Rapper T.I.: “It’s Un-American, Oversensitive For Gays To Shut Down Every Anti-Gay Slur”

Man, I will say this, the funniest joke I ever heard Tracy (Morgan) say during a stand-up was, ‘C’mon man, I think gay people are too sensitive. If you can take a dick, you can take a joke.’ [Cracks up laughing.] That shit was funny to me. And it’s kind of true.

“They’re like,‘If you have an opinion against us, we’re gonna shut you down.’ … That’s not American. If you’re gay you should have the right to be gay in peace, and if you’re against it you should have the right to be against it in peace.”

– Rapper T.I. speaking to VIBE magazine about how gay oversensitivity affects free speech. T.I. says he supports anyone’s sexual preference and once produced a song called “Big Shit Poppin’ (Do It)”.

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  • Marcus

    People like this make me ashamed of being a black American.

  • Mr. Enemabag Jones

    I wonder how T.I. would feel about me talking about the fact, that according to FBI reports, the number of black women raped by white men was less than 1%, but the number of white women raped by black men was over 46,000. Would he support free speech then?

  • Ermm

    The above comment is utter nonsense. That amount of white women also equals less than 1%

  • macmantoo

    If I were to use the “N” word I promise the black man would probably kill me. It’s ok for them to use derogatory words but not the white man? Guess we have double standards when it comes to blacks and whites. Gays have supported the black civil rights but the blacks haven’t supported the gays.

  • Wordsmith

    I’m not nearly as bothered by his comments – Ignorant Rapper Spouts Off Anti-Gay
    Slur. No! – as I am by the fact that his primary audience is suburban teen-age white
    kids. The same suburban teen-age white kids that pummel gay teens in classrooms, taunt
    weaker ones and, worse, blow the heads off sexually provocative gender benders at
    point blank range.

    I’m also troubled, but not terribly surprised, by the lack of outrage in the black
    community. There are pockets of resistance but, by and large, rappers give voice to
    a majority of black people who find homosexuality repulsive.

  • Riker

    @Mr. Enemabag Jones: 1% of what? Giving statistics is meaningless without providing some context.

    In other news, 86% of statistics re made up on the spot.

  • russell

    I agree with macmantoo! It would infuriate him if he were called a “N” but gays are suppose to just accept his homophbia. Talk about as double standard … and if he were called that word where would his love of free speech be? Apparently hypocrisy is his middle name.

  • david

    I say call blacks the N word and see how they like it

  • stevoj

    @Mr. Enemabag Jones: you’re misinformed. but let me ask you this. statistically speaking, why is it that white men commit more crimes (both felonies and misdemeanors) yet our prisons are over crowded with minorities?

    why don’t you take a look at what sentences target which communities. why’ll you’re at it, why don’t you also look up which businesses have government contracts with prisons

    i’d love to tell you but i believe in the “teach a man to fish” principle

  • stevoj

    @david: why don’t you test that out next time you’re at the grocery store or out around town

  • stevoj

    @Wordsmith: how many white suburban kids subscribe to Vibe magazine

    these comments are about as ridiculous as T.I.’s… and he’s a southern rapper. i need to read some other queerty entry

  • J


    I believe you’ve missed david’s point. He was simply saying that black people are as oversensitive about the n-word as gays are about homophobic slurs (and both with good reason). The point being that TI did not acknowledge the hypocrisy of claiming that one is fine while the other is not when, logically, it must be both or neither.

  • scribe31

    African American or gay black guy here… Why do people on this site blame every black person when some dumb ass rapper comes out as against gays? It would be like me blaming every white male I see for the KKK or all men for the rape of women. I have been called the n-word and the f-word and yeah both of them suck. In general the black community is getting better on the gay issue (NAACP joining forces with gay groups)(black leaders like al sharpton supporting gay rights). And on the subject of the n-word and “that’s gay” phrase white teen males love to say those words, hear it all the time at college. I don’t think they are serious just dumb dudes who really don’t know any better trying to be cool to their idiot friends.

  • AlriteBytch

    Really bitches. Seems like American gays are always on the rag… OH you can’t call me a nigga you will hurt my feelings or you can’t call me a faggot because I will cry, a bunch of thin skin [email protected]Marcus: Were you born last night because if this comment makes you ashamed of being black then chile you really got problems… Jus [email protected]david: that’s on you homie if you want to get the shit beat out of you. Make sure you film it and put it on youtube.

  • ChrisM

    I love how the magazine labels the quote as TI’s take on “All Americans Having Equal Rights.” Straights are always so concerned about their right to call gays names, while we are still waiting for the right to not be fired from our jobs over who we are.

    I’m also interested to hear TI’s take on the KKK’s right to free speech. I’m sure it’s not the same song.

  • scribe31

    @J: Dude yup I’m oversensitive call me the f-word or the n-word and you would most likely get punched. lol. T.I. is just a dumb dude and doesn’t represent every blk guy, like every queer dude on here does not represent every gay male.

  • chuck

    I also have heard quite a few black guys use the “F-word” when talking about us. I can only remember one gay guy using the “N-word” about them. And he was quickly stifled by three of us telling him to get lost if that was his true feelings.

  • scribe31

    @chuck: Be a blk gay guy in a all white bar and see how you are treated…

  • AlriteBytch

    @macmantoo: “gays have supported the black civil rights” Whaa? please step away from the tina because baby your mind is gone..

  • Fitz

    What’s important about the word “Nigger” and the word “Fagot”,
    (and no, I am not a preschooler, I don’t need to say “N-word” and “F-word”),
    is the danger that they have in common.

    When someone calls you a Nigger or a Faggot, they decided to NOT call
    you a person– that means that things like violence, theft, harassment, rape are all on the table.

    THATS the problem, not over sensitivity, but dehuamnization and a flippant attitude.

  • mike128

    There’s as much racism in the gay communities as there is homophobia in the black communities. And also there are gay black people, and straight black allies. It’s not like we’re two distinct communities where the black people are the bad guys. So let’s respond to this one statement by one person – and not use it as an excuse to express racist thoughts and language.

    All that said – I dont think you can equate the “right to be gay” with the “right to being against gays”. It’s not like both of them are just an opinion. One is who someone is – the other is a thought.

  • HeroQueero

    C’mon T.I., I think black people are too sensitive. If you can take a whip to the back, you can take a joke.’ *Cracks up laughing*. It’s just a joke, right?

  • Andrew Wells

    So glad I’m not an arrogant American who uses “Americanism” as a justification for making the world a shitter place than it needs to be. “Oh, b-b-but it’s, like, totally un-American!” Shut the f*** up.

  • doug105

    “If you can take a dick, you can take a joke”
    Carlos Mencia HBO Special 1995, morgan stole it he could never be that funny on his on.

  • ChrisC

    When the word ‘faggot’ was likely used by the same attackers and murderers who have executed some of the most brutal hate crimes America has ever seen, why would he willingly choose to say a word that has such a dark and brutal history? Why would he wish to be affiliated with such a word?

    Yes, I have the right to be Gay: Because it’s who I am! I can’t change it.
    And yes, you also have the right to CHOOSE to be a homophobic tool: But remember, history is not going to look back on homophobes fondly.

  • timncguy

    T.I.’s first amendment rights are still quite intact. The first amendment only protects you from GOVERNMENT action. No one from the government is attacking T.I. No one from the government stopped Tracy Morgan from saying anything he wanted to say either.

    But, the first amendment does not protect anyone from NON GOVERNMENTAL consequences based on the things they say. There’s a big difference there that guys like T.I. need to understand.

  • fuzzy

    All of you arguing with Mr. Enemabag Jones… might I venture to suggest that you are missing his argument?

    The way he represents the statistics is misleading and racist – which is the whole point. He proposes a “right” to this hateful speech, the same way T.I. claims a “right” to his own. Yet if this nonsense were actually propagated as stated, one suspects T.I. would speak out against it for the misleading bull that it is.

