One month after police released a CCTV image of a man wanted in connection with the homophobic stickers placed in London’s East End this February, authorities arrested and charged 18-year-old Mohammed Hasnath for causing harassment, alarm or distress. The stickers showed a red line through a rainbow flag and said ‘Arise and warn and fear Allah. Gay free zone. Verily Allah is severe in punishment.” Immediately after finding the stickers, local residents began removing them and replacing them with messages of love. Mr. Hasnath hasn’t been on Facebook recently, has he?
Ray
Send him back to what ever litter box his family crawled out of.
Tallskin
I seem to remember previous discussions about this and various posters refusing to admit it wasn’t a muslim but a right winger – they argued that the right was trying to sow “community discord”
Where are they now??? Fagburn, any comment? (i note your blog doesn’t even acknowledge this young gentleman being muslim!!)
Anyway, here is what the Pink Paper has to say about it
http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2011/05/11/man-charged-over-east-end-anti-gay-stickers/
An 18-year-old man has been charged with a public order offence over homophobic stickers found plastered around London’s East End.
Mohammed Hasnath, 18, of Leamouth, Tower Hamlets, was arrested last month at his home.
He has been charged under section 5 of the Public Order Act of causing harassment, alarm or distress.
He allegedly posted the stickers at four locations in the area between Friday February 11th and Monday February 14th.
Mr Hasnath is on bail and will next appear at City of Westminster magistrates’ court on Wednesday June 1st.
The stickers, which were found in Brick Lane, Poplar, Bow and Canary Wharf, showed a red line through a rainbow flag and the words ‘gay-free zone’.
They said: “Arise and warn. Gay free zone. Verily Allah is severe in punishment.” At least 70 have been reported.
After the anti-gay messages were discovered, local residents began a campaign to remove them and replace them with messages of love.
A Pride parade was also planned but had to be cancelled after it was revealed that one organiser had links to the far-right group English Defence League.
Caligari
Strangely, after news of the stickers was released there were many UK commenters who insisted they were put there by right-wing groups to “frame” the Muslim community. (The question of how these white right-wingers went unnoticed while planting stickers in largely ethnic areas was never addressed.) I’m not a Muslim-basher, I accept there are secular, moderate or progressive Muslims just as there are Christians and Jews, but it struck me as odd these commenters claiming certain knowledge it was a frame-up, as if the stickers being exactly what they seemed was an impossibility. Often, if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and puts up stickers supporting common and well-known duck prejudices, it’s a frigging duck!
Jaroslaw
How can ‘smart’ folks be so dumb? Yeah, it could have been a right winger putting up stickers, but obviously it could also be a Muslim, given their religion’s hatred of all things homosexual. I’m glad this one will probably get punished, but it will only teach them to be more careful not to get caught next time.
Cam
The gay community is so used to being the target, that the largest worry in London, wasn’t that somebody was targeting gays, but that, oh my goodness, is it a right winger or a muslim?!
News for the PC parade….to the people being threatened, it’s kind of irrelevent. So next time, how about a little more outrage at the actual action, and a little less time wasted trying to defend one of two groups that actively hates us whether they be conservative muslims, evangelical christians, whatever.
Tallskin
And, worse, the massive emergency pride march planned for the area to show GAY PRIDE in which the stickers were posted was called off after so much shit was thrown up by lefties like Fagburn calling the organisers racists, islamaphobes etc.
I seem to recall Fagburn directly calling me a racist because I questioned the story about it the racist right wing planting the posters.
dazzer
I’m not giving anyone a free pass on this. But before the Muslim-bashing begins in full, I would point out that the east London mosque condemned these leaflets in pretty strong terms. Having said that, I’m also pretty sure that the leaflets came from Muslim sources and probably some of which have power within that mosque. Muslims aren’t a single homogenous group. Even if the Whitechapel mosque doesn’t like homosexuality, it was prepared to publicly say it did not agree with these leaflets – which was a major thing for a mosque to say. I guess all I’m saying here is: don’t tar all Muslims with the same brush.
