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“You’ll Want To Punch Them.”


From The Editor: Editorial director David just sent me a link to the Los Angeles Times and a note: “The faces of those celebrating Prop 8.” I was afraid to click through, and told him so, to which he replied: “You’ll want to punch them.”

He was right.

By:           Andrew Belonksy
On:           Nov 5, 2008
Tagged: , , , ,

  • 315 Comments
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      HOPE! Woo-Hoo!!!!!!!!

      “African Americans voted for Barack Obama, but they also voted to support Proposition 8, 70 percent to 30 percent. Latino voters were roughly divided on the question.

      Campaign manager Jeff Flint said the Yes on 8 campaign “always felt like a strong turnout among ethnic Democrats, particularly African Americans and Latinos, would be helpful to us.”

      “They are culturally conservative. They support traditional marriage,” he said. “We felt like a Barack Obama surge with those voters would actually help us.”

      http://www.sacbee.com/749/story/1371940.html

      OBAMA’08

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:15 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • chadnnocal
      chadnnocal

      All propaganda has to be popular and has to accommodate itself to the comprehension of the least intelligent of those whom it seeks to reach.
      Adolf Hitler

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:19 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • BillyBob Thornton
      BillyBob Thornton

      While financially I supported the Vote No, and was vocal to everyone and anyone who would listen, I have never considered being a violent radical extremist for our Equal Rights, But now I think maybe I should consider becoming one. Perhaps that is the only thing that will affect the change we so desperately need and deserve.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:20 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Phil
      Phil

      Fuck you prop 8 douche. I hope the courts throw this out on its ass again.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:21 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Cam
      Cam

      According to Exit Polls Every ethnic group supported marriage equality, except African-Americans, who voted overwhelmingly against extending to gay people the civil rights once denied them: a staggering 69 – 31 percent African-American margin against marriage equality.

      I am starting to see a pattern. Large numbers of Jews were workers for Civil rights in the south, some were even killed and hung. Yet for years people like Farrakan and Sharpton demonized Jews. Now the gay community supports African American candidates, supports civil rights and what happens? They treat us the same way the larger country once treated them. Using the excuse of morality and religeon, the SAME reasons once given for denying them the right to marry somebody of a different race. I have one comment for the Black Community. Since you are so religeous. How about a little bit of loving your neighbor as yourself?

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:26 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Stenar
      Stenar

      Can someone in CA please go burn down the Mormon temples there, PLEASE. I mean seriously. DO IT.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:30 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jan Stapel
      Jan Stapel

      As we have done in the past, let put our money where our mouth is. The URL to the LA Times website list all donors opposing and supporting Prop 8.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:31 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jan Stapel
    • Paul Raposo
      Paul Raposo

      Cam, what do you expect? That is the American Dream–get others do prop you up and give you a better life and then look for another minority that you can walk all over.

      The joke in the seventies was, the first black president won’t have to worry about getting shot by racists, because he’ll find a mexican for VP. Guess who the beaners of the 21st century are.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:33 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • chadnnocal
      chadnnocal

      We need to start a movement to remove the LDS Churches tax exempt status. They have violated the tax laws and are now a lobby group, not religion.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:37 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Angelo Ventura
      Angelo Ventura

      YI hope they all rot in hell, those servants of a lying, corrupt devil!
      BAN RELIGIOUS FUNDAMENTALISM!

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:37 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Angelo Ventura
      Angelo Ventura

      May religion be banned one day!

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:39 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • chadnnocal
      chadnnocal

      The Prop 8 Strategy, hind site is 20/20

      By the skillful and sustained use of propaganda, one can make a people see even heaven as hell or an extremely wretched life as paradise.
      Adolf Hitler

      Why does all of Hitlers’ quotes suddenly make sense?

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:40 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Stenar
      Stenar

      By the way, I’M ON STRIKE. I’m not going to work today since gay marriages have been banned in CA.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:40 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Ed
      Ed

      I think we have endured enough. No gay/lesbian/trans/bi persons have it easy being visible and staying strong and proud in this culture. But I’m tired of my gay brothers and sisters being compared to the devil and being used to legislate bigotry. I don’t want to hear how we could jeopardize this or that race if we raise our voices. So, I’m glad we have a democratic president who would stand up for all his citizens (except the gay ones), but it’s just been clear to me that we are not wanted in the fold unless it’s to run their campaigns, spend our money and produce slick advertisements.

      Our notion that we can have a family and contribute equally, if not more, is continually being criminalized while the leaders who speak of change stand by and do nothing.

      Shame on them all for their self-congratulation! Shame on the African-American communities and their churches for ignoring the lessons of history! Shame on my hetero brothers and sisters who didn’t do a damn thing to fight discrimination when I’m the first in line if something deprives them of their rights!

      And shame on us for feeling safe with our luxuries, zip codes and successes. Because right now this FAG is “Mad as hell and I’m not going to take it…”

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:43 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Cam
      Cam

      Paul, True words.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:44 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Paul Raposo
      Paul Raposo

      Give ‘em hell, Ed!

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:45 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rock
      Rock

      Punch them? I want to strap them down and SHIT all over them!

      Fucking assholes! Marriage isn’t for heteros only!

      I want all the hairstylists and fashion designers to go on stike immediately!

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:49 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      “California’s Prop 8, which overturns a state Supreme Court ruling allowing gay marriage, appears to have passed. In one of the most disturbing statistics I’ve ever heard, 95% of African-Americans in California voted for Barack Obama but 69% of them also voted to deny equal rights to gay and lesbian couples. Are memories so short? Only last year we celebrated the 40th anniversary of the Supreme Court ruling that overturned state bans on interracial marriage, a tremendous moment for equality and civil rights.”

      Good question Mr Brayton, but it’s too late, the handwriting was on the wall and most non-color GLBT chose to look the other way.

      http://scienceblogs.com/dispatches/2008/11/random_thoughts_the_morning_af.php

      *Correction for MR Brayton it was 70% of african Americans(so far).

      OBAMA ’08

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:50 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • msim
      msim

      I am not an expert but on the picture above, these people look very white to me.
      I understand some enjoy venting against people of colour but frankly white people are the majority in California and in the US.
      So if Prop 8 got passed (and the lovely Obama got elected) it is because of the millions of white folks who cast their ballots.

      Please calm down and do your math.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:51 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Gerard Priori
      Gerard Priori

      To the out-of-state Catholics and Mormons who contributed to the “Yes on 8″ campaign, I can only say: “F*ck you and the Jesus you rode in on.” That they need to use the force of law to enforce their Bronze Age superstitions demonstrates loudly and clearly to me that Jesus is fiction and god is just pretend. And they know it, too, of they’d let their “savior” get off his ass and do something.

      To the racial minorities who voted to pass Prop 8, I can only say (to phrase it as nicely as I can): “Shame on you! You, of all people, should know better.” If civil rights for racial minorities were put up to a popular vote, we very well may still have separate water fountains.

      Hey, Rosa Parks, there’s plenty of room at the back of the bus, so quit being so “uppity.”

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:52 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Chris
      Chris

      Disgusting. FUCK California. Hope a big earthquake is on the way. Motherfuckers.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:54 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fanboi
      fanboi

      This severely cut into my Obama happiness. I just don’t understand why anyone would vote to eliminate minority rights in this day and age. ESPECIALLY on an historic day like yesterday. The only thing that consoles me is that over the next 10 years or so a lot of the bigoted decrepit old farts who voted for 8 will die.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:54 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Cam
      Cam

      msim, Whites, Hispanics, and Asians, all came out in favor of Marraige equality. The margins were not huge, hispanics were like 55-45, but they still came out on the right side. It was the staggering imbalance of the African American vote that killed us. I understand that pointing out honest counts isn’t very PC, but perhaps one of the reasons the African American community is so anti-gay is because the gay community has been so reluctant to point out anything about another minority. They had an unholy marraige, mormon money and their votes lost this for us and both should be ashamed of themselves.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:56 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • REBELComx
      REBELComx

      Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large numbers…

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:56 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fanboi
      fanboi

      don’t wish CA an earthquake. That will kill us gays too. We voted against Prop 8 and don’t deserve to be punished along with bible-thumping breeders.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:56 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • suzygoo
      suzygoo

      It is time to folks to come to Canada where Gay Marriage is available to all and then launch court actions to have the marriage recognized federal despite DOMA.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:59 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Chris
      Chris

      I’m sorry, Fanboi. I am just pissed off right now I don’t know what I’m saying. Maybe Obama will open people’s eyes.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:03 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Vague
      Vague

      Yeah that pic has me in a bad way today.

      But just to make sure – the caption at the Times doesn’t say whether they are celebrating *for* or *against* Prop 8. ??

      Are we certain which side they are on? Can anybody read the signs on the wall?

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:03 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Cam
      Cam

      I’ve heard that there are still 3 million absentee and provisional ballots to be counted in Ca. Everybody hope that they were all from gay residents who didn’t want to stand in long lines. Fingers crossed people!

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:06 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Paul Raposo
      Paul Raposo

      Wow!

      After coming here for years and leaving comments, one of my comments was deleted. The first time that has ever happened.

      As goes Cali, so goes Queerty, apparently.

      This is why we get walked all over; because we act like cowards, rather than men.

      Racist slurs are permitted, but a call to arms is removed.

      I never thought I’d see censorship on Queerty.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:06 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Chris
      Chris

      I think the signs say, “Douchebags of America”

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:11 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Alexa
      Alexa

      From another blog (no, I didn’t write it, and I’m not black, but she says what I feel better than I could say it):

      “It seems like the frame for the passage of Prop 8 is going to be “It’s because Obama’s candidacy caused increased black turnout, and the black community is homophobic.”

      Never mind that it was voters 65 and over who put Prop 8 over the top, or that one of the whitest institutions in America–the Mormon Church–funnelled millions of dollars from Utah to California to make sure that 8 passed. The parts of the state that went solid for 8 were the inland areas, which are overwhelmingly white.

      There’s no question that homophobia is a problem in the black community, especially the churchgoing segment of said community. And even though I understand why Obama (and all of the other serious Democratic candidates) weaseled on marriage equality, that doesn’t mean I’m not disappointed in him for not taking a strong stand against 8.

      At the same time, I’m frustrated and angry by the rush to pin this defeat on African Americans. It wasn’t a black group that put Prop 8 on the ballot, and paid the signature-gatherers and bankrolled the ads. Nor is it fair to say that Obama’s have-it-both-ways position meant that black voters were going to march sheeplike to the polls and vote as Obama dictated.

      Writing off an entire race as hopelessly unenlightened isn’t going to help; in fact, a lot of the rhetoric I’ve seen in the left blogosphere tonight is only going to serve to reinforce the idea that “gay” = “white”, and that the gay community only notices people of color when there’s a comparison to the Civil Rights Movement to be made. And the Blame the Brown People push leaves those of us who are queer people of color marginalized by both of our communities.

      That’s not the way to build a coalition, and it’s not the way to win.”

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:11 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      “only proves why Prop 8 got passed: we aren’t healed yet.”

      @ No. 39 · Camryn: Yes it’s our fault! We should be ashamed of ourselves. We didn’t kiss more black asses.

      Perhaps we need to lick them and perfume them also!

      Yes, that’s it! That’ll make them like us(a little).

      Should we start with yours Camryn?

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:14 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Vague
      Vague

      Wow – you can sort contributors by amount, state, name, etc.

      The biggest contribution came from The Knights of Columbus Headquarters in New Haven Connecticut. 1.4 million dollars.

      http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-metro-prop-8%2C0%2C2463893.htmlstory?appSession=72445632108777

      The Knights of Columbus website puts their anti-gay work front and center. Disgusting. I wonder what their tax-exempt status is.

      http://www.kofc.org/un/index.cfm

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:15 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Bitch Republic
      Bitch Republic

      Does anyone else think those two main guys in that photo above look like they went home and celebrated by fucking each other? Repressed homosexuals are the leading proponents of homophobia.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:16 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Nellie Danica
      Nellie Danica

      Disgusting. What kind of human being celebrates taking other people’s rights ? The homophobic kind. These people should be ashamed of themselves.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:21 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Paul Raposo
      Paul Raposo

      Bitch Republic, it wouldn’t surprise me if they did. Homocons hate the idea of equal marriage.

      Just read Gay Patriot, North Dallas Thirty, American Elephant for some pathetic examples of anti-equal marriage blog postings.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:26 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • msim
      msim

      No.33 ALEXA, thank you for this breath of fresh air.

      I never enjoy it when small groups attack each other and fight for the crumbs instead of going after the big prize.
      This “white gays” against “black hets” stuff is preposterous. There are not enough people in both these groups in the USA to make laws or pass Props.

      The white Christians Republicans must be ecstatic over the many comments above.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:29 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • InlandEmpire
      InlandEmpire

      Prior to Prop 8, marriage laws were defined in CA Family Code. If Prop 8 passes, limitations of marrige will be defined in the State Constitution. Prop 8 will have the Constitution outlawing polygamy and marriage to same sex couples. Since Prop 8 doesn’t outlaw incest, can I marry my sister now?

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:33 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • richardmirwin
      richardmirwin

      BTW, I’ve never met straight guy who was secure in their sexuality who gave a hoot about mine. Anyone who’s scared of f gs is scared of being a f g. Let’s target this group first for some f ck and tell.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:35 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • David
      David

      Homosexual-agenda supporters always compare their plight to interracial marriages. A clever tactic, of course, but it misses the mark. Here it is, once and for all. I’ll keep it simple:
      Skin color and gender or morally benign characterstics. Homosexuality is a BEHAVIOR.
      Behaviors are not morally benign. They bear out direct consequences, perosnally and culturally. It would behoove many if they would consider those consequences instead of focusing only on “the self”….A trademark of the lifestyle.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:35 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • afrolito
      afrolito

      Queerty really needs to do something about the racism on this site.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:41 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Farrah
      Farrah

      a resounding “Fuck You David” comment no. 42.

      guess what i’m a straight woman and I will stand with my gay brothers and sisters. As the Dixie Chicks once said, “I’m not ready to make nice. I’m not ready to back down.” The fight has just begun bigots of the world and we are no longer going to play nice.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:42 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Vague
      Vague

      Still would like to know for sure whether these people in the photo are pro 8 or anti 8.

      It looks like their signs say “Prop 8 is pro Spanish” “Prop 8 is Religious Freedom” “Prop 8 is Family Rights.” But not sure those make sense :D Any better guesses?

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:42 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Vague
      Vague

      So David #42 – you are gay but chose to marry a woman?

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:44 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Vague
      Vague

      Looks like Knights of Columbus is tax-exempt. How can they spend 1.4 MILLION DOLLARS working against our rights?

      http://www.taxexemptworld.com/organization.asp?tn=549861

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:51 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Cam
      Cam

      David said “”No. 42 · David
      Homosexual-agenda supporters always compare their plight to interracial marriages. A clever tactic, of course, but it misses the mark. Here it is, once and for all. I’ll keep it simple:
      Skin color and gender or morally benign characterstics. Homosexuality is a BEHAVIOR.”
      __________________________________________________

      David, you are a fool. MARRIAGE is a behavior. Whether interacial or gay. So that BEHAVIOR is something that blacks wanted to engage in. They can. It is something that gays want to engage in. We can’t. You aren’t born married idiot.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:53 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Yummy
      Yummy

      Who cares about marriage.

      There are some yummy straight boys pictured I would love to suck off!

      Nov 5, 2008 at 12:55 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Paul
      Paul

      Ah, David. Conflating an adjective and a noun. How unwise of you.

      Homosexuality is not what someone does but what someone feels. A man confined to jail who reluctantly has sex with other men only to return to society to have sex with women exclusively is NOT a homosexual; he’s a straight man who had gay sex.

      Being gay is something you are, not something you do. Don’t believe me? Fine. Tell me the precise moment in time when you decided to be straight.

      That’s what I thought.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 1:07 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • L
      L

      The KKK of C is very visible around the country. They are not a church per se. More like an Irish/Italian drinking club. Feel free to piss on their signs.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 1:14 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jonathan
      Jonathan

      I’m tired of trying to be politically polite. If they are going to vote away my rights based on fear and ignorance and prejudice, I’m going to give them something to be fucking scared of. Two years ago i was politically neutral. Today I’m a radical who is now on a mission to make them all pay for what they’ve done. The only thing that happened yesterday was it allowed me to see the amount of bigotry that still exists and know that when i walk down the street that every other person i pas thinks that I’m less of a human being than they are. Which really means, every other person I pass should duck. Good job guys, way to fuel our revolt. Any one else who is tired of being politically polite can feel free to e-mail me.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 1:15 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • crazylove
      crazylove

      Exit Poll: 52 No, 48 Yes on Prop 8 from yesterday.

      This is the same polling that everyone is now citing as correct as to race. There is also what Nate Silver writes about it over at 538. There is also the reality that was wrong on several other races yesterday. The Exit polls had Al Franken winning comfortably against Norm Coleman of MN.

      I am going to leave it at that because the sad part is that the same mentality that contributed to the sucess of Prop 8 is now on display here with you people. That’s called willful ignorance.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 1:17 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • ggreen
      ggreen

      What exactly did the Yes on 8 folks win? A losing battle!!!

      Nov 5, 2008 at 1:18 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Gerard Priori
      Gerard Priori

      “Man will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.”
      - Denis Diderot

      I see that the Knights of Columbus brag on their homepage about the victory of their bigotry. Their imaginary friend must be so proud.

      I’m glad they have a contact page, which I used to tell them exactly what I think of them and their Jesus.

      The church is a con game with nothing but snake oil to sell. That’s bad enough, but why must they be so vile and reprehensible, too?

      Nov 5, 2008 at 1:21 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jennifer
      Jennifer

      You’ve got a great President. Now you need to get the fundies the fuck out of your nation’s business. BOYCOTT states like California, Arizona and Florida and do it in an organized manner. Make those pieces of shit HURT. Lousy, dirty fascist pigs!

      Nov 5, 2008 at 1:24 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Carsen T.
      Carsen T.

      Shit…my parents have been celebrating, considering they know I am a lesbian, that is fucking disturbing. I just hope it will be found unconstitutional. But I really feel like shit, because since my friends and I have been a bit of a scorn to the Yes on 8 people in the SF archdiocese, I have been getting emails from kids out there who want to stay in the church and still be open about who they are. Now I feel that this will just push those kids away, it will be only a matter of time until the Catholic Church has just basically screwed themselves. I mean with out gay guys and girls, who the is going to be the clergy.

      But my parents are not going to appreciate what is going to happen…hehehe, never let the pissed off lesbian write and proof the Sunday letter by herself. A simple drop of an M from masses can easily turn, “We need 4th to 8th grade boys to serve our masses” to well a very ackward statement. I know a bit petty, but I am pissed. I also know I can screw them more from within the system then from the outside. Yeah too bad, next year’s Bible Camp is basically going to be reprograming all the kids who were brainwashed by the Yes on 8 campaign.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 1:26 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      Hey you guys where’s that UMPF?

      YES WE CAN!!!!

      He’s gonna CHANGE it!

      Obama will help us in our struggle:

      “I believe marriage is between a man and a woman. I am not in favor of gay marriage.” -OBAMA

      “As a Christian — he is a member of the United Church of Christ — Mr. Obama believes that marriage is a sacred union, a blessing from God, and one that is intended for a man and a woman exclusively, according to these supporters and Obama campaign advisers.”

      “he does not support it and is not inclined to fight for it, his advisers say.”
      african Americans will join us, we just need to shed ourselves of our racism and be supportive of them and their plight.

      HOPE!!!

      OBAMA ’08

      Nov 5, 2008 at 1:26 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Sam
      Sam

      Right GGreen.

      There is something to note though. I posted this on another entry but I wanted to post it here too. 52% of California voters voted for this ban. Back in 2000, 61% voted for the ban. Even though we may have lost, this is still encouraging to know that more people are coming on to the equality side. In the end, we will win this but its just going to take time.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 1:28 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • John
      John

      Churchilly etc..

