Yesterday, the House Armed Services Subcommittee on Military Personnel held a hearing on President Donald Trump’s transgender military ban. The hearing questioned five openly trans military members who opposed the ban and two administrative representatives who defended the ban by comparing trans identity to having a disease, according to Think Progress.
James N. Stewart, the Under Secretary of Defense for Personnel and Readiness, and Vice Admiral Raquel Bono, Director of the Defense Health Agency, both defended the ban as not a ban specifically against trans people but rather a prohibition against people who have gender dysphoria, the feeling that one’s gender identity is different from the gender assigned to them at birth.
Under questioning from various Democrats, Stewart and Bono said trans people shouldn’t be allowed to serve for 12 months after starting hormone replacement therapy, but offered no rationale for why, stating only that “science is shifting” on the issue.
Stewart and Bono also implied trans people are less mentally stable because the military requires transitioning soldiers to schedule extra visits with a behavioral therapist, But a Democratic politician pointed out that since the military requires the extra visits, they shouldn’t be held against trans soldiers as proof of their instability.
Then, the administration’s representatives tried to compare trans surgical procedures to surgeries for people with a disqualifying chronic illnesses, like cancer or heart disease. Think Progress explains:
Stewart and Bono, however, attempted to double down. They claimed that the surgical procedures such a trans person would have experienced are comparable to other disqualifying surgeries, like heart surgery. In other words, they directly compared being a happy, healthy transgender person who is qualified to serve with someone who has a debilitating disease.
On its face, the administration’s justifications makes no sense. They say it’s not a ban against trans people because trans people can serve as long as they don’t have gender dysphoria or try to transition.
But this illogical “reasoning” is similar to justifications for Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell (DADT), the military’s now-defunct ban on openly gay, bi and lesbian servicemembers. When it was first instated in 1994, supporters of the policy said that openly LGB people could serve on the military as long as they didn’t openly express any same-sex attraction: Thus, DADT wasn’t a ban on gay/bi people, they said, just their behavior, which is nonsense.
If that wasn’t bad enough, when asked if a fully transitioned soldier who no longer experienced gender dysphoria could enlist, Stewart said no, proving that this isn’t really about gender dysphoria or healthcare costs at all—it’s just transphobia pure and simple.
The trans military ban affects an estimated 1,320 to 15,000 trans people currently serving in the military, making their employment uncertain.
Brian
It seems like we’re trying to have it both ways when it comes to trans people. With the military we are supposed to treat them like they’re no different than anybody else. Yet we also expect the government to pay for transitioning surgery, because gender dysphoria is a legitimate psychological disorder which results in significant distress if not treated by psychotherapy or transitioning. And we know that their suicide attempt rates are much, much higher than non trans people.
Obviously people at different stages of the process are in very different places mentally, but is the military really supposed to get that specific with each individual to determine which ones are fine and which ones are still in the distressed stage? Aren’t there other medical conditions that result in automatic disqualification, even if you as an individual may be perfectly capable of serving?
If it’s a medical condition, it’s a medical condition. This is how the military treats medical conditions. And I assume it certainly has to be a mindf*ck for a person to come to the realization that they’re transgender and that it takes a lot of time and work for it to get to the point where it’s just another aspect of your personality instead of the thing that dominates your mind and your life. So I certainly don’t think the military should treat it like it’s nothing, even though a lot of people have reached the point where it’s nothing.
flogic
And yet transgender people work real jobs everyday, and raise families, and even save people’s lives. Sometimes their own, defending themselves from bigots and transphobic people. I agree, the military shouldn’t treat it like nothing. They should treat them like the courageous people that they are to face the ignorant assumptions and ramblings of people who think they know better.
And what other qualifications that are medical but leave an individual capable of serving? Because the obvious answer to that is, let them serve if they are in fact capable of serving.
Brian
Just because you think things should be s certain way does not mean that’s how they are. There are a bajillion medical conditions that can disqualify people from military service. It’s an eye opening Google search, that’s for sure.
DCguy
Actually that isn’t having it both ways. Medical insurance pays for operations people need, that’s how it works, not really sure why trans people getting a surgery is a problem. The government doctors in the military are salaried, they would be treating them if they had any other medical issue. Frankly I have much less of a problem of my tax dollars paying for a surgery for somebody working for the country, then paying over 1 trillion dollars for a fighter jet the Pentagon didn’t ask for and is being outflown by our current planes.
prosen8966
It appears as if the present administration is suffering from Rectal Foreign Body syndrome and thus will likely have to undergo a Sigmoidoscopy in order to get that fixed.
