pop stars

Mika Finally Caves to the Pressure and Comes Out. As Bisexual


It’s a great scoop for a gay magazine to get a celebrity to admit he’s not straight. But we always knew that about Mika, the Lebanese pop star whose second single “Blame It On The Girls” is making the rounds. Except Mika always refused to talk about his sexuality, and a certain celebrity blogger in the business of outing famous persons helped him hide it. Which is fine; not our business. But now Mika has come out. As bi.

His second album The Boy Who Knew Too Much is the perfect time to drop a publicity bomb. Or at least acknowledge one that everyone’s been talking about since Mika busted on the scene over two years ago. “I’ve never ever labeled myself,” he tells Gay & Night. “But having said that; I’ve never limited my life, I’ve never limited who I sleep with. So, whatever. (…) Call me whatever you want. Call me bisexual, if you need a term for me.”

Actually, “post-emo cartoon character” was the term we had been using for you, so we don’t need one.

But now, Mika, you’ve opened yourself up to the kids who don’t believe in male bisexuality, who will say you’re Bi Now, Gay Later. But whatever Mika’s sexuality, his mere invitation to no longer speculate about which way he swings, but discuss it in hard terms is a turning point for the brown-locked boy wonder. And we’re gonna run with it.

How appropriate, then, that tomorrow is National Bisexuality Day.

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  • hephaestion

    How very Elton John circa 1977 of him.

  • sfhairy

    Suuuuuuure Mika. Sure you like the coslopus! I’m so sure you’re down there eating out the taco with hot dogs on your mind. Just fess up to it and be gay.

  • alan brickman

    Everyone is bisexual…..

  • wmcarpenter

    How very David Bowie circa 1972 of him.

  • Cam

    So let me guess….he’s bisexual because he once kissed a girl in middle school and since then has had 17 boyfriends and never kissed another girl except for some drunken night when his fag hag best friend got him to sleep with her then caused hysterical drama for the next 4 months because he wouldn’t date her.

    Yeeeeaaaaahhhhh Mika, you’re SO bi.

  • Cole


    Exactly! I was wondering when was the last time he had sex with a girl.

  • Mike

    Jesus, you guys are all biphobic idiots. Let it go.

  • Puck

    Bi now, Bi forever.
    Some people just like Taco and Sausage, especially these so many ppl just enjoy sex and sexuality. No labels other than Queer or not straight

  • GeoffM

    Pleeease with the ‘biphobic’ comments. Mika is absolutely gay, he just has ‘issues’. (Economic issues I’m sure)

  • Rojo Caliente

    I seem to recall Perez’s original posting about Mika years ago- touting him as the next, new big pop thing- who WAS gay. He claimed he was “out” already, one of the reasons he continued to feature him so prominently. If I’m not mistaken, he was rather open about his sexuality in the UK until he got pulled under the management of Tommy Mottola (of Mariah Carey et al.) who insisted he be far more coy about his sexuality when making appearances stateside. Sad all around.

  • fubar

    There is one thing that bi men and bi women have in common. They both sleep with men

  • ThatguyFromBoston

    Frankly, I don’t care who he sleeps with as long as it’s not me!

  • HiredGoons

    @alan brickman: I remember when I ‘experimented’ in colllege; by this of course I mean sleeping with women.

  • HiredGoons

    @HiredGoons: college, even.

  • The Swimmer

    I love MIKA to death!! So nobody bash him. Let’s face it though, he is about as straight as a three-dollar bill dipped in cosmo and then lit on fire.

  • alejandro

    and this is why i would never come out as bi…
    its easier to say your just gay.

  • Cam

    To all of you that accuse us of being “Bi-Phobic” I’m not phobic of anything, If you’re gay, lesbian, Transgender, etc… cool with me. I’m just going on experience. I have yet to meet one person who told me that they were Bi, who isn’t out as gay a few years later. The two people I know who said they were “Bi” who married people of the opposit sex have since admitted to me that they are going crazy in marriage and miss sleeping with their own sex and they did it to make their families happy. Oh, I almost forgot about the good friend of mine who married another “Bi” guy. He told her that to him men and women were the same and that he was attracted to the goodness of a person and that it didn’t matter what their sex was, and of course he could be happy married to her and not be with any other men. Well about once a year or so this guy has too much to drink and drunkenly gropes me telling me how much he “Misses Dick” but being married with kids is really great and his family is really happy with it etc…then he’ll try to kiss me and ask me to have sex with him and nobody will know.

    So again, am I bi-phobic? Or have I just never met any man who said he was “Bi-sexual” that seemed to stay that way. If I ever meet a Bi guy, sneaking around behind his BOYFRIENDS back with a woman, just for sex, then I’ll believe that that guy is Bi.

    I don’t believe in Santa Clause…does that make me “Santa Phobic”?

  • ThatguyFromBoston

    @ Cam: Yes, yes it does.

  • John from England(used to be just John but there are other John's)

    He’s horrid.

  • John from England(used to be just John but there are other John's)


    Good point.

    But I do think you can be attracted to-people. But I know what you mean about the ‘cake and wanting to…’

  • Nizara

    His 2nd CD must be tanking… no radio play in the USA
    and he has nothing to lose…except countless tweens who bring him teddy bears. UGh

    so he’s BI ? does his boyfriend know? T

  • GeoffM

    @The Swimmer: Your comment made me laugh out loud. Fantastic.

  • Chris

    @Cam: I’ve been out as bisexual for the entire 15 years that I’ve been out at all. For what it’s worth.

  • Kid A

    You people have got to be kidding me.

    @Cam: This is probably the most overt straw man I’ve ever read.

    If a Catholic priest had echoed your comments but instead directed them toward gays, Queerty would pull out the usual “homophobia” card and make it a big story with a youtube link. You say it’s not biphobic to say you’ve never met someone who’s bi (by your standards), but many straight people at Exodus think that they’ve never met someone who’s not secretly straight (and just rebelling from God.) Are they not homophobic? Denying millions of people their sexual expression is silencing and is no better than those you all denounce on Queerty daily.

    And Queerty, you’ve consistently had a snarky editorial tone about bisexuality (when you’ve mentioned it at all) and your main page link to Cam’s comment just further cements your policy. Commenters: on “is he or is he ain’t” articles, it could take 100 speculative comments before anyone even suggested that the Will Smith or Mario Lopez in question just might be bi. Soon after of course, the comment would be shouted down and the B in LGBT even further marginalized.

    We all share the same experience. After the election, there was a storm of activity on Queerty asking how blacks could themselves make discrimination law, after suffering from it just a few decades ago. Couldn’t a group that suffered oppression understand the oppression of others? In that sense, Blacks:LGBT::Gays:Bisexuals. It’s a very limited analogy, but the general concept fits.

    I’ve been a longtime Queerty reader and occasional poster, for more years than I can remember, at least 3 or 4, and I’ve consistently encouraged articles about bisexuality and commented with corrections to commenters and even articles. At this point, I’ve just about had enough. I’m not trying to be a victim here. I’m not saying anyone in LGB has it any worse than anyone else. I’m saying I’m tired of little representation, and only negatively when it appears. How can you expect middle-america to understand you when you can’t even understand members of your own community? I need to stop ranting, but to wrap it up, I’m out. I’ll check on this post for a bit just to see if there’s any useful discussion, but I’ll be getting my LGBT news elsewhere. Not that this was “news,” or anything but G for the most part anyway. Peace out.

  • gomez

    the bi-bashing is so predicatable. never will understand what is so threatening to gay men about bisexual men. like it’s not enough bi men get it from str8s, they have to get a dogpile from their gay brothers as well. so effin over it.

    i think it’s because certain gay men are so attached to their minority victim status sexuality that they need to circle the wagons every time the see someone deviating from their gay handbook of “realness”, because, i don’t know, they perceive that they’re losing a member or that people will claim that sexuality isn’t so fixed and innate after all.

    it’s these same offended gay men who are the more effeminate of us, and engage in the more stereotypical “queen” behavior, mannerisms and cultural identifiers.

    so the persecuted become the persecutors once again.

    what part of glBt don’t you understand?

  • Mika who

    Jake Gyllenhaal is not Bi. He is Gayyyyy.

    Come out Toothy

  • John from England(used to be just John but there are other John's)

    @Kid A:

    Kid, it’s not personal-nothing here it is but it’s a bugger that this seems to be the only snarky/fun blog around about gay news.

    Bi people need to be more open with HOW they feel and WHY…

    Can you not understand why people are dubious from their experience??

    I now-never post here because it has changed after they got rid of the last editor but do so often when I feel like it and its not too oppressive, cruel or racist.

    I jus think you Bi’s need to be more vocal about who you are etc…and your difficulties because I know that some of us who maybe fancied the other sex when we were young or at one time…still don’t understand..

  • M Shane

    I don’t know to much about Mika, but there are a lot of cute Lebonese. My experience with ‘bi’s, is that they may go on dates with women who are closeted lesbians or just be friends with women they date, and it proves to (1) be a convenient cover if theyy get caught at work doing it with a guy, and (2) they hope to attract other closeted gays.

    While I have really had several relationships with women , I prefer not to tell anyone, because it is not my preferance and I would just as soon let people do what thay want with their prejudice. I could do it with sheeop to if I wanted. Also I don’t want to encourage more women, who tend to think if I can do it , I will really like them-no way).

  • The Swimmer

    I have to agree with those condemning bi-phobia. There is NOTHING to be gained out of attacking a person who labels themselves bi. We need all the out and allies we can get. Let us be thankful that many people are able to admit as much as having an inclination for the same-sex let alone those who are exclusively.

  • Zack

    @Cam: I can’t imagine why bisexual people wouldn’t want to meet you.

  • Cam

    @Kid A: You said “@Cam: This is probably the most overt straw man I’ve ever read. ”

    Please learn the definition of a “Strawman Argument” before accusing others of it. Once again, I have no problem whatsoever with people that are bi-sexual. I have problems with Phony lesbians like the two straight girls trying to give guys in a hooters a charge. Similarly, ever single experience I have ever had in meeting somebody professing to be “Bi” ended up with them not being “Bi” a few years later, or running around cheating on their wives with men.

    If you are a genuine Bisexual that is great, good for you. but the way that Bisexuals could probably stop the disbeleif would be to at least ADMIT that many many gay and lesbian people first claim to be “bi” as a step towards coming out. Most people on here who are bi always refuse to do that. Since that goes against most of our experiences it tends to negate a lot of the argument.

    Again, all I ever hear from bisexuals on here usually are a bunch of posts about how misunderstood and discriminated against you are. you have to understaand, when 99% of the people we meet who say they are bi are really just gays taking that first step out of the closet, that is just what we know.

    Chris on here didn’t bitch and whine about how unfair the world is…he merely said
    “@Cam: I’ve been out as bisexual for the entire 15 years that I’ve been out at all. For what it’s worth.”

    Ok, there you go, there is somebody who is bi, thanks Chris. That is pretty much all I needed to hear.

    For the rest of you, relax. this guy is from a muslim country, he was pressured in the interview and you could read that his answer was dogy and tentative. It is obvious that this is a scared closeted gay, not a bi guy because, with his upbrining, if he WAS bi, he would be trotting around a girlfriend to all the media events. THAT is where the initial comments about him not being bi came from. To see that as an attack is ridiculous. It would be like Hetros seeing it as an attack on them if Lesbians come out and say that there is no way Katy Perry is a lesbian.

  • suzanne

    I am bisexual and proud of being it. I am not ashamed nor do I care what people think.. There are very powerful musicians out there…Like Billie Joe Armstrong of Green Day who is openly bisexual and is one of the best musicians on the planet

    and MIKA is extremely talented and a very good song writer and bisexual

    why do biphobic people really care what their sexuality is?

    People often balk if a musician is gay..

    but its so hypocritical if a gay person doesn’t like musician because he or she is bisexua…shame on you and take some lessons in tolerance

    …no wonder it took me this long to come out as bi! and I am 37

  • olterigo

    Always seemed to me that the reason for “biphobia” is quite simple. And yes, I will compare it to the African-American experience.

    The whiter slaves would usually end up working in the house, as opposed to their darker-skinned brothers and sisters, who worked the fields.

    Similarly, bisexuals (at least when marrying the opposite sex) don’t have the stigma that gays have. They turn into another heterosexual couple on the block. I mean honestly, who goes around telling people he or she is bisexual once they’re in a marriage? At the same time, a gay or lesbian couple can not 1) reap the benefits of marriage in the overwhelming majority of the states, and 2) can’t keep their sexuality hidden and be free from stigma (they are essentially automatically outed).

  • Cam

    @suzanne: you said “and MIKA is extremely talented and a very good song writer and bisexual”

    See Suzanne, thats where you lost me. If Mika is bisexual, why no girlfriend ever? He is from a Muslim country currently living in England. Why no women for the cameras? His life would be simpler, his career etc… if he is really Bi there are PLENTY of girls out there to date.

    The inability of many Bi’s to accept the fact that a timid gay emerging from the closet will often times say they are bi as a first step in the comming out process is what hurts your credibility. I love Mika’s music and I don’t care who he sleeps with. But it’s so obvious if you read the interview that the answer is a dodge. If he said “Yeah, I’m bi, here is my boyfriend, or I’m bi, here is my girlfriend, that is one thing. But to hem and haw the way he is, talk about definitions etc…. well that is somebody doging the question and giving what they think is a milder answer than the truth.

    Again, you bi’s sure have the vicim thing down don’t you? Accusing people of not liking Mika because he’s bi, saying that bi phobia caused you to stay closeted etc… Wow, it sure must be tough to be you. The rest of us on here have no idea what prejudice is, thank you for enlightening us.

  • Qjersey

    Screwing a girl in high school and avoiding vag since does not make you bisexual.

  • Cam

    @olterigo: Excellent point.

  • Cheesus

    I’ll call you bisexual, if you call me to come over

    ahhhhh! lol

  • Cam


    One other thing Suzanne. All my comments about bisexuality and bisexuals I know in here are relating to males who say they are bisexual.

  • tawnie

    @Nizara: Actually he is doing quite well with of all demographics teenage girls. His single we are golden was feature on the popular abc family teen show make it or break it.

  • Cam

    @tawnie: Thanks for the info. His last CD seemed to do well in Europe, Canada but never really take off here int he U.S. I’m wondering if this one will do better. His last CD was like a much more radio friendly version of the Scissor Sisters.