      You are an exhausting fella! Sigh. Do you want and engaging debate with an exchange of ideas and god forbid and exchange of new knowledge or progress? Nay.

      You and you’re rhetoric. Oh well. Tiddly ho.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 1:31 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Eminent Victorian
      Eminent Victorian

      No. 42 · David: Religion is choice, honey. And when enough religious people get together they convert collective hunches into righteousness and bludgeon others with it. THAT is what this country really needs to tackle next, ensuring that organized religions are reigned in and held accountable under the law. Those churches that even once preach how to vote must be stripped of their tax-exempt status, and such cases must be pursued vigorously.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 1:45 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • msim
      msim

      Time is on our side, whippersnappers.

      Jason Bartlett, a black gay man, has been elected, twice, in Connecticut.
      It would have been impossible 10 years ago.

      As for scapegoating African-Americans; I seriously doubt the black population in Arizona (3.8% as per 2006 Census Bureau) is responsible for the gay ban there.
      Racists, like homophobes, are illogical bastards.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 1:48 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • frank kameny
      frank kameny

      Don’t get too excited over narrowing the gap from Prop 22. You can thank Jerry Brown’s semantics trick for that. Go ahead and get a proposition on the ballot to repeal a constitutional amendment, for then you will truly understand what it means to be b*%#h-slapped.

      Your only hope is judicial activism. Except now, those judges will be unable to completely ignore the undeniable will of the people, as voters went to the extraordinary length of actually amending the Constitution, not just passing an initiative that changed the Family Code. Do not believe for a second this fact will be lost on these judges.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 1:49 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • chadnnocal
      chadnnocal

      Our mistake was getting behind Obama. The blacks and hispanics voted for him and against us. Hillary in 2012!

      Nov 5, 2008 at 1:49 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      Yes I do want to engage in more debate, exchange of ideas and unity. I want all of us to do so.

      Let’s start with Queerty’s black sister site:

      http://www.stereohyped.com/

      Yes I wan’t to be looked upon in good favor with them, because it has gotten us (GLBTs) sooooo far!

      I wan’t unity, PANDERING TO THEM DOES WONDERS. I want to love them because they’re going to love me right back!

      YES I DO * YES I DO * YES I DO ’08

      YES WE CAN * YES WE CAN * YES WE CAN ’08

      Deny me my rights, BAN THE LEGALIZATION OF MY UNION.

      YES WE CAN * YES WE CAN * YES WE CAN ’08

      Gay marriage is a over privileged white thing!

      YES WE CAN * YES WE CAN * YES WE CAN ’08

      We deserve what we got!

      YES WE CAN * YES WE CAN * YES WE CAN ’08

      We are to blame!
      YES WE ARE * YES WE ARE * YES WE ARE ’08

      What’s really exhausting John?

      Your tiredness hasn’t even begun John, and I’m not going to be the cause of it. I know hating me makes you feel better about your idiotic choice but…. It’s gonna be the man who’s gonna occupy the Oval Office in ’09 the one who exhaust you.
      Him and the people who I warned about here before this Prop came up for a vote in CA. “SIGH”

      OBAMA ’08

      Nov 5, 2008 at 1:55 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • emb
      emb

      No. 33 Alexa (please, folks, read that post!): Thanks for sharing that. We’re letting ourselves slide into the easiest villification, based on race. Fact is, while a majority of African-American voters wrongheadedly voted for 8, they’re a minority of the voting population. If more voters of ANY color had opposed Prop 8, it would have lost. The fault lies, and our venom and action should be focused against, the Roman Catholic Church (esp the Knights of Columbus) and the Mormons. It was the concentrated resources (financial, physical, and psychological) of those organizations that crushed equality in California.

      We need to organize and focus our attention on the tax exempt status of religious organizations that spend millions of dollars to pursue political agendas. That’s hitting them where it hurts, and we need to hurt them.

      At the same time, we can’t expect that the majority heterosexuals are sympathetic to us. We need to educate them, through positive and negative direct action.

      Sitting around wallowing in easy racism gets us nowhere.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 1:57 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • chadnnocal
      chadnnocal

      CHURCHILL-Y

      Today is NOT the day force us to drink the Obama punch. We may get over this, we may not, but repeating the Obama war cry is not helpful.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 1:59 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • boytroy
      boytroy

      I have never hated America more than I do right now and I am so grateful that I and my husband have the opportunity to live in Canada. I never thought I would say this but I suppose Churchilly has been right. Black heterosexual are not our friend and this proves that blacks are hugely homophobic. Sorry Alfrolito, that not racist, thats shown to be a fact. The victim becomes the perpetrator. Americans in general are still the selfish, evil people they were before they elected Obama. He was elected for one reason and thats because all Americans really give a fuck about is there pocket books. The United States deserves every horror that it has and is going to experience. I find it impossible to wish it any good will whatsoever.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 2:00 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • mds
      mds

      [removed]

      Nov 5, 2008 at 2:11 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • psy
      psy

      Gay marriage ceremonies in front or morman temples weekly! Stake them out! Make sure the kids see us!

      Nov 5, 2008 at 2:11 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • a.
      a.

      We have to look at the bigger picture. There is no doubt in my mind that gay marriage will pass in the future – the only question is when. More than ever before, young people feel able to come out, and their friends and communities overwhelmingly support gay rights – it is a matter of time. Young people are not going to turn 30 and stop seeing their gay friends and family as equals.

      If there are communities that don’t popularly support gay rights, we need to fight against the ignorance and win their hearts and minds, not condemn them for the color of their skin! How can anyone write off all black people as lesser because they voted for this?! Some of us are black, some of our partners are black, some of our most queer+ friends and families are black.

      There are reasons why there is less support among parts of the black community for gay marriage. 1) Huge amounts of racism in queer communities, that is only starting to be overcome – complete white-outs of boards and memberships of queer groups, tokenizing and discrimination in gay bars (and online message boards). I have seen this happen to my friends, who end up isolating themselves from the community and don’t volunteer, therefore you don’t see their faces as often fighting these battles. 2) It is harder to come out for many people of colour because the racism in the gay communities, and the homophobia in their ethnic communities, can leave them feeling completely alone. When your family and community keeps you whole in a racist world, how much harder is it to be open about something that may forever divide you from these people? 3) Let’s remember where this religious bigotry comes from: white people. White people have pushed their anti-gay judeo-christian values on people of color around the world who were often far more accepting in their original cultures. When your people have been murdered and beaten and shut out from participation in society throughout american history, and the church has often been the center of the only community and hope you have, it is going to be harder to go against what you see as your religious beliefs, to support a cause that looks awfully white.
      4) Division between white and black communities. If pro-gay white folks reached more out to non-white people, and fought together against racism, there would be less homophobia in these communities. It will take more than a few queer+ people to change a whole community, but this is already happening, I have seen this happen, and we can choose to make this the future.

      Finally, we have voted in a black president who supports gay rights. He is against using the word marriage because he has to say that to get elected. If he really cared about preserving ‘marriage’ for straight people, he would not have been against prop 8. He speaks openly about bring the country together, gay and straight. Having this man as an emblem for the black community can only help queer folks of all colors.

      Would you really rather see a future where a big majority of black folks don’t support and maybe hate gay folks, but those black people just didn’t vote? What kind of a life is that for their gay sons and daughters? They get to choose between their homophobic parents and the kind of gay community that would make the above comments? Nice.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 2:12 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      @ Chadnnocal,

      Seriously!? Is this the first time you’ve been to Queerty?

      If so then please go to the past posts and read HOW ON THE TANK Andrew Belonsky has been for OBAMA at the cost of informing hi GLBT readers of the dangers of aligning ourselves with certain groups, of the type of people Obama would bring in droves to vote.

      And I’m talking about Queerty’s blind bias waaaaaay before the primaries. Do go and look it up.

      You’re right though, this isn’t a day for happiness this is a day for mourning, but don’t be fooled into thinking people like me who were warning this was going to happen and that waisting our efforts in pandering to blacks would serve us no good are not to blame. NO! you have people like Andrew Belonsky and the whole gamut of Gay blogs like Towleroad and our so called Gay leaders to blame for this disaster.

      It is they who acted like The Pied Piper of Hamelin, playing their Obama flute while the GLBT community followed them blindly like rats to their extermination.

      But hey! They were the brilliant ones(wizards of smart), and people like me were stupid.

      OBAMA’08

      Nov 5, 2008 at 2:20 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      >don’t be fooled into thinking people like me who were warning this was going to happen and that waisting our efforts in pandering to blacks would serve us no good are to blame. NO!<

      OBAMA’08

      THE CHANGE WE DESERVED!

      Nov 5, 2008 at 2:24 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Dan P
      Dan P

      Ignorant, religious, pricks. Marriage is a word, no more, it is not something a religion can own or define, this will be looked upon later as the biggest waste of 76 million dollars anyone ever spent, morons.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 2:28 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • msim
      msim

      No.68 BOYTROY

      Your hatred of black people is not Canadian, it is yours only. Wear it if you may, but don’t drag us, Canadians, in your hateful boat.

      The majority of voters in Arizona /California is white. They voted for Prop 8. Even if every single black person would have voted for it, they remain a minority in numbers.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 2:30 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Chris
      Chris

      let’s put a proposition on the ballot denying rights to blacks and latinos and see how far that goes. There would be rioting on the streets. Gays are the last minority.

      A straight man can kill his whole family, eat them and still be able to marry the girl of his choosing.

      A straight woman can bludgeon her daughter to death with a textbook, cheat on her husband, even try to kill him, but still be able to marry the next day.

      What’s so great about straight marriage?

      If you’re so against gay marriage then DON’T COME TO THE WEDDING!

      Nov 5, 2008 at 2:49 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Clark
      Clark

      #52 Jonathan..I like your style. I say we all get up to no good. For those who don’t want to throw punches, at least fuck with the wacko Catholics.

      Go to the Knights of Columbus website and inundate them with phone calls and emails:

      http://www.kofc.org/un/eb/en/about/contact/index.html

      Nov 5, 2008 at 3:28 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • WillieHewes
      WillieHewes

      That’s it. I’m not coming back here until the editors do something about the racism on this site. I just can’t stomach it anymore.

      G’bye Queerty!

      Nov 5, 2008 at 3:40 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • RainaWeather
      RainaWeather

      You racists make no sense. I’m BLACK AND GAY. Am I to blame for the act getting passed in California?

      Nov 5, 2008 at 3:44 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Clark
      Clark

      It’s wonderful that farm animals got extra rights in California but gay people got existing rights cut.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 3:59 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • charles
      charles

      For God sakes, ignore Churchill. He’s a troll. And he has given *no* indication that he did anything to at least try to get Prop 8 defeated besides trash black people like he has Tourette’s syndrome. No money, no canvassing, no phonebanking, prob. no voting.

      The proposition system in CA needs to be smashed-rights should never be left to the masses-that’s for the courts to decide. And it’s too easy to get a hateful prop on the ballot with not many signatures-I have seen this happen with immigrants and now with gays. And we need to start a petition to revoke the tax exempt status of all religious institutions. And start judge shopping for someone sympathetic to prevent this from entering the Constitution.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 4:07 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      Yes for “God sakes”, ignore me! And what I’m saying!

      Just like you did before this disaster.

      Pay attention to CHARLES, MOESHA777, RainaWeather, WE ARE NOT DEEP ENOUGH IN THE WELL.

      FL, CA, AZ, WE NEED FURTHER DEFEATS!!!

      Nov 5, 2008 at 4:17 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • jose luis
      jose luis

      Where are my human rights or just for being gay I do not have the same rights

      Nov 5, 2008 at 4:25 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • rayrayj
      rayrayj

      I’m amazed at how divisive some of these posts are. Everyone knew prop 8 was going to be an extremely difficult battle. Read about the factors that are involved in persuasion and opinion change. The more people who personally know someone who is gay, the more people we will have who will support our rights to full equality.

      Obama was not my first choice early in the primaries. I voted for Hilary, but from everything I have read and seen, I believe he is solidly in our corner. I’m a little said that CA didn’t perform better but look at the change in the numbers over time. Marriage equality is coming slowly but surely. Even the conservative churches see it coming. Obama will be appointing federal judges, attorneys general and some Supreme Court Justices. Groundwork will be laid. Change will come.

      Churchilly, you’re bitter and disappointed. I’m sorry for you. Really. You have every right to feel disappointed and angry. However the divisive statements you post only serve to make you appear petty and spiteful. It also leads many of us to ignore your posts and therefore miss out on reading any legitimate points you may make.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 4:32 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • krystalv
      krystalv

      To BOYTROY. I am black and straight, and Canadian. DO NOT lump us all into the same category. Yes I understand that the majority of people that voted against Prop 8 were African American, and I am disappointed that my own race would fight so hard for their own rights, but not the rights of others. But it is not our fault. The racism present on this site after Prop 8 passed is OUTSTANDING. For a group of people who want to stop the spread of hate, you are content on spreading your own hate. Because this battle hasn’t quite yet been won, does not mean you should start a new racial battle of your own.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 4:36 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • JJJJ
      JJJJ

      Churchill-y IS right about some things though. African-Americans said “let’s screw those faggots” with voting for Prop 8. Maybe…just maybe….Queerty will finally drop it’s strained attempt to always be trying to push on us that it’s blacks-and-gays united.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 4:37 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • krystalv
      krystalv

      And just to be clear. I’m a black heterosexual who considers herself to be the friend of the LGBLTTTSIQQ community.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 4:39 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • krystalv
      krystalv

      No. 86 JJJJ
      And whites and hispanics also said “let’s screw those faggots” by voting for Prop 8. Why is everyone making this a “black-thing”?

      Nov 5, 2008 at 4:40 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • MattThomasEditorFabMagazine
      MattThomasEditorFabMagazine

      UMMMMM….The Christian right is sending this out via mass email…. a response is needed I would imagine…I’m getting this in Canada at the gay magazine I run… so who knows who’s getting it and it doesn’t look great…

      Lynchburg, VA – In a stunning reaction to the passage of state constitutional marriage protection amendments in California, Arizona and Florida, several self identified homosexuals on a number of homosexual blogs are advocating violence against Christians and other supporters of traditional marriage. Additionally, some homosexuals are calling for church burnings in response to yesterday’s three state referenda in defense of natural marriage.

      In a blog entry titled “You’ll Want to Punch them” on Queerty.com, poster “BillyBob Thornton” wrote, “… I have never considered being a violent radical extremist for our Equal Rights, But now I think maybe I should consider becoming one.” “Stenar” asked, “Can someone in CA please go burn down the Mormon temples there, PLEASE. I mean seriously. DO IT.” “Angelo Ventura,” said, “… hope they all rot in hell, those servants of a lying, corrupt devil!
      BAN RELIGIOUS FUNDAMENTALISM!” And, “Jonathan,” warned, “I’m going to give them something to be f – ing scared of. … I’m a radical who is now on a mission to make them all pay for what they’ve done.”

      Meanwhile, over at JoeMyGod.blogspot.com, “World O Jeff,” said, “Burn their f–ing churches to the ground, and then tax the charred timbers.” While, “Tread,” wrote, “I hope the No on 8 people have a long list and long knives.” “Joe,” stated, “I swear, I’d murder people with my bare hands this morning.”

      And on the Americablog.com Web site, “scottinsf” posted, “Trust me. I’ve got a big list of names of mormons and catholics that were big supporters of Prop 8. … As far as mormons and catholics … I warn them to watch their backs.”

      Matt Barber, Director of Cultural Affairs with both Liberty Alliance Action and Liberty Counsel, said, “This is not just a matter of some people blowing off steam because they’re not happy with a political outcome. This is criminal activity. The homosexual lobby is always calling for ‘tolerance’ and ‘diversity’ and playing the role of victim. They claim to deplore violence and ‘hate.’ Here we have homosexuals inciting, and directly threatening, violence against Christians. This is not free speech; these are ‘hate crimes’ under the existing definition. Imagine if Christian Web sites were advocating such violence against homosexuals. There’d be outrage, and rightfully so. It’d be national front-page news. Federal authorities should immediately investigate these threats and prosecute the perpetrators to the fullest extent of the law. I also call on the Human Rights Campaign, the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force and other leaders within the homosexual lobby to immediately call for an end to these homosexual threats of violence against Christians.”

      Nov 5, 2008 at 5:14 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • AJC
      AJC

      While racial categorizations may be marked by phenotypic or genotypic traits, the idea of race itself, and actual divisions of persons into races or racial groups, are social constructs.

      It’s not about race, it’s about culture; specifically, religiously-dominated cultures of social conservatism, which are usually constructed in reaction to fears of social vulnerability. Maybe the election of Obama will help with that.

      I’m Canadian too, and I know a couple of dozen folk from Africa, South Asia, and the Middle East who have not only been very supportive of equal marriage, but have even attended same-sex weddings themselves. If members of ethnic minorities are voting against equal marriage, it’s for religious and cultural reasons, reasons that need to be challenged.

      Proposition 4, which would have required doctors to inform a minor’s parents before performing an abortion and mandated a 48-hour waiting period before the procedure, was rejected by California voters Tuesday, by a vote of 52% to 48% with almost all precincts reporting.

      So it looks like some of the same people who voted *against* equal marriage voted *for* abortion. It seems as if the morals of some conservatives are every bit as relativistic and selective as those of liberals. Since cultural conservatives generally believe that abortion is murder, what this implies is that, for some at least, murder of the unborn is acceptable, but equal marriage for gays and lesbians is not.

      In other words, it’s about power, not principle; and it’s about fear rather than the “evangelical virtue” of charity. People need to be called on their blatant hypocrisy, which they insist on flaunting at the ballot box.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 5:16 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Bill Perdue
      Bill Perdue

      No On 8 did not make a serious effort to engage minority communities, including Latinos, Asians, Pacific Islanders, African Americans and others. There were a few last minute radio and TV ads but that won’t cut it. They never made a serious attempt to engage the homophobic institutions in minority communities. They left the field of battle as is those communities didn’t count and that explains the vote. If you don’t fight you don’t win.

      The bigotry of Obama and McCain, the timidity of people like Feinstein, Schwarzenegger and others combined to allow bigots to galvanize a vote against us.

      The No On 8 leadership simply defaulted, just as similar people did in 2000. They should have known how powerful the message ‘god’s in the mix’ would be, and probably did, but they refused to call Obama and McCain on their open and often repeated bigotry.

      We need to be clear that it was primarily the bigotry of EuroAmericans voters that beat us in all three states.

      The self appointed leaders of the anti-8 forces didn’t have any idea how to build a mass movement or how to accumulate and work with allies. The unions, the NAACP and MALDEF were our loyal friends in all this but they can’t to the job for us.

      Our ‘leadership’ failed because they refused to take on the political bigots and refused, for the most part, to go after the bigots in minority communities, exposing them and debating them, doing mass leafleting, organizing demonstrations and rallies.

      We should have won by a landslide. But

      In LA Obama got…………….. 1,845,000
      In LA we got ……………… 1,296,000
      The difference is ……… 451,000

      Statewide the bigots got… 5,163,000
      Statewide we got ………… 4,760,000
      The difference is………….. 403,000

      If Obama had the decency to fight for us instead of aginst us we’d have won by the differences in LA County alone, to say noting of San Diego, Riverside, Sacramento and San Bernardino.

      CHURCHILL-Y is an erupting pustule. When racism is illegal we’ll deal with people like him in a robust fashion.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 5:46 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      http://www.jewishjournal.com/thegodblog/item/prop_8_passes_the_legal_battle_begins_20081105/

      “Not yet clear why Prop. 8, which had been losing in polls, passed. Ted Olsen at Christianity Today thinks Barack Obama, who opposed the measure but not gay marriage, helped:

      But African-American Californians overwhelmingly supported Prop. 8, by a 7-to-3 margin. Black women (who made up 6% of the electorate) were even more supportive, telling exit pollsters they voted for the measure by a 3-to-1 margin.”

      OBAMA ’08

      Nov 5, 2008 at 5:48 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Paul Raposo
      Paul Raposo

      ….The Christian right is sending this out via mass email…

      Matt, how do we know those comments weren’t posted by the Christian right?

