SOUNDBITES — “I silently chastised myself for feeling judgmental, and chalked it up to some residual and prudish lack of socio-sexual liberation that, with luck and effort, I might shed in the years to come. I haven’t yet shed it. Perhaps that is why I was mildly annoyed the other day when I encountered two men having oral sex in the locker room of my Fort Lauderdale gym. I think group sex among men is delightful—whenever there is some semblance of privacy afforded by the seclusions of darkness, or at least a clump of bushes. But these guys had absolutely no regard for the rest of us, both straight and gay. (I was actually more irritated by the fact that one of them gabbed into his cell phone throughout the event.) As I drove home from the gym, I wondered if the guys having sex were actually pushing our race to a new level of maturity in which permissiveness would put to rest our fetishizing of things now forbidden. Was I holding down our race by maintaining a meaningless double standard in which I advocate for gay sex but want to keep it hidden?” —Tony Adams, who’s previously managed to mix gay porn and the Supreme Court, on whether the gays are taking their freedom a little too far
‘I was mildly annoyed the other day when I encountered two men having oral sex in the locker room of my Fort Lauderdale gym’
Help make sure LGBTQ+ stories are being told...
We can't rely on mainstream media to tell our stories. That's why we don't lock Queerty articles behind a paywall. Will you support our mission with a contribution today?
Cancel anytime · Proudly LGBTQ+ owned and operated
galefan2004
I really hope this dude isn’t dumb enough to think that two dudes getting it on in the locker room of a gym is not representative of the rest of the gay population. These guys lacked any class that could possibly be shown, and should absolutely have their gym memberships revoked.
Fitz
I agree. That’s not the norm, though. I am no prude. I have had a GREAT time with backroom sex.. but in a backroom, not gyms. Not only does it set us back, it is unsanitary and probably unsatisfying. The most I would do would be to show off, and then try to take someone home– and even that is pushing it for me. Go to your gym to workout, not to fuck.
BUT IN FAIRNESS……
There is a natural hot springs that we go to sometimes, and I have seen the hettys getting DAMN NEAR baby-making until the staff has come over to move them along. So it’s not just the gays. It’s sleazy, low-class people of every orientation.
drake
This is the same type of crap that Sen Larry Craig (Republican of Idaho) was up to in the Minneapolis bathroom, and gave gays a bad name .
Cam
Ugh, get a room bitches!
adolf
odd, the only guys i’ve ever seen trolling for action at my gym in the locker room have mostly had wedding rings on.
Cam
@adolf: LOL!!! So true!
An Other Greek
@adolf: No doubt…
I am no prude, but guess what? I have many options, because I am not closeted and trolling the steam and sauna at the club…
I’m gay and I am annoyed at these guys that come in and out, in and out, and what are they looking for? They are pathetic. And, this is at a gym, not a gay bath…
Seriously, if I was straight, I would have a real issue having these predator-wanna-bees ruin my steam or sauna…
venting…
——————————————————————–
M Shane
The fact that this sort of overreaction occurs is no more that an expression of defiance to the prudish “marriage” mores being pushed down everyone’s throats. It is just a natural expression of defiance to homophobic oppresion by the gay community.
It ‘s happening sooner than I thought. The idea that the shame based assimilation ethics is a ‘step forward’ is absurd, as many people have recognized. It’s too bad that the marriage fanatics have engaged people in so confrontive a display, but that is what happens with repression.
We had made great steps forward in a definative expression of sexuality in the 70’s and 80’s, and then got jerked back by quilt (i.e. sex caused AIDS) , by prudes like Sullivan and Bawer.
If we wise up and back up to a constructive command of AIDS ; put a stop to the prudery and constructively deal with
the requirements better of our sexual and personal needs
we can forgo the reaction otherwise I will just happen.
galefan2004
@M Shane: You are so completely off base. NONE of us have a problem with the two guys sucking and fucking. We all have a problem with those guys doing it in public. I wouldn’t accept a hetero couple getting it on in public, and I’m not going to change that stance just because its a gay couple. Sex in public is not acceptable for anything other than animals (and not the human type of animal).
Cam
@M Shane: You said “The fact that this sort of overreaction occurs is no more that an expression of defiance to the prudish “marriage” mores being pushed down everyone’s throats. It is just a natural expression of defiance to homophobic oppresion by the gay community.
