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  ON THE DEFENSIVE

Dharun Ravi On 20/20: “I Wasn’t The One Who Caused Him To Jump Off The Bridge”

Its kind of ironic that Dharun Ravi is making his first post-conviction TV appearance on ABC’s 20/20 tonight. Hindsight—the kind of vision that would’ve enabled Ravi to know where his actions would lead—is 20/20, after all.

But if you expect the former Rutgers student, who faces up to ten years in jail, to be contrite in his interview with co-anchor Chris Cuomo, you might be left hanging. About as close as we get to a mea culpa is when Ravi says, “even though I wasn’t the one who caused him to jump off the bridge, I did do things wrong and I was stupid about a lot of stuff.”

Wow, don’t crucify yourself, son!

Citing evidence brought forth in the trial that the public has never seen—include a suicide note whose contents have never been shared—Ravi sounds confident that he’s not to blame for his roommate’s death:

“The more and more I found out, it would be kind of obnoxious of me to think that I could have this profound effect on him. After all this time—and reading his conversations and how and what he was doing before—I really don’t think he cared at all. I feel like I was an insignificant part to his life. That’s giving me comfort now.

The fact that we weren’t allowed to read [the note], that they said it didn’t have anything to do with this, gave me comfort also—because I figured if it has nothing to do with me… it must have been something else that was going on. He didn’t even care about this… He had bigger problems in his life”

Can we ever know exactly how Clementi felt about being violated in such a cruel way? No.

Did Ravi get railroaded by a society desperate for an easy explanation for an unfathomable tragedy? Probably.

Is Ravi an idiot and an asshat for deflecting blame so coolly and casually—and suggesting his roommate was a basketcase? You betcha!

In the full interview, Ravi discusses the apology he texted Tyler and why he didn’t take a proposed plea bargain. He also suggests his imprisonment would set back the gay-rights movement:

“The people that are fighting for gay rights, they have a just cause. I think this kind of detracts from their cause. This is something people can point to and say, ‘You guys are going overboard.’ I think it’s bad for them.”

It’s like, we want to feel sorry for this kid whose life is essentially ruined now but he’s such a dick it’s darn near impossible.

By:           Dan Avery
On:           Mar 23, 2012
Tagged: , , , ,

  • 141 Comments
    • dvlaries
      dvlaries

      Somewhere, Halderman and Erlichman are smiling. Their ‘limited hangout’ is alive and well.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 7:17 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Steve
      Steve

      When Ravi says, “I wasn’t the one who caused him to jump off the bridge”, he is quite wrong. Social rejection, including bullying, are a principle contributing factor to youth suicide. It is very likely that Clementi had received social rejection and bullying from other people, the rejection and bullying by Ravi, was clearly the last straw.

      For more information, read http://www.youth-suicide.com/gay-bisexual/index.htm

      The one who strikes the match is responsible for the fire, even if the house was already wet with gasoline.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 8:03 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jon
      Jon

      Well, in all fairness, Cuomo pitched Ravi one softball after another. It was like he was the self-appointed defense attorney. At least in the snippet quoted above, it sounded like the two of them agreed that Tyler Clementi was somehow expendable, and needed to just “become a man,” whatever that means, or take the consequences. I blame 20/20 just as much as Dharun Ravi for the self-righteous and inappropriate tone of the whole interview.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 8:22 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Mrs. Robinson
      Mrs. Robinson

      He doesn’t deserve 10 years in prison but he does deserve to be deported back to his home country. Case closed. Move on.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 8:27 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Spike
      Spike

      If he believed himself to be innocent, why didn’t he take the witness stand to defend his actions? Yet now he is defending himself on TV.

      What he did wasn’t stupid, it was cruel and done with no conscience or regret. Hope he enjoys prison.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 8:46 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • AdamA
      AdamA

      If he weren’t a sociopath, his life would have been ruined the day Tyler killed himself. It’s clear he’s not been too hard on himself about this, so why is anybody supposed to be upset that the jury was?

      Mar 23, 2012 at 9:33 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Caleb
      Caleb

      This guy is the biggest douchebag EVER. He just needs to shut the hell up and go back to his own country.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 9:35 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Clockwork
      Clockwork

      @Mrs. Robinson:
      Deportation would be a fair sentence, justice for the incident, and bring closure.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 9:46 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Delius
      Delius

      Dan Avery…do you think the people who killed Matthew Shepherd need your sympathy, too?

      Mr. Ravi will certainly only get a couple of years in prison.
      At least he still has a life.

      Attitudes like yours are similar to Jews feeling sorry for Hilter.

      People like you make me sick.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 10:04 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Andrew
      Andrew

      This exercise is damage-control rather looks like something that might come back to haunt this young man. The level of questioning was asinine and clearly aimed to spoon-feed him easy denials. By the end of the interview he is actually presenting himself as the victim. If he was “self-absorbed” then, he is no less so now. I think that, in sentencing, a judge might appropriately use this interview as evidence of lack of remorse and hand down a more severe sentence than he otherwise might.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 10:04 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • velocifero
      velocifero

      He is obviously a sociopath and instead of prison needs to be locked in a mental institution. He bullied Tyker and no liberal or PC justification can white wash that. Again, if he had done this to a FEMALE dorm resident and she had committed suicide, then the media would turn him into a monster. But no, the whole media story is trying to now blame Tyler. It’s the old blame the rape victim or now blame Trayvon Williams excuse.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 10:09 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Phil
      Phil

      He’s strange. Gives me a bad vibe.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 10:17 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Hephaestion
      Hephaestion

      Please deport this moron to India and ban him from America forever.

      He did cause Tyler to kill himself. He is such a spoiled brat he will never accept responsibility for what he did.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 10:17 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • MEJ
      MEJ

      20/20 has a history of blaming gay victims, and defending their killers. Just watch Elizabeth Varga’s hit piece on Matthew Shepherd for evidence.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 10:18 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Adrian
      Adrian

      well,there you have it. he said he didn’t do the things the jury found him guilty of. so he must be telling the truth. Tyler, would you like to tell your side of the story? oh, that’s right, you can’t because you jumped off a bridge!

      Suicide is sooooo not cool kids!

      Mar 23, 2012 at 10:22 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • cgd
      cgd

      http://tinyurl.com/NYerTyler

      Clementi wrote, “other people have commented on his profile with things like ‘how did you manage to go back in there?’ ‘are you ok.’ ” The friends were treating “my making out with a guy as the scandal whereas i mean come on . . . he was SPYING ON ME. . . . do they see nothing wrong with this?”

      At quarter to five, he asked for advice on Yahoo Answers. Someone identified as Jennifer replied, “Report him. What he is doing is completely inappropriate.” She added, “I’m not trying to be mean but if you don’t have the guts to take control of the situation it is not going to get better.”

      Clementi weighed his dilemma. It was nearly dawn when he wrote, “I’m just not a great self advocate and am afraid that if I go to the wrong party, I won’t get the help I need.” He went on, “I’m just worried about things becoming a huge mess after this cuz i mean, someone reports you and then you might have to spend the rest of the semester living with them anyway because of stupid administration and then there’s the chance I could get a new roommate that’s even worse. ”

      Mar 23, 2012 at 10:32 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Robert in NYC
      Robert in NYC

      Under immigration law, crimes of moral turpitude which this probably is, are subject to a permanent resident losing his or her status or application. I think deportation would seem reasonable.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 10:51 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • MKisNE
      MKisNE

      Too bad he’s yesterday’s news, after going to trial to try to become famous, and losing, he’s not even famous anymore.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 11:12 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Ogre Magi
      Ogre Magi

      he is like an evil version of Abed from community!

