CLAY CANE/BET: You got into some controversy last year; a lot of the blogs were blowing you up, when you called a cameraman a fag. Some claimed you were homophobic or didn’t like gay people. What’s your reaction to that?
MIKE EPPS (now starring in Next Day Air): I don’t know where that came from. Nothing towards the community — none of that. I might’ve just said it out of anger; it ain’t nothing personally against the community.
Zakakaka
He looks like a closeted bottom….
BobP
Another one.
getreal
I have actually met the guy he could not have been nicer. Some people are starting to learn that the word fag is offensive even when joking. It is too bad he did not issue a better apology.
adolf
would this same “apology” work if it was a white actor who used n****r/n***a?
Dave
Well when I call a black man a nigger, I’l make sure to say “I might’ve just said it out of anger; it ain’t nothing personally against the community.” and refer to Mr. Epps.
Joey
@Dave: Sure, but then again we don’t wear our homosexuality on our skin, right? And why would you call a black man a nigger? It’s not simply about a black on gay incident, which queerty seems to be really found for some reason, that stirs up some petty uninformed comments. For instance, was the camera man openly gay. Are we forgetting that insult like fag or “gay” is quite widespread in our society and they are more likely a new portmanteau terms for idiocy and flawed character rather than a judgement of one’s sexuality. It’s still bad, really bad, and Epps comment are still bullshit, but then again I fell a lot of us will stray from the real reflexion…
Joey
I think queerty posted something about the use of lgbt epithets.
Mark M
@Dave: EXACTLY. Nigger and Fag are words used, in this context, which dehumanize and say “It’s ok to bash this thing, cuz it ain’t a human”. I hope the nigger ain’t offended that I call him on his shit.
Chris
“Are we forgetting that insult like fag or “gay” is quite widespread in our society and they are more likely a new portmanteau terms for idiocy and flawed character rather than a judgement of one’s sexuality.”
You say this like it makes it any better. In fact, I think it’s worse. Being a fag is so negative you can call ANYONE a fag, even those who aren’t actually gay, to insult them. To act like there are no underlying implications of people using these gay slurs, even when they don’t MEAN it to be about sexuality, is disingenuous.
Michael W.
@Dave: Yeah, but you’ll be saying it to the nurse in your hospital room after you regain consciousness.
TANK
Well **** this ******* ********** and the ************* pile of **** that ******* him up and shove that ***** ****** ** up the ****** of a ******* ************* ****. And another thing, **** his ****** in the *** with a ****. *******!!!!!! Simulate his ***** by ******* a cornish game hen through a pair of ************ gray ******. Fin.
Trey
@Mark M: do you always respond to bigoted and homophobic offenses with racism, or is it only with us brothas?
Who
Eps? Epilady? I don’t even have a clue.
DeAnimator
That’s cool. I’ll just toss around the n word. Ain’t nothin personal, bro.
Sky
Jesus, uptight in your panties much ladies? The man apologized, what the hell else to you want? A damn after school special?
Chris
@Sky: Anyone can apologize for anything. Doesn’t mean anything if they don’t actually understand why what they did was wrong in the first place, especially because they’ll likely do it again.
TANK
@Sky:
seppuku
TANK
@TANK:
Oh that was clever. I’m delighted with myself.
Joey
@Chris: If you’ve read trough you can see I’m in no way saying it’s better, I’m just shifting the analysis toward what you’re saying; fag is the summum of portmanteau epithets.
afrolito
@Dave:
I really wish you would go out and call a black man a nigger to his face…..realy I do. I won’t bother to ask you to report back, as you probably won’t be able too, for some time…if ever.
The man apologized, but of course that’s not good enough for the racist white gays, who look for any excuse to justify their own racism.
TANK
@Joey:
joey, is it SAT time yet? Love the vocab ;).
TANK
@afrolito:
jasmyne cannick jr. has spoken!
Who
Meh. Black men are just trying to act more macho than shit because everyone knows that their Mama’s rule their asses.
Joey
@TANK: Bleeh. I guess the trauma is to fresh. Help me TANK!
@Who: Italians to…I’m Italian. Who! Save me from my mom or I’ll grow a nasty bush on my chest and wear a shit load of gold chains and bracelets…wait, that’s my step uncle Julio…and he’s Brazilian.
sparkle obama
gays, grow up!
quit being fake.
the times are too serious for this kind of tomfoolery.
you need to rise above your own snobbery and lazy , crypto-r*cism.
there is no time for this mess, blanche!