Cam
@dazzer:
but once again, you are trying to pull attention away from the actual incident because of a nebulous fear that somebody on here may say something about the Muslim community not being gay friendly.
How about for once the gay community worries about itself for 2 seconds rather than being concerned about hurting the feelings of everybody in the world who wants to do us harm.
If some Preacher from Topeka Kansas is saying that all fags must die. Frankly I really don’t care if, by condeming him, some other evengellical preacher says that I’m hurting his feelings.
The Mosque that didn’t “Agree” with those leaflets has hosted and supported several virulently homophobic speakers…
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/andrewgilligan/100077810/east-london-mosque-keeps-on-lying/
Lefty
@Tallskin: I seem to remember you becoming hysterical and blaming hordes of muslims, specifically the “brown skinned” and “bearded” ones. It’s a lone teenager, dear. It hardly justifies the racist hysteria that was spouted ad nauseum.
And I think Fagburn was sensibly expressing caution in the face of the EDL and their supporters trying to capitalise on said hysteria.
I fail to see how this changes any of that.
Rather, the idiots expressing the desire for violent retribution on an entire community or race look more than a little silly now it has been revealed to be the work of a lone nutter…
Lefty
@Tallskin: “And, worse, the massive emergency pride march planned for the area to show GAY PRIDE in which the stickers were posted was called off after so much shit was thrown up by lefties like Fagburn calling the organisers racists, islamaphobes etc.”
Yeah, that was a shame wasn’t it? Because no way would we look like a bunch of hysterical twats coming out in force because an 18 year old idiot put some stickers up.
Damn those lefties with their lack of hysteria!
Lefty
@Cam: “If some Preacher from Topeka Kansas is saying that all fags must die. Frankly I really don’t care if, by condeming him, some other evengellical preacher says that I’m hurting his feelings.”
But who *hasn’t* condemned the stickers? Who *did* say they didn’t want to hurt the feelings the nutter who put the stickers up?
I don’t recall anyone doing either of those things.
There’s always a suspicious amount of arguing against things no one ever said whenever this comes up…
Lefty
One thing I find alarming is there’s a lot of people here (presumably gay) claiming various commenters were giving muslims a “free pass”, but those same commenters are loath to criticise the EDL and similar far-right groups – equally homophobic, with documented histories of violent homophobia, who tried to capitalise on the fear that WE feel after stuff like this occurs. The far-right are no more our friends than this nutter 18 year old with his stickers. I know which one I’d rather march against…
Tallskin
Lefty- you leave me speechless with your lies and smears, and your insidious implication that people, like me, who asked “where is the evidence that it was the EDL putting up the posters” were/are racists for doubting it was the EDL. I pointed that muslims in the area have done this before.
Not only have muslims in the area put up identical posters before, but muslims have attacked queerbashed, have swarmed into pubs in the area to attack the drinkers .
In the bizarre fantasy-never-never land you lefty pseudo intellectual pygmies inhabit it seems that asking for a dose of reality is tantamount to being a member of the BNP
Still, I was in OutRage! in the 90s and I remember us being called racists when the Buju Banton song “Boom Bye Bye” came out and we demanded black clubs stop playing it, that record shops stop selling it. So, I don’t really give a fuck.
It really seems sometimes that you arsehole lefties are a greater menace than the actual homophobes !
ousslander
there goes the vast EDL conspiracy. The people who promoted that idea, will most likely make excuses for this little peice of shit.
Tallskin
And here is the original discussion thread from Queerty on this issue
http://www.queerty.com/homosexual-messages-infiltrate-londons-gay-free-zone-20110218/
You people should read it, as it makes for an interesting read and reveals Lefty as a lying analwart.
Lefty
@Tallskin: You’ve convinced me! Let’s all take Tallskin’s lead and take to the streets seething with self-righteous anger and violently club to death all (“dark skinned and bearded”) muslims because an 18 year old nutter put some stickers up, let’s tell black people what music to listen to and if we find them with Buju Banton CDs we’ll cut their ears off and let’s invite the far-right round for a cup of tea afterwards.
Fuck measured responses and reason.