      Mar 23, 2012 at 11:13 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • DouggSeven
      DouggSeven

      Ravi is guilty of invasion of privacy and being a bully, but not murder of any degree. People like Clamenti are bullied everyday in similar incidents and don’t kill themselves. The only people responsible for suicide are the people themselves who make that dumb decision. Clearly, Clamenti was not a strong or mentally well individual. Ravi does deserve to be deported.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 11:15 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Joetx
      Joetx

      Deportation alone isn’t a just punishment. I would think his family has money, otherwise he wouldn’t have been able to go to college in the U.S. As such, to just deport him would allow him to return to a cushy life in India.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 11:57 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • DouggSeven
      DouggSeven

      @Joetx: I’m curious what you think his punnishment should be then? He didn’t murder the guy. And have you been to India? The place is a dump. There’s a reason why he and millions more try to escape that hole.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 12:11 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Larry
      Larry

      he really is one arrogant SOB and his own worst enemy

      Mar 23, 2012 at 12:27 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CJ
      CJ

      He needs a few years in jail and then he needs to be deported back to his country without the possibility of returning to the US.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 12:29 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • T
      T

      Ravi by himself didn’t cause Tyler to kill himself. He was the last straw in a long, long line of people who bullied Tyler into a place where suicide seemed to be the only escape. By placing the blame on Ravi, the rest of society can pat itself on the back and return to their lives, feeling smug satisfaction that ‘we got the bad guy.’ Ravi definitely screwed up, but placing all the blame on him takes the focus off all the people who bullied Tyler in the past. In my mind, they’re just as guilty.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 12:43 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      Doesn’t seem like he has any remorse whatsoever. He doesn’t think what he did was cruel, nor does he believe it was a crime. You’re right, Queerty. He’s a total dick. Hope they throw the book at him.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 1:20 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jersey
      Jersey

      Jeez I was of the thought that he was being railroaded, after watching that I hope he gets the full 10 years. What a horrid person he is.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 1:25 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      I just watched again. Clearly a sociopath. Lock him up and throw away the key.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 1:29 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • cwm
      cwm

      On another thread, I wrote how it seemed Ravi was trying to appear contrite (though doing a poor job of it), because he or his attorney thought it would help him with sentencing.

      No. This isn’t merely failing to appear appropriately chastened. Ravi is even more of a self-absorbed asshole than I’d thought.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 1:34 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • grizz
      grizz

      I know i don’t want to hear this douching loser’s voice, so I WON”T be tuning in.
      He can get sent back to India, or wherever, and beg on the streets for all I care.
      DEPORT NOW!

      Mar 23, 2012 at 1:36 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Mike
      Mike

      @Spike-Because in a trial where you’re the one on trial you never take the stand, especially not in your own trial. Ask any lawyer and they’ll tell you the exact same thing.

      I haven’t watched the clip I am in a good mood today and I don’t want to spoil it.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 1:37 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jersey
      Jersey

      Put him in a cell with that Zimmerman asshole.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 1:38 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Adam
      Adam

      Did he really claim that he didn’t orchestrate that online viewing of his roommate having sex? I was on the side of, “Suicide isn’t caused by one factor” blah blah blah, but if he isn’t even willing to own what he did…

      Mar 23, 2012 at 1:52 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • disco lives
      disco lives

      It’s unbelievable to see Baby-Bro-Cuomo giving such a sympathetic softball interview to this convicted felon creep.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 2:00 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @disco lives: I think Cuomo might be in the “we railroaded him” camp. I’m sorry, but no. Perhaps this is an isolated case in a much bigger narrative, but still. He did what he did, is showing no remorse, and now he will pay for it.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 2:06 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B
      B

      No. 5 · Spike wrote, “If he believed himself to be innocent, why didn’t he take the witness stand to defend his actions? Yet now he is defending himself on TV.”

      Well, first, his attorney probably told him not to testify. One reason is that it would give the prosecutor a chance to cross examine him, and all the factual information he could supply might already have been provided by him in the tape of the police interview that the jury was shown. The prosecutor can’t cross examine a video tape.

      Second, just go through readers’ reactions in this comment section and ask if testifying would have endeared him to the jury.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 2:08 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • cwm
      cwm

      @Adam: Yeah, so when Ravi wrote the message (the one we’ve all seen by now), “It’s happening again,” he was referring to…what?

      The 20/20 interviewer should also have asked whether Ravi believes he was framed for the evidence tampering charges. They could’ve both embarrassed themselves even further.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 2:11 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Ben Johnson
      Ben Johnson

      Really? When you get to jail for the next ten years you will be someone chew toy.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 2:22 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Johnny Q. Doe
      Johnny Q. Doe

      @Spike: Not testifying on your behalf isn’t a sign of weakness. It’s part of a legal defense strategy. It has nothing to do with innocent or guilt, nor personal feelings of blame.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 2:37 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Xerxes
      Xerxes

      Total asshole schmuck.
      He will only end up serving one or two years, even if sentenced to 10, because of time off for good behavior and the crowded jail early release policies.
      He could have told the jury all of this also (if true) but his team probably felt that there was no way he could be ever seen by any jury as being a decent human being.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 3:17 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Giovannidude
      Giovannidude

      Ravi destroyed what little is left of his reputation by doing the 20/20 interview, because even the people who were grasping for straws to defend him puked after watching it. Ravi shamed and embarrassed the “he was railroaded” crowd, because Ravi himself has no shame.

      But 20/20 may have embarrassed itself even worse; the show’s anti-gay bias was on full display. Low-suds homophobia is just as disgusting to me as the biggest bully.

      Maybe Ravi can get a personality transplant, and try to repair his reputation on one of the softball morning shows. Or use someone who’s human as an impersonator.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 3:53 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Amanda D
      Amanda D

      God he’s creppy as f##k!

      Mar 23, 2012 at 5:45 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Vijay
      Vijay

      Blaming Ravi is waste of time. Blame Rick Perry! Blame Rick Santorum! Blame the religious right! Let the law prosecute Ravi if there is enough evidence.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 6:22 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • jason
      jason

      I think Ravi comes across as if he’s in denial about the consequences of his actions. Of course, he didn’t physically push Tyler off a bridge. However, he should have known better than to act in the way he did. I don’t see much remorse there, frankly.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 6:57 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B
      B

      No. 33 · Adam wrote, “Did he really claim that he didn’t orchestrate that online viewing of his roommate having sex?”

      He claimed many accusations in the press were false – he didn’t record anything and didn’t post a (recorded) video. Unless you consider a kiss to be having sex, his web cam did not show anyone having sex either. His so called viewing party was scheduled for Sept 21, but did not occur. He claimed afterwards that it was a joke, but with Tyler having shut off the computer, no sexual activity would have been viewable regardless. If there was any hard evidence of a viewing party (e.g., network traffic data showing connection requests), it was not covered by the press.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 7:04 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • David Ehrenstein
      David Ehrenstein

      A Towleroad poster named Dynex5 made the following observation:

      “The most fascinating and tragic thing regarding every story that involved a gay individual targeted by way of homophobia is somehow, someway it is ALWAYS twisted into blaimg the gay, and justifying the homophobic actions of the accuser.
      *Matthew Shepard’s senseless killing was spun into him being a druggie who was coming on to his accusers (false, and confirmed as a false speculation by the investigators, but that sure didn’t stop the homophobes)
      *Larry King child shot in the back of his head after relentless bullying in school. He was painted as over the top, obnoxious, coming on to his cold blood killer and making the killer feel uncomfortable (false, and a twisted spin on the facts)
      *Tyler Clementi painted as some mentally disturbed, nutcase who was going to commit suicide either way, and his killer was simply a fun loving kid just having fun, being a kid, and Tyler was weak and couldn’t handle a prank. Even though his roomate made his discomfort with gays obvious
      Notice a pattern with EVERY single high profile tragic case involving the death of a gay person? by the end of the twisting and spinning, the homophobe is the victim and the gay person “had it coming”

      Mar 23, 2012 at 7:06 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • TJ
      TJ

      Duh-Ruin continues to lie. Evidence was presented that showed how he did this. He didn’t realize computer actions leave a trace, yet he claimed to be so smart. He was offered a plea bargin and didn’t take it. He was so arrogant to think he could get away with it, and now its going to cost him. Since he is a first time offender, he won’t get 10 years, maybe 2 or 3. Deport him back to India, and he can set up all the webcams he wants, no one over there will care.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 7:08 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Auntie Mame
      Auntie Mame

      Dan White executed Harvey Milk and only served 5 years out of a measly 7 year sentence. And people seriously think this guy is going to do jail time? He’s out in less than a year. I guarantee it. Best solution – deport his spoiled fat ass back to India.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 7:45 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      I couldn’t help it. I blogged it.
      http://soyouwanttobealesbian.blogspot.com/2012/03/dharun-ravi-rightfully-convicted-or.html

      Mar 23, 2012 at 8:16 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • DouggSeven
      DouggSeven

      @David Ehrenstein: In most cases where voilence is involved, someone usually is mentally unstable – regardless of sexual orientation. I fail to see your analogy of homophobia links anything you said to the media’s spin. If anything, the media is usually more sensative in cases involving gay people.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 8:33 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B
      B

      No. 46 · David Ehrenstein …. It’s worth mentioning that Tyler Clementi left a suicide note, the contents of which have not been revealed. In the interview, Ravi thought it was not revealed because it had nothing to do with his case and took that as an indication that he was not a cause (at least, not a significant cause) of the suicide.

