believe he is.
all the action is HIS. we simply observe. and comparing him to nazis is overkill. had he committed genocide or other war crimes, fine. but he didn’t. let him work the next 40 years to advance the cause.
really, all i’m saying, is let him PROVE it. if he is genuine, he could turn out to be a formidable ally. or not, it’s up to him.
we all thought Ted Olson was out to screw us too at first…but clearly we were wrong (i know, it’s not a GREAT comparison, but Olson was responsible for Bush more than Melhman with that who Supreme Court thing).
maybe i’m wrong, but what harm is there in encouraging him to make amends—regardless of the enormity of that task.
He can go kiss Rush’s or Karl’s ass for all I care…not mine it’s been metaphorical screwed by he and his ilk way to many times…and I’m sore.
@Bill Perdue: Congratulations GOP shill Perdue; you are officially a bigger idiot than Ken Mehlman, no doubt YOUR hero, since you fool no one. You are GOP Proud, your only purpose on Queerty to vilify Obama, in every thread you’re on. Only a moron and/or a Republican apologist would compare Obama & the Democrats to any Republican. Brainless twat.
D'oh, The Magnificent
@John (CA): That ended in the late 30s no less. I mean- we aren’t talking a decade or even 5 years. Its like 3 or 4 years ago. he was known to be gay then. Its not like he had some great revelation unless one is totally delusional and in denial about what was common knowledge in DC at the time. So, it is a whole lot worse than what you describe. And, the double standard applies to straight as well as gay pols. Spitzer had to resign in a liberal state for having sex with a prostitute (really it was because he went after Wall Street, but we aren’t supposed to realize that). While Vitter of Lousiana has multiple prostitutes, and he’s still in DC. Something is wrong with that picture. Its like when Ginrich- an adulterer and multiple divorced guy- talks about the importance of marriage. Who the fuck is the press kidding with listening to this shit?
D'oh, The Magnificent
@james_from_the_great_city_of_cambridge: Your comment doesn’t even make any fucking sense. I am not a fan of Perdue, but please, at least try to make a logical argument based on what his rants say.
PLAYS WELL WITH OTHERS
~ A friend of mine who is a blog addict who spends a silly amount of time cyberstrolling each day advises that pretty convincing evidence allegerly was about to come to light about Mehlman. The sexual activities he which supposdly gets into are said to be pretty raunchy This is most likely nothing more than a pre-emptive self outing for damage control……….
And I want to say kudos to my fellow posters here in Queertyland tonite. For those of you who have seen my posts for a while, I sometimes make attempts at humor (with admittly mixed results :p), other times I do not hesitate to fire with both barrels against those who spew their hate against our community. For the first time in Queerts history I can say the vast majority of us are all united in denouncing this scumbag and refusing to be the bitch boys of this country any more and allow someone to purposly cut a swath of destruction and hurt through our community to say “hey guys, I’m sorry bout that little misunderstanding are we good now??” ……….Not any more………
He’s redeemable, but only after he’s done three times as much good as he’s done evil.
He’s made a nice profit trafficking in hate and lies, hurting millions of people along the way.
Quite seriously, if he had an inkling of personal integrity, he would have questioned what he had been doing all along.
Sheesh . . . these Republicans . . .
There are more closeted Republican homosexuals than there are open Democratic gays.
@james_from_the_great_city_of_cambridge: is confused (again). Socialists like me are pro-GLBT, anti racist and for unions and opposed to both bigoted parties.
Demobots and Obots who support Obama support his racism, his union busting and support him <b<because he’s a bigot who opposes same sex marriage, refuese medical care for immigrant and imported workers, and refuses to push DOMA and DADT repeal or the passage of ENDA.
On Novemeber 2nd you’ll get a chance to see how real GLBT folks (as opposed to quislings like you) feel about Obama, the Democrats any your brother-cousins the Republicans.
According to an April 12th NBC News/Wall Street Journal poll, more than 80% of Americans see problems with the two-party system — with 31% believing it’s seriously broken and that America needs a third party, and with another 52% saying that it has real problems but that it can still work with some improvements.
Only 15% of Americans believe the two-party system works fairly well.
A Republican is a racist right centrist with a theocrat attached at the hip. Democrats like james_from_the_great_city_of_cambridge are Republicans in drag. Now go home to your Log Cabin and get some rest.
@cr8nguy: Well it is clear that people knew back in 04′ at the height of Ken’s infamous treachery. http://blog.blogactive.com/2010/08/if-i-had-to-say-what-one-thing-really.html , I am not comparing him to the Nazi I am just using them as an example of leaders being held accountable even the ones that escaped justice 65 years ago are being chased down today. Ken needs to be held accountable not transition into some leader in the gay rights community were he can find a way to make more cash and get more praise. I guess the question is redeem himself in what way? Is he going to spend all the money that he made on hate to advertise how badly he messed up? The 2004 elections set gay rights back big time putting us in the spot light and polarizing the country against us. The democratic party is still shell shocked and handles gay issues as if their carting around shells of toxic gas. It is a free country and he is free to try but I don’t see him getting very far. One of the bars he would have to get over is proving that he is not just a selfish clown doing all of this for himself, the gay community is not even the only community he demonized how come he has not made any apologies on those actions? Not a very good start proving you are not just shallow and selfish.
Maybe you can explain what was going through your head when you were hurting people? An honest question, when I was in the closet I didn’t bash guys or even laugh at the jokes. I didn’t not do it just because I was gay, I didn’t attack any group or laugh at discriminatory jokes because it is not the right thing to do. I would have been willing to take on attacks for not being or buying into discrimination then transferring those attacks onto another person. After all every gay person knows what it is like to be disliked. I guess I am trying to understand the mindset because in Ken’s cause I am not sure that he understands that what he did is wrong not because he is gay but because it is just flat out wrong and cruel. There is just to many examples of people in the GOP that don’t understand that concept or flat out don’t care.
Little jimmie from c mbridge is not very bright. He thinks that only Repubicans oppose the Bigot in Chief.
Actually hundreds of thousands of glbt activists will teach him otherwise on election day in 2010 and 2012.
Democrats who support the Bigot in Chief betray the fight for LGBT equality.
@reason: well as far as what he can do….i don’t know either. apologizing is kinda hollow. using his contacts and talents to REVERSE the damage … or mitigate it in some way, would be a good start. working to raise money and awareness to advance the cause of our community is a way to prove his intentions are pure.
maybe they aren’t pure. i have know idea. i’m just suggesting we give him the chance to prove himself.
as for what went through my mind when i was in the closet…FEAR. i didn’t tell “fag” jokes, but i laughed at them and used the word derogatorily. why? well….i was scared to death that if i didn’t, people would think I was gay…and i lived in a farming communtiy in North Dakota. being gay here in teh early 90s was scary as hell for a teenager. talk about getting your ass kicked. people who were the slightest bit different were treated horribly. so….self-preservation was what was going throught my mind. am i proud? no….not at all. but i believed with all my being (at the time) that i’d end up dead. when matthew shepherd died, all i coudl think about was, shit, that coulda been me. (i was already in college then, and out….and far away from North Dakota….but when i was in high school, i was scared to death of being outed).
the only way to keep my secret was to be like the rest of the guys around me. when i came out, i traveled to schools in rural areas with a group helping to start GSAs and talking to students about the process of coming out and the fear that goes with that. i volunteered for a crisis line.
fear is powerful. i’m not saying Ken was fearful…i have no idea. i know i was. he should have had enough of a sense of right/wrong to do something different than he did. actively working at a national level as he did is no where near self-preservation when you are 16 in Podunk.
either way, redeeming himself is an astronomically tall order. but i think he should try, and we should encourage him to do it.
D'oh, The Magnificent
@reason: If this were a court of law, I think the evidence would be enough to convicted him of knowing exactly what he was doing. even now, as he seeks to claim he’s out and working now for gay rights, he does so by lying and not admitting as you say to the evil he previously did in any full way. The very first step he would have to take is to be honest. And, he can’t even do that. People are too willing to accept liars just because they admit they are gay. I think a lot of it comes from projection. “Oh I was once in the closet.” That statement assumes that Ken is anything like the average gay man. its the same mistake people make when it comes to any politician. “I like him or her because they are like me.” I mean people make the same mistake with Obama and they made it with Bush. They aren’t like us. So when everyone is busy trying to say ‘i understand this guy” they need to realize he earned his money off the blood of gay people. So, no, he’s not like us.
