The South Florida chapter of The Impulse Group, a non-profit that “focuses on the sexual and overall health of the gay community” by throwing swanky shindigs, stands accused of age discrimination after requiring anyone over the age of 40 to pay a $50 age tax “donation” for entry into a pool party in Miami.
Related: Gay Party Group Accused Of Age Discrimination For Only Charging The Over-40 Crowd
This week, the group issued a defense saying ageism “played absolutely no role” in its decision to charge anyone over 40 a fee to attend the event, then said promoters were “deeply saddened and stunned” by the amount of hatred and vitriol they received, calling attacks against them and their volunteers “unacceptable.”
That’s right. The club promoters, not the people they discriminated against, are the real victims here. And shame on you for accusing them, a non-profit organization, of being ageist when all they’re trying to do is help raise awareness to HIV prevention!
Related: If You’re Over 40 You Should Stay Out Of Gay Bars, Says Ageist Blogger
Unfortunately for The Impulse Group, its plan to shut people up seemed to backfire.
“Why can you not adopt the simplest solution: charge all or charge no one?” one person commented in response. “You have already stated on your website and other places on this very page you are ‘funded by AHF and private donors.’ Therefore, you don’t need an over-40 surcharge.”
“In the long term, you cannot alienate the community at large even if it gets you what you want for now,” another person wrote.” Later on you might need us oldies, and you will [have] lost us.”
“There is no real apology, for they continue to state they did nothing wrong,” someone else commented. “Too bad, for any hope they could have had for healing this rift is over. Maybe they should have someone over 40 make the responses.”
Here’s the defense in full:
Carlos Zuniga
What respectable gay man over 40 goes to these parties anyway?
moonman157
So can someone explain to me the policy of charging people of a certain age more money that doesn’t qualify it as ageism? Cause this company sure isn’t doing it.
Ken Nolan
They never did say what their “intent” was. Why would the think it’s OK to let the under-40 group in for free and charge the over-40 group? They need to explain what motivated this injustice.
petensfo
So, is this any different than the long accepted practice of a doorman that lets the pretty girls & VIPs skip the line or enter first?
I guess the distinction here is that b/c of age some partiers were made to pay; an unequal treatment. Whereas in the club line, the nerds never paid b/c they were just never allowed in.
Discuss…
Gerry Geddes
One of the first signposts that I was getting old was when I turned 21 and realized that I could no longer get in free for chicken night at the Club Baths.
Gerry Geddes
One of the first signposts that I was getting older was when I turned 21 and realized I could no longer get in free for Chicken Night at the Club Baths
jazz4108
I guess the gay community must learn everything there is to know about aids between age 35 and 39. Such discrimination.
Bill Eastridge
They can deny all they want. Facts are facts.
Chris L. Reynolds
Whether or not an over 40?person wishes to attend a Party isn’t the issue,nor should it be,but,rather, the inherent “Ageism”that is present and represented by this Fee charged,is utterly disrespecting of the path clearing, which these over 40+ Gay people lives lived, represent for our Community, that, make the “freedoms”so easily accessible for the younger Gay Community today possible! We’re our own worst discriminaters!
Xzamilio
What the hell is it with the mainstream gays and their obsession with age and youth?? I got news for you… as long as you keep living, you will get older. No way around it… but this almost fetishistic idolizing of twinks and 20 somethings is almost pathetic.
Xzamilio
I’m sorry…not “mainstream” gays, because “mainstream” as a whole is obsessed with age and youth. But you do see it a lot more with gay men… doesn’t do much to help with our image of being these sex-crazed vapid man-whores… but we don’t speak for each other, so whatevs, lol
throwslikeagirl
@Carlos Zuniga: That’s not the point.
Cagnazzo82
@petensfo: That comparison with women would only be equivalent if you allowed ladies 39 and under to enter free. Whereas ladies 40 and over had to pay.
That’s what would make it the equivalent of what this party group is trying to pull off.
And I’m sure if you only made ladies 40 and over have to pay they would certainly have something to say about it.
Rick Caffey
Im so sorry to say. ..youth forget “stonewall” so they can be be gay..if it was not for us ..you’d still be in the closet. .
DonW
Yeah, they were douches about it, but I kind of understand their motivation. The group’s mission is to address the sky-high HIV risk among younger gay men. Given the ageist gay culture we’re all talking about, any party with too high a percentage of “trolls” (like me) would scare away the youngsters who are the target group.
Can’t some events be age-specific? After all, most gay venues discriminate against under-21s. It would probably make more sense just to set age parameters rather than gouge the oldsters with extra charges.
That said, I’d like to know just how much actual HIV prevention this group does, as opposed to just throwing fabulous parties. I’ve seen too much of the “charity” circuit party phenomenon not to be skeptical.
Eddie Byng
This attitude has been going on forever. I am 60 now but in my 20’s it was the same. Younger gays like to feel and appear to be more attractive and having gays over 40 is like a look in the mirror at who and what lies ahead of them…. Denial.
rickhfx
To be a charity you only need to give 3% of the take i think.
