“The stigma associated with HIV is one of the main reasons HIV/AIDS is still spreading at an alarming rate in some parts of the world.
The images that were burned into our memory from the 1980s and 1990s were effective at shocking people back then but we haven’t moved past that and for many, when they think of or hear the letters HIV, that is all they know.
It shocks me and saddens me that within the younger gay community there is so much stigma and discrimination towards those of us live with HIV.
To be asked if I am ‘clean’ when it comes to inquiring about my sexual health and overall health is not only offensive but it’s incredibly ignorant.
How about we take this to the next level?
Our newsletter is like a refreshing cocktail (or mocktail) of LGBTQ+ entertainment and pop culture, served up with a side of eye-candy.
It’s time we have a new and very real conversation about what it means to be HIV-positive in this day and age and hopefully by me telling my story I’m helping to facilitate that a little.”— ABC News reporter Karl Schmid in an interview with the Star Observer.
Chrisk
I don’t think that most younger gay guys think of themselves in terms of community.
Jaybyrd53
I totally agree. We had MORE community back in the early 80s and the 70s before it was ok to be gay and many were still in the closet. I was 15 in 1980 when I came out and unfortunately I saw many of my friends pass away within mths of finding out the were hiv+ around 1983 It was horrible. we had about 35 in our group of friends and by 1985 there was only 3 of us left and the other 2 are still around as well as me and were all negative, thank God. My point is that back then we were a much stronger community and the younglings these days dont have that. I was so lucky to have met the friends I had made because I had to leave school at 15 due to the bullying and name calling. it was horrible for me so when I lost those friends it was debilitating. sorry for the rant.
Lacuevaman
well said jaybird…. but they do have “social media”…. I thought that was a community….NOT.
Scout
Chrisk, I totally agree. There was a strong sense of community when there were gay bars where we could associate and make our friends over drinks. The AIDS scare of the 80’s brought us together and Gay Pride days meant something more than the latest trend.
Today, with fewer gay bars and a younger generation addicted to their devices for sexual conquests, the sense of community is much different and more fluid.
50 50
Karl is originally from Sydney and the community is very much alive in Australia. It was one of the first in the world to respond well to the original crisis, and has maintained a sense of identity and purpose, even in the social era.
HereIAm
Why are some HIV gays so easily offended or hurt by a simple question “Are you clean”? If you have to always depend on how others say or do in order for you to be happy, you are not going to make it in this tough world. Grow a spine, keep your chin up, and stand your ground. Just man up. It’s not that hard to be strong.
GetOffMyInternets
Typical troll response. How many other troll accounts do you have CastleSF/Windchime? How many times have you been banned?
HereIAm
StraighNNarrow if you have to know. Your consistently second-rate and mediocre responses are astonishing and — laughable. You may wish me to go away but it won’t happen. Sorry.
Umoja
Because U=U. Undetectable guys are untransmissable and this is not a medical fact that is validated by emotional language like “clean” or “unclean”
PinkoOfTheGange
with the level of OP I personally think you should be thankful for a second rate response. You will never get better unless you play with those that are better at some thing.
toronto
I guess, why are some gays so offended when asked “are you a chink or an n*gger?
Feels the same you douche
Yggdrasil
Why? Because it is an absolutely stupid question which displays a huge level of ignorance about HIV.
Why? Because people use it to stigmatize those of us with HIV, to justify their fear and ignorance.
Why? Because I shower every day. wash my hands for 30 seconds after using the bathroom, and wash my clothes when they are dirty.
Why? Because the term ‘clean’ reduces us with HIV to being ‘dirty’, as if we are untouchable, as if we deserve to be shunned, shamed, vilified, and treated as pariahs; stigmatized.
Why? Because a person who was just tested may still be infected with HIV and not know. Because a person may be avoiding their own responsibility by not getting tested and putting the burden for their health upon others. Because even if they got results 4 weeks ago between now and then no one has any idea (except that person) what sexual encounters and types of sex that person had which could leave them infected with HIV. Because the person asking might be lying about their own status out of shame or fear because others label them ‘clean’ or ‘dirty’. It is just a stupid question.