Is it too late to shove this guy back IN the closet? I don’t want him, do you? He’s done enough damage already.
No. 8, “whatever” wrote, “The Republicans are ones whose electoral strategies are completely predicated on demonizing some minority group. One year it’s gays, the next it’s illegals, now it’s muslims.”
Don’t forget to mention how it started for the Bushes:
Willie Horton, a murderer in a weekend furlough program who committed another murder while out of jail. Many believed the Willie Horton ads (the revolving door showing actors playing black and hispanic inmates) appealed to racism. The last Bush had a role model for his gay-bashing: his father’s campaign.
Those dumping all sorts of vitriol on Ken Mehlman need to think about whether doing that is a good idea – it discourages these politicians and political operatives from admitting that they were gays running anti-gay campaigns to get their guy elected. The more who come out, the more ridiculous the lot of them appear to the public, and the less viable this tactic becomes.
D'oh, The Magnificent
@B: Actually, your behavior encourages them to be bigots against you because they realize there is no consequence to their bigotry since you will accept them with open arms.
Many of you have a really fucked up definition of moral accountability. Then again, may that’s part of the problem- you don’t have that internal barometer.
Being out as a gay man is only the start of being a morally honest person. That you accept so little again makes you cheap.
So a person who spent the better part of the past decade drumming up hatred against gay people now wishes to say “ooops, my bad, no harm, right?”
Sorry, not buying it. This man is scum, pure and simple. Now that it is no longer politically and financially profitable for him to be a homophobic jerk he decides to come out? Whatever. It is one thing to be afraid to come out because of religious, societal, community or family pressure. It is quite another to spew vitriol and hatred against fellow gay people to win elections and saddle several states with hateful anti-gay amendments. This man is scum.
Forgive and forget? Nah, you have a hell of lot of hurt and hate to undo first, Herr Mehlman.
Republicans like this guy are the worst. This disgusting piece of shit needs to go back into the closet!
Here’s the question I’d love to ask a homophobic Republican after a speech. Unfortunately I’ll never get a chance to ask it since it would require actually attending a speech by one of these assholes.
“Since it’s inevitable that as an anti-gay Republican you’ll eventually get caught up in a gay scandal of your own, I was wondering if you’d give us a preview? Will it be meth and male prostitutes, chasing underage pages, cruising for sex in a public bathroom, or is your hypocritical scandal actually going to surprise us?”
If any of you get the chance, please feel free to use it.
what consequence can you impose? i never suggeted we welcome him with open arms. i said he should be given the chance to DO something to help repair the damage he helped cause.
you keep saying we are cheap for wanting to give him a chance to do something GOOD for once. how ridiculous. he has to prove himself each and every step of the way. being honest is the first step. now, let him take another. then another.
and this condescension is asinine. it’s as if you are trying to assail us for not being as morally pure as you are. but that’s bullshit. i know right from wrong. it is wrong to be bitter. it is wrong to be hateful. you don’t return bad deeds with bad deeds. just like you don’t allow someone to walk all over you…but caustiously watching what HE chooses to do does not make us cheap.
and i would ask again…who are you to impose a consequence? how would that work? is there a Gay Reveiw Board that you convene to discipline him? seriously??? he’s out now and he says he wants to help further our goals. we can’t stop him from trying. we CAN hold him accountable insofar as we don’t support him or do support him. everything else is just ranting and raving bullshit. when he does something helpful, we thank him and support the outcome and the effort. if he does something not helpful, we don’t support him.
really…what else is there? i never suggested a free pass. far from it. and to keep implying that i—or anoyone else–have is deliberately deceptive and evasive.
have your tantrum and absolutism…if it soothes you to seethe, so be it. but don’t think for one second that those of us who choose a different approach are somehow unworthy. in the end, bitterness is always counterproductive.
I dunno whether I can fully buy into the idea that; “Mike Rogers is right.” The self-proclaimed “star” (his words) of the movie “Outrage” says; “what he (Mehlman) needs to do is sell his ($3.77 m) condo and donate the funds to the causes he worked against so hard for all those years.” This is a creepy statement, and comparable to the ideology of nefarious con-artists like “The Reverend” Jim Jones. Where is Mike Rogers going in his blogging epiphany? I note, “Outrage” ends with a clip showing Harvey Milk, insisting that coming out was central to the project of gay civil rights. This has been the foundation for much of gay politics for the past 30+ years, and now comes Ken Mehlman. What will be said of this guy, if he winds up being the one to turn the tide on issues such as Prop 8? Far-fetched? We’re advised here that Mehlman was the key figure in getting George Bush elected – twice.
Why yes, Ken. You are sorry indeed.
Now please go die in a fire.
D'oh, The Magnificent
@cr8nguy: Its funny how you are more angry us who offer up moral judgment at a guy who has harmed literally millions and continues to lie about what he has done.
Yet, on the subject at hand, you don’t see how you are cheap. I mean. What am I suppose to say to someone who is as damaged as you are? I am getting old and tired. Someone like you has been around forever.
I am sure what you are saying now even makes sense in your head. But in reality, it just tells anyone who wants to treat the gay community like shit- “See there are enough idiots to get away with it. There are no consequences to our actions.”
See, that’s the thing we have to offer him. The thing he wants now after having earned his blood money. Our acceptance. You like a good cheap person just give up at the first lie he tells you. Sad.
I’d be willing to bet that one these two scenarios is behind Ken Mehlman’s sudden coming out.
1. A “scandal” involving him was about to break and he needed to come out in order to defuse it.
2. He met a special Log Cabin or GOProud someone and, despite the fact he worked against gay rights and demonized gay people for his entire political career, he now wants to take advantage of the hard-won victories achieved by the gay activists he so successfully vilified and walk down the aisle with his new BF. Keep an eye on the NYT wedding announcements.
The Republican Party platform, boiled down to its essence, is ‘Fuck you, Jack! I got mine!’ so there is some benefit in this for him or otherwise he wouldn’t be doing it.
@ cr8nguy: This jerk was only too happy to kick in the teeth of gay people when it financially suited him. Now that it is no longer raking in the cash, he decides to share the fact that he himself if gay (something most of the world, including his Republican Mastas, knew all too well).
I’m quite willing to see how he makes amends. But his bullshit “coming out” and non-apology for the damage he’s done isn’t quite cutting it. He’s a big boy, he can suck up the vitriol he himself has earned, considering the damage he’s done to gay couples and families.
Maybe if he can magically undo the 31 state amendments he helped place in front of homophobic voters I’ll consider giving him a pass. But this fucker has a long, long way to go before his bullshit is forgiven.
And it will never, ever be forgotten.
@D’oh, The Magnificent: you aren’t even comprehending what i said. we agree that his behavior was morally reprehensible.
and i am not angry with anyone. well, i’m angry with your assertions i suppose.
how is it cheap to demand he atone for his behavior? you have no answer to that. just like you have no answer to the question about consequences. what consequnece CAN we impose? you don’t wanna let him play with your toys anymore?
i’m 33. i watched his ass-hole-ish-ness too. he will have to work HARD to earn anything other than suspicion from me. but i am willing to let him TRY
he has to EARN respect and trust. can he? who knows? but we have no alternative but to watch him try. so stop the attacks and ad hominens.
@wompman: yes, this is what i mean by EARNING respect and trust. helping to strategize marriage equality advancement would be a good thing for him to do.
and he IS making money…in some equity firm, so i doubt this is a financial thing for him. that doesn’t absolve him of the shit he did.
if robert byrd can redeem himself from his Klan days, maybe, just maybe, ken can too. if not, i wont’ give a shit. if so, it could actually help our cause.
he needs to work his ass off. but if he can’t honestly acknowledge what he did in the past, and it’s impact on our community, i can’t imagine how in the world he could be helpful.
time will tell. i don’t think the vitriol is all that helpful…however well deserved. he should be reminded constantly that he has much work to do. but refusing to give him the chance helps no one.