As an old troll, I like old trolls I think they are HOT.
As to the young ones, I don’t think most young guys care who is at the party as long as they are all having fun.
Dan Levin
So when you charge older people it’s a problem but when a club charges for men but lets women in for free, it’s perfectly fine?
Kevin White
Find another party…. These jerks don’t deserve any self respecting gay man’s business….
William Gilliam
Bunch of stuck up twinks .. They will be 40 someday, well some of them may ..
Mack
First of all, some of us over 40 are pretty hot. Secondly some may go to these parties because their boyfriends or partners are younger and wants to go. If you’re going to charge then it should be all, not by age. Thirdly, the organization does the parties to raise awareness of AIDS/HIV in the younger crowd. It’s kind of a charity situation that all should give to, not just those over 40.
Paco
So, if they were targeting the 18-35 demographic, why did they choose the age of “gay death” to charge a steep cover charge? 35 should have been the cut off for free entry. Why not just limit the party to people that were 18-35?
martinbakman
Isn’t that how to raise money?
Make sure plenty of eye candy shows up, so the paying guests will attend.
It’s like straight bars where girls get in free.
But yeah, being reminded one is older can be rude. There may be no way around that, is there?
Paco
@martinbakman: They claimed it wasn’t a fundraiser. They are funded by AHF and private businesses, so the party was paid for. Which is fine if they wanted to get as many of their target audience to attend as they could afford to support. I still think they should have just restricted the age to their target demographic if it wasn’t about fundraising.
jason smeds
So they are trying to raise HIV awareness by holding pool parties? LOL. What a pathetic reason!!!
The sad thing about homosexual male culture is that it incorporates all the ugly qualities of straight male culture – ie the sexism, the ageism…all the ugly qualities. You know, I think it’s coming to a point where homosexual male culture is just going to have to call it a day. It’s run its race and revealed its ugly colors.
jason smeds
And, yes, there are some straight clubs which charge men but allow women in for free. Why aren’t homosexual men complaining about this? After all, it’s our fellow men who are being discriminated against in this scenario.
Perhaps homosexual men think it’s great that women are given favorable treatment by these straight clubs. If so, it just proves again how completely rudderless homosexual men have become in terms of their opinions. Hypocrisy and double standards rule, unfortunately.
Giancarlo85
@jason smeds: And somehow you manage to bring up women in your angry tirade… you always like bashing on women. You’re full of hypocrisy and bullshit…
SteveDenver
Contact the hotel and let them know that allowing such an event on their premises is INHOSPITABLE. Their main aim is hospitality, it might alarm them to find out they are part of a situation that mars their efforts:
[email protected]
NoCagada
@Carlos Zuniga: And who appointed you the decider of all that is right?
vaughnsopinion
@SteveDenver… thanks for the suggestion!
Management, Vagabond Hotel:
The Vagabond Hotel recently hosted a pool party by The Impulse Group which has officially made your hotel the last choice on my list of places to stay and spend my money. I love South Beach and particularly the retro chic architecture and sense of value the community places on it. I also love the ambiance and night life, but events that you support like this one do you and your hotel a great disservice. You are no doubt aware that men over the age of 40 were charged $50 admission under the guise of a donation, while anyone under that age was allowed to attend free. This is blatant ageism and wrong on so many levels that it is hard to fathom how you could have permitted it on your premises when you are in the hospitality business, and certainly must realize how much investment capital and customer reservations depend on that very age group to start and prosper in today’s economy.
I attach a link to a news article which I urge you to review, particularly the comments section. Perhaps, just perhaps you will think about what such reviews do to your public persona. In the meantime, I and many others who would otherwise have looked forward to booking your hotel will take our over 40 business elsewhere, where we can enjoy the company of “old” people like Anderson Cooper, Daniel Craig, Tom Ford, Hugh Jackman and Neil Patrick Harris. Heterosexual or homosexual, you have made your hotel a party to ageism at it’s finest, and that is not acceptable.
Here is the link. http://www.queerty.com/gay-party-group-accused-of-age-discrimination-for-only-charging-the-over-40-crowd-20150423
A copy of this letter was to have been sent to the South Florida Branch of The Impulse Group, but they have disabled their contact links. Perhaps they don’t care to hear about the reality of their actions.
Jon Brookshire
To be fair, I bet most of us were the same way back in our twenties. No excuse, and I wish I could go back and kick my own ass for it, but it is what it is. Hell, I’m only 31 right now, but a decade ago, I wouldn’t have even talked to a guy my current age or older, lol. My point is, these hot young thangs will be yesterday’s news in no time, and then they’ll be bitching about ageism, lol. The cycle continues!
sportyguy1983
A circuit party and gay men’s health in the same sentence. Such an oxymoron.
