After everyone got done waving their posters and taking turns at the podium in Fresno, Calif., on Saturday, on Sunday “about 250 gay and civil rights advocates met in Fresno to brainstorm and plan their strategy to repeal the same sex marriage ban.” Did you know about this? Probably not, because you weren’t invited to this planning exercise. See, while you were busy recycling your “No On Prop 8” posterboard the day after the press-friendly Fresno event, leaders of Gay Inc. were figuring out how to claim your rights in the next battle for equality. Only problem? They tried this closed-door approach before, and it didn’t work.
Of all the criticism over how the No On 8 effort failed to stop voters from banning same-sex marriage in California last year, one element stands out the loudest: the approach to fighting for equality was organized — poorly — by a group of gay activists who refused to share the bulk of their planning strategies with the outside world. It was this exclusive, insiders club approach to fighting Prop 8 that became part of our downfall; without the involvement of the masses, an undemocratic push to to defeat the measure left us the California Supreme Court deciding our fate.
So now, a renewed effort. Except this time around, it sounds like more of the same: insiders only, closed door meetings, no outside input.
Activist and bullshit caller Michael Petrelis has seen this before. Based in San Francisco, he’s been working for gay rights since at least the 1970s and maintains a fantastic minimalist website dedicated to chronicling even the tiniest of minutiae. So when Prop 8 reared its ugly head last year, Petrelis fought against the “organized” effort to block it. When that didn’t work, Petrelis joined others in calling for Geoff Kors to leave his post as the chief of Equality California. And now, when he’s not highlighting the atrocities suffered by gay Iraqis, he’s warning that history is about to repeat itself. In a very bad way.
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Having already faulted The Dallas Principles for its exclusivity and closed door policy — Why should some 20-plus folks who get together in a Texas hotel room decide what’s best for the gay community?, he argues — Peterlis now sees a reported 250 gay leaders gather in Fresno … and there’s no press allowed, and a clipboard at the door. (He says he didn’t hear about the meeting until it was reported in the news. Neither did Queerty, and, frankly, practically every small town podunk meeting of more than three people where someone merely mentions the word “gay” finds its way to our inbox.)
“There’s a disturbing pattern here and it needs to be confronted,” says Petrelis, an anti-Gay Inc. voice who actually just got done applauding a recent AIDS Inc. meeting for its openness.
A supporter of the Jamaica Boycott, Petrelis represents what’s undoubtedly a large portion of gays who care about their rights: There is no need for a top-down, executive steering committee approach to fighting for gay rights; in fact, that strategy is harmful.
What’s the alternative? A grassroots approach, apparently. The endless stream of websites and YouTube videos (plenty of them posted on here) shows there’s momentum at the citizen level.
But organizers like the Courage Campaign’s Rick Jacobs (pictured, right) and Cleve Jones (left) don’t see it that way. Or at least not entirely. That’s why the met behind closed doors in Fresno to plan a march on Washington on October 11, which is National Coming Out Day and will be nine years since the last GLBT march on the capital.
“The campaign’s next phase will train thousands of volunteers and faith leaders to canvass door-to-door to talk about the issue with neighbors,” the AP paraphrased Jacobs as saying. Quote: “We’re not doing what we used to do, which is meet in West Hollywood. We want people from all 435 congressional districts to tell their stories in Washington.”
That’s pretty shocking to someone like Petrelis, who responded in an email that’s circulating: “I’ve been wondering all weekend, what great group of queers committed to transparency and real community engagement met and decided to proceed with a march on DC? Everyone I asked seemed to have not received an invitation to the organizing meeting(s) for our next march on the nation’s capital. Where was the bottom-up, grassroots call and engagement behind the call to march again on DC? Well, it was the same-old top-down ‘We’ll tell you what you want’ approach that we saw fail so miserably in November for Prop 8, but just a different name of someone who wasn’t on the no on 8 exec committee. […] The medicine I get from my local club is not nearly as potent as whatever it is Cleve Jones and Rick Jacobs are smoking, and making the decision to not only march on DC in four months, but they’re part of the same crew that will also deliver us a new winning gay prop in 2010. What are Cleve and Rick smoking? I’d like to see their Courage Campaign pull off just one of the two big things: a successful prop or march on DC.”
And therein lies the dilemma: A massive, nationwide strategy does need leadership. We cannot afford to put every aspect of our civil rights up for a vote. Choosing a day and a place to meet, and who’s going to secure which permits, and who’s going to organize transportation … someone needs to make those calls. Whether it’s Jacobs and Jones or another crew is almost immaterial; but it must be someone, and these guys cannot be faulted for stepping up. That said, they can be held to the fire for this closed-door approach. We should be encouraging participation, not limiting it. We should be opening the doors of activism to all Americans, not cordoning it off to an elite group of veterans. The Internet (Facebook, Twitter, YouTube, blog ) and even the mainstream media should be tools of organization, not enemies of exclusivity. To be sure, Jones said organizing the march should be done “from the grassroots with a decentralized, Internet-based campaign,” adding, “The primary objective must be to turn out the largest possible crowd.” But that’s only after the good old boys in the smoke-filled back room sort everything else out.
We won’t know how this all pans out until October or, more accurately, until our rights are secured. And maybe Jacobs and Jones’ closed-door planning meetings with 250 activists was the push the grassroots needed to actually move.
But as we learned with Prop 8, we shut the doors on organizing and activism at our own peril.
(Fresno Rally Photo: Sean M. Haffey / U-T)
Tallskin
Simple, follow the constitution that OutRage! in the UK had in the 90s
An open and free meeting, with a chair (elected each meeting) with two vibe watchers to call time on any abuse.
A simple majority vote decides what gets done.
I believe that the OutRage! constitution was based on the New York ACT Up idea.
s’easy
Tallskin
Oh Sorry I forgot to add – they must be weekly meetings and open to all.
And the weekly general meeting idea holds to account the activists who are prone to try and do things in secret!!
Bit like in the UK Parliament Prime Minister’s Question Time is supposed to hold the PM to account.
The Gay Numbers
I would not care how many people are in the room so long as they got things done. THe problem with the gay movement is that our leaders suck. Not how many there are.
atdleft
@The Gay Numbers: YES! And as someone who was there at the Leadership Summit, let me tell you that the media were allowed to cover most of the summit (what wasn’t open were segments covering sensitive info that we don’t want the H8ers to have!!). Oh yes, and registration was OPEN to just about everyone in the community! All one had to do was either respond to the RSVP or ask the Meet in the Middle organizers for an e-vite if one didn’t already receive one.