@cr8nguy: Yeah, making millions of dollars and leading a national movement that is openly condemning homosexuals is not the self-preservation that you exhibited in North Dakota. I am sorry that you had to go through such a troubling time, it is a reminder that places here in the U.S. can be just is bad toward GBLT as some of the worst countries around the world. Ken was targeting communities like yours in North Dakota to gin up hatred in fear of homosexuals to make other young kids like yourself fear for their lives and take unfortunate steps to protect themselves, or maybe just give in and take their lives. Ken was also working with organizations that are exploiting people around the world to treat gays horrible. This is not about bitterness or hatred, this is about justice. Being shunned by the community is what the doctor order, he can’t be thrown in jail or striped of his money, so he has to be punished in some way. I think it provides the perfect opportunity for Ken to prove himself. If he decides to fight to advance GBLT equality even while the community shows outright animosity toward him then we will have an idea if he is sincere in wanting a second chance. If he shows up as the next leader of GOP Proud than we know he is not. I hope Ken takes the former approach, but we don’t owe him anything. We don’t need to give him anything, he has all the tools necessary to start making a difference on his own, he made it difficult for millions in this community why should anyone make it easy for him to avoid histories judgement.
Lets add all this up for ‘B’.
1) He defends der papenfuehrer by claiming that he, who was shooting down allied aircragt, and his father, who was a serving officer in the Gestapo were somehow not Nazis.
2) He defends defend Rekers, an anti-GLBT christian scumwad who got caught with a callboy and yet he questions the ethics of the people who exposed him.
3) He defends racists like McCain “To be fair to Buse and McCain, however, while McCain may spout homophobic statements for public consumption or cast votes against gay rights when he thinks it will keep his constituents happy, he isn’t going out of this way to introduce homophobic legislation“
4) You defend Ashburn, the Republican Quisling who voted against us for 24 years in California saying He voted against gay-rights legislation which is pretty much what his “conservative” constituents wanted him to do…”
5) He defend Obama’s indefensible DADT ‘compromise’ which puts GLBT service members in double jepoardy.
6) He defends the AA bashers who claimed that we lost of same sex marriage in California with the preposterous statement that “Proposition Eight passed by 52% of the vote, and Blacks accounted for nearly 30% of that 2% margin in favor of Proposition Eight. That isn’t enough to “tip the scale”, but it is a pretty significant chunk of it.” He likes to quote an NLGTF report on this question but that report says “According to this survey, blacks’ support for the ballot measure was much lower than reported by Election Day exit polls” the exact opposite of ‘B’s rancid racist claim that the Black vote was a “pretty significant chunk of it.”
‘B’ never met a bigot or a quisling he didn’t like.
In No. 75 · D’oh, The Magnificent wrote, “@B: Actually, your behavior encourages them to be bigots against you because they realize there is no consequence to their bigotry since you will accept them with open arms.”
… wrong on many accounts. I didn’t say to accept them with open arms (you don’t have to take the guy out for dinner or hop into bed with him). What I said was to avoid an over-the-top hostile reaction that would discourage them from admitting what was going on – having as many as possible come out is more useful than calling them names.
ALso, if you think someone who makes his living being a political operative (the sort who runs campaigns by trying to win at any cost) is likely to become “a morally honest person”, I can forward you some email I got from some Nigerians who would very much like to talk to you.
As to your “internal barometer”, as they (the writings attributed to Lao Tsu) say, “Mercy brings victory in battle and strength in defense.” You don’t have to snarl at the guy – he’ll probably feel even more guilty if people are civil to him,
assuming he has a sense of guilt at all (and if he doesn’t, he won’t care if you snarl or not, so either way you are wasting your efforts).
Finally, what is being “cheap” (as you call it) is really the sort of infantile name calling you see from some people, the guys ranting against Mehlman, instead of merely noting that he is quite likely the tip of the iceberg, being a prime example.
In No. 88 · Bill Perdue continues posting bald-faced lies about what I said as part of his infantile vendetta. He’s a good example of the problem – people with such an “us versus them” world view that practically the whole world gets classified as “them”.
I’m not going to bother to list Perdue’s lies and refute them – it would be a full time job given how many lies Perdue can cram into a single sentence.
@james_from_the_great_city_of_cambridge: Have you ever actually read any of Bill Perdue’s comments and his rants about the “looter class” and how the government should control all businesses? He’s not a Republican, he’s a bona fide communist. Lenin is probably too far right for him.
@cr8nguy: There is a monumental difference between Robert Byrd and Ken. Byrd learned the error of his ways earlier not at the end of his carrier. Byrd also didn’t know better, Ken being gay knew exactly what he was doing. If Byrd was found to be Black or Jewish the shock wave would have split America in two, and there would have been no redemption. You do see why people are shocked, it is like a black man burning families alive under the white hood in the 60’s climbing up the ranks to exalted dragon or whatever the leadership is in that organization, making several million, then suddenly emerging and saying I just peaked under my hood and realized I am black and now I want to help you.
‘B’ can’t refute what I say because I’m quoting him. So he stomps his ambulance chaser boots, pouts and pretends to be uninterested.
Look, it’s Baxter, who thinks that Francisco Franco was just a wee bit too liberal.
It should be obvious that jimmie from cambridge only reads his morning orders from Leah Daughtry, the ordained pentecostal bigot who runs Obama’s DNC and opposes reproductive choice and GLBT rights.
It’s true, he may have had a past which is troubling for American minority’s.
But I want to see Mehlman in an open, public fight with NOM. Imagine his spin-abilities combined with actual facts, not lies, put against the hate and lies spewing “Gilamonster Gallagher”!!!
To quote a text-line by Annie Lennox:
“Sweet dreams are made of these, …”
Whoo-Hoo. I’ll forgive him if goes after the Gilamonster.
Gah, so much hate for queer Republicans! Excuse them for wanting to keep my own hard-earned money and guns!
Hopefully this’ll erode the lingering anti-gay sentiment in the GOP’s base. It *is* fading away, slowly but surely.
Put this ass in the stocks – the old clamp around his head contraption which immobilzied them in puritan days, used for embarrassing petty criminals.
And paint on his bare ass – : PLease fuck me Please fuck me.
And lets remember the repubs are full of these kinds of creeps. If they were dems, I’d understand, because I have a number of gay friends.
But thaT THEY also worked for the party of our talibangelicals, there is no mercy , no excuse etc.
Be r3eal careful of supporting republicans.
Obama is not all the gay community wants, and in a white house with 1300 or so employees there are always going to be some asshole zealots.
But don’t make the mistake that some – not a lot of Jews made in the 1930s to support hitler.
For after he got elected, they were first on the list to Auschwitz.
which is what the core of the republican / teap party people want to do to have a final solution to the great marriage debate.
Something about wolves in sheeps clothing
Something about the republicans God – Paul Joseph Goebbels, who coined the phrase:
If y ou tell a lie often enough and outrageous enough, it will be seen as the truth”. He got hitler elected.
And don’t watch fox news. They are running subliminal messages, calling Obama a racist, communist, nazi etc.
This stuff really works. The only way I caught it was to record a show, and step through almost frame by frame – took days, to find how they are twisting minds.
First, he has to read all of the personal stories that are found in Google relating to “gay youth suicide”. Start the search at:
Then, he has to personally apologize to each and every mother whose gay son committed suicide during his political career. Individual visits with actual mothers, not media statements.
If he survives that, he then needs to crawl under a rock for at least seven years to think about what he has done. God might forgive him. I can’t. Too many innocent young people were killed by his self-serving politics.
Say what you will, but the younger gay community would be better off with a guy like Mehlman in power now than they are with someone like Obama and Company.
@Baxter: He’s an idiot GOP operative trying to muddle every issue he can. Anyone who claims to be a Leftie but does and says everything he can to defeat the only Left-wing Party we have in the U.S. is not a Progressive or Socialist. He’s a GOP Proud member, I guarantee you!
@Baxter: He’s a brain-dead GOP operative trying to muddle every issue he can. Anyone who claims to be a Leftie but does and says everything he can to defeat the only Left-wing Party we have in the U.S. is not a Progressive or Socialist. He’s a card carrying GOP Proud member, I guarantee you!