      Look at this language:

      …a violent radical extremist for our Equal Rights…those servants of a lying, corrupt devil! BAN RELIGIOUS FUNDAMENTALISM!I’m a radical who is now on a mission to make them all pay for what they’ve done.

      Doesn’t that smack of the same type of language used by anti-gay Christians when describing us?\

      Maybe Andrew could do a search and find out if those comments came from the same IP address, or an address in Virgina.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 5:58 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • MattThomasEditorFabMagazine
      MattThomasEditorFabMagazine

      I agree that was my first thought and I sent a little friendly reminder email to the Matt Barber that online website talkback plants are quite easy to fabricate….

      Either way the spin they put on the campaign at the end painting themselves as victims doesn’t need anymore fuel, it’s way too counterproductive.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 6:18 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Paul Raposo
      Paul Raposo

      I agree that was my first thought and I sent a little friendly reminder email to the Matt Barber that online website talkback plants are quite easy to fabricate…

      Glad you did that, Matt. They need to know we’re onto their bullshit.

      Funny thing too, all the blogs cited in that email don’t need a password/login to post. Just a name and any email addy will do.

      Thanks for posting this email though, Matt. I’ve asked around, (I’m Canadian too) and none of my friends have received this yet and some are still checking their emails. I’ve emailed American friends as well to find out if it’s landed in their in-boxes.

      Love your magazine by the way 8^)

      Nov 5, 2008 at 6:28 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Billy Crack
      Billy Crack

      I see a lot of hate crimes that can be prosecuted on here if carried out. You want to be protected by the hate crime laws but don’t mind burning down a church because the may or may not have voted for same sex marriage.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 6:37 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • John
      John

      Churchilly

      Hey you’re exhausting not cause of the TRUTH but because you ‘talk/write @ people’ and you seem to have an agenda….and that’s your HATE for black people…it’s obsessive AND exhausting because if you really, truly wanted to have a conversation about race/gays etc, you wouldn’t be so agressive in delivery…

      Sometimes you have a point and I’m saying this as a black person but come on….do you really want dialogue? No. You want us all to agree with you and hate a whole race-for being a ‘black’ race. You want us to generalize and blame an entire sector of people who were brought as slaves to the US (not their choice!) and 90% of Africa, plus other areas in Europe, The Maldives, Southern India in the 50′s and so on.

      Come on?

      Yes, SIGH.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 6:47 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Emily Sors
      Emily Sors

      I’m as angry as the next person on here (my partner is Californian), but, way to meet hate with more hate… and misdirected hate, too. If anything we should be going after the churches that spent millions to deny our rights. We should be lobbying to remove the tax-exempt status of the KoC, the LDS church and the catholic church for their illegal involvement in politics.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 6:48 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • frank kameny
      frank kameny

      Yes, isn’t it wonderful that all these wonderful boys and girls who fly their rainbow flag and talk about “tolerance” would advocate violence against institutions and people that didn’t vote their way in an election, i.e. the free exercise of DEMOCRACY.

      Fidel and Hugo would be oh so proud.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 6:50 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Billy Crack
      Billy Crack

      Emily Sors,
      Go after this church first:
      LOS ANGELES

      WHAT: “Faith for Equality: A Multi-Faith No on Prop. 8 Call to Action”

      WHEN: Saturday, Nov. 1, 2008, at 12:00 pm PDT

      WHERE: St. John’s Cathedral, 514 W. Adams, Los Angeles, CA. 90007
      WHO: The Right Rev. J. Jon Bruno,
      Rabbi Denise Eger, Congregation Kol-Ami
      Alia al’Barakah, Muslim leader
      Douglas Hunter, Mormon filmmaker
      Bradley Whitford, Actor
      Martin Sheen, Actor
      Rabbi Allen Freehling, Exec. Dir., Human Relations Commission
      Rev. Mike Schunemeyer, Exec. F/ Health and Wholeness, Nat’l UCC
      Amy Brenneman, Actress
      Kate Walsh, Actress
      The Rev. Susan Russell, Episcopal priest
      George Takei, Actor & Buddhist
      Eric Garcetti, President, LA City Council
      Sam Harris, singer
      Tony Sweet, gospel singer

      SPEAKERS WILL BE AVAILABLE FOR INTERVIEWS AFTER THE EVENT.

      ON-SITE MEDIA CONTACT: Jason Howe – 415-595-9245

      Nov 5, 2008 at 6:56 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • John
      John

      This does seem rather predictable. Churchilly antagonizes people, again and again…then still no ‘bite’….but then he gets the newbies…creates a long thread for Queerty…

      And then we live all so not happy ever after in the world.

      The End.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 7:01 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      @ No. 97 · John: Right on!

      By the way, what was the date you were brought here (USA) as a slave?

      I think President Obama was brought as a slave to Hawaii on Agust 4th, 1860 just a year before the American Civil War started.

      And I think most of those 70% of your fellow brothers that voted against Equality for Gay people where brought to California as slaves IN THE 1830′s.

      In all seriousness John, you want to see what you want to see. The facts are the facts and 70% of the people from your ethnic community in California and 71% in Florida chose to discriminate against Gay people.

      Now you can spin it and blame Gay people all you want but the fact remains that people like me who saw the handwriting on the wall and who knew of the viciousness and hatred BLACKS have for us and were also willing to say it without fears of being called names, well we where in the minority and most GLBT’s where under the spell of the Obama flutes being played by The Pied Pipers of Hamelin like Andrew Belonsky. So in reality your people chose to stab in the back(AS I SADLY PREDICTED IT WOULD HAPPEN)their (Gay) allies.

      Facts are facts, and if 71% of a group of people engage in the same behavior not in one state but in two(counting only this election) then it’s not generalization it’s reality.

      Feel proud for yourself and yours.

      You brought CHANGE to America, the bad kind!

      Nov 5, 2008 at 7:21 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Mad as hell
      Mad as hell

      “There are reasons why there is less support among parts of the black community for gay marriage. 1) Huge amounts of racism in queer communities,”

      Yeah, that’s it. Seventy per cent of African Americans in California voted to strip us our rights and it OUR fault? I’m so sick of this “blame the victim” mentality. Fuck off with your apologia for the appalling homophobia in the black community.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 7:43 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Steven
      Steven

      President-Elect Obama,

      We want our $5000 contribution back.

      Steven & David
      a gay couple from California

      Nov 5, 2008 at 8:30 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      I really hope this doesn’t happen , it will be a sad day for Equality if it does :(

      I love the way Bill Perdue (I can hear many people shudder/call him rude names) attempted to say that the level of homophobia and racism is much higher in the UK… at this point expect Bill to deny this, possibly ask for a quote (If I didn’t have better things to do I would give him one from months ago), blame Europe and the UK, wait EuroAmericans…. I think he already did. I personally think bigot is Bill’s favorite word. he called me something a while back, gosh I wish I could remember it, it was funny, oh yeah he also called me english which I had to laugh at.

      Gosh when I think of the things that I have been called by a handful of american guys on queerty…
      pro tory, bnp, and dup. A bigot, oh yeah and racist!
      Now before anyone gets mad, I did live in america as a kid, and I am not having a go!

      … However as a gay person living in NI supporting neither the SF or the DUP, and defo not tory or the vile BNP I do feel a tad shocked, but from what I learnt from Bill and others is that they love to state opinions as fact, make wild accusations, spoof a lot of unrelated garbage, and make darn right silly suggestions, for example the suggestion that the IRA should carry out ethnic cleansing of the British from Ireland. From this you may, or may not see why I am so frustrated. The suggestion of civil war in a country in which “peace has broken out,” and the suggestion that I as a gay guy who witnessed homophobia in America, and recently in NI, I would support the BNP are particularly offensive to me.

      It was Bill’s support of the terrorist organization the IRA that worried me the most, he suggested that this organization was more like a civil rights movement! Most in NI today would agree that both sides did terrible things. The support of any terrorist organization that committed such terrible crimes disgusts me and I hope you will forgive me for going so far off topic here, I just can’t stand that sort of denied ignorance. Is suspect he was hoping that someone from NI wouldn’t ruin his credibility, unlucky for him he got a gay guy from NI with no support of either the DUP or SF who lived in America.

      Here is what I do when I am not fully aware of the latest developments, you might want to get a pen and paper bill… It’s simple really, I ask…
      I see many figures on the racial breakdown of voters, can anyone help me out with a reputable link?

      Nov 5, 2008 at 9:59 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • RainaWeather
      RainaWeather

      @103. No one is blaming (white)gays, but there is a lot of racism in gay communities, just look at the comments on this site, and that alienates people. ANYBODY would be less likely to care about gay rights if they feel gays hate them. There are just as many racist white gays as there are homophobic blacks.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 10:09 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Wayne
      Wayne

      Many gay Americans came together to help elect the first African American President only to see a large majority of the African American community vote against gay equality. (CNN exit polls show a staggering 75% of African American women voted Yes on Prop 8).

      Nov 5, 2008 at 10:09 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • RainaWeather
      RainaWeather

      Why do pople trust those fucking polls? The polls said Prop 8 would be defeated, obviously they are WRONG!

      Nov 5, 2008 at 10:13 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • RainaWeather
      RainaWeather

      *people*

      Nov 5, 2008 at 10:14 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Wayne
      Wayne

      Many gay Americans came together to help elect the first African American President only to see a large majority of the African American community vote against gay equality. (CNN exit polls show a staggering 75% of African American women voted Yes on Prop 8).

      ps. These are the same African American women that Obama targeted on his Obama “Faith Tours” in black churches that had “Yes on Prop 8″ advocates openly shilling for Obama and the passage of Prop 8.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 10:14 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      Many thanks for the info, I will check out CNN for myself, and don’t worry RainaWeather I take polls with a cellar of salt!

      Nov 5, 2008 at 10:16 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      http://www.thenation.com/doc/20081124/kim

      Nov 5, 2008 at 10:21 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      quite clearly a blog CHURCHILL-Y, hmm and with language like this I don’t care for it much!!! “some blacks were using their clout to stop the queers from wedding?”

      Nov 5, 2008 at 10:25 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      that last comment of mine was RE village voice

      Nov 5, 2008 at 10:26 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      Fair enough B Nesbitt, read the other one if you’re so inclined. Plus I do suppose you checked the exit polls on CNN. If you did you saw how under the black demographics both for Yes and No on Prop 8, CNN decided to omit the numbers.

      This is the new reality we are gonna be faced here with in America.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 10:31 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      Hey B Nesbitt, I think you might also enjoy this:

      http://www.cbs2.com/video/?id=82302@kcbs.dayport.com

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:29 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Mad as hell
      Mad as hell

      “There are just as many racist white gays as there are homophobic blacks.”

      And presumably today, the day after this vote, you are going to primarily African American sites to bravely challenge them on their homophobia just as you as you are challenging the gay community on its racism here?

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:36 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • dzerobc
      dzerobc

      These assholes really need a good and hard fisting. With no lube.

      Nov 5, 2008 at 11:45 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Andy P.
      Andy P.

      Is it just me or is the guy on the far right in the dark blue shirt pinging your gaydar?

      Those Mormon closet cases…

      Nov 6, 2008 at 12:18 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      Votes by race:

      http://www.americablog.com/2008/11/its-official-nearly-20000-marriages-of.html

      Nov 6, 2008 at 12:27 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Phoenix (Who voted "NO" on 102 and Wants To Kick A Something Hard)
      Phoenix (Who voted "NO" on 102 and Wants To Kick A Something Hard)

      Okay, maybe African Americans voted 70% for/30% against prop 8, but they make up only what 6-7% of the population in California and 4% of voters…you can’t blame this on them. It wouldn’t have mattered if every single one of ‘em had voted for this, it would have passed anyway.

      It’s religion. Go after the religious parties who funded Prop 8/102/2 etc etc. Yank their tax exempt status. Hit ‘em where it really hurts…the wallet. Make their collection plates hemorrhage cash.

      Only then will they give us respect and a wide berth.

      p.s. Clean up the fucking racism on this site.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 1:18 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Phoenix (Who voted "NO" on 102 and Wants To Kick A Something Hard)
      Phoenix (Who voted "NO" on 102 and Wants To Kick A Something Hard)

      Whoopsie! It wouldn’t have mattered if every single one of ‘em had voted against this, it would have passed anyway.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 1:20 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      Yeah the race came to a 52% Yes and a 48% No(our side) and 7% wouldn’t have made the difference!?

      You’re screwed up Phoenix and it’s because of idiots like you pandering to blacks that today we find ourselves stripped once again of our rights.

      Folks don’t believe me or Phoenix, just check CNN’s exit polls, link in No. 121

      THE FACTS DON’T LIE.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 1:39 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • HATER
      HATER

      Well if ONE EXISTING right can be taken away, i say…
      BLACKS back to the back of the bus, slaves again, and separate drinking fountains,let’s take back Armenians right to own homes in California, let’s take back the right for Races to INTERMIX in marriage,let’s make those Mexican’s whom WERE illegal , but are now granted citizenship, have to go BACK TO MEXICO, let’s take back the Indian Reservations, let’s take BACK womens rights to vote and otherwise…where does it stop? ALL OF THESE THINGS at ONE TIME were OPPOSSED by the MAJORITY of the “people”.. I’ll bet these minorities are glad the GOVERNMENT stepped in and said it’s a human rights issue for thier causes. HYPOCRITES.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 1:54 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Phoenix (Who voted "NO" on 102 and Wants To Kick A Something Hard)
      Phoenix (Who voted "NO" on 102 and Wants To Kick A Something Hard)

      sigh I know we’re not supposed to feed the trolls, but….

      @ CHURCHHILL-Y

      Actually, blacks only make up 4% of the vote. So it still would have been dead even. Why not be angry at Whites? They make up 59% of the population. Why not get angry at Hispanics who make up 36%? Instead you get enraged at a very tiny proportion (7%) of the a whole population. Your vitriol and rage is just as irrational as a homophobe’s loathing of us.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 2:02 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Phoenix (Who voted "NO" on 102 and Wants To Kick A Something Hard)
      Phoenix (Who voted "NO" on 102 and Wants To Kick A Something Hard)

      The largest number of votes for “YES on 8″ came from white males. Hate them.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 2:03 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • pigmentallychallenged
      pigmentallychallenged

      BLACK PEOPLE REMEMBER YOUR KARMA. WE GAYS were cheering you and you “kind” on and voted a black man into the office, little did we know you were selling us up the river! My grandparents were Racist and I stook up for you all my life, they would always tell me that you people were lazy backstabbers and if anyone gave you an inch you’d take em a mile. i didn’t want to believe, but i know now it’s TRUE. You can bet your ass, next BLACK RIGHTS issue , grants, $$$, ect coming up, us GAYS and OUR MONEY will remember your betrayal. IT’S ON. You have effectively turned the clock back.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 2:05 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • michael
      michael

      Wow, this has really created a new divide in America, and as it should! It good to see our community inflamed about these injustices. And of course the Christian Reich is going to try to look like victims in this and just like the perpetrators they are will try to make sure they stay in the loop of hate that they create. After a period of simmering down we will all get our heads on straight and know how we should best proceed. But my fear is that this passion that has been ignited will be burn out and we must have this energy to move forward. Anger is not a bad thing, it can help propel one forward, it just energy that needs to be harnessed and made to work for us.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 2:22 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • michael
      michael

      one more thing. The Christian Reich wants a war. They have to hate, because, well, thats what they do. They hate. They are inviting us to do something stupid to them. They are going to all rot in hell anyway, along with Falwell there big fat leader so let the bastards squirm.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 2:24 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      “sigh I know we’re not supposed to feed the trolls, but….”

      I know but I’m a caring individual, so here comes the spoon you douchebag;

      According to the 2006 ACS Estimates, California’s population is:

      59.8% White American,
      12.3% Asian American,
      6.2% Black or African American,
      0.7% American Indian,
      3.3% mixed, and 17.3% of some other race.
      35.9% are Hispanic or Latino (of any race).

      Many sites, specially those dealing with the criminal system put the percentage at 7.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 2:28 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • richard smith
      richard smith

      I am highly angry at the way in which people have taken exit polls (which are not reliable to begin with) and used them to race bait. 1) look at the photo above…where are all the people of color? 2) even if the exit polls are accurate, .7 * .062 * .3 = 1.3% of the population of california that is african american voting for prop 8. The initiative passed by 4% of the total voting population. that leaves 2.7% of non-african americans who also voted for the initiative. who were they? more to the point…what was the demographics of the actual votes for the initiative? BTW…1.3% of the state population is approximately 330,000 votes. The total yes votes were 5,376,424 (with 99% of votes counted). This equates to 6% of all yes on prop 8 votes being from african americans. this is exactly why exit polls are so misleading. people, do your math!

      Nov 6, 2008 at 3:16 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • mds
      mds [Different person #1 using similar name]

      Queerty is not the only place where people are inflamed about the way blacks voted. People are commenting all over the place in the San Francisco papers about it. Personally I resent the shit out of seeing them all happy about how they have “overcome” while they took a dump on the rest of us. This is a group of people who have played the victim card to its highest degree and expected all to stand up for them. But do they stand up for the oppression of others? Hell no. Yeah, white men may have voted the most against us but then we all know that they are mostly peaces of shit, did we expect anything out of them? But I do not think it is unfair to expect something from the biggest fucking cry babies mankind has ever known. Fuck them all, they contributed to our defeat and I think they should have all there rights stripped away as well.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 5:02 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Nitesurf
      Nitesurf

      So it’s ALL the blacks fault and we’re just supposed to overlook the fact that a large percentage of whites were the MAIN GROUP behind the ENTIRE Yes on 8 movement? Don’t let knee-jerk racism blind you to actual facts, people.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 5:04 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Nitesurf
      Nitesurf

      But I do not think it is unfair to expect something from the biggest fucking cry babies mankind has ever known.

      And why the FUCK do you think blacks were “crying” in the first place? I suppose it had NOTHING to do with being enslaved, murdered, raped and DISCRIMINATED against by WHITES. FUCK YOU RACIST ASSHOLES!

      Nov 6, 2008 at 5:07 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • ZeeLee
      ZeeLee

      OK, even I admit, this board is getting quite racist, and I’M WHITE… geez people, it’s not ALL the black’s fault.
      ZL

      Nov 6, 2008 at 7:59 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      Thanks for the links CHURCHILL-Y, other than the first one lol.

      All this talk of race, and the “blacks,” it may be very interesting but to be honest I don’t care what race they were, if they voted against equality they’re equally bad in my opinion!

      Also “the blacks,” c’mon people! To me that sounds racist, If a gay person has said that just think how you feel when you hear “the gays,” or “the queers!”

      Nov 6, 2008 at 8:08 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Mad as hell
      Mad as hell

      Of course it’s not the fault of ALL Blacks and of course other demographics are more responsible for the outcome on Prop 8, but Mormons, Fundies, and Republicans don’t call themselves Democrats—they don’t claim to be part of Barak Obama’s grand coalition.

      THAT’S the difference here. That and when anyone tries to call the Black community on its homophobia, the inevitable kneejerk defenders turn around and blame the very group whose rights were taken away on Tuesday.

      Mormons are evil. Republicans are evil. But the Black community, who apparently thinks just as lowly of us, well, that’s actually our fault because we threw one too many “White” Parties.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 8:13 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Drew G
      Drew G

      What if every gay man and woman in America just set a date and didn’t show up for work? I don’t feel people realize how many positions we hold and what it means not to support us. We have always “pussy footed” around and never make a statement that matters.

      Do you think we could get organized enough to make something like this happen?

      Nov 6, 2008 at 8:47 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      Also, keep in mind, you jackasses, that while a lot of blacks voted for Prop 8, there were also at least a few hundred thousand who voted against it.

      The more generalized racist bullshit like that which I’m reading here gets spread, the less + less likely we’ll have support among blacks for gay rights in the future.

      Two words for you: divide. conquer.

      You are feeding right into the hands of the anti-gay wingnuts by alienating the blacks who are either gay themselves or supporters of gay rights.