Come on, Queerty. Your last story on MitM was great. Why do you want to f*ck it up by posting misleading rumors?
alan brickman
they want it done in secret so later on they can also make backroom deals that benefit themselves before others too!…
Qjersey
The problem with our gay leadership… is that it resembles political party nepotism… “whose turn is it” “who needs to be rewarded” “who do we need to appoint to shut up the detractors”
None or hardly any of our “leaders” were “chosen” based upon their qualifications.
Tallskin
Well, go for it, and do it yourselvs for fuck sake, don’t sit around whining!
Myles
@atdleft:
Well the problem is. No one really KNEW.
Now. I have to say I do TRUST these guys more than the people who handeled No on Prop 8.
As for the “what wasn’t open were segments covering sensitive info that we don’t want the H8ers to have!!”.
It will eventually come out just like theres does. You know the other side has NO SECRETS. They send mass emails by the 100’s of thousands letting their bigoted followers know whats going on.
Myles
Alkso can we stop this State by State, issue by issue bullshit. It is NEVER EVER GOING TO WORK and if it did it will take many many, many, many, many, many, many years before we WIN EVERY RIGHT. You would think that we would have learned by now thay this strategy is non-effective.
We need to refoucus and like African American Civil Rights go for the whole enchilada at once.
4njvotes
it’s really simple to be invited to these and all meetings that have been going on since 11/4 – get involved. Show up and sign up to more than the occasional visibility rally. I’m not leadership for any of these groups and I knew about the Sunday meeting. Why? Because I’m on every single listserv I could find in order to stay on top of and be “active” in what is going on. It takes individual effort to be involved. They don’t come knocking on your door while your drinking your brew, watching TV and ask you to come out and play. If you weren’t “invited” it’s because you are not really involved with any one of the grassroots groups that have been trying to cover your back. Sad to say but many of my straight friends are Way more involved in this fight than my gay friends. Quit whining and take action.
Alex
Actually, wasn’t 2010 decided by a vote? Both Courage Campaign and EQCA asked their membership to vote (I don’t know if an email list counts as the grass root) and they overwhelmingly favored the 2010 date. Additionally, many of us (myself included) see parallels between our movement and Obama and the Civil Rights movement and Kennedy. What Obama needs is a kick in the pants so we’ve been emailing the movement leaders and posting on blogs, which trickled up through the likes of David Mixner to the leadership of the movement.
I’m a little sick of this Gay Inc. conspiracy shit. I had a friend who was on the front lines of Prop 8 working his ass off and going to law school at the same time, plus holding down a job. From his perspective the main problem was that while plenty of (gay) people were willing to show up to something fun like a rally or a fundraiser, when it came time to do the hard work of getting organized, making calls and canvassing, most of our side seemed to disappear. We lost Prop 8 because the haters mobilized more people than we did. Maybe the reason it isn’t a grass-roots movement is because our grass-roots aren’t doing jack.
Alex
Also, while I’m ranting, a brief reminder that not all gay people live in California.
Douglas Gibson Jr
@4njvotes: I agree. I am not involved in the leadership and I don’t even live in CA, but I knew about this meeting due to lots of e-mails about it.
atdleft
@Alex: YES! Courage Campaign, Marriage Equality USA, and Equality CA all polled their members. And surprise, surprise, supermajorities in all 3 organizations want 2010. We’ll see when EQCA listens to its members and just goes for it, but Courage and MEUSA are now on board with 2010.
And btw, thanks for joining me in giving Queerty a kick in the pants when they need it. I’m no “Gay, Inc.” multibillionaire power diva, yet I knew about the leadership summit as soon as I registered for Meet in the Middle. And yes, you’re totally right that all one had to do was sign up with any of the grassroots groups to figure it out. One could have even found out by just listening in on a MitM planning session conference call! So yes, I’m calling BS on this “secret meeting” crap. Just get involved and you can know about this and other upcoming events!
And if anyone is still pissed over this much adieu about nothing, I dare you to email me at atdnextATgmailDOTcom so I can tell you how to get involved.
Derrick Mathis
You know,
Gay journalists and news outlets are really starting to freak me out. I never really started to read gay news outlets until the past several months due to my work as an activist for marriage equality in Los Angeles. Time and time again I’ve encountered misinformed, biased and untrue allegations particularly around marriage equality. I’m very disappointed.
Last week it was the misreporting of President Obama making fun at gay protesters expense when he gave a speech at a DNC fundraiser at the Beverly Hilton in Los Angeles. All one has to do is pick up the NY Times to get an account of what the president actually said. What Queerty and the likes reported was completely taken out of context and just wrong.
Now today I see you’re accusing gay activists who participated in the Leadership Summit yesterday at the Meet In The Middle Event in Fresno, of having a closed door meeting and cutting off the public.
Nothing could be further from the truth. You really ought to be ashamed of yourselves for reporting such blatant lies. In addition to Meet In The Middle, they’ve been publicly advertising the Leadership Summit for months to any and all–practically begging people to attend. However on the day of the Summit—yes, they closed the doors to all who had not already sent them an RSVP. THAT’S TYPICAL OF ANY MEETING. They needed rsvps so that they could provide an adequate amount of chairs, right sized venue, food, etc.
It’s called “meeting planning.”
Queerty you took that and turned it into something completely different and not cool at all. These so called leaders that you are referring to are hard working, none-paid committed people who are giving everything and all for the fight to restore marriage equality in California. Most of them like myself are grassroots activists meaning in addition to the many hours we dedicate to this cause a lot of what is created comes directly out of pockets. And DESPITE the shocking amount of apathy (of which I’m constantly a witness) that remains at large in California gay communities, these people press on—preparing for this civil rights battle as though their lives depend on it–and spending a good amount of time trying to recruit others in their communities to hop on board. I can’t think of one marriage equality organization or activist group that is not at this time BEGGING for more involvement and participation from the gay community and our straight allies. So for you to publish something as IRRESPONSIBLE as this piece is just stunning.
I can only hope that you keep doing it often enough that your readers began to see it and stop reading this blog. Shame on you.
