A pair of dads to a boy, age 9, and a girl, age 7, have appealed to advice columnist Dear Prudence with a most upsetting problem: they think none of their son’s friends will come to his sleepover because they are gay.
“Our son really wanted to have a sleepover for his birthday with four friends,” the couple, identified as “Guarded Dads” writes, “but three of the friends have declined, despite having similar sleepovers at other friends’ houses over the last couple of months that our son has been invited to. Our son is devastated and thinks it is about him and the boys not wanting to be his friends.”
“My husband and I have a sneaking suspicion that it is one of two other reasons: parents being uncomfortable with their sons in a house with two male adults, or some underlying discomfort about their sons spending the night with a ‘gay family,'” they confess. “Where we live is not particularly progressive, so we feel these are real possibilities.”
“My husband feels like we should sit our kids down and finally have that conversation about homophobia with them, and about why maybe the parents of our son’s friends might feel uncomfortable with them sleeping over, as we are worried our son is still thinking his friends hate him,” the Guarded Dads fret. “I want to talk about homophobia with our kids, but am not sure about directly accusing the parents of homophobia. I am 80 percent sure all of this is rooted in our sexuality, but I don’t want our kids to go to school and start talking to their friends about homophobic parents, as that could blow up and lead to a feud we don’t want, especially when this is just based on our suspicions. The parents haven’t seemed to have a problem with us before.”
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“I feel if we just have a conservation about homophobia in general, and not lead our son directly down the path of talking about his friends’ parents, we will get there on our own,” they continue. “My husband wants us to be direct, because in his viewpoint, this is just the first time and will most likely happen again.”
Related: Gay dads celebrated in a beautiful new photography book
“How candid should we be with our kids about this?” the dads conclude.
Prudence, as always, replies with her candid advice.
“It’s worth running this by a family therapist,” Prudence cautions, “but I think kids their age could probably handle something like, ‘A long time ago, lots of people didn’t understand that kids could have two dads and didn’t like it when two men or two women were in love. Many people get it now, but there are still some who are behind and don’t want to be around families like ours. We really don’t know what your friends’ parents were thinking about the birthday party because we can’t read their minds, but we think this might be it. It could also be that they were busy. The most important thing to remember is that you’re great kids, people like you, and none of what happened with the birthday party is your fault. You don’t have to do anything different. Is there anything you want to ask?'”
“Keep in mind that kids of color and kids with disabilities have already learned the sad truth about the world and how others see them (and treat them unfairly) at this age,” Prudence continues, “so your children won’t be the only ones having to grapple with something tough. Perhaps you could back up your talk with some good children’s books that reaffirm the way you want them to feel in a world where they will inevitably find out about homophobia.”
“It would also be nice if you could be intentional in trying to cultivate—maybe through out-of-school activities or LGBTQ groups that you join—a friend circle with confirmed non-backward parents, so there will be some contexts in which you and your kids won’t have to wonder whether people are treating you differently,” she also advises.
Sounds good to us. Despite a good deal of stigma around same-sex parenting, recent studies have shown same-sex parents tend to be more attentive than their straight counterparts, and their children grow up better adjusted and healthier as well.
WashDrySpin
Why is a stock photo of an alone, sad and dejected black child as the lead photo for this story…
But then once opened there is a happy white gay couple and their white smiling and happy children…that is some micro aggressive racist stuff that is constantly done by the gay white community
Are you saying black children are lonely and sad and without decent parents….
Now before anyone says something like settle down… SCREW YOU!
Cam
Hi Right Wing Troll Account.
It’s cute that you think you’re being leftwing under this screename, but you always overdo it and you’re typing style is the same.
Your troll game is sad and weak.
TheAbsoluteTRUTH
U guys can find anything and make it about race ffs where it doesn’t exist but hey that’s what professional liberal mo’s do
WashDrySpin
Dear Cam and Absolute Truth
F
U
C
K
Y
O
U
Heywood Jablowme
Although it’s possible to identify someone’s writing style with about 80% accuracy, you’d need “stylometry” computer software for that, and at least a 50,000 word writing sample. WashDrySpin’s 40 or so Queerty comments (going back to 2019) wouldn’t add up to anywhere near the required sample size. They do however seem to identify him as a black man who has never made a “right-wing” comment before. Apparently someone’s troll-identifying crystal ball is “FUBAR” again.