PLAYS WELL WITH OTHERS
@GreenmanTN: Please be so kind as to read post #67……..Looks like he gets into some kinky, raunchy shit and some pretty convincing evidence of such was about to come to the light of day and he is simply trying get ahead of the scandal…….Typical repugnatican bullshit..
It seems your #1 seems to be the reason for the sudden overwhelming feeling of Gayness for this prick. Me I gots a sudden overwhelming felling of nausea from his statement………
I’m not even going to bother wasting my time reading the anti-Republican drivel I’ll see here.
I want to see what he can do now, that’s what’s important to me. And raising a million bucks is a good first start. I’m with AFER on this one, give the guy a chance.
Go ahead and make your vile and hateful comments now.
@DR: A Republican is a racist right centrist with a theocrat attached at the hip. A Democrat is a Republican in drag.
With Democrats like Obama who needs Republicans?
jimmy for cambridge is an Obot, a racist islamophobe, pro-war (political) chickenhawk and supporter of of an anti-same sex marriage bigot named Obama I don’t think you have to worry about being extradited anywhere. The rightwing likes you just where you are, trolling at Queerty.
The bigot you fawn over is getting punished in the polls, He’s well into bigot Bush’s territory and his unpopularity is deepening faster than any President since his mentor, Reagan.
PLAYS WELL WITH OTHERS
@DR: A million dollars may make this reprehensive scumbag somewhat acceptable to me…….
~ A million dollars for each Gay person who was thrown out of their homes, fired from their jobs. Because of their landlords and employers have zero laws to protect Gays because of the policies he has been instrumental in creating and instituting
~ A million dollars for each Gay couple who have been denied the exact same rights as straight couples have as a result of the laws enacted with his full support and encouragment.
~ A million dollars for every Gay teen throw out of their homes and forced to sell their cocks to survive. Unfortunately the thousands of Gay teens who have committed suicide can’t participate in the million dollar bonanza…….All because their parents bought into the vile reprehensive dogma spewed every sunday from the pulpits of hatefull ministers following the republican lead in hating all things Gay…….
Perdue, if he’s an Obot, you’re a paid schill. All of this false equivalency about Obama is bullshit. Mehlman was at the head of a pogrom to actively demonize gays and lesbians for political gain for nearly a decade.
You can’t allow Mehlman to stand or not stand up to his mountains of sins so you distract with Obama.
Now you see his REAL reason for coming out, is to help head up a fund-raiser in California…this from Huffpost:
The impetus for Mehlman’s coming-out was a Sept. 22 fundraiser for the American Foundation for Equal Rights, which is fighting for marriage equality in California. Mehlman will co-chair the event with Elmendorf and high-profile Republicans including Steve Schmidt, who managed John McCain’s 2008 presidential campaign, and Nicolle Wallace, who advised both McCain and President George W. Bush.
So he’s doing it for the fees? What a douchebag! Laugh his pathetic ass off the stage on Sept.22!!!
@Polyboy: There’s no equivalency at all. Mehlman is a self loathing ‘homosexual’ Republican bigot. There’s nothing gay about him. He’ll get no sympathy or forgiveness from us.
Mehlman, Like Obama is a political hustler who sells out to the highest bidder. He did incalculable damage to our agenda. But not as much as Obama. Obama is much, much more powerful and consequently more actively harmful.
Tell that to Leah Daughtry next time you go to pick up your paycheck.
Please read and consider my post before slapping it with a thumb down:
I’m not surprised, but saddened by the hatred that exists in the gay community and how they’re throwing this person under the bus so unceremoniously.
I’m not saying the gay community doesn’t have a right to be angry, and I’m not saying Mehlman’s past actions are excusable, but consider this.
Let’s say that a few weeks ago we were told that a prominent Republican figure who worked closely with the Bush campaign that did a lot of damage for gay rights wanted to come out, that he wanted to try and undo some of the damage he’d done by speaking out for gay marriage and equal rights. Would you have said that would be great, please do that, or would you have rather he stayed in the closet and never come out and at least tried to do some of the right thing, no matter how late in the game?
People want to throw him back in the closet and not welcome into the gay community as if it’s a club where membership can be accepted or denied. If you’re gay, you’re gay, and you’re part of the club. The other club members don’t have to like it, but he’s there.
Why waste your time on anger and hatred for the past. I’m not saying to excuse his actions or forgive him his sins, but could you maybe not hate so much? Isn’t this whole thing about love anyway, about working towards getting people to accept the right for LGBT to love each other as heteros do? How can we ask for love and acceptance and then preach hate and intolerance? Isn’t it like fighting for peace?
Ok, maybe not a popular point of view, but thank you for reading.
D'oh, The Magnificent
@cr8nguy: HEre’s something for you to comprehend: He continues to support anti-gay politicians even as your damaged persona here tries to defend him:
I really have no words to offer you that will help you see how fucked up you are.
D'oh, The Magnificent
@Bill Perdue: Yes, I have notice a pattern of people who claim to be gay here defending some really homophobic behavior. Well, here and else where. I am suspecting like the governor candidate of CA, there just the spammers who are paid to write this sort of shit on sites like this because otherwise a) there are some really pathetic homophobes with too much time on their hands or b) some gay people so damaged as to really need years of intensive therapy to help them with their issues.
He lives in Chelsea? If any of you live in his building, I suggest you smear some “Santorum” on this doorknob ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santorum_(sexual_neologism) )
@GaryG: A gay Republican is simply someone who wants to make money and not have to share it with sick people and the like. That he/she happens to be gay and the party bigot is of course unfortunate, but he/she doesn’t see the connection.
Not like people will, but for those that gave my post a thumbs down (#108), why did you do so?
Ok, so he’s gay. That doesn’t take away the fact that he’s a digusting human being!
EVERYBODY please look at post 109 and click on the link! D’oh has posted some electrifying info:
MEHLMAN CONTINUES his ANTI-GAY Ways!
No, Cr8nguy, I get what you’re saying in post 62, but D’Oh really has a point – you seem to be more angry at the “haters of Ken Mehlman” than at KM himself! Maybe you’re not; but that is what it seems.
Another thing I don’t think you get – Constitutional amendments are very hard to overturn. Carelessly amending Constitutions should have been opposed by everybody, even if they don’t like us Gays. And even though KM isn’t by any means solely responsible for this, how could he ever atone? That is what people mean by “accepting the consequences” here.
I know what you’re going to say in response – what if he didn’t help our community at all by hosting the fund raiser etc. Well, I don’t know. Maybe it isn’t fair that he can never redeem himself, but that is realistically how it is.
I should also add for a lot of people, taking money from people like Ken Mehlman is like accepting blood money.
You stated you feared for you life and it affected your behavior growing up. Don’t you think the possibility of being treated like a pariah (like in this case) can often influence people facing the decision to do good or evil?
Little jimmie from ca mbridge is not very bright. He thinks that only Repubicans oppose the Bigot in Chief.
Actually hundreds of thousands of glbt activists will teach him otherwise on election day in 2010 and 2012.
Democrats who support the Bigot in Chief betray the fight for LGBT equality.
Gary B – I didn’t give your post 108 a thumbs down, but I will tell you why I think people did. First of all, you got thumbs down for not reading the previous posts. It’s already there.
Since you missed it, I’ll tell you. People of power and influence who are in the closet like KM do what they do, enrich themselves all the while kicking us Gays or whomever, in the teeth. AFTER they are past their glory and their career is at an end, they want to come out and get forgiveness, at minimal or no cost. Or maybe they will donate some, but remember they’ve had all the fun they wanted when they were young, and now they’re old or older and they don’t care about money/sex/travel/posessions as much. All of this and much more factors into why people are angry at people like Ken Mehlman.
And even though you may not have expressly said this, the implication is that Gay people are not allowed to be angry, but are supposed to instantly forgive just because he’s “one of us.” Well, in many ways he’s not.
Again, re-read ALL the post and let me know if you figure it out.
@Jaroslaw: My points still stand. Regardless of his motivations, at least he’s doing something positive now that could help the cause.