Gary
This is another example of what’s wrong with the political aspect of the GLBT equality movement. Closed door meetings and coctail parties. . .and granted, 250 is a better number than 20.
Why the secrecy? Are we to think that our best interests are being attended to when our supposed “leaders” are conducting secret meetings? Not announced, nor open to anyone with ideas other than another million dollar march on the D.C. Mall?
I guess they all signed on to that dumba$$ idea. These supposed leaders don’t understand that most of us could not/cannot attend even if we wanted to.
Meet on the east coast to march on DC? again? . ..How about a coordinated effort on a national level to meet at the Capitol of every State or federal building in the nation . . .yes, there are GLBT families and individual all across this nation that are being ignored. Most don’t have that mysterious “expendable income”.
Why can’t we band together & form a political party that won’t just auto-support democrats & hold their feet to the fire unless we get something more than lip service?
We don’t need secretive meetings, perhaps we need regional conventions where all can be invited.
Derrick Mathis
And see Gary that’s just it. Your opinion is a perfect example of what irresponsible reporting creates. People like you get misinformed and it just creates confusion and ill will. That would be justified if what Queerty reported was the truth. But it’s not.
James P. P.
there are several problems that i have noted before that prevents us as a group to move forward. for one, there is no national dialog amongst those that have the ability to spend long hours doing volunteer work and those of us that have to work for a living. there is a division between those that live in Miami/New York/LA and those of us that do not. there is a HUGE difference between “leaders” that spend the majority of their time bouncing from fundraiser to fundraiser, and those of us just trying to live our day to day lives as human beings on this planet.
second, there is not one singular news outlet that keeps the homos in this country united and informed. as mentioned (thank you Derrek M) we are clouded by the sensationalism and the biased self-righteousness and pseudo-frustration. we are ‘blogged’ down with pointless (and sometimes wrong) information, we leap frog over common sense just because we tend to get wrapped up in the drama. i wish there was one news source that says “this is what happened” and nothing else – AND NOT PULLED IN ONE WAY OR THE OTHER BY ADVERTISING. I agree with Bill Mahr – we lost the real news whenever the news became considered a ‘money making’ section of a company. the world is full of commentators. we don’t need commentators at the top, we need motivators.
lastly (this is all just my opinion, by the way) we honestly need ONE organization that is actually run like a decent, functional organization. sure, there will be problems with it, there always are. for example, regardless of controversy, the Red Cross still shows up fully functional during disasters. there is no reason why the gays outside of california and new york have to be left out of such an exciting time. there is no reason why we cannot have a national organization of stronger substance that can then trickle down to individual communities and help centers (like the Boys & Girls’s club, etc. does).
so that is my rant. organization is possible, but for some reason we have created smaller special interest groups inside our special interest group, subdividing finances, efforts, energies, donations, and attention. now we are all struggling to keep our head above water at the same time… and articles like this one doesn’t help.
atdleft
@Gary: Please read what @Derrick Mathis just said. This story is WRONG. This pretty much was a one-day convention for CA LGBT activists after MitM. All Queerty had to do was apply for a press pass to attend!
And btw, the reason for the closed doors during the meeting was that we were hearing some VERY SENSITIVE data that we didn’t want leaked to the NOMbie H8ers. We want everyone in the community informed and involved, but we sure as hell don’t want the opposition to know how we plan to win next year.
Gary
All one has to do is actually be objective and make their own conclusions. Irresponsible reporting has nothing to do with my opinion. I’m certainly not misinformed or manipulated.
My opinion is mine, take it or leave it but don’t assume.
J. Scot Coatsworth
As many have already said, this event was open to the public – you just had to sign up. Come on, Queerty, do a little research here. My partner and I are gay bloggers, not “organization leaders” but we were both welcomed in. In fact, as far as I saw, anyone who showed up, even without an RSVP, was let in. And the conversation included everyone in the room.
So please don’t be so quick to say this is the same as it ever was. The movement leaders are making a huge effort to incude anyone who wants to be at the table. You just have to show up.
J. Scott Coatsworth
Oh, and by the way, the meeting was not about planning the March on DC… in fact, it was barely discussed. It was on how to respond to the Supreme Court ruling on Prop 8.
GrrrlRomeo
Hi, I live in South Carolina and I heard about the meeting.
Also…lots of crabbing about leadership. From people who don’t see how it’s changed? It’s changed a lot over the last year. And I’m not just comparing to the No. on 8, but the last painful decade of inaction.
Derrick Mathis
@Gary:
“This is another example of what’s wrong with the political aspect of the GLBT equality movement. Closed door meetings and coctail parties. . .and granted, 250 is a better number than 20.”
Sooo your opinion is not misinformed or wrong. You just seized the opportunity to gripe about something that’s not untrue? Um…okay Gary.
atdleft
@J. Scott Coatsworth: Thank you, Scott! Yes, Cleve Jones only briefly mentioned the march in DC and asked folks interested in participating to sign up with him. Otherwise, it was mainly about how to go back to the ballot in CA and win marriage equality in 2010 and/or 2012. And even though most of us there supported 2010 along with Courage & MEUSA, the summit didn’t even endorse 2010 or 2012. It was a chance for us to get educated, connect with each other, and build a better movement.
For all of you who have been “concerned” over this false story, sign up with your local LGBT grassroots group and you’ll find out about the next planning sessions coming up.
Phyllis Wilson
Goddamnit Queerty — get your facts straight before you report bullshit like this. I’ve been receiving emails on this meeting for months and am an absolute nobody. I did not RSVP and still showed up and was allowed in. I know some of the organizers personally and know that they quadrupled the reservation size with the hotel in the last week before the event. On top of THAT — it was announced from the stage at MITM on Saturday by Robin McGehee and the whole damn crowd of 5,000 people there were invited to attend.
Geoff Kors and Rick Jacobs were initially sitting on the floor — and, for the record, Geoff Kors of EQCA was hissed at when he was introduced. This meeting was far from a behind-closed-doors A-list lovefest. In fact, it was EXACTLY what people have complained should have been done last year — everyone was invited, everyone had an equal voice, it was neutrally moderated, no group or strategy was allowed to be elevated above another.