      That’s certainly a possibility, however there is another one. Ravi was not charged with contributing to a suicide, but rather a privacy violation under circumstances where that is criminal, “bias intimidation” and evidence/witness tampering. If the suicide note put a significant level of blame on Ravi (whether fairly or not), releasing it could have prejudiced the jury.

      Given that the note has not been made public, I think the responsible thing to do is to not speculate one way or another as to what the cause actually was. That includes both not blaming Ravi for Tyler’s death and not declaring him blameless. It also includes not disparaging Tyler Clementi.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 11:09 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Paul1964
      Paul1964

      After just watching the entire 20/20, and yes Ravi is a self-absorbed dick without a shred of contrition or guilt.
      But, frankly I was more appalled at the blatant bias by Chris Cuomo – that had to be one of the WORST interviews I’ve ever seen. Not a single follow up question, not a single pressing question – WTF is the deal with that? Why didn’t he just say, “I got your back on this one dude.” It’s over – he’s guilty. Let’s see what the judge does on May 21st. A year in prison and deport his ass.

      Mar 23, 2012 at 11:10 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rockery
      Rockery

      Chris is looking good. This Ravi guy is acting very shady, someone should ask him what DID he do then..

      Mar 23, 2012 at 11:17 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Paul
      Paul

      “It’s like, we *want* to feel sorry for this kid whose life is essentially ruined now but he’s such a dick it’s darn near impossible.”

      Queerty, you just took the words right out of my mouth.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 12:13 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • 1equalityUSA
      1equalityUSA

      His eyes gravitate to the right when he answers, scheming. Blinking a lot, lying.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 12:35 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Sandra
      Sandra

      As parents our job is to prepare our children for the harsh and sometimes brutal world. We spend their childhood & adolescences teaching them everything from manners, to communication to the very life skills they will need to succeed in the world on a somewhat independent level. 

      So how is it that Tyler Clementi’s parents FAILED when preparing their son to deal with the pressures of college, peer bullying, or self esteem. When Tyler could not deal with the emotions or fears from being “outted” he did the unthinkable, and ended his life. 

      Suffering as a somewhat closeted college student discovering his own sexuality & independence, Tyler gave into the unbearable depression and shame which must have been repressed for the majority of his teenage years. 

      On several accounts, Tyler expressed his mothers rejection and disgust with his coming out, the fact her son was gay brought her tremendous stress. 
      (Clementi said in an instant message to a friend that his mother had “basically completely rejected” him. In later interviews, Clementi’s mother explained that she had been deeply disappointed to realize that he would not marry a woman and have children, as well as by his not having told her earlier that he was gay, and that she had been taken aback by his expressions of sadness over his perception that he had difficulty making friends and over his uncertainty about religion)

      Not only was Tyler not taught self esteem or how to deal with the stress of the real world, he was rejected from his own mother. The same mother who is confident the jury convicted the right person of the hate crimes which lead his lost young man to his death. 

      Care what your college peers think? 
      Or the rejection from your mother? Which pushed him to the point which he could not return. 

      Someone to take the fall for the lack of a support system or life skills that the Clementi’s neglected to instill in the very person who needed it the most. It’s clear that the hate crimes started with the very person who was suppose to be protecting Tyler Clementi. 

      These hate crimes started at home. 

      Mar 24, 2012 at 12:35 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • the crustybastard
      the crustybastard

      I wasn’t sure ANY lawyer could have been stupid enough to advise this sociopath to roll the dice at trial rather than taking that cakewalk plea.

      And now I’m sure there isn’t ANY lawyer who could have convinced this sociopath there was some chance he might not walk out of a courtroom utterly vindicated.

      Ravi’s convinced he had almost nothing to do with Clementi’s death. Moreover, he now thinks HE’S the one being persecuted by gays.

      He’s dangerously crazy. The jail time he’s going to serve is going to justify his next victim.

      And I would add my voice to the chorus saying Chris Cuomo is staggeringly incompetent. Good lord. That was a painful reminder of why I cannot watch TV “journalism.”

      Mar 24, 2012 at 1:09 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B
      B

      No. 56 · Sandra wrote, “So how is it that Tyler Clementi’s parents FAILED when preparing their son to deal with the pressures of college, peer bullying, or self esteem. When Tyler could not deal with the emotions or fears from being “outted” he did the unthinkable, and ended his life.”

      He was not outed – he was already out to the point of telling his parents and wanting the room for a few hours to be with his new boyfriend. That is not the behavior of a closet case.

      He might have come out to his parents sooner if it wasn’t for the anti-gay drumbeat you get from certain elements in U.S. society. Those elements deserve some of the blame. Also, you can’t really blame his parents for not “preparing” him for whatever additional pressure he might have felt due to being gay. They didn’t know until he was about to leave home.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 1:09 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Sandra
      Sandra

      His father had accepted him. His mother rejected him- those are his exact words. He was very apparently gay even as a younger teenager, his parents may have denied it- but they knew. Instead of unconditional lovd and support— SHE REJECTED HIM. Yet she’s somehow completely off the hook.

      College students have forever tried to catch their room mate having sex via webcams, heck it was even in American pie. Even with straight sex- this is college.

      Had Tyler had a support system, and a mother who supported him and loved him, maybe hos choices would have been different.
      It’s in fair to place all the blame on Ravi, a young college student. That clearly DID NOT hate gays. When someone hates gays they use slang terms to degrade or express disgust. Ravi never expressed such views at all. Who did?….Tyler’s mother.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 1:23 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Just being real
      Just being real

      Sandra Tyler’s mom didn’t reject him. She was just shocked or maybe surprised when he came out. One of her other sons is gay and she has accepted him fine.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 1:29 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Sandra
      Sandra

      Tyler Clementi’s parents, Jane and Joseph Clementi, established the Tyler Clementi Foundation, which focuses on promoting acceptance of LGBT teens and others marginalized by society, providing education against all forms of bullying including cyber bullying over the internet and promoting research and development into the causes and prevention of teenage suicide. -wiki & other sources

      How about a foundation which teaches parents the signs that your child is different? Or how to speak to your children openly about sexual orientation. Or maybe even how to love your children even if they are gay Abd you don’t approve.

      Besides all that- a suicide note posted on Facebook, I think clearly shows how misguided our communication with eachother really is.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 1:30 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Sandra
      Sandra

      Being rejected was Tyler’s exact words regarding coming out to his mother.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 1:34 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Sandra
      Sandra

      And what about this older guy, who’s been described as old & creepy— when Tyler was vulnerable this guy is there for a quick hook up.

      How can one person (Ravi) be held responsible for ones persons decision to end his life- its clear Tyler did not have family support, and could have been taken advantage of in a time of need. Maybe he needed a friend to support or listen not some older creep to take advantage of him. The problem
      Is, well never know because the ONLY focus has been on Ravi, a young college student. The parents, this older creep all played a role AS WELL.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 1:37 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B
      B

      No. 57 · the crustybastard wrote, “Ravi’s convinced he had almost nothing to do with Clementi’s death. Moreover, he now thinks HE’S the one being persecuted by gays. He’s dangerously crazy.”