Geoff B
@vaughnsopinion: You couldn’t have nailed it better if you had an actual nailgun. I am barely on the “wrong” side of 40 and crap like this makes me so glad my husband and I told the “gay scene” to kick rocks years ago. Even when I was in my 20s I found older guys sexy and that’s who I dated.(My husband is only a couple months older than me, but whatever). The ageism in our “community” is getting more and more ridiculous. What people seem to forget is that there are younger guys who find us attractive, and we tend to have more disposable income to donate to causes like this (or in my and the hubby’s case say “fuck it” and build our own damn pool. I don’t care to help support causes or businesses who think I’m supposed to fade into the sunset just because I passed a certain age. There are plenty of causes and businesses who are happy to take our geezer ass 41 year old man money and treat us with some respect.
Geoff B
@sportyguy1983: If you only knew how right you are. Back about 11 or 12 years ago, the promoter of Fireball in Chicago was charged with murdering a cab driver while high on meth. It was a circuit party benefitting HIV awareness and prevention which is ironic since a great way to not get HIV is to not do meth. While out on bail, he attempted suicide and in the hospital spat blood at a nurse yelling “here’s some HIV blood for you, bitch!” I wouldn’t go to shit shows like the one in the story if you paid my old ass 50 bucks to attend.
Wilberforce
When I was in my 20s, all my friends were ageist. And nothing has changed.
I think people are bigoted because they have emotional problems that prevent them from learning. Rednecks don’t want to learn the many lessons that minorities can teach. And twinks don’t want to learn what older gay men know.
It’s threatening to them to admit that other cultures may be superior in some ways. So in the case of young gay men, they pretend that they’re too attractive for others. If they only knew that treating others disrespectfully is pure vulgarity.
jwtraveler
It seems that every day I read something that demonstrates how gay people, despite all the injustice we have suffered throughout history, are no more decent or enlightened than the average heterosexual, Christian American. I guess the heteronormative/assimilationist gays are right: We really are just like everyone else.
Giancarlo85
@Wilberforce: So what does that mean? Younger gay men should feel compelled to be attracted to older gay men? Why is that?
Geoff B
@Giancarlo85: Not at all, no one should ever be made to feel coerced to do anything they don’t want to do. That isn’t what this is about. It’s about treating people who don’t fit some arbitrary ideal because they’re the “wrong” age, race, body type, etc with disrespect. Enjoy your youth and good looks, but remember it doesn’t last forever. Those of us who are on the other side of 40 were all once in our 20s too.Some friendly advice is respect yourself, but respect others too.
jwtraveler
@petensfo: @Dan Levin: Are you guys trying to justify one form of discrimination by citing another? That makes no sense.
@DonW: Refusing entry to people under 21 isn’t discrimination. If the establishment serves alcohol, it’s the law! I also have my doubts about how a pool party prevents HIV/AIDS transmission. If anything, I’d think it would facilitate it. Knowing gay men, as we do, it’s hard to believe there isn’t some unprotected sex going on there.
Guy Shreeves
This isn’t just a gay thing. I’ve seen many pool parties charge guys rather girls. How many clubs does this happen in too. Bad news and bad practice on all counts.
seaguy
What a pathetic response and to try and turn themselves into the victims just adds insult to injury and shows that this organization is not worthy of anyone’s donations because the leadership is delusional and incompetent. If age played no role than why not say how they came to the decision to charge those over 40 a $50 entry fee while those under 40 had no fee.
I hope this group is boycotted until they stop being ageist, pompous “victims” refusing to take accountability for the actions of group.
seaguy
@jason smeds: Your tirade is what is pathetic. Get real and stop hating yourself and your community.
Sluggo2007
What these bitchy little queens need to realize is that the over 40 crowd paved the way for the acceptance they have today.
Chris
@DonW: There’s an article in this week’s South Florida Gay News to the effect that Impulse’s mission is focused on younger gay men, a demographic among whom HIV-infection rates are very high. What is more, Impulse is supposed to receive some sort of award for their efforts from Save Dade, one of the area’s oldest political-action groups that was created back in the time of Anita Bryant (i.e., the 70s).
Living in this area, I’ve noticed that young gay men are almost nowhere to be seen in social venues where older folk congregate. So I guess that the strategy of making something free for the under-40 crowd and charging us oldsters a lot makes sense.
However, it also sent the ageist message that I was not welcome to their event. The issue is not whether I’d go but that, at the same time I am being asked to contribute to this organization, I am getting such an unwelcoming message. … And this has nothing to do with bars or other businesses that vary their prices based on whom they seek to attract. This is a not-for-profit that survives based, in large part, on the philanthropy of people in my age range.
Hopefully next time they put on an event, they will figure out a way of targeting their specific demographic without resorting to ageist messaging. Until then, I am redirecting my gift giving and fund raising efforts elsewhere.
mastik8
Translation – We hate that we got caught but we’ll take a page from the Religious Right playbook and claim victim status as a result of your anger.
Giancarlo85
@Geoff B: I’m not disrespecting anyone. People took something I said in the past the wrong way. I said I’m simply not into dating older men.