    The whole message is, ‘how much do you like it if the tables are turned?’ Not ‘black people are criminals.’

  • Kev C

    @timncguy: That’s right. TI has the same rights as the KKK. The only difference between him and the KKK is that he’s on a major music magazine and supported by the mainstream music industry.

  • the crustybastard

    @ChrisM: “Straights are always so concerned about their right to call gays names, while we are still waiting for the right to not be fired from our jobs over who we are.”

    Came here to say something like this.

    You said it better.

  • Steve

    Mr. I should be more niggardly with his opinions

  • Cam

    Fine, when I see him campaigning for white’s latino’s and asian’s to use the N word more often, then I will buy this.

    This is just a bigot who is irritated that he can’t be a bigot as easily anymore.

  • CBRad

    Well, did he actually say that or did he rap it? (Who cares what some rapper said, guys! I’m always hearing about these rappers ((rapperz?)) I never heard of before on Queerty).

  • roger

    F the N , (fill in whatever words you want). who gives a damn about what some ignorant rapper thinks. he should remember there are plenty of guys who can take a dick and still kick ass. as a joke or not its not funny its stupid

  • Ray

    Oh well then I have a whole slew of black slur he shouldn’t mine me calling him to his face then.

  • Will


    Be a white gay boy in a Hip-Hop bar and see how you are treated

  • CBRad

    Be a Catholic (ethnically) at a Protestant gay party in NYC and see how you’re treated! THAT’S the worst, because the culprits aren’t even embarrassed about it. At least they KNOW they’re supposed to hide the racism a bit.

  • Kev C

    @CBRad: Ethnicilly catholic .. what does that even mean? Nobody is born catholic. It’s not permanent like skin color or sexual orientation. You can change your religion any time your choose.

  • Kyle

    Why are gays the only group talked about in this manner?

    Why couldn’t TI have said, “It’s un-American to call Jews ‘kikes’, ‘Christ-killers’, and ‘greedy’. I think Jews are overly-sensitive.”

  • Kyle

    Or, rather…

    “It’s un-American to NOT call Jews ‘kikes’, ‘Christ-killers’, and ‘greedy’. I think Jews are overly-sensitive. I mean if you’re gonna be a Christ-killer, be a Christ-killer in peace. But, if you don’t agree with Christ-killers, don’t agree with them in peace.”

  • Tony

    Oh, the irony. Too bad it’s probably lost on him.

  • Kyle

    @Tony: That’s true, but, there are a lot of people who agree with this ignorance. This web site is a small, tiny portion of the world who doesn’t agree with it. Gay kids, however, will pay the price. Some gay kid met with gay slurs right now is being told, “C’mon faggot, if you can take a dick, you can take a joke.”

  • Steve

    This is why gay people need to carry guns. If you’re not packing, you need to be. Nobody has the right to call you names and get away with it. Nobody.

  • CJustSickening

    Hmmmmmm. So Let me get this straight….

    Let’s combat ignorance with more ignorance.

    I’m a PERSON who ultimately happens to be a gay black male.
    And yet, I am suddenly grouped in as a whole based on
    What ONE ignorant person has said.
    And based on some of what you have posted, I should be called a ‘nigger’
    To ‘see how it feels’. -_-

    The last time I checked, I was GAY too!
    Better yet, I am a fucking PERSON with feelings reading this shit.
    Some of you are NO better than T.I. or even some of these damn bullies.
    I come to ‘Queerty’ to feel united with others who share and have the same sentiments as I do.
    But today has left me heartbroken by some of your comments.

    What T.I. said wasn’t only bigoted towards ‘whites’ like some of you believe.
    That was meant for every GAY PERSON.
    Including black gays.

    For the SAME reason why I don’t support Christianity or any other forms of homophobia,
    I find myself questioning my support for the ‘LGBTQ’ community.
    Some of us are STILL divided when it comes to race.

    I have many black, straight male friends who has NEVER used ‘faggot’.
    Or has used any homophobic slurs in my presence.
    And I doubt that they would say it when I’m not around.
    And yet they are being attacked by the comments some of you post.

    And by the way, I am NOT support T.I.’s idiotic bigotry in any way.
    He’s a fucking douche just like some people on here as well!

  • Max the Communist

    But queer people don’t have the right to be queer “in peace,” do they T.I.? The anti-gay not only get to be anti-gay in peace, they also get to force their bigotry into the lives of LGBTQ people. If queers didn’t complain about it, all you’d hear was deafening silence while prejudice and persecution ran rampant. Who would pay attention to LGBTQ kids dying of bullying and suicide if we shut up? Who would pay attention to queers in 20-year-long relationships, wanting to get married, while straight people divorce left and right? Who would pay attention to a black bisexual navy man August Provost being murdered by his fellow seamen while he was serving his country? Certainly not you.

    So, no, we’re not going to leave the anti-queer haters in peace. That includes you. You-all have it too easy anyway. As for the discrimination that you feel due to racism, imagine being both black AND LGBTQ. Where you gonna go for help now, motherfucker?

  • jason

    Rihanna is also a supporter of extremely homophobic murder musicians who have been boycotted owing to their lyrics which encourage the bashing, burning and hanging of gays and lesbians. Here is Rihanna at a concert with Beenie Man, one such musician:

  • Aiden

    You guys should take this into account next time you tell a trans person they are too sensitive and need to get over words. It’s not so fun when it’s being said to you.

  • CBRad

    @Kev C: Ethnically-Catholic means of an ethnicity that has been primarily Catholic for generations. So that, if one wants to use crackpot science, the physiological, or even DNA, makeup of the person is, in a sense, Roman Catholic. And even if you convert to…whatever other religion..the essence of the person’s makeup will still be Catholic. Sort of related to being culturally-Catholic, but that can be changed easier.

  • Mr. Enemabag Jones


    Thank you.

    Usually my arguments go right over the heads of people reading them. Nice to know that some readers like to think about a comment they’ve read, before posting a knee-jerk rebuttal.

  • ke

    Link please for this so-called ethnically Catholic. Need to read studies about Catholicism being apart of somebody’s DNA.

  • CBRad

    @ke: I don’t have a link, don’t know where they got it. I think those gays just made it up to try to pretend to be superior.

  • kylew

    Respectfully, I can see the guy’ point. It seems that there’s an all or nothing attitude by the gay community. Every slur is the biggest, the worst, the most intolerable.

    Stands ups unreasonably attack women, blacks, asians, muslims, the disabled, the mentally ill, etc, etc, and all of those groups are still subjected to prejudice in daily life – yet the audience doesn’t leap up and start protesting those kind of jokes, and I certainly don’t hear most of you guys specifically standing up for them.

    Either you believe in a world of free speech, where the stupid and ignorant have a right to speak too, or you don’t. Or don’t you care what comedians or others say so long as you’re not in the sights?

    Now hate speech, and incitement to violence; that’s a different matter. Finding the line may be tough, but that’s different discussion. The issue here, is that most campaigning gays don’t seem to recognise degree or context, taking total offence at the smallest comment. It just seems a bit like effemminate hanky flapping to me.

  • Mel Gibson

    @kylew: I agree!!

  • Christopher

    ” if you’re against it you should have the right to be against it in peace.” Well how does that work? Like – oh, I’m against black people having rights but I’m against it in peace and that’s quite fine and normal. What a load of BS.

  • stevoj

    @J: no the comment below yours by scribe31 makes that point. I’m not going to magically infer your understanding when David simply tried to justify hate speech as a rebuttal to hate speech. that’s just like saying punch the bully back and see how he likes it

    the n-word and the f-word are just small parts of a much larger problem. what troubles me the most about T.I.’s quote is that he feels like being gay is a joke. in his mind he honestly thinks that homosexuality is a bigger deal than homophobia and that is the problem. we are who we are and that is no laughing matter

    well that’s what I interpreted

  • Musk

    Matthew Shephard was quite peaceful while he hanging on that fucking fence.