      Fuck you.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 8:55 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      And so it continues… the blacks, the blacks, wise up!

      Nov 6, 2008 at 9:01 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      I am black, B Nesbitt, + I’m not offended by my use of the phrase in that context.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 9:24 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      Yeah B Nesbitt don’t you know in here THE BLACKS can get away with anything knowing that they wont be called on it. They most certainly won’t from THE GAYS.

      Wise up! And depart Northern Ireland B Nesbitt, if after seeing those polls not only in CA but also in FL you choose to look the other way, then that’s it. You’re choosing to turn your back on reality.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 9:36 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      What about the polls for AZ, where there is even less of an African American population?

      Could’ve sworn they just banned gay marriage there, too.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 11:10 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • mds
      mds [Different person #1 using similar name]

      And why the FUCK do you think blacks were “crying” in the first place? I suppose it had NOTHING to do with being enslaved, murdered, raped and DISCRIMINATED against by WHITES. FUCK YOU RACIST ASSHOLES!

      No fuck you black bigot, your so self centered and selfish that you
      have expected the world to atone for all that has happened to your
      people, but the what do you do? You turn around and vote to enslave another. Thats the point fucktard, you just did to us what was done to you and you see no problem with that? That why the outrage because we never expected such treatment from another oppressed group. But its obvious there is only room for 1 victim in this country and your gonna make sure nobody takes your fucking place. Its okay to be a homophobe, but God forbid anyone just call your race on its vile behavior in this election. Black people alone did not cause this but collectively they were a part of what caused this, so take fucking responsibility for your wrongs, you certainly expect others to!

      Nov 6, 2008 at 11:28 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • chadnnocal
      chadnnocal

      We need to focus. It is the Mormon and Catholic Churches that perpetrated the lies about children being taught about marriage in schools and preached half truths to their members. There is a great article located on the link below. It shows how the LDS Church has created a divide amongst it’s own members. Forget the blame game of minorities it is the baby boomers and religions that violated our civil rights.

      http://www.contracostatimes.com/ci_10809469?source=most_emailed

      Nov 6, 2008 at 11:35 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      Ok fredo777, that’s fair enough, we all have our different views or terminology like gays, blacks, I’m sorry I didn’t spell it out but that wasn’t really my point.

      I am not denying the validity of the polls, I’m not expressing an opinion of the polls, I simply said I view all polls with suspicion. I also said I don’t really care what race they are if the voted yes! So wise up!

      “depart Northern Ireland B Nesbitt,” hmm I’m guessing your trying to say I have a restricted view of the world, however I lived in America, and spent a long time traveling across states. I have also travelled to many countries across the world, and spent time working with youth from across the world. Therefore I feel no need to wise up or depart NI!

      Nov 6, 2008 at 11:37 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • paul
      paul

      It would completely stand to reasons that blacks would vote the way they did in proposition 8. It is classic for one oppressed group to oppress another. They see what they hate about themselves in the other group, powerlessness. They hate that thus the mistreatment of a group that they see the same qualities But it is themselves they actually hate. Victims tend to see the perpetrator as having all the power and that is why victims often become perpetrators. Its a false way to feel powerful. That is why the victim perpetrator cycle continues on and on. There really is no difference between the two.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 11:37 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • chadnnocal
      chadnnocal

      I hope don’t come across as terse, but I am so pissed I could spit nails!

      We have to stop blaming other minorities, it does not cast us in a good light, in fact we look like racists. There is evidence to suggest that the religions supporting prop 8 had more to do with our civil rights being violated. They are tax exempt and are ruled by very specific tax laws that among other things precludes them from endorsing and engaging in political elections.

      Take away their tax exempt status and this will be the last time any minority will have to fear religions violating their rights.

      http://www.contracostatimes.com/ci_10911064?source=most_viewed

      No more Mr Nice Gay!

      Nov 6, 2008 at 11:53 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      “We have to stop blaming other minorities, it does not cast us in a good light, in fact we look like racists.”

      RACIST >hatred or intolerance of another

      Thank you for reminding me that Chadnnocal, now I remember that it was Gays the ones who voted overwhelmingly on Prop 8 to discriminate against BLACKS………. Wait I think I got that one reversed.

      “There is evidence to suggest that the religions supporting prop 8 had more to do with our civil rights being violated.”

      Yeah they are called Mormons 2% of California’s population but a wretched bunch none the less and they are also called the black community 7%, who have as a community as much or maybe even greater mental religiosity/superiority complex than the Mormons that enables and encourages them to discriminate against us while decrying racism in every turn.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 12:13 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Unnatural Acts
      Unnatural Acts

      An unnatural act, homosexuality, cannot be sanctioned by society and the government. Try accepting that the majority of people do not subscribe to your radical and illogical views of what defines a marriage.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 12:32 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • frank kameny
      frank kameny

      “They are tax exempt and are ruled by very specific tax laws that among other things precludes them from endorsing and engaging in political elections.”

      So then to not be hypocritical, I take it you want to go after the churches which opposed Prop 8?

      But it’s a moot point.

      When it comes to an organization’s status under 501(c)(3), the political restrictions are in regards to endorsing INDIVIDUAL CANDIDATES and LOBBYING. Churches CAN endorse or oppose ballot initiatives.

      But don’t let facts stop you from repeating it ad nauseam.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 1:24 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Eugene
      Eugene

      I think all Californian gays and lesbians should launch a pink triangle campaign. The Nazis made gays and lesbians wear pink triangles during that terrible persecution. Wear pink triangle arm bands to work, to school, to church, to the park, everywhere. When people ask why you are wearing the pink triangle, tell them that it is to make it easy for people to know who you are so they can discriminate against you. You can also offer them a pink triangle armband so they can easily be targeted as well if the support GLBT rights. If they do not, offer them an armband with the Swastika on or shout “Heil Hitler” after them in the street. Take their photo and post it online explaining that they hate GLBT people. If they are so proud of their hate, they should have no problem being made extra visible to the world.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 1:30 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Eagles soar
      Eagles soar

      It seems the constitution makes for a constitutional way to create an ammendment to the state constitution. Now if the constitution is followed, you want to call it unconstitutional. I see some tried to have it called unconstitutional to amend the constitution. Some claim it is unconstitutional; for the majority to call for a change in the constitution. Why doesn’t someone call it unconstitutional to send a baby home from the hospital without a uterus if they were born wanting one.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 1:34 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      HaHa look at no 151… let us Ignore the lead balloon, he’s reading queerty, maybe he searched how to come out as gay and queerty was a sponsored link or something!!

      Nov 6, 2008 at 1:34 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • AJC
      AJC

      Pat Robertson was interviewed on CNN last week. He praised McCain, cast doubt on Obama, and predicted McCain would take Virginia.

      He was on CNN yesterday, praising Obama, just like Elizabeth Hasselbeck. These people are so full of shit that if you were to slap them, they’d splatter. Hypocrites.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 1:34 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Vague
      Vague

      An unnatural act, voting to take away equal rights for some people, cannot be sanctioned by society and the government. Try accepting that the majority of people do not subscribe to your radical and illogical views of what defines a just society.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 1:38 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • frank kameny
      frank kameny

      “Try accepting that the majority of people do not subscribe to your radical and illogical views of what defines a just society.”

      In case you missed it, the majority of California voters do.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 1:45 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      well said Vague, I’m being petty cos It has been a very long day, I’m tired and annoyed about this one.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 1:45 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Tom in Lazybrook
      Tom in Lazybrook

      Here’s what we can do…

      1) Immediately start the repeal process. Amendment language follows: Gay and Lesbian Californians shall enjoy the same rights and responsibilities as other Californians. Straight Californians need to realize that they will hear nothing else until this is repealed.

      2) If we must wait until 2010 to put it on the ballot as a constitutional amendment, get the CA legislature to pass laws prior to that point that will: Revoke California Tax Exempt status for any entity donating to any Constitutional or Proposition Amendment. Require that ALL donations for propositions or amendments in CA from organizations be attributable to a specific person’s donation. Tax Community/TV Radio Station property (eg. Religious broadcasters using non-profit licenses) in California that engage in election advocacy.

      3) Remember African American leaders that failed to LEAD their constituents last time and let them know if they are OUT FRONT in the repeal effort, they can forget about winning any statewide offices in the CA Democratic primary or about Gay support in any elections where the need or support. Simple press releases wont be enough. Lets let African American political leaders know that we will judge them on their ability to lead their constiuents. If 90% of a city councilperson’s constituents vote No on repeal, and all they did was issue some tepid press release, they can count on universal opposition when they try to run for a higher office where they may need our help or neutrality.

      4)Expose the Mormons..The LDS is claiming that they don’t oppose CA style civil unions..Ok..make em eat those words.. Start the process in IDAHO and UTAH for CA style civil unions. After all, the LDS General Authorities say they are in favor of CA style civil uinions. If they backslide or don’t directly SUPPORT the Utah and Idaho amendments prominently..directly call them LIARS. Ensure that Mormons are prominently identified with this Amendment.. My suggestion for a media campaign.. ERASE LATTER GAY HATE..REPEAL 8!…If the Utah and Idaho efforts fail THIS YEAR..give up on them for 2010 and turn our efforts towards going after Mormon hypocrisy, such as…naming their University after a polygamist like Brigham Young and marrying dead people in their temple while simultaneously demeaning Gay marriage.

      5)Continue to go after those that supported Prop 8. No violence guys, but definately make sure that you know who supported 8 around you and make sure they HEAR about it.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 1:47 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Vague
      Vague

      From http://www.azpolicy.org/pdf/churchescan.pdf

      However, the activity must not constitute more than an “insubstantial” part of a church’s overall activity, including time and money.

      1.4 million dollars from the Knights of Columbus sounds like pretty substantial money.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 1:48 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Vague
      Vague

      In case you missed it, the majority of California voters do.

      I suspect you are wrong. You think that the majority of California voters believe that constitutional rights should be given or taken away based on a majority vote? I call that fascism.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 1:52 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Vague
      Vague

      Thanks B Nesbitt. I’m pretty bummed myself. This is intolerable.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 1:54 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Eagles soar
      Eagles soar

      Looks like there is a lot of intolerance directed for LDS. I suspect attacking churches tells us who is intolerant and biased.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 2:13 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Tom in Lazybrook
      Tom in Lazybrook

      Hey Eagles Soar.

      The Church of Latter Gay Hate is being fairly portrayed as hateful bigots. They DO marry dead people in their temples. They DO celebrate a polygamist pedophile (I’ll call marrying someone 40 years younger pedophilia) as they namesake of their “University”. They DID singlehandedly finance this hate amendment. One of Matt Shepards lynchers has a Mormon heritage. Their General Authority (Mormon leadership) actively LIED about their support for civil unions. They DO oppose paying Gay people the same in wages and benefits as straight people. In short, they hate Gay people and want to HARM their families. These are all FACTS.

      The Mormons bought this Latter Gay Hate Amendment. They can deal with the aftermath. We certainly have to deal with more of it than them.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 2:21 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      stating the obvious here… my own experience with LDS is they stop the nice stuff when they discover you are gay, and start treat humans with no respect or love, how christian of them! From oh so friendly to disgust in the time it takes a guy to hold your hand, I call that Intolerant Eagles soar.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 3:05 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Arondeus
      Arondeus

      A large majority of African-Americans supported this. On the same day that we celebrated the first black president. Now, I’m thinking back to all of the testimonies I heard from black Americans – those tearful and joyous testimonies describing how they felt when Obama won. And I’m thinking back to all of my Queer brothers and sisters (black, white, latino, and asian Queers) who volunteered to help Obama win. And I’m thinking “Screw them!”
      I don’t want to hear ONE more African-American whimper and preen about how proud they are of Obama’s win. I don’t want to hear ONE more African-American shed those crocodile tears while stomping us into the dirt. Not ONE more!! Hypocrites!!

      Nov 6, 2008 at 4:20 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Arondeus
      Arondeus

      I agree with Tom in Lazybrook. WE MUST ACT NOW!! If we can lose our rights in CA of all places, then we can lose much much more then we think. AGITATE, AGITATE, AGITATE!!!!!

      Nov 6, 2008 at 4:28 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      Yeah, that’s the way, Arondeus. Blame the African-Americans.

      And call them hypocrites when you see any one of them crying over Obama’s win.

      Oh, just make sure to ask first if he or she is one of the hundreds of thousands of black voters who were actually voting against measures like Prop 8. What difference does that make, though? If a lot of blacks voted for Prop 8, we should probably just play it safe + attack all of them as a result.

      Smart idea. And next time we have a “Prop 8″ situation, maybe we can work our way up to 95% of blacks voting in favor of it out of spite? I’m sure, after all, that they’re all alike.

      This is a vicious cycle. Instead of getting pissed at all blacks for the actions of some, maybe our time would be better spent finding more ways to connect to gays of color + non-gays of color to spread awareness + understanding. Just a thought, of course.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 4:40 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Arondeus
      Arondeus

      Fredo777, I appreciate your opinion but I disagree. We have tried being polite. We have tried building coalitions. We have tried to build consensus. We have tried to find common ground. It is time to be angry.
      There is alot of blame to go around. I blame religion. I blame the intolerance and bigotry of christianity, not just the African-Americans.
      I am simply pointing out the hypocrisy of this election’s results – especially considering that it was a black man who won the presidency for the first time. That fact makes the case for me that 70% of black Californians voting to discriminitate against us is just that: Hypocrisy.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 4:58 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      So, basically, black voters should be held to a different standard, because they’ve been oppressed in the past, + shouldn’t vote based on their own beliefs? Again, religious issue. Not a racial one.

      Btw, did anyone ever consider the fact that, just maybe, exit polls are as flawed as any other poll? Consider the possibility that more black voters polled were just honest about having voted for Prop 8, while some of the voters of other races might have lied + given the more “PC” answer (just as plenty of people do when they are polled about such topics before voting)?

      It’s entirely possible that a higher percentage of white voters (for example) also voted for Prop 8 in the privacy of the booth, but told exit pollsters what they thought sounded better. What proof do we really have? Also, all of the CA ballots haven’t even been counted yet.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 5:23 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Not very comfortable with this
      Not very comfortable with this

      Regarding “next time we have a Prop 8 situation” – I say that’s the problem.

      What kind of state has a popular vote on what groups of people get rights and who doesn’t? A fascist state. How the bloody h*ll can California allow this?

      Nov 6, 2008 at 5:25 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      True, I hope we don’t have any more Prop 8 “situations” in the future, also.

      I’d rather spend my energy on finding more ways to unite the gay community + my other community, the black one than finger-pointing + alienating. Maybe that’s just me.

      All in all, I’m tired of arguing this subject.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 5:34 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Carla
      Carla

      Look, people, I really, really, hate to have to say this, but on one level, some gay/lesbian people were dramatically foolish, and that foolish behaviour has come back to bite us, pit-bull style.

      The “pit-bulls” of the “religious wrong” have been over-joyed for years now, getting to show photos and videos of the more “dramatic” images from the pride parades. Think about it……its not hard to remember quite a few images which played right into the hands of the jesus-jumpers, holy-rollers, and assorted other types of religious frauds, the ones who make bigotry a “family value”

      For quite a few years now, my partner (and now, allegedly, ex-spouse) I flatly refused to take part in any event where a small minority of gay/lesbian people made such a spectacle of themselves.

      Again and again, we tried to talk some of these people out of doing the dramatic “flaming faggot” , “leather daddy” and suchlike images for public display……cos it was just do damned obvious that those images were going to be used by the jesus creeps to “educate” (propagandise) their followers about gay/lesbian people.

      Sure, the main reason we lost so badly on prop h8te was the sheer high quality of the propaganda scam commercials run by the jesus creeps…..think about this…..they were “playing to win”, and were willing to promote any scam, lie, cultural/emotional “hook” which would grip the emotions of the prospective voters.

      That worked pretty damned well, now, didn’t it?

      The “no on h8te” commercials, by contrast, were honest and gentle…..putting up honesty against hard-core propagandists worked out pretty much like the tragic story of the famous Polish cavalry in 1939, with their beautiful Lippizan-trained horses, facing the German “panzer” tanks, “stuka” aircraft, and the other horrors of Hitler’s “Blitzkreig” war machine.

      We were really “just lucky” to have lost by so small a percentage, when you consider the jesus creeps’ propaganda “Blitzkreig”. That, at least, tells us that bigotry “doesn’t sell” for very nearly half of Californians.

      Now……with apologies for being a bit “harsh”…..consider the opinion/advice of a crusty old dyke who was a “quiet little mouse in the corner” back in the “Daughters of Bilitis” days of the ’60′s.

      We may well be set back for four years time, before we can undo the effect of prop h8te. In those four years, we can, if we work together carefully, reverse the public image which the jesus creeps used against us, and show the world an image of gay/lesbian people as responsible citizens.

      To that end, I would propose that the next couple of pride parades be run as solemn marches of mourning.

      Having the television news of the world showing thousands of conservatively dressed, solemn-faced gay/lesbian people, and our allies, marching slowly but purposefully, with tasteful but clear signs saying “we will see our civil rights restored”, “end bigotry” and similar themes will demonstrate to the world that we will no longer allow ourselves to be used by the promoters of discrimination and bigotry.

      As I write this, the “religious wrong” creeps are putting in statements on their web-sites about how their “god” has been avenged, etc., ad nauseam. Go read their web-sites, and learn about how, having stopped “faggot marriage”, now they will go on to reverse domestic partnership/civil union rights, and bring back the “Knight amendment” to fire any school employee suspected of being gay/lesbian.

      They are deadly serious…..They are the “American Taliban” and they are deadly serious in their quest for political power…..and will literally “stick at nothing” to accomplish that objective.

      It really is no joke, people…..go read for yourselves…..can you imagine living in an Islamic theocratic country?…..Well, substitute “Jesus” for “Mohammed”, and “God” for “Allah”, and thats just what we’ll get if we aren’t careful.

      (Sorry about the seeming paranoia, but the threat is very real…..take the time to follow “links” on the internet, and read up on the theocracy psychotics for yourself…..they may be mentally ill, but they could well be dangerous….its no joke, we’ve just now seen a teeny-tiny bit of their agenda, and it really hurts, doesn’t it?)

      cheers

      Carla

      Nov 6, 2008 at 6:05 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jim
      Jim

      Sorry Carla, I can’t agree with that. You have your choice to participate or not.

      Use your time and talents creating something, not telling everybody else how they need to present themselves.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 6:33 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      SWEEP….SWEEP….Blacks voted 70% in CA in favor for the ban…SWEEP….SWEEP….SWEEP…Blacks voted in favor of a similar ban in FL 71 %…SWEEP….And SWEPT under the rug!

      Meanwhile Mormons as vile and hateful as they are make roughly 2% in CA and unlike African Americans are not hard line Democrats……SWEEP…SWEEP….SWEPT!

      The MORMONS ARE ONLY TO BLAME!

      Nov 6, 2008 at 6:45 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Tom in Houston
      Tom in Houston

      Lets find out which African American State legislators, Congressmen, and other elected officials had the highest percentage of yes on 8 votes amongst their constituency and make sure they know that if they fail to LEAD their constiuents, we will make sure they’ll see payback in the next Dem primary.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 7:25 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • callmewhitey,call me faggot
      callmewhitey,call me faggot

      I don’t give a FUCK if WHITES were the majority of the votes to put us under, the percentage of the Whites who DID vote, were a LOT lower AGAINST US than the percentage of MEXICAN that voted against us (53+%) and the BLACKS (69+%) that voted against us!

      PAYBACK IS A BITCH!

      Next time there is a vote, or Money to be doled out to these groups, such as COLLEGE FUNDS / EDUCATION / VOCATIONAL, IMMIGRATION LAWS, or MONEY needed for various causes, ect. US GAYS and OUR SUPPORTERS WILL REMEMBER THIS!!!!