Thank heavens for testosterone filled violent fuckwits!
Tallskin
Folks here is one of the original discussion threads on this subject
Note the same tired comments by lefty and fagburn. And also please note the lack of apology by lefty and fagburn for implying strongly that the EDL put up the anti gay posters
http://www.queerty.com/homosexual-messages-infiltrate-londons-gay-free-zone-20110218/
Lefty
@ousslander: And there goes the vast “it’s a muslim horde” conspiracy too.
Tallskin
Folks, you can read the original disussion threads for yourselves here http://tinyurl.com/6x66hmd
I note neither lefty nor fagburn offer an apology for saying, in very strong terms, that it was the EDL putting up these posters. No doubt next he and fagburn will argue that it was the EDL sympathisers in the police who fitted this muslim lad up for this crime!
Tallskin
Folks, you can read the original disussion threads for yourselves here
http://tinyurl.com/6x66hmd
I note neither lefty nor fagburn offer an apology for saying, in very strong terms, that it was the EDL putting up these posters. No doubt next he and fagburn will argue that it was the EDL sympathisers in the police who fitted this muslim lad up for this crime!
tallskin2
Folks, you can read the original discussion threads for yourselves here
http://tinyurl.com/6x66hmd
I note neither lefty nor fagburn offer an apology for saying, in very strong terms, that it was the EDL putting up these posters.
No doubt he and fagburn will now be arguing that it was the EDL sympathisers in the police who fitted this muslim lad up for this crime! And that it was the EDL all along!
Tallskin
Lefty, you say: “let’s tell black people what music to listen to and if we find them with Buju Banton CDs we’ll cut their ears off”
Lefty, are you saying that anti gay Hate music is ok?
that buju banton’s song Boom Bye Bye, which calls for gays and lesbians to be murdered, is ok?
Are you saying that the campaign to stop the jamaican ragga artists from performing was and is wrong?
I think we’d all be interested to read your answer.
Cam
@Lefty: said…
“Yeah, that was a shame wasn’t it? Because no way would we look like a bunch of hysterical twats coming out in force because an 18 year old idiot put some stickers up.
Damn those lefties with their lack of hysteria!”
___________________________________
So a march for gay rights, and against anti-gay bigotry is “A bunch of hysterical twats”???
You are obviously some anti-gay troll, or you have such a severe case of battered wife syndrome that you will automatically take the side of people who hate gays.
I’d say you should be ashamed of yourself, but frankly I think you are so deranged that technically you probably aren’t responsible for your comments.
Lefty
@Cam: Do you realise how hysterical you sound? It was one teenager with some stickers. There are plenty of things we should mobilise against and march for. If you think questioning the intelligence of marching against a single teenager and some stickers is tantamount to being “anti-gay” or a “battered wife” then I think it’s impossible to reason with you.
I heard a little kid calling someone a faggot the other day.
When we’re done marching against this nutter and his stickers can we all march against that kid, please? In our thousands?
Lefty
@Tallskin: “Lefty, are you saying that anti gay Hate music is ok?”
You’ll have to point out where I said “anti gay hate music is ok”.
“that buju banton’s song Boom Bye Bye, which calls for gays and lesbians to be murdered, is ok?”
Same as above.
“Are you saying that the campaign to stop the jamaican ragga artists from performing was and is wrong?
Same as above.
“I think we’d all be interested to read your answer.”
I think “we” would all be interested to hear why you keep arguing against things that no one has said.
Why you keep arguing against people giving muslims a “free pass” (which no one has done) yet you seem to get very angry when anyone criticises the EDL/far-right.
If I wanted to use your pathetic rhetorical device I could ask “Do you deny the far-right are homophobic and have a long and disgusting history of violent homophobia”? But as I say, it’s pointless and pathetic.
TheRealAdam
@Cam: Completely agree.
@Tallskin: Completely agree.
@Lefty: Your PC exaggeration is absolutely ridiculous. A threat is a threat is a threat, and if there is strong evidence (and, in this case, as Tallskin has repeatedly pointed out, there is) that violent homophobic attacks and rhetoric are originating from a certain segment of the population (read: Muslims), then it should be perfectly acceptable to address that threat. These are not isolated incidents of Muslim aggression; they are part of a larger strain of hate, and calling attention to them is not “racist.”
