Pride festivals are set to take place around the world this weekend, including in major cities such as New York. As such, the perennial debate around the inclusion of kink (leather and fetish lovers, pups and BDSM fans), has reared its head again.
YouTube comic Michael Henry has made it the subject of his latest video, simply entitled ‘No Kink at Pride.’
In it, Henry and a friend try to persuade a younger pal why kink has a place at Pride.
Henry mentions having his leather harness oiled in preparation for the festivities, prompting a disapproving “eww” from Gen Z chum, Julian.
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Julian says he doesn’t think kink should be allowed at Pride: “Just because I’m at a Pride event doesn’t mean I’m consenting to see your naked, hairy ass flapping out of your leather pup costume.”
He goes on to state, “Pride should be for everyone: kids, teens, allies, my nana. Live out your horny fetish fantasies in private.”
“Kink was at Pride since the start,” counters another friend, Cal. “Why should we censor ourselves just because you’re uncomfortable?”
Henry agrees, saying, “Fifty years ago Pride was a riot against the police. Against having to live our lives in the shadows … I’m sorry, but Pride wasn’t always rainbows and butterflies and Citibank butt plugs … policing how we show up and present ourselves is counterproductive.”
Related: Gay dudes reveal their secret kinks and fantasies
Henry told Queerty that he’d done some research in advance of making the sketch and found that it was often younger generations that expressed a problem with kink at Pride.
“I actually searched on TikTok NO KINK AT PRIDE and it was all younger people under 25 that said they had a problem with it,” he said. “And they were very vocal and adamant about it. And I think it’s because younger people have been taught about setting boundaries. I know I was never taught about setting boundaries. So I think it’s great that these younger adults have these boundaries for themselves and that they feel comfortable expressing them and vocalizing them on a platform. I respect that.
“But at the same time just because you have a certain boundary or opinion, that doesn’t make it fact or a law that everyone needs to agree with. And I think that’s the disconnect. You can respect someone’s boundaries but also you need to respect me and my side as well.”
The video has prompted over 500 comments.
“The pride parades have definitely changed over the years,” said one commentator. “In the 70s it was about sexual expression; when AIDS hit in the early 80s, the parades were about activism; in the 90s and beyond it was about proving to the straight world that we were just like them…wanting marriage equality, kids and a family.
“This message was much more corporate-friendly and big sponsors came on board, not really to support us but to advertise to an audience with lots of disposable income. The last time I saw the pride parade in LA, sadly there were more floats with religious depictions than men in leather.”
Another said, “I went to my first Pride at fifteen in 1993. It had nudity and kink. I was already gay, it just showed me that gay was also amazing. After that, the bullying, fear over AIDS, and discrimination didn’t feel so bad. I had a new family that wasn’t ashamed of anything.”
Related: This is how Michael Henry’s dad reacted when he came out as gay
Others said kink put them off.
“I’ve never particularly enjoyed Pride, and the kink aspects did make me feel uncomfortable, however I went with the I don’t have to attend option because I don’t want to be telling someone else how to live their life,” said one person.
What are your feelings on kink at Pride? Let us know by commenting below.
Crayonap
“And they were very vocal and adamant about it. And I think it’s because younger people have been taught about setting boundaries. I know I was never taught about setting boundaries.”
Putting this in terms of boundaries is a good one. What boundaries are being breached? The Pride Parade commemorates the moment when our community refused to accept the boundaries that the heterosexual community imposed upon us. We refused to accept the notion that we did not have the right to walk down the street and to be seen. Remember Stonewall (the act we are commemorating) was a rejection of the parading laws established against our community. The ability to walk down the street telegraphing who we are is the ENTIRE point of a PARADE!!. What exactly is taking place in terms of BDSM/Leather community that makes it not acceptable? Leather gear? Swimsuits? Glitter? Be specific. So, let’s talk cultural appropriation. Every pop star is dressed in neon pink pseudo-leather gear, but the actual members of the community that is being ripped-off for corporate profits are to be denied access. To the children in the chaps and chain choker–did Daddy put that chain around your neck or did you purchase it yourself? I think maybe corporate overtaking of our culture has destroyed your ability to understand your own community and perhaps you need to examine the internalized homophobia that the corporate culture is trying to foist onto their good consumers. For the record, I never attend “Pride” events anymore as they are just endless ads for alcohol companies these days.
RandomGuy
I’m old and think kink has no place in a pride event that is meant to represent (all gay people), not everyone is into it, and I know for a fact that I’m not the only gay guy who feels that way, and they are both the young and geezerly.
mikenyc352
Why should it be there cause you aren’t into it? If you don’t like it don’t participate in kink but why does that means someone who does should be excluded? I’m not into conservative and vanilla but I’m not demanding you be excluded or forced into a different expression.