Realitycheck
@Jon Brookshire:
>>To be fair, I bet most of us were the same way back in our twenties…….. Hell, >>’m only 31 right now, but a decade ago, I wouldn’t have even talked to a guy my current age or older, lol.
Everybody is like that, even at 15 kids think 20 is older LOL, and you
know what? It is totally normal, kids want to associate with kids their own
age that have things and thinking in common with them.
I think the term ageism is often misused and abused, if people were able
to put their ego a side and let things be as they should and give time to
kids to grow and be kids………..
lykeitiz
@Ken Nolan: Exactly! That’s what I took from it. A bunch of indignity deflecting from the fact that they STILL haven’t given their reason for it.
Hey Mikey
“Any attack leveled against a person or group of people who volunteer countless hours towards the greater good as well as those in the community who felt fit to stand up to them is, at the very least unacceptable to us.”
Hmmm, where have I heard that exact argument before? Oh yeah, from certain “religious” groups who actually do charitable works and volunteer countless hours towards the greater good [well, the greater good of “acceptably” deserving people – sound familiar?] – and there are many – but cry foul when accused of obvious homophobia. By Impulse’s argument, it is unacceptable to “attack” that. Just because the issue here is self-contained within the gay community doesn’t make it any less discriminatory – it’s just a different kind of discrimination. Their letter sounds remarkably similar to those from the Christian right who are now labeling the gay community as “bullies” and “fascists” out to destroy true Christianity.
Impulse’s mission statement shows that their target is 18-35. (It seems that since their donation requirement was for the “over 40” crowd, those who were 36-39 got a free pass this time.) I’d be interested in knowing what the basis of picking their “demographic” was. I’d also love to know what their definition of “community” is. (P.S. By the very nature of picking a”demographic,” it is by definition discriminatory to the community as a whole.) They can’t claim to be targeting teens or young adults who are more at risk because of less life experience. (30? 35?) By picking the age range, what are they saying? That people over 35 (or 40) – (1) don’t have sex anymore and are therefore not at risk?, (2) have more money and therefore can afford to find their own awareness… and give more?, (3) don’t count because it’s too late for them anyway? (4) will scare away their younger target groups by over-running and trolling their events if they can get in free? Saying they didn’t intend discrimination and that it was misinterpreted is just empty words (again, sound familiar?) if they don’t actually come out and say how it isn’t discrimination and how it was misinterpreted… which they didn’t.
Look, the fact is that if their work does reduce the risk of infection even just in their demographic group, they ARE doing a good thing. And despite being over 50… I mean 40… myself, I reserve their right to choose whatever target they want and I reserve the right to support or not support it. But doing good work does not mask or deflect the fact that they clearly are exclusionary of those in a more mature range and they should just own up to that. Hiding behind their work, as good as it may be, to defend against objections to their… age limits… is what is truly unacceptable.
But hey – it will put a unique twist on their GoFundMe account, no?
Jeff
All that written diarrhea, and still nothing was said. New PR person …Please!
James Sigmon
Old new move on
Hey Mikey
@Realitycheck: I don’t disagree with you, Reality… for kids (although personally even in my teens and early 20’s I was much more attracted to the maturity of guys in their 30’s and 40’s, which I guess made me kind of a reverse-ageist).
15… 20… even 25 these days… I get it. But over 25? 30? 35? 39? On what planet can people at that age still be considered “kids”? And that’s the range here.
Funny though, for many in their early 20’s, 35 is just as foreign as 50. I have a 31 year old friend who is terrified that anyone will think he’s more than 26 or 27. What does that say?
There’s no denying that the gay community is separated into innumerable fragments, and not solely based on age, which personally I think is just human nature. But we have to hope that – especially at such an important time as this in history – those fragments don’t become fractures because we’re alienating each other from within.
Realitycheck
@Hey Mikey:
I agree, everything you say is true, to be honest the reason I did not
comment directly on the party is because I still don’t know the real reasons
and thinking behind it.
I was how ever a bit uncomfortable with some of the comments about age.
And I thought Jon Brookshire, expressed it the best way, and so did you!
Captain Obvious
I blame the people over 40 for worshipping twinks in the first place. They wouldn’t have a God complex if you’d stop literally begging them for attention.
I see so many old men chasing after 18-25 year old BOYS instead of 30+ year old MEN. It’s pathetic.
Why would you even be at a party like this? Leave the little boys alone and start a party for men only. Children can go to the kiddie table.