The suggestion that the EDL/far-right was complicit in any of this only affirms the fact that people like you refuse to look at the elephant in the room at the risk of making the foreign religious bigots who hate us feel welcomed. And when people acknowledge that elephant, you come out swinging and tarnishing the members of your own community whose lives and rights are in jeopardy. You need to reassess your priorities.
@Lefty: The point is to condemn all bigotry. If you feel that the far-right/EDL is not being sufficiently addressed, then by all means address it, but to try to inject that into a discussion of Muslim extremism only serves to protect the violent and draw attention away from their bigotry.
The trend has been for these Muslims to be coddled and only mildly reprimanded because of worrying about them being offended. I certainly haven’t seen the same considerations being extended to GLBT until very recently, and I’d like to see that trend continued.
Adonis-of-Fire
Send that goddamn idiot back to his sh¡ holecountry. God, I hate these damn muslims.
Queer Supremacist - Islam is a WMD
We told you these goyim were up to no good but suddenly we’re r*c*st for pointing it out?
It really seems sometimes that you arsehole lefties are a greater menace than the actual homophobes!
Bingo! They’re not against r*c*sm, anti-semitism, misogyny or homophobia when it’s practiced by non-white non-Christians. It’s white Christians and rich people they’re against. (And I say this as someone who hates Christianity just as much as I hate Islam).
Progressivism is a lie. Whenever I see a “coexist” bumper sticker I laugh. These monsters don’t want to coexist with you.
Homophobia is Nazism. Kill all Nazis.
Jaroslaw
lefty – let’s ask the obvious, you ignorant twat…you keep saying it is ONE teenager with some stickers….So (A) he printed up the stickers all by himself ? and (B) became virulently homophobic all by himself without any input from his religion/culture/family ? or (C) do Islamic countries in general have a terrible record on Gay rights?
While it is true there are some Christian religions that are two faced, the vast majority will tell you to your face homosexuality is a sin. Whereas how many times do the Mosques preach love and coexistence only to be caught over and over spouting the real agenda in their own language when they think the opposition isn’t listening? BTW, I’m tempted to say on this particular subject I’m open to objective data, but I’m sure you’ll say I’m overreacting too, so anyone OTHER than Lefty please answer this one.
gregger
@Lefty: It was one teenager with a shit load of stickers. How would you like it if the stickers went after you? No “hysteria” or anything else that you might feel impinged upon. What if you were solely the one being attacked?
That said, I really hope trolls like you wake the F up and realize that phobias lead to violence on a regular basis.
Lefty
@gregger: The stickers did go after me. I’m gay. I live in London. I’ve been attacked by homophobes. Why do you people need to keep calling anyone who doesn’t agree with you a troll? Or anti-gay?
Lefty
@Jaroslaw: “lefty – let’s ask the obvious, you ignorant twat…”
Ah, more personal abuse. I’d prefer it if you could show me where you think my ignorance is, because all I’ve said is that we should be more reasoned when reacting to this – NOT for the sake of this nutter with his stickers (which everyone arguing against me keeps wanting to imply, which is interesting in itself) but for OUR sake. March and mobilise when we need to, yes and use everything in our power to combat homophobia where it’s intelligent to do so but escalating community tensions will not benefit either community. The far-right know this. Muslim extremists know this. Neither give a fuck about us and want us dead. I would express caution to anyone gullible enough to be manipulated by either.
“(A) he printed up the stickers all by himself ?”
Who knows?
Why jump to conclusions?
“(B) became virulently homophobic all by himself without any input from his religion/culture/family ?”
The neo-nazi David Copeland left a nailbomb in the Admiral Duncan pub in the middle of Soho (London’s gay district) in 1999. I assume he didn’t become that virulently homophobic all by himself either.
What’s your point?
“(C) do Islamic countries in general have a terrible record on Gay rights?”