Chitown Kev
First of all guys, the excuse for this type of racism are getting old. Real old. Real fast.
On the matter of Mr. Epps, when I apologize for something, I admit that I have done something wrong to an offended party and I don’t make excuses like “I was mad” or shit like that.
Admit the wrong doing, apologize, and don’t do it again.
Simply to say that “I was mad” or “I’m sorry” means that yes, you are a sorry ass. Sorry for getting called out on your shit.
Quit it with the racism guys. Please.
Dabq
@afrolito: You have that right, the “progressive, I want my civil rights and equality” white gays up in here spew that word so much her and without any regard to the black gay posters here or white ones who abhor racism, they are as vile as Epp’s is. And they wonder why no one can relate or care to them or care about their alleged “issues,” and how homophobia is the same as racism, when they are the biggest racists around and worse than the typical GOP gay basher.
But then again, racism seems to be condoned here, so not a big whoop to see them going off, yet again, and, since they think they are better than anyone else, it will never stop.
Chitown Kev
@Dabq:
Yeah, while I disagree with afrolito that Epps “apologized” (he I totally wish some of these racist queens would run up to even a black drag queen and call them a nigger.
It would be like someting I heard a long time ago in Detroit and in a much, much different context.
“Bitch, I will drop this miss and pick up that mister and beat your motherfucking ass.”
Spewing this shit on the blog is no good and it ain’t like the right wing ain’t watching us. In fact, the right wingers of the Wasilla Witch’s ilk would kill black folks and gays if they had the chance.
So homophobic black folks and racist queens need to shut the fuck up and recognize!
Landon Bryce
@Chitown Kev:
Yeah, but even you’re not fair here: you use the language of hatred (“racist queens”) to refer to gay people but the language of political correctness to refer to “homophobic black folks.” If you’re calling someone else out on their bigotry, shouldn’t you avoid hate speech?
It is very, very rare for someone to criticize racism in the comments on Queerty without including bigotry and hatred directed at gay men in their comments. No one sounds anything other than idiotic when his attack on someone else’s bigotry is peppered with “queens” “fags” and “panties in a twist.” That shit is offensive, bigoted hate speech. People need to knock it the fuck off.
It is bullshit.
But so is this article.
My reaction to seeing this story was, “Queerty is being racist again.” The focus here, the picture– its designed to appeal I was surprised it took until the fourth comment for things to get get explicitly racist there. I find some of the comments from Joey and Afrolito offensive and bigoted, but they came after a great deal of blatant hatred of black men. And Joey’s initial point is the same salient in my opinion: why would any of us use the language of bigotry to refer to each other?
Chitown Kev
@Landon Bryce:
Interesting point Landon, although I wasn’t aware that “queens” would be a deregatory term on a gay blog.
Then again there is that whole masculine/fem thread so I see your point.
Also, I have been known to use some very un-PC language as regards “homophobic black folks” myself, particularly when I see or hear expressions of it. I guess I use because, being African American, I can actually get away with it but I’d have to show you some examples (though I wouldn’t be able to do it here.)
Dabq
@Chitown Kev: Its always good to call out the racists within the gay community, its that little secret that no one wants to talk about since may of the posters here have issues with blacks, gay or straight and have no problem saying so, online of course since most are cowards and there are more than a few on almost any gay site who have as much hate as possible. The same ones who spew the n-word as freely as they want, will be the same ones screeching on how they have no civil rights, can’t get married, can’t do this or that, and, yet, they use the rights of white men and all the privileges that go with that, gay or straight. And, they wonder how the right wing has been able to keep people of color from supporting gay rights, when all they have to do is go to any gay site and see the real deal. Just keeping it real.
And, oddly enough, few ever seem to call out the racists, but let if be some black homophobe and they will go to town down dressing them.
Ousslander
@afrolito: afrolito do u realize hoe racist and homophobic your comment is, by assuming white gays are so weak to be unable to defend themselves, us poor little scared sissy boys. Also the internalized racism by assuming black men are so child like that the only way to respond to a word is with violence.
Call me a fag and i’ll call the you( not u personally) a nigger. Yes i may wind up in the hospital but the other guy may too or dead.
Both words are wrong but sometimes u fight fire with fire.
Chitown Kev
For the record guys, there really is a pretty good discussion to be had here, if folks were willing to have it.
Sadly, I don’t think anyone really wants to.
Trey
@Ousslander: and what would you black gay friends think of your response?
strumpetwindsock
@Ousslander:
…and when you have burned everything down, then what?