  • rudy

    @gomez: If anything your full-out homophobic rant supports CAM’s point – at least about SOME closet queens who call themselves bi.

  • ricky

    bisexual? to the straights that means he’s a cocksucker.

  • Cam

    @gomez: You said “it’s these same offended gay men who are the more effeminate of us, and engage in the more stereotypical “queen” behavior, mannerisms and cultural identifiers. ”

    Ahhhhh, so let me see if I have this straight…don’t judge you, because to judge you means we are evil biphobic dicks. Oh and bi the way, anybody who disagrees with you is a bitchy queen who has feminine mannerisms? Well, glad to see you Bi’s are so openminded and non-judgemental. (cough cough)

  • ilovemika

    Frankly, I don’t care who he sleeps with as long as it’s me!

  • tavdy79

    @Cam: I know loads of openly bi women, and a couple of bi men though they’re certainly much rarer. One of my closest friends is bisexual – he came out to me the night we first met, and the only thing that’s changed since is he’s got sexier. He deals with more crap from biphobic gays than most gays do from homophobic straights; it would be far easier for him to lie and say he’s gay – most of the bisexuals I know do.

  • Nizara


    well he has always written TV show bumper jingle-type songs–
    if they don’t go gold — he can make a buck selling them to
    media outlets.

  • Cam

    @tavdy79: you said “@Cam: I know loads of openly bi women, and a couple of bi men though they’re certainly much rarer. One of my closest friends is bisexual – he came out to me the night we first met, and the only thing that’s changed since is he’s got sexier. He deals with more crap from biphobic gays than most gays do from homophobic straights; it would be far easier for him to lie and say he’s gay – most of the bisexuals I know do.”

    My question for you. If they are equally attracted to both sexes then why do so many “Bi” men date their own sex? Being able to have sex with women doesn’t make them Bi if they prefer their own sex. Your close friend, he wouldn’t have to lie and say he is “gay” all the time if he had ever done the one thing that would make people believe he’s bi……date a woman.

  • TF

    Most people are excepting of female bisexuality, Women and Men, Gay or straight. Some gay people, especially effiminine gay men seem to be truly threaten of men who consider themselves as bi. I do know from personal experiences that some men are bi until they meet the right man, but there are truly an underground society of men who are married, love and like sex with women, but secretly like and have sex with men. But society still call these men GAY. Why??? Yeah, they are lying and passing in our society as straight. Maybe this is the reason for the negative comments. The Men who are opened with their sexuality as bi are then ridiculed as gay and gay only, then persecuted for lying by many GAYS. So much for (tolerance and judgement). I know of a number of men who are married and some who date women mostly who are attracted to and have sex with men on occasion. Hey, I believe in the Kinsey theory. I believe most people are bisexual but a large majority of them don’t act on it.
    Nothing like a sexy confident openly bisexual man, ahhh, but he would be denounced by most open gay men and the gay media. Maybe most of them say, “why bother”.

  • simon

    I think that gay men in America are too tied up in identity politics. As a result, there is too much segregation of male sexuality into the gay or straight polar opposites. It’s a conceptual problem.

    Another reason this has occurred is marketing. The business people who make money from our community need a word like “gay”. The word “gay” is a marketing ploy. It enables them to make money. Men who identify as “gay” represent a cornered market, and the word “gay” plays on their vanity and their endless desire for sex.

    Overall, I would say that 50% of all self-described gay men are bisexual in the entirety of their lives. The figure for self-described straight men is about 90%.

  • simon

    You also need to distinguish between bisexual in orientation and bisexual in practise. Many straight guys are straight on account of their failure to act upon their same-sex feelings. Mentally, they are bisexual in orientation.

  • Victor

    Oh please Mika’s not gay… he’s not even bisexual. He has a long term girlfriend in New York and she and I both live in the same building, so I see Mika here quite often. His girlfriend lives with her family. Really nice girl. She’s invited me to his upcoming concert on October 16th.

    She introduced me to him a long while back. He’s a really polite, affable guy.

    I suppose until Mika says otherwise, people will continue to assume he’s gay.

  • simon

    It is perfectly possible for a bisexual guy to have a girlfriend to whom he is faithful. Being bisexual doesn’t automatically mean you can’t be faithful.

  • Hoyden

    Wow, I was really happy when I saw the headline of this article (I actually did a little whoop). I was a little dissapointed by the tone of the article, and then I just became sad when I read the comments.
    No wonder it’s taken him this long to come out, look at all the wonderful support he’s getting from his own community! Who needs enemies with friends like Cam.
    You’re right, maybe I should just limit myself to exclusively dating the opposite sex, at least I know the straight community wants me, the gay community certainly seems to have no time for me.

  • me

    he’s REALLY trying to be twinky version of freddie isn’t he?

  • Jim

    @Cam: As a bisexual I sometimes date women and sometimes I date men. Does this make me gay? Stop the dichotomous thinking please! Have a look at the K.S.O.G. (Google or Wikipedia)

  • Jamie

    @simon: Okay, Jason. Oops, sorry, Simon.

    I believe that male bisexuality exists, and I believe Mika when he says he’s bisexual (though the whining about labels is off-putting), but this “everyone is bisexual” thing is annoying. Why can’t we let people define their own sexuality? I’m sick of people acting like I’m repressed because I’m only attracted to men.

  • Merv

    Bi schmy… He’s hot! I love skinny guys with dark hair!

  • glasshouses

    I’m male.
    Partners of the same sex vs. opposite sex: 30 – 70%
    Engaged to opposite sex: 2 years
    Married to opposite sex: 14 years, still.
    Enjoyable sex with opposite sex: yes, very much thank you, still.
    Unfaithful with partners: Once, years before marriage, with opposite sex while dating same sex partner.
    Advocate within the GLBT community: 24 years
    Identify as Bi: 22 years

    So, am I Queer enough and does my identity actually exist?

    I understand the contentions that you have had about your experiences with bisexuals. You have asked for responses from Bi people; two have now presented stories that differ with your experiences on this board alone. It is just as negative to suggest that all of us are of the same nature as me noting that I know two Ex-Gay Christians who prayed out the gay, so why can’t all gay people on this board do the same thing? It’s wrong.

    Do some people come out as bi and then realize a gay identity? Yes, of course. Bisexuals are just as diverse as any identity. That doesn’t mean all of us are the same or worse, should be assumed to be less than by the same community of which we consider ourselves to be a part.

    We have bigger fights to wage than against our own.

  • Kropotkin


    “Again, you bi’s sure have the vicim thing down don’t you? Accusing people of not liking Mika because he’s bi, saying that bi phobia caused you to stay closeted etc… Wow, it sure must be tough to be you. The rest of us on here have no idea what prejudice is, thank you for enlightening us.”

    Lolz, you gays do to if you want to play the oppression olympics angle. Give me a break because your getting knee deep in the hypocrisy here.

    Some bi people have dated both sexes. Some have only dated one sex but know they know that they like the other even though they haven’t dated the other because they haven’t found someone of that sex they like yet. Some are actually in a transitional stage to identifying gay or straight.

    I don’t care what Mika identifies as. I don’t get a toaster or a gift certificate if he turns out to be bi like me or gay like other people. Why do you care so much? What’s your dog in the fight Cam? That just seems odd and comes off as insecure, IMHO.

    But I’m commenting because telling people what they identify as is not cool and makes whoever does that seem like a pretty small-minded person because there are quite a few other people out there who would say we ALL are “lying”, “confused” or “really straight”, except they all hide behind a cross and a bible, not a pink triangle or rainbow flag.

    But no matter who does it, trying to tell people who they are is just judgmental and in bad form.

    I’ll take Mika at his own word, he knows what he likes.

    I hope he likes me


  • Kropotkin

    Oh Glasshouses, don’t you know Cam has met a few bi people who turned out to be monoseuxal? He’s an expert on this! We’re all deluding ourselves, the professor of bisexuality has spoken.

  • beets

    @Victor: omg is it Lady Gaga???

  • StraightGrrrl

    Aww he’s cute so happy that he finally opened up. I’ve honestly never heard of him before, but briefly checked his myspace http://www.myspace.com/mikamyspace and it appears he’s very popular. I’ll give him a listen now.

    I happen to know a Lebanese bi guy and he’s really stunning and exotic looking.

  • glasshouses


    Good point. But if I agree and come out as monosexual in his class does he give me the toaster or the gift certificate? I don’t think he’d be willing to go both ways.

  • John from England(used to be just John but there are other John's)

    @ Victor

    And?? Wtf? Why don’t you email the magazine and his record company and then post on this site about his girlfriend? Weirdo.

    @ Glasshouses

    What you’ve done is amazing but why do you call yourself Bi?

    @ All

    Slam Cam all you want and I don’t agree with his scenarios but if you can get away with sleeping with women-why do you come on gay websites? Why do you even care?

    We’ve had this discussion sooo many times as Kid A has mentioned but the bottom line is that you STILL don’t understand what it’s like to only like someone of the same sex. Can you not see what people (wrongly) think it’s greedy?

    I would LOVE to be bisexual! But am not.

    I just hate the way you guys see yourselve’s as victims because the ‘straights’ don’t get ‘you’, so you’ve had to come with the gays, lg..b…t.

  • Distingué Traces

    If your hair is darker than blond, but lighter than black, then YOU HAVE BROWN HAIR. You just do.

    Yes, it’s true, simply saying “Mika has brown hair” may not fully describe all the subtle nuances of shade and sheen that make Mika’s hair-color so very special and uniquely his own.

    But you know what, Mika? You’re the only one who would ever care that much about choosing a word to describe your hair. To the rest of us, it’s just brown.

  • Hoyden

    @John from England(used to be just John but there are other John’s): Reading your comment has just caused me to have a stroke. Are you for real???? If you can get away with sleeping with women why do you come on a gay website? Why did the bi’s come to join the gays? Please someone tell me this is some increadible new form of satire and I’m just not smart enough to get it.

    Just when Kropotkin and Glasshouses were making me feel so much better…

  • An Other Greek

    I believe that

    gays that refuse to recognize bisexuals


    victims of their very own phobia, and egomania, yes,

    an aggressive refusal to believe OTHERS’ experience, over their own.



  • glasshouses

    John from England suggests something that I think should be considered: how do we as Bis identify ourselves if behaviors don’t entail either being with the same sex (thus, we’re straight) or opposite sex (thus, we’re gay) but that is really assuming that identity is linked to behaviors only. I contend it’s much more complex than that (ironically, the Religious Right would likely disagree with me, assuming that there are no such things as gay identities, only gay acts. The same argument appears to be in place concerning some bisexuals.) Simply, a celibate straight monk is still straight, ditto a gay one, ditto a bi one– behaviors and identity are not the same thing.

    The other issue seems to be that there should not be a B in GLBT at all. Indeed, the argument can be made that the G, L, B, T are all uniquely different and shouldn’t be lumped together. Some argue, even on this board, that Queer and not Queer makes it a lot easier if Queer is pretty much anything but hetero. We as bi and gay folk experience same-sex attraction, it’s part of who we are– there’s the link that I see to the rest of the GLBT community but even more, increased members can lead to greater exposure can lead to greater impact and change.

    Queerty is a page not only for Gay issues but Bi (and Lesbian and Transgender and Queer) ones too– the name itself even assumes not gay but all that is not straight; bi stories are indeed covered here, in fact, we’re posting on one right now. Again, why the suggestion of a gay members only stamp?

    I would never question a gay person’s identity or right to that identity but yes, that does happen to bisexuals, even on this board. Personally, I don’t get into the “which is worse, homophobia or biphobia or transphobia argument” in any context. It’s all phobia and it’s all pretty damned awful– and we should all be working to stop all of it.

  • osocubano

    I had sex with two women 30 years ago.
    Does that make me bisexual too?

  • simon

    Always go to Kinsey. He said it best.

  • Cam

    @glasshouses: You said “Do some people come out as bi and then realize a gay identity? Yes, of course. Bisexuals are just as diverse as any identity. That doesn’t mean all of us are the same or worse, should be assumed to be less than by the same community of which we consider ourselves to be a part. ”

    THANK YOU!!!! That has been my point all along. My issue with the early posts on this was that the “Bi”s were getting pissed off that “The Gays” automatically assumed Mika was gay. My point was, that so many times the Bi’s on here never seem to want to recognize the fact that many many gays declare themselves as bi as a first step to coming out. Mika, born in a mostly muslim nation, refuses to talk about his sexuality, pressured into it in that interview doging the question etc… would most likely think declaring bisexuality was somehow less controversial than homosexuality. right or wrong, that is how the interview came off. But nobody can declare that without a hoard of angry Bi’s coming out and calling us “BiPhobic”. Your post was reasonable, enlightening and spoke to the truth of your experiences. I have no trouble reading your post and believing that you are truly bi-sexual. Additionally, I would like to point out, that as I believe is often the case with true bi-sexuals, you married a woman. Why not? Society makes it easier, it’s legal, etc… I get the feeling most of the screamers on here are the people who claim they are bi, yet have only had boyfriends for the last ten years.

    Thanks for the post glasshouses.

  • Cam

    @Jim: You said “@Cam: As a bisexual I sometimes date women and sometimes I date men. Does this make me gay? Stop the dichotomous thinking please! Have a look at the K.S.O.G. (Google or Wikipedia)”

    Jim, no, that makes you bisexual. Many of us constantly deal with these angry folks that claim to be bisexual and when you question them about it it’s all because in high school they kissed Lucy Jane Parnell under the bleachers and since that time for the last 10 years that have only dated and slept with men. Again, as your post would indicate you live a bi life, and are bi. One thing I’ve noticed, the posts from people that seem to be true bisexuals seem to be much more reasonably written and thought out than the angry posts from the “Only dated men but how dare you tell me I’m not Bi” people.

  • romeo

    This is an interesting conversation that I think goes beyond what has been addressed here so far in the dilemma “bi-sexuality” presents to gay people in general. I have known many men that considered themselves bi, but only a few that I thought actually were. I do believe that it exists, but is rarer than bi men would like to believe. I agree with the posters that it is usually a comfort level label used on the way to “oh, f*ck it, I’m gay.” That was certainly my own coming out experience. I had sex with women, more than once, and every time it felt unnatural and disgusting, and these were beautiful, desirable women.