Bad Ass Biker
Being victims, I guess they will now start a GoFundMe page to support their bigotry.
revjshoregoss
First off discrimination is what it is…. They need to stop drinking the AHF kool aid and do some honest work for the community. AHF as their major funded is one of the most destructive and decisive organizations in the AIDS community they must be silenced
PARKAVMAN
Do they have another name for it? I haven’t seen one. They can either come clean and say “We screwed up’ or cross off a large number of supporters from their list. The damage is already done and their playing dumb and victimized is not going to get them out of it.
jmi2
there has long been a ‘rift’ between the younger & older members of the lgbtq community – real or imagined. what this group has done is brought it to the fore and proved it just might be true. i would like to know the ages of the people who run the group. it might be interesting to see where they fall on the continuum.
and i agree with others commenting – i wouldn’t go to this function…
Wilberforce
@Geoff B: Exactly. Thank you.
wpewen
@Chris L. Reynolds: Don’t expect improvement. At 56, I have really been away from the gay community for almost twenty years because of crap like this. Even though people say I look in my 30’s, I’ve got zero interest in what I had hoped when I came out in LA in the late 70s to be a neat experience. It’s gotten worse-young gay men barely know who Harvey Milk was, what people went through, etc. Sorry to generalize, I just am very disappointed considering what it was like in the 70’s. A completely energizing, inclusive adventure that had an definite intellectual side to it.
skilos
Not only is the charging of men over 40 ridiculous, but their mission statement of preventing AIDS in men 18-35 is totally off the wall. Are you immune from AIDS at age 36 or do they think men over 40 already have AIDS? A group like this should be to “reduce the risk of AIDS/HIV” for everyone, no matter the age or sex of the people. To me the whole party thing here had the main purpose of meeting other men, with the hope of having sex with one or more of the attendees. And just how many are going to have ‘safe’ sex.
Sister Iona Dubble-Wyde
What a fail instead of talking about HIV we’re talking about agism
Joe Anderson
Shame, a dirty shame on them
lcandela123
Impulse leadership is being arrogant and stupid. They simply needed to acknowledge that they made an error, truly apologize, and agree not to do it again. But, their huge egos are apparently in the way. No, we are incapable or error, and to criticize us for this is “unacceptable” (to borrow their self-serving rhetoric)!
All other Impulse events have been free to all. However, at this one, they decide to disincentivize older gays from attending by charging them $50. That is blatant ageism, no matter how you cut it. They say that their intent was to be able to reach out to their target audience, 18-35 yr olds. Give me a break! This was a big pool party! Hardly an educational outreach. They just didn’t want ugly old guys at their pretty pool party. Duh!
Ask yourself this. If an organization had a target audience of white people, and only charged the African Americans $50 to attend, wouldn’t that be racism?
Impulse’s PR person needs to get canned. They really blew it on this one. Their organizational arrogance is laid bare for all to see.
Although they childishly refuse to own up to having made a mistake (horrors!), I bet they don’t pull this BS in the future. Watch and see.
Maude
I may not want to dance, but I want to be asked.
lcandela123
@jason smeds: You are zipping off on some weird tangent. Stick to the issue here. Pointing out that other similar wrongs exists in the world does not make this wrong OK.
Joe Conrad
Well, people in denial are going to deny and dismiss
Homo Erectus
It’s not an age tax, it’s a drool tax. If you’re the type of over-40 who goes to such a cheesy event, you’re going there to drool. Twinks don’t have much money. Tattoos are expensive, so is meth! Let’s be practical. Plus if you give the twinks enough meth you won’t need to drool anymore, you can just fuck them (bareback of course), as long as you give them a lecture on HIV “awareness” first because apparently twinks in south Florida are not very aware of it.
Allen Horner
Well I guess if even their mission statement is ageist their parties will be too. I’ll continue to support AIDs groups that support everyone.
Fredrick Bertz
Yeah right. They’re only sorry they got caught.
batesnight
Although I wonder who over 25, let alone 40, would be going to a party like this anyway.
Raul Gonzalez
Age/racial quotas simple don’t belong in our society.
Liam
C’mon. The whole idea was to exploit the twinks in hopes of enticing money out of a specific audience. It was just prostitution on a meta level. Which in no way changes it from being stereotypically gay ageism.
Jeremy Coburn
Sansacro
I wouldn’t mind paying more for a party. I got a good job. The problem is I have no ‘fffing interest in going to a circuit party in my 40s. At all. I’d rather go to dinner, theater, a museum, a concert, an author talk, even a run–but, hey, that’s me. They could bar me from these events and I would not give one sh*t. Nor do I give a damn if a guy in his 20’s is not attracted to me. We usually don’t have the same interests. And there are enough interesting guys–younger, my age, and older–where there is mutual interest.
Musk
What a ridiculous and immature response, Anyone care to guess the age of the person that came up with that?
Musk
@moonman157: You’re joking, right?
Tom Belkowski
If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck…
Ageism is still ageism, even when you call it something else.
Musk
@Musk: Ignore that “You’re joking” comment.
Stache99
@DonW:Don, no one wants to hear from an old troll like you.. Love:)
Stache99
@Captain Obvious: What they did was ALL about age discrimination no matter they dressed it up.
However,,,,your point needs to be addressed too. You hit the nail on the head. When I was younger me and my friends never referred to our elders as old trolls unless they wanted to invade our space and chased after us. Now nothings preventing you from partying like a twenty something circuit boy and exclusively chasing after twinks but don’t expect automatic acceptance either.