Many members of the LGBTQ community were at one stage or another considered to have some sort of psychological disorder rather than simply non-straight individuals and only time will allow this phase to pass by.
And a more specific response to Brian, for example, would be that while gender dysmorphia is a subset of the transgender community, it does not follow that all trans members are suffering from an identity crisis.
The administration, if it were not so homophobic, might realize that instead of issuing a ban, they should treat trans individuals the same as they treat all other members of the military. Everybody has to pass a mental stability test in order to serve in our armed forces: if a small group of trans individuals do not feel stable as a result of gender dysmorphia, that will come out during this process. If people in general, after joining the armed forces, appear to be acting in an odd manner that could result in harm to themselves or others, they can again see a therapist to ensure that they are not suffering from effects from hormone therapy or GD.
It isn’t a problem in the trans community; it’s a problem in the administration where the VP considers homosexuals to be “diseased” individuals and believes in camps that “cure” a person from swerving away from the straight heterosexual lifestyle.
In my humble opinion.
Brian
“If people in general, after joining the armed forces, appear to be acting in an odd manner that could result in harm to themselves or others, they can again see a therapist to ensure that they are not suffering from effects from hormone therapy or GD”
Yeah, I’m sure that would work out great in the military. What could go wrong with that concept with all of those weapons around?
Catholicslutbox
And yet there are still several trans that support the trump administration……………..
prosen8966
There are also (to my surprise and horror) supporters of Trump who are: Black, Muslim, some part of the LGBTQ community [not just a few trans individuals], women, individuals from military families, possibly a tiny amount of Mexican-Americans. Jews. (Stephen Miller puts together the most repulsive policies that Trump follows. I find it embarrassing to have anything in common with that hideous toad.)
It doesn’t seem to matter that Trump has, at (more) than one point, spit upon every single one of these groups. He disparaged Sen. John McCain, who bravely fought for America and suffered for five years in a POW camp (even after he was given the opportunity to leave earlier, bc of his relatives). I was always going to vote for Pres. Obama, but a normal, decent human being HAS TO respect what McCain went through during his military years (as well as his public service) & Trump literally laughed at the mention of McCain being a “hero”.
For some people, certain issues — perhaps the economy, abortion, something — are more important than character or basic decency. Or, TBH, a general understanding of the actual job.
These people are unlikely to change their minds re Trump bc he showed just how horrible he was PRIOR to the general election and yet still close to half of the country voted for the man.
To win in 2020, we need to pick up the millennials, the people who didn’t bother to vote, the moderates who (should be) appalled at what has happened to the Constitution, & anybody who still cares that America is supposed to be a melting pot of diverse people and races to come to in their time and need.
Otherwise, I expect a stampede towards Canada. For real.
Brian
Still better than Hillary.
DCguy
@Brian
What a shock, a Trump troll doesn’t like Transpeople.
Thad
Health care for trans people costs less than health care for diabetics. Yet nobody suggests drumming diabetics out of the services.
And even Caitlyn isn’t supporting Trump on this.
truthseeker
@Thad
If you’re diagnosed with diabetes, you aren’t allowed to enlist. Same with many other issues such as asthma, depression, etc. You won’t even be accepted into service if you have bad credit, certain tattoos, or a past arrest.
Trans people suffer from high levels of depression and are required to take a multitude of anti-depressants and drugs that create hormonal imbalances. Male-to-female individuals also must insert a thick medical shaft into their surgically created vagina most of the day to prevent it from closing.
Someone that has that many existing circumstances, doesn’t need to add the trauma of war on top of it. Many soldiers cannot adjust to civilian life and take their own lives. Throwing trans people into that situation just makes matters worse
A person battling internal issues, depression, and hormonal imbalances shouldn’t be on the battlefield making life or death decisions in regards to saving their fellow officers and killing enemies in cold blood.
flogic
@truthseeker
Nice name as you open with lies and misinformation. There are trans people suffer from depression, and it is known why and it does not require a multitude of antidepressants. Stop making things up as you go. Those who have depression are typically suffering from a situation depression related to awful treatment by family and friends. Once resolved the rate of depression is no different than anyone else.
It is obvious that you are assuming all transgender people transition fully, and are male to female. Yes a few male to female transitioners who elect to have gender confirmation surgery need to dilate after surgery, as there is a period that a few times a day dilation needs to be done (typically during a bathroom break.) Where do you come up with this “thick medical shaft” needing to be inserted into their vagina that is required “most of the day” misinformation coming from?