      OUR votes and MONEY CAN make the difference of some of those people being DEPORTED, NOT GETTING CITIZENSHIP, NOT GETTING THE FUNDS THEY NEED FOR EDUCATION< HOUSING, WHATEVER! ** YES WE CAN ! ***

      These REVERSE RACIST, BIGOTED FUCKS sure want our Money and our services (hello Hairdressers,stylists,waiters,ect), but want us to be treated as lower class citizens!

      i think it’s because BLACKS were the LOWEST form of existence on the totem pole for SO LONG, Now THEY have the opportunity to put another class BENEATH THEM.

      Not too long ago, BLACKS and GAYS shared a very special bond, during the depression when being Gay was ILLEGAL, and BLACKS had NO RIGHTS,they actually mingled together in “underground”, “Illegal” bars/nightclubs where they could find strength and solace in one another. They were each others ALLIES which is WHY this SO OFFENSIVE TO US MORE THAN ANY OTHER group of people bagging on us.

      It’s AMAZING what being able to bang some white girls, having some cash in your pocket thanks to selling crack, pimping, and success of a few Rap videos can do to a GROUP OF PEOPLE.

      PAYBACK IS A BIOTCH

      Nov 6, 2008 at 8:06 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • LOL
      LOL

      LMFAO at the previous post! It’s shocking when somebody actually says what a lot of us are thinking but don’t have the nerve to blurt out.
      LOL

      Nov 6, 2008 at 8:10 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      http://www.insidebayarea.com/elections/ci_10909847

      “Black and Latino voters critical to same-sex marriage ban’s success”

      Nov 6, 2008 at 8:15 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • debra
      debra

      I am an African American woman too. I find it hard to believe that we are being singled out as voting overwhelmingly for Prop 8.

      I am not gay, but I am tolerant of others who aren’t like me. We are all human. I would have voted no on Prop 8 but I do not live in California.

      To tell the truth, I think it was deliberately confusing and unfair to phrase Prop 8 as a yes or no referendum where voting no meant yes, and yes meant no.

      It wouldn’t surprise me if regardless of race and sexual orientation, people voted “yes” intending to say that “Yes, gay marriages should be legal” Or “No! Gay marriages are terrifying and I don’t approve of them”.

      It’s a mistake to start ganging up on the Black vote.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 8:17 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      Debra, it doesn’t matter. A lot of the short-sighted folks just want to make someone a scapegoat, neglecting the fact that thousands of black voters were also voting against Prop 8 + alienating more + more people in the process.

      Not to mention, a lot of the same people so outraged about the black voters who voted for Prop 8 likely weren’t making nearly as much noise before Nov. 4th to get blacks, whites, + everyone else (including the thousands of Cali gays who didn’t even vote) to vote No on 8.

      We all have to take some blame for our efforts (or lack thereof) which lead to this prop passing.

      Btw, Cunthill-y, I’m still grading your posts + you are still at a 100% negative-against-black post rating. Sad.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 8:36 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Tom in Houston
      Tom in Houston

      Debra and Fredo.

      What part of 70% of blacks voted against Prop 8 don’t you understand? African Americans in California and the Mormons are responsible for this latter day Plessy v Ferguson (seperate but ‘equal’) and will be blamed for its passage until it is repealed.

      There are a few (apparenly VERY few) Blacks and Mormons who didn’t support hate against Gays. We recognize that. But this is POLITICS. And it is a FACT that without extreme hatred of Gay people by virtually all African American “christian” leaders, this would not be law.

      So where do we go from here? 1) We need to make sure that African Americans who need our support on anything must LEAD (not just a press release – I mean LEAD) their communities on these issues. I don’t want to see them palling around with those bigots. Otherwise, they can count on our opposition in the next Dem primary. And I’d rather have a Republican in office than an Anti-Gay Democrat.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 11:17 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Truth
      Truth

      I don’t think there is anything racist with pointing out the facts.

      I hate that. Just speak the truth. If a certain percentage of African-Americans voted for the thing, then say it! Why should people fear pointing out the truth?

      That is the shit that gets to me. Wanting your cake and eating it to. Doing something then coming back and saying “Oh we are being picked on” and “We are the victims.” Bull. We have an black Prez. We are moving to an equal playing ground. Everyone has to be held accountable for their actions. It is about accountability.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 11:17 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      Bishop FRANK STEWART TO GAYS:

      “SUCK IT UP”

      http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/Protestors_Signal_Battle_over_Same_Sex_Marriage_Not_Over.html

      Nov 6, 2008 at 11:25 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • CHURCHILL-Y
      CHURCHILL-Y

      on the video to the left in the nbc Los Angeles site.

      Nov 6, 2008 at 11:26 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Sad in Sacramento
      Sad in Sacramento

      Can someone tell me what the hell the black community was thinking supporting prop 8?

      I am just totally dishearted on how they have treated gay people full knowing that it was discrimination.

      Especially disheartening is how the other progressive iniatives (1a, 2 & 4) fared compared to prop 8. Chickens received more respect and rights than did gays.

      Considering how involved the gay community has been over the long haul of racial social justice (one of Martin Luther Kings major sidekicks was a gay man!), there’s a bitter irony in how the black community forgot so soon how exclusion feels!..

      Nov 7, 2008 at 12:20 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      Tom + “Truth”, which part of hundreds of thousands of black voters did vote against Prop 8 aren’t you understanding?

      There is no problem at all with accountability + being honest, but there is neither reason nor place for alienating those members of the LGBT community + our allies who are black by making generalizations + only singling out the black voters as the reason Prop 8 passed. After all, there are places with negligible percentages of black voters where gay marriage has also been banned. Are we supposed to put more weight on a black vote against gay marriage because black citizens are also minorities + should be held to different standards?

      At the end of the day, there were still way more white voters who voted against gay marriage in Cali than black ones. If the exit polls are to be believed, about half of them. So, by your logic, every other white Californian you encounter is just as much an “enemy” of our community.

      Focusing only on race, though, is counter-productive when religious beliefs are the real target.

      Nov 7, 2008 at 12:28 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • debra
      debra

      I agree with Fredo.

      No one here is trying to excuse the black voters who voted yes. The common thread among “yes” voters was more likely religion regardless of race. And there were many voters of all different heritages voting for the ban.

      Let’s not forget that the exit polls everyone is quoting are unreliable to begin with.
      When 70% of people polled from a “randomly” selected precinct voted one way the data collected is not a reliably accurate sample of the entire population.

      http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2008/11/ten-reasons-why-you-should-ignore-exit.html

      I couldn’t help noticing that “sources” I’ve seen quoted in these prop 8 related news articles have been reverends from assorted churches.

      Not every voter consults a preacher before heading to the polls. So the preacher’s point of view is not a representative sample of likely voters either.

      Could these church leaders be required to make public statements that skew toward a more “general” audience?

      Churches of all stripes have gotten a bad rap after a rash of high profile lawsuits by families of molested children.

      Could the phenomenon betray some other motive?
      The need to say “Don’t look at us, We’re not all Gay, Really, we think something should be done to protect our children!!”

      What’s up with the anti-black scripture studied in the Mormon Church? They donated heavily in favor of the ban.

      Here’s a randomly selected page that I found about Mormon racial attitudes just now:
      http://www.i4m.com/think/history/mormon_racism.htm

      “Mormon scripture: God curses bad races with black skin…”

      Here’s what a less random search on wikipedia turns up:
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Mormonism

      Please, before anyone says another angry thing about hypocritical Black voters, take a deep breath, exit your homes, and have a conversation with someone black that you actually know.

      Then talk to someone else. Keep doing it until you have a healthy sample of opinions. Keep in mind that if you only speak to one, the data you get might be 100%. If you talk to two, there’s a chance it will drop to 50%, if your sample size grows to three the result could drop to 33%.

      If you keep going bet you’ll find that there is a great range and diversity of opinions among blacks and everyone else in your own communities.

      I’m willing to bet that your personal inventory will not match these stupid polls.

      Nov 7, 2008 at 4:10 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Wayne
      Wayne

      Wow ,the homophobia and bigotry on open display by the Black “Yes on Prop 8″ Advocate in this video is shocking. Even worse, Obama had speakers just like this one shilling for him on the “Obama Faith Tours” that targeted Black churches and exploited the ugly homophobia and bigotry within the Black community to help garner votes for his Presidential run, while encouraging a Yes on Prop 8 vote. Nor should we forget about Obama’s earlier “Gospel Tour” with the bigot Donnie McClurkin, who also preached that Gays were all pedophiles and that we were targeting America’s children. Pathetic.

      Unfortunately, THE TRUTH IS OFTEN UGLY:

      Nov 7, 2008 at 5:32 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      Wayne = Churchill-y

      Nov 7, 2008 at 5:49 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      Nov 7, 2008 at 6:14 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Martin
      Martin

      The result is a disgrace. Its time gay people all over America make our voices heard. Bash the bible bashers.

      Nov 7, 2008 at 3:04 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      @Phil: Itis an interesting thing that those who practice one type of sin want those of us to love them and their ways !What they dont realise is that the bible also says thatwe should not put up with theuiir bad habits of immorality !Jesus said :But now I tell you to buy a sword and take your money with you,because I send you as sheep among wolves ! So do you want us to do what scripture says and Love our neighbor or do what scripture says and harm no innocent blood! you are the ones who do not deserve the time of day, until you repent of your sins(breaking Gods Laws), Since it is your choice and not a disease ,unless you consider Satan a disease!

      Nov 7, 2008 at 3:10 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • tim
      tim

      @Stenar:

      Please don’t…I am referred to below in an LDS release “some”…at Church I am respected for my decision by other members, and I think anyone would be hard pressed to find any church that supports both right and left like the LDS Church does…from Harry Reid to Mitt Romney we support the idea that we all make our own decisions…most other churches are all right or get out or all left or get out…

      “…Before it accepted the invitation to join broad-based coalitions for the amendments, the Church knew that some of its members would choose not to support its position. Voting choices by Latter-day Saints, like all other people, are influenced by their own unique experiences and circumstances. As we move forward from the election, Church members need to be understanding and accepting of each other and work together for a better society.”
      http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/news-releases-stories/church-responds-to-same-sex-marriage-votes

      Nov 7, 2008 at 3:12 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      @BillyBob Thornton: you better read some literature lilke the Quran and ask some Islamic people those who practise what is actually written . Also you should ask those Islamic people what will hapen to all of those who practise Homosexuaity when they take over this country and put in shuriah law, They have already said in news papers and public statements that they “would gut all of the homosexuals that they saw in the street! You better wise up and start thanking God foryour freedom for your corrupt ways ,becasue it will not last much longer !Iwish that you all would come to the realisation that God does love you ,not your corrupt ways ,and recieve His forgivcness, ask THE FAther ,in Jesus name and be born again before it is to late and you die in your sins!sincerely Rev Larry

      Nov 7, 2008 at 3:21 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rivcuban
      Rivcuban

      Roland Martin of CNN said the reasons blacks voted for Proposition 8 is because it was a “moral issue” to them. Well then, if blacks are
      so concerned about morality, why are the majority of black children born today abandoned by their fathers?

      Nov 7, 2008 at 3:34 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      RivCuban, that was an intelligent + not at all ignorant question.

      Nov 7, 2008 at 3:49 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      @Rivcuban: althugh leaving could be considered a moral issue it is usully a temperment issue, and perhaps if you would start helping those fatherless you would lessen your help of the immoral issue of the gay agenda! perhaps if more of you would put God first there would not be any moral issues to fight against!?

      Nov 7, 2008 at 3:57 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      Martin, encouraging us to bash those who oppose us isn’t productive + only gives the wingnuts more ammo against us for future battles over gay rights.

      Nov 7, 2008 at 3:57 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      @Rev larry:

      Sorry, but what got you on queerty?

      Nov 7, 2008 at 7:28 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fuckoff
      fuckoff

      Rev Larry, FUCK YOU. Go suck your God’s cock.

      Many religions and races also don’t believe in MIXING the races or having one person within the religion marrying someone in a different religion either, so because of that, you are saying since this is a “moral issue”, we can take the “morality” of OUR beliefs and apply them to you?

      Are we allowed to take away YOUR rights to marry into another race, or someone else whom shares different religious views from you?.

      Yeah, you blacks only cry discrimination and racism when it applies to YOU.

      Us gays won’t be mad for much longer, we’ll just GET EVEN.

      There are several initiatives coming up regarding Immigration issues, education, funding, and so on that would benefit YOUR causes and YOUR family.

      next time it’s OUR turn to vote against YOU and YOUR FAMILY. Most whites will vote against you already,.. you NEED, and used to have the minority vote you have screwed over.

      let’s see how you MEXICANS and BLACKS will feel once we vote against YOUR causes, and it finally affects YOUR family.

      You Blacks and Mexicans outta be really scared right now, because if it is possible for the Majority to take away the rights of one minority group, who’s to say down the road it won’t be possible to take away the rights that YOU have been granted?

      WHITES outnumber you and there is still a lot of prejudice, Most mexicans have issue with you, and now you pissed off the gays.. DID YOU FORGET? Your ONLY Ally in the past.

      We are going to let MONEY and OUR votes do the talking now.

      Nov 7, 2008 at 7:57 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      Oh Dear, I was trying to be polite here, I guess the “rev” will not care if we are rude or polite if he doesn’t believe in equality, but that’s not the point, I do believe that by preaching at individuals he is asking for it.

      I don’t believe that shouting at people who think somehow they can just say ‘god says it not me’ is pretty useless, Peter Robinson did it last week to justify the outbursts of his unstable wife, however on questioning the christian psychologist crumpled live on Tv.

      Nov 7, 2008 at 8:22 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rivcuban
      Rivcuban

      The problem with black churches is that they keep on perpetrating the same lies and myths over and over again. Blacks believe that being gay is a choice and equate it only as a “sex act”. How wrong they are. Actually, being gay is a much deeper and intrinsic part of a human’s existence than skin color. Skin color is only that…the color of your skin and it has minimal influence on your total being.

      Nov 7, 2008 at 8:49 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      deeper, intrinsic, instinctive you don’t think of the sex act when u like a boy in your class age 7 now, so you?

      Nov 7, 2008 at 9:41 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      “Yeah, you blacks only cry discrimination and racism when it applies to YOU.

      Us gays won’t be mad for much longer, we’ll just GET EVEN.”

      You do realize that black + gay are not mutually exclusive, right?

      Calm down.

      And RivCuban, how are you the expert on what “Blacks believe”? You might want to use some quantifying words like “some” or “a few of the black persons that I’ve met”.

      Nov 7, 2008 at 11:16 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rivcuban
      Rivcuban

      And RivCuban, how are you the expert on what “Blacks believe”? You might want to use some quantifying words like “some” or “a few of the black persons that I’ve met”.

      ————————————————

      Moron. WTF do you think 70% voted for Proposition 8. For the most part, the black culture views homosexuality as only a sex act and not as an intrinsic sexual orientation. I’ve been around that mentality all my life.

      Nov 7, 2008 at 11:49 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rivcuban
      Rivcuban

      And the Hispanic culture is only slightly better. And white Republicans are the worst. Of course it doesn’t have to do with race. It has to do with ignorance and lack of education. There are quite a few churches that accept gays with open arms, so religion is only a partial explanation.

      Nov 7, 2008 at 11:53 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • froggyola
      froggyola

      Oh happy day? Well, sort of….

      Proposition 8 is disgusting in every way. A trumped up motion started by religious zealots that amends California’s constitution to define marriage as legal only between one man and one woman and steals back the rights of gays and lesbians to marry in the state of California. A right that 18,000 gay couples have already exercised. Why people that profess to follow a figure such as Jesus would go so far out of their way to try to steal the civil rights of others is mind boggling. The Mormons, The Knights of Columbus, and our dear friends at Focus on the Family were the largest contributers to this 80 million dollar Hate-fest. Truly the work of the Lord.

      This took thousands of hours of work to even appear on the ballot. An artist gave his or her talent to come up with the Yes On Eight logo. People had to make hundreds of phone calls and send out letters and e-mails to people whose support was needed. Preachers and pastors had to add this topic to their Sunday sermons to drum up support for this mockery of true Christian values. Mothers had to take time out of their busy day to talk to other mothers about the evil gays and their desire to have the same rights as heterosexual couples. Not more rights. Just the same rights.
      Couldn’t all this Christian energy go towards helping people rather than trying to hurt them? Pick a cause. ANY cause. The ill, the homeless, the hungry, the lonely, the dying.

      Even more saddening, seven out of ten blacks that voted in California, voted “YES” on this discriminatory proposition. Blacks who no doubtedly wept that an African American was chosen as President of the United States, who surely understand the evils of discrimination, with their own hands chose to discriminate against another group of people that they deemed unworthy. Some, First-time voters ,who may have been ignorant of the issues, but others who were very sure of what they were doing, used their experience to say, “YES. I want to discriminate”.

      It is surely a glorious period in the history of the United States. Barack Obama has the potential to be one of the greatest leaders this country has known. American voters ignored the smears and voted from their hearts. They transcended their fears and voted for the best candidate. He is clearly a good man worthy of respect and I am sincerely happy for him.If he is who says he is he must put in motion a measure to insure equality to ALL Americans. Time will tell if he is authentic. In the meantime, America has some growing up to do and most of its so- called Christian citizens of ALL races would be best served to reexamine their actions and ask themselves if these actions reflect the same values as their precious Jesus. If history is any indication, the vote would clearly be “NO”.

      Jhon Centurri

      Nov 8, 2008 at 1:27 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rivcuban
      Rivcuban

      @froggyola: Excellent post Jhon!!!

      Nov 8, 2008 at 2:47 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rivcuban
      Rivcuban

      Here is the long list of “Yes on 8″ contributors. Let them know how you feel!

      http://www.californiansagainst…..rRoll.html

      Nov 8, 2008 at 3:38 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Betrayed
      Betrayed

      It it now clearly apparent why Blacks were denied the vote for so long. They vote 97% for a liberal president, yet vote 70% in favour of a socially conservative legislative measure. If they are so socially conservative, why the fuck to they vote democrat in the first place??? Obviously, because they are a absent minded baboons who votes for candidates based on their race and not policies! At least when WHites have socially conservative views, they don’t pretend to be something they are not and delude themselves by voting democrat! Its scary to think that by 2050, California’s population is predicted to be only 30% non hispanic white with the rest being a combined majority of hispanics and balcks! Imagine how fucked up our society will be then, when these brainless ignoramus’ will be control of our state.
      Get out of America whilst you can people!

      Nov 8, 2008 at 8:05 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Betrayed
      Betrayed

      Also, I think its pretty funny how all these mormons are congratulating the blacks and latino’s for voting for ‘preserving the sanctity of marriage,’ but I wonder if they would be feeling as joyous if blacks and latino men started marrying and impregnating their mormon daughters en masse. Somehow I don’t think so.
      WHAT A BUNCH OF FUCKING HYPOCRITES!! THIS COUNTRY HAS NO FUTURE

      Nov 8, 2008 at 8:15 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      Elton may have swiftly dealt with her drunken outburst on stage, but I think Lily’s song is fitting http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=PxHx2NAnGeE

      Nov 8, 2008 at 9:08 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      RivCuban: “Moron. WTF do you think 70% voted for Proposition 8. For the most part, the black culture views homosexuality as only a sex act and not as an intrinsic sexual orientation. I’ve been around that mentality all my life.”

      I’m far from a moron, bitch.

      And as I’ve already stated, the numbers from that random exit poll are seriously flawed. Don’t presume to know what “blacks believe” based on some poll numbers. All that means is that 70% of the black voters who were actually polled in that particular sampling said that they voted yes on Prop 8. How fool-proof…

      Anyway, I’m black + I don’t even know what all blacks believe. Noone here does. You piss + moan about being discriminated against + then respond by making half-assed generalizations. As such, you’re no better than any one of the millions of folks who voted Yes on Prop 8. Yes, that includes the “82% of white republicans”, if CNN’s numbers are to be believed. Feh.

      And, Betrayed, you are an ignorant blowhard.

      Nov 8, 2008 at 10:23 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rivcuban
      Rivcuban

      FREDO777: On the frontpage of today’s LA Times…

      http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-gayblack8-2008nov08,0,1601616.story

      (excerpt) Many black voters didn’t see it that way.

