An “effeminate” man is worried be might be “too effeminate,” so he’s seeking a second opinion from his local advice columnist.
“I’m an extremely effeminate (not to the point of transgenderism) homosexual man,” the letter begins, “and I was wondering: What are your thoughts on males who behave like females (wearing makeup, into fashion, etc.)?”
Related: Man Seeks Advice: Why Is Being Asian, Gay, And Effeminate Frowned Upon?
The man continues by saying that sometimes “I feel that God does not like the way I am.”
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He wonders: “So would you say I should change, even though this comes naturally for me?”
In his response, advice guru N. John Shore, Jr tells the man to “screw changing [himself] to please others.”
“The world needs men who predominantly exhibit stereotypically feminine behavior, and women who predominantly exhibit stereotypical male behavior,” he writes. “People like you … are showing all of us how we, too, might live into the joyfully expansive totality of who we really are.”
He continues: “People such as yourself are the heroes of our society. You’re leading us to a fuller, richer understanding of what it means to be human.”
But it doesn’t stop there.
Related: Woman Writes Candidly About Discovering Her Husband’s Gay Double Life
Shore applauds the man for being “part of the movement of people who are evolving us past those kinds of ruinous, cruel, long-held stereotypes.”
“Simply by virtue of having the courage to be yourself, you are teaching us that no behavior, thought process, or natural inclination is exclusively ‘male’ or ‘female’–that everything always contains elements of both,” he writes.
He concludes by saying, “And you don’t have to worry about whether or not God is OK with your being and living exactly as you were created. … If you painted a beautiful picture in the most vibrantly wonderful colors, would you then want that picture rendered in black and white? Of course you wouldn’t. You’d want that baby to shine, just the way you made it.”
We couldn’t have said it better ourselves.
Related: Are Modern Gay Men Obsessed With ‘Seeming Straight’? This Guy Thinks So.
Danny279
Sad and gross. It’s kinda funny how much Queerty posts on this subject and on hooking up. Queerty is obsessed with trying to persuade gay men to be as effeminate and as promiscuous as possible, even though gender deviance and promiscuity are both overwhelmingly associated with poor mental and physical health. Effeminacy and promiscuity are both unattractive and that is why so much energy is needed to promote them.
Thank god gay men are charting a new and better course, where we will live not as minstrel acts and girlish clowns, but as men with self-respect and dignity.
Aromaeus
@Danny279: You sound jealous of all the fem gays getting more d!ck than you.
ChrisK
@Danny279: Speaking of poor mental health I see you’re still posting factless BS about your insane new world order.
ChrisK
@Aromaeus: Anyone with self respect would kick that insane judgmental troll to the curb immediately.
ChrisK
I’m masculine myself and I have friends who are effeminate. No big deal. I wouldn’t want to be in a world where everyone marched to the same beat. Talk about boring.
mdosac
Yes, by all means, do change. All of my gay friends are only attracted to men who act like men. The minute you open your mouth with the purse flying out, all erections then go soft, much like you. Effeminate men are one of the main reasons gay men are not accepted by the majority of my straight friends, man up!
DDstar1me
@mdosac- You are a fool. LMAO.
Paco
@mdosac: Did you really just blame homophobia on effeminate gay men? Homophobes don’t make a distinction between masculine or feminine gay men. They hate us all because we aren’t sleeping with the opposite sex and they have the same reaction whether the two men are burly lumberjacks or twinkish young men.
When your straight buddies boast about their latest big chested conquests, do they enjoy hearing about the big, hairy masculine c0ck you had in your mouth the night before? Highly doubt it. Don’t ask, don’t tell doesn’t equal acceptance.
astro.dude
@Danny279 @mdosac So refreshing to see other gay dudes pushing back against the pc police who want to us to be feminine & promiscuous. Effeminate men are not only one of the main reasons why we aren’t more accepted by society, they are also one of the reasons so many guys stay closeted. If you’re just a regular dude, you don’t people to associate you with being feminine & prosmiscuous. And yeah, me and all the gay guys I know are attracted to masculine men make jokes about effeminate men (i.e. that one opened his mouth and a purse fell out..)
Brian
Effeminacy in a man is a sign that you’re prepared to take the side of women. It also de-sexualizes you in the eyes of women, thus enabling a woman to see you as “one of the girls”.
A man with effeminate mannerisms will often exaggerate them in the presence of women.
DDstar1me
@ astro.dude @mdosac ….Yes, while guys like you stay in hiding. The Fems have already done the heavy lifting. Now the so called “masc’ gays can come out and profit from everything the Fems had to teach the public about acceptance. At least Fem guys are brave enough to be themselves. People like what they like and that is ok. I know plenty of masc guys that prefer fem guys. So lets not pigeon hole a sub-culture of men because you see a piece of them in yourselves. I WISH DIAHERRA ON ALL YOU FEM HATING GAY MEN. LMAO.