It ‘s happening sooner than I thought. The idea that the shame based assimilation ethics is a ‘step forward’ is absurd, as many people have recognized. It’s too bad that the marriage fanatics have engaged people in so confrontive a display, but that is what happens with repression. ”
___________________________________________________________
Oh yeah, because people NEVER have had sex in gym’s before. Give the Psych 101 reading list a break.
dvlaries
Miss Manners on this topic:
[It’s vulgarity,] one of those lapses of manners that do arrise from ignorance or accident. Whether it is showing off or showing too much, it is done to provoke others to envy or disgust. So while allowing it to become commonplace helps dull the reaction, it forces down the standards with which everyone else has to live.
That some like to observe or be observed does not strike her as a reason for arranging for the disinclined to do so when they are going about their normal business. And that some things may be delightful in one context and shocking in another is not a contradiction that should trouble anyone with a modicum of sophistication.
Now we get to the tricky part. How do you shield some people without suppressing others?
By custom. The mannerly principle of not deliberately provoking others, which is the foundation of civilized living, supplies a sense of etiquette about what is permissible where. If you attend orgies, you cannot complain of indecency; if you stumble upon the same activities in the grocery store aisles, you should. The vulgar have their venues and should not expect to be allowed to set the tone everywhere.
Cam
Oh, and I just have to say that you have to love Queerty for the placement of “The Bathouse at Mandalay Bay” ad with the two naked guys cruising each other on this thread. LOL!
Cam
@dvlaries: LOL!!!!!! Great post.
galefan2004
@Cam: QT has adds? Who knew.
alan brickman
this is totally rude behaviour!!..there are two bathhouses in my city for that thing and online cruising…gyms are for working out..not having sex while small kids running around like they do at my gym…
galefan2004
@alan brickman: The bath houses that I live closest too (that I went to like one time when I was about 21) had some damn nice gym equipment on the top floor (where clothing was required) and the bottom floors for fooling around. These boys should have obviously joined one of those types of gyms.
AlwaysGay
The only time I’ve seen public sex is with heterosexuals.
JohnTV catches heterosexuals having sex on the streets of Oklahoma.
http://www.youtube.com/user/videovigilanteokc
dvlaries
[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v467/dvlaries/emoticons/brickthrow.gif[/img]
I would have been terribly tempted to pull up a stool close to those two, settle myself, and begin directing each how to do what they were doing, and see how THEY liked that. If people are going to arrogantly privatize public space in such a manner for the most intimate of activities, they should be prepared for WHATEVER reaction they draw.
Sam
@galefan2004: “Sex in public is not acceptable for anything other than animals (and not the human type of animal).”
Once upon a time, it was not acceptable for women to show a bare ankle in public. Now women walk down the street half naked.
Not really arguing for or against. Just saying that times change and sex in public seems to be getting more acceptable – homo or hetero.
James
Where are the pics?
Tony12
uhhhhh. When did gays become a “race”??
Dennis
@dvlaries:
Genius! I also think commenting on their technique (or lack therof) would have been fair play as well. As would camera pics taken and posted on Youtube/Xtube. Really, it’s just kind of tacky…everybody knows that sex sometimes happens at many gyms, but c’mon sluts, it’s done in the sauna or steamroom, and stops when a straight/or prudish/ or easily offended person enters.
Going at it in the middle of the locker room is a bit much…many straight men would (rightfully so) complain to management, and most gyms would have those two thrown out, and their memberships cancelled…save it for the bathhouse.
Brandon
Everything is cyclical. I think that if this was the 70’s most of the people on this board who are feigning offense wouldn’t give this occurrence a second thought b/c they themselves would have just finished strolling the piers and getting fucked in an abandoned warehouse or a park or bathroom, which was a natural part of gay life at that time. But now b/c of the aftermath of the AID’s crises and the continuing desperate attempts to ape the heterosexual community in order to have our existence legitimized by law we’ve adopted the same prudish mentality as str8s. This isn’t bad or good imo it’s just part of the cycle. In the 60’s when str8s were all about free love there were plenty of them having sex out in the open but that era is over. Everything comes around again, mentalities change and then go as they were. Ebb and flow.