Cato
Do you see the irony in saying “a pride event that is meant to represent (all gay people)”, while excluding a prominent and active part of the community?
Den
I’m 71 which I think classifies me as actually old and catch a faint whiff of troll on you, but will respond anyway.
You can be certain that the right (which you are most likely on) would like nothing better than for our community to descend into infighting over who “really” represents us “properly”. You may well be “not the only” person who objects to the presence of various fetishists at pride events. But you know there also those few who object to the presence of POC not often otherwise seen in the gay male community, or object to the presence of lesbians bearing breasts in a way that men are allowed in most public spaces, and so on. This is about the community as a whole not being afraid to celebrate who they are with no shame. So there are really only two allowable responses to you. First, you should be ashamed of yourself, acting as backwards as an evangelical. Second, get over yourself…it is about all of us, not what you are comfortable with.
mawaby59
Seems this issue is basic event management stuff. Is the event public or private? What is the mission and purpose of the event? If it’s a public parade does the advertisement and marketing state it is all-age family- friendly? If the event is all-age family-friendly then adult sexual kink and fetish displays may not be a good fit. Some communities may have adult parades and some may have all-age family-friendly. It’s up to each community and event manager.
Den
What makes something “not family friendly” is most often that parents fear questions they might have to think carefully about how to answer in an age appropriate fashion. There is no difference between the gay person who doesn’t want to figure out how to answer when their child asks “why are those people dressed like that”, and the homophobe who does not want to see gay couples acting identically to straight couples because their child might ask questions. What harms a child is being sheltered or lied to, not exposing them to things they are very likely too young to even register. What harms a child who may be gay is growing up thinking there is nobody out there like them, and happy and proud, as so many of my generation did.
It is not as if people are giving blow jobs publicly at pride, and it is not as if seeing gay couples all over each other is any different from seeing hetero couples all over each other. Though the parades are public (and somehow nobody in countries that celebrate mardi gras seems to worry that very sexualized costumes and dancing in parades is damaging kids), post parade events almost always involve some sort of entry donation or fee, so they are not really public.
Brian
“The last time I saw the pride parade in LA, sadly there were more floats with religious depictions than men in leather.”
Yeah, and do any of those people stop and think that they’re making people feel uncomfortable? I’m actually tired of the number of churches evangelizing at Pride events. Churches are actively working against us. Churches funded Prop 8, famously so. Churches from outside of California funded the efforts to successfully reverse the ability to get married. Churches abuse children, lie about it, and then claim that gay people are innately abusive or evil — how twisted is that!
And why do any Pride parade organizers allow cops to have contingents? Pride is the anniversary of police violence. Cops have not done enough to end their aggression, the false arrests, the racial profiling, the murder of unarmed civilians. Cops are in the news almost constantly for harming people. Cops marching within the parade make lots of people uncomfortable.
For some reason, we’re focusing on shirtless men wearing leather harnesses. This discussion is ridiculous.
markpkessinger
Gay Pride parade were never intended to make people outside of our community feel comfortable. And for those within our community for whom expressions of kink make them feel uncomfortable, I would respectfully suggest they need to reexamine their own attitudes, and to refamiliarize themselves with who the clientele of Stonewall were in 1969. Hint: they weren’t the buttoned down corporate types we see today!
monty clift
This whole “consent” thing has been taken to the extreme, now it’s anything that makes me feel slightly uncomfortable is akin to rape or sexual assault.
mikenyc352
Exactly and it centers heteronormative expression as a default standard not requiring consent while sexual minorities are othered. It builds on the myth of the gay male rapist/child abuser by equating our expression with rape by using words connected to consent causing us to internalize heterosexism and self police.
I don’t remember giving consent to see people express themselves in vanilla clothes and actions
GlobeTrotter
Personally, I don’t get this overwhelming need for exhibitionism. So you’re gay, so what? Who cares? Why the need to exhibit everything about yourself to the world? God knows I’m no prude (and I’ve got the photos from my 20’s as proof!), but the only person who should be concerned about your sexuality is the person you’re sexing. I don’t need to exhibit myself or mimic sex acts at some “pride” parade to prove my sexuality. Sometimes I get the impression that a lot of these guys who go to such extremes at pride parades are struggling with their own issues, but then again, that’s just my opinion.
Prowelsh56
agreed on the need to exhibit/mimic sex acts on a float to prove my sexualilty…very well stated. That the thing that bothers me most. Just not what I think is needed.
basils_Herald
No shade, but you sound like the one with the issues. It’s one thing to be comfortable in your body when everything works right, the popular kids think you’re hot and even your haters would think about sleeping with you, but we all get old and sick some day. What then? Everyone should feel comfortable in their own body and flaunt what they’ve got. We’re sexual animals and we shouldn’t be ashamed of it. That’s how organized religions have controlled and subjugated Queer people since at least the Doctrine of Discovery and the European conquest of the Americas. Plug: John Boswell’s (RIP) Christianity and Social Tolerance is a good history of gay relationships in Western European society.