I did clearly say in my post “I’m not saying the gay community doesn’t have a right to be angry, and I’m not saying Mehlman’s past actions are excusable.”
I never said or implied that people are supposed to instantly forgive him because he’s one of us. All I said was “Why waste your time on anger and hatred for the past. I’m not saying to excuse his actions or forgive him his sins, but could you maybe not hate so much?”
The point is there’s a lot of anger and hatred I see on this board. Again, I’m not saying the anger isn’t justified as I’ve often shared it, but hatred just doesn’t seem healthy or constructive to me.
Well, like I said, I didn’t think it would be a popular view but I tried. A lot of people are married to their anger, hatred and bitterness as they love to express it and it seems very popular here, but for me you don’t fight hatred and intolerance with hatred and intolerance. You fight it with love and acceptance, while at the same time standing up for what we believe and not backing down. Gandhi and MLK Jr. managed to do this. Maybe I just expect too much from people…
@sjames6621: Hopefully your tin foil hat will protect you from the mind control.
@Bill Perdue: Still looking for a fight Gop-proud Bill? I’m not your enemy o small dicked one; your enemy is the people you’ve joined with, the Republican Party, to attack the Dems. Get some therapy, take that George Bush dildo out of your ass and stop the self-loathing. You fool no one with your idiotic wannabe-commie postings which are nothing but a way to throw the scent off your true affiliations with the American Nazi Party aka the Republican Party. Go argue with Jason or someone as crazy as you; I’m not interested in morons with 4th grade level arguments.
@GaryG: It seems to be real easy to be a hypocrite these days. Or shall I say anything for money, “I’ll be straight as long as you are paying me to be.”..BS!
Gary B- Well, starting off with “my points still stand” is not a very clear indication that you’re open to dialogue. I totally get the part that he is doing something positive, but you must have also missed that he is still giving to anti-Gay candidates as well (see post 62).
I get also the MLK/Gandhi thing you’re trying to put accross – and it is a noble idea; but you are also angering people by saying they are only being knee-jerk angry and following a groupthink philosophy and while some are, most are not. I’m furious in a healthy way that this man and the Republican party are so anti-gay (if only to further their own agenda which would make it even worse) that they would not stand up to carelessly amending state Constitutions.
I would go on, but you either get where I’m going or you don’t.
And remember, you’re the one who asked.
In No. 93, Bill Perdue lied some more by saying, “‘B’ can’t refute what I say because I’m quoting him.” In fact, Bill Perdue was not quoting me in general (his first lie in this sentence) and didn’t even accurately paraphrase what I had said (which counts as a second lie).
I’ll give two examples:
First, Perdue dishonestly claimed, “He defends der papenfuehrer by claiming that he, who was shooting down allied aircragt, and his father, who was a serving officer in the Gestapo were somehow not Nazis.” In fact I said nothing about the current pope’s father and all I said about the current pope is that he was a young enough teen during World War II that he probably just did what his parents told him to do. As to his “shooting down allied aircragt [sic]”, give us a break – he was drafted (while at an age generally too young to be tried as an adult), and in any case, we did not punish a single German draftee for being assigned to an anti-aircraft unit.
Then he lies about what I stated about the African American vote.
Perdue’s version is, “He defends the AA bashers who claimed that we lost of same sex marriage in California with the preposterous statement that ‘Proposition Eight passed by 52% of the vote, and Blacks accounted for nearly 30% of that 2% margin in favor of Proposition Eight. That isn’t enough to “tip the scale”, but it is a pretty significant chunk of it.’
What I really said is at http://www.queerty.com/obama-will-let-some-gay-federal-workers-share-gym-memberships-20100603/#comment-309977 and it is anything but “racist”. And Perdue selectively quoted me, snipping text that was critical for understanding what I was actually saying: the original stated, “As to Blacks, a post-election statistical analysis ( http://www.ncsu.edu/stud_affairs/glbt/pdfs/Prop%208%20Report.pdf ) showed that religious views were the determining factor in how people voted, and that the relatively high Black vote in favor of Proposition Eight (58% of Blacks) simply reflected a higher level of religious belief among Blacks than among the population as a whole. Proposition Eight passed by 52% of the vote, and Blacks accounted for nearly 30% of that 2% margin in favor of Proposition Eight. That isn’t enough to “tip the scale”, but it is a pretty significant chunk of it. Blaming Obama (who couldn’t even vote in this particular election) and ignoring the Black vote and the reason for it is a recipe for losing when (or if) a repeal is attempted. It’s important to note the reason for that vote in order to improve the cost effectiveness of campaign advertising and ‘outreach’ for this particular demographic.”
And then Perdue lies by saying “He likes to quote an NLGTF report on this question but that report says ‘According to this survey, blacks’ support for the ballot measure was much lower than reported by Election Day exit polls” the exact opposite of ‘B’s rancid racist claim that the Black vote was a ‘pretty significant chunk of it.'” In fact, the exit polls Perdue is referring to claimed a 70% Black vote in favor of Proposition 8 and I pointed out that the number was 58 percent, attributing it to a higher level of church attendance rather than racial differences.
I won’t waste time on the rest of his lies. Perdue is obviously trolling and his main goal seems to be to get us fighting among ourselves. The only rational reason for that would be for him to be a “mole” belonging to the homophobes. Alas, that explanation assumes he might actually be rational.
^^^^^^^ anyone defending Rekers, der Papenfuehrer, Ashburn, racism, Clinton, Obama, the DADT compromise, McCain and now Mehlman etc is not one of us. He’s one of them, the self loathers and bigots he defends.
Well anyway, I said my piece.
D'oh, The Magnificent
@Jaroslaw: Yeah, I note the radio silence from the defenders in responding to my post after that.
#128 – D’OH please keep us posted if KM has anything to say in his defense of still giving to Gay candidates. Probably I’m more curious than anything as in “what could he Possibly say?”
He must have been getting it from Jeff Gannon/Guckert – that is the only way that guy (Jeff) got past White House Security.
People calling Ken Mehlman every name in the book and who lash out at anyone who is not as rabid as they are might want to read an article in the Huffington Post by Steven Petrow, who is a past president of the National Lesbian & Gay Journalists Association:
I might add that there is something Mehlman should be encouraged to do: spill the beans about exactly what went on regarding the Republican Party’s anti-gay campaign. What did people really think, no matter what they said for public consumption? What financial arrangements were there? Who planned what?
How would the religious right wing react if they learned that they were being used – that they were viewed as easily manipulated fools who could be ignored after the election, and that it was planned that way from the start?
It might hurt the Republicans in the short run, but they just might learn to never try those tactics again if the consequences for the party are bad enough, and the other parties would get the point as well.
However, you won’t get that information from him if you are so rabidly hostile that he feels threatened merely being in the same room.
Mr. Mehlman tries to wash the blood off his hands with a PR campaign about his recent “awareness” from the heart of Gay America in Chelsea. I don’t buy it. He also tries to redefine homophobia- his and President Bush’s. That’s fresh. To have no observable conscious for the monumental harm he heaped onto the GLBT community and friends in is quest for power and money is tragic. Honestly, it’s hard to think of a bigger creep or loser- unfortunately, there are many to pick from.
D'oh, The Magnificent
@Jaroslaw: No, he won’t. Right now, there is a segment of upperclass gay white men like him for whom the only sin is not to be out. Those men have too much influence over the movement. So they will attack Obama relentlessly for the same behavior in terms of not supporting gay rights, but then ignore the same behavior from one of their own once he comes out.
So, now he can do and say whatever he wants. You can see that reaction here. There isn’t a moral core to any of this. So don’t expect him to say anything. The group he is trying to please doesn’t require it.
In fact, expect some upperclass gay white men of his background to defend it and become angry at the rest of us rabble who don’t. I don’t think all upper class gay white men think that. In fact, I applaud Joe My God for holding this man to the same standard he would anyone who follows the Roy Cohn approach. But, there is a segment that does.
Yeah, he’s smarmy. But let’s face it — Bill Clinton is the one that signed DOMA into law. Obama won’t support marriage because it goes against his “Christian values.” Where’s all the vitriol for them? It concerns me that we give a big “Pass” to the Dems on this stuff and then vilify Republicans for same.