      “I was born black. I can’t change that,” said Culver City resident Bilson Davis, 57, who voted for Proposition 8. “They weren’t born gay; they chose it,” he added, reflecting a commonly held belief that many researchers dispute.

      Nov 8, 2008 at 2:12 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • froggyola
      froggyola

      Fredo777: Your post magnifies a very tired and absurd argument from the black community. It is a shame that “thought” and “common sense” is so often ignored. I don’t know of any culture that so easily throws intellectualism out the door and trades it for cultural mythology with the possible exeption of back- woodsy Christians. It will be nice to see if blacks can rise to the occasion of supporting full equality for ALL.

      Jhon Centurri

      Nov 8, 2008 at 2:32 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • jb
      jb

      @Stenar:

      Yeah, good luck with all that you guys. Im just glad that soon enough Darwinism should kick in, and then we wont have to deal with all this lame crap you people keep producing.
      HA HA WE WON!!!

      Nov 8, 2008 at 3:02 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • froggyola
      froggyola

      JB: Does demeaning others make you feel better about who YOU are? You seem to have low self-esteem. This is not where you will gain it.

      Rev Larry: If you are secure in your own beliefs, why must you have gay people agree with you? Isn’t it enough to just believe what you are free to believe? Why do you need others to validate these beliefs for you? Why do so-called Christians as yourself seek to change others? There is enough “on your side of the street ” that needs cleaning. Why concern yourself with what others are doing in thier private lives? This is very strange.

      Nov 8, 2008 at 3:49 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • froggyola
      froggyola

      Here is a link to a Youtube piece featuring Esther Hicks on the topic on Gay Rights. I hope it serves gays as a balm to relieve the sting of injustice that exists in our country. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_c7NWWiUnk

      Jhon Centurri

      Nov 8, 2008 at 4:26 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      “Your post magnifies a very tired and absurd argument from the black community. It is a shame that “thought” and “common sense” is so often ignored. I don’t know of any culture that so easily throws intellectualism out the door and trades it for cultural mythology with the possible exeption of back- woodsy Christians. It will be nice to see if blacks can rise to the occasion of supporting full equality for ALL.”

      Froggyola, it will be even nicer to see if narrow-minded persons like yourself can stop making derogatory generalizations about blacks + actually rise above your own prejudice so that we can build bridges + achieve full equality for all.

      Nov 8, 2008 at 6:37 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      “(excerpt) Many black voters didn’t see it that way.”

      I’m sure many of them didn’t. I have never argued that there are no homophobes in the black community; my main point is that blacks are being made the scapegoats for this particular Prop 8 issue based on some questionable polling results. Instead of mending ties between the two communities, I have seen more + more divisive accusations which only alienates blacks within the LGBT community + its allies. And all as a result of the beliefs + actions of some black voters.

      Racial slurs are being uttered, black gays are being shunned. It’s nonsense. If this continues, there will be even less — not more — black allies of LGBT causes in the future. I’m done arguing this point for now, though.

      Later.

      Nov 8, 2008 at 6:46 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Megawatti
      Megawatti

      Not too long ago, BLACKS and GAYS shared a very special bond, during the depression when being Gay was ILLEGAL, and BLACKS had NO RIGHTS,they actually mingled together in “underground”, “Illegal” bars/nightclubs where they could find strength and solace in one another. They were each others ALLIES which is WHY this SO OFFENSIVE TO US MORE THAN ANY OTHER group of people bagging on us.

      Bahahaha! I love the sense of outrage in this (and many other posts).

      I love that so many in our (gay) community have absolutely no problem in putting black/Latino/Asians into a little box, suitable only for exotic encounters (“OMG, It’s not RACIST to not want to associate with gay people of color, it’s a PREFERENCE! I don’t sleep with women, so does that make me SEXIST?!”)

      But then, whenever our (gay) community wants something, it’s all “OMG COLORED AND GAYS HAVE ALWAYS BEEN FRIENDSOMGOMG YOU’RE SENDING US TO THE BACK OF THE BUS!?!?!”

      “Us gays won’t be mad for much longer, we’ll just GET EVEN.

      There are several initiatives coming up regarding Immigration issues, education, funding, and so on that would benefit YOUR causes and YOUR family.”

      Mega-LOLS as the poster seems to believe that one cannot be both gay and Black/Mexican at the same time.

      Quick! Somebody tell RuPaul before she votes against HER causes and HER family while she tries to GET EVEN.

      “You Blacks and Mexicans outta be really scared right now, because if it is possible for the Majority to take away the rights of one minority group, who’s to say down the road it won’t be possible to take away the rights that YOU have been granted?”

      True because the blacks and Mexicans don’t know what it’s like to be disenfranchised, and have never been disenfranchised…at least not YET.

      Nov 8, 2008 at 8:08 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • froggyola
      froggyola

      Fredo 777: There are no bridges to people that don’t desire it. Blacks ,in general, do not desire it. This is a sad fact that they themselves prove daily. Sorry if this offends you but calling me narrow minded because I have eyes and a brain and notice things around me and post my thoughts will not change my mind about how I see this. I stand by what I posted and I am not racist or narrow minded for doing so. It would be nice if people like you would pull their politically correct head out of their ass, and deal with what is reality.

      Nov 8, 2008 at 8:36 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      Fuck off, Froggy.

      I’ve tried reasoning with you, but I’m wasting no more of my time.

      Nov 8, 2008 at 9:36 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • froggyola
      froggyola

      Fredo 777 Now THAT’S intelligent. Thanks for helping me make my point.

      Nov 8, 2008 at 11:48 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      Yes, because I really need to prove my intelligence by one-upping some random poster on a blog.

      - yawn –

      Feel free to pat yourself on the back, though. Really. I’m sure you’ve earned it.

      Nov 9, 2008 at 12:44 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • James
      James

      You know, I feel very sorry for what is happening during this case. People want to make the case that Gay’s supported a African-American candidate but did not support Prop. 8. Funny, the gay community did not look at the Prop. 8 as the black community looks at what is taken away from the black community (the father from the family and mother away from the family) and what that means. Now, to take a statement from Hitler and call the black community filled with hatred is stupid to say the least. Other comments of a fight between issues that the gay community will not support that might help lower income communities or immigration issues because the Black and Mexican communities would benefit would crazy. That would affect all people including the gay community.

      Nov 9, 2008 at 7:16 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Megastupid
      Megastupid

      Hey Megastupid. You can LOL, OMG, or SMD all you want.

      I AM part of a group of one of the Minorities that voted against gays, and when these initiatives come up, I WILL VOTE AGAINST MY OWN RACE because of it.

      I’m mexican , but i am a CITIZEN, and all my relatives are as well, so why should i give a fuck if these idiots end up getting deported or not obtaining citizenship, or someother initiative that will benefit or affect their family like prop 8 affects mine?

      They didn’t care about my family, so now it’s my turn. I know PLENTY of people who are black or mexican and GAY, that will NOW vote against their own race when the time comes.

      Whether Rupaul does or doesn’t I could give a shit.

      Nov 9, 2008 at 7:44 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      FOUR LESSONS GAY MARRIAGE ACTIVISTS MUST LEARN FROM OBAMA ::

      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/lee-stranahan/four-lessons-gay-marriage_b_142469.html

      A must-read article. Makes a hell of a lot of sense.

      Nov 9, 2008 at 8:28 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Jhon Centurri
      Jhon Centurri

      Yeah it makes a lot of sense but to suggest that we talk to Christians on their turf about gay issues and gay marriage and expect a positive response is overly idealistic. Especially from black or hispanic churches. They are not prepared to accept us. They don’t want to accept us. If you think that it is possible though, I would love it if you tried it and tell us all how it goes. I’m curious to see the results. Here’s a link to a Jay Bakker’s attempt to do it. Maybe he can give you some pointers.

      Nov 10, 2008 at 12:22 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      I don’t think they meant necessarily going up to the front of the church + preaching. Probably something on a smaller scale, like talking to church-going folks in our own lives.

      Now, you try it + let me know how it works out.

      gogogogogogo…

      Nov 10, 2008 at 12:36 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • JustMe
      JustMe

      WoW. You “gay” people are mean. Really… you change the definition of “gay”. Maybe that’s why so many states are voting you out! Thirty so far. Nine more and it can become a Constituional amendment. I pray for that day!

      Nov 10, 2008 at 10:00 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      Mean? Really?

      Well, JustMe, I think I speak for the entire gay community when I say: suck our collective d*ck.

      Nov 10, 2008 at 10:03 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • JustMe
      JustMe

      I rest my case!
      http://americansfortruth.com/news/what-gay-marriage-has-done-to-massachusetts.html

      Nov 10, 2008 at 10:20 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • JustMe
      JustMe

      Maybe it’s because the average American doesn’t want this taking place on their “Main Street” http://americansfortruth.com/news/nudity-is-illegal-but-nudity-was-everywhere-at-folsom-street-fair.html

      or this

      http://americansfortruth.com/issues/homosexual-hate/public-indecency

      Nov 10, 2008 at 10:45 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      @JustMe:

      “I rest my case!”

      Great. Now rest your mouth.

      Nov 10, 2008 at 10:53 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • froggyola
      froggyola

      Just Me: Does it make you feel good about yourself to come on to a gay blog and attempt to agitate people with your silly comments? What’s wrong with you? Don’t you have any other purpose in your life? It’s fine if you don’t care for gay people. We are used to it and have risen above the small minded, but why are you trying to poke at us? It’s bizarre.

      Nov 10, 2008 at 12:51 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • froggyola
      froggyola

      Here’s a link that I hope gives all my fellow gays a much needed laugh during this stressful time.

      Nov 10, 2008 at 10:45 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • American Warrior
      American Warrior

      @BillyBob Thornton:

      One thing I can’t stand is stupid small minded people who demand someone change their tradition just because they want them to. If you queer people want marriage, start your own goddamn tradition and stop demanding others change theirs just for you! How pathetic! You would throw a serious bitch fit if straight people tried to change your traditional gay day parade. But see someone else with something you want all you do is think of yourself and everyone else be damned.
      You people asked for being recognized and accepted, but you just keep pushing and pushing to make everyone change but you. There’s no meeting anyone half way. You want all or nothing.
      Either meet us half way or just come and try to take a poke at me. You’ll find your ass handed to you in a way you can kiss it yourself. Threaten me you prick and you will find out what it’s like to get back in the closet.
      Now either shut up and learn to work things out and start your fucking traditions, or bring it on and set your goddamn community back 30 years.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 6:28 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      @American Warrior:

      “But see someone else with something you want all you do is think of yourself and everyone else be damned.”

      Like some of you hets are only thinking of yourselves + jealously guarding marriage from gay couples even though it doesn’t actually harm your own marriages (ahem…Canada…Massachusetts…CT…the 18,000 couples who were already married in Cali…+ so on…)?

      It looks like you’re the one coming to a gay-themed blog + throwing a “bitch fit” over something that shouldn’t affect you one way or the other, you fucking hypocrite.

      Nov 11, 2008 at 6:36 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • anonymous82
      anonymous82

      I am so apalled and sickened in my stomach by all the racial bigotry and hatred against blacks on this site. These blogs should be deleted and the threats investigated. The reason for the marriage amendment passing in three states is not solely because of African-Americans! We had every right to fight for our freedom. We were born black and our ancestors were brought to the US by force. HOMOSEXUALITY is a sin and is a lifestyle choice. You are not an ethnic group therefore CHRISTIANS as a whole will not fight for you. So stop comparing your issue to civil rights. HOMOSEXUALITY is not a civil rights but a MORAL issue. It was CHRISTIANS who fought to get the law passed; and some blacks happen to be conservative christians. The majority of blacks voted for Obama for cultural reasons. The racial prejudice needs to stop IMMEDIATELY. Your racially hateful messages only turns minorities off and discourage us from supporting your cause even more. You also have forgotten the fact that there are homosexual blacks who do support your cause. We as black Christians were in a tight spot this year. Some of us want to support you but can’t because pressure of our family, church, and our upbringing. So take that in consideration when posting you next “hate” blog. You will all be held accountable for your racially and religiously charged comments if you don’t stop. This will be my first and last blog. May God have mercy on you all. He loves you and wants to change your life, but choosing to curse God and burn churches will make things worse on yourself.

      Nov 12, 2008 at 11:56 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      @anonymous82:

      B.S.

      Being gay is not a lifestyle choice + if you want to preach to us about not being prejudiced, perhaps you should take a dose of your own medicine.

      Nov 12, 2008 at 12:20 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Anonymous82shutup
      Anonymous82shutup

      Hey Anyonymous82 the “Christian gay Lady/man/monkey/…whatever you are”? What are you doing on a “homosexual propaganda site” Anyways?

      Go back to the 700 club where you belong.

      Nov 13, 2008 at 12:07 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Bob Smith
      Bob Smith

      @Alexa: I am heterosexual, but I am totally for equality for everybody. However, before I would approve of gay marriage I think the following should be implemented immediately to protect the heterosexual people in this country. First we need to have straight men and women restrooms and showers, and then separate restrooms and showers for gay and lesbians. This will help protect all people. I mean do you know how uncomfortable I would feel with a gay man scoping me out in the shower? It is really no different than me going into a shower for females. Further, I would like to see a stop to explicit illustrations ie pictures being shown to school age children teaching them how to perform homosexual acts. This is going on in MA, were gay marriage was made legal. Is there a connection? I am totally for sex education, but do we really have to push each others agenda on the children? Teach them about STDS, how to protect themselves, but don’t show them illustrations of any sexual activities. That goes for heterosexual or homosexual acts. Also, if homosexuals have rights to marry, why can’t people who support love of animals have a ceremony of some sorts. There are quite a few people who would approve of legalizing beastiality. Why can’t the beasties have their say? I believe they have a case. Shouldn’t everybody be free to love whoever or whatever they wish? I really don’t think the dogs or horses in those videos on the internet are being forced to engage in sexual acts with those women or guys. I am sure some of the same people who are standing up for gays and lesbians will not also stand up for the freedom’s of beasties. Most people gay or straight will say that is disgusting. Just like a lot of heterosexuals say about homosexuality. Kind of funny when the table is turned. What about immediate family members who would like to marry. Sisters, brothers, mothers, fathers, and first cousins. They all should have the right to marry and have the same protections as other couples, gay or straight. Suppose a 30 year old man would like to marry his sister or mother to bring them under his insurance plan. He could also marry his brother because it would be legal to do so under proposition 8. I really don’t see the problem with this. It isn’t like the two brothers will have mentally challenged kids or something. When we are all free to love whoever or whatever we wish, we shall be free!

      Nov 13, 2008 at 5:44 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • froggyola
      froggyola

      Bob Smith are you for real? Your post is absurd.

      Nov 13, 2008 at 6:10 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      @REBELComx:actually it is not absurd you are absurd why do yooooou think that God put limits on man? the world was destroyed once for the evil that men had done! What makes you think that it won’t be done again? only by fire (nukes)!man is stupie enough to do that thinkingthat if they die for their Islam Allah they will be translated right to heavenwith 2virgins. OOPS no homosexualks ? well suprise it is not heaven it is either hell or outer darkness unless you repent and jesus is the only way!why do you think there are no openly gaypeople in Saudy Arabia? Because they have been beheaded! just like any who leave islam are killed ,perhaps you would like to look it up ,you will find that Islam is tough on gay’s

      Nov 13, 2008 at 9:38 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      @Anonymous82shutup:actkually this was sent to my e-mail the other day !an I suspect that The Lord would like you to repent since it is a choice to be gay /at least to practice it just like it is to be heterosexual-choice!only in that instance it is not sin! men and men or women and women are forbidden and although my daughter has a same sex lover I do not hate her I do what I can to help her BUT it is still a sin ,and she must be borna it couldbe my fult ,it could be genetic but it is still a choice!God said so! And you must be born again !

      Nov 13, 2008 at 9:48 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      @Anonymous82shutup:actually this was sent to my e-mail the other day !and I suspect that The Lord would like you to repent since it is a choice to be gay /at least to practice it, just like it is to be heterosexual-choice!only in that instance it is not sin! Men and men or women and women are forbidden and although my daughter has a same sex lover I do not hate her I do what I can to help her BUT it is still a sin ,and she must be born again it could be my fault ,it could be genetic but it is still a choice!God said so! And you must be born again !Obama is just another schill for the one world govt.,if it is not so then he wouldfollow the constitution of the USA and he has not he has blatently used his so called christianity to put sin in the white house by using a gay practicing gay priest ,watch and see whether this country is punished for all of that and more ,because abortion is worse than gay!

      Nov 13, 2008 at 9:56 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      @Bob Smith:

      I’m sure you think you’re very clever.

      You’re not.

      We are not seeking marriage of our pets or of our blood relatives, but civil marriage of our same-sex partners, as is the case with thousands of married gay couples worldwide.

      Slippery slope arguments are always ridiculous, because they work both ways. For example, Biff, why shouldn’t we also be able to start limiting marriage to the same race again? The majority used to be against interracial marriage, too. I’m sure someone could use the bible to justify that.

      Oh, right. Separation of church + state + this being a constitutional republic, not a democracy or a theocracy.

      How silly of me.

      Nov 13, 2008 at 10:07 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      @Rev larry:

      - Yawn -

      Again, not a theocracy.

      Not too concerned with your choice of religion, since you have absolutely no right whatsoever to legislate it.

      Nov 13, 2008 at 10:08 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      @Rev larry: I never believed in born gay, and nobody would guess I am gay, but my choices from a young age have always made me different, I had girlfriends some time ago but I have never felt love for females, choosing to be straight was not an option. So I can only assume the choice you mean is live a life alone. How dare you, you have no right to suggest I or anyone else should not seek to live a fulfilling life with another individual of the same sex.

      @Bob Smith: Well you gave me a lot to laugh at, you are a bigger moron than bill perdue…. and many on this blog will tell you that is hard to be!!! Bill even suggested that a modern Irish civil war would be the right, and of benefit of Irish people! At least he has ignorance as a defense!!!

      Nov 13, 2008 at 11:48 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      @Tom in Houston: I do not really understand why you don’t like God or yourself,who done something to you your the one who hates not bible belifing people,we not unllike God ,who made the tem commandments and all of therest of the rules that you must live by or you are headed for HELL, by the way there is a hell,I saw it a few times and it is as bad as it is written probably worse , you need to get a book on it callled 20 minutes in hell. or maybe you can get God to let you live it for a few!

      Nov 13, 2008 at 12:32 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      @fredo777:you are all wrong no matter on what issue, you can never be sure that you have the right answer since if you do not know what is right with sex then how can you know what is right about anything else? you cant! Any one with any sense would know that it has to be free will when it comes to sex and we have a right to legislate it since you do not know right from wrong! there are laws about harrassment but when it comes to a lot of gays look how you talk in this and other threads, hit them burn that youare always wron becasue you will not come to the light; Jesus Christ and the Father; and see yourselves and what your sin is!

      Nov 13, 2008 at 12:41 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      @Rev larry: haha

      Oh, pumpkin. You’re too adorable.

      - playful chin sock -

      Nothing is coincidence, I’m afraid. The male g-spot being no exception.

      That is all.

      Nov 13, 2008 at 12:44 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      @B Nesbitt: I dare because I also was raped by several of my male cousins and an uncle,and I have fought that curse ever since so don’t get the idea that I don’t know where you are coming from! It has been a thorn in my side all my life ,but my CHOICE was a wife and family which I did fairly well,but with Gods help and even now it is a small problem but I choose not to be that way , Jesus said “as you believe so be it unto you ” also “Watch your thoughts ,for out of your thoughts come the very issues of life”! YES YOU CAN BEAT IT THE LORD IS GREATER THAN ALL!

      Nov 13, 2008 at 12:51 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Bill Perdue
      Bill Perdue

      I don’t reply to swine like Nesbitt. It’s just not possible to train a pig. Attempts to elevate them out of the muck just seem to irritate them.