Stache99
Btw. Sometimes I like to go out to places like the Abbey. I look at some of these guys half my age and I think to myself. Was I ever that stupid. Oh yes you were and then some. This is their phase and for me once was more then enough.
Peter McNamee
Peter McNamee
They are only saddened by bad publicity.
Charles Jenkins
They wouldn’t be having these parties without the hard work of those over 40! Discriminating within our community is never going to help us obtain our right of equality.
Stache99
@Paco: Ha. Age of gay death. It’s interesting how fast that goes by don’t ya think. Most gay men come out somewhere in their mid twenties. So were only talking about 10-15 years of visibility in the gay community. However, that’s only half or even less then half of your whole damn life.
Bob LaBlah
To be honest, I have an old queen to thank for “opening my eyes” to a reality that I always “knew” was coming but hadn’t given much thought to until that “fateful” night in a bar. I was all of thirty-seven at the time and would roll my eyes at the ceiling every time I noticed this sixty-something queen smiling at me. One night she approached me after an eyeball rolling incident and asked me politely “what have I ever done to you other than think you’re cute” and sure as nothing, she had me DEAD cold. From that minute on, we were friends because I realized what an ass I was acting like. I cried the hardest at that queens funeral too. I knew I had lost my friend. And I do mean FRIEND. It was an uncle/nephew like relationship. That uncle that only told you what you didn’t want to hear but in the end, they were right and you ended up glad you followed their advice.
It doesn’t seem like it was twenty-one years ago now but it was. As our friendship grew the old queen gave me some SOUND advice about growing old and not having shit once I was ready to retire. She told me about investing, retirement plans and to trust her when she said “the day will come when you simply do not want to work anymore”……….every damn thing a twink would not even be thinking about let alone at this point in their lives have to look forward to (because they never are going to be able to retire).
To be honest, I think they did the older guys an indirect favor by letting them know they were wanted as long as they could pay to enter. If these guys were dumb enough to think the entrance fee guaranteed them a “sample” then they got just what they asked for…..disappointment and their money took.
Robert Julian
They seek to make older gays not simply metaphorically invisible but literally invisible. Some smart attorney should be filing a suit right now.
Paco
@Stache99: Yeah it’s sad that those of us, beyond a certain age, get shown the door and told the party is over. I don’t really mind though, because even when I was young, I was only interested in guys older than me. As I got older, my interest in older men never changed. I’m not into leather and am not a bear, so the venues for us “crypt keepers” to socialize without the fetish themes are few it seems.
edwardnvirginia
GO VISIT aidshealth.org – AIDS Health Foundation – the organizational home of this blatantly discriminatory enterprise.
Some facts may amuse you:
2014:
Total ‘Salaries’ over $83,000,000!
Healthcare sales over $484,000,000!
Total ‘Professional Services’ over $15,000,000
Total Expenses: NEARLY ONE BILLION $
Incorporated in CA, Los Angeles city auditors have disallowed nearly $2,000, 000 claimed costs under a grant program with the city.
They have been buying up formerly local community-based AIDS services around the country.
Currently – April 2015 – there are media reports from former employees that the corporation may have been involved with illegal and/or questionable practices that may be Medicare and Medicaid fraud.
Bailey-Quin Taylor
Oh my god who fucking cares!? Seriously. If a venue wants to have a certain age group, then why should it matter!
Stache99
@Musk: No one over 40 apparently.
bareskin
In clubs, sex clubs, they discount younger people, not something I am necessarily happy with as a 50+ gay male BUT in a charity environment this is not correct and as I have seen in previous posts it would be of great interest to know what the ‘board/committee ‘ are paid and their ages. Let’s be totally honest it is us older people that will help fund this don’t whinge show your displeasure by taking your money elsewhere!
Adolfo Anthony Celis
A party to raise money by not charging people under 40. ¯_(ã??)_/¯
scotshot
In the future they should collect a $10.-20. entrance fee from everyone attending, with the first drink “free”. I always find it funny that the young crowd is always deemed “poor” when half the guys attending are wearing $600.00 shirts.
Alec Hughes
Disgusting. Period.
DavidIntl
It is highly disappointing to me to see once again the blatant ageism from the gay community – it is an ongoing personal frustration. I would like to think that years down the road, we will not have such an imbalance in the gay world, once the progress we have made settles in a bit. I think we are at a unique period in history, when there is a large cohort of guys in my position, who unintentionally fuel this sort of thing. When we were 18, we were incredibly attracted to 18-year-old guys, but weren’t in an environment that allowed us to ask that guy to the prom, or go to a public party, or dream of getting married and raising a family. When, 20 years later, we finally decided our world was safe enough to come out of the closet, we find we are still holding on to the dream of taking that 18-year-old to the prom. So we treat young gay guys as incredibly desirable, and will put up with being treated very badly by them, in the hope that there might still somehow be a chance for us to live that dream. I can no more convince myself that I am attracted to a 40-year-old guy than I can convince myself that I am attracted to a 20-year-old woman. And it isn’t really a matter just of appearance, but of attitudes, lifestyle, interests… So, in some ways we are a big part of the ageism problem in the gay sphere – but we really can’t help ourselves. I wish I had a solution.