  • hf2hvit

    “Man, I will say this, the funniest joke I ever heard Tracy (Morgan) say during a stand-up was, ‘C’mon man, I think gay people are too sensitive. If you can take a dick, you can take a joke.’ [Cracks up laughing.] That shit was funny to me. And it’s kind of true.”

    Guess he’s speaking from experience.

  • kylew

    @hf2hvit: I wouldn’t mind, but he stole that joke from white middle class english comedian Jimmy Carr, a highly intelligen comedian widely praised by all sectors of the British press, from the most serious down to the gutter press. Funny how it didn’t cause such a scandal then.

  • Dr. Dick

    @CBRad: Really? Does that really make sense to you??? Generations of behavior have ZERO genetic influence on a person’s ideology/beliefs. That’s not crackpot science, it’s basic logic. I am black, my family has been Christian since they were unloaded off the boat honey, but that 400 years of Jesus has ZERO pertinence to my current beliefs. Cultural values are learned, at least for me….. If you felt like the Catholicism was gripping your very genetic makeup, I am very sorry for you, but don’t put that evil on all of us!
    @CJustSickening: Amen indeed! Every post about a black homophobe degenerates into ignorant, priviledged bitchiness. I personally could give 3 shits about what one calls me, I am wwaayyy too secure to let words hurt me, but when people say “Well now I can call him a nigger!” it makes me sad. I’ve been called both more times than I can count, in multiple languages, whatever. What hurts me more is the white pseudo-intellectual gay man who cannot see how much he mirrors his “enemy’s” ignorance.

    Just remember, a white faggot and a str8 nigger are (roughly) equally worthless (historically) to Str8 White (cisgender) Males

  • Kev C

    Here come the black gay homophobes. You guys probably want to beat up white gays for being so gosh darn racist, huh? Maybe get a baseball bat or a knife and start wailing on whites for their percieved racism, huh? And you could justify any violence because your feelings were hurt by words. Huh?

  • jason

    Blacks were too damn sensitive about all those segregation rules in the Deep South, weren’t they? Martin Luther King was an over-sensitive prick, wasn’t he?

  • matt

    @SBC19: “no one else HAS to be a supporter (or a friend) of the gay community”

    No one HAS to be a supporter of the black community either but openly racist people are shunned by society. The root of the problem people have with TI is that I’m sure he agrees with how society treats racists but for some reason he is defending homophobes. It is clear that he doesn’t view racism and homophobia as on the same level. I agree with you that making blanket statements about any group or attributing blame to a certain group of people is wrong, but I still think TI’s attitude about this is awful. It has nothing to do with him being black I just don’t think he is very informed about this and probably doesn’t know many gay people personally, this is a problem with many people of all races.

  • kylew

    @jason: The fact is, mainstream people will always joke in the most inappropriate ways. Did you never tell such a joke? Maybe a Michael Jackson, Steve Jobs, Shuttle Challenger, or even dare I say it, shock horror, a 9/11 joke? If you never have, I suspect that you’re in the minority.

    Part of me thinks, well yeah, there should be limits on humour, but the trouble is, the second I start down that path I always end up with a big brother state, and thought police, because who is to say exactly what’s appropriate? If I make a Matthew Shepperd joke is that crossing the line? Perhaps a DADT would be okay? What if I just do an effeminate walk? Where IS the line. Reading the comments on this site, I’m damned certain i wouldn’t want most of you guys deciding for me. Maybe it’s bullshit for me to say this, but perhaps the price of freedom is hurt feelings sometimes.


    @Musk: “Matthew Shephard was quite peaceful while he was hanging on that fucking fence” Really and who put him there??? Some white dudes right. check your own before you try and check others. some white queens sit and wait for this lady to write a negative article about a black person so they can say on queerty what they are AFRAID to say in real life..

  • ewe

    Shitty career trying to be a gang banger when all he is is a pretty boy. Fuck him.

  • ewe

    @scribe31: STFU. Typical you would change the subject.

  • Phil

    @kylew: “Either you believe in a world of free speech, where the stupid and ignorant have a right to speak too, or you don’t. Or don’t you care what comedians or others say so long as you’re not in the sights?”

    A world of free speech doesn’t mean you get to say whatever you want and can get off scot-free. You wanna call a nigger a kike? All well and good. But all of the “niggers” and “kikes” out there can call you any number of things to shut you down because what was said was offensive and hurtful. Some may even resort to violence! That would be wrong. But let’s be honest here, if you’re going to be a giant dickbag to large swarths of people, you don’t exactly have the moral high-ground.

    I’m tired of this “But those rights only apply to the me and the groups I identify with!” mentality.

  • perdeep

    @kylew: There’s this thing called “context” when it comes to a joke like that, though. Jimmy Carr deliberately does a segment about offensive jokes and then analyses why people who find them offensive still laugh. It’s quite academic, and at the end of the day he makes it very clear that he’s not actually racist/homophobic/sexist/etc. His actions outside of the comedy club show his true colours. But when someone with a history of homophobia says that same joke and means it, the context totally changes. You’re right that a proper White middle class English guy might get less flack no matter what he does, but in this case I really think it’s CONTEXT.

  • michael

    Did anyone notice something. Yes, the gay community can and will shut u down. When has anyone said that about the black community? I feel pity for them. Uneducated, ignorant and foolish. Bring it on TI because we will just as easily shut u down too.

  • skzip888


    Don’t feel self-conscious. Rap is pretty much marketed at white aggression junkies from the suburbs who never quite got into metal.

  • Kev C

    @skzip888: aka ethnically catholic.

  • perdeep

    @michael: I’m going to be so, so sad and upset and just feel sick inside if you’re not a troll.

  • Avenger

    Comedians mock and poke fun at all kinds of differing traits amongst people (race, gender, body size, handicap, intellect, etc., etc.) – but the minute they poke fun at gays; a bunch of online queers want to act like they were kicked in the shins and make like a thousand gay kids just committed suicide over it.

    Too many gays seek to be an overprotected class, who want to be coddled and over embraced just because they were heckled walking down the hall in school. Just a frown, eyeroll, empty expression or vague indication of disinterest in support of the community is enough to send them on tirades about homophobia. That’s what T.I. was talking about and I agree with him 100%. That “you’re either with us or against us” attitude. You can’t even be nuetral these days (unless it leans more in favor).

  • CBRad

    @Dr. Dick: Okay, but…….what you say is all legitimate but I don’t get how it relates to the ethnically (actual, more physically) Protestant versus Catholic thing in the gay Manhattan (and other cities) scene. (But I don’t want to drag this thread too far from the topic).

  • CBRad

    @Kev C: Yeah, right. You think no Protestant kids stoop to enjoying that rap junk?

  • Kev C

    @CBRad: Ethnically protestant? The angry ones listen to Spongebob songs .. really loud!

  • CBRad

    @Kev C: Spongebob is a clever cartoon, but I’ve never seen any evidence that it appeals to Protestants more than Catholics. But, maybe you know more than I do. While we’re here, I’m not saying you, they, whoever can’t believe there’s a difference in the ethnic makeup of Catholics and Protestants (Caucasian ones). I would never be so arrogant, since I’m not a biologist or geneticist or…Maybe the two ARE different, but I’m just reporting that the hostility Protestant gays have for Catholics in that scene is very potent (since it was being debated if it’s worse to be black in a white bar, or white in a black bar, I wanted to remind that there are other variations, beyond black and white, on that whole thing).