Yes, of course. So do many non-Islamic countries. What’s your point?
Lefty
@Jaroslaw: “While it is true there are some Christian religions that are two faced, the vast majority will tell you to your face homosexuality is a sin. Whereas how many times do the Mosques preach love and coexistence only to be caught over and over spouting the real agenda in their own language when they think the opposition isn’t listening? BTW, I’m tempted to say on this particular subject I’m open to objective data, but I’m sure you’ll say I’m overreacting too, so anyone OTHER than Lefty please answer this one.”
You say you’re open to objective data but make some very broad assertions without any of your own.
Christian religions are openly homophobic and that’s good? And if not, why make your distinction in the first place?
Odd.
Lefty
@TheRealAdam: “Your PC exaggeration is absolutely ridiculous. A threat is a threat is a threat…”
And the far-right is just as much of a threat to us as muslim extremists. Both of which scare the crap out of me.
Before this kid was caught there was some suspicion that it was a ploy by the EDL, so it was right to step back and advise caution at the time.
The EDL tried to capitalise on the growing fear in the local gay community and the tension between the two communities.
It was right to focus on that and to reject them.
For our own sakes.
Lefty
@Queer Supremacist – Islam is a WMD: “Progressivism is a lie. Whenever I see a “coexist” bumper sticker I laugh. These monsters don’t want to coexist with you.”
Kill them all? A war against muslims, yeah that’ll work.
Lefty
@TheRealAdam: “Your PC exaggeration is absolutely ridiculous.”
Also, I always find it odd when apparently gay people use the term “PC” in a negative sense. Much of the cultural and social gains we’ve made in the last 30 years have been because of so-called “political correctness” coupled with INTELLIGENT focused activism.
I’ve heard thousands of right-wing bigots who want to joke about gays, to use words like “faggot” etc, moaning about “PC” for obvious reasons, but why a gay person should feel the need is baffling to me.
Despite some here and their desperate need to misrepresent what I’ve said: I have NOT defended this nutter. I have NOT defended the homophobia of islamic extremists.
Tallskin
Lefty, you’re like Cassandra, the christian nut, who also witters away, also convincing nobody.
I think most of us just yawn at your nonsense.
Joe Clark
And here we see the true value of Queerty and any and all “queer” blogs with comment sections.
How’s that monetization plan coming along, kids?
Lefty
@Tallskin: Well it saves you answering any of the points, doesn’t it? How convenient. For all your bluster, name-calling and accusations when it comes down it, you seem to have nothing else to offer.
Lefty
@Joe Clark: Hi. I like the work you did on “gay money”.
Cam
@Lefty: said..
“@Cam: Do you realise how hysterical you sound? It was one teenager with some stickers. There are plenty of things we should mobilise against and march for.”
_______________________
You keep claiming that it was “One Teenager with Stickers”.
What you seem to leave out is that when the march was planned, nobody knew what was going on, the Mosque in that neighborhood had hosted and still hosts virulently anti-gay speakers, there had been anti-gay assaults etc…
You are obviously somebody who would defend Saudi Arabia from the “Hysterical Women” calling for more rights for women there, because you wouldn’t want to hurt the feelings of the male citiznes.
Lefty
@Cam: “You keep claiming that it was “One Teenager with Stickers”.”
I’m not “claiming” anything, Cam. The police have arrested one teenager over the stickers. The claims are coming from people like you who are making broad assumptions based on no evidence and attacking anyone who prefers to stick to the facts and then plan our reaction in a reasoned and beneficial way (to our community) based on those facts.
That’s not so difficult to understand, is it?
“What you seem to leave out is that when the march was planned, nobody knew what was going on,”
On the contrary, that’s what I and others were saying when some (not all) were making broad assumptions about who did this and already planning action based purely on those assumptions. Regardless of what the negative impacts on our community may have been; and then attacking anyone who advised caution and asked for a reasoned response and patience in the face of scant evidence about the culprit(s).
“You are obviously somebody who would defend Saudi Arabia from the “Hysterical Women” calling for more rights for women there, because you wouldn’t want to hurt the feelings of the male citiznes.”
