With the exception of a few trolls, it’s safe to say readers of this website are big supporters of equality in the workplace, and anti-discrimination laws that keep us safer on the job. Like a federal ENDA! But while various cities and counties and states have created a hodgepodge of protected regions for queers, there are still plenty of us who live in places where we can still be fired for being gay, bi, or trans. That sucks. But here’s another sucky reality: There are plenty of us who have no jobs, who are struggling to feed and support ourselves and our families, whose life savings have plummeted, whose hopes of retiring soon have vanished, and who would trade in their MBA for a Starbucks gig if it meant a paycheck. And for that group of us who want a job, any job in this economy, how much dignity are we willing to trade for a job?
Worrying about getting fired for being LGBT is one thing, but what about willingly taking a gig in an environment that’s homophobic? Careers where dealing with the “fag” jokes are everywhere; so too are careers where a good old boys club rules upper management, while gay men and women are relegated to the lower rungs. Forever. And transgender job hopefuls, whether out or unable to “pass,” face their own set tyranny from co-workers and bosses. Whether you work on the sales floor of a retail store, on a shipyard, in an art gallery, a tech start-up, or on the executive suite of a Fortune 500 company, there’s always some anti-LGBT bullshit to deal with.
So while it’s great to hear about the gay-oriented job fair Out to Work, and how it teams potential employees with queer-friendly employers, those opportunities — where you’re all but promised a discrimination-free job environment — aren’t there for everyone.
And yet, we still need jobs. We still need to survive. So, let’s discuss: Would you take a job that you knew would entail some level of discrimination against LGBTs? Is there a “tolerable amount” you could endure (i.e. a co-worker saying “that’s so gay” is fine, but not picking your own bathroom is not)? If the pay is good and there are great health benefits, does that influence your decision? Have you picked a job you knew would be intolerant to you? Are you in one now? Have you refused a job because you knew it would be unbearable? Tell us about your living situation (married? single? supporting kids?), the factors that go into a decision like this (need to pay off student loans? move out on your own? have health care?), and how much anti-LGBT crap is too much (some? any?).
How about we take this to the next level?
Our newsletter is like a refreshing cocktail (or mocktail) of LGBTQ+ entertainment and pop culture, served up with a side of eye-candy.
Let’s share. And, though we urge you to use caution in identifying the company you work for (retaliation is a bitch), if you’re so willing, go ahead and name your employer (or one you turned down) … but you might want to make yourself anonymous with a different username. And don’t post anything libelous, because companies have a tendency to subpoena websites like this one for IP addresses when they don’t like what’s being said.
(Cartoons via Slap Upside The Head)
EARLIER: The Perfect Time to Come Out in the Office: During the Job Interview
Cam
One thing that is always said is that the best way to make people less homophobic is to let them get to know gay people. I used to work in an environment that could be very homophoic…not the violent kind but the macho B.S. I worked there, was out to my good co-worker friends, did well, got promoted, was well liked, then brought a boyfriend to the company party. Rather than telling people one by one I was suddenly out to the whole company. A few people acted weird after, but the majority were either very cool or uneffected by it. Afterwards I did notice a large lessening of any gay jokes. I was very pleasently surprised by just how well it went.
Some people are unchangeable, but in many of these cases it can end up beeing one of those “Teachable moments”. I moved on to a different job years abgo, but while I know that several of those people who before wouldn’t have given a crap about gay issues have now recently said to me that they can’t believe we can’t get married. So worked out well for me in that instance.
Rick
I’ve been laughing at gays for years for free. Now I learn that I can get PAID FOR THIS?
Rikard
I corrected the Creative Director at a design agency I was working at when he regularly said “that’s so gay”. I simply told him that a manager could not afford to be so careless with his speach. He didn’t do it again, but didn’t appreciate being corrected either. That’s ok, I outlasted him at the job and the new CD is a cute gay guy who heard my comment years before. He never said so, but I hope he appreciated my willingness to stand up and say something when I needed to. It didn’t protect me from the lay offs, but it was a moment of empowerment where I did something and somehow didn’t take it too far and become an ass (a real feat for me).
Dennis
@Rick:
As you clearly have no other skills, then yes, perhaps you could work at Focus on the Family, or NOM.
They could use an asshole such as yourself to continue their decent into irrelevance and obscurity. Douche.
RomanHans
I worked for a government contractor, and security clearances were required for job promotion. I’d been out since the minute I was born, though, so part of my résumé included bartending in a gay bar. Luckily this was the 80s, so rather than being fired, my security clearance applications were simply “lost” for — believe it or not — up to two years.
Buddy
The gays do a lot of things deserving of laughter.
M Shane
I’ve lost several good jobs for being gay. The last two in a city: Minneaopolis, where there are supposed to be legal protections. I worked for a national corporation Contracted to promote Arts Organizations. One of the Managers who was a Christian Fanatic had a crush on me and I made it clear to her what my sexual dispositon was. She had me run out of the company by a close Religious freak friend of hers.