      He actually said he thought his roommate was mostly ignoring him (or something like that) and that a lot of misinformation about him was appearing in the press. Some of that is true – reports that he recorded a video of sexual activity, for example, which never happened. Similarly, “broadcasted” is simply the wrong word to use in describing what he did. He wasn’t being “persecuted by gays” but rather he was subject to the same sort of sloppy reporting that occurs in any number of cases.

      The level of responsibility he has for a death is not clear – there is a suicide note and it has not been made public. Ravi hasn’t seen it. Possibly the only people who have a right to see it beside the D.A. are members of Tyler Clementi’s family. If they choose not to divulge it for whatever reason, that’s their decision.

      Ravi thought that the fact that he was not allowed to see the note was an indication that he had little to do with the suicide. Whether he’s right or wrong about that, it is not surprising that he would react that way – a lot of people would grasp at straws rather than blame themselves for a death, whether they were objectively responsible or not.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 1:38 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Sandra
      Sandra

      The male in question that was with Tyler that night, somehow gets to she anonymous, that’s not odd to anyone?

      He said he met Clementi on “a social networking site for gay men,” and hoped to see him again after their second date at Clementi’s dorm, but “as far as whether I intended to see him there again, I felt a little uneasy about it.”

      Most likely a closet, married older men- carries such shame and falseness it can be depressing to be the subject of another gay mans disgust for hos own sexual orientation. But again well never know, just like the sucide note because like everything in this case- it was shrouded in bias and hate towards Ravi. Instead of looking at the whole picture. The gay community found a target and narrowed in refuses to see, the family contributed, ananonyous sex w. strangers from online dating can be debitrimental & depressing.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 1:45 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • cwm
      cwm

      Portraying M.B. as a child molester, partly by describing Tyler Clementi (an adult) as if he were an infant.

      Just when you thought this homophobic type of “logic” had been dead and buried for decades: here it comes again.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 2:48 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • cwm
      cwm

      @the crustybastard:

      …he now thinks HE’S the one being persecuted by gays.

      If a prosecutor were gay, that’d probably be grounds for a mistrial. Anyone openly gay on the jury pool? They’d have been dismissed “for cause,” i.e. the defense wouldn’t have to use up any of their peremptory challenges.

      I might have been ready to excuse Ravi for feeling persecuted; he was the defendant in a nationally prominent criminal trial.

      But it is unsettling: his complete lack of any misgivings.

      After a friend took his own life, I struggled with survivor’s guilt. Despite having had no reason to feel responsible. He’d chosen to leave the country; I couldn’t possibly have been alert for signs. And his final note expressed love and gratitude toward me. Even so, it was difficult not to feel I should have helped him somehow.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 3:13 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • jar137
      jar137

      Shame on Chris Cuomo and 20/20. This biased report in which Rhavi was not challenged on any of the facts or his statements- hell, Cuomo didn’t even ask him why he didn’t testify- reinforces the painful fact that in America certain people are less valued than others. (Just as the recent incident in Florida attests.) Cuomo’s complicity in Rhavi’s weak excuses and his promotion of the false notion that Rhavi was somehow maliciously prosecuted only serves to promote the kind of behavior (invasion of privacy, bias-based harassment) that Tyler Clementi was forced to endure. I am livid and saddened at this yellow journalism.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 3:59 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • jar137
      jar137

      cwm- a prosecutor’s sexual orientation would never be a ground for mistrial. Similarly, a prospective juror cannot be excused for cause on the basis of their sexual orientation. I assume you are not a lawyer. Your understanding of trial practice is inaccurate. Prospective gay jurors may have been excused peremptorily, but not if the judge would have entertained a Batson challenge (the US Supreme Court has ruled that venirepersons cannot be excused on the basis of race or gender). NJ may also prohibit challenges on the basis of sexual orientation in light of the Lawrence case. I do not know NJ law, so I cannot opine on that point.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 4:04 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      Watched the whole 20/20 thing. He is a remorseless sociopath, and the same spoiled prince with zero regard for others as he has always been. Throw the book, I say.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 5:28 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      And since when is Chris Cuomo Ravi’s defense lawyer?

      Mar 24, 2012 at 7:55 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Hephaestion
      Hephaestion

      Chris Cuomo should be ashamed. Weak, shoddy work. Get Tyler Clementi’s folks in the same room before you ask Ravi any more questions.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 8:01 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @Hephaestion: That whole segment is shameful and biased. It is obvious that Chris Cuomo is of the opinion that the anti bullying mob mentality and the LGBT activist community scapegoated Ravi. However, I now personally have no doubt that he is a bigot and a criminal.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 8:20 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • xerxes
      xerxes

      Chris Cuomo gave the worst interview- did he have Ravi’s lawyer’s write all the questions?

      And Sandra, whatever your ax to grind against Mrs Clementii may be, you can call her way of dealing with Tyler different things, but it was NOT CRIMINAL like RAVI’S.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 10:23 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • xerxes
      xerxes

      @cwm:

      You sure are wrong on the law. Being gay is not cause for being tossed off a jury (nor is race or gender) nor is it a reason for mistrial. What internalized homophobia.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 10:27 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • FunMe
      FunMe

      Yesterday evening, I viewed the biased 20/20 show trying to put Ravi in the best light possible. They even had Dan Savage saying perhaps it was a rush to judgement.

      DOES.NOT.MATTER.

      Case is closed. He was found guilty. And guilty he was of the things he was accused of. Ravi is going to go to jail. Maybe even thrown back to his country of India.

      Lessons will be learned, whether he, or other people defending him, like it or not.

      Case closed! (Caso Cerrado!)

      Mar 24, 2012 at 10:56 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Sandra
      Sandra

      The fact everyone is turning a blind eye to Tyler’s OWN words regarding his OWN feelings about how hos mother rejected speaks volumes about the lack of a voice Tyler had before and after his death. PEOPLE LISTEN TO TYLER. He said in his OWN words he was rejected by hos mother. Maybe she was over it and accepted it. But it was clear she did not communicate that with him very well.
      The impact of a parent rejecting (Tyler’s words not mine) him & his sexuality played a big role in his depression, I’m not saying the webcam didn’t, but the fact that everyone has put this entire suicide on Ravi is WRONG. There was more bullying than just his peers. Hos own mother rejecting him had a larger impact and was far more isolating. Look at the big picture. Instead everyone, media, this thread, the family and solely decided the only hate crime was committed by Wei & Ravi.

      NO. The parents who don’t support & love their children based on his coming out ARE ALSO AT FAULT.
      Without his note, one of the few words Tyler left behind was the instant message regarding his mother rejecting—- yet that’s just ignored—by EVERYONE. If your going to start holding people accountable for this tragedy you cannot accuse one and let everyone else just slip by.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 11:11 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Sandra
      Sandra

      Also the irony here is, on this thread, the amount of hate and disturbing language regarding Ravi is hypocritical and also WRONG. Racism is not better than sexual discrimination, even threatening voilence up to and including murder—-people should be ashamed of themselves. Your comments are disturbing and also considered -HATE CRIMES.

      Examples: No. 37 · Ben Johnson
      Really? When you get to jail for the next ten years you will be someone chew toy.
      Mar 23, 2012 at 2:22 pm · @Reply · Flag
      No. 7 · Caleb
      This guy is the biggest douchebag EVER. He just needs to shut the hell up and go back to his own country.
      Mar 23, 2012 at 9:35 am · @Reply · Flag

      Only a few of the hate crimes on this VERY SITE.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 11:28 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Sandra
      Sandra

      @xerxes: And. Maybe it should be? If you want to accuse and convict someone of hate crimes- leading to this suicide EVERYONE who contributed to the hate. EVERYONE should be held accountable. Which included his mother when she put him out in the cold.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 11:49 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Callum
      Callum

      Sadly, Ravi get railroaded by a fervor in New York and also a rather vindictive District Attorney who wanted another notch on her belt.