As a Central California homo I can tell you that there is nowhere in this state where the animus toward the last campaign is more hostile and pervasive because we were left out COMPLETELY — we couldn’t even get fucking yard signs until the SUNDAY BEFORE ELECTION DAY. And our response to that abandonment was to throw the best fucking protest you’ve ever seen in Fresno, CA. And for Queerty to suggest that we would somehow allow our weekend to culminate in some super-secret strategy session is downright insulting.
You dropped the ball Queerty — in more ways than one — you didn’t get your shit together to attend the meeting and cover it like professionals so instead you’re just going report lies. Shame on you.
Gary
@atdleft:
Ah yes. . .A closed door meeting . .”VERY SENSITIVE data”. Sounds like Cheney.
The reality is that this is exactly the type BS that people people like me and my family are sick and tired of.
If you want our support, include us. Engage us in something that might involve more than a trip to the east coast or protesting a constitutional ammendment in a state we don’t live in.
Secretive meetings only give fodder to the maggies . . .our mysterious agenda . . .don’t let the fundies see “page 13”.
Forrest
Our “community” encompasses every group in society. We are so wildly diverse that self appointed “leaders” get adulation from those in their orbit. But they inhabit a NYLASF axis and have no connection to those of us in the rest of the country and most LGBT minority groups.
So the greatest impact will be made through daily dialogue from common citizens who know how their own “world” works and not “leaders” holding preach to the choir meetings.
Gary
“As many have already said, this event was open to the public – you just had to sign up”.
Just where was this event announced and who sponsored it? Why are now we told how we should just fall in line after the fact?
Perhaps the numbers aren’t correct, but the sentiment is.
K Esslinger
As someone who was at the meeting and not of the leadership elite, I can verify that this was an open meeting, even to the press until the sharing of confidential polling data that obviously shouldn’t be published by the mainstream press. Again, anyone could attend. It was announced at the rally the day before. It was sent out to all the people who registered to attend. Please verify your facts before publishing untruthful alarmist articles that take us down rather than build us up. Please, we are all working for equality.
Thanks.
michael
After I watched the episode of “Hardball” with Chris Matthews where he hosted the two attorney’s that are taking the case to the Federal Supreme Court I have come to put my money on them. I am not saying don’t go ahead and plan for other angles, but when I listened to them I thought they were brilliant. They had an answer for every question and angle Chris Matthews threw at them.
Even if Prop. 8 were to be repealed we still live with a dangerous precedent in place, and that is that the rights of minorities are subject to the whims of the majorities. That should not be, that is wrong and if anything in California needs to be changed it is their constitution. It is a dangerous document that subjects humans to inhuman possibilities. What happened with the California Supreme Court was a nightmare for all of its citizens. It upheld the right for Californians to decide on how a group of people should and should not live. Californians, whether for same sex marriage or not, are fools if they cannot see the dangerous possibilities that are coming their way if they don’t do something and quick. If I were a Californian that is where I would be placing my efforts, to make a complete revision of a constitution that gives the power to the people to perpetrate great evil. Human and civil rights should never be up for vote, never.
Fitz
Well, i am one of the millions that have no right to bitch about this. I belong to no glbt organizations, except for my 6 month membership at steamworks. It’s time for me to figure out who the good guys are, and start showing up at their meetings.
flightoftheseabird
I have known about this event for months. Probably because like someone indicated above I am on listserv or two. Jeez all it takes is one. I received invitations to attend from HRC, EQCA, Long Beach Equality, OCEC, Stonewall Dems, I saw fliers at Long Beach pride, at the D-Day Rally, on Facebook, on blogs. I mean come on. Like I would have had to have been dead to not known about this event!
And as someone who was there, this was a VERY open meeting. People were showing up and being let in, “Just make a name tag” was the only requirement to get in. Everyone was equal in there once it started. I heard from a high school student and Geoff Korrs. Both of their opinions were equal and heard. It was a 4 hr meeting and the press was allowed in during all but about 35 mins of it so we could discuss very sensitive, *very expensive* polling data about how we can win this fight. No campaign releases internal polling. Why should we?
Shame on you Queerty for this piece. It just a hit piece because of your seemingly irrational hatred of the national and state organizations, or as you call them “Gay, Inc.” What you also failed to mention is that the state and national orgs really had nothing to do with either of these events. We were asked to co-sponsor the rally and were invited to attend the Leadership Summit as participants … just like the High School student from LA and the college student from Fresno, or the mom from Vasaila … but we did not help plan or facilitate anything.
flightoftheseabird
Oh and Queerty, this meeting where we were planning a March in Washington … it consisted of about 3 mins of the total time. Someone mentioned it, Robin Tyler said that it was a stupid idea we need to devote our time in CA, and then the topic disappeared for the rest of the meeting. Cleve Jones mentioned it from the stage as almost an after thought on Saturday.
Unless there was some other secret meeting in which Rick Jacobs was also in attendance on Sunday at the same time, then you are just wrong, and badly so. Like your credibility is about that of the Star or World Magazine reporting on Bat Boy with this one.
Joe
There was plenty of publicity about this. Anyone who was paying attention could have attended.
mark
FRESNO was a stupid idea…seriously STUPID!
If you plan a major demonstration between two of the LARGEST queer enclaves which can turn out a MILLION EACH for Pride, don’t plan some lousy hundred person demonstration in Bum F*ck CA. better to have NO DEMONSTRATION than a weak demonstration.
Derrick Mathis
@Mark:
Fresno was a stupid idea?!? Dude, you must be on very bad drugs. Thousands upon thousands of Californians went to Fresno this weekend to create the biggest civil rights gathering in the last 2 years. Legitimate news accounts of the event are all over the Internet.
Fresno was the perfect place for that kind of event—a town where they voted over 70% in favor of Prop 8. I guess you think preaching to the choirs of West Hollywood would’ve been more sensible. There ought to be more rallies like that in Prop 8 supporting communities. Hopefully Meet In The Middle is only the beginning. Would love to see similar in Salt Lake City.
Mark, go back under your rock, please.
Gary
@flightoftheseabird:
I will err to caution. I personally receved nothing/nada from HRC or Stonewall Dems regarding this conference. As for Long Beach Equality and OCEC those are local orgs that I would not expect a press release from.
I think it’s obvious that I’m no fan of HRC, but I keep up. Perhaps I don’t get this info from them. I’m certainly not on the preferred lists anymore.
So, am I to understand that this was a local conference that just got blown out of proportion because it was attached in some way to the “meet in the middle” event?