    Bisexuals have a tendency to try to strengthen their position with straights by opining the notion that “everyone is really bisexual,” and so forth. Gay people pick up on this and have a visceral reaction that is perhaps difficult to articulate, but let me try. After all, the problem gays and bisexuals have is really not with each other, but with the majority straight society, and I think that gays instinctively fear that if straights see gays as merely recalcitrant bisexuals, straights would think (and many already do) that “if they’re really bisexual, then they can be just as happy in a heterosexual relationship. So let’s make it easy for everybody and help them over their confusion by repealing all their civil rights laws and forcing them into what is best for them, and best for our straight comfort level.”

    Don’t laugh. You have no idea how many straights would go for that. Bottom line, bisexuals and gays should probably be more sensitive to each other, AND resist the urge to universalize from their own, individual experience. There may be bisexual men, but there sure-as-f*ck are exclusively gay man as well, and a lot of them are really butch BTW.

  • vernonvanderbilt

    You know, my experiences with bisexual folks have generally been…I won’t say negative, but certainly dubious. Most of the bi guys I’ve met are pretty much just looking for hookups between opposite-sex relationships. They have mostly just wanted to use me to “scratch their itch,” as it were.

    But that does not meant I question bisexuality, nor that I am hostile to it. It simply means that I have only experienced one slice of bisexual life. Anyone who would condemn an entire group of people based only on their own experiences with members of that group is forgetting that there is no way they will ever meet and interact with all members of that group. Personal experience only has meaning on the individual level. When you begin extrapolating your experiences and assumptions to include people you have never met, engaged, or known, then you’re being a bigot.

    We need to embrace everyone who is a member of the LGBT+ alphabet soup and stop fighting amongst ourselves over petty bullshit like labels. These are your brothers and sisters. Is that not good enough for you?

  • Cam

    @romeo: really thoughtful post!!

  • Roy Rogers Oldenkamp

    @Cam: Well, I have bi friends, mostly guys who prefer women but like to experiment. Lots of younger dudes are like this, but don’t necessarily brag about it. Sounds like you’re hanging out with bitter old confused queens. Broaden your facebook crowd, dude.

  • Kian

    @romeo: “I had sex with women, more than once, and every time it felt unnatural and disgusting, and these were beautiful, desirable women.”

    The fact that you wrote this statement leads me to believe that you’re projecting your feelings about your own bisexual behavior onto others’ behaviors. Just because you found it “disgusting” does not mean that other men will eventually find it also disgusting and turn permanently to their inherent and pure gayness like you have. If you didn’t like it, then don’t do it again! Pure and simple. You don’t need to understand it; you just need to accept it. Because if you don’t accept others differences in sexuality, how can you expect others to accept your differences.

  • roxy

    @alan brickman:

    totally agree with that!

  • terrwill

    Gays in denial always refer to themselves ad “bisexual” what it really means is they sleep with both men and boys……. ;-P

  • Timmeeeyyy

    Many of the comments show how much work gay folks need to do to erase their own prejudices and -isms.

  • JA

    @Cam: i don’t identify as bi. i identify as “mostly gay”. and yeah, it’s mostly effeminate bitchy queens who have their panties in a twist about bi guys. calls it like i sees it.

    don’t believe male bisexuality exists? one word: prison

  • gomez

    @rudy: “full-out homophobic rant”? see, this is exactly what i’m talking about. “you can’t criticize me for dissing bi guys!!! that makes you a homophobe!”

    yeah, no sorry, it doesn’t.

  • gomez

    @osocubano: only you can answer that? does it?

  • rudy

    @romeo: “Bisexuals have a tendency to try to strengthen their position with straights by opining the notion that ‘everyone is really bisexual.'”

    That’s old Kinsey thinking, and I don’t know of any recent studies that would agree.

    Most gay men can have straight sex if they have to, just as straight convicts will have gay sex in prison and never again when released.

    Sexual orientation is today defined by who arouses you, who you dream about, and who you love. For bisexuality, GLASSHOUSES would be a textbook case (take bow).

    Married men deceiving their wives and cruising public restrooms and parks or searching classified ads to hook up with other “discreet bisexual” men don’t fit that profile.

    That’s more like Ennis Del Mar, Jack Twist, and most gay men before Stonewall.

  • Roy Rogers Oldenkamp

    Read Angie Bowie’s book Bisexuality: A Primer

    and learn a little, folks.

  • mizzm

    @osocubano: no, it makes you an obvious gay bigot

  • mizzm

    those of you gays going on about how we don’t exist, you really are just as bigoted as straights are against you in that regard. obviously you’ve learned nothing from your own oppression and you are hypocrites. I always find it amusing when one group talks about how bad they have it, but that doesn’t stop them from putting down another group and doing the exact same thing that is done to them. whether you like or not, we do exist, and we’re building a great community. I agree, we need to be more independent, so we don’t have to deal with your ignorance so much.

  • Leah

    Bisexuals (and pansexuals, like myself) are not confused, nor are they in denial. Biphobia is the very reason why many bisexuals stay in the closet by calling themselves ‘gay.’

  • Kyle Schickner

    Why are gay men SO afraid of bisexuals?

    This article and many of the comments below I bet are making it easy for hundreds of teens trying to figure their sexuality out. Of course they are gonna come out as bi now if for no other reason than to not be associated with such close minded fools. How sad it is for young men and women around the world, faced with the bigotry of a homophobic mainstream, to have to find themselves in a community as closed minded as the one they left.

    Do you know how dumb you all sound when you say “I don’t believe bisexuals exsist”? I have a 5 year old niece who refuses to admit that there is such a color as green, it doesn’t make it true, it just makes her sound silly. The difference (for those who need it spelled out) if she’s a toddler, and you are a “writer”. Maybe we can get my niece a a blog too.

  • I'm Not Your Bitch Don't Hang Your Shit On Me

    The biphobic comments here are so very expected. When Adam Lambert came out as gay, there were a ton of homophobics trolls leaving comments, quoting the bible and saying it is a sinful “choice”

    It’s funny how some of you think you know someone’s sexual orientation because of personality or apperance. How do you biphobics know what turns Mika on? or who he had relationships and sex with? or what he gets off too? YOU DON’T. So don’t be ridiculous. Learn to fuck off on subjects you don’t know anything about and stop creating stereotypical shit up.

    Mika said he is bisexual and that’s that. Who do any of you think yall are to question him? Is he questioning yall for being gay or for being straight? Sorry people but you are in denial about something. There is no excuse in absolute to be biphobic unless you’re hiding and nobody is responsible for that EXCEPT YOU SO END OF STORY.

  • simon

    One of the reasons some gay men are afraid of bisexual men is because some gay men are bisexual in orientation but don’t want to admit it. Denying the existence of male bisexuality is a way of denying it within themselves.

    Interestingly, these gay men don’t seem to be as afraid of bisexual women.

  • GenuinelyBi

    I love how so many gay people totally said, Where are the bisexuals… and then we show up LOL!
    Mika identifies as bisexual, either accept that and accept him, just like you want people to accept your sexuality definition.

    (esp. all those men who have families and then discover they like taking it up the ass at 35. How’d you get those kids, because you DIDN’T like pussy? I bet you’d accept THOSE men as 100% gay when they “come out” though their history would suggest bisexuality. You wouldn’t judge them like this!)

    Accept him or shut your jealous i-wish-he-was-a-fag drama queen mouths the next time someone looks at you and ridicules YOU for your sexuality.

    I’m not a swinger (never have been), I’m a woman in a relationship with a woman that I do not hide, have never cheated on any of my partners, have had a satisfying relationship with a man, too, and can love someone based on their insides, not on their external parts. I’m happy with whatever I find inside the heart and soul of a human being, not limiting my desire for a person based on their genitalia.

    This is no stepping stone to me admitting to being a lesbian, folks. I am bisexual, fuck your phobic responses, and small minded binary inability to understand complex sexuality. Gay or straight? Neither! HAPPY BI PRIDE DAY!!!

    I’m not coming back for clarification or to respond to your “let’s hate on bisexuals.” I don’t have the time for stupidity. I just wanted you to know… I’m here, I’m QUEER (too), get used to it.

    And get ready for more, our little group has heard about your hate responses, we’re coming with our pink/purple/blue guns to bust down the doors of your limited perceptions.

    Add us on Facebook… we’re there in the THOUSANDS, ready to laugh at your “bisexuals don’t exist” comments.
    Congratulations, Mika, you’ve just taken a step towards erasing bi erasure.

  • simon

    The only bisexuals I don’t like are those women who use it as a marketing ploy. They tell the world how much they like to kiss girls and then run home to be with their boyfriends. Ewwww….

  • Hoyden

    Simon- Going off your previously supporting comments, I’m going to assume that you are referring to that bizarre nightclub phenomena of two women making out in front of guys to get them hot, which doesn’t personally offed me because, whatever gets you off, I don’t see that as diminishing a legitimate bi identity in any way, but I can sympathise if you do. If such is the case, please excuse the following. However, if you’re refering to women who self-identify as bisexual and then assuming that it’s only a marketing ploy, like Angelina Jolie, Megan Fox, Drew Barrymore, then you’re doing the same thing to them that we’ve just argued against happening to Mika. I don’t think the phrase ‘the only bisexuals I don’t like’, is really helpful here. Why do there have to be ANY bisexuals that we don’t like? I mean I’m sure Glasshouse and Jim are excited beyond belief that Cam and co have given them a pass by declaring them ‘true’ bisexuals, but i’d prefer it if we didn’t all have to establish our bi identity through an explanation of our entire sexual history every time we want to be thought of as a valid bisexual. I note that Cam believes that the ‘true’ bisexuals have posted more reasonable and well thought out arguments on this board, and I point out that the only people he considers to be ‘true’ bisexuals are those that have explained their previous history so that he could critique it (and thank you to them for doing so). So anyone who hasn’t taken that step is of course one of the screaming, porely spoken dolts that are the rest of us. Although you’ve twice tried to turn the argument towards bi women, I would also point out that the bi women are already here, taking the attack on Mika as an attack on themselves as bi people, rather than perceiving it as strictly an attack against male bi people.

  • Hoyden

    fyi, supporting = supportive

  • Rowen

    I can’t speak for my other gay brethren, but I can tell you guys what and why I feel certain ways about bisexuality, and why it doesn’t matter, and what you guys can do about it.

    There was a time when I identified myself as bisexual. At the time, and to a teenager, it sure felt more comfortable saying that then admitting that you were an outright “fag.” I’ve also known, and witnessed, a lot of my fellow gay men going through the same phase. Now, what that means, is that often times, when I hear a celebrity, or a young person, hem and haw, talk about not wanting to be defined, and then settling on bisexuality, my first thought is “that’s great, let’s talk when you’ve grown up some more.”

    I’ve also fooled around with a number of guys who claimed to be bisexual. Many were college guys still in the process of coming out. Another large chunk were married men cheating on their wives. A few were more or less straight guys who didn’t want anything to do with a gay guy unless the bisexual REALLY wanted a blow job and couldn’t get it any other way.

    Outside of fooling around, I have yet to meet a guy who claims to be bisexual, who’s primary relationship is with a man. All of the bisexuals I’ve meet (now, I do realize I haven’t met all of them), who are in relationships, are in relationships with women, and either are allowed to play around on the side, or are in a monogamous relationship. I have yet to see it the other way around.

    Now, all of my experiences have lead me to inwardly cringe or roll my eyes when someone says they are bisexual. However, I don’t act on these first impressions (and really, they aren’t the other person’s fault), and simply tell that part of my brain to shut up, and then deal with the person at face value. If that means today, they are bisexual, and tomorrow they’re gay, that’s fine. If today, they’re bi, and they’re still bi tomorrow, that’s fine.

    Lastly, I don’t want to excuse “biphobia” in the gay community, but I do think that it’s high time more truly bisexual people came to the forefront. It’s kind of like the moderate and liberal Christians (i.e. other’s claim they don’t exist, and as long as the middle of the road Christians allow the far right to high jack the movement, no one’s gonna believe that they exist). You have to get your face and your story out there, because, otherwise, in many people’s eyes, you don’t exist. Gays have been told the same thing for years, and it’s true. I can only go so far with theoretical and anecdotal information I read in some book somewhere. Until more bisexual people stand up and say “I am bisexual, and I’m not a closet case, fence sitter, or slut,” there’s a lot of folks out there that will just stew in their own ignorance.

  • Rowen

    @GenuinelyBi: I know plenty of men who got married, because they felt they had to, had sex with women, because they felt they had to, and fathered children, because they felt they had to. Today, they classify themselves as gay, feel no attraction to women, say they never felt any attraction to women, and will tell you the tricks they used to perform sexually, and explain how the sex they had with women was purely mechanical and had nothing to do with being an expression of their sexuality.

    If you would like gay men to stop trivializing your sexual experiences, please don’t trivialize theirs.

  • glasshouses

    Personally, I’m actually really enjoying the comments and this conversation. For the record, and in response to Rowen, I am indeed bisexual, and I’m not a closet case, fence sitter, or slut. The description of monogamy, enjoying sex with women, kids– yea, still bi. (Now, some of my friends, straight, bi, gay, trans, Queer, whatever, have also noted that I am the most boring bisexual that they have ever met but that’s likely to be just my personality as I can be about as exciting as paint drying.)

    Looking at the original article and this may read like a truly hypocritical view, but I take issue with a portion of Mika’s statement not due to his bi-ness, gayness or straightness, but to the practical suggestion that bisexuality is default or defined by sexual behaviors:

    “But having said that; I’ve never limited my life, I’ve never limited who I sleep with. So, whatever. (…) Call me whatever you want. Call me bisexual, if you need a term for me.”

    Now, maybe it’s me but I read the notion that bisexuality and a lack of limits, sexual and otherwise, are synonimous. Granted, in the following paragraph of the interview, he noted his focus on how self-limitations are bad. But his own reaction toward his bisexuality strikes me almost as default, not positive at all. In fact, I found myself comparing his response to that of another (I argue infinitely more talented) out and married to a woman bisexual, Mr. Greenday himself:

    “I think I’ve always been bisexual. I mean, it’s something that I’ve always been interested in. I think everybody kind of fantasizes about the same sex. I think people are born bisexual, and it’s just that our parents and society kind of veer us off into this feeling of Oh, I can’t. They say it’s taboo. It’s ingrained in our heads that it’s bad, when it’s not bad at all. It’s a very beautiful thing. I think mostly it’s been kept in my head. I’ve never really had a relationship with another man. But it is something that comes up as a struggle in me. It especially came up when I was about 16 or 17. In high school people think you have to be so macho. People get attacked just because someone insinuates something about their sexuality. I think that’s gruesome.”