      Ravi’s “crimes” were no different than comments that would have been posted by Clementii’s own gay friends had they been in a similar situation as was Ravi. In fact 18 year old queens would have posted much worse. What Ravi posted and did was not the cause of Clementii’s emotional problems. Remember, Clementii was the first to post dirt. He posted that Ravi was a rag head and that Ravi was definatly one whose family ran a Duncan Donut Franchise (alluding to an Indian or a Pakistani?) Had Clementii wanted anonymity he would not have kicked out his straight roommate to have a trick over. TRhat was insensative to the max. Clementii should have taken his trick to a cheap motel room or gone to the abode of his trick, or done it under the bleachers!

      As for sending Ravi back to his own country, get a grip on it folks! Ravi was Bron in India, but Ravi was raised from a small child in the United States. Ravi is more American than he is Indian.

      I feel very sad for Ravi and I am a 65 year old gay man who has seen and experienced most everything. My coming out in the early 1960′s was certainly not as easy as it was for Tyler Clenentii in 2010. I persevered and life did get better. Tyler has only himself to blame.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 12:27 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Sandra
      Sandra

      @Callum: EXCELLENT POINT. THANK YOU.

      The amount of hate filled comments regarding India on this blog are disgusting. BE ASHAMED. BE VER ASHAMED. to throws someone back in India as of it was a prison or to imply that an entire country is disgusting.
      A forum which is so sensitive about hate crimes should maybe review and edit the comments they ALLOW on their site. It’s offensive & racist and A HATE CRIME.
      It is extremely ignorant & hypocritical.
      Absolutly disgusting. Those comments regarding India, or referring to Ravi as “fat” are all the sand hateful things this thread was arguing Against
      The truth is all these comments ARE NO BETTER than what Ravi did, yet everyone tolerates that.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 12:46 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • the crustybastard
      the crustybastard

      @B:

      Only you would be delusional enough to accept Ravi’s self-serving statements as unimpeachable fact.

      Congratulations, you’re a dumbass.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 12:55 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Sandra
      Sandra

      @the crustybastard: Way to prove your point with hateful comments—really proving your argument against hate crimes with name calling—-really?

      Mar 24, 2012 at 1:06 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Sandra
      Sandra

      @Sandra: @the crustybastard: That comment was intended for you

      Mar 24, 2012 at 1:07 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @Sandra: Telling someone who has committed criminal acts in this country to leave is not a hate crime. In fact, the law says if you are convicted of crimes of “moral turpitude,” and are not a citizen, you could face deportation.

      You’re also a Ravi defender with an obvious ax to grind against Mrs. Clementi, when you should be feeling for this woman for her loss instead. Despicable.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 3:02 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Blah, bla..huh?
      Blah, bla..huh?

      And here I’d begun to think Sandra had finally martyred herself, leaving the world a little more sane in her glorious wake. Now she’s out spreading her psychotic gospel again, shit. Queerty officially sucks again until she checks in to adjust her meds next time.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 3:43 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • chefperfect
      chefperfect

      It is sad that all of you are missing the point.

      First of all, how is it possible that gay people even have family? They don’t and cannot reproduce. That is a simple fact that is often overlooked.

      This is very sad what our world has come to. People are too serious. Have fun, make fun and laugh.

      Gays want to take take take and then complain that they have to pay when the bill comes.

      It’s common sense hence the theory of relativity.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 4:25 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • DouggSeven
      DouggSeven

      Why is everyone still arguing here? Tyler took his own life. End of story. He was not a well man. His mother, Ravi, society, the media, etc etc etc are part to blame…but how are you going to arrest them? You can’t. I’m sure everyone in this thread has been bullied in some way for being gay – did we take our own life? No. In high school, rumors began swirling over me for supposedly preforming oral sex on some dude (it was false), did I kill myself? No, I am stronger, and smarter than these people who just give up on life. It’s time people start taking responsibility for their actions and stop playing the blame game.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 4:27 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @chefperfect: We do have families. It’s called mothers, daughters, brothers, fathers…and yes husbands, wives, life partners, and CHILDREN. Listen up you bigot, you are on a thread where we are mourning one of our own. You have no place here.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 4:34 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • chefperfect
      chefperfect

      @Shannon1981

      “Listen up you bigot” Haha, who are you, Patrick Henry? Take a hike.

      @DouggSeven What are you up to tonite? Drinks?

      Mar 24, 2012 at 4:42 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @chefperfect: You’re being homophobic on a gay blog. My comment is appropriate in response.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 4:58 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Sandra
      Sandra

      @Shannon1981: Calling someone of Indian desent a rag head is. Which Clementi & his gay friends did. Implying India is like a prison or no one would WANT to live there is also wrong and a hate filled statement. Guess what folks there’s gays in India also so your really bashing MORE gays at that point.
      In fact being openly gay in India is more accepted then in bigoted America.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 5:29 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @Sandra: I never said anything along those lines, personally.

      Also, you are simply trying to deflect the arguments away from Ravi’s wrongdoing. Not working.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 5:32 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @DouggSeven: Good thing the jury and the law disagree with you.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 5:38 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • DouggSeven
      DouggSeven

      @Shannon1981: I didn’t say anything about any laws. Ravi may get deported, but not for murder, but for invasion of privacy.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 6:03 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Amanda D
      Amanda D

      85, you are whacked out of your mind. What exactly are gay people taking? Please tell me.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 6:10 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Just being real
      Just being real

      @Shannon we don’t know if Ravi is a sociopath and you’re not a trained psychologist or psychiatrist at all.

      I agree with Doug Seven. There are tons of LGBT teens and adults who do not kill themselves at all and who have been bullied and had horrible things happen to them. I’m one of them and so are you Doug 7.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 6:12 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Just being real
      Just being real

      @Shannon we don’t know if Ravi is a sociopath and you’re not a trained psychologist or psychiatrist at all.

      I agree with Doug Seven. There are tons of LGBT teens and adults who do not kill themselves at all and who have been bullied and had horrible things happen to them. I’m one of them and so are you Doug 7. In the end only Tyler knows why he killed himself and it was his choice to do this.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 6:13 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @Just being real: His lack of remorse is nothing short of sociopathic. Even after all this time, he is showing no signs of believing he did anything criminal. That interview was just him and Cuomo and the rest of the pro Ravi crowd in a circle jerk of excuses for his abominable, and, yes, CRIMINAL behavior.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 7:12 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • DouggSeven
      DouggSeven

      @Shannon1981: Are you insane? No, are you bat-crap-crazy!?! Put down your accusitory agenda for just a second here and let’s go over the facts. What you are accusing Ravi for is similar to what Charles Manson got put in jail for (rightfully so I might add). Ravi pulled a prank and it went out of control – THAT IS ALL HE DID. Did he murder Tyler? No. Was his intent for Tyler to kill himself? Absolutely not. Should Ravi have remorse for Tyler over what happened? Not exactly. Ravi would have no way of knowing that his prank would send this Tyler person over the deep end and make him take his life. I’m sure Ravi has dealt with Tyler’s death with regret and sadness – but for him to be accused of his death as a result of a prank is downright wrong. How would he know what Tyler’s mental condition was? It was a tasteless prank yes, but should Ravi go to jail for it? Absolutely not.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 7:45 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Sandra
      Sandra

      @DouggSeven: Well said! Excellent point.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 8:01 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @DouggSeven: It was not a prank. He broke the law. A lot of folks agree with me. Read around the net and you’ll see. You are wrong. Had there been no correlation between the suicide and the incident, there would have been no trial and we all know it, regardless of what the jury was told to disregard.

      At any rate, he is a criminal and will be punished as such, and rightly so.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 8:36 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • DouggSeven
      DouggSeven

      @Shannon1981: Many times, pranks can break the law. In this case, the law was invasion of privacy (along with many other laws he broke trying to obstruct justice), but Ravi is not being charged with murder. This is the arguement we’re debating about. Also, people go to court all the time over invasion of privacy laws – a quick google search of ‘boss spying on employees’ or ‘webacm in bathroom’ I’m sure would bring up a bunch of cases. I agree that he is a criminal and should be punished – but not for murder.

      And ‘read around the net’!?! Now I think you’re trolling me.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 9:05 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B
      B

      No. 80 · the crustybastardk proving himself to be an idiot, wrote, “@B: Only you would be delusional enough to accept Ravi’s self-serving statements as unimpeachable fact.”