And there you go again – like Tallskin et al – misrepresenting what I say, putting words in my mouth and resorting to personal attacks.
The final irony is that you all claim to be defenders of gay rights; yet you attack any gay person who disagrees with your approach and who advises a more cautious and measured response based on reason.
I’m just expressing an opinion. I trust the intelligence of any of Queerty’s readers to accept or reject what I say based on the reasons I have given. That’s what matters at the end of the day. 🙂
Caligari
I’m all for Political Correctness in most situations, but there are times when it crosses the line into blind stupidity and becomes a political philosophy so spineless it’s not even concerned with self-preservation. If you accept prejudice and violence from ANY group in the name of diversity or “respecting cultural differences and values” you’re only empowering people who are NOT going to respect YOUR cultural values in return!
Yes, in this instance ONE kid was arrested but he is an example of others who hold the same views, just as the white Christian country music star who tweeted a homophobic message is representative of an entire “Red State” mentality. Is there any doubt that, as a general rule, Muslims are homophobic and anti-gay, particularly recent immigrants? I don’t think so. By addressing the actions of this single person you are also addressing others like them; they’re just the momentary public face of a larger problem.
And we still don’t know if this guy was the only one putting those stickers up or was part of group who is doing it. While it’s not fair to take an event like this and turn it into “They’re ALL like this,” when someone is caught it’s not the time for PC-fueled excuse-making either. It’s not the time for hand-holding or a rousing sing-along of “We Are The World,” it’s time to set boundaries.
When something like this happens it’s in society’s best interests to reinforce the message that these actions ARE NOT ACCEPTABLE, that hate against others not a “cultural value” we’ll tolerate. If you keep making excuses, keep accepting anti-social behavior in the name of diversity or “respecting other cultures” it’s only going to get worse. Look at Holland, particularly Amsterdam. They’ve gone from Gay Mecca to the fag-bashing capital of Europe because they didn’t nip it in the bud early on.
prohomo
@Caligari: Exactly, Caligari.
Jaroslaw
Lefty – Sorry, you ask for abuse when you call everyone else hysterical and your implications that everyone is delusional.
My post did say let’s ASK the questions, which my clear implication that no one acts alone, the “teenager” who is really an adult at 18 years old….was influenced by his surroundings. If you’ve ever priced stickers, those are pretty expensive to be that large and in full color, so I’m not “jumping to conclusions” as you ask, I’m using common sense.
(B) My point about becoming homophobic due to culture/religion is you keep harping on “this lone teenager” business.
(C) and the Christian Churches – I’ll put these together – my point is to mention Islamic countries is to say I think they are much more extreme as they are theocracies. I think my point is buttressed by the fact in a democracy (of course, I speaking of the USA) at least we have open discussions and we DO have marriage in some states, civil unions in others and ongoing discussions and court cases. DADT is about to fall. No one (who is takin seriously) is calling for our open murder. I’m not excusing any Christian church for being homophobic, but I don’t think that Christianity and Islam even come close in a comparison for which is worse for Gays.
Cam
@Lefty: said..
“@Cam: “You keep claiming that it was “One Teenager with Stickers”.”
I’m not “claiming” anything, Cam. The police have arrested one teenager over the stickers.”
_____________________________
Siiiiigh, ok, so I’m either dealing with somebody who has no reading comprehension, or who is so wedded to their opinion that they will pretend to misunderstand.
As I said LATER in my post, “What you seem to leave out is that when the march was planned, nobody knew what was going on, the Mosque in that neighborhood had hosted and still hosts virulently anti-gay speakers, there had been anti-gay assaults etc…”
But you left that part out didn’t you? Perhaps you should get a job at FOX News editing vidoes. I’m sure you could have made an even better video of Shirly Sherrod then the one they played.
Jaroslaw
PS some Christian sects are open and supportive. Can you say the same for ANY Islamic faction?
Lefty
@Caligari: “When something like this happens it’s in society’s best interests to reinforce the message that these actions ARE NOT ACCEPTABLE, that hate against others not a “cultural value” we’ll tolerate.”