      And what’s worse than a grumpy closeted pig like Nesbitt. Not much.

      Nov 13, 2008 at 12:51 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      @Bill Perdue: that is where you are wrong if you were a christian with gods Holy spirit ,which you must ask for< then you would understand what you shal love your neighbor as yourself that is AGAPE LOVE not carnal lovebill what you need is Jesus, also just ask the reason for me being on this thread ?I have many other things to do but these people need what they do not have THE HOLY SPIRIT and to be born againevery one needs that and the time to reflect on the goodness of God!

      Nov 13, 2008 at 1:00 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      @Rev larry:

      That’s just the thing, Rev.

      Some of us don’t look at our being gay as a thing to “beat” or wrestle with. We are perfectly content being who we are + that is just a part of it.

      Sure, you could live in denial of that part of yourself. Noone is arguing against that. There have been plenty of closet cases who get married + have kids because they don’t want to accept that they’re gay + some might even be happier that way.

      But that’s not for everyone + some of us don’t want people beating us over the head with the constant need to “change” who we are + shame us into trying to be something that we aren’t…heterosexual.

      To each his own, though.

      Also, sorry to hear about your being molested.

      Nov 13, 2008 at 1:02 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      @callmewhitey,call me faggot:You sure have shown your colors hatred of truth, hatred of what God said, you are not right and you know it,look at what you wrote and tell me that you are a decent loving human being, you dont want to obey any law, unlessit isyours ,Well guess what unless you repent of your sins< disobeying laws,) you will end up in prison or worse in a prison made without hands a place we call hell! You should have the right to doany thing that you want to do and show God what a fool you are ,but in the same way I do not like the Idea that because of you my nation is going to fall,(judged by almighty God) and not just you but all of those who kill their babies knowing that life begins at conception , otherwise there would not be a baby human being ,to kill (abort).

      Nov 13, 2008 at 1:15 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      @Rev larry: I’m very sorry to hear that, and I am glad that you found strength in god, but what happened to you, and the life I lead are very different. I am gay, not a rapist. I ask you kindly; please don’t even imply to compare the too, I have a friend who was raped as a child, she is a christian, she also chooses to have gay males as friend, she finds comfort and security in them. I think this alone proves my point.

      I don’t think I can show you just how disgusted I am at that, I think what happened to you has made you bitter, so I understand where you are saying what you say.

      Iris Robinson, an anti-gay NI politician who spoke at the Grand Committee session on Risk Assessment and Management of Sex Offenders, is quoted as saying:
      “There can be no viler act, apart from homosexuality and sodomy, than sexually abusing innocent children.”

      This quote still upsets me rev, can you understand why? You can skip the bible quotes, please just speak for yourself for once!

      @Bill Perdue: Firstly I am in no closet dear, I am not what you wold call swine either, I do not feel the need to tell you why I am far from swine. Oh and thanks for the reply!

      Bill you only don’t reply to me… oh wait you did, but that’s not the point. You dislike me because I showed you to be an uninformed bigot on several occasions, a closeted pig if you like.

      Sláinte! (like me not english! :P)

      Nov 13, 2008 at 6:09 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • revlarryshutup
      revlarryshutup

      Ok “Rev”, now it’s crystal clear why you have such an agenda against “the gays”.

      You claimed you were “raped”, and because you and people of your kind equate Pedophilia with Homosexuality you are confused and you have probably questioned your sexuality all your life which has fueled your fire.

      It’s unfortunate, however not uncommon, for many victims to admit to having some kind of “dark fantasies” later on about the experience, so maybe you have some guilt that you just may have enjoyed it no matter how horrific it may have been for you?

      Many Women have been raped by MEN, so should they turn their hatred to men and become Lezbos?

      You keep saying gay is wrong, immoral, blah blah.
      I DO BELIEVE the god YOU believe in and the religion YOU follow does teach this. Does that mean it applies to those of us who DO NOT SUBSCRIBE to YOUR RELIGION? NO.

      We have religious freedom in the good ol’ USA.

      Ever hear of “SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE”? We have the right to choose a religion, or NOT HAVE ONE AT ALL. Laws are NOT TO BE MADE on religious grounds.

      Prop 8 did not affect you or your family. it only affects Gay people and their family, as it has stripped away their rights,.. rights they HAD!

      People like you believed it would be “ridding the world of gays”. Guess what WE ARE STILL HERE. WE ARE GOING NOWHERE. you will STILL see gays on TV, the movies, in the internet, at work, and YES * at SCHOOL*

      your kids WILL be taught about gays at school because GAY KIDS STILL GO TO SCHOOL . And most likely Prop 8 will be OVERTURNED anyways!

      We don’t seek people like you out, you seek US out. We aren’t coming over to your house trying to affect you Household, so quit doing it to us in OURS.

      You keep saying Gay is a choice. SO IS RELIGION. I choose not to have Your religion, you DO NOT HAVE THE RIGHT to force it upon us.

      Nobody is forcing gay marriage on you, you are not invited to the ceremonies, you are not invited into their homes, they are not coming over to your house. Yet you are trying to force your religious views on them. It ain’t going to work.

      So get over it.

      Nov 13, 2008 at 7:33 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • missalimac
      missalimac

      After reading a few of these comments, and being LDS myself, I was a little hesitant to post here but I have to say a few things.

      I voted a huge, unregretted, NO, on Prop 8 and wouldn’t take that back for anything. Though, hearing about all the violence, and the wanted violence directed towards my religion is really discouraging. Just because idiots within the LDS church donated money does NOT mean we all agree with it. I know of many people that turned away from the Church because of their support and donations to the “Yes on 8″ campaign. So, I say to you, unless you can single out those within the church who have done this, why persecute the entire religion? Why aren’t there protests outside Catholic establishments? Why do you hate every Mormon, and want to destroy the things they worship, when not every one of them supported the donations or the actual law?

      Nov 13, 2008 at 8:21 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      @revlarryshutup: your problem is that you will never understand the sdifference between the act of a gay person and that person themselves there is no hatred for the person ,it is the act ,I wonder have you ever gotten hypnotized,to find out the real cause of your feelings! knowing that you and your same sex partner could never have children and that is what marriage is all about procreation any fool could figure that out as a child!that is right I do not have the right to force it upon you but I do have the right to say what the truth is, there is NOTHING in the constitution that says separation of church and state IT SAYS THAT THE GOVERN SHALL NOT MAKE A RELIEION BUT GUESS WHAT THEY HAVE – AND IT IS CALLED SECULAR HUMANISM WHICH WAS STATED IN COURT IN 1973!! I said that you will never understand unless you get the Holy Spirit,and you can’t get The Holy spirit until The Lord gives it!Now if you are interested you should read it and ask for The Fathers help in understanding it !it is not understood just as it is written at least not usually ! Have you ever considered the Gospel in Matt. Mark Luke and JohnLIKE Jn 3:16? it is totally different than what you and the churches think !and about overturning prop * that is not up to a judge the judge is sworn to uphold the law as it is written and passed ,and if the judges decide to “make or change law ” from their bench they need to go back to school and study about their duties!when this countruy was started it was started by menwho worshipped the one and only God of heaven!that is a fact if you would bother to look up the documents !but then you only want your “truth”! I personally do not care what proposition is passed EXCEPT THAT IT WILLDESTROY THIS COUNTRY !AND YOU WHO THINK THAT YOU RE SAFE ARE OUT OF TOUCH Prophecy says that Isrel will be over run again BUT THEN That is when The lord will come and protect them ! You havent got a clue as to the power that God gives his people sometimes ,and that sometime is real close !If you died right now, where will you go and why do you think so? I’m really interested!

      Nov 13, 2008 at 10:24 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      @revlarryshutup: oh yes you do seek christians out I saw that on tv whena bout 100 gays with signs went to a church that never hurt you and you caused a lot of damage to them and the church and the cops are so stupid that they did not stop it which means that you are not up to date on things that happened a couple of years back. If you would get enough people to over turn that proposition 8 at least real christians would not threaten you. any one who threatens you is not a follower of Jesus but if they preach it to you then that is fair since you want freedom, what you need is the spirit of the Lord, that is real freedom!

      Nov 13, 2008 at 10:36 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      @Rev larry: Avoiding a few questions there… surprise that.

      I don’t buy this hate the act BS, if you don’t want to let a person love a person of the same sex then you (not god, you) are seeking to deprive that person of happiness. Therefore it is irrelevant wether you hate the act or the person. I think this argument is only relevat among close friends and family, generally for individuals, but you hate a very large group of people for what they do, not an individual, shame on you for doing so!

      @missalimac: I don’t hate everything mormon, although I have reason to dislike a few. fact is that some people do hate everything mormon, and some hate everything gay.

      “Why do you hate every Mormon?”

      and this is my point to Rev Larry… when you don’t distinguish between such a large group and individuals it is not their acts you hate, it is those people. Or does the Rev want double standards for this one?

      Nov 14, 2008 at 7:59 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      @Carla: Hadn’t read your post 174, you raised some points which should make some people uncomfortable, but I think that people seem to use god in order to say what they want to say, instead of having the guts to just say what they want to say, always having to use bible quotes, but hey the sheep follow them, generally with little informed decision making. It’s too easy to get people acting irrationally. Look at cults, religions, governments!

      Certain cults have people take their own lives, same with certain religions. Governments, well (and I use this as an example not a comparison! so please avoid going off on a tangent on this one, twisting my words) look at Nazi Germany!

      This will not get through to the likes of Rev Larry, they will dismiss it as irrelevant or lunacy, just a little too close for comfort. Wether you preach to us because you think you are doing good in the world, or because of hate or fear from your past, people are vulnerable! Especially those with limited exposure to the world, and limited education. A form of mob mentality seems to exist causing people to take little responsibility for what they say. I think you must treat the quotes that people use almost as if they were their own words, they don’t just randomly speak quotes, although sometimes their tedious relevance, or lack of it can be baffling. their is a motive behind using a quote, and I for 1 am not willing to swallow them whole!

      Nov 14, 2008 at 8:48 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      @B Nesbitt: You cant seem to get it and i doubt that you will until you get a taste of Hellfire! if it wasn’t for Gods judgment on having sexual relations with the same-sex-partner I f it wasnt that I know that you will go to a place of torment I would not even bother you. But you are wrong! There isn’t and never was any hatred in me towards another person! To the things that they do, that I dislike! I have nothing against someone Loving another no matter what the sex is but do not do that act which is totally unclean!and an abomination to The Lord! let me pose a simple scenario ;If as you believe ,I am wrong and God and Jesus doesn’t matter and we all cease to exist at death,then I have lived a life that was nice just as you think you have :: BUT IF THERE IS ONE CHANCE IN A BILLION THAT IT TOTALLY MATTERS AND YOU DIE AND GO TO A HELL THAT I BELIEVE AND KNOW IS THERE, THEN I HAVE GAINED AND YOU HAVE LOST AND HAVE A LONG TIME TO ROAST ,Now what would it hurt if you asked for God to come into your life by the Holy Spirit in Jesus name and forgive your sins (Gods broken laws). If there is no God or salvation you have lost nothing if he is real you have gained eternal holy life! have you ever played the lottery ?

      Nov 14, 2008 at 11:24 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      @froggyola: obviously you hav no Idea what a marriage was meant to do “it was to replentish the earth which apparentlly was destroyed because of the same corruption that had god destroy Sodom and Gamorra! If you would take a little time and read some of the new teatament not even old testament ,and see what is said by jesus about the last days of this age! Matt24:4-51 wars and rumors of wars, floods in different places earthquakes increased ,sunamies(waves roaring)icecaps melting,yes it is all there “when you see these things (jerusalem surrounded by the armies of the world) Look up for your redemption draws nigh(near)! when I read The scriptures (by The Holy spirit)it is like reading a local newspaper!in your love keep it agape love not carnal love there is more satisfaction with Agaoe love than the other!

      Nov 14, 2008 at 11:42 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Bob Smith
      Bob Smith

      @froggyola: That is exactly what most heterosexuals think about gay marriage! Absurd and gross, deviant behaviour. They are wrong also! Won’t you stand up for the beasties and the incestors also? Please, where is the humanity? You can’t stand up for one group of people, but not another? Fido needs your love too, just like the peter puffers and carpet munchers. Why can’t we marry our sisters or brothers?

      Nov 15, 2008 at 12:13 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      @Bob Smith: No you will be a slave and if you dont think so you better read ancient history about other democracies! when they become morally bankrupt, like you have sugested another society,country beats the crapola out of them and they then are slaves to other nations !if you and all of you cant see what is happening you are like the governor of NY, “the blind leadeth the blind and they both fall into the ditch”! NO I do not have any thing against the blind (so do not take it out of context)BUT A BLIND GOVERNOR IS THE STUPIDEST THING THAT i HAVE EVER HEARD OF WHEN SOMEONE WANTS TO TAKE SOMETHING FROM HIM THEY JUST DO IT AND HE DONT EVEN KNOW WHAT HAPPENED!Sure he is a very nice guy ,but he does not belong in that place because he can not know what the sneaky ppoliticians are doing!

      Nov 15, 2008 at 12:28 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      @revlarryshutup: oh yes just because you say that it(my religion / beliefs) doesn’t apply to you, that doesn’t make it so! BECAUSE I HAVE GOTTEN A COMMAND AND THAT IS TO TELL THE TRUTH! THE LORDS TRUTH! you can never say when you are standing in judgement “golly I didn’t know that , no one warned me” remember this when you pass from this world to the next,sk for someone to help you get forgivness if it is not too late!I have asked God The father to forgive you and show you (all)to know the truth of HIS Agape Love!

      Nov 15, 2008 at 12:39 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • froggyola
      froggyola

      Please, let’s not argue with these so called christians who are obviously dedicated to their ignorance and limited thinking. It is futile. We have a revolution to win, and we need to focus on the big stuff, not the pantywastes that try to torment a gay blog. Pathetic.

      Nov 15, 2008 at 2:39 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Straight Ally
      Straight Ally

      I’m not gay ,not in the slightest but let me assure you I utterly share your disgust at the utter betrayal of the LGBT community by the racist Black churches.

      I have long seen the rampant homophobia and been silenced by the PC mob but now its out in the open.

      Its time for our non Homophobic black supporters to come out and shout.

      Its time to flip the bird to the so called radicals who won’t consemn the homophobes who make up 70% of the Black community.

      My marrioage is cheapened by my LGBT brothers and sisters not being allowed to join me .

      Shame on California -double shame on Calfornias blacks.

      Nov 15, 2008 at 10:25 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      @Rev larry:

      More of the same, eh? Still not answered all questions posed, don’t worry I expected that.

      I haven’t missed the point, I get what you are saying, It doesn’t take a genius (oh I’ll stop poking fun, too easy). You say you are doing gods work, what you have missed, is that I think that you are personally responsible for all the words that come from your mouth.

      I think your own tragic circumstances have clouded your judgement. therefore I do not hate you, just what you are doing. you think I am contradicting myself?? No I am making a stab in the dark, using it on a personal basis, no bluntly saying I hate what all Revertants do, which I do believe doesn’t actually mean hating their acts, it involves intolerance.

      Your use of language shows how important fear is in your work, I find it pathetic that you use disjointed rants, but I don’t believe you used bible quotes, I’m impressed.

      You say that you are able to hate the act and not the person, lets just you are able to do this, do you think your ‘flock’ also has this ability? Or is there the possibility that these people have treated people that are homosexual badly?

      I believe there is a relationship of sufficient proximity, and it is reasonably foreseeable to assume that your words could cause those you preach to act of out hatred, therefore you would be personably responsible

      Must dash

      Nov 15, 2008 at 1:20 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • revlarryshutup
      revlarryshutup

      “Rev” (and i use that term as loosely as your asshole probably is..) maybe you just need to “take one for the team” again and get off your high horse.

      Just because YOU feel passionately about something DOES NOT MAKE IT TRUE.

      If the ‘Lord” has something to say to me or anyone else than HE will say so. We Don’t need YOU to tell us anything.

      Your speeches mean nothing here. Nobody is listening. It’s just fun to banter back and forth with you and all the other idiots.

      Like they say “MONKEY see MONKEY do”!
      How Appropro!

      Nov 15, 2008 at 3:14 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • revlarryshutup
      revlarryshutup

      And you blacks complaining of us gays being ‘Racist’ because the “N” word has been thrown around, well guess what? You pigmentally challenged retards have been throwing the “F” word at us the whole time. FAG. Doesn’t feel good does it? Besides your own people call each other the “N” word all day long, so why are you so surprised when other people repeat it? If you want that word to go away, start within your OWN community. And i don’t care if it’s “nigga” you people are saying instead of “nigger”. Same difference in my book.

      Nov 15, 2008 at 3:19 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • revlarryshutup
      revlarryshutup

      Another thing “Charlie Manson”, “Hitler”, and numerous serial killers also felt they had a “command from the lord” and a “devine calling” as well, so I guess you are in good company! SEE YOU IN HELL ASSHOLE!

      Nov 15, 2008 at 3:24 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      @revlarryshutup: Lovely…

      You may have a point, but do you have to be so vulgar?

      Nov 16, 2008 at 9:24 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      @Rev larry:

      You can’t miss this one Rev… http://www.queerty.com/i-dont-care-what-your-spiritual-religious-beliefs-are-it-should-not-interfere-with-our-government-20081115/#comment-98425

      Or do you not agree with the First Amendment?… Doesn’t always suit, does it :(

      Nov 16, 2008 at 2:57 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry [Different person #1 using similar name]

      what your response says is so true God said(through Jesus ) that he would send us to warn people like you ,and scripture is so true “hell has enlarged her mouth without measure ” ,of one thing I am sure you will have a fine taste of hell if you do not get on the right road with God through repentance ,which means to change your life style! There is no other way to get to heaven or a nother place of rest ,in my fathers house are many mansions” but to those who deny Me says the Lord there is only a deeper hell!and the language you use proves that you are working for Satan at this time !but if God ever calls you you will know and I believe he has and you (actually the evil spirit in you) are so angered by it that you hate almost every one ,including yourself, Someone done something to you? or do you think you were born mad!BY READING THAT WHICH YOU HAVE WRITTEN IT SHOWS THAT YOU ARE NOT HINKING AT ALL IN ANY RATIONAL WAY! hOPE YOU GET BETTER!

      Nov 18, 2008 at 11:48 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      @Rev larry:

      Judge not…

      Let he who is without sin cast the first stone…

      Get thee out of my house.

      Pay special attention to that last one, Lawrence.

      Nov 18, 2008 at 11:53 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry [Different person #1 using similar name]

      you and other nits say separation of church and state there never was any ammendment like that this is what is said READ IT:1,ST Congress shall make NO law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
      THE PROBLEM IS WE HAVE A LOT OF ILLITERATE PEOPLE INCLUDING JUDGES WHO CAN NOT READ PROPERLY,OR THAT DO NOT EVEN KNOW THE MEANING OF SIMPLE WORDS AND NEED TO START OVER IN KINDERGARTEN AGAIN! AND WHEN THEY GET IT WRONG SLAP THEIR KNUCKLES WITH A RULER LIKE IN THE DAYSWHEN i WAS IN SCHOOL . YOU GOT IT RIGHT VERY SOON!

      Amendment II,

      Nov 19, 2008 at 12:13 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry [Different person #1 using similar name]

      @AJC: THAT PRINCIPAL IS STUPID ,First the Government says that we have to watchover our minor children ,then they make an illegal law like prop4 ,talk about screwed upo minds those are the ones that need to be horse whipped and put in oprison for interfering with family matters ,it is not the stupid governments or family planning to murdrer those babies before they have a chance at their life !you better hope that they have a huge capascity for forgivness,or your dead already!

      Nov 19, 2008 at 12:20 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry [Different person #1 using similar name]

      @Jonathan: Sir you are a fool God said that by your poor choices you have made your own bed of nails !

      Nov 19, 2008 at 12:31 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      @Rev larry:

      I’m very sorry Rev, your comments are strung together very poorly, maybe if you actually had better arguments they would flow better.