Dennis Mitchell
Log Cabin?
Evilklown13
Oh so now we’re part of the community. Well these organizers don’t sound very mature now. They choose to discriminate and then play victims. How the hell are we ever going to get past being discriminated against, if we’re told by these groups that it’s ok to discriminate within our own community. I say “post on line” the names of the businesses involved and boycott them. We have to show the world that we refuse to tolerate hypocrites.
northparkgemini
@Dan Levin: Are you implying that gay men turn into women after 40?
lcandela123
@Bailey-Quin Taylor: Is your brain working, dear?
northparkgemini
@jason smeds: Yes, because gay men always go to straight clubs to check out all the ladies that got in free? Yeah, that makes sense!
blackberry finn
I don’t find this policy so much ageist as a way to get a good, mixed crowd. Young people have less money and are more likely to come when entrance is free. Older folks have money and are keener on paying if young folks will be there. Straight clubs in my country do this all the time, charging men but not attractive women. Also, they asked for a “donation”, not a straight-up fee. personally, I have no problem with it as long as the policy is explicit and consistently “enforced”.
jwtraveler
@mastik8: An accurate and succinct summary. I’d call it a “nopology”.
dbmcvey
Wait, a non-profit that “focuses on the sexual and overall health of the gay community” by throwing swanky shindigs?
What kind of bullshit nonprofit is that? This sounds really shady.
dbmcvey
@Carlos Zuniga: What kind of self respecting gay man under 40 would go to one of these parties. The whole thing sounds like bullshit.
winemaker
This charging to get into a party for over 40 is Horseshit! I live in San Francisco and I see the posters for the various parties throughout the Castro and I find this amusing. I’m over 40 and on principal, refuse to pay to get into a party / event if there’s an age code. Actually, I’m 60 yrs old and considered good looking. I take care of myself, eat right and go top the gym, although I had to take several months off due to major spinal surgery. I’ve found the men in this city to be some of the rudest men anywhere! It seems that if you’re not their type, they give you ‘attitude’ and treat you as if you don’t exist. This is truly sad as we need to be nicer to each other. I’ve been in the city for years and when I moved here years ago, the men actually were nice to each other and any bar you went into, the guys actually spoke to each other and had actual ‘verbal interactions’, AKA, conversations. Unfortunately, the gay community is so shallow and superficial and that men over 40 are non entities, not worth time, sad, so sad !
onthemark
@DavidIntl: “I can no more convince myself that I am attracted to a 40-year-old guy than I can convince myself that I am attracted to a 20-year-old woman. And it isn’t really a matter just of appearance, but of attitudes, lifestyle, interests… ”
Whoa! So you’re saying you’re physically about 40, and psychologically still 18.
That’s fucked up, but yes, that is YOUR problem and one you can probably work on.
“So, in some ways we are a big part of the ageism problem in the gay sphere – but we really can’t help ourselves. I wish I had a solution.”
Therapy. (Or if you prefer, a monastery.) At least you’re not blaming the whole thing on the “gay community,” but it’s interesting that you’re so sure there are lots of 40-year-olds in your situation. That’s your only hope – you have to grow up and learn to be attracted to guys your own age.
onthemark
@winemaker: Doesn’t SF have any old-time leather-type bars with almost all old-time geezers in them? I’m pretty sure they do. Doesn’t SF have SAGE? I’m pretty sure they do.
But okay, if it makes you feel better, blame all your problems on the “gay community”!
Giancarlo85
@onthemark: Lol. I actually agree with you when he said that. He is one of those older guys who desperately tries to pursue younger guys and faces rejection… In my opinion (and only my opinion).
I think if someone is being treated badly, maybe they should change their habits?
I am 29, and generally prefer guys around my age. I didn’t go to prom or whatever… But even I wouldn’t date an 18 or even 21 year old right now. My bf is 27. Different mentality even in the later 20s.
Stache99
@winemaker: Yeah, I’ll never understand the mentality of allot of gay men. If they’re not interested in sex with you then you don’t exist to them and they’ll go out of their way to make you know it. A bunch of immature/peter pan assholes. You don’t see the same thing with straight men though.
Stache99
@DavidIntl: “in some ways we are a big part of the ageism problem in the gay sphere – but we really can’t help ourselves.”
It’s sad because I see allot of older gay men chasing after twenty somethings. We all see the “under 30” profiles all the time by guys 40 and above. They’d rather have no sex at all then to think of having sex with someone near their own age. Even 30 somethings would gross them out.