Fitz
@Brandon: It’s not prudish to know the difference between a playspace and a gym. I am so liberated that if I feel like fucking a stranger, I can walk into Steamworks or blowbuddies or mac with no problem. (or any of the other good places around here). But the gym is the gym.
galefan2004
@Sam: Women being half naked isn’t sex. Its nudity. The two are completely different. I don’t care if someone wants to walk around naked really. I just care when they start fucking each other in the middle of the street.
TANK
This is fuckin’ gross! If I saw that shit at the obvious bath house this guy goes to “work out” (Puhleeze, it’s so transparent), I’d call the motherfuckin’ popo. I didn’t vote for barack obama to be exposed to this shit, especially in a gay bathhouse.
galefan2004
@Brandon: My desire to actually give a fuck about the man I’m fucking around with has nothing to do with being prudish or wanting to appeal to the straights. It has to do with having self-respect for my personal morals and values. That being said, not everyone has those same morals and values and that is alright.
Brandon
@GALEFAN2004
I never said certain sexual behavior is prudish. Im referring to this judgmental view of others. This idea that ur view means “morals, values, self-respect” and those who choose not to behave the same way most be devoid of these qualities. Ur comment is exactly what Im talking about. Ur not simply stating that u dont want this for urself u implying that its wrong for others as well.
But the whole jist of my comment isn’t whether liking it or disliking it is right or wrong. My comment was simply pointing out that our view of it being right or wrong is heavily influenced by the world we live in, which is dominated by CURRENT hetero sensiblities. If we were living in a different era, like my example of the 70s, most gay men would feel differently about what happened in that gym. Not b/c they are w/out morals or self-respect but b/c the gay world @ that time has less interest in conforming to the heterosexual moral and social construct. As, likewise may str8s rejected in the 60’s.
The point Im making is that it is very well possible that expression of sexuality may soon swing back to the more liberal and open, with displays like this potentially not being entirely scandalous. If this was ancient rome and a guy was blowing another guy in a gym would anyone be surprised? What is the difference between humans 2day and ancient Romans? Are we genetically different? No. The only difference is the society we live in and currently it is prudish in comparison w/ past SOME societies. We are all products of the society that we are born in and it would be naive to think ur incapable of being prudish when u were born and raised in a country founded on puritanical beliefs. But the pendulum always swings and 40 years from now u may see something like this happen and not bat an eye. Would that make u w/out morals, values or self-respect? Not imo. U would just be in line w/ the current societal standards. Right now prudes rule the day. This neither right nor wrong. Just life.
Cam
@Brandon: you said “”But the whole jist of my comment isn’t whether liking it or disliking it is right or wrong. My comment was simply pointing out that our view of it being right or wrong is heavily influenced by the world we live in, which is dominated by CURRENT hetero sensiblities. If we were living in a different era, like my example of the 70s, most gay men would feel differently about what happened in that gym. Not b/c they are w/out morals or self-respect but b/c the gay world @ that time has less interest in conforming to the heterosexual moral and social construct. As, likewise may str8s rejected in the 60’s.””
_____________________________________________________________
An issue or two with your comment. Gay men in the 70’s have the reputation of fucking everything all the time, but one thing you forget. They did it in bathouses, in the West Villaige etc… they didn’t go into a gym in the suburbs and start sucking dick in the locker room. So although they may have been more freewheeling with their sexuality back then (we can debate the fact of self-hating self destructive behavior vs. the liberated freewheeling argument another time) they still weren’t acting this way in downtown Des moines or Pittsburgh. You can’t confuse what gay men were doing in the very very specific spots of NYC and SF bathhouses with what their behavior would have been in other less appropriate locations. Remember, those same guys at the bathouses, were most likely closeted in every other area of their lives.
galefan2004
@Brandon: I prefaced my comment with for me and I respect that others don’t feel the same way. I don’t hold it against people when they want to fuck around. I respect sexual freedom. Personally, I feel that I need an emotional attachment with my partners to make ME happy. If someone else doesn’t feel that they need that to make themselves happy then that is fine. I think it all comes down to how you think and feel. If you can respect yourself it doesn’t matter what you do in my book.
galefan2004
@Brandon: See where I take offense is when you say that my ideas are from the heterosexual world. I don’t think its a heterosexual idea to love the one you are with. I think it belongs to the gay world just as much as the straight world. I don’t know if you mean to, but you are coming across as someone that is saying that hooking up meaninglessly is part of the gay world but loving the man you are with is part of the straight world.