  • michael

    Perdep…. Why? Should I just brush off the African countries being so vocally homophobic? Should I brush off the hypocrisy of the homophobia found within the black community? Recently I moved into a black community and manners are almost nonexistent. While u can’t tell what every page is like from a book’s cover, u sure can get an idea of what the story is all about. I am sick of saying I am not racist because u know I am. For a black person to be so hypocritical when it comes to bigotry is just appalling. Our founding forefathers really f’d up with slavery because we are dealing with such crap today. I don’t hate black people but I hate homophobes and I am more than able to point out ignorance and hypocrisy.

  • stevoj

    @Christopher: i know right lmao, in what way is peaceful opposition applicable ESPECIALLY when the punch line of a gay “joke” from Tracy Morgan’s ignorant ass involves stabbing his own children

  • MKe

    So this is coming during the biggest sales week of the year. He’s officially a sell out now.

  • B. Hill

    @michael: “I am sick of saying I am not racist”

    Then maybe you should stop telling that lie…
    The reason you have to keep on saying it is probably because no one believes it, and if your offline attitude is an any way akin to what you display here I can see why.

    Some of the most callous, egregious and entitled homophobic attitudes and behavior I’ve ever seen in person has come from white men, and yet I know better than to go around painting every white man I meet with the same brush because of my experiences with a small handful. Too bad you’re intelligent enough to do the same. Oh well.

    And since you’re a bigot yourself, if you ever do encounter any other bigots (black or otherwise), then you deserve it.

  • Avenger

    @michael: “I am sick of saying I am not racist”

    Then maybe you should stop telling that lie…
    The reason you have to keep on saying it is probably because no one believes it, and if your offline attitude is an any way akin to what you display here I can see why.

    Some of the most callous, egregious and entitled homophobic attitudes and behavior I’ve ever seen in person has come from white men, and yet I know better than to go around painting every white man I meet with the same brush because of my experiences with a small handful. Too bad you’re not intelligent enough to do the same. Oh well.

    And since you’re a bigot yourself, if you ever do encounter any other bigots (black or otherwise), then you deserve it.

  • Sebizzar

    Ugh… can’t believe i had a crush on this guy -_-‘

  • menumk2

    It’s really quite simple folks. TI can speak freely about whomever he chooses and if anyone disagrees with him they are free to speak back!
    TI and others think “Freedom Of Speech” only goes one way.

  • Wendy's bleeding cunt

    @menumk2: That’s right, freedom of speech goes both ways, just like a bye-seckshuual. That’s how they say it down South.

  • Godiva

    No, you shouldn’t have the right to express an opinion about how one group shouldn’t have the same rights about other people. That’s wrong. You can’t justify that as a valid opinion, that’s just stupid, and comparing the right to be gay to the right to be homophobic is absurd. One is a difficult battle that is worth fighting, the other is ignorant, entitled people spreading hate because they think their ideology is gold. What does TI know anyway, has everybody forgotten about his jail time?

  • Gus

    Naturally. TI puts out sucha gay vibe.

  • michael

    B hill, avenger, whatever ur name is…. Grow up. Again, so I should just blow off the extreme amount of homophobia?? U have proven how low classes some people are with his inability to post under one name. On the downlow maybe? Grow a f’n pair and get some reading comprehension skills while ur at it because u obviously missed the sentence coming right after ur quotation of mine. Pointing out that manners are nonexistent in the hood ishardly akin to telling someone God f’d up when creating u. Figure out the differnce u uneducated idiot.

  • rory

    @scribe31: Well if it was me, then you would be the hottest guy in the room!

  • David Ehrenstein

    T.J. is obviously on the down low.

    When do we get the sex tape?

  • DJ Veno

    I don’t know what’s sadder, T.I or the comments on this topic.. It’s hard enough being gay, why add racism???

  • the other Greg

    OMG, I’m invited to a mostly gay party in New York next week, and I just know it’s gonna be full of Protestants and bitter EX-Catholic queers making fun of the ridiculous Catholic religion. (Maybe there will even be some Jews there! – it’s New York & all.) At least you can usually count on the black guys being Protestant.

    But if I see a very Irish-looking guy who’s drinking a lot, is he likely to be one of these ethnically Catholic queers I should be careful about?

    Should I defend the ridiculous Catholic religion in order to protect the potential hurt feelings of any ethnically Catholic queers there?

    I wasn’t expecting to click on the comments for this story and be presented with such a moral conundrum!

  • CBRad

    @the other Greg: Dude, I don’t know which crowd in particular it might be, but there probably won’t be any Catholics invited, especially Irish or Irish-American ones (the most roundly hated by gays). Also, you can make fun of religion, Catholic or otherwise- it’s not about theology, it’s about a supposed class (or wished-for class) and status.

  • CBRad

    @Luther: I’m not politically-correct in the slightest, but to talk like THAT is just not right, man.

  • Kev C

    @CBRad: All religions hate each other. And all of the major ones have codified prohibitions and condemnations of homosexuality, even buddhism. But it isn’t going to stop people casual sexing. If you’re looking for a religiously compatabile relationship, you probably shouldn’t be looking in bars and clubs.

    Try a church social.

  • Luther

    @CBRad: Stop being over-sensitive. It was just a joke.

  • michael

    Dj venom, get off the high horse. Mud can only be flung ur way so much before u start flinging some back. I have more issues with the African countries then some wanna be trying to cover up how often he takes it up the ass…

  • CBRad

    @Luther: Okay. I get your point.

  • CBRad

    @Kev C: Why should I try a church social? I think all religion is ridiculous. But it’s not about differences in in any religion’s teachings, it’s about the ethnicity of various groups that have remained under one religion for a long time. If a Jew converts to Protestantism or Buddhism, does that mean it wipes out any possible genes for Tay-sachs disease he was carrying? Does changing religion change an Italian’s looks ? I personally don’t believe in superiority/inferiority of those descended from different religions. But, like I said, I’m not saying the gay (as a general rule) belief in all that is wrong in itself, it’s just that I don’t see why either one is superior or inferior in any way (the Protestants are descended from the Isaac Newtons of the world, the Catholics from the Copernicus and DaVincis). And there IS a lot of a sort of hypocrisy too, because the status-hungry gays of Manhattan will espouse hating ethnic Catholics but many still lust after construction workers or sneak up to the Bronx at night to pay straight micks to be allowed to blow them. But, maybe that’s okay too, it’s nothing new.

  • DJ Veno

    @michael: I’m not on a fucking high horse… It’s just with bigger problems like trying to keep a job or being able to get married, why does racism amongst the gay community have be added?

    It’s funny, most the black gay guys posting on this topic are asking this very same question, why add us with the rest of the ignorant black people??? Then again I thought we were support to judge everyone as individuals, not as a whole…

  • Kev C

    @CBRad: I think your confused. There is no such thing as ethnic catholics. While many ethnic groups share the catholic religion (irish, polish, italian, latin american), there is no ethnic connection between them (language, genetics, location). Catholic is not an ethnicity. Anthropologist who study ethnic groups, don’t study catholics as an ethnic group.

    Ethnic Catholics? Survey Says:


    sorry luv

  • the other Greg

    @CBRad: Although I found your point easy to make fun of – partly because it just seemed off-topic – I can see now what you’re driving at.

    At parties in the East Village (mostly) I seem not to have encountered the “status-hungry gays of Manhattan” you refer to. I suppose I’m having a little trouble picturing this party that bothered you so much?

  • the other Greg

    @Kev C: I’m guessing CBRad grew up in the Northeast – it seems a peculiarly Northeastern U.S. trait to identify that way. Elsewhere in the country it’ll strike people as odd (& technically, yes, incorrect).

    Aside from being in the northeast, NYC is additionally its own peculiar culture, and CBRad is obviously upset or annoyed about certain aspects of gay life there.