    Now, I can argue with the literal Kinsey here but it strikes me as a lot more positive view of his own sexuality then “call me bi by default.”

    I’m not suggesting disrespect to Mika’s coming out (although I never really liked his music and I found the lyrics to Billy Brown, which he has oft noted as indicative of his Queer positive stance as biphobic, homophobic, perhaps both, or just not very positive.) I’d still welcome him among the Bi Peoples Meeting in that big cabin in Idaho, should we ever have one, but his response didn’t strike me as the most glowing endorsement of that same meeting.

  • Rowen

    @glasshouses: I think Mika’s hemming and hawing, dodging the question, bitching about labels, and finally settling on bisexuality is what’s making so many of us gay men roll our eyes. Many of us have been there/done that.

    As for Mr. Greenday, many gay guys get turned off by having someone who’s never had a relationship with someone of the opposite sex, and is firmly entrenched in the institution we are barred from, trying to . . . well, jump on our bandwagon. (Queerty experienced this in a similar form in the past month when dealing with race, and the various racism olympics that followed) For us, that married, bi guy means A) we look flakey when he finally leaves her and comes out, B) we look even worse when he’s caught cheating on her, or C) we look like we can be “changed” when he stays loyal to her. So, many of us would rather someone like that stay in the “straight” world and raise the kids. Of course, come election time, that bisexual’s vote will definately be counted on, so it’s a bit of a thorny path.

  • Rowen

    @Rowen: I meant to say “a relationship with someone of the same sex”

  • Bi Social News

    This is so sad, the Lesbian and Gay Community who want equal rights from well everyone, bashing a bisexual who is part of the community. And this is why Bisexuals are speaking loud and proud that the enemy isn’t our straight allies, it’s the gay and lesbian con artist who got the straight community believing they are tolerance and fair about sexuality…. clearly the gay community is living in 1972. Wake up and smell the irony.

    Happy Bi Day all my brothers and sister! Bi Social News, also was linked on Logo because Logo, GLAAD and others media sites, understand the issues bisexuals are dealing with in their own community — biphobia… congrads…. my fake allies….

  • Lina

    DAMN IT, I wrote a long, elaborate post about how I don’t know what the hell I am, am almost Mika’s age (getting there!), and could understand why he doesn’t seem to have or want to have a clue, either. And then my computer crashed just as I hit submit and don’t have the zeal to rewrite all that.

    BUT, my point was that I have been attracted to both men and women, but mostly men, and have engaged in “activities” with both, but much more with men. If I label myself as:

    a. straight: this is disingenuous because I am legitimately attracted to women
    b. gay: this is disingenuous because I am very attracted to men
    c. bi: this is disingenuous because I don’t like both equally.

    Basically, I am into men, but unlike, say, romeo, the thought or action of having sex with women doesn’t feel unnatural or disgusting when it’s with the right one. It has sometimes been a pretty fulfilling experience, and actually moreso than being with some men.

    I tried to justify my straightness during college by saying “oh, everyone is bi, blah blah, kinsey, blah blah.” Admittedly, I don’t think I knew what I was talking about, and neither did a lot of my gay friends. But (I swear I did it for the science!) when I tried to hook up with several of those gay friends, they looked like I had just asked them to eat a box of maggots. And it’s not because I’m not attractive (some people think I am, and I believe them!), it’s because being with the opposite sex to them is gross and unnatural. But for me, I’ve never felt that because of sex.

    I think I’ve felt that disgust somewhat when I hooked up with a guy I hated as a person, but I can’t imagine it’s the same thing. This is the closest I have to that experience though, so I have ZERO understanding of what real straight or real gay people feel. But I don’t know what it is to be bi, because I’m so rarely attracted to women that I’m practically straight, I think? Right? …maybe? I would actually love to hear some advice on just how bi you have to be to be “bi”, if that makes any sense.

    So where do I go? How do I label myself without doing a disservice to one of many sexual communities by lying? And wouldn’t it SUCK if I was super hot and talented and famous and I was constantly harassed by the media to pick a team to bat for??

    I think my responses would be something along the lines of “I’m post-gay” or “would you leave me alone if I said I was bi or whatever? God, you people.”

    Well, looks like maybe I did have the zeal to rewrite all that.

  • Red

    It would probably be easier for Mika to come out as gay. Why deal with both homophobia and being demonized by uptight gay people? He doesn’t really gain anything by coming out as bi. (I note that the guys on Afterelton.com have been much cooler than those here.)

    Ultimately I think that biphobic gays are shooting themselves in the foot by alienating a lot of potential allies. There are probably more male Kinsey ones and twos alone than there are gay men. If gays insist that these men “pick a side”, which one do you think they’re going to pick? I think the real fear of biphobic gays like Dan Savage is losing what little political power they have to a bisexual majority.

    I look at male bisexual forums from time to time, and the vast majority of men on them are closeted. On the other hand, I was struck by the thoughtfulness, inclusiveness and lack of bitchery I found there. I agree that if they want respect, they’re going to have to come out. We’ll all be better off when that happens.

    I agree with Mark Simpson:

    “Fear and loathing of male bisexuality is something tends to bring heterosexuals and homosexuals together. Instead of pondering the possibility that public attitudes towards male bisexuality are a truer, less censored indication of what many people actually feel about male homosexuality in general and its enforced incompatibility with masculinity, gay men too often rush to condemn bisexual men and reassure heterosexuals: don’t worry, you’re not being homophobic when mouthing off about bisexual men coz we hate them too!”


  • glasshouses


    An interesting post but I would note one thing:
    “For us, that married, bi guy means A) we look flakey when he finally leaves her and comes out, B) we look even worse when he’s caught cheating on her, or C) we look like we can be “changed” when he stays loyal to her.”

    It seems to me that the issue is thus really more about the politics of representation. This may sound a bit familiar: How does a bisexual’s opposite sex marriage affect a gay person’s identity, unless through some pretty strong hasty generalizations?

    In other words, it seems that the negative response is honestly due to the notion that we represent a straight community’s repsonse for a way for gay men to be “cured.” (If we’re out as bi, trust me, they’re thinking we’re not exactly “cured.”) Also, if a bisexual person is cheating on someone, that can be a reflection more on biness than gayness. Simply, the B and G aren’t the same identities and the actions of one can’t or at least shouldn’t be assumed to reflect on the other.

  • Hoyden

    I have a friend who’s a football player and a power bottom. He is one of the queeniest (his discriptive, not mine) guys I know, but also one of the toughest and most masculine at times. When we go clubbing he likes to wear his football jersy, my feather lined coat and lots of eyeshadow/eyeliner- think Eddie Izzard. One day he got jumped by a bunch of guys who started beating him up (it wasn’t the first time, gay bashers tend to see him coming), he took two of them down and was busy chasing the third down the street with a stick when our friend showed up to pick him up. He has slept with half of his football team mates, and almost all the cheerleaders. His current boyfriend, by contrast, once told me that he’d tried to have sex with a woman once just to see what it was like but couldn’t get into it and finally gave up.

    Both of these guys identify strictly as gay though their sexual histories are vastly different. The word bisexual has never passed the lips of my jersey wearing friend because that’s just not how he sees himself, though he has nothing against bisexuals. Both guys know and love me as bi and have never been anything less than supportive of that, and I have never questioned my friend identifying as gay when he’s been with so many women, and so frequently tries to feel me up ;-)

    I’m sure I’m not the first to have made this point, but my point is this: the guys who beat him up didn’t stop to ask how many men he’d slept with, if he’d ever slept with a woman, how he identified. They didn’t care, because to them any gay is too much gay be it 5%, 50% or 95%. The bigots dump us all in together, make the same jokes, threats, take away the same political rights, make the same assumptions. They view us as a group even when we don’t. That’s why I would prefer a blanket term like queer, but I just find that lesbians get annoyed when I dont make it clearer that I sleep with men also, so I use bi. I suspect that people like Mika also use bi becasuse it makes other people more comfortable to know where they stand ‘oh he sleeps with both’, but just wish that they didn’t have to spend their lives worrying about making other people comfortable by applying labels to themselves. And yes I get that visability is important, that’s why I still say Queer (or another blanket term) is best with less attention spent on segregating and dividing and adding extra initials to the GLBT and questioning and analysing people’s gay credentials.

  • Hoyden

    @Lina: Hey Lina, great post, and can I say that I don’t think you have to be a 50/50 to be bi. Most people sway more one way or the other. Come join me under the umbrella of queer, there’s plenty of room ;-)

  • beets

    Well, the end-all be-all of gayness, the Stockholm Pride Twitter gaydar (http://www.stockholmpride.org/howhetero/), says @mikasounds is 29% hetero- or, as they put it, a “holiday hetero”. A dodgy holiday, perhaps?

  • The Gay Numbers

    Whether one is bisexual or not is separate from the issue of whether Mika is bisexual. My problem in reading the comments is how much people project themselves into this. There are reasons to question whether this cat is actually bi or gay. There is nothing wrong with being bi. But I question whether MIKA is bi.

    Some people, like it or not, do use bisexuality for purposes other than describing what they truly are. They see it as more socially accepting. Certainly in some Muslim cultures, having dated gay Muslim men, the idea of being a bi guy for some moderate Muslims may be more acceptable especially if you say you are a top. Yes, it really goes that deep from some.

    I guess my chief problem here is the simple minded construction of the conversation as “If you can not believe this person is bi, then you a biphobic.” That may or may not be true of some. But I can honestly say that my instinct having read about this guy is that he is a gay guy. I have only met a few truly bisexual guys.

    I can not speak for the entire group. I can only speak for the one’s I have met. One was what I truly believed was bisexuality. Most have tended to see me as an opportunity for someone to fuck them, but not for a relationship

    I had one guy say to me “yeah, if we were on remote island, I could be with you.” I did not say anything back to him because all I could think was “how much of what he does is him and how much of it is social pressure that he will never admit to?” I could not say. And, frankly, I did not feel like trying with him because it is enough work to deal with gay men who are insecure than a guy who still is trying to worry that much about social dynamics. He is not mean to represent everyone. He is meant to represent one face of the complexity of the issue.

    I have only met one true bisexual for whom I truly believed he had no such hang ups- you want to know why? Because he had been in long term relationships with both men and women. He told his wife that if they ever broke up there is no guarantee what gender he would end up with because she entertained ideas that he was now “straight” but he wanted to marry her with absolute honesty.

    Now, he is to my knowledge still with his wife. But the idea that he would say that, and make no issue of it , had maintained long term public relationship with men, etc is what convinced me his bisexuality was sincere.

    The complexity that is not reducible to bigotry is that some bisexuals are sincere, and some are not. SOme of it societal and some of it is personal. It hard to know which is which.

  • Bi Social News

    “he Gay Numbers” Oh please. Why can’t you take him at face value. When others come out as gay, you don’t question it? Why question his bi status?

    “But I can honestly say that my instinct having read about this guy is that he is a gay guy. I have only met a few truly bisexual guys.”

    So because you only met a few, then the whole population doesn’t exist? Again, this is the same song and dance. Question, say he’s not bi he’s gay, and then get upset because someone calls you out of your biphobia. Classic.

    “Because he had been in long term relationships with both men and women”

    There are straight folks that haven’t been in long term relationship, they are still straight. Just because you fall in love with one sex, and didn’t have the chance to meet another, doesn’t mean you aren’t bi, it means, that you still like both, but fell in love with one. I wish the gay community could understand this. Love one personal at a time is okay, still means you are bisexual, because you are attracted to both sexes.

  • gomez

    @The Gay Numbers: the problem is that you just narrowed the definition of bisexuality to a very specific quality: having the ability to have long term relationships with either sex.

    “bisexuality”, in general, is a much broader range of behavior and attraction than either straight or gay. it’s much bigger than your one example of a “true bisexual”.

    and to say that to identify as a bi guy is more “more socially accepting” is a larf. no one believes that, not even you. muslims don’t identify as “bisexual” at all. they identify as straight. and bi guys probably compete for transgenders for who gets the lowest rating on the social totem pole. everybody knows this. and it’s a biphobic bigotry.

    and this constant second-guessing and dissing of bi guys only feeds it.

    it’s always bisexual or “bi-curious” men who are questioned by straight people and gay men while the bisexual/curious women are question by both lesbians and gay men.

    interesting that it’s gay men who are most judgemental of bisexuals in general. also pretty fucking lame. why is that?

    how about instead of questioning or throwing doubt on a bisexual’s identity, we just accept them at their word? doesn’t seem that it should be that hard.

  • simon

    Women who use their so-called bisexuality as a marketing ploy ought to be kicked out of our movement. Their appeal is directed towards sleazy straight guys who don’t give a rat’s about our rights. Time to give these women the flick.

  • jason

    One of the reasons female bisexuals – especially the boner dyke ones – disparage male bisexuals is because they fear exposure. Fake female bisexuality stands in sharp contrast to honest male bisexuality.

    Generally, male sexuality is far more honest than female sexuality. Women in general tend to use their sexuality as a marketing ploy, and hence the dishonesty factor comes into their sexuality and how they verbalize and express themselves.

    The relationship between female sexuality and prostitution is stark: females tend prostitute their sexuality for benefits that are unrelated to the achievement of sexual satisfaction. Why do they do it? Because they can. Fake orgasms, fake interest in sexual activity…it can all be conducted without the evidence of arousal.

    The clothing double standard is a good illustration of what’s going on here. Why are women allowed into nightclubs and formal functions with cleavage-revealing tops and mini-skirts, yet the men are required to wear body-covering jackets and trousers? It’s because, like the bisexual double standard, women are being set up as cheesecake by heterosexual men and their enablers.

    The women don’t mind it because it enables them to obtain the sorts of benefits that come from using their sexuality as a marketing ploy.