      The “self-serving statements” you are referring to are ones that were corroborated by testimony during the trial. For example, nothing was recorded. They did not see anything more than a kiss or a couple with their shirts off (nothing you couldn’t do legally in public). In case you are too dumb to know, “recording” implies making a permanent copy that you can replay whenever you like. That simply didn’t happen. Similarly, media reports indicated that on Sept 21, Ravi pointed his web cam towards Tyler’s bed. A witness stated it was pointed towards Ravi’s own bed and the door, and then repositioned, moving the field of view an “inch” towards Tyler’s bed.

      Ravi said that some of the media reports were wrong. In just about every case in which I knew what was going on first hand, what I saw in the newspapers was a very distorted view of what actually happened. Ravi was in fact misrepresented in the media. It’s quite common. Why am I not surprise? Being misrepresented doesn’t mean he didn’t misbehave. It means the media got a number of facts wrong. Just like they nearly always do.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 9:08 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @DouggSeven: You just said he should not go to jail, called it a simple prank, thus contradicting yourself. He broke the law. End of story. No wonder they say the gay community eats our own. You’re on the side one of our oppressors. Despicable. Let this criminal rot as any criminal should.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 9:19 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • DouggSeven
      DouggSeven

      @Shannon1981: I saw that and unfortunately I cannot edit my posts (like you can on most every other forum, but I digrerss). Yes, he should go to jail or be deported for invasion of privacy, but not for murder. Get it now?

      Mar 24, 2012 at 9:24 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @DouggSeven: Who is charging him with murder?

      Mar 24, 2012 at 9:33 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • DouggSeven
      DouggSeven

      @Shannon1981: No one – but your accusation of ‘sociopath’ indicated that that’s what he should have been charged with…hense, murder. He pulled a tasteless and unlawful prank – how is that even close to sociopathic behaviour…do you know what the term means? By your logic, we should put up Ashton Kutcher as well and try him for something.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 9:42 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @DouggSeven: All the sociopath accusation says is that he doesn’t feel bad about his possible cause in this. To me, after watching the entire 20/20 segment along with the small clips here…shows me he feels nothing. In his mind, he wasn’t wrong at all. Anyone with any conscience would feel some semblance of survivor’s guilt. He does not.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 9:45 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • DouggSeven
      DouggSeven

      @Shannon1981: He’s defending himself over ridiculous accusations (and yes, it looks as though he lies a few times there) and being put on the spot by the interviewer trying to get him to admit to Tyler’s murder. How do you expect him to act? Cuomo even says ‘face of the bully – we want answers when gay kids die’. Wait, what!?!

      Mar 24, 2012 at 9:55 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @DouggSeven: Cuomo softballed him. That whole thing was just a way to make him look good for sentencing. As for his lying? A habit. I think we all see that he is a spoiled upper middle to upper class prince with a BMW who probably got away with a lot up until now. Finally got into something daddy’s cash couldn’t get him out of, that’s all.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 9:59 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      As for the bias, what sealed it for me was the 20/20 viewing of the classmate/friend who got the “you might see something nasty” text. She said she read that to mean something nasty as in two men together. We all know guys watch porn. They do not find straight porn “nasty.” It’s a turn on, it’s hot. But gay sex? OH NO! That’s NASTY. If that isn’t homophobia, I don’t know what is.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 10:02 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Xerxes
      Xerxes

      Sandra, you can go visit Ravi in jail since you are so troubled by all of this. You’ll be able to report to the world how well he is learning to get along with his roommate. Also, you can tell us all what his reactions are to having himself monitored by camera all over the place, and taking a shit in the tin can toilet out in the open of his cell. Maybe you can publish on the subject.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 10:04 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @Xerxes: Good idea. Eye for eye, do to him what he did to Tyler.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 10:05 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      “fuck my life he’s gay”

      “making out with a dude”

      “bacardi and beer viewing party”

      “its happening again”

      “might see something nasty”

      sorry, but that looks like homophobia to me, Ravi defenders. He is a liar, an arrogant, spoiled prince with money and a BMW, and a homophobe and a peeping tom. He is getting what he deserves, and may any attempts to repeal fail.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 10:29 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B
      B

      No. 110 · Shannon1981 wrote, “As for the bias, what sealed it for me was the 20/20 viewing of the classmate/friend who got the “you might see something nasty” text. She said she read that to mean something nasty as in two men together. We all know guys watch porn. They do not find straight porn “nasty.””

      Err, Shannon1981, type in “nasty porn” into Google without the quotes and see what you get. Straight porn comes up. The term “nasty” is no doubt put there by the porn outfit’s marketing guys, but they wouldn’t use it if they didn’t think “nasty” was a turn-on for straight men. I’ll spare readers any quotes from the search results.

      The problem is that people’s hatred of Ravi is causing them to just make stuff up about him, whether it is true or not. It’s like what the Bush administration did regarding Saddam Hussein – instead of saying what he actually was – a brutal thug running a dictatorship – they made him into a James Bond villain. You had imaginary torture chambers where they’d take over a plastic factory and slowly drop someone into a machine that would grind them up and extrude them. In reality, they tortured people with low-cost, common implements. It’s not like they hung some guy on a slow-moving winch, started to lower him towards the grinder, and then left the room saying, “it will be a tight squeeze, Mr. Bond,” not noticing the voice-activated high powered laser in his wristwatch.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 10:42 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @B: “nasty” in this case was not a turn on, and you know it. It was something bad, something disgusting. Ravi’s own friend painted it as such in court.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 10:44 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • DouggSeven
      DouggSeven

      @Shannon1981: So, where are you going with this now? If we’re going to lock up everyone who’s homophobic, there goes the entire state if Idaho. I’d miss my potatos too much.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 10:51 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @DouggSeven: He deliberately intimidated and there is evidence of it. That’s my point. He might not be a KKK hood wearing hater, but he is definitely a homophobe who could be described as arguably playing a part in the loss of a precious human life. You gamble and pick on the wrong person, you lose. That is the message that needs to be sent, and it is. That is comforting to me. He fucked up, he is paying for it. He’s a hateful homophobe and a criminal, like it or not, and his homophobic actions had tragic consequences. He is now facing said consequences. If I have to go to NJ myself, I’ll make sure this fucker gets no appeal.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 10:54 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      In fact, I am going to email Garden State Equality right now. As we saw from the interview, the guy who runs it sees this for what it is. Good night.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 11:08 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • DouggSeven
      DouggSeven

      @Shannon1981: This mentality is a problem. So many factors went into why Tyler committed suicide, but singling out Ravi as the main one is downright wrong. Suicide is no one’s fault but the one who does it. People need to stop making suicide victims into martyrs – they are not well.

      Mar 24, 2012 at 11:14 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B
      B

      No. 115 · Shannon1981 wrote, “@B: “nasty” in this case was not a turn on, and you know it.”

      What you said was, “We all know guys watch porn. They do not find straight porn “nasty.””
      I simply typed “nasty porn” into Google and reported what came up – straight porn as well as gay porn. Obviously “nasty” is a selling point for both.

      It has nothing to do with “this case” (assuming your mean Ravi) but rather with what you actually said. The issue was the overblown rhetoric. If you want to disparage him, at least try to refrain from making things up.

      Mar 25, 2012 at 12:35 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @B: If Ravi’s own friend can figure out what he meant when he sent that text, then you should be able to as well. You are simply reaching.

      @DouggSeven: No, your apologist mentality for the criminals who harm our own is the problem.

      Mar 25, 2012 at 3:38 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Go Shannon!
      Go Shannon!

      @Shannon1981: Thanks for fighting to tough fight here Shannon, but it’s a lost cause. Ravi’s defenders are not going to change their minds. The jury, however, agrees with you and, fortunately, that is the only opinion that matter. Unlike Ravi’s defenders, the jurors heard ALL of the evidence in this case and they very quickly returned guilty verdicts. They had to consider 17 counts and they came back with verdicts in less than two days. A reasonable person would see that as definitive. Despite the endless speculation by Ravi’s defenders that Clementi’s suicide had something to do with this case, jurors told the New York Times and 20/20 that they never considered that in their deliberations. Some people are impervious to facts and argument and that is certainly true of those people who continue to champion Ravi’s cause.