  • michael

    Dj venom, stop labeling gay men as racist when we have problems being told we should be content to be shoved to the back of the bus. I am biased against any homophobe and bigoted against ignorance and total hypocrisy. And sorry, just like every other group, there are some stereotypes about blacks that are spot on. It’s insane for u to think gays should just STFU and get over white like this without pointing the obvious out.

  • michael

    Btw that should be shite and not white….

  • J

    Ethnically catholic? That is the stupidest thing I’ve ever heard.

  • J.

    Ethnically catholic? That’s the stupidest thing I’ve ever heard.

  • kylew

    @Phil: Absolutely agree in free speech without accountability. But if he’s prepare to pay the price for what he says, then why does he have less right to say what he said than any other offensive comedian?

  • kylew

    @perdeep: Yes, I do take your point about context, but again, a with the freedom of speech argument, who will decide appropriate context? So a blatant homophobe can’t make a homophobic joke, but what about someone slightly homophobic, or someone who is simply impartial? If I had my way, every christian on the planet would be placed on an island, minus their kids because I feel that they do far more trouble than an out and out homophobe and his remarks that are distasteful to the majority of the population. But that’s not very democratic is it?

  • DJ Veno

    @michael: Your not getting what I’m saying.. I just hope you understand at someone that there are black people in this very community, yeah gay community and you don’t see us as that, only thing you see in as black person= stupid..

    Black people of this site if you haven’t notice it yet then let me help you.. Michael and other white poster feel we aren’t intelligent enough to be seen as individuals or even gay… sad shit man.

  • jason

    TI has UBMS (ugly black male syndrome).

  • DJ Veno

    Someone= some point:

  • sammy

    Where you have a proudly misogynist culture that denigrates and batters females, you’ll also find a predatory culture that beats up on gays and lesbians; it goes hand in hand. Anyone who has had the misfortune to live in a majority black city (TI and many others just like him live in Atlanta) knows the overriding cultural motif is one of misery, crime and corruption, ignorance, sexism, racism toward all non-blacks, and homophobia due to crazy ass black evangelicals with a 5th grade education, at best, which is more education than their congregation possesses.

  • michael

    Dj, would u stop playing the “whoa is me” card and quit putting words in my mouth because its completely obnoxious. Where did I say being black means ur stupid? Wow, stop playing the victim here and grow up. Yes, I am “racist” towards black homophobes but I also equally dispise white homophobes just as much, especially evangelicals. Figure out the difference in hating an entire segment versus hating anyone who thinks gays should just stop whining about prejudices. It’s unreal ur slicing up what I am saying so u can serve it whole on ur racism card.

  • michael

    Btw, one way I might be racist is in pointing out the complete void of manners i sometimes encounter in this hood…. Just twenty minutes ago on the subway this guy was sprawled out with his legs stretched out so people couldn’t really get by. Did he bother moving at all when my family was trying to get by so we could exit? Um, no and that shite happens more often than not on the subway. At my work, 95% of the people who cancel their scheduled days to work are black. If pointing that shite out makes me racist then that’s fine with me.

  • CBRad

    @the other Greg: Yes, it totally annoys me. I’ve seen nice guys genuinely hurt by it. And it annoys me especially because it’s mainly an adopted attitude by out-of-town transplants (usually gays from some suburb) who think it’s so sophisticated to look down on ethnic Catholics. Again, I can’t say whether it’s true or not (nobody argues that being Jewish isn’t partly ethnic), but….why do gays need to categorize, and discriminate, against people so harshly. And, believe me, when gays laugh about how many mick firemen were gotten rid of on 9-11, they would not care if those fireman had converted to Paganism or Druidism the week before. They’ll still be considered as ethincally Catholic as the dagos who cut the vowels off their last names in order to pass for WASPSs.

  • DJ Veno

    @michael: Trust me, I’m not playing one bit of victim and only thing to do is grow up.. However you and majority of poster have used “blk people” in your pervious post not straight blk people but you know what I stop posting on your white man site.. Enjoy~

  • CBRad

    @the other Greg: P.S. The East Village is the worst for that sort of snobby attitude! Way worse than the “elite” (money-wise) Central Park West monied crowd. The East Village is almost entirely made of of out-of-towners now wanting to think they’re cool. In the East Village I’ve even heard talk about how Catholics are a physically-ugly people.


    @michael: so why didn’t you tell him to move his fucking legs? I know why, you are a bitch, you just saved it so you can cumplain about it to your posse on Queerty and I am the only black person where I work and my white coworkers do the same thing so your point is straight people are [email protected]DJ Veno: Homie don’t let these silly bitches run you off they don’t worry me because they’re NOTHING but hot air and a keyboard so post on. I know I will

  • Kev C

    @CBRad: Stop saying “ethnically catholic”. Your not even religious so what does it matter? Are you saying that some gays discriminate against irish gays? Because no, they don’t. Are you saying some gays discriminate against working-class looking gays? Because no, they don’t.

    But you should know the history of the catholic church who were burning sodomites in the past. The catholic church is an influential and powerful organization with many members, and they continue to oppress gays. So some gays may be angry at that shit, ya know?

  • DJ Veno

    @SEXXYJAMAICAN: I wasn’t going to call him out on that subway drama out but thank you. I will, I do like this site since it’s the only gay site I use but as you can see people love to ruin the experience.

  • CBRad

    @Kev C: I know all about world history, and the Catholic Church, from the Borgias to the Index. You’re saying gays laugh about Irish Catholic firemen dying because of…that stuff? Rather than the snobbery thing? That’s never been the reason, as explained to me. And, we can debate this, but don’t be dishonest: gays absolutely do discriminate against Irish gays (they actually despise them), from the black-headed ones to the redheads, AND blue collar gays. Everybody throughout NYC and others cities (like Boston) knows this. Just look around the internet and you’ll see it. Look at blogs like Towleroad, etc. And those blog statements are just the tip of the iceberg. Granted, some of the “hickier” gays, in the ‘burbs or the country, grow up with no proper sense of ethnic bonding and class distinction, etc., and have to learn that if they move to a city, who to like and who to hate, but… And stop yelling at me about “ethnic Catholics”! I didn’t come up with that, I’m just reporting on one aspect of gay culture. I’m just saying I don’t know if I agree with them or not, since they do make some good arguments for it.

  • CBRad

    @CBRad: And even IF gays are mad about the modern Catholic Church, that has nothing to do with it : a man can convert to another religion, but he will still be, to the gay, ethnically Catholic. The religion-conversion will not change his physiology, DNA, genetic makeup, etc. Again, I don’t agree with persecuting people for those reasons (since I think Catholics and Protestants produce an equal percentage of hot men), but who am I to say the gay is incorrect?? Because, yes, if you picked 10 white American men, lined them up naked, and asked us to guess which 5 were Catholic and which 5 were Protestant (any Protestant, from Baptist to Anglican), most of us would guess mostly correct.

  • Kev C

    @CBRad: Maybe some gays have personal preferences against irish or working class gays, but there is no movement of hating on them at all. Many successful gays are irish, have red hair, and get laid a lot, or married.

    As for laughing at dead firemen. I don’t know if that’s true. But I do know that not many gays are firemen or construction workers because of discrimination by “ethnic catholics”.

  • CBRad

    @Kev C: Well that’s just one of the theories about why Irish/Irish Americans are singled out as the most hated white ethnicity amongst gays. I’ve also been told it’s the gay connection with Anglophile culture (English-good MUST = Irish-bad), and also the association with Irish and the hated police department. Maybe it’s all of it. (But what Irish gay with red hair is “successful” and gets laid a lot? I’m sure there are some, whose boyfriends are other Irish or other Catholics…or Protestants thinking they’re slumming!…….but who?)

  • CzarM

    Co-sign. “michael” just seems like the type who only has chops when he’s on the internet. I bet the big shit he’s talking here doesn’t have the nerve to fall out of his mouth IRL.