As sexy as some kink gear is, it’s also just freaking useful. I’m 5’6″ and my husband is 6’4″, my harness makes certain positions much more feasible and I want to keep having sex when we’re old.
GlobeTrotter
@basils_Herald: “Everyone should feel comfortable in their own body and flaunt what they’ve got.”
I agree that everyone should feel comfortable in their own body, but why does that necessitate flaunting my body? It seems to me you’re saying that we need the approval of others to be feel comfortable in our own bodies, and that’s one assertion I strenuously reject. I can feel very comfortable in my own body and still not feel the urge to “flaunt”.
“I’m 5’6? and my husband is 6’4?, my harness makes certain positions much more feasible and I want to keep having sex when we’re old.”
More power to you, but what does any of this have to do with exhibitionism? What you and your husband do in the privacy of your home is your own business. Does it need to be shared with the rest of the world?
mikenyc352
The problem is when people decide to center their understanding of the world as the norm and to police others through that understanding. Just because it’s not what you do doesn’t mean you should take an armchair psychologist viewpoint and try to pathologist those that do and even less does it mean you get to demand that others conform to your understanding. All of our viewpoints are limit by our own experiences be open to the fact that other might legitimately see thing in different ways through different eyes. Judge less and experience more inho.
Bradley
I’m an ancient geezer, and I didn’t care to see the “kinkier” side of pride. I drove my vintage convertible in one parade, and marched in a few parades with a group, and attended the “festivities,” but I stopped, because I didn’t enjoy it. That was when I lived out West. I’ve been ostracized by the very community that I’m supposed to be a part of, and “proud” of, so, no, I’m not proud. I’m back in a small town in the Midwest, where there are no local celebrations, anyway. I’d be happy with one like-minded friend (not a euphemism friend) to be able to talk to, but I can’t even have that. At this point, I don’t care who flaunts what, let your freak flags fly, boys and girls (and everything in between).
Den
“I’d be happy with one like-minded friend (not a euphemism friend) to be able to talk to, but I can’t even have that.”
And from your post, that seems very much to be a specific choice you made because you were unwilling to be open to diversity within your community. And were you ostracized because of that specific attitude or because of a generally judgmental nature that considered anything which made you a bit uncomfortable “inappropriate”? Personally I dislike a lot of things, but at my age (is 71 geezerly enough?) have the maturity to understand the essentially shallow nature of my dislikes and judgements when they are based on anything other than a person’s ethics and actions towards others.
basils_Herald
I think that American attitudes, even in the Queer community, are shaped by how under-educated we are sexually. What just seems like a fetish to one person, could be another person’s favorite thing about sex. Pride is supposed to be about celebrating sexual diversity and the legal victories the Queer community has won (which have been few, fragile and relatively recent). I wish that the Queer community would do more to encourage each other to be more curious. What will it take to move folx knee-jerk reactions from “Eww” to “OMG, what’s the scoop on this trend I always notice at Pride” ??? Pride wouldn’t be a thing if it weren’t for trans people, drag queens and kink. It’s the people who’ve been bold about confronting social mores that made Queer victories possible in the first place.
GlobeTrotter
But why does anyone’s fetish and sexuality have to be exhibited in such an over the top manner? I can have my curiosity about any fetish satisfied by meeting like-minded guys at a bar/club/Grindr. What does exhibiting nudity and mimicking sex acts in public have to do with celebrating sexual diversity?
I think the reason so many people react with “eww” is because they’re struggling to understand the relevance of much of the exhibition put on at pride parades, which come across as grotesque and out of place. I myself fail to see any connection between being gay and the sexual exhibitionism at pride parades.
basils_Herald
Because they’re free and celebrating their freedom – it’s not about you
GlobeTrotter
“Because they’re free and celebrating their freedom – it’s not about you”
I didn’t imply otherwise. I simply questioned this overwhelming NEED to exhibit. Everyone has sexual freedom, everyone has the right to live their lives as they see fit. No one really cares however, what other people do in the privacy of their own homes.
Den
They come across as grotesque and out of place TO YOU. They seem over the top TO YOU. Learn that you are not everybody, and that what offends a few people does not become inappropriate because they are made briefly and slightly uncomfortable. To most attendees it is amusing, or street theater or neutral.
“No one really cares however, what other people do in the privacy of their own homes.”
This is the common refrain of the homophobe and those who simply would feel better if we went back into the closet…they say it even in the presence of PDAs which cause no reaction at all when hetero couples do it. That comment casts suspicions on who and what you are, why you are here and so on. Just as heterosexuality is about more than what people do in the privacy of there own homes, so too is homosexuality. Tellingly, it is almost ALWAYS heterosexuals who fail to understand this.