Josh447
This masc / fem thing among gay men is a difficult opposite to resolve. I fall into the category that people cannot tell that I am gay yet I’m attracted to men who are right in between masc and fem, you can tell they are gay but when they open their mouth they sound like men and do not speak purse. Like straight people who just can’t figure out gay people because they aren’t gay and were not born that way, it’s been a real eye-opener for me to finally understand that fem guys were born that way and technically should have no bearing upon them to change. Once I got out of the ignorant phase of thinking that they were into some sort of act that they could control, like straight people thinking men who are gay can control themselves into being straight, I had a lot more acceptance for the fem guys and the tribulations they suffer. Now I find myself to be completely accepting of them because it’s their nature and not some self-imposed attention-getting Act. My mistake. I would date one if the situation presented itself.
Heywood Jablowme
@Danny279: @astro.dude: This article doesn’t even mention promiscuity, so why are you guys equating effeminacy and promiscuity???
He mentions “fashion” and “makeup,” neither of which are generally or automatically associated with promiscuity.
Do you really think masculine gay men are NEVER promiscuous??? That’s a very odd assumption to make.
Heywood Jablowme
I’m surprised no one here has brought up this guy’s funniest line:
“I feel that God does not like the way I am.”
Ridiculous! Oh well, if he hasn’t already changed his effeminate ways for GOD, I think it’s unlikely he’ll change just because Danny279 and astro.dude tell him to!
CaliKyle
@DDstar1me: Im stereotypically masculine and have always been most attracted to and enamored of pretty males who are considered effeminate. I agree with you that fem boys with the courage to be themselves should be admired and respected, not mocked or pitied.
Mkiel
@mdosac: you are a bigoted idiot.
Danny279
@Heywood Jablowme: I mentioned promiscuity because it, along with gender deviance, are the twin pillars of the quasi-religion known as “queer” – a belief system which is constantly evangelized on this and other sites. We should be aware of the agenda that the editors have when they push stories like this.
@DDstar1me – You talk about “Fems” and “Mascs” like they are two different species. That’s false. There are no Fems and Mascs. There are men. And as men, we should all strive to live up to the standards of manly conduct, defined as the conduct practiced and respected by men. It may be more difficult for some, but with effort and perseverance, they can succeed. The worst course is to give up on yourself and to act like a girlish minstrel performer. If you degrade yourself, you can hardly expect others to respect you. I have seen such gender deviant men and they are respected by no one. Not by gay men (who are turned off by them), not by straight men (who are repulsed by them) and not even by women (who treat them like a source of entertainment).
Heywood Jablowme
@Danny279: “…they are respected by no one. Not by gay men (who are turned off by them), not by straight men (who are repulsed by them)…”
Since, in general, both gay and straight men are sexually turned off by effeminate gay men (and I don’t necessarily disagree with you about that), why are you so sure that effeminate gay men are promiscuous in the first place? Who are they being promiscuous WITH? There’s nobody left!
You can’t have it both ways.
Paco
@Heywood Jablowme: Fairly certain straight men are sexually turned off by men in general, masculine or feminine. Unless you meant the in the closet variety of “straight”.
Heywood Jablowme
@Paco: I don’t disagree. Although I suppose there’s a certain type of “straight” man who’s sexually interested in transvestite types. No official census figures on how many, or how promiscuous they might be. 🙂
I’m just trying to pin down why Danny279 assumes these two things (effeminacy & promiscuity) go together like peanut butter & jelly. I really doubt he has thought this through.
dwes09
@Danny279: “Sad and gross. Thank god gay men are charting a new and better course, where we will live not as minstrel acts and girlish clowns, but as men with self-respect and dignity.”
I don’t really know how to respond to you in a way that is either kind or civil in any way. I’ll start by saying Queerty has never spent many column inches trying to persuade anybody to be anything they are not. That is entirely in your imagination. The new course we are charting is the understanding that we can behave any way we want so long as we are not (as you are) mean spirited and ignorant, and we can desire whoever we want without fearing disapproval from twits like you.
You know little boy, people used to say the higher levels of substance abuse among gay men of all sorts were due to our weak physical and mental makeup. Turns out it was really the result of societal distaste, turns out it was people like you, but straight ones, who were the problem. Personally I am not sexually attracted to effeminacy or androgyny, but I would never be the asshole you are and project my personal sexual taste as an indication of what was healthy and intrinsic behavior in others.
It goes both ways, that clownish thing. We, as a community don’t need mannish clowns such as yourself who are so unsure of what little true masculinity you possess that you need to diminish others to see yourself as whole. Little boy, you are in no position to present your opinion about the mental health of anyone. Yours is all you should be concerned about given your post.
Danny279
@Heywood Jablowme: You seem slow, so let me try again. I didn’t say that effeminate men themselves were more promiscuous. I said that effeminacy and promiscuity are the two things pushed by this website and by the quasi-religion of “queer.” It was a comment about Queerty and the frequency of its posts on those 2 topics, not on the promiscuity of effeminate men per se. There is little doubt that both normal and effeminate men can be promiscuous.