  • Rowen

    Bi Social News,

    The problem, as has been stated before by many of us, is not that Mika identifies as bi. The problem is that he ran through the gambit of existential, question dodging, theoretical word play that many closeted men go through. Many of us have been there and wondered why does anyone have to “label” us, or express the feeling that everyone is actually bisexual, and for myself, and for each and every person I have ever known, that was a cover up. It was a way to use logic to not have to admit that we were truly gay. I’ve been there, and many of the other gay folks here have been there.

    It’s not that we “hate” bi folk, but that when we see someone young and very stereotypical dodge the question, mouth some existential nonsense, and then finally say he’s bi, we take it with a grain of salt.

  • Timmeeeyyy

    So many of these negative comments are really no different than straight people telling gays they’re just confused, or it’s just a phase.

    If you want others to celebrate diversity, you need to do the same. You have to be willing to give what you get.

    Oh, and how is discussing your sexuality in a gay magazine in any way closeted?

  • gomez

    @simon: @jason:

    what made you guys officers in the homoerotic police? you don’t own anyone’s else expression of homoerotic behavior and for you to go around and pronounce what’s “authentic” and “more honest” and what’s not, and give “fake” bi girls the “flick” is height of arrogance, condescension and moral judgement. not unlike the arrogance, condescension, and moral judgement of straight people towards us. you think dissing on bi girls is going to win us allies? we should be encouraging girls making out with each other, just like straight dudes.

    goddam y’all are some bitter jealous mysogynistic queens. keep it up.

  • Rowen

    I have a question for the bisexuals out there, too. I’ve meet bisexual women who are in both same sex and opposite sex pairings, but I have yet to meet a bisexual man who is in a primarily same sex pairing. I’ve meet plenty who are in monogamous opposite sex marriages, and I’ve meet plenty who are in some form of open/poly couplings.

    So, are there any bisexual guys out there who identify as truly bisexual, but are in a monogamous same sex pairing?

  • Rowen

    @Rowen: I dunno, gomez. Since I have nothing to do with girls, in a sexual or dating scenerio, I haven’t really formed an opinion on girls just causually making out with each other, but I know a hell of a lot of lesbians who get livid that their sexuality, which they fought hard for, gets used to primarily turn on some republican frat boy who’s then gonna go and vote against gay rights after jacking off to the bisexual girl porn.

  • Cam

    @gomez: You said “and to say that to identify as a bi guy is more “more socially accepting” is a larf. no one believes that, not even you. muslims don’t identify as “bisexual” at all. they identify as straight. and bi guys probably compete for transgenders for who gets the lowest rating on the social totem pole. everybody knows this. and it’s a biphobic bigotry.”

    you know nothing about Muslim society. In certain muslim areas where women and men are kept segregated there is a hidden acknolegement to look away if younger unmarried men are messing around. Of course every single one of them if confronted will claim to be a top if you can even get them to admit what happened. but yes, claiming bi-sexuality is much more safe there than homosexuality. Bisexuality would be like saying over there that you had one drink. Homosexuality over there would be like saying that you had a Ham and bacon sandwhich and owned a brewery.

  • Cam

    @Rowen: You said “It’s not that we “hate” bi folk, but that when we see someone young and very stereotypical dodge the question, mouth some existential nonsense, and then finally say he’s bi, we take it with a grain of salt.


  • Red

    Most men who are really bisexual know to avoid the bitchy, intolerant queens. That’s why so many of you THINK you’ve never met a bi guy. You’ve met them, you just don’t know it because bi guys know what to expect from you. The same queens that demand that straight people stay out of THEIR business feel they have some jurisdiction over all homosex and everyone who’s ever had it.

    I laugh at the people who think that gays are better, more enlightened and more tolerant than the straights.

  • Bi Social News

    I have a question for the bisexuals out there, too. I’ve meet bisexual women who are in both same sex and opposite sex pairings, but I have yet to meet a bisexual man who is in a primarily same sex pairing. I’ve meet plenty who are in monogamous opposite sex marriages, and I’ve meet plenty who are in some form of open/poly couplings.”

    nani? I just meet a few last night at a bi event… they are not like bigfoot you know, they do exist and out and about all over the world…. wait, if you look now to the left, you will see one, going out to dinner with their partner… wow! I can’t believe it, I saw one!

  • Bi Social News


    That’s just it, you’ve been there. This doesn’t account for the other true bisexuals who have not. You can’t lock in your experience of what You did with the bisexual community. This is the basic of the bi debate. Gays and lesbians trying to come to terms that bisexuals didn’t have the same experience that “you” did with regards to being bi or gay….

    Well I’m hear to tell you many bi’s who have moved on to the young are still bi, so you are stating a very narrow viewpoint. But the bisexual community is use to this sort of talk. No, different then the straight community thinking you lie about being gay…

  • Bi Social News

    lol, Jason you lie! Is it just me, or did someone have a bad experience here?

    “The women don’t mind it because it enables them to obtain the sorts of benefits that come from using their sexuality as a marketing ploy.”

  • Rowen

    @Bi Social News: While I haven’t attended any soley bisexual events, I have spent years being active in the gay and poly communities along with numerous other sexuality oriented events, both in Texas and New York. My question was honestly asked and was asked with the intention of information seeking.

    If you would like to continue to greet people who ARE trying to get more information with sarcasm and put downs, I’d be more then happy to return to my ivory tower of indifference and “bigotry” resting securely in my empirical experiences, rather then find more about a similar group of people who seem to be claiming persecution while being bitchy to the same people who worked for the legal recognition that we all have today.

  • The Gay Numbers

    @Bi Social News: Because facts are facts, and I do not feel the need to make a political agenda of what evidence to the contrary or gut instinct is telling me.

  • The Gay Numbers

    By the way, I will not be commenting further on this thread. People have a political agenda beyond responding to what is being said. I am interested in discussing the complexity of actual human behavior and actions. Not your political agenda over bisexuality. It is true there are real bisexuals, some are good, and it is also true there are those who use such realities as a shield against being labeled gay. One does not negate the other. That you are trying to do so is enough for me to move on because you are not serious commentors. You have a lot of baggage.

  • Rowen

    @Bi Social News: Dude, I think you really need to bone up on your reading comprehension.

    Here’s a recap of what I did say. Any further misreadings on your part, and I will view this thread as over.

    When someone says they’re bi, I take them at face value. When someone goes through a checklist of things that most guys dealing with coming out say/do, and then reluctantly says they’re bi, I’ll take them at face value, even though I might have some private judgements.

    If my THOUGHTS (not ACTIONS) are offending you, then I have no problem in letting you go form some bisexual society outside of, and removed from, the gay community. I’ve done too much for my rights to feel ostracized because someone didn’t like the way I think (as opposed to act).

  • romeo

    @Red: Just look at your post. Could you be anymore anti-gay? A point that also hasn’t been made here is how superior most of the bisexuals I’ve met feel to gay men.

    Interesting the way all the insecure bi’s are showing up here to post. What are you insecure about? That comment about gays being more accepted than bi’s is the biggest bunch of drama gueen bullsh*t I’ve ever heard. Straights are way more comfortable with bisexuality than with pure gayness.

    I posted a response to this discussion yesterday, and I find that the discussion is still in full swing, mostly with neither side listening to each other. There were two direct responses to my post, both of which missed my point.

    @Rudy: Kinsey was not my issue, bi-guys attempting to paint the whole world as bisexual to legitimize their position was my point. The fact that Kinsey is outdated doesn’t matter to such guys at all.

    Now to the response that REALLY ticked me off, @Kian: where did I make any projection on to other people. I was saying exactly the opposite. READ before you respond. Who knows? Maybe people will start listening to you. The point was that that was my own individual experience. And as far as my own “bisexual behavior,” kid, if you’re pressured into it, and you feel bad before, during, and after, not to mention all the mental gymnastics you have to put yourself through to get the deed done unbeknownst to the women (God, if women only knew), then that makes me GAY ! not bi. LMAO

    Perfectly willing to concede that bisexuality exists, that there are men that enjoy sex with both women and men. I’ve been in some group scenes that would certainly lead me to believe that’s the case.

    But I also know that there are some drama queens who can’t handle the thought that they’re gay. Some of the bi-defenders here can figure out which kind of “bi” they are.

  • benlayvey

    @Cam: Hear hear, I second your thoughts. Bisexuality is the last stop on the great colorful way to Gaydom. Its their way of gauging people’s attitudes toward them in case they come out eventually. Furthermore, I think such men are cautious about lunatic politicians as well. Consider, bisexuals are vigilant so as to deny their sexuality should any conservative nut [yes of the Hitler kind] be elected to office who suddenly plans our extermination under the ‘Protection of Traditional/Family Values Law'[I made it up]. Bisexuals will be quick to shed their Homo side to avoid deportation to death selfishly. So anyone who is not ‘fully out’, I find them cowards who are not willing to join the equality fight to counter such a dim prospect for our people for we mustn’t forget if it happened once, it can happen again.

  • gomez

    @Cam: show me one muslim in the muslim world who identifies as “bisexual”. go ahead, i’ll wait.

  • gomez

    @Rowen: yeah and the humorless livid lesbians have no jurisdiction over how other women, straight or otherwise, conduct themselves homoerotically. none. what. so. ever. just like str8’s have no jurisdiction over us. ya dig?

    so what if str8 and bi dudes get off on “girl-on-girl”? it will always be this way. this behavior is clearly homo and we are shooting ourselves in the foot when the homoerotic police dictate what is and what is not “authentic” homosexuality. we should be putting a spotlight on the “republican frat boys” and their taste for bi girls, not trashing it. jeezus this seems like such an obvious angle to work.

  • The Gay Numbers

    @gomez: I dated a guy who identified as bi who is muslim, and part of the reason was that somehow it gave his family a sense (as far as I could tell) that there was “hope”

  • Hoyden

    I feel that this is perhaps the root of this argument. It’s the difference in perception that any two groups can have when conducted with the exact same bits of information. If I may speak for the gay side for one second, I feel that Rowen has just encapsulated how you view the history of Mika’s avoidence and refusal to label himself. Several posts have told me that this is the case, that you suspect that he may truly be a gay man because either you or many men around you who ended up taking on a strictly ‘gay’ label, flirted with the identiy of bisexual as a ‘stop on the way to gaytown’. Thus in him you see the journey of a gay man who’s just not there yet, someone who is being a chicken and avoiding the display of moral courage it took for you all to come out as truly gay.
    For the bi’s however the avoidence and refusal to label behaviour, is exactly what they and a lot of their friends did as a stop on the way to ‘bi town’. Mika’s previous and current behaviours are exactly what a lot of people who eneded up taking on a strictly ‘bi’ label, exhibited. The avoidence, the questioning, the stuff about labels. Thus in him we see our journey, the journey of a bi man who is finally ready to come out. We were happy because we felt that he had FINALLY displayed the moral courage that it took to come out as truly bi, and though I know some of you see that as being less than the courage it takes to come out as gay, having had to do it myself, any advantage in the reduction of shit I get from the straight people is more than nullified by the extra shit I get from the gay people. So I really do disagree, because I can tell you, it wasn’t easier for me.
    So while I finally see how the gay men are sceptical or doubt his intentions, can I say that the reason the bi people are upset is because, however unintentional, or indirectly, you took what should have been a ‘yay’ moment for us, and made it all about you guys, your perceptions, your idea of his sexuality, your past experiences with bi guys. You took a bi moment and made it gay. I understand now why you did that, and I’m really not trying to be attacking about it, i’m just saying that this is how I see the situation and why I think some of the bi’s have argued in a more hostile manner, they feel directly under attack on this issue.
    If you always doubt him at his word, you are in effect, doubting us at our word. You ARE questioning our existence in that respect. What we’re really hoping is that when someone comes out as bi that you accept that and say, ok, and don’t make funny comments about elton john and david bowie because as we now all know, yes, you were right, elton john did just turn out to be gay and for him, it was a stop on the way to gaytown, but if you have listened to any bowie interview on the subject post 2002 or read his wife’s biography, bowie does in fact consider himself to be a bisexual man, but he got so much shit about it that he went back into the closet.

  • gomez

    @romeo: [A point that also hasn’t been made here is how superior most of the bisexuals I’ve met feel to gay men]

    oh that irony is just too rich to let slide.

    [Interesting the way all the insecure bi’s are showing up here to post. What are you insecure about? That comment about gays being more accepted than bi’s is the biggest bunch of drama gueen bullsh*t I’ve ever heard. Straights are way more comfortable with bisexuality than with pure gayness.]

    again the delicious irony is thick and rich. and bi girls? yeah, clearly and we should embrace it. but you clearly don’t live on planet earth when it comes to bi dudes.

    [But I also know that there are some drama queens who can’t handle the thought that they’re gay. Some of the bi-defenders here can figure out which kind of “bi” they are]

    and which posters are those? name names. the chutzpah to question those self-identifed bi guys or gay guys who are less than 100% gay. you’re no better than the homophobic religious right. f u guy. we know who we are. you just can’t accept it because it disturbs your fragile little persecuted all-gay paradigm.

    and yes, it’s the bitter intolerant queens and dour lesbians who are supposed to be our allies but instead mock and spit in our eye.

    nice going.

  • Cam

    @gomez: You said “@Cam: show me one muslim in the muslim world who identifies as “bisexual”. go ahead, i’ll wait.”

    You mean other than Mika? But if you need something else, here is a link to a Muslim group for bisexuals.


    And again, to purposely misunderstand another persons post is ridiculous. Go back, reread and then try to get the point, being bi in the Muslim world is seen as a dirty thing that some boys go through merely because of the absence of women. It’s like parents catching their kid on drugs. They will flip out, but it’s ok because it’s thought of us prison sex….HOWEVER, to come out as gay will get them thrown out, arrested and possibly honor killed.

  • Cam

    @gomez: You said “again the delicious irony is thick and rich. and bi girls? yeah, clearly and we should embrace it. but you clearly don’t live on planet earth when it comes to bi dudes.”

    You ask for proof from the other poster in your comment, but if you notice, in your comment you make generalized statements like this with no proof whatsoever.

  • rudy

    @gomez: “yes, it’s the bitter intolerant queens and dour lesbians who are supposed to be our allies but instead mock and spit in our eye.”

    Maybe it’s because you call them “bitter intolerant queens and dour lesbians” that they think anything else you say is probably a lie.