@B: Why would the religious right care that they were being used by the Gay Ol’ Party? The Republican politicians were using them, and they were using the politicians right back. It was, and is, a match made in hell.
Goodness knows, the wicked’s lives are evil. Goodness knows, the wicked die alone. Nothing grows for the wicked, they reap only what they sow.
@RLSinSF: When the Dems run their entire election year plan every two years on riling up their idiot evangelical base with hate-filled rants on what gays are doing to society, then and only then will Obama and the Dems be as bad as Republicans. Only one party makes us an election year issue every two years, all for the wrong reasons. And it isn’t the Democrats. If you want to defend the GOP, do it. Just say you love money, hate poor people and that is more important to you than your self-respect. Stop trying to compare the two parties as if they were the same on gay rights issues when you know they aren’t. In other words, stop being an intellectual swine like Bill Perdue above. I can tell from your writing you’re not as mentally challenged as he is so you know deep down that your arugment is sh*t.
I was just describing, jimmy fr om cambrodge, as a puffed up idolator without a brain in your head, but he does it so much better.
No. 134 · james_from_the_great_city_of_cambridge wrote, “@B: Why would the religious right care that they were being used by the Gay Ol’ Party? The Republican politicians were using them, and they were using the politicians right back. It was, and is, a match made in hell.”
Read http://americandemocracy.nd.edu/assets/11315/hillygus.pdf which contains the following statement: “Rev. D. James Kennedy, a broadcast evangelist, declared that ‘now that values voters have delivered for George Bush, he must deliver for voters. The defense of innocent unborn human life, the protection of marriage, and the nomination and confirmation of judges who will interpret the Constitution, not make law from the bench, must be first priorities come January.'”
Of course, what happened is that Bush et al. dropped same-sex marriage and other issues after the election – the people who deserved to be paid off where not the voters but campaign donors, and the donors cared primarily about lining their own pockets. And the religious right felt betrayed. And if they feel betrayed (and remember during the next election), they won’t go out to vote.
Lots of people have difficulty coming to terms with being gay, but most of them don’t choose to work for organizations, such as the Republican Party, that hate and oppress gay people. I have no sympathy whatsoever for Mehlman, and I don’t think the gay community should welcome him or forgive him anytime soon.
I also cannot understand why any self-respecting gay person could call him or herself a Republican at this point in history. I can understand a gay person adhering to certain tenets of conservative philosophy (sort of) but that is a very different thing than being a Republican.
#130 – B; you need a history lesson. While what you say sounds good “you’ll never get him to ‘cooperate’ being so rabidly hostile. It doesn’t matter. Think about this: People who are rabidly anti-gay don’t care about logic, truth or facts. The best debate means nothing to them because they know better,(they think – based on their superior morality, religion etc.)
The only thing that works in the long run is strong opposition and usually some form of violence. I wish I could remember who said Power concedes nothing without a demand.” Civil rights for Blacks came after the riots, not polite discourse. This country broke away from England after a war.
Correlated – I went to the wonderful link about provided by David Ehrenstein – and there are many good things there, but what relates here is a clip with opposing points of view about forced outing. The first one is from a RNC field officer saying it is “wrong and dishonest” and then Andrew Sullivan saying “it shreds ones’ privacy” or something like that. Finally Barney Frank saying people have a right to privacy but not hypocrisy. There is something about seeing the actual film of the people saying it that doesn’t come accross in print.
I remember years ago being conflicted about outing, but very shortly thereafter I concluded everyone should be outed who is in a position to affect the lives of others. Doesn’t this situation prove it?
Finally I tried to go to the link to Huffington but it kept bringning me back to Queerty so I can’t comment on that, but will if I can find it on Huffington.
@Bill Perdue: And you’re a GOP operative who’s getting paid to blog anti-dem bull all over the gay blogs. The fact you’re here trolling for anyone who’ll respond to you 24/7 proves it. Hope you burn in hell with Mehlman, shit-tard.
So, Mark Foley, Larry Craig, Ted Haggert, George Rekkers, now Ken Mehlman…are any Republicans NOT self hating fags???
To all of those commentators who are suggesting that the LGBT community give this creature a chance and who decry the well deserved hostility of many commentators towards this man: According to this site and others he is still donating money to anti-lgbt conservative Republicans like Quayle! Actions speak louder than words and it certainly doesn’t appear as if he is wholly committed to helping his newfound community attain equality and atone for past mistakes/crimes against our community if he is still supporting these people. Enough said. Get a grip, People. He hasn’t changed.
I wholeheartedly agree with Mike Rogers’ position on this individual.
D'oh, The Magnificent
@Chuck: There have been out gay moderate Republicans in Congress. I want to make that clear that while I don’t like Mehlman I don’t hate all Republicans as far as being anti-gay. The conservative gay Republicans included
I don’t like his policies, but I can not put him on the level of Mehlman.
Jack E. Jett
He will be making a shit load of money off the HRC and other rubber chicken shit organizations.
I hope I don’t sound too harsh but I hope this piece of crap dies a horrible death and burns in hell for ever and ever.
“New realization” my ass. The least this low lying scumbag piece of shit could do is publish a tell all, and I mean tell ALL book, and out every hypocrite he knows, in detail, including karl rove. He owes it to us in spades. What a vile cunt
jimmy fror camb ridge is playing his attention whore game all night. Don’t worry, people notice you and make note of the fact the you’re a racist islamophobe, a pro-war (political) chickenhawk and obsequious disciple of an anti-same sex marriage bigot named Obama.
The bigot you fawn over is leading the Democrats to defeat. His total failure shows in the drubbing he’s taking in the polls. He’s well into bigot Bush’s territory, but much earlier in the game and for the same reason – both are racists, war mongers, lap dogs of the rich and anti-GLBT bigots. Come on, fess up little man, that’s why you like Obama, isn’t it?
@Bill Perdue: Oops…I meant to say that you are NOW a GOP shill. But you were once a Hillary Clinton shill (evidence in link below.) You’re another sad PUMA (I doubt you have a dick so you qualify), embittered that the wife of the worst Democratic President since Carter, Billy boy, lost to a Black man. I’m going to remind people of who you are and the real reason you hate Obama wherever I see you from now on, including other places you hang out at (Towleroad & Queertoday as well as Queerty.) See you on the internet GOP/Hillary pig!
That’s a different Bill Perdue, you clueless Obot racist. In 2008 I lived in Nevada. That guy lives in Washington, stupid.
I’ve been a long time critic of H. Clinton (and all the rightwingers who run the Democrat and Republican parties) since H. Clinton ran for office. If you weren’t such a pathetic, clueless little troll you’d have been able to do a little research and figured that out.
We don’t expect much in the way of honesty or smarts from Obots and you certainly don’t disappoint. Keep it up. You’re making yourself look like a fool.
Forgive? Hardly; Forget? When Hell freezes over.
Have a nice life, Ken.
@Bill Perdue: Hey, all I know is that my google research matched up your Queerty bullcrap with that Washington Perdue. Just admit you’re a PUMA/GOP shill; we all know it anyway, you twat. It must be sad for you to have everyone figure out that you’re only agenda here and other gay blogs is to promote your GOP Proud agenda by making Obama out to be the enemy instead of the Repubs who want to make us third class citizens and in some cases covert or imprison us. Your sad GOP Proud agenda to make the repugnant Republicans who are Evangelical owned and paid for equal to the Dem party has been exposed. It will follow you to all your gay blogs, especially on Queerty. You’ve been served Gay Gop butt-boy!
jimmy – you’re funny, in the head.
Obama is a bigot, and you’re more than a little pathetic.
#127 Gary I don’t know why I can’t leave you be, but it is bugging me for you to whimper out of here with “at least I said my piece.” Yes you have, but I couldn’t have been gentler in my response to you and you still won’t answer the salient points. Even if you want to stick to your Ghandi philosophy, you won’t concede you understand what I tried to explain to you?
And what do you have to say about him STILL giving to Anti-Gay politicians and/or candidates?
And I didn’t really track this guy, I would have been harder on him still if I realized he is only 43. I thought from a quick glance at his photo he was 63 or 73!