The Minneapolis Civil Rights Commision commited unproblematic fraud in their disposition of the case, since only Religious fanatics(black )ran the organization. The mayor promised to interveen but ran me around. The cities gay organization: pretty much as closeted as everyone else, did nothing to intervene.
The lesson in this is that laws are no better than the the people enforcing them. A lot of people in the Gay rights business seem to be there only because they are cashing in, and have no serious intention of fighting for real gay liberation, which is far from being an easy road, and ages before there is any resolution.
More interesting, I read an article by the gay employee of a large California firm, who’s story was about what he had discovered about his own company, in which he was fairly well placed. The article was entitled, quite appropriately, “the Mormon Mafia” . He discovered that the company which is very large was literelly glutted with Mormons who were hired first and formost above any better qualified employees. Male Mormons were excused ,e.g, for fucking female secretaries in presumably being fired but just really being moved around. The whole Company was under Mormon Control.
The fact about that is that they are very secretive and thier goal is to take over the country sereptitiously company by company and state by state.and of course get rid of Gays.
He thinks that we grosely underestimate the power of that group.
HiredGoons
‘”tolerable amount” you could endure (i.e. a co-worker saying “that’s so gay”‘
I actually had this happen to me several times at a previous position; I didn’t get along with my boss very well. I complained once, and she witnessed the other incident, and when she let me go I got a month’s pay and a glowing reccomendation – I suspect it had something to do with this.
nikko
But RICK, nobody beats being evil like straight men, right? No laughing matter.
Jason
@Dennis:
Anger is not your color.
FAIL.
Qjersey
I once walked out of a restaurant where I was making very good money as a waiter because the maitre’d kept on referring to the gay staff as “fudgepackers”
hephaestion
Would I Take a Job That You Knew To Be Hostile to Queers? Fuck NO.
Yuki
If some of the people used “that’s so gay”, then sure, I’d take the job; I’d just tell them I didn’t appreciate those comments.
If it were openly hostile, though, with clear insults and such, then I would NOT take the job and I would report it to a higher official.
uffda
Would You Take a Job That You Knew To Be Hostile to Queers?
Absolutely. Easier to annihilate the organization from within.
Brian Miller
This is the age of anonymity, with a few simple proxy servers. If an organization discriminates against LGBT employees, the world should know about it — including that organization’s customers and clients, which doubtlessly includes a large number of LGBT people. Anti-gay discrimination in the workplace is economic poison, especially in the present climate.
Rose
Hostile is different than just flat out ignorant. I mean if they were harassing queers and making it harder on them than anyone else and if the company gave money against queer issues, then no, I wouldn’t work there. But if we are saying they are just ignorant but don’t harass…then by being there I’m just being me in the world. (Since I’m surrounded by ignorant folks as it is) I am who I am and if someone at work harassed me consistently for it, I’d bring it up to HR and if it wasn’t handled then I’d go above them. But I wouldn’t purposely work for a company that I knew was anti-queer. Although, I’ve learned that working in the corporate world is just the same as being in high school. I don’t think there is an easy answer to this. How’s that for a convoluted answer?
wmcarpenter
I am currently in a job that condones homophobia, albeit not the violent kind. Hardware stores have always been a boys club, so my sexuality isn’t up for discussion. I’m not out and don’t know if I ever could be. I’m sure my coworkers have their suspicions. I don’t know what would happen if I came out.
Why? I’m a student, a year away from my degree and it’s the only thing I know how to do well that pays.
kyle
Don’t know. i’m not gay just a rights advocate from birth.
my last job as a manager at HomeDepot was really gay friendly, (well… making fun of the 4 or 5 really known gay people was never done but making fun of straight man for doing some that might be seen as gay was a sport everyone including myself took part in.)
i’d have to say that if the company was anti-LGBTQ and i could tell i would start looking else where for a job.
Mea
I go to school in north dakota, but I’m originally from seattle. I stumbled on LGBT around the day of silence. That said, I printed out the cards and showed them to my grandpa who then showed his distaste for the whole idea. That was a real blow because I was a “grandpa’s girl” and I respected him a lot.
When I went to school and passed out the cards to my teachers explaining why I wouldn’t speak, I got the silent treatment from every one of them. Throughout the day I realized how many of my friends hated homosexuals.
People here are hard-core Christians, so they believe it’s a sin. I’m grateful I have at least two friends that didn’t hate on me because of it.
Until then I never really thought people could be so narrow-minded. It’s hard to stick up for what you believe in. I’m not homosexual, but I was still frowned upon for my beliefs.
People don’t realize that a part of being an adult is realizing there are some things you just don’t have the right to change.
scott ny'er
@No. 19 · Mea
Sad to see but you got to walk in our footsteps a little. And it’s not always pleasant (which of course brings up the whole why would anyone choose to be gay in this type of society). I thank you for being so cool and trying to promote change.
