A straight cis women says she’s “repelled” by heterosexual culture, particularly heterosexual men. She wants to meet a bisexual or bicurious boyfriend who is more sensitive towards women. So she’s seeking wisdom from our friend Rich Juzwiak over at Slate.
“I’ve been thinking maybe I should look for bi dudes/bicurious gay dudes,” she writes, “but I am not sure how best to do that.”
She wonders: “What would you think of a woman being on Grindr or Scruff?”
Oh, dear.
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The woman continues, “I do want to be respectful of gay men’s spaces and not horn in where I’m not welcome, but I really would love to find a vers guy with queer politics who would be up for casually dating a woman.”
“What do you think? If you were me, where would you look?”
In his response, Juzwiak wastes no time reminding the woman that “the world is not your bachelorette party” so “don’t try to make something that has been designed to be not about you about you.”
“A general rule of thumb that I wish more people followed is: If you enter a space as someone who is not a member of the demographic for which said space was established, you should behave yourself,” he writes.
“So if you must go the route of using digital spaces dominated by men seeking men, as a cis woman with (no offense?) ostensibly hetero desires, don’t bother people. Let them come to you. Also prepared to have your profile deleted. I actually have seen cis, hetero women on Grindr and the like before, and whenever I do, I think, ‘Well, she’s not gonna last.’ And she doesn’t.”
Juziwak goes on to warn the woman that she probably won’t have a ton of luck on any apps marketed for men looking to meet other men, but she’s welcome to give it a try. Also, just because a guy is gay or bi doesn’t mean he’s any better than the straight dudes she detests.
“There are a lot of shitty men who identify as gay and bi, and their queerness doesn’t automatically absolve them of misogyny,” he writes. “In fact, the misogyny in some of these dudes is compounded by a perceived lack of use for women. At least straight guys will pretend to be civilized for the sake of getting laid.”
What do you think about straight cis women looking for love on Grindr and Scruff? Sound off in the comments section below…
controversial2019
Dangerous comment to make;
A general rule of thumb that I wish more people followed is: If you enter a space as someone who is not a member of the demographic for which said space was established, you should behave yourself
Given that the heterosexual community outnumbers the queer community, one could argue that bars/clubs that don’t wave the rainbow flag are intended for the ‘majority’ demographic. So straights. Therefore queer people should ‘behave themselves’ when there.
Could one not expand it to the general WORLD? The majority of people on Earth are heterosexual thus Earth’s demographic is heterosexual people. Thus queer folk should behave?
This would be a dangerous suggestion. Silly advice lady.
fingertrouble
” If you enter a MINORITY space as someone who is not a member of the demographic for which said space was established, you should behave yourself”
I think the context makes it clear he meant the spaces for minority people…for straight people don’t have spaces. Nearly everywhere is their ‘space’, they don’t need to have special areas because the world is their space. So by definition they aren’t talking about those spaces. Cos they don’t exist.
Why are you seeing drama where there is none? Just trying to be controversial?
1898
“Therefore queer people should ‘behave themselves’ when there.”
and they DO behave themselves in non-LGBTQ spaces 99.9% of the time, lest they be queerbashed or worse.
radiooutmike
The rest of that paragraph goes:
So if you must go the route of using digital spaces dominated by men seeking men, as a cis woman with (no offense?) ostensibly hetero desires, don’t bother people. Let them come to you. Also be prepared to have your profile deleted. I actually have seen cis, hetero women on Grindr and the like before, and whenever I do, I think, “Well, she’s not gonna last.” And she doesn’t.
A digital space dominated by men seeking men is by it’s definition is a minority space. You made a very good point. No need to be facetious about it.
PLAYS WELL WITH OTHERS
Sorry dear, ya need a pole to go fishing in those ponds….
controversial2019
@fingertrouble – but the advice doesn’t say minority. You have put that in there. That’s your interpretation.
My point is that just like we say celebrities with their public forums and their influence on society need to be careful as to what they say so as to not unfairly ostracise a community or inadvertently promote prejudice towards a community, so Those who give ‘advice’ in columns need to choose their words carefully so that they CANT be misinterpreted and/or used against communities.
cliche guevara
It doesn’t but it is pretty clearly implied and I’d say anyone trying to use it against a community is doing a lot of mental contortion kind of like you are doing.
1898
she should try OkCupid. there are tons of bi guys on there, along with guys who identify as “heteroflexible” and “homoflexible,” and the site/app allows you to search for those categories as well as many others.
that would make a lot more sense than joining Grindr, and a LOT more sense than joining Scruff.
one of my biggest pet peeves about Grindr these days is that so many of the guys on there are self-described “str8” who are only interested in MTF trans women. it really does feel like gay/bi men are being pushed out by straight guys who just want a chick with a d!ck.
cliche guevara
Both Grindr and Scruff have made efforts to be more trans inclusive, that is a move that I completely applaud. Does that mean that guys will show up that are looking for trans woman? Yes. But I really don’t see how that is different then other guys that aren’t into me for a variety of other reasons as well.
cliche guevara
I have talked to and met a few women on Grindr over the years. They were there for different reasons and all fo them were super respectful and very much aware that they were guests in that world. It’s totally antidotal but yeah .. my experience is that they were more pleasant to interact with than most of the men I have talked to.