Lex
Wow and the racism comes out in force. Couldn’t wait for an excuse to use it huh?
Black gays are expendable once again. Nevermind what we think about it.
Thanks for throwing n-bombs at us, the ones frequenting this site. Thanks for the racism as usual.
So quick to compare yourselves to black people and then turn around and act like the KKK.
Chitown Kev
By the same token, though…
I’m a little surprised that Clay Cane (whose work I really, really like) didn’t call Epps out on this apology (which really isn’t an apology as far as I am concerned).
Most of that I attribute to his being in a somewhat impartial journalistic role, space constraints, and…let’s face it, it IS BET.
Lex
Funny I never see anyone dragging white actors names through the mud when they say fag or make homophobic rants. Especially when they fit the “All-American” mold.
Ousslander
@Trey: If i get into a fight i’m not thinking what any of my friends think. In a fight u pick the words or weapons that would hurt the most, wether u believe or not it’s just to hurt at that moment. Hopefully they know me enough not to be racist, if i was why would i have black friends inthe first place, and that it’s said out of anger to their use of faggot.
Strumpet, what? Unless you are eluding cross burning and saying i’m a klan member.
Chitown Kev
@Ousslander:
That’s not what he’s talking about, I think, I think it’s a vague reference to a scorched earth policy but I’m not sure.
strumpetwindsock
@Ousslander:
Just following on your allusion “fight fire with fire”.
Don’t try to make more of my statement than what it is.
You don’t stop discrimination with more discrimination. That just makes you more like the people who hate you… and the people who like to see us divided and at each others’ throats will laugh and rub their hands together.
Chitown Kev
@strumpetwindsock:
What I would like to know is this…
Do white gays hold black gays responsible for the homophobia in black communities? Or, in other words, do white gays consider us to be enablers of homophobia in black communities?
While I think there would be some truth to that accusation, frankly, I also think white gays don’t necessarily go out and work on homophobia in the communitites they were born and raised in, but instead head to urban centers where there is a “gay community” in a physical since. They suffer from the illusion that they have worked on “white homophobia.”
Trey
@Ousslander: So your anger justifies the use of racial epithets? It sounds as if you subscribe to Mike Epps way of thinking. I can’t speak for your friends, but if I found a member of my homies to be capable of slinging the word, “nigger,” around, i’d have to seriously reexamine our friendship.
strumpetwindsock
@Chitown Kev:
You’re asking the wrong guy…. Canada.
And I’m not in Toronto, Nova Scotia or any place where there is a huge black population, and with the exception of the east coast I think the majority are more recent immigrants from the Caribbean and Africa.
And the situation with our largest non-white group – natives – is quite different. There’s homophobia, but I think there’s also a higher open gay population among natives (but as you say, that may also be among those who have had to come to the city).
I do know people who are out (and some closeted) in the country. On the one hand there are stricter rules, but on the other hand in a small community you have to depend on your neighbours, and sometimes (not always) that results in more tolerance and undertanding.
strumpetwindsock
@strumpetwindsock:
But you’re right. I don’t think whites see themselves as a community in the same way we label others.
We certainly don’t voice or feel the need to take responsibility for our own the way some others do.
Chitown Kev
@strumpetwindsock:
No, I was putting the question out there in general for anyone that wanted to respond.
Chitown Kev
@strumpetwindsock:
But…now it is MY opinion that many African Americans do see whites as a “community.” Never mind that many “whites” only came over here after the Civil War, had discrimination hurled at them as well (and I am thinking of the Irish and the Italians, primarily). “Whites” are no more of a community than “blacks,” really.
Ask a working class African American how he REALLY feels about a “bougie.”
strumpetwindsock
@Chitown Kev:
I’m sure.
The problem is that with whites there’s the assumption that you can’t pin it down to race: from lapland to the caucasus to portugal and through russia you can have people that look the same, but vastly different traditions, beliefs and races.
So I think the assumption from within and without is that it is a dominant culture moreso than a race. So yeah, there are assumptions about whites, but again it’s more cultural.
Non-whites unfortunately get lumped into one, and there’s the assumption that people are all in one group, even though they may be from vastly different cultures.
And of course there are non-whites who are accused of being “white on the inside”. Again, it’s a cultural discrimination.
Or so I assume…I’m just seeing it form the white perspective.
Chitown Kev
@strumpetwindsock:
Oh no, youre right. I’ve been accused of being “really white” on the inside myself.