Exactly. And while people were busy talking about “dark skinned” and “bearded” hordes of muslims on internet forums, some were busy taking these stickers down and putting pro-gay, anti-homophobia stickers in their place. The local mosque publicly condemned the original stickers. Yes, they may be tolerating homophobia inside their mosques but that two-faced approach to homosexuality can be seen in Christianity and Judaism too.
The reaction to the stickers was widespread condemnation. Society, as a whole, rejected the act the moment it was reported.
My point is: the message *was* reinforced, loud and clear.
Again, I don’t see anyone here excusing the homophobia of islam or any other religion. It exists and it’s a major problem. The developments in places like Amsterdam are indeed worrying, just as the Catholic driven rampant homophobia of the press and large parts of the government in places like Poland is (which has a massive knock-on effect, of course).
We’re seeing a systematic attack on the Equality Act in the UK by the right-wing press and the government, with a bias towards “religious freedoms” – as shown by the recent cases of Christian B&B owners who want the right to refuse gay customers. The very fact this was even discussed is worrying. I’m more afraid of the fact that nutters like this kid with his stickers or those Christian B&B owners could claim their right to religious freedom to openly preach against gay people or discriminate against them and that we may live in a society that respects that (false) right.
Lefty
@Cam: No, I addressed that part of your post already. And you accuse me of lacking comprehension. Ironic.
This is becoming circular, repetitive and tiring now, so if anyone wants to address anything I have ACTUALLY said rather than something I haven’t, then I’ll gladly reply…
Cam
@Lefty:
No, you just blathered on about it. You are so deep into the PC world that you have actually become self hating. You are like the Baptists who think that they must suffer to deserve heaven.
Lefty
@Cam: Sorry, I would reciprocate with a pointless personal insult, but I find spineless displays of superficial aggression through the safety of the internet a little embarrassing.
How old are you, btw?
Cam
@Lefty:
Does that ever work? Claiming that you aren’t going to insult somebody then following up with an insult? Does that go over well in the coffee shop after your Sociology 101 class?
The fact remains, you feel that gays rights are less important than any other group feeling insulted. If you do not agree, then you should perhaps go over your postings and figure out why it is that that is how you are presenting yourself.
Devington
Clearly that’s just a white guy who changed his name to something a bit more Muslimy, got a spray-tan, and dyed his hair in order to frame our steadfast, supportive, loving Muslim allies for this.
Damn crafty white devils.
Lefty
@Cam: “The fact remains, you feel that gays rights are less important than any other group feeling insulted. If you do not agree, then you should perhaps go over your postings and figure out why it is that that is how you are presenting yourself.”
That’s not how I’m presenting myself, Cam; and anyone reading this can tell that from the simple fact that I haven’t said that or anything like that.
You and everyone claiming I am saying such things are either unable to discern fact from fiction or are trying to put words in my mouth for other reasons.
The fact remains that you and everyone arguing against me has resorted to arguing against things I have never said or personal attacks – if you think I’m so obviously wrong and you are right, then perhaps you should ask yourself why the need for such underhand tactics.
I get the impression you’re an American? Well, I live in London in an area similar to the ones where these stickers were put up, and I have friends in Hackney and the surrounding area. I am gay and have been attacked for being gay. I have said why I think jumping to conclusions based on generalisations and assumptions is bad for OUR community. I’ve said why I think jumping into bed with the EDL is bad for OUR community and why allowing ourselves to be used as pawns by both the far-right and muslim extremists is bad for OUR community. This should all be quite simple to understand, yet you and people like the commenter above still try to characterise this falsely as sympathy for the perpetrator or excusing homophobia; and even worse trying to portray me as “anti-gay”, self-hating and a troll. You characterise all muslims as homophobic, when there are clearly a vast amount of gay muslims in the world who are also being attacked with your generalisations.
And the greatest irony is that you do all this while portraying yourselves as the defenders of gay rights.
I’m not religious and find anyone who is deeply frustrating, but they aren’t going away anytime soon, so you’ll forgive me for not giving much credence to people like “Queer Supremacist” who seems to suggest we should kill them all (including GAY muslims, presumably). I don’t see how such unfocused aggression benefits OUR community, quite the contrary.