Hintetsomaru
… I didn’t consent to the Kink communities, communities who’ve been there from the start, who helped bolster the older gays during the tough times, who held our hands and cried with us, being denied from celebrating their authentic self.
I’m not comfortable with big corporations using Pride as an advertising event, because Pride has become ‘sanitized’ and we’ve become ‘marketable’.
I’m not comfortable with the amount of Religious Liberty people telling me “You don’t have to be gay”, or that I ‘chose’ this lifestyle. I was born gay, I CHOOSE to be fabulous.
basils_Herald
+1 on the Rainbow washing <3
Jami Stardust
I’ve never been to a pride parade. I have no problem with people showing their kink. Isn’t that what it’s about? Why are there religious floats in pride parades? How do floats get in the parade? Why do they allow anti-pride floats in the parade? That sounds ridiculous. I’ve thought of going to see all the different groups, but religious floats turn my stomach. I’m antitheist, so, religious floats are what I don’t want to see. Now I may not go ever.
bodie425
The religious floats are only for those churches who fully support the LGTBQ community, as far as I’ve seen. There are still many in our community that seek some solace and understanding within the religion construct. As an atheist since the second I came out of the closet 30+ years ago, I don’t need it, myself.
Ronbo
I’ve been to many, many churches and religions and only a handful are anti-LGBTQ.
I agree with bodie425. I’m not religious at all, my husband of 36 years is. I’ve attended many types of services and only once did I hear anti-gay rhetoric. I made an accidental impact. At a mega-church in Chicago, the minister started spouting anti-gay nonsense. I stood up and turned my back to the speaker. To my amazement about a quarter of the people did the same – and more importantly, a lot of people started walking out. They had not passed the collection plate yet, so I KNOW we got their attention.
Pride is about visable action in support of acceptance and compassion.
Diplomat
I’ve always been sensitive to how gays represent themselves to the world. IMO it’s a total fail. Gay pride is a place to celebrate our sexual orientation and our wins, not to celebrate sex acts and leather chaps with asses hanging out. Go to a leather fest if that’s your kink, but don’t ruin it for the rest of us.
I don’t go to pride bc I’m not proud of the overt sex act representation that goes on. It’s as if these people just want to flip the bird to the straight community or those that belive sex is a private thing. Not a good look.
This opinion runs the gamut through all ages. It’s not just young people. Unfortunately, this is one cavalcade of run away cats you can’t heard back to center.
basils_Herald
I still always come back to the perspective of your position (and I love a Catherine Tate sketch): but am I bothered though?
Why does it bother you to see a man dressed in clothing evocative of gay sex, especially as a man who has sex with men? (presumably)
Diplomat
I have zero issue with hot guys in chaps. It’s a total turn on. Give me more. But there’s a time and place for everything and a back room at a leather bar isn’t appropriate for the world stage. It casts a very bad shadow on our cause, to be accepted as decent human beings. Not sex craved sex addicts running in the streets. As they say “when in Rome”.
markpkessinger
The myth underlying your discomfort is the belief in that if only we conduct ourselves respectably enough, then straight society will accept us. It is a tempting illusion, but it is just that: an illusion.
And it has been tried already. In the days before Stonewall, there was the Mattachine Society. Whenever they would protest be anywhere, the men in would show up in suits and ties, and the women in dresses, all because that organization’s leaders believed that the way for the community to gain acceptance from straight society was to confirm ourselves to the norms of heterosexual society, to make ourselves respectable to straights on straight terms. But what many of us learned is that bigotry doesn’t actually need a reason. Despite the best efforts of the Mattachine Society, the police raids continued, along with the arrests, the ruined careers and the evictions
What has been lost in recent years is that gay liberation was also part of the wider sexual liberation movement. Perhaps for you, it is unimportant to claim your sexuality in such a public way, but for others, it is. The LGBTQ+ movement should be about accepting people, and their sexuality, how ever they want or need to express it, and setting aside judgmentalism!
Den
“But there’s a time and place for everything”
First of all, Markpkessinger is absolutely correct. Regardless of how “normal” we present ourselves to be, the right will still scream that we’re “groomers” and pedophiles and that homosexuality is a choice similar to the choice to become a drug user or thief. They have been saying it since the 1950’s when republican control through fear first became a prevalent tactic of theirs.
Second, Pride gatherings are a celebration of Gay/Queer space. BY US AND FOR US. They are not us saying “yoo-hoo heterosexuals, look we are just as normal and suburban/amurican as you.” Even if displays of fetish pride were restricted to smaller more private events the right would STILL send stealth attendees to “report” on them and lie about how public they were and whether or not there were children there, etc. They already do it, they are already liars of the worst sort to advance their antigay agenda. If there is even one leather lesbian with a child in a stroller it would be all over FOX, NewsMax, OAN, InfoWars, The Daily Storm and so on.
jamescastlerock
I think it’s sad and disgusting that this is even an issue. CLEARLY the people with a problem either don’t know about gay history or they don’t care about gay history. This is just the further erosion of gay culture in a world that seeks to erase us.