WashDrySpin
Heywood Jablowme these dime store idiots are attempting to gaslight…while NOT addressing what I put forth…but that is typical of many when asked a difficult question
GayEGO
Well Donnie Trump, you are as messed up as we thought!
DennisMpls
@Cam I’ve been wondering for some time if I should address you on this issue. I’m not as regular a reader as many other commenters here appear to be, but on most of the comment sections I’ve read you are accusing someone of being the “same sad right wing troll.” You apparently instinctively apply that epithet to anyone who posts something you don’t agree with. As a writer myself I’m quite attuned to the nuances of style, and it’s clear that most if not all of these commenters are different people. WashDrySpin is certainly not MissTerri or other of the people you’ve accused.
The thing is, I think what you’re doing is counterproductive. From what I’ve seen you have a lot to offer as a commenter, and this repetitive shtick just diminishes your impact. And, from what I’ve seen on this and other threads, generates some antipathy. Whenever I see those same old comments from you I tend to discount your input.
In this case, WashDrySpin raises a valid point that should be considered, whether or not you ultimately agree or disagree. My own thought is that Queerty had no underlying bias in picking those photos. They just picked one of a sad kid and one of a happy gay family, without considering race. Considering the world in which we currently and unfortunately live, we at least for now have to give some thought to how anything with a racial tinge may be perceived. Psychologists have learned that things that may slide by us white folks may resonate with people with a different life experience.
Can’t we just intelligently consider and even debate the issue in a respectful way?
Den
Ok, children…calm down.
1. It is quite probable that the images chosen for the email and the web page were chosen by different people, with no hidden agenda or racial animus. And clearly “wash dry etc” was too triggered to notice BOTH images were stock photos, and the only reference to race is Prudence’s implied assumption that the family is white.
2.The response to the father include a statement about children of color, and disabled children already having learned harsh life lessons, so the picture is not entirely inappropriate.
3. This notion that all the regressive or critical comments here are posted by sock puppets of the same troll is, to be honest, ludicrous.
And to those of you actually trolling or responding in hysterical fashion, are you so dull that you don’t understand you are humiliatingly yourselves? Nobody takes you seriously. Everybody finds you stupid.
Liquid Silver
@DennisMpls It’s the best a low-insight, low flexibility person like Cam can do, alas. He may actually think we’re all the same person, and you’ve now been added to the list. Enjoy being told that your troll game is “sad and weak,” for whatever reason.
Or he’s just off his meds. I’ve never really put much thought into it myself; when a troll acts like a troll, it’s not really worth that much thought–is it? I have my own life to lead, that doesn’t involve pondering the clearly unpleasant lives of others where everything is Somebody Else’s Fault and they’re always the victim of everyone around them. It sounds awful.
I have much better things to do.
WashDrySpin
@Den
“And clearly “wash dry etc” was too triggered to notice BOTH images were stock photos, and the only reference to race is Prudence’s implied assumption that the family is white.”
Stock photos don’t just appear on a website…someone had to pick them…these white gay men are seriously tiresome and quite ignorant about racial matters
Den
“Stock photos don’t just appear on a website…someone had to pick them…these white gay men are seriously tiresome and quite ignorant about racial matters.”
Look, as an elder “white gay” man and Jew who grew up with both overt and “microagressive” anti Semitism in the 50’s, 60’s and 70’s, I find your animus towards a very varied class of people to be a lot more real and troublesome than assumptions about the choice of two pictures. And I take it as a personal insult from someone who knows absolutely nothing about me. There is no shortage of real and damaging personal and institutional racism in the US, especially now as white Christians are poised (based on the latest census) to fall below 50% of the population. Similarly, anti gay sentiment is on the rise from ALL communities. Choose your struggles wisely or your efforts and energy are dissipated.
Charleshhhh
So what are you trying to get out of this?