      Mar 25, 2012 at 8:57 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • David Ehrenstein
      David Ehrenstein

      @DouggSeven: Sounds like a plan!

      Mar 25, 2012 at 12:08 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @Go Shannon!: Thanks. I am no fan of railroading, using, or unjustly punishing people, but that is not what has happened here. This guy was malicious and yes, criminal. I realize I cannot win an argument with folks who refuse to see those things. But, yes, the jury agrees, and I am awaiting a reply from Garden State Equality on what I can do help make sure he gets his just desserts.

      Mar 25, 2012 at 1:35 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • the crustybastard
      the crustybastard

      @Sandra:

      Yeah, I didn’t make “an argument against hate crimes,” dumbass.

      @B:

      Pay attention, dimwit: Ravi’s self-serving statements that you’re accepting as unimpeachable fact are, for example, “He actually said he thought his roommate was mostly ignoring him (or something like that)” and “Ravi thought that the fact that he was not allowed to see the note was an indication that he had little to do with the suicide.”

      You are convinced Ravi lacked motive or animus based solely on Ravi’s own statements about his thoughts and feelings. Of course, you’re free to believe any stupid thing you like, and you’re likewise free to white-knight any amoral asshole you choose. But you’re convincing nobody with your endlessly recycled arguments like, “b-b-but it wasn’t an actual RECORDING!”

      Who gives a shit? That’s not the point.

      Imagine a shoplifter caught red-handed, in possession of the stolen goods. The shoplifter insists, “I wasn’t actually stealing the items because I meant to sneak them back into the store later that day.” Just because YOU believe the accused, his self-serving statements ARE NOT SUFFICIENT in themselves to establish that the shoplifter lacked the requisite motive to make the act a crime. That is a matter for the jury to weigh and determine.

      The jury — not YOU — heard ALL the evidence, then decided that, with respect to most of the charges, Ravi did indeed have the intent to do Clementi ill.

      You don’t have to like that, but the jury wasn’t wrong simply because you have abounding faith in Ravi’s personal integrity.

      Mar 25, 2012 at 2:41 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • aa72dallas
      aa72dallas

      Forget about anyone being gay. It is despicable to spy on someone electronically PERIOD.

      Mar 25, 2012 at 7:07 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Zach
      Zach

      @Paul1964: I am sure that the law firm set guidelines as to what could be asked. Yes, no follow up questions to Ravi’s answers, softball tosses to him, etc. had to be expected in order to get the interview. Too bad.

      I have been twisting on one thing. We all know the timeline. RA comes to Ravi while Tyler is in class and tells him of the complaint for the room change. RA Grover says Ravi is upset and confused and tried to explain but he cut him off, saying I am not the one you need to explain to (I take it to mean he should explain it to Tyler -another person says he meant to the Senior RA-I guess either is possible, I just think if I was the RA I would mean explain it to Tyler). So, Ravi knows Tyler is upset. Tyler comes back to the room somewhere around 2 hours later and Ravi is there. This is what I cannot get a grip on. Ravi does NOT immediately apologize, explain what he wants to try to say happened like he did with the RA, he says NOTHING. The opportunity to explain in person is there and he does nothing. Ravi leaves after about an hour together with Tyler, Tyler leaves after writing the note, only a few hours later Ravi does his first text. (a weak excuse) then ten minutes later after no reply from Tyler he sends another, better one. I just cannot get this out of my head, WHY NOT TALK IN PERSON, even if Tyler is so reserved and quiet? Immediately and in person, not by text where you cannot see a response in person and deal with it. Scared? Not wanting to deal with it? (of course he did with the RA and had almost 2 hours to think before Tyler got back)I would so want to be able to say I talked to Tyler and we are cool now, or I tried.

      Mar 25, 2012 at 10:11 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B
      B

      No. 125 · the crustybastard made a fool of himself by saying, “Pay attention, dimwit: Ravi’s self-serving statements that you’re accepting as unimpeachable fact are, for example, “He actually said he thought his roommate was mostly ignoring him (or something like that)” and “Ravi thought that the fact that he was not allowed to see the note was an indication that he had little to do with the suicide.” You are convinced Ravi lacked motive or animus based solely on Ravi’s own statements”

      Whether “the crustybastard” is simply a fool or a liar is something readers can decide.
      The actual quote he is referring to is as follows:

      “He [Ravi] actually said he thought his roommate was mostly ignoring him (or something like that) and that a lot of misinformation about him was appearing in the press. Some of that is true – reports that he recorded a video of sexual activity, for example, which never happened. Similarly, “broadcasted” is simply the wrong word to use in describing what he did. He wasn’t being “persecuted by gays” but rather he was subject to the same sort of sloppy reporting that occurs in any number of cases.”

      So, I point out that “some” of what Ravi said was true, giving examples that clearly indicate that I was referring to distorted press reports, with the sort of errors that the press often makes. Then “the crustybastard” pretends I had posted something quite different. In case “the crustybastard” doesn’t know, “some” does not mean “all.”

      Mar 26, 2012 at 2:22 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B
      B [Different person #1 using similar name]

      No. 121 · Shannon1981 wrote, “B: If Ravi’s own friend can figure out what he meant when he sent that text, then you should be able to as well. You are simply reaching.”

      Really? Explain why everyone ignored his “viewing request” and show any evidence of purchases of rum for his “viewing party”. Did anyone even see the bottles lying around?

      I can believe he made the viewing party up as a joke. He may or may not have wanted people to watch.

      Since you probably don’t know, if anyone had tried to view his webcam, their software would have to send some sort of connection-request packet to either Ravi’s computer or to a server he was using. We know that Rutgers’ IT department had traces of network traffic because Rutgers’ IT guy testified specifically about Ravi’s computer. Any requests trying to reach Ravi’s computer, even if his computer was shut off, would have been seen. If he used a server on the Internet, there would most likely be a log file and either the D.A. or the defense would want to introduce that as evidence, depending on what it showed.

      To be blunt, I’ll trust the data presented by Rutgers’ IT department as a far more accurate indication of what happened than what you say about it.

      Mar 26, 2012 at 2:31 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B
      B

      No. 125 · the crustybastard. in self-righteous mode wrote, “The jury — not YOU — heard ALL the evidence, then decided that, with respect to most of the charges, Ravi did indeed have the intent to do Clementi ill.” and “But you’re convincing nobody with your endlessly recycled arguments like, “b-b-but it wasn’t an actual RECORDING!””

      First, a recording is objectively more serious than a viewing – once recorded, especially in digital form, it tends to follow the victim around for a very long time as people email it or post it. That (fortunately) didn’t happen.

      Second, “the crustybastard” is simply wrong about the jury. The “bias” charges are the ones involving intent to “do Clementi ill”. The “invasion of privacy” charges are for the act itself. If you look at http://www.queerty.com/breaking-jury-delivers-verdict-in-dharun-ravi-trival-guilty-on-most-counts-20120316/ there’s a list of the charges.

      For the bias charges in which Clementi was the victim, we have http://www.queerty.com/breaking-jury-delivers-verdict-in-dharun-ravi-trival-guilty-on-most-counts-20120316/.

      For the actual invasion of privacy, Ravi received acquittals on all charges in which he invaded Clementi’s privacy with “the purpose to intimidate” (but not for ones in which the victim would be reasonably assumed to feel intimidated). That in itself accounts for half of the “invasion of privacy” incidents, so “the crustybastard”‘s claim of “most” is incorrect. The ones where Ravi was convicted for “the purpose to intimidate” were for failed attempts at invasion of privacy – the web cam ended up being turned off, with Ravi claiming to have shut down the chat application and Clementi claiming to have shut off the power strip.

      Mar 26, 2012 at 6:40 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @B: I have an IT degree. I certainly know all of that. I never said there was an ACTUAL viewing party. I also never said anything was recorded. I know it wasn’t. However, that doesn’t delete the fact that this prick tweeted all of that.