      Separation of church and state IS a widely accepted legal policy derived from the first amendment, it is not used in the amendment, but Thomas Jefferson used in a letter.
      I think this is pretty weak coming from a christian, I mean look at the bible, even if it was true principles are drawn from stories in the life of Jesus.

      I could provide as weak an argument as that by saying the word homosexual was never in the bible, but wait, it was put there by a publisher not that long ago, and queerty covered it. Just think, that is now, and think of all the translations.

      You missed the point, you should keep your beak out of “state” relations, I suspect it was the fear and hate, added to by ministers like yourself that brought this situation about. One where the rights of homosexuals are pissed up against the wall.

      Quite funny to see you throw your toys out of the pram Rev, you’re maybe not the best person to try and convince us we are wrong. I see you claim I am not acting in any “rational” way, exactly what gives you the right to say this? I am acting rationally, you are the one preaching on a website which contains soft porn, give it a rest!

      Nov 19, 2008 at 5:37 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      @Rev larry:

      I’m very sorry Rev, your comments are strung together very poorly, maybe if you actually had better arguments they would flow better.

      Separation of church and state IS a widely accepted legal policy derived from the first amendment, it is not used in the amendment, but Thomas Jefferson used in a letter.
      I think this is pretty weak coming from a christian, I mean look at the bible, even if it was true principles are drawn from stories in the life of Jesus.

      I could provide as weak an argument as that by saying the word homosexual was never in the bible, but wait, it was put there by a publisher not that long ago, and queerty covered it. Just think, that is now, and think of all the translations.

      You missed the point, you should keep your beak out of “state” relations, I suspect it was the fear and hate, added to by ministers like yourself that brought this situation about. One where the rights of homosexuals are pissed up against the wall.

      Quite funny to see you throw your toys out of the pram Rev, you’re maybe not the best person to try and convince us we are wrong. I see you claim I am not acting in any “rational” way, exactly what gives you the right to say this? I am acting rationally, you are the one preaching on a website which contains soft porn, give it a rest!

      Nov 19, 2008 at 5:37 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry [Different person #1 using similar name]

      @fredo777:all
      The sins that are pointed out are those which The Lord wants you to repent of ,I am not throwing stones only Gods word for your own good!If you listen!
      judgement is given unto the son But vengance is mine saith the Lord
      Your house is built on sand and it will not stand so when someone sees you -no house!

      Nov 19, 2008 at 8:32 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry [Different person #1 using similar name]

      @B Nesbitt: To try to get a message to those who are in total danger is a hard thing to do ,there is a place in Saudy Arabia where they get rid of people who go against Islam ,and those who are killed are homosexuals ,christians and any other that they do not like here is the small picture and they intend to put shariah law into effect in this country and already have started in the banking systemeven though it is illegal to do so!and they will come after you and I becasue we are the enemy!
      CBC News: the fifth estate – A State of Denial – Justice in Saudi Arabia
      Saudi Arabia also has one of the highest rates of executions in the world. … carried out in public in what’s know to locals as ‘Chop-Chop’ Square in Riyadh. …go online and do a little look up then get after your representatives to stop this just like I have been trying to do, YOU REALLY DO NOT UNDERSTAND, i DO NOT HARBOUR ANY ILL WILL TO YOU ,BUT IF YOU WANT TO LIVE EVEN IN THIS COUNTRY YOU MUST GET YOUR CONGRESS AND REPS,TO DO WHAT IS REALLY LEGAL THIS GARBAGE ABOUT THE FIRST AMMENDMENT AND THE SECOND AMMENDMENT IS JUST THAT ,SOMETHING FOR THE MASES TO ARGUE ABOUT WHILE THEY (THE GOVT.) PULLS THEIR CRAP ON ALL OF THE REST OF US! i MAY HAVE A PROBLEM GETTING A FLOW OF IDEAS BUT I DO NOT HAVE ANY PROBLEM WITH TRUTH LLIKE SOME DO! THESE PEOPLE THAT ARE IN THE GOVT ARE OUT TO RUIN YOU AND EVERY ONE ELSE THAT THEY CAN ,NOW IF IT IS NOT TOO LATE DO SOME REAL GOOD IN THIS COUNTRY AND TRY TO STOP THIS TAKE OVER!Including the trade agreement that bush signed for the unification of cnada ,the USA and mexico when that deal is done that treaty does away with our freedom! If you do not believe that then you might as well dig your grave now becasue they are going to ,I do not think that you are a stupid person just a little foolish none the less do some real research anduncover every ones eyes!

      Nov 19, 2008 at 9:05 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry [Different person #1 using similar name]

      @Angelo Ventura:what you need to do is ask for forgivness immiediately it may be to late already, you never ,never blaspheme Gods Holy spirit and get away with it ,I pity you in your darkness!

      Nov 19, 2008 at 9:19 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry [Different person #1 using similar name]

      @revlarryshutup:NO you wont see me there unless it is to ask me for a drop of water ,but there isno escape unless ,you repent!your lnguage gives you away!you need Jesus Christ who died (lay down his life for you) and then rose again!in a court of law in our country you only need one un impeachable witness, to prove a case ,in the case of Jesus there were thousands of un impeachable witnesses ,,the only thing stopping you is you would rather hang on to a filthy rag than get something new and inviting! “If you would accept it” , your sins are forgiven,

      Nov 19, 2008 at 9:29 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry [Different person #1 using similar name]

      @chadnnocal: hitlers quotes make sense only to those who have no truth in them”

      Nov 19, 2008 at 9:31 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry [Different person #1 using similar name]

      @chadnnocal: it seems kind of irrational to quote someone who commited suicide!or perhaps you are trying to emulate him?

      Nov 19, 2008 at 9:34 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry [Different person #1 using similar name]

      @revlarryshutup: what you say may be so but guess what Islam is abut to close your book ,please do some research,they hate you just because you arent their color and religionandthey said they would gut you in the street so Iwould suggest that all of those who are gay and those who are “N’s” better work together or you will all be out of gas,,dont be blind ,that is why we have at this time a some what ffree country ,but we must work together ot else—————-

      Nov 19, 2008 at 9:40 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry [Different person #1 using similar name]

      @Straight Ally: you are foolish whether you believe it or not God is still in charge and HE still said that man shall not lay down with man ,as he does with a woman! or isnt that clear enough! Also every nation that became corrupted by homosexuality was destroyed , what do you think, that it is a mystery? GOD will do the same to any other nation who does likewise!

      Nov 19, 2008 at 9:48 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry [Different person #1 using similar name]

      @froggyola: because when you die youwillgo to a place where few in this world have ever seen !It is called hell ,there is also a place called outer darkness I have seen some of it and been there ,in the spirit several times !The Lord of my hope said it was at that time that “Gold is purified by fire and silver is beaten out” I have had both ! The Lord said that we must “love our neighbor as ourself””Agape love” I am sure that you don’t understand that it is my business to see that a soul that is going to hell ,is saved ,if possible!Only Gods spirit can do that Soo I try to warn those who think that they know what they are doing !

      Nov 19, 2008 at 10:01 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry [Different person #1 using similar name]

      @Stenar: DONT YOU KNOW THAT YOU CAN BE ARRESTED FOR TERRORIST THREATS ! BY WHAT YOU SAID?

      Nov 19, 2008 at 10:03 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry [Different person #1 using similar name]

      @revlarryshutup: i ALWYS WONDERED where that saying came from and where some think that their ancestors were monkeys ,now I see where it came from it was your lineage and some are still up there!

      Nov 19, 2008 at 10:08 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      @Rev larry:

      Dude.

      This is not a bible study blog. If we wanted to read that, we’d go to one.

      And if God wanted to force us all to be christians, we wouldn’t have been given free will in the first place.

      Go away.

      Nov 19, 2008 at 11:43 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      I think your true colors are shining through pretty clearly now, I talked to you like a reasonable human being, and I will continue to do so, despite the fact you cannot answer a question directly, and ignore points raised.

      Please don’t reply to me trying to dodge the point and rant about sharia law, your techniques of avoidance and fear will not wash with me!

      You rant about Islam for some unknown reason, I am well aware of the terrible crimes that occur in the name of Their god. Don’t wash your hands of the lives taken in the name of your god, christianity did not only spread through “peaceful means.”

      So really it’s a question of the religion you know, or the religion you don’t.

      Your trashing of the first amendment is dangerous to say the least, the US principles are supposed to determine how the country is goverened, but it seems to me that you are fine with religion dictating, so long as it is christianity.

      To try to get questions answered by those who are, well, not willing to answer them, is a hard thing to do!

      Jeez preaching fear on a website which contains soft porn, give it a rest!!!
      Now please either “sh*t or get off the pot.”

      Nov 19, 2008 at 12:08 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      That was obviously @Rev larry:

      (don’t want to give this person a reason to avoid posts:P Not that he needs one)

      Nov 19, 2008 at 12:11 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • fredo777
      fredo777

      @B Nesbitt:

      I’d love to give him a reason to avoid posts. Or the entire blog, for that matter.

      Nov 19, 2008 at 1:49 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      @revlarryshutup: How do you figure that Prop 8 only affects gay people ? It will affect this whole country ,becasue God is not blind or deaf ,as far as the first ammend ment it was put the way it was so that the government could not make any law concerning a religion or say to someone you must go to that church !I still do not understand why you are not interested in truth ,not my truth truth that has taken down every nation that ever used fiolence and every other kind of perversion as a way to conduct itself! Hitler fell for that very reason ,He started out catholic and ended up worshiooing false Gods

      Nov 22, 2008 at 6:45 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nssbitt
      B Nssbitt

      @Rev larry: Surprise, surprise, again with the avoiding posts! You’re losing it Rev; also, spell check??
      It may be BS, but at least make it readable BS!

      Nov 23, 2008 at 9:55 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      oh look Fredo777, he didn’t need a reason after all. Sorry about the typo in my name peeps.

      Nov 23, 2008 at 9:57 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      What is the diff ,if it isnt spelled correctly since you would not know the truth any way! The problem is that you all think that I get something from trying to warn others about what they think is idle talk ! But whether you believe it or not I do care !Although it might not matter to you ,”you say” and whether you believe in what i have said guess what The word that I have written will get you just the same, I onlly wish that you would get some sense in your head and quit hating every one including yourself, that iswhy you will not listen ,The hatred,and mockery of all things that are good and marvelous like God your creator made them ! one thing for sure ,you can never say That you haven’t been warned ,and it will be your own free will that put you where you are going !when you find out that I am right try to remember That and Ask God through Jesus Christ to save your soul, because where ever you are there HE is also !May God bless and make you whole !

      Nov 25, 2008 at 4:19 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      “if it isnt spelled correctly since you would not know the truth any way! ”

      @Rev larry: Oh rev, we have had this already. No one said/will say that dear old Rev Larry didn’t warn us!

      “if it isnt spelled correctly since you would not know the truth any way! ” …
      I am not saying that spelling changes the message, but your posts are a rant of bad spelling and poor punctuation; this does not do you any favors!

      How dare you, I do not hate as your rant implied. I am a valued member of my community and I serve it in my own way, through youth work, and saving lives at sea!

      “When you find out I’m right,” Rev let me tell you, everyone thinks they are right, it can lead them into doing what they think is right, and I respect that you think you are right, but I think what you are doing is perverse. You actually do have ( DENY IT ALL YOU LIKE, IT’S POSTED FOR ALL TO SEE!) a lot of hate in you.

      I wish I had a little bit longer here, but what’s the point, you will just miss the point anyway!

      Nov 26, 2008 at 11:18 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      With this year’s Thanksgiving holiday at our door, it is fitting that we ask an important question that has so much to do with our Constitutional liberties: What is the Separation of Church and State?

      Why is it fitting to ask this question as we approach the Thanksgiving holiday? Well, it’s precisely the Thanksgiving holiday that reminds us of the origins of the phrase, separation of church and state.

      In 1620, a group of Christian pilgrims known as the Separatists washed ashore in what came to be known as Plymouth, Massachusetts. They first left England to escape religious persecution there. They landed in Holland but realized Holland was not a place that allowed their faith to flourish. They set sail again; this time for America.

      When the pilgrims set up their colony in Plymouth, Massachusetts, they soon employed a policy that came out of their own struggles for religious freedom. They employed the first American policy of a separation of church and state.

      This may seem like a counterintuitive decision for a group of deeply religious people. However, the Separatists knew full well that when the power of the church is placed under the control of the government, the government then begins to mandate its own sanctioned religious practice. The Separatists had endured the religious persecution of the state in England and wanted to ensure that no such persecution would occur in America. Unlike the Puritans, who believed in establishing some form of a Theocracy, these Separatists, being true to their name, decided to separate the two entities of the church and the state so as to allow the free expression of religion to flourish. That is precisely what happened. Early America in the 1600’s saw many religious groups and sects set up colonies that were specifically designed for the free expression of their religion without government interference. That is what the separation of church and state is really all about: keeping the government out of the church’s business.

      Fast forward to the writing of our nation’s Bill of Rights in 1789. Founding fathers like Patrick Henry and James Madison knew that allowing a mandated government religious practice would stifle religious expression in the new nation. They decided to embrace what is the most harmonious balance between the federal government and the church that the world has ever seen. They wrote the First Amendment of the Constitution.

      In the First Amendment we see the balance between the federal government’s role in protecting religious practice and not coercing it. The First Amendment of the Constitution of the United States, which guarantees all Americans the freedom of speech, religion, press, petition and assembly, has this to say about religious practice: “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof…”

      The federal government cannot mandate a religious practice, nor can they prohibit religious practice. Unfortunately, in the last few decades we have seen many judicial rulings that demonstrate a desire to uphold the establishment clause of the First Amendment at the expense of the free exercise clause. This is completely contrary to the purpose of the First Amendment and a violation of it as well.

      The first major case that undermined the balance between the establishment clause and the free exercise clause occurred in 1947. In Everson vs. Board of Education the Supreme Court, led by Justice Hugo Black, an FDR appointee and member of the Ku Klux Klan, reinterpreted the meaning of the First Amendment of the Constitution. This decision set in motion an unconstitutional chain of events that has undermined our First Amendment liberties ever since.

      Just what did Justice Black and the other FDR appointees to the Supreme Court do? They hijacked a phrase used by President Thomas Jefferson, “separation of church and state,” found in a letter he wrote to the Danville Baptist Association in Virginia (1802). Jefferson’s letter was actually used by the court to limit religious freedom.

      By taking completely out of context the phrase used by Jefferson in his letter, “separation of church and state,” the Supreme Court ruled that the freedom of religious expression in the public square was a violation of the “separation of church and state” found in the Constitution. This is an astounding ruling, as the phrase “separation of church and state” is not even found in the Constitution.

      In 1947, the Supreme Court actually used Jefferson’s letter to the Danville Baptists as the basis for their decision, even though his letter is not Constitutional law. This is another example of the Progressive Bait and Switch tactic at work that I spoke of in my last article with Townhall.

      Another interesting fact concerning Jefferson’s use of the phrase, “separation of church and state” is its true meaning. Thomas Jefferson used this phrase as nothing more than a metaphor to express the First Amendment’s role as a protector of religious expression in the public square. So even if Jefferson’s letter was Constitutional law, Hugo Black and the other FDR appointees on the Supreme Court still misinterpreted the meaning of Jefferson’s letter and the separation of church and state.

      In his letter to the Danville Baptist Association, President Jefferson said he believed there was a “wall of separation” in the Constitution that was designed to keep the government from interfering in the affairs of the church, not a wall to keep free speech out of the public arena. Thankfully, the Supreme Court finally clarified what Jefferson truly meant in Lynch vs. Donnelly (1984) when they said that the phrase “separation of church and state” is nothing more than the opinion of Thomas Jefferson, a “euphemism” as they put it, not Constitutional law.

      While the 1984 case was a breath of fresh air to those who love liberty, the damage of the 1947 case has led to other terrible decisions that defy logic, reason and the Constitution itself. In fact, the 1947 ruling, in spite of being inaccurate and unconstitutional, has become part of the American collective consciousness.

      In what has become the most infamous Supreme Court ruling regarding religious speech, Engel vs. Vitale (1962), the Supreme Court reinterpreted the meaning of the establishment clause in the First Amendment and misused its authority to ban the free exercise of religion in schools. This is the famous school prayer case.

      Nov 29, 2008 at 2:42 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • Rev larry
      Rev larry

      Also you lie you can never save a life ! you may prolong someones life ,by the ggrace of God ,butSAVE IT? NEVER HAPPEN ONLT THROUGH jESUS cHRIST CAN A LIFE BE SAVED! :)

      Nov 29, 2008 at 2:46 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      Would it hurt to use a spellchecker?!

      @Rev larry:

      Firstly Rev, I don’t need a history lesson dear. I can’t believe how silly you are, twist it whatever way you want, I really don’t care, the truth remains. Not the truth you claim from your religion, or the truth any religion claims for that matter. You choose to preach fear and hatred, it may work amongst your flock, but here where everyone is allowed to have their own opinion, it is useless.

      Haven’t we seen this before?! Quoting history in order to gain the moral high ground? I Think his name was Bill!!!

      Secondly Rev, I am no liar! You are a disgrace! On the water, not so long ago, during the summer, I watched as a fellow coxswain pulled a child from the water, who was lying with his face underwater, after being knocked out by a boom. That child was saved, yes his life was prolonged (can’t argue with that, he, like us all will die someday), but you try telling that to him or his parents!

      You moved on from talking about my hate to calling me a liar, it’s clearly getting harder and harder for you to clutch at those straws!

      You keep spreading that hate amongst this lovely blog of gay news and soft porn, and I will keep up the rescue and youth-work, trying to ensure that young people grow up balanced, for example try to stamp out homophobia amongst them!

      Nov 29, 2008 at 8:13 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      @Rev larry:

      *Whistles*… ah good, peace and quiet!

      http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=eoVbihkZdLY

      Enjoy

      Dec 11, 2008 at 8:17 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • TAHEWITNESS42
      TAHEWITNESS42

      @chadnnocal: The trouble with all of you is that you seem to not read a lot did you ever read one of the one of the Greatest”western German philosopher,Fredrich Nietzsche,the reason s that western civilization works is because of christian values. Because some of these ideas seem to have taken on a life of their own ,we mighthave the illusion that we can abandon Christianity while retaining these Ideals. This illusion,Nietzsche warns us is just that . Remove Christianity and the Ideas will fall also.
      Consider europe,where secularization has been going on for at least 100 years .For a while it seemed that secularization would not affect Eu morality or its institutions. yet today there is a decline of the close family that made Europe great. Overall birth rates have fallen,while rates of divorce and out-of-wedlock births are up.
      Netzsche also warned that, with the decline of Christianity new radical ideas opposing Christianity would arise,the revival of eugenic theories even arguments of infanticide! Just look at Washington state,& Oregon ,otherstates also have put laws in for self murder already, The reason is thatthose things are against God and Christianity and are evil The eradication of Christianity and of Christianity, would mean the eventual extinction of the principals of human dignity. Considerhuman equality ,why do we hang on to it so dearly?The Christian idea of equality in God’s eyes is undeniably responsible, the attempt to get respect for equality purely on a secular basis ignores the vital contribution of Christianity, to its spread throught the worldit is foolishness to think that it would /could survive without continuing aid of a religious belief solely because if there is no heaven or hell then there is no punishment! If we cherish what is distinctive about western civilization then , what everyour religious convictions we should respect rather than denigrate its Christian roots!
      If you think not then read the letters and documents that our for-fathers wrote ! They also said “if the republic were to stand there has to be those in government who are governed by Gods laws in their hearts “!An unbeliever will seldom do what is right unless it serves himself in some way!

      Dec 21, 2008 at 5:26 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • B Nesbitt
      B Nesbitt

      *Yawn* did someone say something?

      Jan 9, 2009 at 6:31 pm · @ReplyReply to this comment ·
    • George P Metesky
      George P Metesky

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    • rockettube
      rockettube

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      Apr 4, 2011 at 10:46 am · @ReplyReply to this comment ·

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