  • gomez

    @benlayvey: [Bisexuality is the last stop on the great colorful way to Gaydom.]

    no, not always, sorry. whatever militant all-gay textbook you’re reading from is wrong.

    [Bisexuals will be quick to shed their Homo side to avoid deportation to death selfishly.]

    your hypothetical scenario from “the handmaiden’s tale” is funny. yeah, how selfish it is of them to lie to avoid death, how dare they. and i guess homos would march proudly to their deaths in this scenario.

  • romeo

    @Gomez: Thanks for reiterating my post and helping to prove my point.

    Are you sure you’re up to this posting on the web stuff? LMAO

  • gomez

    @rudy: um, they are bitchy, intolerant queens and dour lesbians, to the last one.

  • gomez

    @romeo: is this backwards day?

  • gomez

    @Cam: um i ask for no proof. i simply assert the reality as it is.

    quote: “Straights are way more comfortable with bisexuality than with pure gayness.”

    when it comes to bisexual men, utter nonsense. seems to go double when it’s bitchy intolerant queens dealing with bi men.

  • romeo

    @Gomez: I’m butcher than you ever dreamed of being, dude. And I only do occasional posting when I have some spare time, and the subject interests me. I spend far more time getting laid.

    Man, you are not bi or gay. You’re in a whole different category. Not sure what that category is, but it’s filled with hate. This is not the forum for you. Try “Exodus.”

  • gomez

    @Cam: “And again, to purposely misunderstand another persons post is ridiculous”

    so now i “purposely” misunderstand another person’s post. typical.

    quote: “Some people, like it or not, do use bisexuality for purposes other than describing what they truly are. They see it as more socially accepting. Certainly in some Muslim cultures, having dated gay Muslim men, the idea of being a bi guy for some moderate Muslims may be more acceptable especially if you say you are a top.”

    i am talking about muslim world, geographically, where they surely don’t identify as “bisexual”. if this is about some london-based muslim culture where “bisexuality” is more accepted, well color me misinformed.

    and if that’s the case, then that acceptance is even more evidence that “bisexuality” among men is just as “real” and “authentic” as gayness.

    what is the point for you to question, diss and in general downplay another person’s (and especially a man’s) claim of biseuxality? what cherished idea are you protecting?

  • Hoyden

    I give up, all I can do is thank god that the gay men I’m friends with aren’t the intollerant douches from here. Happy bisexuality day everyone. It’s lovely to feel so loved by your fellows. Gomez- thanks for trying, I for one appreciate the effort.

  • gomez

    @romeo: ok mr butch internet tough guy, if you say so. hate? yeah, i hate the fact that whenever bisexuality for men comes up, it’s a dogpile from the gays.

    [This is not the forum for you. Try “Exodus.] right, police me out of the community if you can. i’m just not authentic or “real” enough to get my gay membership card, i guess. who’s really threatened here? it’s you, mr. butch realness.

  • romeo

    Happy Bisexuality Day guys, and I for one truly mean that. As I kept saying, I think there really are bi guys. However, the next time you go on a gay site looking for affirmation, you might try refraining from calling everybody “bitchy queens” and “dour lesbians.” Especially when you’re not understanding their posts.

    And, yeah, Gomez, thanks for the laughs. LMAO

  • gomez

    @romeo: what, no hot affirming butch blowjob before you go while i eat some pink taco? what kind of happy bisexual day is that? that makes me very dour.

  • The Gay Numbers

    @Hoyden: I doubt they care enough to actually try to speak to you you on this level about this issue. I have seen multiple post try to clearly parse what they mean, and then i see one of you write something that just lumps all opinions as one. If you are an example of your friends- I doubt they are that developed mentally. Seriously, what annoys me more here than anything else is the absolute laziness of lumping some really divergent views as if they are all the same on bisexuality. If you did not intend to do so- you need to specific to whom you are speaking.

  • Hoyden

    Yeah, i for one definitely came on this ‘gay’ site looking for affirmation. It’s not at all that I’m a long time reader who foolishly thought that a site for people who sleep with the same sex meant everyone who did so, rather than everyone who exclusively did so. And stuipd me to come into a post about a bisexual and expect tollerance, little own affirmation. The first ten comments alone certainly showed me that I wasn’t going to find that, but the masochist in me stayed to try and understand. Don’t worry, I won’t be coming back. You can keep your exclusively gay world all to yourself and I’ll just go back to After Elton/Ellen and enjoy the progressive inclusion that I find there.

  • The Gay Numbers

    @romeo: I think they have a political agenda outside of what you or anyone else has actually said. Thus, they are not really listening so much as just here to push whatever people say into that agenda. My first post was on how some people are real bisexuals and some are not, and, the first response was to try to push that comment into the agenda rather than understand the thesis that I was making- namely , that to have a real conversation one must aknowledge that not everyone who says they are bisexual are. This started out as a discussion about Mika- who is a very specific type of person with specific type of behavior. It is not his bisexuality claim alone that is at issue, but the lead up to it that creates the question mark. Rather than addressing that, they, several posters here, seized on his statement as a way to affirm their own identiy rather than admit that there is a possibility that he’s actually a gay man. Indeed, as I said, the one true bisexual I know- was unappologetic, and had been in relationship with both men and women. There was none of this coy game playing. That alone makes me quesiton Mika much more than anything else.

  • John from England(used to be just John but there are other John's)

    @The Gay Numbers:

    Good post.

    Some people who are Bi here are being v silly. Very much I want my cake and….

    It’s that whole black and mixed race thing/argument…

    Bi’s are like it’s just as “bad for us”…and it’s quite offensive when you think of all the young gay kids who’ve committed suicide. It’s like I don’t know of many bi kids who’ve committed suicide because well, they could just date a girl at least and not groan that they couldn’t get with Jim the jock.

    I’m from the UK and Bi is the new black! Duncan from Blue (He’s gaaaaaaaaay), Mika (he’s gaaaaaaaaay) etc all coming out with being Bi! Yeah right, why NOW?

    But I do know a lot of genuinely Bi people and these guys are not. At all.

    If anyone watched Hollyoaks (crap silly show) but loads of the guys there are genuinely Bi-they’d fuck anything and have blurred boundaries. For real. And good for them-you only live once!

  • The Gay Numbers

    @Hoyden: Yeah, actually you did since you are distorting people’s statements to fit your agenda. You take a comment about one guy who fits a particular type of guy who is being coy in music, and who acts like prior music acts about his sexuality, as a means to advance what may be legitimate concerns,b ut you are doing it with a guy who is not the best of cases to do it. Mika is probably full of shit. That’s what our point is. Not that ALL bisexuals are. Indeed I pointed out one guy I know who was not only bi, but was pretty clear and had been in relationships with both men and women. You and others ignore those kinds of comments from those who say something different than “oh wow everyone who says theya re bi are bi” Instead, we get this silliness about biphobia just because we point out that not everyone who says this is being up front about who they are. So, yes, you are looking for affirmation, or you would actually be reading the nuiances and complexity of what is being writtenr ather than falling back on knee jerk reaction.

  • The Gay Numbers

    @John from England(used to be just John but there are other John’s): I have seen Hollyoaks. Bi is how the character of Craig was presented, and it made since and really was an affirmation of being bisexual rather than playing at being bi to obtain some sort of social acceptance.

    I think the problem here is that people have an agenda outside of calling a duck, a duck. That some people are really bi, and but others are not. That when someone like Mika says he is bi we need to place his comments into context of how he has acted previously. if he had said I am bi in the begining I doubt I would have these questions. It is his behavior that makes me question is sincerity. This got off track because some can not accept that kind of complexity- that some people lie and others are telling the truth. That some use it as a shield while others are identifying who they are.

  • John from England(used to be just John but there are other John's)

    @The Gay Numbers:

    I’ve never know a Bi guy to hide who he is, unless he is surrounded by really homophobic people and in that case-he/she would just do it on the sly if they had the urge or wait till they go into university.

    But maybe it’s just England??

    I mean if anyone but Mika had said this…you may understand but are people really arguing about MIKA?? Someone who’s created this warped situation for no reason other then he thought he may appeal to more people in the US?

    Bad move.

  • beets

    @John from England(used to be just John but there are other John’s): I had forgotten about this, but no one is bringing up just how much Mika is trying to appeal to Americans at this point in his career. His tour is coming here, he’s in New York right now doing interviews for talk shows, if you read his website, it sounds like he really couldn’t care less about the rest of the world.

    Mika’s CD is selling way better in the UK than the US, but his giddy tweets are only about how he’s finally selling *something* in the States. There is clearly a strong desire to break through to Americans, and I totally understand why.

    BUT, while he’s trying to court the great nation of GlennBeckia (where all porn is gay porn, etc), it would probably be smart to keep the rainbow flag in the luggage, at least until people love you enough to stop caring.

    So this is another piece of evidence in the “Mika is gay” pile, but at the same time, he said he was bi to some obscure-ass gay magazine. There’s no reason to have not said he was gay if he was, since the interview is in like Danish or something anyway, and no one in mainstream straight America will have heard about it.

  • Hoyden

    @John from England(used to be just John but there are other John’s): ‘Bisexual men and women report higher levels of self-harm, suicide attempts and thoughts of suicide than heterosexuals, and in many studies, higher than gay men and lesbians as well.’ -Brown Univeristy Health Education Service.

  • Hoyden

    That’s just in response to your little: “Bi’s are like it’s just as “bad for us”…and it’s quite offensive when you think of all the young gay kids who’ve committed suicide. It’s like I don’t know of many bi kids who’ve committed suicide because well, they could just date a girl at least and not groan that they couldn’t get with Jim the jock.” Which really does take the award for most offensive comment of the day.

  • The Gay Numbers

    @beets: Honestly, that’s my view. He’s trying to sell his music. This is not about his sexuality at all other than people keep asking questions so he feels he must say something that will keep his options open. The problem is that some here seized on our cynancism over Mika in particular to make statements about bisexuality. On some level, it is not about bisexuality as a general topic. It is about whether this specific person named Mika is bisexual. That’s it.

  • John from England(used to be just John but there are other John's)


    Wow, that’s interesting. Thank you for posting that. I don’t have an agenda. For all the UK’s mentalness-we’re really open when it does come to people being out, so that’s really interesting.

    Is this study just US based? Because I swear in the UK, so many mainsream people I know are Bi-or well….like both sexes but don’t own up to it publicly?

    Urgh, that’s horrible. I guess their confusion or feeling of being alone stems from not fitting into a box??

    Dunno but would love more details of that research-really interesting.

  • John from England(used to be just John but there are other John's)


    Thanks I know I can be offensive and your job is to put me right, which is what progressive and engaging dialogue is.

    So thanks.

    I’m not weirdly insercure. I love being wrong because how will you ever learn?

  • John from England(used to be just John but there are other John's)


    Exactly Beets.

    This was my first thing because I remember when he came around and he was just plain ol gay.

    And it’s sad because, will they be loyal? But I guess he saw/sees himself as the neo-liberace…? Or Elton John? Fair do’s. It’s every pop star who seeks mainstream approval to get recognition from the US.

    People make muchos money here but also, it’s the U S of A. Y’know?

  • Hoyden

    Thank you very much for your apology John. I actually didn’t know myself until I read it on one of the gay news sites the other day that another study had come out with that result. I can’t remember which one though and I had a quick look but there is so much on the internet about gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender suicide in general that I couldn’t find the other references which singled out the bisexual results, so if anyone has a link to one of those studies please provide it. As you can see the brown quote referenced several.

    Being from Australia (a country much like England), I honestly have never had much shit about being bisexual from straight people, other than a few ignorant comments, but they tend to fire me up and make me feel like i’m fighting the good fight. It’s when a gay person says something negative (like it’s easier being bi because we can just hide it by going straight) that I get upset, because I feel more alone then and left out of the group and I would never EVER hide who I am because it’s easier to be accepted by the straight community. I have honestly wished I was just a full on lesbian since I was a little kid because my parents have always been very accepting of gay people, so have never had any negative feelings about liking the same sex, my conflict always comes with not knowing where I fit into the queer community because I feel insecure about not fitting model of what I thought gay was supposed to be.

    That’s why I was happy that Mika came out. So many of his song lyrics seem to deal with bisexuality (see stuck in the middle or billy brown) that I had been hoping he was. I also wish he’d done a better job of dealing with his sexuality in the past, and if he does turn out to be fully gay I will be very upset with him because it damages the bi community every time someone does that, but right now, i’m trying to take him at his word.

  • John from England(used to be just John but there are other John's)

    @ Hoyden

    “Kera says she was 10 when she realized she was interested in both sexes. “It was confusing for a while, because for some reason I thought that you had to be straight or gay, and that you couldn’t be both,” she told me at the coffee shop. “So I thought about it a lot, like I do about everything, and I went online and looked up bisexuality to read more about it. I realized that was me.””

    This quote from the coming out at middle school by that NY Times writer, I think is really apt to this conversation…

    Genuine, honest and raw.

    Sorry, but not like Mika.

  • John from England(used to be just John but there are other John's)


    Hoyden-he isn’t bi. He’s gay.

    Soo many Australians are in the UK @ the mo, I’m friends with a huge amount and we do have a v similar culture of being ‘live and let live’ although it’s not loud!

    But remember that Mika is also Arabic/French, who’s dad was a diplomat and had to leave Paris for London and then NY for a small time..

    Again, I think you Australians take it for granted because, man, you’re all immigrants or mixed but Mika’s thing reminds me of how I grew up-which is why I originally liked him-you’re from somewhere, your family had money but things go bad but you still go to really good schools etc..

    To me, that was HOW I empathised with ‘his’ been stuck in the middle. Stuck in between cultures.

    I went to international american schools as a kid-I STILL have an american accent and know soo much about the place BUT I’m not from there…

    So look into that…or kids who go to Boarding schools and are ‘stuck in the middle’..

    Whether or not it’s your experience, doesn’t mean you don’t ‘get’ what it feels to bot fit into a societal ‘box’.

  • Hoyden

    John- I’m not saying I won’t turn out to be wrong, but look at his song stuck in the middle.

    The first part of the song seems to reference an older member of his family and him telling them something about himself that they don’t like.

    It ends-

    “I know that what I’ve started
    Means that when we have parted
    I can live in honesty

    Oh, oh, oh, is there anybody home?
    Who will believe me, won’t deceive me
    Won’t try to change me?