Ahhh .. Geoff Korrs spoke ..that must have been enlightening.
Poll information “very sensitive, *very expensive*”. . .well you know ..some of us would like to know where our donations & support are going to as well. . .this secrecy seems to read that whatever this mystery polling was . .didn’t come out to our advantage.
“No campaign releases internal polling. Why should we?”. Umm . .perhaps the self imposed powers never bothered to inform the rest of us that there was a “campaign”? . . .for repealing Prop 8?, for Equality on a Federal level? For other States?, on DADT, DOMA or ENDA?
Enquiring minds want to know the results of some extraenous poll that we put our cash into I suppose, so we can make up our minds on which org to give our cash to next robocall.
dgz
so, i’m going to steal a quote from an NAACP conference, and make it gay.
Right now, we don’t have Gay Leaders, we have leading gays.
sparkle obama
woww.
flightoftheseabird
@Gary: The point was you did not have to look very far for the info. It was very visible.
This was not a local conference. It was called the California Statewide Leadership Summit. It was planned inconjunction with the MITM4E rally because several thousand gay activists from around the state were heading to Fresno, so why not try to harness that energy and opportunity into something concrete so we can figure out how to move forward.
Geoff Korrs did not speak at either the rally or the Leadership Summit as an invited speaker. He was a particpant just like everyone else and he presented his tables top three ideas on what they wanted out of the meeting and moving forward (there were many other tables, each doing the same thing); which was basically the only time I heard from him all day.
The information in the poll if it got out could hurt us and could be used against us. Know that this a very collaborative poll, very detailed. It had buy in from national orgs, state orgs, local orgs, labor, and even some churches.
The base findings of the poll which we can talk about on-the-record is that basically we are still slightly losing (no surprise); we have a lot of work to do with non-evangelical christians – evangelicals are basically a lost cause; and that certain ballot language helps us. This poll will be used a baseline moving forward to help shape the campaign and strategy as they develop over the coming weeks and months. It was explicitly about marriage equality in CA, post Prop 8; nothing about other states, Federal, DADT, DOMA, or anything else.
Lee
Phony issue.
If truth were told, Petrelis wouldn’t let HIS OWN twin in such a meeting because each of their goals would be fighting the other for control specifically and worshipping the lunatic fringe generally. His idea of “democracy” and “transparency” is the inmates running the asylum…with HIM in charge of course.
You might have to have lived in San Francisco and seen the number of nuts among the fruits to understand this and how they quickly drag serious discussion to a halt, but trust me reasonable limits on participation is more common sense than “elitism.” When did anyone EVER hear of HRC holding a brainstorming session with 250 people?
kevin (not that one)
FYI:
Michael Petrelis has a long history as a gay rights activist and he should be commended as being one of the few folks in the LGBT community willing to be the persistent contrarian.
It should be noted, however, that Michael often goes about being the contrarian in ways that can also be quite damaging to both his reputation, integrity, and the gay community at large.
This includes joining forces with AIDS denialists in harassing journalists and health officials:
http://www.aegis.com/news/sfe/2002/SE020106.html
And joining forces with the anti-gay, anti-sex education wing of the Republican party in an effort to cripple San Francisco’s Stop AIDS Project:
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2001/11/16/MN145369.DTL
Petrelis’s history of activism can summarily be described in one word: attack. Petrelis is not one who builds bridges, builds community, or even attempts to reform or hold accountable groups he disagrees with. With the exception of his latest effort to highlight the persecution of gays in Iraq, Petrelis’s activism is centered around tearing down high profile people and organizations without discretion or a worthwhile goal, other than keeping his name in the spotlight.
Some would call this erratic destructive behavior “activism”. I’m not always convinced it is so.
Michael may be, and often is, right on a lot of issues – but we should take what he says and does into account of his past history.
mark
@Derrick
go…..(Cheney told Leahy on the floor of the Senate.)
btw I donated to CA equality when I don’t live and CA and would never choose marriage for myself or my partner of 6 years.
I’ve also demonstrated for equality and AIDS funding and drugs, and Safe legal abortions before Roe vs. Wade and nearly a decade of Anti War Viet Nam demonstrations.
I don’t need a lame little twink’s opinion…..cupcake.
WE WON THE RIGHTS you whiney little nothings take for granted.
Gary
@flightoftheseabird:
Last time I looked, California is a State . .Prop8 has been a huge blow to all of us, however . . .now the backtrack?
“California Statewide Leadership Summit”. For the rest of us in the other 49 that is “local”.
National “leaders” meet up in CA for a meeting on CA politics to decide what is best for how to move forward . .okay, an email blast from the HRC and posters on the phone pole?
So now there’s a secret nationwide poll that involves all of us, “national orgs, state orgs, local orgs, labor, and even some churches” . . .Excuse me if I didn’t ask about how a poll being used as a “baseline moving forward to help shape the campaign and strategy” in CA needs to be so secretive. . .If this was such an extensive poll why not ask my family?
Up here in the netherlands of Washington State we’re dealing with religious crackpots who want to put simple DP equality up to a public vote. . .are we supposed to wait for the results of a poll in CA or the approval of HRC before we move forward in our opposition because of some poll we were never included in?
I’ve been doing this “step by step” for 30 years. . .another poll isn’t going to change anyones mind.
Give me a hunk of chalk and a street or sidewalk . .at least that got Reagan to eventually acknowledge that AIDS exhisted.
Silence=?
getreal
I was there and that event was open to any activist who wanted to attended it was closed to the MEDIA not the EQUALITY COMMUNITY. Courage Campaign is the only org. that is offering resources to activist to do grass roots work in their community they are some organization sending down edicts. They do grassroots activism training’s on their own dime then offer resources to activists with NO strings attached. NO ONE ELSE IS DOING THAT. Certainly not Geoff Kors who got hisses and boos at the leadership conference when he tried to speak. This movement is going to be about empowering each other now power hungry orgs. like Equality California.
Dabq
@Derrick Mathis: Thank you, but, not putting out the truth or the whole story is how this site seems to be going of late, and, sadly, most of the readers are duped by the often wrong and sensationalized cough, reporting.