DuttyBarb
A gym bathroom..sounds disgusting and dangerous. No need for more comments.
galefan2004
@DuttyBarb: You make me want to go fuck a dude in a church bathroom for jesus.
Brandon
@ Cam
I dont agree w/ that. Sure gay men in NY were having sex on the Piers, which was very open to the public, and SF was known for its bathouses but most gay men across the nation didn’t have access to bathhouses so sex was had in many public places, from parks, to cruising in bathrooms @ the mall, to truck stops, and various public places. We didnt have the proliferation of suburban gyms during that time so we can’t say if given the opportunity what gay men of that era would have done. But I highly doubt that gym locker rooms would have been off limits.
I know I wrote alot so u prob didn’t read the whole thing (I always have a prob condensing my thoughts) but I used gay men in the 70s as an example of cyclical social views not as a statement about gay sexual behavior. I mentioned ancient Rome where we know the gym and sex were rather intertwined. If they had been alive during Roman times most of the posters who are offended by sex in the gym now would be confused as to why sex wouldn’t be in a gym. Its not the action itself that makes it right or wrong it societies view of it @ the specific time in history. Go back some years or forward some years and ull find and entirely different viewpoint.
InExile
I was in Fort Lauderdale in May and worked out at 3 different gyms during my stay and saw nothing like this, must be an isolated incident. I also do not find it appropriate, makes me remember a girl and a guy doing it in a car directly in front of a restaurant in LA while me, my friends, and the entire restaurant watched. Everyone clapped when the stepped out of the car.
Brandon
@galefan2004
“I don’t know if you mean to, but you are coming across as someone that is saying that hooking up meaninglessly is part of the gay world but loving the man you are with is part of the straight world.”
——————————————————————-
Im confused as to where ur going w/ this statement and I think it is futher evidence of how ur views are a product of heterosexual puritanical/prudish concepts of love and sex. Nowhere in my response did I mention love. My comment was specific to public sex being right or wrong. I mentioned heterosexual hippies in the 60’s as an example of different attitudes toward public sex, so Im clearly not implying that public sex is unique to gay men.
Im not sure why u have made the assumption that public sex means that a person is not in a loving relationship or that the sex is meaningless. There are many loving commited str8 and gay couples who get off on exhibitionism. This is what I meant by people being influenced by societal ideals of morality and right vs wrong. U had no information about these people yet simply from reading about a sexual act u have deduced that their “self-respect, personal morals, and values” are different from urs and that what they were doing was a “meaningless hookup” devoid of love. Dont get me wrong Im not claiming that it wasn’t but ur statements sound to me very much like what conservative elements of the CURRENT hetero world want people to think.
But like I keep reiterating this is the way societies work and thing change one decade to the next, one century to the next and so forth. I personally just like to be honest about were my feeling about certain things come from. I could never do what these guys did but I wont post statments calling them gross, or wrong (not saying u did this) b/c in another time I may have been first in line to join.
galefan2004
@Brandon: I’m not referencing public sex. I’m referencing how you attack me by saying that my belief to love the one I’m with makes me a heterosexual want to be whack job that believes in morals and values and self-respect as exclusive terms and wants to force those on everyone.
On the other hand, every time you talk about sexual freedom you bring up how gay men should be more liberated then to believe that they need to love the one they sleep with. At least that is the way you come across. I’m certain its most likely not intentional though.
Fitz
Hey, I WAS a gay man in the 70’s! I can, 100% promise you… I never fooled around in a non-fooling around place. That doesn’t mean that when I was young I didn’t do ALLL the stuff you know about, but I had some respect for my community and myself. And in 2009, I don’t think it’s prudish at all to be offended at guys having sex in a non playspace. Like I said at first, take it home. That’s better anyway!
Brandon
@GALENFAN2004
“”””””I’m not referencing public sex. I’m referencing how you attack me by saying that my belief to love the one I’m with makes me a heterosexual want to be whack job that believes in morals and values and self-respect as exclusive terms and wants to force those on everyone.””””””