Michael Letterman
To be honest I have taken jobs where I worked with gays. In one job many, many years ago, my supervisor was (I don’t know what the PC term for it is) flagrantly queer. He enjoyed having me in his office while he rambled on about his weekends and all the perverse things he did with his various lovers. He seemed to enjoy my discomfort of listening to his sexual antics (I would have felt the same if he was a straight man telling me about his straight encounters).
His biggest problem with me was my night sharing any stories of my own. While I did not report him, someone else did and he was first transferred and later forced to resign and I took his position. So in answer to the original question I would take a job where there was open hostility towards gays but I would attempt to circumvent the hostility and create an environment where people do not discuss their sexuality or sexual antics in the workplace.
Robert, NYC
Mea, thank you for your insight and your courage. Its heartening to know that there are many decent, fair-minded, non-judgemental straight people out there who aren’t threatened by someone’s sexual orientaiton. The majority of our haters have a lot of problems with their own sexuality and lack of sexual satisfaction in their marriages and other relationships. Then there are those heterosexuals, mostly men, who commit a disgusting act of perversion in the form of sexual harassment of women in the workplace but their sexual orientation is never called into question, no matter how perverse their action is. The same goes for heterosexual men who pimp women into prostitution, call girl rings, importation of women from the far east to work in brothels, perversions in and of themselves. Then there are the vast number of straight males who troll the internet, going into chat rooms and doing all kinds of perverted things talking to women or seeking extra-marital sex. Its a double-standard of course laced with hypocrisy and bigotry, and again, their sexual orientation is never ridiculed or called into question.
Eastern Europe guy
I live in Bulgaria and study in a university. I am not employed right now but being among other students and sharing time and effort with them has its similarity with doing an actual job.
People here aren’t really homophobic. I am not out because most people think that showing you are gay is like parading about it, like showing off and stating “Look at me, I’m different!”. I agree with them. Showing your sexual orientation without being asked to show it is wrong. I believe in the pure idea of working with a team where personal life should not be discussed and telling everybody in their face that you are gay is ugly and wrong.
I believe staying in the closet the right thing to do when you are not being pressured about your personal life. Of course, in any other cases I agree with most opinions I read here.
Dasher
Would anyone like to work for the TSA? (I understand they may be taking applications in some locations).
Well, at the Orlando Airport, the TSA let homophobic employees post a “Jeopardy” game on a blackboard in a training room, and the category for gays was called “Pickle Suckers”.
Someone took a picture of the homophobic (it was also racist- and ethnic derogatory too) blackboard, and smuggled it out to an Orlando TV station, WESH-TV Channel 2, which showed it on the noon news today. The story is also on their website, minus the photo and minus the fact that it was also derogatory to gays. CNN also ran the story.
My first reaction was to chuckle. Pickle Suckers! They could have used terms a lot harsher than that. I’m not part of the Politically Correct Police, and I don’t want to overreact to something that was just some dumb lame-brain’s idea of a joke. But if I had a category for him (Dumbass Redneck), would he be pissed? I think he would.
Work_It
Would I work in a place that was deliberately homophobic?
No. Not very likely. I have worked on Lawn Mowing crews, and have done other sorts of jobs where I was surrounded by very butch guys……Quite honestly, they were fine…It seems like people that are fine with themselves, don’t really give a sh*t as often….especially if they get to know you as a person, and also if you aren’t some flaming crazy queen pushing your sexuality in their face…..which shouldn’t be happening in a work environment….I don’t want to hear about their wives in bed, either.
I find that the places where people get freakish about homosexuality (as well as race) are usually places that care more about having some sort of “front” or are concerned with having an image….not just getting a job done – say the music industry (which is FILLED TO THE BRIM WITH FAGS, and has brought us such lovely things as the term “No Homo” —- please like Kanye doesn’t know a million gay guys….offensive, Kanye! And don’t even start me on 50 cent.), politics, etc.
Robert, NYC
Work_it No. 25….You said….”It seems like people that are fine with themselves, don’t really give a sh*t as often….especially if they get to know you as a person, and also if you aren’t some flaming crazy queen pushing your sexuality in their face…..which shouldn’t be happening in a work environment….I don’t want to hear about their wives in bed, either”.
Actually, straights do push their sexuality in our faces when they kiss or hold hands in public, on t.v. or in films where you see a plethora of steamy sex scenes. We’re bombarded with it 365, 24/7. Its a direct message about who they are and with whom they are sleeping whether we as gay people like it or not. If that’s not in our faces, I don’t know what is. Maybe we should call for a ban on it when they go into hissy fits about a same-sex kiss or bedroom romp here and there, forcing tv stations to take programs off the air because its offensive and not straight? A lot of those flamboyant types you were referring to were in the vanguard of gay equality, don’t dismiss them as being crazy. Their lives are just as valid as any straights you hear discussing their wives or girlfriends in bed.
more: http://www.queerty.com/tell-queerty-would-you-take-a-job-that-you-knew-to-be-hostile-to-queers-20090921/#ixzz0fdUfcUYv