    Ah, ah, ah, is there anybody home?
    Who wants to have me just to love me?
    Stuck in the middle

    Comes across as genuine and honest to me. In fairness to him, maybe it’s a little bit easier to come out to people who know you, rather than to the world through the media.

  • John from England(used to be just John but there are other John's)


    It still doesn’t make him Bi. Unless he said he was Gay at the start of his career in the UK just because…?

    Thing is, that the UK is tiny. I worked in the music industry and I still have friends who do.

    We all thought he was gay cause he said he was…

    Not my fault.

    Not sure this is allowed but do you get holymoly.com? If not, you should. Brit goss website that has stuff on Mika even before anyone knew he was….Orlando Bloom too fyi…

  • Hoyden

    I’m looking over at holy moly, can you link me to something specific where he says he’s gay. I’ve tried their search engine. If he came out early in his career and said he was gay and is now using bisexuality as a cover I am going to kick his arse.

  • John from England(used to be just John but there are other John's)


    Keep checking this post cause I’m actually gonna have to go through some old Holy Moly’s! Actually, wow, the site now is a mainstream gossip site…not in my days…

    But will find the link…

  • Hoyden

    Strike that last comment, it was beneath me. Who am I to judge someone else’s experience and motives. But I will be sad and disapointed if he is really not bisexual.

  • Rowen

    @Hoyden: Hoyden. I think you’re getting at what Romeo, Gay Numbers, Cam and I have been trying to say. We’re not denying or trying to quash people who are bisexual. In fact, I celebrate my bisexual friends.

    There’s just a lot of buzz words, phrases and actions that, definately for me and it sounds like the same for a lot of others, that set off warning alarms when certain people claim to be bisexual. Beyond any mental shit that gays might attach to theoretical bisexuality, every person who publically uses bisexuality as a way to not fully come out makes it even harder for those who truly are bisexual to come out and function without stigma.

    If Mika had just said, from the beginning, “Yes, I’m bi, why do you ask?” that’d be fine. This waffling, especially when it seems more of a marketing ploy then anything, just seems cowardly and shouldn’t, to me, be celebrated as a courageous step towards bisexual inclusion.

  • The Gay Numbers

    @John from England(used to be just John but there are other John’s): I saw that NY Times article. The bisexuality and that of the others felt real. The story was great too. Mika’s coming out as bi does not. His seems like an old rock industry cliche and a guy who lacks courage. I doubt anyone would really care if he is gay or bi except for him and his handlers.

  • The Gay Numbers

    @Rowen: Absolutely agree with your comment. It is the games that make me not believe. Not the statement of what he claims to be.

  • The Gay Numbers

    I do have a little test that I use: if someone says they are bi, and they are as comfortable with men as women, and they seem to have no hang ups about it, I tend to be believe them. However, if someone claims they are bi, and they have a problem with the same gender aspect I tend to question their bisexuality. It is just a question mark because it is the same question mark I have of straight men who claim to be 100 percent straight but have slept with me. Now, with guys who show comfort i n their sexuality, and are forthright, I assume they are telling me the truth. This really is behavior dependent regarding how they treat the issue.

  • John from England(used to be just John but there are other John's)

    @The Gay Numbers:

    I agree

  • benlayvey

    @gomez: I’m not implying Gays will march to their deaths ‘proud’ like sheep to the slaughter but merely that these bisexuals-by denying their Homosexuality-will lessen our chances of successfully fighting off any would-be aggressors to our person. It drains our man power is more my point. Such men must be considered traitors to the cause. As for your militant accusation…well every faction needs its paramilitary wing funded by secret interest groups. nes pä??

  • jason

    The Gay Numbers,

    Being bisexual in orientation does not mean that you are oriented to both genders equally. It’s an unfortunate fact of the prefix “bi”, which suggests equally distributed orientation, but this is far from the fact.

    Many bisexually oriented people are more distributed to one gender. For instance, a man who is 95% straight and 5% gay is still bisexual but he is predominantly heterosexual in his feelings and fantasies. Thus, he may exhibit verbal and physical discomfort at the notion of being with a man despite the fact that he is bisexual in his orientation. It’s a small component of his orientation, and thus he may consider it “unusual”.

    Also, there is a lot of social stigma against the male-male erotic interaction than there is against the female-female one. Thus, men are affected by this far more than women.

  • Huh?...LMAO

    Thus, he may exhibit verbal and physical discomfort at the notion of being with a man despite the fact that he is bisexual in his orientation.

    This comment makes bisexuality sound like a mental problem; at least a potential one. LOL

  • The Gay Numbers

    @jason: Do you know how to read? My comment was not about how weight of attraction.

  • The Gay Numbers

    @Huh?…LMAO: Which gets at my point. This is not about whom they are attracted to. It is a bout how they react to the attraction.

  • jason


    I’m simply informing you of the perspective of some men who are bisexual in orientation but who are uncomfortable about their same-sex feelings. I’m simply informing you, not advocating it. Don’t confuse information with advocacy.

    You need to understand that, because of social stigma against the male-male erotic interaction, many bisexually oriented men classify themselves as straight.

  • The Gay Numbers

    @jason: We do not need to understand your internalized issues with your sexuality. And nor is that lack of understanding bigotry as it has been labeled along this thread. As someone else wrote, this is the cake and eat it too part of the conversation. You can certainly want people to accept your lack of courage regarding the same sex part of your attraction, but don’t piss on our legs by telling us that there is something wrong with us for not giving you our acceptance. This ultimately is not about bisexuality. It is about honesty, fairness, courage and changing society. Step up to the plate or don’t whine that you are being treated unfairly when others must win the struggle for acceptance without you.

  • Hoyden

    I have read all your posts in this thread and agree that you yourself have always tried to make that point while showing respect to other people. That being the case however, I have to say that things here could have gone a lot better from the start if other people had just couched their disparaging reactions to Mika’s announcement with a nice disclaimer along the lines of ‘no offence to our bi brother’s and sisters but I think Mika is really just using this identity as a cover’. The rest of us aren’t mind readers and the first thirty posts just began a dishartening trend of comments like:

    There is one thing that bi men and bi women have in common. They both sleep with men (not from any of the people you listed I agree) and from Cam: “So again, am I bi-phobic? Or have I just never met any man who said he was “Bi-sexual” that seemed to stay that way. If I ever meet a Bi guy, sneaking around behind his BOYFRIENDS back with a woman, just for sex, then I’ll believe that that guy is Bi. I don’t believe in Santa Clause…does that make me “Santa Phobic”?

    Do you see where we may have started to get the idea that the problem many posters here had wasn’t with them not believing Mika specifically but bi men in general.

  • Hoyden

    @The Gay Numbers: You are being spectacualarly unfair to Jason. Jason made a comment about how there are some men out there who are mildly attracted to men but who are uncomfortable with that fact. Are you really denying that point??? He at no time said he was one of those men, nor did he appeal for understanding for those men, he merely said they exist and tend to hide out in the straight community. Do you really disagree with that point? Reading your posts and Jasons I really don’t see where you feel he is asking you to accept those men. I’m pretty sure he merely said that there was a stigma attached to same sex attraction for men and that this leads to some people being unable to accept their own attraction to other men. Go back and read those posts and tell me that you honestly feel that Jason just deserved the verbal tongue lashing you gave him.

  • The Gay Numbers

    @Hoyden: How is his points relevant to my statement other than as excuse? Does he really think I do not realize people closet themselves? The more important question is why do they closet themselves? Because of shame and fear over same sex attraction. Then, the question which I am asking and answering is should we excuse that behavior? I say no. It does not matter if it is a bisexual or gay person doing it. It is the same underlying currents. It should be addressed the same- with respect to the attraction without it being a point of embarrassment. Really, it is ironic that this conversation starts off with claims of biphobia, but scratch the surface, and what are some now saying?

    He seems to be, and now you, through your defense of him, not just defending bisexuality, but cowardly behavior. One can be bisexual and not a coward about it. I mentioned one example of a guy whom I respect. Sexual orientation is not enough for respect. Behavior and personality is. This guy never hid any aspect of himself to anyone important. I respected that. And, yes, I consider it cowardly to hide the same sex part of one’s attraction while mentioning the opposite sex attractions while claiming one is not being accepted as a whole. You can not have it both ways. Be out with it all, and accept it all, or don’t expect respect from me.

    You can defend bisexuality, and I will agree with that because it should be respected, but don’t expect me to agree with any attempts to excuse someone treating same sex attraction as bad. It is not going to happen. I am not interested in it from gays, and I am sure as hell not going to listen to it from people who are bi. Since my post was about my problem with such behavior, I have no idea why he would even make his statements except as defense and excuses.

  • Hoyden

    @The Gay Numbers: You may have read it that way, but I feel very very sure that this is not the way he meant it or indeed said it.

    You said: ‘if someone says they are bi, and they are as comfortable with men as women, and they seem to have no hang ups about it, I tend to be believe them.’
    He said: ‘Many bisexually oriented people are more distributed to one gender. For instance, a man who is 95% straight and 5% gay is still bisexual but he is predominantly heterosexual in his feelings and fantasies. Thus, he may exhibit verbal and physical discomfort at the notion of being with a man despite the fact that he is bisexual in his orientation. It’s a small component of his orientation, and thus he may consider it “unusual”.
    You then accused him, by saying that such men exist, of being an apologist for such men. He came back and declared that he in no way advocated on their behalf, merely said that it was an unfortunate side effect of societies discomfort with male same sex attraction. You then accused him of saying that you should have sympathy for such men and excuse them from taking on the advocacy role that you and all gay men have fought so hard for. One hell of a step there mate. That is what I would call some major projection. I think some confusion may have occured around the fact that you had referenced men who ‘say they are bi’, while I believe Jason was not talking about men who have claimed to be bisexual, rather saying that there was probably a lot more people out there whos inate same sex attraction leant more towards an unbalanced % rather than a strict 50/50.
    Jason’s point, and I agree with it, is merely that there are probably a lot more people out there who are attracted to their own sex to some extent who will never exhibit comfort with their same sex feelings, who will never accept that part of themselves (and though I am sad for them on that account, I don’t expect anyone else to give them pity, especially not a gay man because he is of course more likely to suffer at the hands of their own internalised homaphobia either through their expecting some down low action from him or beating him up for being comfortable with what he can’t be). To take Jason’s point further, I believe this is why you are much more likely to meet ‘out’ bisexuals who share a more equal same sex affection, or at least one of a significant percentage because those people have really had to face up to the reality of their feelings. Hence people often have the image that all real bisexuals experience an equal same sex attraction along the 50/50% line.
    So, just to be clear, if a bi person is not out and does not admit to same sex attraction, I feel no need to advocate for that person, consider them part of the community or defend them and I don’t believe for one minute that Jason suggested that we should do so. Rather I will continue to advocate for acceptance of same sex attraction in general so that maybe one day those people will come out and join the rest of us or at the very least stop being such arseholes.

  • The Gay Numbers

    @Hoyden: I am not going to go back and forth on this. There was no reason for him to respond to my post with what are essentially either excuses or off topic statements.

  • uglybaby

    @alan brickman:

    Agreed. All these jerks saying this crap are all just little insecure assh*les.

  • jason

    In a perfect world, men who are bisexual in orientation would be proud to say it. Indeed, I believe most men ARE bisexual in orientation. Unforutnately, men are the victims of forces that are compelling them towards a polarization paradigm – ie to declare themselves as gay or straight. Here are the reasons as I see them:

    a) homophobia towards the male-male interaction. This is ingrained from a young age. Male-male feelings are associated with a lack of masculinity. Therefore, a male child grows up repressing these feelings.

    Young women, on the other hand, are “bisexualized” by their parents. They’re given female dolls and told to call them “pretty”. Can you imagine mom or dad giving a male doll to their son and calling it “handsome”?

    b) the excessive politicization of the gay community. In a way, I can understand this. Our rights have been won at a political level. It has been necessary to fight for our rights under the “gay” banner, not the “bisexual” banner.

    c) the excessive sexualization of the gay community. Unfortunately, the gay male community has become heavily sexualized. Porn, quick sex, rippling abs…all these have come to signify “gay community”. When a bisexual man appears, it poses a challenge to the assumption that all the men in the club are there to have sex with men and men alone.

    d) the jealousy of women. Women are exceedingly jealous of male-male relationships. They see male-male relationships as usurping their role in life. Unless a man classifies himself as “gay” – and thus easily confinable – a woman finds it threatening.

  • Hoyden

    @The Gay Numbers: And yet Jason’s point still stands. An opera singer who gets stage-fright is still an opera singer. To demean someone for pointing that out is just irrational.

  • Thawk

    Naww poor Mika, he caved. I totally respected he’s “I’m a popstar, I sing, what the hell does my sexuality have to do with anything, it’s none of you’re or anyone else’s business but mine” attitude to the stupid media. It’s a shame, cause he had a good point… but he caved, and the trash gossip magazines won :( It’s a sad day, but kudos to Mika for remaining determined for this long at least…

  • sam

    who gives a fuck. honestly, he says he is bi, then so be it.
    If he comes out as gay later on then your right, if not your wrong. whatever.

  • charlotte- michaela

    Mika came out as Bisexual & that is just what he IS accept it will you people! He HAS dated women I know of this! He has a girlfriend now (who lives in New York!) And the only time he’s ever been in love was with a woman & may I say while I was with him in London (during his gig there) He gave me the eye & I am a woman!

    I do have friends who could back me up too!

    I certainly think you guys need to take a look at his lyrics to see plainly & clearly it’s there right in front of your eyes!

    take a look at the lyrics of the song lollipop (which he wrote for his younger sister) “mama told me what I should know too much candy’s gonna rot you’re soul, if SHE loves you let HER go ’cause love’s gonna get you down, take a look at the GIRL next door SHE’s a player & a downright bore Jesus loves HER SHE wants more oh bad GIRLS get you down”

    then have a look at toy boy

    its a cruel cross
    that I have to bear
    if you come a little close
    I’m going to pull your hair

    more than just a toy
    in a patched blue suit
    when you hold me in your arms
    I’m just a boy like you

    but your momma thought
    there was something wrong
    didn’t want you sleeping
    with a boy too long

    It’s a serious thing
    in a grown-up world
    maybe you’d be better
    with a Barbie girl

    she’s the meanest hag
    that has ever been
    pulled out my insides
    with an old safety pin

    I’m the sorest sight
    now i feel like trash
    clothes are made of rags
    and they don’t even match

    so she dressed me up
    as the man she loved
    and threw me in a box
    when she had had enough

    now the light of day
    I no longer see
    she stuck her voodoo pins

    see a suggestion of bisexuality!!

    then take a look at good gone girl

    Could you believe
    The same old story
    It never bores me
    Though I’ve heard it all before.