  • CBRad

    @Kev C: And if the gays make the excuse for hating Irish being for modern Catholic Church homophobia, why do they equally despise those of Irish descent who belong to the pre-Christian Pagan (etc) cults in NYC?

  • Kev C

    @CBRad: NYC has lots of irish gays. Nobody is hating on them for their irishness. Maybe they dislike you because you’re paranoid.

    In NYC, gays are under-represented and under-employed as police, firemen, sanitation (but not EMS, lots of gay EMS), and in blue collar jobs like construction, dock workers, railroad, etc. Lots of ethnic catholics have these jobs, irish, italian, hispanic, but they aren’t gay and they don’t want gays in those jobs. So if you’re a blue collar gay guy, maybe you’re perspective is coming from the people you work with. Do they know you’re gay? Are you out on your job?

  • CBRad

    @Kev C: How do you know NYC has lots of Irish gays, though? And who are the successful ones you’re talking about? No offense, but I feel like you’re making stuff up (because of wishful thinking) rather than going by real feedback from life experience. (I’m a Cuban Protestant, btw., from a rich family, NYC born. And I can pass for a WASP. I’m considered quite “classy” in the circles, but …I don’t like what others do).

  • Kev C

    @CBRad: I live in NYC. It has lots of irish gays. Maybe you never visited NYC. Gay irish can’t march in the St. Patrick day parade. They aren’t discriminated against by gays but catholics.

  • CBRad

    Well….how long have you lived here? That might explain a lot.

  • Kev C

    @CBRad: You’re just trolling for the catholic church, aren’t you? Probably not even gay.

  • CBRad

    @Kev C: LOL. Church of the child molester.

  • CBRad

    Well…anyway, I just brought up the subject to remind everyone that there’s lots of other types of “bigotry” and “discrimination” that goes on in the gay world besides black and white. I know it, they know it, straight Irish know it, ethnic-Catholic gay Italians know it, the Jews DEFINITELY know it (those people are sharp observers), everybody knows it (unless you’re a country bumpkin). Didn’t mean to hijack the topic here, but some pretended to disagree with me so I got caught up in it. I’ll leave you guys to the more direct topic of the rap guy’s statements.

  • Kev C

    Cuban Protestant


  • michael

    Wow, sexxy and Dj, u r playing up to the dumbass ignorant stereotype, aren’t u? What I did was intentionally stepped in his foot, stared right at him and just waited for him to say some shite to me. Both of u r pathetic. This whole “u white guys and us black guys” feeds more into the racism card than any if us “white” guys ever could do. Until u figure out the difference in being a racist versus being intolerant of intolerance then I suggest the best thing for both of u to do is stfu. It’s too classic u both assumed I became a coward in the subway today when u obviously bred ur cluelessness out of complete ignorance. U obviously have no idea of what I can and will do in real time.

  • Queer Supremacist

    Maybe the reason nobody rails against “white homophobes” is because we don’t expect much from white “people.” They’re the ones who started the slave trade (even though African tribal kings gladly sold their subjects to the white devil), the Holocaust, and the ongoing Breeder Jihad.

    I am of Western and Eastern European descent and a Jew; I refuse to align myself with the white race when it has spread so much misery to everyone who doesn’t have the misfortune to be a Breeder Goy Aryan Male. Even though my skin is pink, I am not “white.” I hate white people more than any of the self-hating black kapos defending this breeder thug.

    Drop all this crap about “gay white male privilege.” A “straight” black male has more privilege than a gay man or woman of any race.

    You keep exercising your First Amendment rights, I’ll start exercising my Second Amendment rights.

  • michael

    Hey u 2, isn’t it a bit racist for both of u to have assumed a white guy was going to go out of his way to avoid confrontation with a black guy on the subway? I guess in ur limited book racism only goes one way but both of u have proven beyond a doubt with ur postings u just don’t have a clue. Yup, us white guys, or would that be us gay guys, aren’t tough enough to take any black guy on when confronted with such bullshite. The stereotype of a dumbass this time for u two can not be blamed on race nor orientation and is rooted in both if u being total idiots.

  • DJ Veno

    @michael: Dude you can call all the names you want but the reality of the problem is people like you.. Go live,breath and die with your stereotyping mindset.. Maybe you need some fucking help, only thing I ask was WHY IT HAS TO BE THAT WAY, an in comes your confessed ass talking about people on a high horses, now you trying to be the hulk?? Boy set down.

  • DJ Veno

    @michael: Oky love your starting to sound like trailer trash, I’ll stop posting before you make yourself look more like a prick than you already do.

    P.S For some strange reason I feel sorry for you. . .

  • xander

    This talk of the Irish seems a derail, but the hatred of the Irish in the Northeast goes back to the huge flux of immigrants due to the mid 1800s ‘Potato Famine’ and when the Irish were met with signs in store windows stating “Irish need not appply.”

    As for T.I., he doesn’t get that it’s our RIGHTS and equality at stake, not just our comfort zone!

  • michael

    That’s funny Dj because I was just thinking u were starting to sound just like some nygger, uneducated, ignorant and ape like. Don’t blame me if u want to start flinging names here and don’t blame me when it comes back to bite u in ur ass. Don’t waste ur pity in me because ur limited amount of intelligence probably can’t spare the brain cells. Btw, I love how u start tossing out names like trailer trash when ur apparent racism is pointed out.

  • michael

    Btw Dj thanks for pointing out the problem this article entails. It’s ok for u to stereotype me, a white guy, imbue assuming I went out if my way to avoid confrontation with a black guy because I am a coward but the moment ur stereotyped u huff and puff and freak. Why is it ok when u do it but God forbid its done to u?

  • Kev C

    Homophobic black rappers aren’t exactly news. So why not talk about the Irish? Check out this St. Paddy’s day video. The black guy is wearing a rainbow flag pin which isn’t allowed.

  • DJ Veno

    Huff and puff??? I think your the one with limited brain cells..

    A. T.It’s statement was meant ALL gay people, read it..

    B. Read your first post that was addressed to me, how do you avoid confrontation with a post like that??? Once again I only ask, Why add to the damn problems we as a community already have?

    C. I’m a proud nigger ape, but please don’t let this ape get a 4bedroom,3 complete bathrooms, up and downstairs house with a 2010 BMW.. please don’t let this black nigger with a sexy ass white boyfriend do better than you..

  • DJ Veno

    Huff and puff??? I think your the one with limited brain cells..

    A. T.It’s statement was meant to ALL gay people, read it..

    B. Read your first post that was addressed to me, how do you avoid confrontation with a post like that??? Once again I only ask, Why add to the damn problems we as a community already have?

    C. I’m a proud nigger ape, but please don’t let this ape get a 4bedroom,3 complete bathrooms, up and downstairs house with a 2010 BMW.. please don’t let this black nigger with a sexy ass white boyfriend do better than you..

  • DJ Veno

    @michael: From your first post addressed me you made it well known that you hate all black people dude, gay or straight.. You can sit there at your keyboard and make me out to be a racist ape all you like luv, I’m fine with that.

    I’m black, yeah like I had a choice right? Stop making it hard for people on here, your just as bad as those bullies out there making kids kill themselves.. If you wouldn’t have even said a word to me I would be sitting in my tree still eating my bananas, but you are second person in my lifetime to make me see that you can be nice to everyone..

  • DJ Veno

    @michael: From your first post addressed me you made it well known that you hate all black people dude, gay or straight.. You can sit there at your keyboard and make me out to be a racist ape all you like luv, I’m fine with that.

    I’m black, yeah like I had a choice right? Stop making it hard for people on here, your just as bad as those bullies out there making kids kill themselves.. If you wouldn’t have even said a word to me I would be sitting in my tree still eating my bananas, but you are second person in my lifetime to make me see that you can’t be nice to everyone..