Fahd
Without Cam policing the comments this site would be intolerable and I wouldn’t be participating. The trolls are very close to taking over and ruining it for everyone as it is.
Whoever stole Cam’s screenname seems to have been busted, but otherwise there isn’t much moderating going on. And besides, their suspension seems to have been lifted – every click counts.
Maybe Cam’s not 100% accurate in his troll detection, but he seems to me to be pretty good at it, and he’s keeping the comments section viable. I feel sure that if he weren’t calling out the trolls (albeit sometimes they are just numbskulls), the comments section would be overrun by right-wing trolls.
For those who don’t like Cam, you could start a facebook group where you could exclude him and get to know each other better, — share what you have in common .
Just my thoughts.
Liquid Silver
“Without Cam policing the comments this site would be intolerable and I wouldn’t be participating.”
Cam doesn’t police, he cries, screams, and whines. Occasionally it rises to a screech and saying the same things over and over and over and over. He has no power. He accuses without proof. The proof of that statement is, simply, that all of us “sad and weak” trolls are still here.
Cam is not the police. For which we’re grateful; that thing would be as abusive as the average policeman usually is.
Most likely the troll just got bored. God knows listening to the same crap out of Cam’s mouth repeatedly is boring. Yeah, yeah, my troll game is “sad and weak.” The voices in your head want you to take your meds, Cam.
Ronbo
@Cam
Listen to DennisMpls. You do more harm than good posting the same accusation every time. It’s very troll-like.
Heywood Jablowme
@Fahd: When you were new here, Cam accused YOU of being the right-wing troll. I can provide the cite if you don’t remember it. Everything we write here is Google-able. Cam declares a lot of “alternative facts” that are simply untrue and easy to disprove.
Cam is certainly an expert on trolling, always explaining to us such things as the proper amount of time to wait before responding to your own sock puppet. He seems to have literally written the rule book on trolling; he should compile it into a PDF for us. But how did he acquire such esoteric knowledge? The most likely explanation is years of practice responding to his own sock puppets (e.g. Miss Terri, rural queer socialist, etc. etc.). “Fake Cam” was probably just an attention-getting stunt by Cam himself. It just didn’t get the response he’d hoped for. No “stolen” password or anything. That’s by far the simplest explanation.
The Queerty Comment Policy forbids “mean-spirited” commenters and for this reason alone – totally aside from any troll theories – Cam could be banned. And if he’s so-o-o-o concerned about the multiple screen names, why doesn’t he urge Queerty to check IP addresses and ban any anyone doing that? There is an obvious explanation why. He’s doing it himself.
The purpose of commenting is to PERSUADE. If someone doesn’t even attempt to persuade, and routinely uses the “troll” card as a way to avoid making any argument whatsoever, they have an ulterior motive for being here. This thread is a perfect example. There was nothing remotely “right-wing” about WashDrySpin’s comment and a few seconds on Google proves he’s not a troll. But the truth doesn’t matter to Cam.
Fahd
In my opinion, the Cam detractors are being unfair to him. (I’m well aware he has called me out, and I didn’t like it, but I have persisted, and I’m still very glad he”s there to rebuke those whose participation is usually nothing more than a provocation or an expression of corrosive personality. )
As I said above, maybe Cam’s not 100% accurate in his troll detection, but he seems to me to be pretty good at it, and he’s keeping the comments section viable. I feel sure that if he weren’t calling out the trolls (albeit sometimes they are just numbskulls), the comments section would be overrun by right-wing trolls.”
Moreover, I think that the answer to not wanting to be undermined or silenced by Cam, is not to silence Cam. Free speech works in his direction too. (Obviously no one is silenciing anyone, by the way.) Queerty should do more moderating in the comments, but that’s not going to happen – meanwhile my opinion is that Cam’s efforts are overwhelmingly more good than bad – so many sites have to shut off comments because a group takes over and makes things unpleasant and intolerable. I just disagree with those who think Cam’s presence is unwanted — even while recognizing that he does sometimes misfire.
Also, as I said above and meant without snark, for those who can’t take Cam, you could start a facebook group where you could exclude him and get to know each other better, — share what you have in common .