    Her name was Georgia
    And she was gorgeous.
    When she adored ya
    The whole room would get to know.

    Like a movie that is filled with lust
    Coming at you with a double D bust.
    At the bed of a wounded soldier
    In a rush cause she’s gettin older.

    there’s a million & one clues you just need to look for them!

    though some people will just NEVER believe him even if he married a woman & stayed with her for decades people would say he was a closeted gay how can anyone be truly bisexual

    believe whatever crap you want to I say… some of us know the truth so what does it matter whether you believe it or not?

    if you do your research you’ll also find that in the beginning someone who worked with him (one of his record company lot) said that they thought Mika was single as far as they were aware they said they hadn’t seen him with a boyfriend or girlfriend & said yeah I believe he’s bisexual

    that’s coming from someone from his own record label before he really took off he’d barely even got known at that point google it you’ll eventually find it it was ages ago i read it

    will post where it is if I ever come across it again just to prove a point that even those working with him knew & admitted he was bi!

  • charlotte- michaela

    may i also say it may have took him this long to admit to his feelings, to his bisexuality because A) he is quite young still & may have only in recent months/years become fully comfortable with who he is & B) he was so badly bullied at school that he had a nervous breakdown at 11 years old!

    this is a guy who is incredibly sensitive & fragile (just ask any true fan & they will confirm it)

    he may well have been scared of the kind of reaction from everyone & probably knows full well the kind of comments he’d receieve this is a very vulnerable & fragile guy we’re talking about here you know, so I could totally understand it!

    And also I can understand his not wanting to use labels on himself he’s never been one to “conform” to standards & normality like Myself he is every different & quirly & refuses to be pigeonholed & good on him I say!

    i have much respect for Mika :)

  • charlotte- michaela

    pardon my typos above I meant to type he is very different & quirky

    couldn’t undo it as I only noticed once I hit the submit button & it was too late, it’s what you get from typing way too fast!

  • Victor

    To momentarily digress from the more serious discussion at hand…

    @charlotte- michaela I don’t know anything about Mika’s past relationships… like I said before (in post no. 53), I’m only aware of his current girlfriend because we’re in the same building, therefore I see them quite often. I will assume any other relationships he’s had, will have been a while back as these two have been together for a long time now.

  • Heather

    I think he probably doesn’t really care about someone’s gender, so he doesn’t label his sexuality, but got so sick of everyone TRYING to label him that he found a label close enough to what he actually is just to shut everyone up.

  • Geri

    As far as I’m concerned Tom Robinson (Glad To Be Gay) already proved that being bi and coming out as gay is way more invidious than being gay and coming out as bi. But then he didn’t know he was going to fall in love with a woman did he? Stuff happens.

    Seriously bi-bashing and biphobia is for losers and morons – just like any other kind of phobia about other people’s sexuality.

    It’s not like sexuality is fixed for life for everyone anyway.

    Please. Grow up already.

  • Sophie100

    This is a page about Mika’s sexuality yet everyone here is happily posting their sex lives to prove they’re not bi or are bi etc.

    Mika is DEFINATELY Gay, deal with it.

    Nobody gives a toss what your sexuality is, please stop posting things about it.

  • Victor

    No, Mika is not gay. Mika, MOST CERTAINLY has a girlfriend. Deal with that. Honestly, the way some will insist on their own point of view is amazing to see.

  • Geri


    Yes this page is about Mika’s sexuality and he has come out as bisexual. So who the bloody hell are you to say he’s gay?

    Well who are you? Know the guy personally do you?

    No, of course you don’t.

  • Jeremy

    I know he’s bi for the simple reason that I’m bi and I also only like big girls too :D

    Personally I don’t see why gay men are so petty that they need to try and label every sexually diverse man as completely gay: the world isn’t that boring and there’s a whole spectrum heading up to the stars on the other side of that rainbow boys. Don’t understand why we like girls? That’s fine but don’t claim to know whether we do or don’t.

    If you just accepted how fun being bi actually is you wouldn’t be trying to kill our buzz right now.

  • Nikki Kirpestein

    Well i think he’s serious and he’s not taking seriously by mostly of the people. And I guess he must be angry because of all the people who are complaining about him. He knows himself best what he is. So I think people just can shut up about him if there are complains about this stuff.

  • noora

    I read a few of the comments and I just have to add:

    Maybe MIKA himself knows the best what he is.

    And maybe you ppl noticed how he says “IF YOU NEED A TERM FOR ME”. He doesn’t want to be labeled as anything, but since everyone in this damn labeled world needs a term for damn everything, he says it’s easiest to be called bisexual.

    There are people who don’t want or need to be labeled. MIKA is clearly one of them, so why do you care if he likes guys or girls? Maybe he doesn’t care about the sex, maybe it’s easier NOT to fuzz your own head up with thoughts of “OMG AM I GAY OR NOTTTTT”.

    ranting. sry.

    peace out.

  • jb

    @alan brickman: What the fuck are you talking about?

  • lou123ify

    @Cole: I know that he was with Kate Perry before she get married. Nothing else. And you must be a homophobig person who says things like this. ‘Cause Mika is awesome and you should know that. And everyone else out there.

  • lou123ify

    Go to hell homophobic people. There is male bisexuality and I know that. My cousin John is bi. I am bi but I am a girl. There’s nothing bad with this. Mika saved my life through his songs and that makes him a lot better than all of you ASSHOLES!

  • lou123ify

    @noora: I think you’re right. I am bisexual and I know that. Mika says “If you need a term for me” Well what if he is bi? He saved my life through his amazing songs and that honours him damn much. I am not anyone important but saving a life by following your dreams is a great achievment.

  • jason

    The stigma against male bisexuality comes mainly from liberals. Liberalism is based on female bisexuality, not male bisexuality. When the sexual revolution began, it promoted – through porn and other forms of adult environment – the bisexualization of women but not men. Men could engage in same-sex activity but only if they were segregated.

    Segregation was thus the key to allowing male-male sexual activity. If we hadn’t accepted segregation, we would still be legally forbidden.

    Thus, there were strings attached to the allowance for male-male sexual activity. Female-female, on the other hand, was given a free run.

    I’ve always said that this double standard is one important reason why liberalism is a phony philosophy. All phony philosophies eventually fail, and liberalism isn’t far off having a major collapse.

  • lou123ify

    @jason: You’re very right my friend. Very right. And I really agree with you.

  • geri

    @jason: My local member of parliament is bisexual. He’s a Libral Democrat. Coming out as bisexual didn’t loose him his seat – he was re-elected this year. He’s a good MP.

    Please stop blaming bi women for the “bisexual double standard” – which is way more of a problem in the USA than it is in the UK or the rest of Europe as far as I can see – it’s really completely unfair.

    David Bowie denied his bisexuality in the late 80s and 90s because he felt it had damaged his career in America. He admitted as much when he quietly came out as bisexual again in the 2000s. Being openly bi helped his career in the UK in the 70s.

  • lou123ify

    You homophobic/biphobic people are pathetic. TOTALLY PATHETIC. Mika is bisexual, and, trust me, I know it preety well. I am bisexual too, but I am a girl[…] It’s a very long story… Being bi isn’t wrong. Being openly bi isn’t wrong either. I understand that you make fool of MIKA because you are completely jealous of him. He is wwwwaaaaaaaaayyyy better than all of us. AND he has. CHANGED all my LIFE. I know that he is really amazing and that you are junks.

  • French chick ^^

    Hey all of you guys & girls, calm down!

    I think Mika is the only one who has to know who he sleeps with, and i think putting a name on everybody and everything is not always a good idea…

    Let’s just enjoy life & body, without thinking it’s male or woman… Sometimes we need guidance and time to find our true selves.

    Don’t forget that naming something is to be less frightened of it…

    That said, take care all :)

  • Shannon

    As a mostly closeted bisexual woman, whoever compared bisexuality to the situation with African Americans working in the fields or in the home due to skin tone, do you know how wrong that assumption is? We DO NOT get less hate from homophobic straights. We are the ones they think can “choose”, and we’ve chosen to be “indecisive whores”.

    And then we get the biphobic hate from the gay population that WE SUPPORT. Do you know how much that hurts? It’s like offering someone your hand, and they spit in your face instead of taking it.

    I have been ridiculed as a “dyke” all my life. I don’t even have a leaning towards either side, but I was called a closet case from middle school onward, by both gays and straights. I’ve fallen in love with people of both genders. I have also never cheated on anyone I’ve been with. I have, however, been cheated on by all kinds. Straight men, lesbian women, bi women. That doesn’t mean I think that entire selected demographic are a bunch of whores.

    One of my closest friends in high school was a closeted bi man. He was always labeled a queer and a faggot and shoved into lockers. Then people assumed he was dating girls because it would shake his “faggy” image, but he actaully really liked them, and had steady relationships with 5 of them throughout high school. He waited until we were in college to date a boy. When I visited him next, he had a steady boyfriend. When they broke up, he dated a girl.

    We’re still extrememly close. He tells me almost everything, even going into the TMI department. He would never cheat on his wife. He loves her dearly. But he’s still very attracted to men. If he were actually just gay, he would tell me. I know that sounds cheesy, but it’s true. He dated more girls than boys, but I assure you that his 4 year long relationship with his last boyfriend was no experimentation. Eventually, people will realize real bisexuals do exist, and we have just as many problems as gays.

  • Charlene Graham

    Uh! Why is this so hard? First Mika is “coy” about his sexuality, and then when he does try to discuss it in the labels everyone demands, he gets attacked by both sides. Like in American politics, if you say you’re a Moderate, the Conservatives and the Liberals both think that is code for one of them without the balls to admit it. No one can just stop being so arrogant and judgemental long enought to consider that some of us feel differently than you do.

    I don’t like labels either. I’ve fallen in love with men and with women. Because my male relationships were more public, everyone labeled me “straight.” But I’m always arguing with the labels and encouraging everyone to consider that we’re all gay and straight and at different points on the Kinsey scale at different times in life. It’s natural.

    No wonder Mika was reluctant to talk about it. The majority of the world is too narrow-minded and uneducated on this subject.

    Look, I fall in love with who I fall in love with. I’m faithful and I’m loyal. I’m also honest about the occassional attraction to someone else that I do not act on when in a committed relationship. But at the end of the day, I love who I love. Sometimes it’s going to be love with a man, and sometimes it’s going to be a woman. I hope someday I grow old with someone perfect for me. Male or female? Don’t know, but I love the suspense.

  • lou123ify

    @Charlene Graham: Haha, it’s nice that you can say it. I am just like you in this matter of life. I don’t like labels, I just sometimes use them so others can understand. I love men but I also love women.

  • Emily

    Okay, reading all this drama is just silly. I am a MASSIVE Mika fan (the extend of stalking) And no, it’s not because I’m female that I want him to be bisexual, I couldn’t care less actually.

    He’s bisexual, just leave it at that. Why are people so afraid of people being bisexual? Especially men… Gosh.

    I’m bisexual myself also but because I’m female, I get told “yeah yeah, sure” but I, myself know what I’m attracted to. Anyway, Mika HAS been seen with numerous females, one being Adele. I think it was 2008 where he was spotted on a sort of “date” and it was up EVERYWHERE all over the Mika fan sites I regularly visit (almost four times a day) and yeah. He also has been seen too cozyly siting hanging with Katy Perry, giving her piggie back rides. Also, he was seen linking arms with Lady Gaga. Now, you could say he’s just friends with these women. But if they were all men, would you say they were just friends? No. Because everyone wants to say he’s gay. I have no idea why, because to me he doesn’t scream. He more so screams a eccentric boy with an odd out look on life. Though, I have seen him probably flirt with male interviewers. And to the person saying he was upfront about his “gayness” he never was, because I’d know about it. I’m a walking Mika biography. I don’t think there’s something I don’t know. So take it from a Mika stalker, who’s been around since the early years. I’d take his word on it.

  • Sierra

    @fubar: …and women.

  • Mya

    I think what hes trying to say is: he doesn’t just like boys, or just like girls. He likes people.

  • Keppler


  • Marz

    This makes me crazy. I’m directing my comments towards the bi-bashers who use their personal experience as an excuse, fact, or justification for discrimination. My own parents used to tell me that they knew all “blacks” were criminally inclined from personal experience. Ignorance is ignorance, and personal experience is not factual data. It is colored by perception and prejudice.

    No, 99% of bisexuals are not eventually gay – not by a long shot. That is just not fact. If you want hard data, check Kinsey stats: http://www.kinseyinstitute.org/resources/FAQ.html homosexuals and bisexuals in both males and females tend to be about the same numbers from year to year with very little fluxuation. Ignorance and fear create ALL prejudice, and it is clear that victims of hate, fear, and ignorance are just as likely to commit the same and pass on the sickness.

    You want personal information about how we feel, so you’ll believe/understand us? Okay. I did not understand my bisexuality until I was an adult – as in, I did not know. I was not hiding it, I just did not understand what I was. I had feelings for both men and women. I was exclusively in relationships with the men because that’s my culture, and I am attracted to men. I am attracted to women too, but because I’m attracted to men, I never really worried about being a lesbian. I knew I wasn’t. I had sexual fantasies about women, but they were my private things. I fell in love with a woman in adulthood, and I spent a long time trying to understand what that meant. She was nuts. That ended. I was heartbroken. I have since loved men and women. I am currently single, but I am open-minded about who I can fall for. Honestly, I find straight men and both bi men and women more accepting of me, so I don’t even think about any attraction to lesbians – especially not those who are very involved in the community, as they are far more likely to judge me and demand I admit I’m not bi. Fine honey. If it makes you more comfortable when I stare at his arse when he walks by, I’ll lie to you. – No thanks.

  • Emily

    @Marz: Couldn’t agree with you more.

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