  • L21480

    Majority of the comments/votes on mainstream blogs (like TMZ) agree with TI’s position. And so do I. TI said nothing homophobic. He didn’t even endorse anyone having an anti-gay attitude. He’s commenting on the self-righteous people who like to gasp themselves into an asthma attack or pop a blood vessel simply because :::OH NO!::: some folks aren’t 100% gay embracing. Who the hell cares? Some gay people act as if NOT being an ally to the community equates you to being a member of the WBC.

    Bottom line: If they aren’t harassing gays or in some way stopping them from living in ‘peace,’ then it shouldn’t matter if someone has a negative attitude about homosexuality. That’s their business and their right.

  • dancobbb

    From the comments here, it seems that there are blacks who agree with TI and blacks who disagree with TI and whites who agree with TI and whites who disagree with TI.

    Just goes to show you the reality: no community is monolithic in its beliefs. All black people do not believe the same thing –why would they? All white people do not believe the same thing –why would they? Not all gay people believe the same thing –why would they? I mean, I cannot believe that in the 21st century that blacks and whites and gays and straights still have to make this point!?!! TI is an ass in my opinion. I happen to be a gay white guy, but does anyone out there really believe that when TI says something, that it’s representative of what all black people think?! COME ON! People are individuals and have different opinions regardless of their race, ethnicity or sexual orientation. This is basic basic basic stuff we’re talking about here. The ABCs of the real world.

  • Irritated

    Wow! Ok so gay men think of anal sex as equivalent to lashing now? Blow jobs I suppose are equivalent to being shackled in the bowels of a ship for 3 months straight. Oh never mind. I heard that Tracy Morgan joke too and it was hysterically funny to me. Whats even funnier are the queens on this site with their knickers all bunched up in a ward over God knows what. People should be able to express their support or disaffection for anything including homosexuality. Gays in truth believe in this given that I find gay sites to contain far more racism and mysoginy than any other forums I have been to. Gay bars are even worse! Dont even get me started on the transphobia.

    Point is, TIs right to expression has got nothing to do with whether all people are entitled to equal rights and a safe existence. Pick your battles better, the outraged tantrum throwing, hands-on-hip is just played out and bloody irritating even to me.

  • jason

    Pop singer Rihanna has collaborated with a number of singers who had previously been boycotted due to their extremely homophobic lyrics, lyrics that incite people to murder gays. Yet, Gay Inc failed to criticize her.

    The concerning thing is that gays rightly jump all over TI but fail to even mildly criticize Rihanna. Why the different treatments?

  • DJ Veno

    @dancobbb: Thank you, basically what I’ve been trying to say.

  • Jordan

    ahahaha i find it funny how many people think tracy jordans jokes about gay people were funny. I just found them to be dumb. Like saying things he thought a lot of straight men would relate to and find funny. it weren’t clever, which is what bothers me about it. as for TI, im just offended by the fact that he’s stereotyping all gay people. You know if a white comedian had said oh black people are just too sensitive about black jokes he would be offended. he’s a hypocrite. I love a good gay joke as long as its funny and not its not performed by a desperate comedian trying to get a cheap laugh by saying something that’s not really funny. Love him in 30 Rock. Think he’s not so good at the stand up though. I’m gay and I can’t speak for all gay people but I know I’m not trying to ”shut anything down” – again if a white comedian had said that about black people you know he would definitely have something to say about that. Stupid comments, anti gay or not.

  • Steven

    @Avenger: This is not about people complaining that someone made a “gay joke” (Lampanelli, Cho, etc…). This is about him telling gay people to just “suck it up” in the face of discrimination and abuse.

    If you are going to quote the previous Tracy Morgan scandal then no, that isn’t going to work since that was not a joke; it was literally a homophobic rant.

  • quantheory

    My excessive thoughts:

    -You can advocate legal freedom of speech without believing that all speech is moral. Legal freedom of speech isn’t really the issue here, since people can legally say almost anything. Everyone has the legal right to condemn practices that they think are immoral, including speech. Homophobes have the right to speak, GLAAD can condemn speech it finds homophobic, T.I. can condemn GLAAD for speech he finds oversensitive, and other people can condemn T.I.’s remarks. Those are all things we have the “right” to do. Whether any of those statements are right or wrong, factually or morally, has not the slightest thing whatsoever to do with whether anyone has the legal right to say them.

    -What’s more relevant to this discussion is private discrimination based on speech. Certain forms of speech are legally protected from certain types of discrimination (you can’t usually be fired for expressing your religious beliefs in a non-disruptive way). Others are not (if you are a public figure who says something stupid, and afterward people refuse to consume your product or vote for you, that’s your own problem). Some situations may be ambiguous. If you are a famous figure who expresses the religious belief that gays, Catholics, and non-Christians go to hell, maybe you can’t be fired, but you may find that your value as a celebrity (and thus income) plummets if and when you lose a lot of your audience. That might concern you. You might think that the people who boycott you are immoral. But it probably isn’t violating any of your legal rights.

    -My personal opinion is that all anti-gay prejudice is immoral. That doesn’t mean that it’s all equally immoral. A non-accepting but usually tolerant person is not nearly as bad as the WBC, and the WBC are not nearly as bad as homophobes who have actually assaulted, arrested, or killed gay people. However, I reserve the option of passing judgment on whomever I damn well please, and I have no respect for the Tolerance Police showing up to tell me that I can’t criticize anyone less homophobic than the WBC. If you want to tell me that sometimes my reaction is excessive or misplaced, fine, we can have that conversation. If you want to tell me that I’m wrong to ever pass moral judgment on “tolerant” homophobes, or if you play the “X is worse, so why don’t you focus on that.” card, I am going to start wondering about what kind of fantasy world you live in where those objections make sense and are not completely hypocritical.

    -When T.I. says “if you’re against it you should have the right to be against it in peace”, he’s right about legal rights, but he’s quite wrong about what’s right and wrong in public dialogue. No one has a “right” to not be judged by or criticized for their publicly expressed opinions. As long as those criticisms don’t cross the line into threats or harassment, anything is fair game for anyone. That’s what free speech is all about.

    -It’s pretty damn pointless to have made this whole thread about racial issues. Lots of white people have expressed opinions approximately identical to T.I.’s, so it’s not like this is a viewpoint that only exists in the black community. I think it evinces an unhealthy attitude about race if the first thing that springs to mind is not “another celebrity complaining about gay people being offended” but rather “another black person who doesn’t like gay people”. The whole history of prejudice is filled with examples of people overgeneralizing from specific individuals. “Person X is gay and has AIDS.” turns into “AIDS is a gay disease.” turns into “If I meet someone gay, that person has AIDS, and if I meet someone with AIDS, that person is gay.” Even if, statistically speaking, homophobia is more common amongst black people, it’s still unfair to treat every statement by a black person into a representation of how all (or most) black people are. I shouldn’t be expected to represent everyone of my orientation, gender, moral beliefs, or race(s). Neither should anyone else.

    -Most jokes about gay people are dumb. That is, most of them fall into one of two categories:

    a) They assume that gayness is just intrinsically funny, because it’s weird and a potential source of conflict and has to do with sex. You know, haw haw, men who like dicks, how totally bizarre and unexpected! And how uncomfortable straight guys must feel around them! And how can you find out which ones they are? The politically incorrect mix-ups must be hilarious. Or, a tad less frequently, haw haw, lesbians are totally unlike normal women! What do you do with them? How do they have sex? What is funny old conservative grandpa’s opinion? And you’ve gotta be kind of a perv to decide to be bi… right? Of course, if being gay just seems normal and unexceptional to you, this sort of joke magically transforms into one that’s not any funnier than the straight equivalent would be.

    b) Poorly informed stereotypes. “You know how lesbians are all auto mechanics, and gay men have those tiny little prissy dogs?” No. Those kinds of observations might have been funnier when the genre was sort of new, and most people didn’t really know what gay people were like, and so it didn’t matter that they didn’t actually apply to most of us. But nowadays, they basically are funniest to people who are culturally unaware and/or are already laughing because of the better jokes they heard earlier. Every group gets these jokes, and they are almost all terrible, not necessarily because they are offensive, but because they actually make no sense. It’s a way to seem edgier and to sustain an act or show with shock value and nervous laughter, but it doesn’t really require any wit or talent. Throw ’em in the history bin with the women in advertisements who can’t work any device more complicated than a vacuum, and the cartoons of East Asians with enormous buckteeth. Laugh at how terrible we once were, but don’t give me the “It’s funny because it’s so true!!!” bullcrap.