ElPillo
“ She wants to meet a bisexual or bicurious boyfriend who is more sensitive towards women. ”. Right, because we are respectful and never look at each other like sex objects…
Donston
Grindr is not really the place for anyone who’s looking for legit dating and looking for someone to be “sensitive” to them. While as far as I know, there are already a decent amount of women on these apps. And if you’re really worried about “invading” people’s space then don’t. It’s fairly simple.
She seems to want to date a “bi guy” because she feels it will equate to him being more “sensitive” and perhaps more submissive. That is sometimes the case. But there are many inherently bisexual/pansexual guys or guys who contend with fluidity who are misogynistic or who only view women as sexual playthings. Not being heterosexual or homosexual does not mean that you want to date a woman or love a woman. It doesn’t mean you respect women. She shouldn’t be that focused on someone’s identity when it comes to finding a partner. Then wanting you, being able to express their feelings for you and getting some understanding of where they are on the romantic, sexual, affection, emotional, relationship spectrum should take priority. It also seems like she’s someone who will easily fall in love with “queer dude” who doesn’t genuinely want her and can genuine love her and be fulfilled in a hetero relationship. The “casual” thing comes off like lip-service.
The reality of it is that there just aren’t anymore exclusive “gay spaces”. Political correctness, queer politics and money has sorta stuffed that idea out. And I do understand some of the resentment. Having to always make room for hetero dynamics and non-homo romantic ambitions is annoying. It does feel like their just isn’t anywhere for guys who are looking to indulge and express same-sex passions and relationship ambitions to be. But it is what it is.
C_Alan
I’m just glad to hear that there are women out there that want to date a bi guy. I read so much that women don’t want to have anything to do with bi guys.
Donston
It’s not really that unusual. The couple of times I’ve had relationships with a female the women were the aggressors. While I’ve been hit on by plenty of women throughout the years who know that I’m not heterosexual. And do you think these guys who are closeted or on the DL all have wives/girlfriends who are clueless about their orientation? If you’re good-looking, and/or you have money, and/or you are charming and fun it’s not that difficult for you to date the sex/gender you want to. Most “bi guys” who only date women are just not publicly out. But a significant percentage of their female partners know what’s up. This is why the idea of identity will always be a flawed concept and will always involve choice.
I do think women who are into “queer” guys have to be aware of their privilege. The dominance of hetero-normalcy, hetero pressures, male homophobia, internalized homophobia, gay shame, self-misandry is still strong. Having a female partner equates to an easier sociological life for a male. And she can give a man a traditional family. Too many women who are into “queer” guys don’t seem to understand or respect that they have those advantages and privileges. Some purposely use those things to their advantage. And too many women assume that a dude not being homosexual equates to them eventually wanting to have sex with her or wanting to eventually settle down with a woman.
There is thankfully less whining nowadays from “bi guys” about how they feel that they can only be with a guy because no woman wants them or understands them. No matter your identities, struggles, fluidity or where you fit in the romantic, sexual, affection, relationship spectrum, you should be with who you want to genuinely be with. You should be in a same-sex relationship because you want persistent same-sex passions, affections, comfort and connection, you want same-sex love and commitment. It shouldn’t be viewed as some consolation prize. And we are just now getting out of that “consolation prize” era.
Aires the Ram
I agree with most everyone who posted, especially Donston in the post above. My take on it is this:
She said: “says she’s “repelled” by heterosexual culture, particularly heterosexual men”.
There, THAT, in a nutshell, is what I believe her problem is. I think her being ‘repelled’ by str8 culture and str8 men, ought to tell her (and by extension, us), something about her own sexuality, that she obviously isn’t accepting. If she were truly a straight/heterosexual woman, she’d want a straight man, not a man who rides the fence. So I’m calling but*sh&t on her.
Donston
Some women are so traumatized by “straight” guys that they go looking for alternatives. They get abused, get their hearts broken and start searching for something else. That type of trauma and self-misandry is partly why some dudes don’t want to seriously date guys, even if they know their passions, romantic affections, emotional investment, relationship contentment veers towards their sex. Sometimes a woman indulges relationships with women for these reasons. But now some women are starting to go for “queer” guys as well. These alternatives are not as threatening as them. They don’t represent abuse or potential heartbreak. And they won’t be forced into traditional hetero roles. It’s hard to gauge what’s really going on with this lady. But clearly there’s some stuff from her past and perhaps her sense of self that she’s not really confronting.
Cam
1. Bi guys are not going onto Grindr to meet women.
2. The only reason she thinks other guys will be more sensitive to her are because she’s dealt with her gay friends and assumes dating a bi guy will be the same as having a gay best friend. She will be screaming about how insensitive LGBT people are as soon as that guy sleeps with another guy.
lord.krath
If this happens, you can bet Grindr is as good as dead. It’s bad enough dealing fickle gays, now we have to deal with swarms of straight women who can’t find men elsewhere? Lords have mercy. It’s like when lesbians started going to the gay clubs in Austin. One by one they shut down.
jaxxx0731
Totally been there and done this as a cis woman… met some cool people … some of dated some who have turned out to be friends . I didn’t go into it with high expectations and I have had to on more than one occasion answer “why grindr ?” And my answer is always why not ? I don’t judge and I am not in the space to cause any drama or controversy , it’s a platform to meet people and that is just what I have done ?????.