Unless you make allot of $ you’re going to be a very lonely man. Even the ones that pay for it must feel lonely at a certain point too because you can’t buy love.
onthemark
@Stache99: hmm – I got a different impression from “winemaker”‘s complaint. Back in those good old days he refers to, when he was young, how did he act towards 60 year olds? Dismissive? Occasionally even “rude”? He may not even remember. Plus he’s presenting an “apples and oranges” problem, in that conversation with potential friends is different from conversation with potential sex partners. (As was discussed at some length in a recent comment thread you were in.)
onthemark
@Giancarlo85: Thanks for agreeing with me (for a change lol). I hope I wasn’t TOO harsh to him but I was trying to get through. His problems are probably the result of not coming out by his early 20s like a normal gay guy (I managed it & that was a long long time ago, early 1980s, I’m quite a bit older than he is). Maybe he had religious trauma to deal with? Otherwise I don’t get it. I’m mystified by someone like that who was too scared to come out until his late 30s. And worse, is convinced there are a lot of 40 year olds like him? Fixated on 18 year olds? Yuck. I’ve never noticed that phenomenon, and hope it’s NOT generally true!
@Stache99: It’s one thing for a 40 year old to be hung up on younger guys’ looks. Hey, most of us think they are cute. But he also says: “And it isn’t really a matter just of appearance, but of attitudes, lifestyle, interests… ” – yikes, the latter part is disturbing. Even a little creepy. But also kind of hopeful because the latter part is stuff he could deal with in therapy and possibly, maybe improve.
Cam
Anybody correct me if I’m wrong, but I think that they were using the same irritating strategy that straight bars use when they have a “Ladies Night”. They let ladies in free, or have them drink for free hoping that hoards of guys will come in and spend a bunch of money because that is where all the ladies were.
These guys were hoping that if a bunch of broke young guys were there, that a bunch of wealthier older guys would come in and buy the drinks all night.
I think that both things are sort of bullshit, but the marketers of these parties should at least own up to their strategy. They figure, that young guys want free things and older guys want to pick up younger guys, and they are just embarrassed because they got caught and there was a backlash.
Kangol
@Xzamilio: It really is out of control, and has been my entire adult life as a gay person, though it did seem right once the AIDS crisis began wiping out several generations of gay men that there was some (brief) appreciation for older gay people. That moment seems a lifetime ago, though.
DavidIntl
@Stache99: I appreciate everyone’s comments in reaction to my post. I should clarify that I haven’t been so pathetically lonely, no. I did finally come out when I met my ex-husband, who was indeed 20 years my junior. Sadly, we ultimately couldn’t weather the rejection from his highly-religious family (for whom homosexuality being an abomination was the biggest issue, but the fact that I was only a couple of years younger than his parents certainly didn’t help either). My current boyfriend is also about 20 years younger than me, and a pretty amazing, brilliant, and, yes, unusually mature, guy – we just returned from a picture-perfect romantic getway in Europe. Hopefully we will manage to make it work long-term, despite the challenges of being two highly career-focused guys. So, I didn’t mean to sound unnecessarily whiny. Though I will also admit that in between those two relationships, I had to endure several short-lived encounters with some very immature, and at times even violent, and often gold-digging, young guys.
As to the prevalence of the phenomenon I cited, I have no statistics to quote. But whether online or in the clubs on a Saturday night, I see huge numbers of 40-somethings desperately pursuing 20-something partners.
nineinchnail
Maybe its time to remind the youngsters of today how hard we over 40s fought for THEIR gay rights they seem to take for granted.
notevenwrong
Not an apology.
Try again.
jbqueernews04
@petensfo: Also completely unacceptable. When this happens in the gay bars it should be widely noted in the gay media, but it generally is not.And why would it be? The gay newspapers and magazines all have pictures of young buff men on the front covers.
jbqueernews04
Something questionable about an organization that is devoted to AIDS education and awareness – that is then apparently encouraging promiscuity with a pool party where everyone is walking around half naked. What was going on in the more private corners OUTSIDE of the area seen in the photo above, or after it turned dark? Let the mind wander.
jbqueernews04
@Bailey-Quin Taylor: Oh mah Gawd, have you READ any of the comments posted in this thread?!?!? I mean – actually READ them? Why would you choose to indict yourself in this way – in full view of everyone else scrolling through the comments?!?!?
bjoh249
@Eddie Byng: Thank God when I am over 40 they will probably have better anti-aging treatments. Things are different now then when you were in your 40s.
bjoh249
@Stache99: 30s isn’t old and I am sick and tired of that stigma. Obama and Janet Napolitano caused that stigma though.
bjoh249
@William Gilliam: Hopefully we won’t have to look it by then.
bjoh249
@Paco: Because you read it wrong. Their target is 18-40.
bjoh249
@Jon Brookshire: I don’t know why people can’t find others their own age. People can be attractive at any age if you are the same age they are. It is all relative. Why worry about what some 20 year old thinks.
I also wouldn’t call people like Neil Patrick Harris and Andersen Cooper yesterday’s news. In fact, I bet there weren’t even any famous people at this club. Just average joe twinks.
bjoh249
@Geoff B: and 30s too.