Heywood Jablowme
@Fahd: “maybe Cam’s not 100% accurate in his troll detection.” Ya think? More like 5%.
Normal people apologize for their mistakes, at least once in awhile. Mentally ill narcissists (like TRUMP) don’t.
Okay, Fahd: if Cam apologizes for his mistake HERE – just this once, re: WashDrySpin – I’ll consider your points! More likely it’ll snow in Seattle tomorrow.
Heywood Jablowme
Yeah, this is typical. Cam is a hit-and-run coward. Makes a reckless charge that’s easily disproved, then he disappears. Pops up later to do it again. That’s “policing”? Well, now he’s wearing a body “CAM,” so to speak, and we can often see when he beats up a non-troll.
Cam
@DennisMpls
I would take your comment more seriously if you didn’t start your post with the same wording you’ve used multiple other times. “I don’t read this very often but……..” Before you then list off a bunch of specifics and defend the one troll account.
You also love to try the “I’m a lesbian or “I’m a trans person but” before saying something completely bigoted.
The thing I love is you can always tell when the troll gets furious at being exposed and what topics really upset it.
Whenever I bust you on a post about race issues you always bring out multiple screenames to freak out. Your obsession and whininess is delicious.
Cam
@Heywood Jablowme
So an acknowledged troll screename comes on to defend a suspected troll screename.
Thank you for confirming that WasDrySpin’s name was taken a while ago. I suspected, and you just confirmed it. I love how terrible you are at this.
Heywood Jablowme
@Cam: When did I become an “acknowledged” troll screen name? You’ll need to provide a cite for THAT! Poor Cam, do you understand how Google works? 🙂
“…confirming that WasDrySpin’s name was taken a while ago.” Taken? By who? Are you saying I “stole” his account? I doubt that’s even possible – I bet it didn’t even happen to you – but why didn’t the real WashDrySpin complain about it? And I love how you think that anyone here claiming to be black or lesbian, etc. must be faking it. But what did you even dislike about WashDrySpin’s comment? What is bad about it? How does it “prove” he’s a “right-wing-troll”? Never mind “THE” right-wing troll?
You don’t “expose” anything, you don’t “prove” anything, you got nothin’, and sometimes Google proves you’re just making stuff up.
Heywood Jablowme
@Fahd: Still think “the Cam detractors are being unfair to him”? He now declares – with no proof whatsoever – that DennisMpls is a racist and is yet another manifestation of “the” right-wing troll account. He’s saying that DennisMpls, Liquid Silver, WashDrySpin, and me, along with DOZENS of other commenters, are all the same commenter. Seriously, does that make any sense to you?
You have astonishingly LOW standards for Cam. He’s insulted you too but you don’t expect him to be logical, or rational, or even civil. Why is that?
Liquid Silver
Even I’m mildly amused. Cam can screech in one note: troll. While calling others trolls.
DennisMpls
@Cam That is a truly bizarre reply to me. I didn’t attack you at all. And I’m not now going to take the bait and reply to your attacks with attacks of my own. In fact, I complimented you. All I did was suggest that you re-think the strategy of accusing everyone who expresses an opinion you don’t like of being “the same right wing troll.” And your response to that is to then say that I am that very right wing troll. I originally thought that was a mere strategy, and that there was no way you actually believed that. But now I’m really puzzled, and I’m thinking you MAY actually believe that. Despite the very clear differences of style and outlook among the 10+ people you’ve lumped into that group.
I’m now seriously wondering if YOU are the one who is punking or trolling the rest of us. If you’re genuine I simply ask that you take a step back and think about this situation with an open mind. What you’re doing is certainly not constructive, and is short-circuiting the genuine discussions we could be having.
leo1008
‘A long time ago, lots of people didn’t understand that kids could have two dads and didn’t like it when two men or two women were in love. Many people get it now, but there are still some who are behind and don’t want to be around families like ours.‘
It was not a long time ago. This is one of those cases where the past is not even past. And it’s presently not just “some” people who don’t like same-sex couples: my own guess would be that the overwhelmingly vast majority of straight couples do not like same-sex couples. And they never will. Sure, there are “progressives” who will claim that they have no issues with same -sex couples, but then they’ll just find some excuse to keep their kids home from sleepovers in same-sex households. Sorry to be a downer, but I do think it’s important to recognize the reality that we’re dealing with …
linedrive
Oh yeah. It definitely wasn’t a long time ago. But it might not be great to tell kids that young that a majority of people don’t like their family. I think the suggestion was more about being gentle with the children while letting them know it isn’t their fault that the sleepover didn’t work out and that there might be more things that don’t work out in the future. That’s painful enough.