Don’t interpret this as I have any inkling of respect or even tolerance for the likes of Dick Cheney, but he has a gay daughter and he was the only prominent republican that I know of who supported gay marriage at the time.
In No. 141 · Jaroslaw wrote, “#130 – B; you need a history lesson. While what you say sounds good “you’ll never get him to ‘cooperate’ being so rabidly hostile. It doesn’t matter. Think about this: People who are rabidly anti-gay don’t care about logic, truth or facts.”
It’s actually Jaroslaw who needs a history lesson! We aren’t talking about a random bigot but about a person with inside information. The historical analogy is Daniel Ellsberg’s release of the so-called “Pentagon Papers” in 1971, leading to public outrage at government lies: http://www.bmartin.cc/pubs/03BRwhistle07.html , http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CCQQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.u-s-history.com%2Fpages%2Fh1871.html&ei=0UV9TIbsDoz6sAPhtLiCBw&usg=AFQjCNHg7o3-6ME9McDVzKYGwNh36EhZJA , http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CBoQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FPentagon_Papers&ei=0UV9TIbsDoz6sAPhtLiCBw&usg=AFQjCNE0TzT0vx4LKCTgb5yPnFoDBcmyRg .
Do you think Ellsberg, who had had a top secret clearance and had been working for the government and defense contractors, should have been shunned by the “left” because of that? If that behavior was the norm, do you think it would be as likely for him to have spilled the beans? As it was, the Nixon Administration tried to destroy him, even having shadowy out-of-control operatives break into Ellsberg’s psychiatrist’s office to look for “dirt”. It was the same group who did the Watergate burglary and the cover-up of that lead to Nixon’s resignation just in time to avoid an impeachment trial. With the government persecuting him, what chance would he have had if the people he was helping had gone after him too?
Mehlman, given his former position in the RNC, knows a lot of what was going on internally regarding the Republican opposition to gay rights, and getting inside information on what actually went on would undoubtedly be highly valuable. Imagine what would happen if someone leaked a memo showing that the Republicans viewed “social conservatives” as easily manipulated dupes who can be ignored after the election and that the Republican’s “defense of traditional values” was simply a ploy to win an election. Whatever you think of Mehlman and similar people, don’t be so hostile that they become afraid to tell you what they know – the objective is to get equal rights, not “get” some hapless now-former closet case.
B – I was speaking in general terms of history, the “power concedes nothing without a demand” kind of thing. Yes, there are always exceptions and anecdotal evidence and I do understand what you mean.
But interesting, the paragraph of mine you chose to “copy” in your post proves my point. I said something like ‘Rabidly’ anti-gay people don’t respond to logic etc. Really, sincerely, what can he tell us that we don’t already know? Does the public REALLY care? How many politicians have already been unmasked, MARRIED ministers and priests outed, undercover sting operations exposed? It has made some but not enough difference.
Social change is the hardest thing in the world to make happen and when it is so intricately tied with religion ten times more-so.
Now, I’m not “out to get him.” You won’t find anyplace where I said to knock his head into a wall. Just the reverse on another post here on Queerty -I don’t want him to get beaten up if only for the reason I don’t want him to get sympathy and deflect from the the larger story. His actions are reprehensible and if he wants to atone, he can sell his 4 million dollar condo donate it to proGay causes AND stop giving to anti-Gay candidates. I really would like him to go on record and explain the giving to anti-gay politicians.
It appears D’oh the Magnificent is right when he said the only “sin” for upper crust White Gay men is not being out, everything else can be overlooked. Apparently – look at this guy, Mehlman.
I really would appreciate you answering this, though, since no one else has. When all is said and done……..WHY did he come out at all? He could have found a similarly unprincipled person to share his life and/or paid for whatever boys/men he wanted and finished out his life in relative obscurity. What was the benefit for him? Is he just an attention seeker? Power hungry? What? I would love to know.
#157 a cursory glance at what Cheney said was pretty obtuse. He “supported freedom” for everyone, but not a Federal Statute in 2004; marriage is a state issue etc. He was a little more clear in 2009 but still “didn’t have a problem” if some states alowed SSM and some didn’t.
Not exactly a ringing endorsement, but I grudgingly give him something since he is Republican.
No. 159 · Jaroslaw wrote, “B – I was speaking in general terms of history, the ‘power concedes nothing without a demand’ kind of thing. Yes, there are always exceptions and anecdotal evidence and I do understand what you mean. But interesting, the paragraph of mine you chose to ‘copy’ in your post proves my point. I said something like ‘Rabidly’ anti-gay people don’t respond to logic etc. Really, sincerely, what can he tell us that we don’t already know? Does the public REALLY care? How many politicians have already been unmasked, MARRIED ministers and priests outed, undercover sting operations exposed? It has made some but not enough difference.”
You missed the point totally: Mehlman is not some random rabidly anti-gay person but was the head of the Republican National Committee and hence knows a lot of the details. That is the reason it does not “prove” your point.
He can tell us a lot if he chooses to and it is not a question of
merely “unmasking” various politicians. The interesting details are how the whole operation worked. What discussions led to the decision to run an anti-gay campaign? What sort of risk analysis or trade-off analysis did they do? Who made what decision? The person doesn’t matter so much as his/her position and clout in the organization. What sort of input did Bush provide as president – did he offer any guidance as to the tone of the campaign or did he just do what he was told? What did they say about the “social conservatives”? There are rumors that Karl Rove or someone in a similarly high position called them a bunch of crazies that they were simply taking advantage of, and it would be damaging to the Republicans if that were confirmed. It would be particularly interesting to know if they thought their anti-gay campaign was bad for the country but were doing it anyway because the number one goal was to get Republicans elected at any cost.
A comprehensive description of what went on would be quite useful for developing more effective countermeasures if they try this sort of thing again, and getting that information in my opinion is far more important than castigating Mehlman for his personal role in it.
If you want to know why Mehlman came out at all (your final question), you’ll have to ask him. It could be a lot of things. Maybe he is interested in some guy who isn’t willing to sneak around. It could be as simple as that, but only he knows the reason.
B – I think you like to argue. Which is fine, I do to sometimes. I conceded some to you. And I already agreed with some of what you say. But you just won’t let the bone loose.
I didn’t write a dissertation here! But I guess I have to start: Isn’t it clear enough that there is another agenda or social problems whatever you want to term it; behind WHY we have sting operations? Why the press covers up for people like Mehlman? Guess what? Most of the public agrees with that. I hear all day long from bigots who claim tolerance, but Gays should “keep their sex lives to themselves.” Keep it private. YOU are one who missed the point.
Again I will say – I don’t think anything Mehlman has to say will be of particular use because a huge segment of our population doesn’t care about Gay people anyhow. They are already aware of the unfairness – gosh- 32 states have passed laws barring same sex marriage and if that isn’t the stupidest thing- how does my same sex marriage affect a straight couple in any way? Plus they didn’t even care that the were doing something very sacred – amending the state’s CONSTITUTIONS.
You really think they’re going to care if Bush is caught on tape saying ‘well, we’re going to SanFransisco for a debate next week, and we better play nice with the fags ’cause we don’t want bad publicity?” It will just be dismissed for any number of reasons: strategy; or it was in the past, or “you know Bush is older, from a different era.” Or you say that if certain things came out, it would be very damaging. No. A spokesman would say we highly regret that a small segment of the RNC thought that denigrating Gays was an appropriate strategy, they did it on their own and it was in no way a plank of the RNC platform.
Add the words “until next time” to the last sentence above.
No. 162 · Jaroslaw wrote, “B – I think you like to argue. Which is fine, I do to sometimes. I conceded some to you. And I already agreed with some of what you say. But you just won’t let the bone loose.” … the problem is that you are not responding to what I was saying!
For example, you just said, “I don’t think anything Mehlman has to say will be of particular use because a huge segment of our population doesn’t care about Gay people anyhow.” But, what I said is that the inside information Mehlman has could be very useful for determining how to counter such campaigns in the future. I.e., useful for people actively running a campaign to stop anti-gay-rights political activity. It doesn’t matter if those details bore the general public to tears. Rather, if you know how their decision-making works, it is easier to predict what they’ll do next, which is very useful when planning a political campaign to stop them.