    Should comics (all comics) be allowed to make fun of gay people and gay culture? Of course! But frankly, if 90% of that material got thrown out, it would be no big loss.

  • michael

    Wow, Dj, u really have problems with basic reading comprehension skills, eh? Where did I say I hate all black people? And, whoo, u drive a nice car and live in something more than cave… Hmm, lemme see if I can find my two flying fukks so I can pretend as if I care. Thanks tho for proving how superficial some can be when you sum up ur life its via ur material possessions. Let me guess, you work out, eat right, have bright shiny teeth yet u still haven’t been the center of any party’s attention… Maybe one day you’ll realize its the amount of people ur able to impact and not what kind of car u drive that really makes life worth living.

  • DJ Veno

    @michael: Are you still trying to be a wise ass? Don’t you have a family you should be tending to vs. trying to train a nigger ape as you called me? You don’t give a fuck then why even say anything about it?

    As I said before, you hated black people from the start.. Thing is I’m not worried you calling me all these names, questioning my intelligence, and even calling superficial because you don’t know me personally, if you did.. You would know Davinity don’t do parties,drink or smoke. I will continue to respect, love and support my fellow man. I will continue to see everyone as a individual and not as a fucking group.. So dude you have said enough to make a open minded person become racist, glad I enough love for you to look past that mess.

    I love ya Michael because it seems like no one has said it to you lately <3

  • DJ Veno

    No. 91 · DJ Veno · Member · 35 comments I don’t know what’s sadder, T.I or the comments on this topic.. It’s hard enough being gay, why add racism?

  • michael

    And for the gazillionth time would u mind pointing out to me where u said I hate all black people?

    Do u know what ur problem is??? U r one hypocritical dumbass. So u can call me trailer park trash but when I return the name favor, via to prove a point, it u completely have ur head so far shoved up ur ass ur too clueless to realize I only dropped the ape name to prove u can’t take what u dish out and u, my friend, have completely proven ur hypocrisy. When u stereotyped me, along with the other black guy, by assuming I was too much of a coward to confront the black guy on the subway u showed exactly how racist u r when it comes to white guys. U have done the best prime example of wtf is wrong with many in the black community. U r the first ones to whine about being stereotyped but r too f’n ignorant not to see how often u do it to others. Piss off.

  • michael

    What is the difference between a white homophobe and a black homophobe? One is just some uneducated idiot that can easily be written off and the other is someone who not too long ago was in the same exact spit as the LGBT community is today.

    Now which one might frustrate u a bit more?

    My problem isn’t with black Americans, for they can simply kiss my ass, but its these African countries being so viciously homophobic. U seem them on TV and, yes, I start to feel a bit racist but there is a huge difference if hating those who hate u versus just hating.

    Btw, these black guys in America making such homophobic comments are a joke because it’d be a safe bet that in America its the black guys who are going gay the most often.

  • Who?

    Who is this “TI” person?

    Never heard of him.

    TI = “totally inconsequential,” I guess.

    We’re supposed to care about his opinion… why?

  • Riker

    @CBRad: Have you ever been to Boston? TONS of hot successful Irish gays there.

  • ScaryRussianHeather


    Plenty. I know a 23 year old female, Jewish Princess type jet setting Miami resident who makes homophobic comments all the time, and so does her entire social circle. Her latest Facebook entries include her attendance at three different rap concerts. Listening to today’s rap and rappers is this generations similarity to their parents’ liking Motown. Plus hate.

    My business takes me to many high rise condo buildings and not a day goes by that I don’t hear the same crap. In elevators, lobbies and on phones. And I’m always shocked to see it’s just as many from this generation as the last. Statistically? No, but still…

  • DJ Veno

    No. 69 · michael Did anyone notice something. Yes, the gay community can and will shut u down. When has anyone said that about the black community? I feel pity for them. Uneducated, ignorant and foolish. Bring it on TI because we will just as easily shut u down too.

    No. 142 · michael That’s funny Dj because I was just thinking u were starting to sound just like some nygger, uneducated, ignorant and ape like. Don’t blame me if u want to start flinging names here and don’t blame me when it comes back to bite u in ur ass. Don’t waste ur pity in me because ur limited amount of intelligence probably can’t spare the brain cells. Btw, I love how u start tossing out names like trailer trash when ur apparent racism is pointed out.

    Yeah this pretty much shows you HATE black people, and you can actually stop saying your not racist.

    No. 97 · michael Dj venom, get off the high horse. Mud can only be flung ur way so much before u start flinging some back. I have more issues with the African countries then some wanna be trying to cover up how often he takes it up the ass…

    Hmm, your talking me? My first comment was nothing more than begging, asking why..why have racism amongst our gay community?? We do have enough problems.

    No Mich, I’m not going to pay attention to anything your saying because it was alot of extra from the damn start that wasn’t needed at all. Its fine for you to walking around calling people pathetic and idoits before I even said trailor tash, which comes in many different skin tones not just white tyvm. He called you a bitch oh wow, not like he called you a weak or white bitch, you took that made that into a racial stereotype as well, News flash the Army is made of many different races even White people, so that oh “because I’m a white you think I’m weak” can go right along with the rest of your extra nonsense. People pull bitch moves every day, no matter straight, gay,black or white.

    Do me one favor, stop looking like a victom and so defensive, not everyone in the black community out to piss you off or ruin your day. I fine you very amusing, it’s the only reason I keep replying.. I’m just waiting to what other stuff you can come up with. <3

  • CBRad

    @ScaryRussianHeather: The difference is also that Motown was actually good music. But, I can just imagine what you’re saying : I know several neighborhoods where it’s the so-called “wiggers”, the white boys who adopted that whole culture and hang out with similar blacks (NOT 9-5 “decent” black folk), who seem to be very homophobic (unlike the general youth population these days). So there probably IS an influence there.

  • arbiter

    Whatever. I’m over it already. Words are just words, the power they have is only what we assign to them, and none of these words have any power in my mind. I’ve used the “N” word and the “F” word, neither of which mean anything remotely like the original intent in most contexts. And the joke is kinda funny, though Morgan is still an idiot. And Mencia never thought of any joke on his own, so don’t go too far praising him! lol

  • Haha

    Obviously the Tracy Morgan joke was hysterical to you because you’re a self-loathing douche. I find the joke funny because Tracy probably knows about taking a dick up the ass since he oozes gayness. Same goes for T.I.

    The only one on the rag is you. You are criticizing others and calling them thin-skinned for being called names, but have no problem with others beating the shit out of David if he uses the N-word? Seriously, crazy bitches like you make zero sense as usual. Whatever, take a Motrin.

  • A Gay

    @HeroQueero: HeroQueero, while that actually was a REALLY funny joke imo, lol, it’s a little bit different ’cause black people were whipped as a form of oppression and torture that was incredibly institutionalized into society, whereas gay men, unless they’re being raped, take dicks ’cause they like it. Or maybe ’cause they want to get paid a good amount of money for a little amount of work……not speakin’ from experience or anything…… ;D

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