Tombear
Jesus, if someone is wearing assless chaps. So what. Don’t look. Now the younger gay community wants to discriminate against kinksters. The young gay people are as bad as the Republicans eating their own. If you don’t like kink at Pride ignore it. Kinksters have their rights too!
Diplomat
The point is Tom, it’s not a kinkfest. The Castro Street Fair is a kinkfest and is off scale hot. No one is discriminating against kink or kinkfests.
I have zero issue with hot guys in chaps. It’s a total turn on. Give me more. But there’s a time and place for everything and a back room at a leather bar isn’t appropriate for the world stage. It casts a very bad shadow on our cause, to be accepted as decent human beings. Not sex craved sex addicts running in the streets. As they say “when in Rome”.
Den
“The Castro Street Fair is a kinkfest and is off scale hot.”
Uh, hello? Sounds to me that you have never actually been to the Castro Street Fair. It is not now, nor has it ever been a kinkfest, and there will be many fewer men and women in fetish garb than there would have been at the civic center today (which would not have been a huge number). And no offense, but there is something kind of suspicious about someone posting almost the exact same verbiage twice (almost all of your post is exactly the same as a previous one, a common trollery), especially when it reveals they have no idea what they are talking about.
Diplomat
It was not Castro it is the Folsom Street fair in SF. Name right or wrong the message is the same. There’s a right and a wrong place for everything.
And it’s not the 1950s anymore. We’ve gained alot of acceptance since then. Like it or not it hasn’t been from sexing in the streets. So all your endless babbling doesn’t really work in today’s market.
You obviously know little about marketing and PR. The high majority finds butt plugs and assless chaps disgusting. I don’t. But I like it done in the right space. What I do find unacceptable and “uncomfortable” is the global stain it imprints on our community. It’s like. Get a clue.
Think about this if you can get past your bluster. Maybe it’s the right posing as pro gay that pushed for Parade sex in the streets so they could lambast us about it. Things just may not be as they seem.
bodie425
The glaring display of kink does not help our cause, but that’s my opinion. As I’ve come to slowly discover over nearly sixty decades of life, I can be completely and utterly wrong, sometimes. I present myself at Pride as I think we should and that is that. And, you do you, boo.
As for corporate sponsorship: There’s no pleasing some of you! You’d be complaining if they ignored us and now you’re complaining because they don’t. Changing hearts and minds doesn’t come overnight–it takes time. These corps and orgs are taking baby steps for some and giant leaps for others, but they’re moving in the right direction. Find positivity wherever you can and praise it.
Apollonos
Um, “sixty decades of life”? That’s six centuries. Are you a vampire? Do you use 600 SPF sunblock? LOL
[email protected]
I’m 56 I don’t get kink never have. Don’t want to see it myself. I don’t go to pride any more don’t feel it’s relevant to me anymore. But I think it all has a place-kink included-I don’t want to see it but I don’t care if you do.
scotty
to each their own. you want g rated pride? but you want r rated pride? and those that want x rated pride? same day perhaps but three different sections of wherever. YMMV this is such a non issue ooooh im gay but i dont like it when somone does something i dont like do you honestly listen to yourselves?
Diplomat
what is YMMV?
Prax07
I’ve never gone to any pride event, and that’s mainly because of the kinksters/nudity out in broad daylight. IMO it puts us in a terrible light, that were all oversexed maniacs that can’t control themselves. It’s not a look I want to be associated with it judged for. You want to wear puppy gear and a jock, or a g-string and nothing else, then do it at a night event. Do it at a club. Do it at a gay private event. Do it at an appropriate place, not a daytime pride parade where normals and kids are. Why do straights hate us, that’s a big part of it.
Den
“Why do straights hate us, that’s a big part of it.”
No, it’s not a big part of it. Learn some history. They hated us in the 1950’s when we were barely visible at all. They hated us in the 60’s when we were indistinguishable from the hippies. They hate us because they cling to lies about who we are and where we come from. They still believe we recruit their children. They still believe we choose to be homosexual. They hate us because they don’t realize the numbers of kinksters among their kind is no less than the number among ours, or they do realize it and hate us because we are not consumed by guilt over it.
And who do you think pride is for anyway? It has never been and is not now a presentation to the heteros of how “normal” we our. It is us claiming our space where we can behave exactly as we choose with safety in numbers. OTHERS put us in a terrible light when people like you give them the power to do so by buying into their lies and bull.