People online need to get offline and to the frontlines in this fight for equality. Cackling online about how ‘angry’ you are does nothing, since the foes of glbt equality are working in person to stop it, not screeching online.
getreal
@Dabq: I am starting to realize very few of the indignant people on here criticizing are doing any actual work in the equality movement and Queerty in a space of months seems to be moving from reporting on the activities in the equality movement to twisting them for controversy and site traffic.It is another way we are shooting ourselves in the foot. Anyone who wanted to come to Meet in The Middle could have come to that leadership conference the fact is most gay Californians were to apathetic or lazy or busy to bother attending yet love to criticize the work that was done. You want to included SHOW UP!
Gary
@getreal: Yeah ..just like I’m going to take a week off work, purchase airfare and hotel for a march on DC. . . .even if we had known about the Fresno gathering after the event it wouldn’t have ever been an option.
So I should just stay silent now?
“You want to included SHOW UP!”
and the rest of us should just . . .
quit whining
A bunch of people from my University’s student group were at this event. It clearly wasn’t closed-door to us. If teenagers can get in, so can you! If you make the effort, anyone in CA’s queer-rights movement is available to you. The barriers to access are so low. If you really care about queer rights you should make the effort to find out what is happening and get involved, not just sit on the sidelines and criticize.
flightoftheseabird
I meant local as in a Fresno-centric or Central Valley-centric. It brought people from all over the state, which in my opinion is bigger than local. But I tend to think in terms of scale.
It was not a nationwide poll, it was a poll of California voters specifically asking about issues relating to issues around marriage equality in the aftermath of Prop 8. So no, they would not have asked your family in WA or anywhere else. But it was paid for in part by different groups.
This whole thing was a CA specific event (that could have ripple effects in other states) but the rally and the leadership summit was how to move fwd in CA after Prop 8.
Jon
@Gary: @Gary:
JUST THE FACTS MA’AM would go long way here to dispel the idea behind “conspiracy” “closed doors” and “cocktail party” monikers.
FACT: 110 organizations were invited to participate in the Sunday meeting. Want to know who? Go to meetinthemiddle4equality.com click on the “contact” tab scroll down to “press” and download the endorsing organizations list. Every one of those were invited to attend and let their members know. In addition the “RepealProp8” listserve and the “polling” listserve were also invited.
FACT: The meeting and location was announced from the stage on Saturday’s Meet in the Middle Event.
FACT: No one was turned away at the door. Even if they had not RSVP’d to the event.
FACT: The meeting convened at 10am and ended at 3pm. It was open and accessible to all except for one hour when sensitive polling data was presented to the group and everyone was allowed to ask questions for complete understanding of how to use this to enhance any future efforts. During this time journalists were asked to leave and then invited back after the conclusion of this portion.
FACT: The meeting was streamed live on UNITETHEFIGHT.com (except for the closed portion). The meeting can still be viewed there and on other sites on the web. When has any other group done this or provided such transparency?
It is disturbing, insulting and downright detrimental to make wild accusations about the motives of the meeting organizers that are not based in fact.
This comment goes to individuals, media & bloggers and to QUEERTY.
getreal
@Jon: Wow. Thank you so much for spreading facts not misinformation!
btmenw at Twitter
HEY ALL…
I was there. Every group grassroots & national had representation at the Leadership Summit.
Anyone who wanted to attend was able to if you arrived.
There was no prima donna status. EQCA members arrived late and they had to sit on the floor even though they preregistered.
Jointheimpact, dayofdecision, courage campaign, & Yes on Equality founders were there. MEUSA, 1 Struggle 1 fight, ACLU, SAME, SDEC, SDDC, Cleve Jones, Dan Choi, Sara Beth Brookes, and many more organizations were represented & leaders present. Every group sent representatives.
The meeting was open to press up until we talked private strategy & that was correct to do. WHAT ORGANIZATION WHO HAS A MEETING LETS PRESS FILM MOST OF IT?
Jealousy from some groups pissed off at successes of grassroots organizations in areas they are working is no more and has to not start up again. Please, do not start bad press.
UNITY is the only way, & maybe you need to interview those who attended to find out how it was. I know that I was pleased in putting faces on about 95% of those I follow in California on Twitter. They were there and we were able to look at where we need to go now, & what is happening.
If anyone wants to know information, then you need to go almost any CA town’s lgbt group & you will find someone who was there.
Contact me for the next one. I will be working on the committee to help people be informed, find lodging, & get info for a new MITM type event being planned for JULY in Southern California.
Mark/ btmenw on Twitter
Brian Miller
@atdleft: All Queerty had to do was apply for a press pass to attend!
Oh man.
Do you guys in Queer Politics Inc. realize just how hilarious you are?
“It’s open! It’s grass roots! Everyone knew about it! And in order to attend, all you had to do was fill out these eleven forms to get your own invitation and pass to the session.”
LOL!
Queerty (and all the other blogs, bloggers, and everyday people) were able to participate in the grassroots equality protests post-prop-8 without “press passes” and “committee approvals” and all your other crap.
So many of you guys take yourselves so seriously, move to exclude, and then wonder why your centrally-managed little cliques are politically ineffective.
The reality is, you don’t have room for anyone who believes, acts, looks, or thinks differently from you. Folks who aren’t willing to applaud the Democratic Party’s every move, do things your way, and follow your orders don’t get their “applications” for “passes” approved.
Brian Miller
@Jon: 110 organizations were invited to participate in the Sunday meeting.
“Were invited?” Not very grass roots.
Hint: Grass roots involves spontaneous support from the ground-up, not some organized “invitation-only” event with “press passes” and “managed access.”
Brian Miller
@getreal: most gay Californians were to apathetic or lazy or busy to bother attending
Or maybe they just weren’t “invited” or didn’t “apply” for the proper “pass.”
Brian Miller
@Lee: When did anyone EVER hear of HRC holding a brainstorming session with 250 people?
I never have — then again, I think brainstorming requires several brains… which are in short supply at HRC when it comes to effective politics.
They can build pretty office buildings in DC, operate a nice chain of retail stores in gay ghettos, pay out very nice six-figure salaries to their officers, cover for anti-gay Democrats, and throw great invitation-only parties at exclusive clubs in DC, SF, LA and NY. But they have never achieved anything meaningful from a policy perspective.