That having been said, it is possible that effeminate men, being less desirable to gay men generally, might prefer a subculture of promiscuity for 2 simple reasons. First, in a promiscuous subculture (with bathhouses and backrooms), it is possible for these men to hook up with complete strangers and with a minimum of social interaction, thus making it easier to conceal their effeminacy. Second, if people are having more sex with many different partners, they are less likely to be choosy. When you are having sex with scores or hundreds or even thousands of partners, you care a lot less about vetting #327, with whom you will be copulating for the next 10 minutes than you would the man you might be dating for the next 2 years and then marrying. In a promiscuous subculture, less desirable effeminate men might still “get some” even if what they are getting is loveless, diseased copulation with strangers. So there might well be a connection, even if it is not a necessary connection.
RomanHans
> There is little doubt that both normal and effeminate men can be promiscuous.
Ha! That’s pretty good trolling. I’d say that’s good work for either a non-idiot or Danny279.
dwes09
@Danny279: You are calling someone else slow!? Hahahahahahaha.
You cannot even tell the difference between your imagination/neuroses and reality.
Maleness and masculinity are essentially and overwhelmingly social constructs. Specific anatomical differences and greater upper body strength are what separate men from women, and that is not even always true. Not too long ago in western civilization men wore the high heels and the makeup. And even now among the African Wodaabe the men wear the makeup and see extreme vanity as a male characteristic.
One of the things that characterizes “true” masculinity is comfort in one’s own skin and not being threatened by difference. How fucking weak you must be inside (emotional weakness, not the already noted intellectual weakness)!
Heywood Jablowme
@Danny279: Ha. I bet you’re a real flamer.
dwes09
@Heywood Jablowme: He is so scared to flame even occasionally for fun that he probably gets cramps in his wrists from trying to keep them rigid and immobile.
dwes09
@Danny279: During the war, stationed on Guam, my dad and a few friends used to dress up and do Andrews Sisters routines, dancing and lip syncing (a military tradition that persists to this day among hetero men). He and his buds were more man than you could ever hope to be. He’d think you a twit as soon as you spouted a few sentences of your bull.
Baba Booey Fafa Fooey
@Paco: You are a gem in this site. I love your posts.
Danny279
@dwes09: If masculinity is “essentially and overwhelmingly” a social construct, then so is effeminacy. There is no need for effeminate men to cling to that particular social construct and it is no particular big deal to ask that they adopt a different social construct. Glad we worked that out.
As for your dead father dressing up as the Andrew Sisters and having fun with his buddies, that has nothing to do with effeminacy. In fact, it is the opposite of effeminacy. Why? Because those guys were doing it for laughs. They weren’t embracing the idea of men acting like women, they were laughing at the sight of it. Big burly soldiers dolled up and trying to be the Andrews Sisters was hilarious to them. If any of them actually started acting like a woman for real, in daily life, or tried to argue that it was just as valid for men to prance around and act like women in daily life, I can assure you the laughter would very quickly stop and that person would find himself swimming to Hawaii. BTW, what killed your father? Was his demise perhaps hastened by the heartbreaking knowledge that his son failed to develop normally as a man?
Paco
@Baba Booey Fafa Fooey: Thanks! 🙂
Baba Booey Fafa Fooey
@Heywood Jablowme: “I feel that God does not like the way I am.” Sad.
Chris
Be genuine. If that means you are effeminate, then so be it. ….. on the other hand, if it’s an act, then people may be turned off by the act and not by the effeminacy per se.
robho3
One thing I’ve realized in my 50+ years on this earth is that if someone isn’t into you because you act too ‘gay” or whatever is that there are about 20 other people that do… so fuck the bitches who aren’t into you for whatever reason. Be comfortable in your own skin. And would you really want someone in your lif who is that shallow anyway?
NateOcean
It’s helpful to have a few effeminate friends around; others notice, and consequently it improves your own masculinity rating.
SonOfKings
I’ve noticed that many gay men who are very effeminate and androgynous in their teens and early twenties gradually butch up, grow hair on their chest, and get muscles as they approach their thirties and beyond. I think it’s because that emo/waif/sugar-twink thing only works well on very young men. It’s less cute as they get older, so they go in another direction, eventually turning into bears at some later point. My advice to effeminate 19 year olds is to work that gig for all it’s worth now, because they may be looking like lumberjacks by the time they are 30. And then there will be a new game to play.
Neonegro
People should be who they are and behave as they feel.
You are effeminate, good for you.
You are masculine, good for you.
You are nondescript, good for you.
You will not fool anyone by ACTING.
As for me I prefer a quiet masculinity that does not need to shout. You simply feel it when you are in its presence.
Neonegro
@SonOfKings: growing hair on their chest and getting muscles will not make them masculine. They will simply be hairy and or muscular effeminate men. There are plenty of those.
One is either masculine or one is not.