Kangol2
You’ve never been to Pride, you’re worried about with heteros’ views of LGBTQIA+ people, and you are talking about keeping things hidden in the dark..I mean, your comments really speak volumes about how much internal homophobia you still have. Why are you so afraid? You could at least show up at a Pride parade first before commenting on them, but I guess one of these days you’ll make that leap and get over your fears. Or maybe not.
Prax07
YMMV means your miles/mileage may vary
Doug
Strange that Mardi Gras has always been known as being pretty decadent and most people have no misgivings about it… in fact, they celebrate it. Why is a Gay Pride parade singled out for doing the same thing?
GlobeTrotter
I might be mistaken, but the exhibitionism at Mardi Gras has more to do with costume and choreography. Two female cousins of mine spend weeks making their own skimpy outfits and practicing their dance moves for Mardi Gras every year.
At gay pride parades however, it’s all about the in your face simulation of the most extreme sex acts imaginable, to the point where we come off as sex-craved sex addicts, as one other poster above put it. And if you object to this level of extremism, you’re labeled a “prude” or lectured on “pride”. There’s a difference however between celebrating gay pride/visibility and being so insecure in your sexuality that you feel the need to shock in order to impress.
Den
Yup, you are mistaken about both Mardi Gras and Gay Pride events. The floats and marching contingents vary from fairly chaste to lascivious as hell, though all have intricate and lovingly made costumes. And the people in the streets get the coveted Mardi Gras beads FROM BEARING THEIR TITS, OR SHOWING THEIR DICKS/ASSES when asked to by people on the balconies and in the parades.
And at Gay Pride almost none of it is about “in your face simulation ” of anything! Sounds like you have never been to either, and only watched one on FOX news.
Mardi Gras excesses are tolerated BECAUSE THEY ARE OVERWHELMINGLY HETEROSEXUAL. Pride excesses, which are exponentially fewer than your imagination claims, are controversial BECAUSE THEY ARE HOMOSEXUAL and offend folks like you who seem to want to think Pride has something to do with kowtowing to heterosexuals.
Kangol2
Very good point. Also, at Carnival/West Indian Day/Jouvert, etc. celebrations in New York, Miami, etc. you see people in very skimpy and sexually explicit costumes and no one freaks out, children are present, etc. Even the cops get into the hip shaking and grinding, because it’s a celebration.
Jaws1939
Pride is for everyone under the LGBTQI. I am not into kink but why should I care if other people are. Pride means enjoying your life as you are!
RandomGuy
Everyone has the right to be who they are, and enjoy what they enjoy, but Pride was meant to be for all of us, and guys dressed as puppies wagging their buttplug tails at me isn’t pride, it’s kinksters getting off on exhibitionism, and shocking people.
Den
So then you obviously do not mean “pride was meant to be for all of us” do you? You mean “I believe pride is supposed to be for people who dress, act and think pretty much as I do or as I think they should.”
A large percentage of heterosexual, almost exclusively on the right, think gay people doing ANYTHING in public that identifies them as in a same sex pair bond is shocking exhibitionism. You empower them.
Dunder Tom
Gen Z Julian said it perfectly. “pride should be fo everyone.” Kink included.
519
My problem with displaying kinks is that there are more and more children on the parades as many LGBT+ people take their kids to Pride. I’m really not sure if seeing this kind of stuff is healthy for them, although I’m not a psychologist, so I can’t know for sure. There should be some ground rules so that the parade is family friendly and for everyone. For example, I don’t think it’d be a problem to have people dressed in leather to express their kinks, but the assless chaps and imitating sexual acts are really unnecessary.
markpkessinger
Oh, please! Everything doesn’t have to be Disney!
519
I’m not saying it should be Disney. I’m only saying that there is a certain level of decency that should be expected from everyone who participates. Otherwise right-wingers will keep on saying that pride parades are full of exhibitionist perverts and it’s not safe for children, and it’ll be really hard to fight their arguments.
PubicHairus
When I was a wee little queer, I would’ve LOVED seeing men express their leather kink in a parade. It would’ve told me there was a life out there where self-expression was possible and pride in that self-expression was celebrated rather than shunned.
This conservative trend towards queer people shaming other queer people for expression in order to appease a heteronormative expectation is alarming, and I hope the majority of queer people do not agree. Often, the dumbest and most shortsighted folks are the loudest–even when they are a minority.
519
You wish you saw grown up men showing their asses to everyone and imitating sex when you were little? Okay, that’s not alarming. At all… Also no one is shunning anything. But if you wouldn’t do something when you just walk down the street on a regular day, why would you do it on a pride parade? Or why don’t you do it on a regular day as well? Also, the community should really should decide what the parades are for then. Do we want to show straight people that we are not that different from them, or we want to show that we have fetishes that the majority of people probably don’t want to see in public?