You also missed the point about the president: the public may not care if he said what you suggested, but they very well might if he said, “well, I guess we better do what Karl said – its more important for me to be re-elected than to do what is best for the country.”
B – What do you want me to say? I am responding – I don’t think knowing the details from Mehlman to plan the next strategy means diddly-squat precisely because the public doesn’t care. Oh, they may feign an interest in fair play, just like they used to say they would vote for the best candidate even if he was Black, and then go into the booth and vote for the White guy. (That finally changed with Obama and it was only tiny percentage and the other candidate was awful). I’m not talking about the public being bored by the details; they don’t care, and even if they do, there are 25 other things that come before Gay on their priority list. I gave the example of amending the State Constitutions as well. You’re apparently not looking at the broader picture, because I think I’m responding to exactly what you’re saying. Just not point by point, statement by statement.
Your last paragraph in #164 – I don’t know if that is illustrative or “potentially” verbatim – but politicians do this all the time in practice if not stating it out directly. I honestly don’t think it is going to resonate with the public. Far worse things have hardly made a dent long term- how about the 700 Billion dollar -and probably much more- bailout. Enron? What lasting, far reaching changes have been implemented as a result of these fiascoes? Almost nothing. Tiny tinkering aroung the margins —maybe. And that is people’s MONEY.
I think I got some pretty bang up rebuttal examples – but I think it is YOU who isn’t answering me!
Heck 163 -until next time- isn’t even my opinion or a theory. It has been going on for years. God the best example was that disgraced racist congressman – I thought I’d never forget his name –
during a session of Congress in front of hundreds of people said “Barney Fag.” (for Barney Frank). Was he drummed out of office? Censured? No, he said what he really thought and what a lot of people really think. And basically nothing negative happened. Now when it was found out he was racist, look what the result was.
No. 165 · Jaroslaw wrote, “B – What do you want me to say? I am responding – I don’t think knowing the details from Mehlman to plan the next strategy means diddly-squat precisely because the public doesn’t care.” What you are not responding to is the idea that those details are important for people running campaigns in favor of gay rights – you weren’t responding to what I had actually said.
Whether the public cares or not is not relevant to the point I was making. Let’s use the Proposition Eight campaign as an example: if our side knew more of how the “yes on eight” side was making its decisions, our side could have done a better job of anticipating the types of ads the “yes on eight” side would put out, and our side would have been able to respond faster. It’s important because it can make the difference between winning and losing, particularly when public support is close to 50/50.
“Whether or not the Public cares is not relevant to the point I’m making…”
Of course it is! What is the point of having “better information” to counter ads by the anti-gay side – aren’t the ads and strategies you are speaking of directed at the PUBLIC?
You are making a giant assumption that the “truth” matters and knowing it will change the outcome. I gave you a bunch of examples where it doesn’t. If you are saying in a roundabout way that knowing the oppositions’s prejudices and weaknesses and the other side brings them to light MAY influence a few people in a very close election I might buy that.
But for the record – (re Cal Prop 8) didn’t you read right here all the strategy errors and illogical decisions made by the pro-equal rights sides, how many different groups there were who couldn’t come to agreement, the sometimes outrageous salaries and misuse of money? Apparently ignoring the good information we did have? Ken Mehlman wouldn’t have changed any of that.
No. 168 · Jaroslaw wrote, “‘Whether or not the Public cares is not relevant to the point I’m making…’ Of course it is! What is the point of having ‘better information’ to counter ads by the anti-gay side – aren’t the ads and strategies you are speaking of directed at the PUBLIC?”
Sigh. The ads may be directed at the public but the details of how you guess what the other side is going to do would bore the public to tears, but those details are useful for planning purposes. Just knowing how fast the other side can react is useful information. Does the public care about that? No, but someone running a campaign definitely does. Both sides are going to want to put out ads at the last minute that the other side will not be able to counter before the election. Knowing if the response time is a week versus 3 days is very useful information to have.
“didn’t you read right here all the strategy errors and illogical decisions made by the pro-equal rights sides” … I went to a fund raiser and the people running the campaign told us that focal group studies had shown that public opposition to Prop 8 was weak and that people could be easily influenced by the ads they expected the “yes on eight” side to use. There was also a funding problem limiting the ability of the “no on eight” side to respond, although a bit later more money came in – after it became obvious that there was a problem. Regardless of what you “read right here”, if you have better “intelligence” about what the other side is doing, you can make your own campaign more cost effective.
B you’re just bored right? that “sigh” above – let me quote myself: post 165
I’m not talking about the public being bored by the details
Of course I agree that strategies matter to the person(s) running the campaign. It is the campaign itself that doesn’t matter. Whether by a little or a lot, Gay issues for the most part up to the recent past have LOST. The tide is changing, I think and hope.
Have I made no sense to you at all talking about Trent Lott (I knew his name would come to me) calling Barney Fag, in front of the whole congress and nothing happened, amending the state constitutions, etc. etc. etc. The bigger picture? None of that matters?
In No 170, Jaroslaw wrote, “Of course I agree that strategies matter to the person(s) running the campaign. It is the campaign itself that doesn’t matter.”
… but Proposition eight passed by getting 52% of the vote. It’s pretty obvious that anything that could improve the campaign well enough to get a 2% shift would have changed the outcome of the election. Given that, the campaigns do matter, particularly because public support for same-sex marriage is increasing (making winning feasible): do you want to win the next time it comes up for a vote or wait for a subsequent election?
As to “Have I made no sense to you at all talking about Trent Lott (I knew his name would come to me) calling Barney Fag, in front of the whole congress and nothing happened, amending the state constitutions, etc. etc. etc. The bigger picture? None of that matters?” … the answer is that none of that is relevant to the question of whether Ken Mehlman was privy to enough useful information that it’s worth being a bit easier on people in his position in the hopes of getting them to come out and then (hopefully) spill the beans. We can’t change the past, but we can learn from it, and we won’t learn from it if we can’t get accurate information about what actually happened.
I think I said somewhere in this thread that changing hearts ad minds is the most difficult thing in the world to do. The mightiest armies can conquer and destroy but do not change the underlying will of the defeated populace.
Add religion to the mix relating to Gay issues and it becomes darn near impossible. So what has the most impact? The fact younger people are becoming less religious and the more religious are dying off or advertising strategies by action committees or both?
This reminds of “women’s liberation” – did all the political advocating help or the fact that in modern times, due to flush toliets, frozen foods and washing machines that women no longer are chained to the house or both make liberation possible?
Ultimately both probably, but my disagreement with your position for all the reasons I’ve mentioned over and over – a large segment of the population doesn’t care and a significant chunk is rabidly anti-gay and it just doesn’t have the impact you think it MIGHT.
Mehlman had to know what kind of reception he would get. If he is truly repentant, then he understands the anger. To expect less is unrealistic, and if naive – then I don’t believe him. If he really cares, he will do the right thing and provide this information anyway, if for nothing else, to atone for his grevious misdeeds.
Still, I think the washing machines, frozen food etc. did more than all the protests to free up women. Prior to this they were absolutely essential to make the clothes, probably spent all day over a coal or wood stove to cook etc. Recall for every position, there is the other side and we only remember the victorious one.
No. 172 · Jaroslaw wrote, “but my disagreement with your position for all the reasons I’ve mentioned over and over – a large segment of the population doesn’t care and a significant chunk is rabidly anti-gay and it just doesn’t have the impact you think it MIGHT.”
But my position essentially is to treat people like Mehlman the way the CIA would treat a KGB agent who decided to defect. They
would not tell him to get lost because having been a communist
or Stalinist was unforgivable. Rather, they’d treat the guy well
enough that defecting to our side (and providing useful intelligence) would be an attractive option. The KGB of course behaved the same way.
Remember that Proposition Eight passed by getting 52% of the vote. If we had information that allowed us to influence a couple of percent of the voters, ones who voted against us, due to using resources more effectively, Proposition Eight would not have passed.
You’ve made your point about 10 times about how valuable you think Mehlman’s inside information is. I disagree. I also give up trying to broaden the discussion since you ignore everything else I write.
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