Fahd
I think the suggested approach is the best one can do. I’m surprised the children have been sheltered from the homophobia until now, as suggested by the son thinking his friends aren’t accepting the invitation because they don’t like him. These children will have to deal with this issue for the foreseeable.
If it were me, I might also take the easier approach of trying to build a home in a location where acceptance is more ready and they don’t have to be as much of a pioneering family or as prudence suggests find situations/groups where acceptance is more forthcoming. They only have one childhood and maybe being on the front line of social change in suburban Dallas or where ever it is, is not for everyone. But good luck with the challenges.
Liquid Silver
Prudence is usually pretty gentle with her advice, which I approve of here. There’s no reason to slap a 9 year old with the reality of the situation…people suck. They’ll probably suck a lot less on this point by the time he grows up, so there’s no real need.
GayEGO
Educate these homophobes so they know that we are like the majority of civilization and we do not sexually molest anyone. Relationships should be taught, like my 57 year relationship with my partner.
Den
Sadly, this is still a rather backwards country in terms of acceptance of affectional preference. Mostly due to the overwhelming influence of Christian Predeterminist/Calvinist philosophies. That is changing more rapidly in Europe where people are more easily embracing a secular worldview.
As it happens, there is clearly no difference between the depth and longevity of relationships among my straight and gay friends. And of course the notion of us “recruiting” or being more likely to abuse children is insane.
Charleshhhh
They really do need to be direct with the other parents.
PerhapsYesNoMaybe
I agree. They don’t want their son (or their daughter) going to sleepovers at homophobic households that may denigrate the two dads.
Karlis
I just love (not really) how much energy people spend in this comments section accusing each other of sociopolitical nefariousness. You’re secretly the troll! No, YOU’RE secretly the troll. As to the topic of this article, though, I think Prudence missed something. I think that the two dads should contact the parents who refused the sleepover invitation and ask them why they did so. That might be a teaching moment for the adults, as well.
Heywood Jablowme
Sorry about that. (Hey, you’ll NEVER get an apology from Cam! And he started it! Dad, he started it!)
I like your idea.
Cam
@Heywood Jablowme
I love how you keep exposing your new troll screenames by rushing in to back up their comments.
It really shows how enraged you were that your racial comment got busted.
Heywood Jablowme
@Cam: Classy. I guess your ultimate goal is to accuse literally everyone on Queerty of being the right-wing troll? You’re really making friends and influencing people! 🙂
Cam
The one trouble parents need to worry about is that their kids need to deal with these kids in school for years. So they could confront the parents, upset them and then have those parents tell their kids not to hang out with their son anymore. Or they can soft peddle it, try to expand the friend circle to give their son more options.
white-queer-african
How we look forward to the day we don’t need to read the comments and fights between the idiots on the right and the idiots on the left of the political spectrum in the USA. Instead of focussing on the queer subject / matter being discussed, it becomes about who is a troll or not! The rest of us in the big World is not interested in petty, bitchy squabbling between, dare I say, tired old queens!
Back to the article. As a bi-racial couple with a 10 year old son, we have no such problems in getting our son’s friends to stay over for a weekend. And to think we from a sh*thole country in Africa!
The real Bruce
Welcome to the reality of some of the “queens” of America, you beautiful couple over there. I envy you both because whatever problems you may have, you deal with them with thought and maturity. Something we seem to sometimes lack over here. Some of the “regulars” who comment on here could very well be supremely humbled by taking a good hard look in their mirrors at their true selves. By the way, I LOVE the coffee and tea that come from the various regions of your country. YUMMY! Peace and Love.