Also where is your proof that throwing trans people into a war situation makes matters worse? It is just as likely that the trauma they’ve lived their whole lives with makes war stress simply more bearable. I know it did for me, but understand that is anecdotal evidence albeit based on an actual life not conjured up hypotheticals.
There are soldiers facing divorce, adultery, guilt for their own adultery, drinking problems, a great variety of documented depression, and YES even hormonal imbalances everyday, even on battlefields. If you think every soldier out there is in tip top mental shape, you obviously have never served in the military let alone done so during a war.
I believe I just F’d your logic up. You simply repackaged the tired and bigoted arguments that were used to segregate troops, prevent LGB members from serving openly, and to limit women’s roles in the military.
We don’t need you protecting us from your fears and fake scenarios, and neither do our fellow soldiers, airmen, sailors, and Marines who serve with us. They’re some tough MFers, and know who has their back and who doesn’t. It has never depended on what was between their legs or who’s legs they got between back home.
truthseeker
@flogic
No lies or misinformation in my post. You have a nice name as well with it being “flogic” (sounds like “F*** Logic) which summarizes your post considering it’s riddled with huge assumptions about me and my post.
When you say, “There are trans people suffer from depression, and it is known why and it does not require a multitude of antidepressants. Stop making things up as you go”, that is false. It is not definitively known why the depression is caused because there are next to no studies that investigate that issue with adults but my post is not meant to tackle the WHY in the depression but merely point out that it exists and that the military regards clinically diagnosed depression as a disqualification from enlisting. According to the ADAA, 6.7% of the general US population suffers from depression whereas nearly 50% of transgender individuals suffer from clinical depression and are treated medically. Lastly, another study on young adult transgender women from JAMA found that they are up to 3.6 times greater to have psychiatric disorders and have substance abuse dependence. Nothing I stated prior is “made up as I go” and is backed by the studies out there.
Then you allege, “It is obvious that you are assuming all transgender people transition fully, and are male to female.” I never said that either. There are some who take hormones and some who opt for the full surgery to anatomically become a woman. Then you strangely state, “Where do you come up with this ‘thick medical shaft’ needing to be inserted into their vagina” but right before state that these individuals must dialte. A thick medical shaft is a dilator. It’s a shaft made of hard plastic and provided by healthcare professionals and they increase in thickness over time. If someone enlists in the service and MUST dilate 3 times a day, they would automatically be disqualified to enlist because on the battlefield, there aren’t dilation breaks.
Third, you quip, “Also where is your proof that throwing trans people into a war situation makes matters worse? It is just as likely that the trauma they’ve lived their whole lives with makes war stress simply more bearable”. Your reasoning makes no sense and never has a clinical psychologist dictated that to combat depression in clinically diagnosed individuals that we should treat their depression by throwing them into a life-or-death war scenario. That is why the military prohibits enlistment of clinically depressed individuals.
Currently, 20 veterans a day commit suicide because they cannot cope with the horrors of war and they account for 14% of all adult suicides as compared to the national average of 8%. If you think putting transgender individuals, many of which suffer from clinical depression and some who take hormonal drugs along with psychiatric medication, in a war scenario will make the stress of war more bearable and not lead to more mental health issues for them, then I question whether you’ve actually served in war when enlisted.
Lastly, you claim “You simply repackaged the tired and bigoted arguments that were used to segregate troops, prevent LGB members from serving openly, and to limit women’s roles in the military.” That is also blatantly false. I’m okay with gays serving in the military, I’m okay with women serving in the military. When you resort to name calling (“something something you’re a bigot”), it shows you just base your response on emotion and not logical facts.
Polaro
As long as the person is capable of doing the job, there is no valid excuse for denying them the job. Each trans person should be evaluated individually, just like any other soldier. I’m not sold on this current full embrace of transgender sex change, but as far as letting people do a job they can do, my thoughts on how they live their life is irrelevant.
MuslimSlutBox
Only Rosie O’Donnell. Or maybe Cher.
MuslimSlutBox
Flogic and truthseeker. Get a room.
QueerTruth
The title is click bait and that’s not ok.
They are comparing gender reassignment surgery to other major, in this case, disqualifying surgeries to be in the military.
They are not comparing trans-people to a disease.
This may be wrong as well. I do not know since I’m not a doctor…. Regardless, it is a huge difference. And Q editors know that.