And before you come at me with internalized homophobia, I wouldn’t want to see people showing their asses or imitating sex regardless of orientation, because I don’t think that’s something that should be done in public. I have nothing against marching in leather gear, I think that should be enough to express what people are into. Otherwise you are alienating people, and your argument that pride is for everyone becomes invalid.
Den
Thank you Mark!
Den
“But if you wouldn’t do something when you just walk down the street on a regular day, why would you do it on a pride parade?”
BECAUSE. IT’S. A. PARADE! DUH!!
Everyone there understands that they are going to see the things they do. Nobody is suddenly teleported and dropped on the edge of Market Street or wherever. Get real. The parades are for US, they are not to show heterosexuals anything. Everyday is hetero pride day. Every ad in the media (practically, that is starting to change) is a Hetero pride ad. Almost every television program, popular song, book, magazine and so on is a paean to heterosexual supremacy.
Pride is for US, the parade is for US, the crowds are for US. The events are theater, and over the top in part. Don’t like those parts? Then look away. They are not to placate those who hate us, as they will hate us and lie about us and try to make us go away regardless of what we do. For God’s sake, have some pride in yourself!
519
Sorry, I can’t be proud of people, who don’t know what’s okay in public on a supposedly family friendly parade, and what’s not. And if pride means showing your ass and stuff to everyone then no, not every day is hetero pride.
OsoDark
If Gen Z Julian is so adamantly against kink at pride celebrating freedom of sexuality then I’m anxious to know how he feels about his generation of music artists. I feel like they do the same thing glamaurizing sexuality. Lizzo, Lil Nas X, Doja Cat, etc. etc. I’m sure he has seen a lot of their videos. Was that consent to see Lizzo shaking her half naked a$$ on national tv? I’m so blown away that someone can have a such a riteuous disapproval of something. Seems very toxic to me.
inbama
No one marching in those first parades imagined that gay and lesbian characters and stories would be part of regular programming on virtually every media outlet or that same sex marriage would even exist. With even more accomplished than most activists ever dreamed of, our former civil rights organizations have drifted into leftist intersectionalism where kink has a place but LGBT cops are banned from marching together in uniform.
This week’s abortion ruling shows how fragile rights won through reliance on court decisions can be. We should take Clarence Thomas’s threat to our progress very seriously.
Is it possible to create a disciplined movement that’s able to win the needed votes to overcome decisions by Trump’s Supreme Court? Success in the past relied on assuring the public that we were no different from everyone else. That idea in this Age of Identities seems obsolete.
markpkessinger
What history are you reading? Bigotry didn’t need a reason in the past and if doesn’t need a reason now.
The Mattachine Society believed as you do, i.e., that if only we conducted ourselves respectably enough by the standards of straight society, that we would gain acceptance. But that approach didn’t get us very far, and it sure as hell didn’t stop the police harassment, the ruined careers and the evictions. When we began to make real progress as a community was when we finally said “enough,” and began cleaning ourselves AND our sexuality loudly and proudly!
Diplomat
Mark,
It’s not about fitting in or impressing anyone. It’s more about not grossing people out.
Den
“It’s not about fitting in or impressing anyone. It’s more about not grossing people out.”
The people needed no actual reasons to be “grossed out” by us in the 1950’s. No attempt to remove the things that apparently gross YOU out now will remove the disgust the right wing has for us in the present time. No amount of kowtowing to heterosexual evangelicals and fundamentalists will stop their lies about us.
Mark is correct.
Kangol2
Inbama, you sound utterly ahistorical. Do you have ANY CLUE about who marched in the early Pride parades in New York, San Francisco, Los Angeles, etc.?
–Most WERE POLITICALLY LEFTIST and RADICAL and INTERSECTIONAL in their politics;
–many were sex radicals;
–most were anti-establishment (cf. the Gay Activists Alliance, radicalesbians, etc.);
–all remembered the police brutality on display at Stonewall and other venues;
–and they were not the tame, scared, silent center-right homonormative bots you seem to imagine.
These were the people marching and fighting for your right to be ahistorical. The people in the past did NOT “rely on assuring the public we were no different from everyone else!” Where did you even get this nonsensical, ahistorical crap? Your ignorance is not bliss–if you don’t believe me and others, just look it up! There are more than enough books and documentaries to stir you out of your ignorance!
Paul2
What’s next, banning drag at pride? Come on, leather and kink has been around since I came out in the 60’s, and most likely before. We are all in this together. If it bothers your sensabilities don’t look at it. The guys in the picture are pretty hot.
frapachino
Is it any surprise that the most radical leftists in here are the ones against gay men expressing their freedoms at the pride parades? You people are setting us all back with all your radical politics.
Den
Actually those who are whining are the right wingers like you. None of the progressives are making the claims that we all have to act “normally” Are you that far removed from reality?