If ur not referencing public sex than I dont understand why ur responding to my posts b/c that is ALL that I am talking about. I have never claimed that ur beliefs “make u heterosexual”. I have said that the view of these 2 men as doing something wrong is a result of a society that is heavily influenced by CURRENT hetero/puritanical/prudish ideals concerning right vs wrong and morality. It is something of which we all, myself included, are products. If we lived in a different time we most likely would feel differently. Once again you keep mentioning love. This suggest that in ur view what these men were doing couldn’t possibly involve love and therefore it is lacking “morals, values and self-respect”. To think that those qualities are determined by whether someone has sex in public or not is clear evidence of societal influence. This is neither right nor wrong imo. If it was simply a matter of personal taste u would simply not want it for urself. To make a comment on the behavior of others and make conclusions about their morals and values is indicative of something broader. Once again neither right nor wrong.
“”””””””On the other hand, every time you talk about sexual freedom you bring up how gay men should be more liberated then to believe that they need to love the one they sleep with. At least that is the way you come across. I’m certain its most likely not intentional though.””””””””””
Once again u imply that if a person sucks someone’s dick in a gym they dont “love the they sleep w/”. That sort of thinking is learned/taught and is usually the result of popular opinion. Which brings me back to my original point. Popular opinion changes w/ the times. If this was ancient Rome we prob wouldn’t be having this discussion. And in 40 years maybe things will have 180’d and this will be acceptable or we could all be wearing chastity belts. Either way our views will still be shaped by the society we live in. That is inescapable. This was all I was pointing out in the first place. So, for u to interpret my comments as being a referendum on gay love and relationships doesnt really make sense to me.
I thought we were having an exchange of thoughts but now u claim to be feeling attacked so I guess Ill end this. U clearly are no longer reading my words and have turned to the defensive. But I dont like having my words misconstrued, so I thought Id try one last time.
rick
THEY WERE PROBABLY STRAIGHT.
Fitz
@rick: I dont think so. Most of the straight men that I know don’t suck dick. But they may have been the very lowest form of life: closet cases.
Rowen
This is totally not what we’re talking about, but the historian in me is spazzing out. The ancient Romans, for the most part, did NOT all blow each other at the gym. Roman male citizens were very big into machismo, and could be seen as being penetrated or made weak in any shape or form. Sucking someone off in a public place would have been a BIG no-no, as tongues most certainly would have wagged. Hell, they even wagged from supposedly private events. At best, a Roman male who wanted to engage in homosexual behavior picked up and moved to Athens, leaving behind a bunch of gossip.
I just wanted to get that straight. Please forgive the intrusion.
Distingué Traces
Omigod, talking on his cell phone while getting blown?
The gays are such trash.
hyhybt
It’s more fun to imagine the one on the phone was giving.
DavidinSeattle
If they are 8’s or better on the looks scale, go for it and I’ll watch, anything less I cringe and yell, “go get a room!” And by the by, I’m Catholic.
DavidinSeattle
I think it would have been alot better if they were both on cell phones, talking to each other!
jason
I get so irritated by these tacky sleazeballs who seek sex in public places. Control your hormones, guys.
Kay Fierce
I’m sick and tired of these straight guys talking about how gay men are sluts. It’s the same double standard they try to put on women, men who seek women are studs, but men and women who seek men are sluts.
Jon
@Distingué Traces:
How do you know it as the guy GETTING blown? Ever heard of multi-tasking?
Burl
Somehow out of the 60s, sex became a right for gay people. A right to have it wherever, with whoever and as many times as desired. When i first moved to NYC I was given what i now called a sentimental journey, which included the piers, the brambles and of course mid-down. These places are gone now, although a recent trip did reveal a little penis showing in Battery Park. Gay men are in many ways exhibitionists. Always have been. Fortunately many have discovered Camming, so they are no longer trolling the parks and bushes. It was always a little out of hand and frankly we should call it out , be it a straight people or gay people having sex in public…it’s just not the appropriate place for it.
SiegfriedNYC
I wanna join that gym!
Eric in CT
@Kay Fierce:
Most women have common decency. They know when to say “no” and that there’s a time and place for everything. A public locker room is not the place for sex. I would definitely report something like that if I saw it going on in the gym I belong to. I don’t want to see that sleaziness. I don’t want it in my gym. If those two guys are so out of control that they can’t leave and go to one of their homes, then they should seek help for sexual addiction. People hate us for the promiscuity and many still view AIDS as a gay disease because it began in the gay community. Every step forward, we do back two steps.