Perhaps understanding the situation on the ground would help them — a little listening, rather than taking over and running things. Though I’m sure you’d have to “apply for a pass” for that as well. 🙂
Brian Miller
@flightoftheseabird: The information in the poll if it got out could hurt us and could be used against us. Know that this a very collaborative poll, very detailed. It had buy in from national orgs, state orgs, local orgs, labor, and even some churches.
Wow, I’m won over now.
A double-super-secret ultra-double-secret poll conducted by “national and local groups!”
Clearly, we’re not fit to see it. We should allow those who are fortunate enough to have the Secret Knowledge of its contents run everything for us.
That’s an open and grass-roots approach if I’ve ever heard one! Secret information, invitation-only “strategy sessions,” and closed-to-the-gay-press “rallies.”
J. Scott Coatsworth
Brian,
Did you read all the comments above before you posted yours? As has been mentioned above, anyone could attend. There were no press passes. People who showed up without an invite were welcomed in. There were no forms to fill out. No one was excluded. Many (conflicting) viewpoints were represented. And there were all kinds, races, sizes, shapes, ages, and geographic locales represented.
Take a minute to read what others who were in the room have to say next time – it’ll save you a lot of grief.
Jon
@Brian Miller:
WOW!I mean really…WOW. What the fuck is wrong with you?
There were no “press passes” unless you count fillng out your name on a namebadge as a “pass”. There were no forms other than let them know if you’re coming so that the organizers could have a chair and a lunch ready for you. That’s called logistics in the real world.
If you want to reach a large group of LGBT activists and grass roots organizers you don’t think sending out a meeting notice and asking them to attend and spread the word among PEOPLE WHO ARE ACTUALLY FIGHTING FOR SOMETHING is a good starting strategy?
WOW. Let me know how many thousands of grass roots folks come to your next potluck. I’ll be sure to wait for my spontaneous word of mouth ESP message.
Brian Miller
There were no “press passes” unless you count fillng out your name on a namebadge as a “pass”.
That’s not what the organizers earlier are claiming.
And the planning meetings and various other events were indeed closed.
Take a minute to read what others who were in the room have to say next time – it’ll save you a lot of grief.
I’m reading the comments from the entire group, and the initial defense from the organizers is “you needed a press pass.” Now, folks are flip-flopping and claiming that the meeting was open to just everyone.
I do know that most folks here, locally, were not invited nor informed of the event unless they were members of the established gay rights organizations.
J. Scott Coatsworth
Brian,
I just checked, and only one guy said “press pass”, and he was referring specifically to Queerty as a news organization. Even that wasn’t required. I write a gay news blog, and attended just as me, and needed no press pass. And my partner, who wasn’t RSVP’d, was let in with no questions and no fuss, as were many others who showed up at the door without forms, reservations, or passes.
There was no defense from attendees. Just the facts, which the article above got miserably wrong. The meeting was nothing like what was represented above, and many posters here who were there have backed that up.
jojoko
i saw cleve jones speak at the defrank center in san jose california. he is all about grassroots. and frankly he seemed pissed the way that prop 8 was handled.
GoFish
Well beyond the realm of arguable subjective differences,this is where retraction is the appropriate remedy. indicates how far from boots on the ground involved the poster must actually be. Was this person actually at the rally? It was announced from the STAGE! Only mention of the March on Washington at the meeting was a one sentence expression of the opinion that it was a bad idea. I remember Marc Solomon, Rick Jacobs or Cleve saying anything at the meeting at all (correct me if i’m wrong).
Show up or shut up.
Brian Miller
Show up or shut up.
I didn’t have a pass, nor an invitation.
The meeting wasn’t advertised through typical gay grassroots channels.
It had a “secret” survey, a “secret” strategy meeting, and was planned by a smallish group.
Not publicizing the event through national grassroots channels, keeping parts of it off-limits, and then telling people it’s their fault they didn’t “show up” is rather silly.
Real grassroots events don’t have trouble getting random people to show up — as the anti-Prop-8 demonstrations across the country illustrated quite handily.
J. Scott Coatsworth
Sorry, Brian, you’re an idiot. Everyone who showed up at the summit was there to do the hard work for equality, everyone was welcome, and if all you can do is snipe at them, you’re not worth the effort.
Derrick Mathis
Oh stop with this ridiculousness. How many people who attended the darn thing does it take to get you conspiracy thinkers convinced it was open to one and all? Geez…clearly that was the case. Why are you trying to find fault where there isn’t any?
The meeting wasnt ALL OF THAT. Some of you are making it sound much bigger than what it actually was. What’s hilarious is that the slightest hint by this 2nd rate gay rag that they may have excluded anyone has you all up in arms. And you won’t let it go in the face of obvious evidence that any dizzy queen and his brother could’ve went to the meeting by just showing up.
Queerty screwed up and needs to retract the story. It’s the responsible and professional thing to do. But based on some of these comments I’ll bet even then some of you will continue to believe what you want to believe.
Eric
No really, the reason ya’ll can’t seem to win a popular vote is because you keep on bickering rather than working together. What a bunch of drama queens.
If you look at the polling, everything was going in EQCA’s favor until some idiot non-campaign related organization decided to attack the Mormon Church. Then, a bunch of Xtians and Mormons who were persuaded to vote NO on 8 changed their mind. If you want someone to blame – blame them.
Seriously, its really obvious ya’ll never worked a day in real politics.
getreal
@Brian Miller: I forgot to RSVP and walked in with three friends who hear about it the day before at the rally which they ATTENDED. We walked in and were handed pens and name tags and pens there was no list no questions. It was an open event for activists. If you showed up to walk 15 miles and do the not always fun activism work you would have know about it. Thousands of people were there and heard the announcement sorry it was not announced for those you on barstools and on complaint threads it was for leaders people who are stepping up and actually doing not just kvetching. Why don’t you concentrate on grassroots action in your community on a weekly basis you will hear about these events. Keep being a do-nothing complainer you won’t.
getreal
The only reason they attempted to have a rsvp system is so they would know how many people they would need to feed for lunch which i thought was tasty particularly since the conference was free.
Unite the Fight
I’m pretty disappointed in this report. It’s pretty inaccurate and obviously done by heresay.
I provided the live streaming for Meet in the Middle and for the Leadership Summit the next day. For the latter, I did my best to get the best feed out there, but the 3G network wasn’t strong. But the purpose of this was so that the community could be involved from home LIVE and without editing.