      Mar 27, 2012 at 5:48 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Zach
      Zach

      think of it if you were socially already screwed up like Tyler, to have people look at you as you walked down the hall and whisper and laugh when you were just away from them. He said himself he could not talk to anyone and this would put him even more in the outsider category. He was a big bag of emotional problems needing treatment and this could have been the last straw. He would have to tell his mom he was changing rooms and she would surely question him, no one in the dorm standing up to Ravi to tell him it was wrong, all of that had to be going through his mind plus whatever else was there.

      Mar 27, 2012 at 8:05 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B
      B

      No. 131 · Shannon1981 wrote, “@B: I have an IT degree. I certainly know all of that. I never said there was an ACTUAL viewing party. I also never said anything was recorded. I know it wasn’t. However, that doesn’t delete the fact that this prick tweeted all of that.”

      As is typical, you missed the point. If nobody at all tried to view the web cam, what does that tell you about how seriously they took Ravi’s “tweets”? If 10 to 100 bothered reading his tweets and paid attention to them, you’d think at least one would have tried to connect to his chat session, if only out of curiosity (perhaps thinking he’s joking and wanting to see what the joke is, but maybe to see what he literally advertised).

      If you really know anything about IT, you should know that any chat protocol is going to requiring some messages for users to join the chat session. Where’s the data showing that those messages existed? Also, the D.A. most likely obtained a list of Ravi’s “followers” on Twitter, and probably at least telephoned them to ask about the tweets. Most, if not all, of those who noticed the tweets probably said that they looked at the tweets and just shook their heads at how immature Ravi had been.

      What he tweeted, BTW, is not a violation of criminal law if there was no cam or chat session, or an attempt to set up such a session. That’s in the instructions to the jury – they could consider the bias charges only if they first found the defendant guilty of a relevant invasion of privacy charge. You can find that in Queerty’s article on Ravi’s conviction, listing the charges and the outcome – the text includes an indication of what is necessary for a bias charge to be considered. Joking about a “viewing party” is legal as long as there is no actual attempt to set one up. Just because it is legal doesn’t mean it is socially acceptable behavior, but we don’t jail people merely for having bad manners.

      Mar 27, 2012 at 1:49 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Xerxes
      Xerxes

      My hunch, not from evidence, is that there are numerous skeletons in Ravi’s closet about the viewing party, what he may have done to set one up (whether or not any one showed up), and lots of other things about his homophobia, and what he was saying when he encountered people before and after Tyler died. For me, this explains why the only character witnesses he had were people his parents ages, who were the parents’ friends, not really Ravi’s. It spoke volumes to me that not a single peer was a witness for him. I believe that this is because no one who really knows him wanted to get involved because it would have involved keeping quite about too many damaging things regarding Ravi’s defense.

      Mar 27, 2012 at 5:51 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B
      B

      No. 134 · Xerxes wrote, “It spoke volumes to me that not a single peer was a witness for him. I believe that this is because no one who really knows him wanted to get involved because it would have involved keeping quite about too many damaging things regarding Ravi’s defense.”

      I think the reason is that they probably all knew that Ravi was an asshole. That would come out during cross examination, and the defense didn’t want a string of witnesses all telling the jury that Ravi was a jerk. Someone who knew Ravi’s peers in the town he grew up in posted a comment for another Queerty article and stated that Ravi had a reputation for taking a joke too far and doing things that nobody else thought was funny. Aside from that, so-called social-networking sites seem to run on a business model of invading privacy to the maximum extent that would not get the company’s executives thrown in jail. These sites would, given a subpoena, give the D.A. a list of all of Ravi’s contacts (“friends”, “followers”, or whatever the cute terminology du jour happens to be). If any of these peers had any information germane to the charges against Ravi, they would have been called by the prosecution and would probably not help Ravi cover anything up – why risk jail time for the sake of someone who behaves like Ravi did?

      Mar 27, 2012 at 8:42 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Zach
      Zach

      Xerxes, yeah, his lawyers were pretty lame. I think it was Jason Tam (not sure of the first name) who said Ravi met a gay guy at orientation earlier and was very impressed with him. Ravi says, but the friend never shows up, that he has a good friend at home with a close open relationship. The lawyers should have had one of them to testify. I feel for Ravi but the kid just lies all the time. I think his enabling parents are as bad as Tyler’s mom. Ok, back on point. His very good friend Tam, the one he was chatting online with when he first found the gay information before being roommates, says Ravi lies all the time and he would trust a brick more, haha. Molly says the same. Bet she regrets his being across the hall. If I were his lawyer I would tell him he was going to get KILL IN COURT with all the lies he tried, the trying to get Molly to lie for him and getting caught with the text, his changing the viewing message to his friends, telling a guy the next day who tried to look that it got messed up (why not say you disabled it if that is what you are saying now?) on and on. I think they sadly misjudged how it would play out even if he maybe should have gotten off as technically the invasion was not of sex, body parts, etc. And the bias was close but all the jury had to find was that Tyler was intimidated and OMG to expect to get off on that was a long shot. Conviction of witness and evidence tampering, whatever it was called, was a given. So,Xerxes, I think the jury thought just like you did and I do.
      BTW, did you notice that Tam and others said Ravi never had a girlfriend? I wonder if he was a virgin and it freaked him out to see/know shy Tyler having sex

      Mar 27, 2012 at 8:52 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Xerxes
      Xerxes

      @Zach:

      “…did you notice that Tam and others said Ravi never had a girlfriend?”

      I have been saying that I would not be at all surprised if Ravi is actually gay and deeply in the closet, and that his homophobic responses to Tyler were to disassociate himself publicly from Tyler, so that Ravi would not appear to be gay himself. I also think that if this is true, that Ravi may have also been jealous that Tyler was getting laid , and brave enough to pursue it, even if his outward image was as a geek/music nerd. When I was in college, the nerdiest, homliest guy in my dorm shocked all of us when right from the first week, you could hear the moans and groans of him and his new girlfriend of one week through the walls. Everyone was shocked /jealous, and nick-named him the “Mad Baller.” This went on for 4 years, and they married the week after graduation.

      Mar 28, 2012 at 12:35 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Shannon1981
      Shannon1981

      @B: Just saw this, B. I realize that the tweeting itself wasn’t illegal. Did it ever occur to you that perhaps Ravi’s friends aren’t sadistic sociopaths like he is? Perhaps that is why they didn’t attempt to view.

      And of course I realize that there would need to be messages,etc for the chat session to take place. No, there is no evidence of that.

      I also know we can’t jail folks for bad manners but I think something like this goes a whole lot further than simple bad manners.

      Apr 8, 2012 at 6:19 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • John
      John

      I think the mysterious MB who Tyler brought to the dorm room for the trysts needs a little inquiry as well pertaining to factors influencing Tyler’s suicide. Ravi on first meeting the man told detectives MB would not even acknowledge him when he greeted him. Two he had a beard and was seen as scruffy and “creepy” by most of the students on the dorm floor at that time. Does this vindicate Ravi in any way, shape or form? absolutely not, and what the courts rule is what needs to be enforced and accepted. But why was this character not even required to give his name in a media shielded courtroom, allowed to wait until the last minute to give his name to the DA’s on strict nondisclosure agreements? [Here I have to wonder if the name disclosure was so late in the proceeding that even if the DA discovered a history of theft's on MB's record it could never have been used in court to back Ravi's claim of spying the first time for fear of theft of his personnel property.] MB was not a long time trusted friend and lover of Tyler he was according to reports a casual hook up from a Adam to Adam site. Did anybody else pick up on his suddenly aggressive insistence that he was at Tyler’s room legitimately under questioning. And Ravi claimed the spying episode began with suspicion of MB, isn’t that intimidation and bias towards him more than Clementi? Yet he was acquitted of all bias and intimidation charges against MB, with no protest. In fact MB seemed to be cool and unemotional through the whole proceeding. Yes Tyler was 18 years but this man it seems is in his late twenties if not early thirties, there is just something a bit off about the court and medias allowance of absolute anonymity of this man.

      Apr 17, 2012 at 12:14 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·

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