Den
I should say that rather than necessarily being far removed from reality, you might simply be lying. Both are very likely for you right wingers.
Kangol2
What are you babbling about? Radical leftists strongly support LGBTQIA+ people in their/our self-expression, though if you are expressing anti-LGBTQIA+ attitudes, you know, maybe skip Pride. If you want to wear a monk’s cassock and carry your rosary at Pride I’m as for it as if you want to a leather harness, chaps, and biker boots! Stop trying to gaslight everyone, Fraps!
mz.sam
Why Queerity has not reported on the terrorist shooting and a Queer club in Oslo, Norway this week of Pride month? This is tragic and just as important as the Pulse Nightclub shootings.
DavidIntl
I have been really surprised at how little attention that has gotten in general.
inbama
The murder of over-privileged white gays doesn’t fit the Woke narrative as to who is “most marginalized” and who is not.
Meanwhile, there is a pattern here:
Muslim Zaniar Matapour, two shot dead and injuring 21 others in Oslo just days ago.
Muslim Yousef Palani, beheaded 2 gay men in Sligo, Ireland earlier this year
Muslim Khairi Saadallah confessed to stabbing 3 gay men to death in Reading, England this past November.
Kangol2
Wow, here comes inbama with the racist invective–“over-privleged white gays”….”Woke narrative….” Are you going to add this to your ahistorical understanding of the LGBTQ rights and equality movements too?
inbama
@Kangol
Racist?
Man, you are such a left stereotype.
If the victims were trans, you’d be adding them up for the next “Remembrance Day,’ but they’re white and gay, so you don’t give a d**n.
All that matters to you is to keep everyone from knowing that the murderers were Islamic extremists, and to keep that info from the public, you’ll brand anyone who mentions it a racist.
You’ve just perfectly illustrated how intersectionality steers any group away from its actual mission.
sfhairy
And the children will get over it. Kink has a place at pride, whether the little children like it or not.
DavidIntl
I support everyone being themselves, yes, but I agree with the voices pointing out that the way the LGBT community presents itself is often counterproductive in the ongoing battle for us to gain acceptance in the world at large. I am not personally uncomfortable with anything I have seen in a parade, but I don’t feel a need to antagonise people who otherwise could be brought on board as supporters of our cause.
LegionKeign
I thought Folsom Street Fair and Southern Decadence was for the Kink crowd and the Parades were for the family types, the twinks, the muscle boys, the himbos, the Asians, the Latin(x)? is that PC?, the Jews, the Arabs, the First Nation folks the Dikes on Bikes, the Trans, the Non-Binary, oh, shit I’ve lost my train of thought….
Velvetalex
Kink is fine just not on designated family days.
Kangol2
Pride Parades are for all LGBTQIA+ people, so people in kink gear have a place at them. Attending yesterday’s events in NYC, as with events all over the city, and the many Prides and gay-themed holiday (Halloween) marches I’ve attended across the US over the years, sometimes as part of the marches, sometimes as an observer or representing an outreach organization, and I’ve seen people, including families with children–many of them probably not LGBTQIA, but definitely without right-wing hangups–at these events for years.
This current wave of right-wing anti-LGBTQ hysteria is yet another power play, and one of the saddest things to witness is how many LGBTQ people, including some on here, internalize this anti-LGBTQ hatred and fear, and then try to gaslight the rest of us into buying into it.
As the earliest marchers in the 1970s–the Stonewall veterans, the people involved with the Gay Activists Alliance and the later Gay Liberation Front, as well as regular people who were empowered by Stonewall and subsequent rebellions all knew, the fight for LGBTQ liberation, rights, and equality involve struggle and that no matter how much we try to conform to heteronormative ideals, there are still going to be a sizable number of people trying to erase us, so working together across our differences, while acknowledging them and celebrating them, towards those larger goals is essential.
Diplomat
“This current wave of right-wing anti-LGBTQ hysteria is yet another power play, and one of the saddest things to witness is how many LGBTQ people, including some on here, internalize this anti-LGBTQ hatred and fear, and then try to gaslight the rest of us into buying into it.”
I think you’re jumping to conclusions. We’re not right wing at all. We’re people with moral compass just like str8s. No public nudity at parades. It’s tasteless and classless. That’s the standard in this country. It’s not right wing, it’s culturally responsible. It’s not about fitting in w straights, it’s about decency.
Now if you are completely miopic and could care less what the public thinks, that’s your story. But it’s definitely not the majority. Not taking the whole of society into consideration on this public matter is dangerous.
These attitudes in the LGB community have been around forever. It’s nothing new. What’s new is an article discussing it.
We’re getting our rights anyway and since this public debauchery has been present since day one, it’s really too late even for discussion. The damage is done. But I will say I’m all in for private debauchery.