See the post with the live stream here. If you look under the comments on this post and on this one, you can clearly see that Michael Petrelis was aware of the summit and that it was live and that he even commended this at one point. Because I couldn’t keep the stream going, he then makes the illogical jump to criticizing the PARTICIPANTS. He didn’t even know who organized the summit.
I want to clarify, I HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH ORGANIZING THE SUMMIT. That was the organizers for Meet in the Middle and Yes on Equality.
I just posted my full report on the summit after interviewing many organizations involved. You can read it here. They intend to make no decisions without involving the community.
I hope this clarifies the INTENT of this meeting. Yes, I understand that emailing and Facebooking about the meeting doesn’t reach everyone and I agree with that criticism. We the grassroots need to get better at not depending on the internet to get the word out on important issues, meeting and events. But I feel we all are getting better.
galefan2004
State by state isn’t an option its the ONLY option. We can’t demand that the US government gets involved in fights that have nothing to do with them. The constitution doesn’t give the federal government rights over marriage and equality. That is why to give blacks equality there had to be an amendment. That is why DOMA is unconstitutional. For that matter, that is why RvW is also unconstitutional, but that is a different matter. Grass roots movements start from the community up. If you try to push the passage of a gay marriage amendment on the federal level it will back fire and we will lose ground (most likely in the form of a protection of marriage amendment which supersedes all states where gay marriage is legal). The majority of the country is just not there yet. They have been coming around slowly but surely for the last 40 years, but until they are there trying to rush them is going to end very poorly.
galefan2004
Derrick,
You are OH SO WRONG. Any grass movements movement that is going to demand RSVPs and turn away people without them is borked. If there aren’t enough chairs (as you said) then people are willing to stand. You don’t turn people away simply because they didn’t fill out your nice pretty form. You encompass anyone willing to show up. You think the majority of people that get involved filled out that form? I doubt it. After working two congressional campaigns that were completely and utterly grass roots, I have to say that no major meeting was ever closed off to the media or to anyone wanting to attend rather there was a RSVP filled out for each and everyone wanting in or not.
galefan2004
We have a long history of trying to protect the gay/lesbian people from the big bad bully pulpit. We need to get on the other big bad bully pulpit and take aim carefully and hit hard. We need to stop trying to protect gays and lesbians in this country and start letting gays and lesbians fight for themselves. Until we do that, we are just going to sit around having our closed door meetings to protect “important discussion” instead of standing up for our own rights and freedoms.
GoFish
One more time kids: ANOUNCED FROM THE STAGE. Was the poster at the rally? Meetings that you fail to attend and then don’t bother to actually talk to folks who did, do not constitute “secrets,” but commenting on them in a obvious vacuum of information does constitute hackery.
Retract.
flightoftheseabird
@galefan2004: Ok, let’s see if we can spell this out so you understand. The RSVP was strictly so they had an idea of how big of a room to reserve. Like did they need a small conference room in an office building that holds 10 people or the Fresno convention center that can hold 20,000? It turns out they needed a room that could accomodate around 300 people. They also provided food…for free. So the RSVP system in addition to know how big a room was needed they also needed to know how much food to prepare so that everyone could get food if they wanted it.
To my knowledge not a single person was turned away from this event if they showed up Sunday morning w/o an RSVP. People stood in the back and around the sides. And the tables were so tightly packed that you could not walk through the room w/o tripping on a chair. So you see, w/o some RSVPs the organizers would not have had any idea of these basic, basic logistical issues. That has nothing to do with exclusion, because no one was excluded. It has to do with organizing an event in private space (a hotel conference/meeting room) that requires tables, chairs, audio/visual, and food. These sort of events don’t just magically happen.
Please stop with the stupidity, it burns.
getreal
Was Queerty just too busy to attend the event because as someone who attended this sounds like third hand not even second hand information. Anyone was free to sail right in and there was only an hour where polling data was discussed that media personnel were asked to turn off cameras,blogs,twitter. The opposition does not need to hear polling data that a group of org. spent money collecting why should we help them. It is disheartening that so many would rather complain about what is being done than get off their butts and do something themselves.
Bryce
As someone who attended the rally in Fresno this past weekend, I find the basis for this article perplexing. At the rally, before the 3,000 people present and potentially millions over the internet, EVERYONE and ANYONE was invited to the planning session held the next day. Just because the author of this article missed the announcement is no reason to suggest they planned a “closed door meeting” with the intention of excluding others.
It’s impossible to keep everyone happy…I’m just glad we have so many dedicated people trying their best.
Nakhone
Japhy – This is so much bullshit. You have been misinformed my friend. I was there I was sitting in that room as Press because I’m a blogger/activist. It’s a shame you didn’t learn about Meet in the Middle for Equality and the leadership summit. It was all over Facebook, Twitter and other networking sites. Didn’t you belong to the OUTWest Coalition googlegroup? This is irresponsible reporting. We were not sitting behind closed doors plotting the fate of all of our community and we were not planning the March on Washington. Cleves Jones mentioned it during his speech at the rally on Saturday and Sunday was the leadership summit. Again, I sat at the Press table and there was an AP stringer there. At lunch, we asked the Press to step out briefly as we were having a private discussion and the blogger/activist were asked to take off our blogger/media hat and just participate as an activist. Before you go blasting the “elite” gay rights activist in California, make sure you show up for one of our events. Aren’t you based in New York? Please get your information first hand and get your facts straight before writing an article like that. Everyone is invited to our meetings, protests and rallies. It’s hard enough getting our community to show up for a march in response to their Constitutional right being taken away, because they see it fit to go drinking at a bar as opposed to marching in the streets. We don’t need you to stir up any shit or drama that is not there. Yes, there are issues that will need to be worked on and I’m pretty vocal in my criticism of what’s going on but I highly suggest you showing up to one of our events and get to know us before you go throwing out the baby with the bath water.
-Nakhone Keodara
http://socalvoice.net
Student
As a student who was at this meeting – it was fabulous to connect this many leaders in this movement in one room – I sat next to a man from Fresno who just came because it was announced at the rally. My friend sat next to Rick Jacobs.
THAT’S democracy.
What an inspirational event and meeting.
Very thoughtful. Thank you.
mark snyder
Clarification: The march on washington was not discussed or organized at the meeting on Sunday. I do not believe that the courage campaign or any of the organizations in CA are involved in that effort which seems to be Cleve Jones’.