I see this aggression on here all the time, including under reports about Bradley Manning – calling for him to be executed or laughing at his disgraceful treatment, even though he hasn’t even been tried yet. More beligerence based on assumptions. More aggression. More blind right-wing fuckwittery.
You mention me going to class as though me being young is a thing to mock. Well, at least I take it upon myself to learn and judge things on facts before deciding my course of action. I’m still learning, yes, and I’m prepared to change my mind but you’ll forgive me for not being convinced by people who have nothing much to offer besides misrepresentation, blind generalisation and personal attacks.
Cam
@Lefty: said…
That’s not how I’m presenting myself, Cam; and anyone reading this can tell that from the simple fact that I haven’t said that or anything like that.
You and everyone claiming I am saying such things are either unable to discern fact from fiction or are trying to put words in my mouth for other reasons.
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You showed the truth to my statement right there when you said….”You and everyone claiming I am saying such things”
Yes, me and EVERYONE…meaning that either everybody reading this blog has zero comprehension of the written word….or, more likely, you either have the opinions we are seeing, OR, you lack the ability to present your thoughts cohearently.
You THEN said “You mention me going to class as though me being young is a thing to mock. Well, at least I take it upon myself to learn and judge things on facts before deciding my course of action. I’m still learning, yes”
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What you should be asking yourself is this….why was it so easy for me to pick out your age? The answer is, because it is incredibly typical and obvious of young people to be almost self hating in that they fetishize any perceived insult to an outside group. HOWEVER, rather than being born out of a sense of caring, it is actually incredible arrogance. The “I’m incredibly above average, so I see things others don’t, and while I can handle these problems, the uncooth unwashed masses can’t and they need me to protect them.
That isn’t a dig at you, I am merely explaining why your age was so easy to spot. I hate to say it, but rather than being unique, you were so typical that I spotted it from your first post. There is nothing wrong with falling into the same thought patterns as many others your age, but it is wrong to think that you have discovered something unique.
Lefty
@Cam: “You showed the truth to my statement right there when you said….”You and everyone claiming I am saying such things”
Yes, me and EVERYONE…meaning that either everybody reading this blog has zero comprehension of the written word….or, more likely, you either have the opinions we are seeing, OR, you lack the ability to present your thoughts cohearently.”
“Everyone claiming I am saying such things”, dear. The verb is kind of important. If you can’t understand the difference between that sentence and “EVERYONE”, then you really do need to learn something. Yet again, you ignore the important aspect of what I say and argue against something I haven’t. And then you patronise me because I’m younger than you and tell me I have no “reading comprehension”.
“What you should be asking yourself is this….why was it so easy for me to pick out your age? The answer is, because it is incredibly typical and obvious of young people to be almost self hating in that they fetishize any perceived insult to an outside group.”
Blimey, if you can’t see how idiotic you sound there, then I doubt I can help you.
You seem to base your view of everyone on sweeping generalisations.
A gay man generalising about an entire group of (gay) people. Whodathunkit!?
As a matter of fact, your comment above is the only instance on this page of anyone actually attacking gay people. And then you accuse me of self-hating!?
“That isn’t a dig at you, I am merely explaining why your age was so easy to spot. I hate to say it, but rather than being unique, you were so typical that I spotted it from your first post. There is nothing wrong with falling into the same thought patterns as many others your age, but it is wrong to think that you have discovered something unique.”
I think I’ll leave you to your world where all muslims are homophobic, anyone who wants to plan activism in an intelligent way based on facts that actually help our cause rather than hinder instead of a one-size-fits-all borderline hysteria is an “anti-gay troll” and where all young gays are self-hating.
It’s not a world I recognise or want to live in, to be quite frank with you.
Maybe the fact that no one else who’s reading this hasn’t spoken up against you is because any young gay readers who might be watching this and who disagree don’t want to be bullied by the self-righteous commenters here who think because they disagree it makes them trolls, or self-hating.
Just a thought…