Or to use another example, Muslims. Arabs have a very different culture from Persians. And when you bring Indonesians into the picture, forget it.
Warrington
Dirty little secret… A lot of white gay men are RACIST! If you can’t refrain from directly or indirectly calling a black man a nigger when he uses a gay epithet, then understand that you are racist and contradict any effort to end hatred in our society.
Tony
Ugh. Both F and N are bad. That said. If a white person called a cameraman a “N” all hell would break loose. It is okay to call a person a “F” in the minds of many.
In all of this race/sexual orientation banter, the most vulnerable members of the LGBT Community get hurt the most. Of those who were murdered as a result of being LGBT, a majority of these people were LGBT people of color. Yes, there is a great deal of homophobia in the African American Community. This means we need to be more supportive of LGBT African Americans. Remember the 11 year old who hung himself?
Queer has no color and those queer people of color need our support, compassion and protection.
Chitown Kev
@Tony:
One the note of the 2 black kids that hung themselves over bullying (and I am not forgetting about the white teenager in Ohio) ther I give the LGBT community a lot more credit for covering that story than I do the AA community.
Tony
@Chitown Kev
I agree. I just think that there needs to be more focus on being supportive to LGBT people of color. I think a lot of the anger that arose from Prop 8 resulted in making LGBT people in the AA Community feel more isolated.
Vulnrable people on the margins have been pushed further from the support that is needed. Racism in the LGBT Community damages the LGBT Community because members of minority groups are also members of the LGBT Community. We need to give support to the most vulnerable members of our community.
For example, HIV infection rates among MSM individuals in the AA and Latino Communities are higher and we need to address this issue, along with a host of other issues impacting our community.
Dabq
@Warrington: Amen, the truth shall set you free and this has to be the best post of this thread!
Chitown Kev
@Tony: @Dabq:
I agree BUT…
We also need to do a much better job of addressing homophobia in our respective ethnic communities. In many instances we remain silent because we feel we will lose their support. And when white LGBT’s attempt to address, sometimes they sat things that are out and out racist, just plain ignorant (which isn’t necessarily racist) or they are accused of being racist.
I have continually asked the question, for example, of where was the black gay community when Marion Barry said all of that cracked out shit? Even in this thread with Clay Cane why did Cane feel that anything less than an admission of Epps that he was wrong suffice?
Ousslander
Strumpet i apologize for my misunderstanding. The above message is response trey.
Trey
@Ousslander: If you can’t see the offensive hypocrisy evident in responding to a gay epithet with a racial one, then there is nothing really to discuss. How would you suggest african-american LGBTs respond to Epps? Endorsing such a base way of defending yourself disregards and marginalizes AAs in the gay community.
strumpetwindsock
@Ousslander:
Gotcha. Thanks
strumpetwindsock
@Warrington:
A dirty BIG secret, actually.
I think we have all got ingrained discrimination (not only whites) to some degree. But it is amazing the things some people can do or say and not see that it is racist.
mb00
@Landon Bryce: SNAP!!! I couldn’t have said it better.
Phil
I’ve never posted a comment before, but I felt the need to say something here.
Regardless of the gay v. black issue (which is huge and complicated and totally not the point here), something seemed startling to me.
The guy never actually apologized for anything. Not even in a perfunctory way. An apology is where you say, “I was wrong, I’m sorry/please forgive me.” Nothing of that anywhere in that statement, unless it was selectively edited, it’s kind of pointless to place the blame on his race. People of every race should be saying, “Whoa, Mike Epps (who hasn’t done anything particularly exciting since Friday After Next), using words like that is not okay.”
But what do I know?
alicia banks
i thank him for apologizing
most black gaybashers are rabid homohaters and never bother to do so:
http://aliciabanks.blogspot.com/
i like him!
thanks clay!
peace
ab
Gay Rights are Universal
Oh lord people, we are all every damn one of us going to heck in a handjob basket, have you read the dumb ass shit you’re saying to each other up this thread?
Inexcusable.
We’re making Mike Epps look good, people.
MAYYYBBEEE it’s good that the white and black folks on here have the opportunity to work out their aggression?
Either way, folks, there’s fucked-up sh*t on all sides here, so stop acting like your community is better than anyone else’s. Cuz it ain’t.
EWE
@afrolito: Do you have a camera on all the commenters of this thread. How do you know everybody is white or gay? Fool. You are such a hypocrite.
EWE
@strumpetwindsock: Unaware of racism? Kinda like when you refer to yourself as “100 percent white” huh? Creep.