As to the toxic masculinity of your statement to “man up” … try living with HIV and the stigma people dump on us. For all I know you may be HIV+ and are just having a great life and not facing any stigma at all. If so that’s awesome for you. But for all too many in the HIV+ community, the stigma is real … and it hurts. That stigma leads to anxiety and fear and depression, and your statement to “Grow a spine”, displays a lack of compassion for others and empathy.
Others are not you. They are not required to be like you. They are not strong but they are still human beings worthy of kindness and care. I hope you’re never in a position to need the kindness of others, because no one is “strong” all the time in their lives.
HereIAm
Stop being so melodramatic Yggdrasil. My point is, if you and other HIV people need other people’s “compassionate” responses in order for you not to feel like a victim, then you are choosing to indulge in your victim mentality and let others control your happiness. The reality is, you only have two choices, be weak or be strong and the right choice has never been clearer to me.
supremebuddy
It amazes me at the callous remarks made by some in our so-called GLBTQ Community. Or possibly, the Russian trolls are at it again.
supremebuddy
Grow a spine? What give you the right to judge anybody. Your comments have been reported and hopefully you will be removed from commenting on this or anything again. You must be a real piece of work or just a bot trying to stir-up trouble.
GetOffMyInternets
@hereiam I am not StraightNNarrow I’m very gay. Go ahead and rate whatever responses I have as “second rate”. You’re a self hating troll with a mediocre self awareness. You don’t exist, you’re a moralizing troll who hates his community and is CONSTANTLY banned from the website, hence why this is what..,your 4th account? You hate hay people, how we live our lives, the issues we have. So either you yourself aren’t gay at all (much less Asian as I seem to recall your commenting on an article awhile back praising a white person doing yellowface) and are just some troll (like that fake Christian troll account who made headlines over her Taylor Swift tweet) or you’re seriously a lonely, self loathing, gay man who never stood a chance because his dates didn’t come with Thorazine. I don’t know why you even stick around because you hate the gay community and everything about it. All you do is complain about how disgusting we are and whining and whatever. Meanwhile you trash everyone and everything. Nothing is good enough for you, so please…when are YOU just going to shuffle off this mortal coil?
Lacuevaman
fool… what makes you think hereiam is referencing you? you’re an idiot and typical of the other idiots on this site… if anyone has any opinion unlike yours, you call them a troll.
Vince
@Lacuevaman. Oh please girl. Lol. Everyone and their mother knows that hereIam is the resident troll and has been at it for a long time.
Of course your thing is constantly attacking others so that makes you a troll I guess too.
GetOffMyInternets
@lacuevaman Your attacks are as pathetic as HereIAm. Of course you’d defend HereIAm as you yourself are another troll account. I don’t give a damn about his opinions but he’s an insufferable asshat and yes he *HAS* been banned from this website quite a few times. But as trolls do (you should know, your own diatribes of nothing sure mirror a previous account or two, so I’m sure you were a banned account too) he makes another account to promote his Jesse Helms moral authority. Proof positive he’s a troll. I also have a feeling he’s not Asian as he sure praised a racist yellowface performance once when discussing a movie. So, people having sex is so awful but his praise of a racist performance is telling, considering he referred to it as “oriental”. And personally I don’t care what you personally think of my opinions. You’re not even LGBT, you’re just a loser piece of garbage who wants to come mess with the queers. No one is impressed, I’m sorry your Grandmas basement gets boring at times. Call me whatever, but unlike you I’m not eating per diem and I’m perfectly happy in life. You yourself are free to leave anytime too.
Love ya Poodle!
Love ya Poodle!
Jaybyrd53
WOW that was quite a tongue lashing.
Lacuevaman
and they all responded n kind…..
Chrisk
@GetOffMyInternets. That reminds me. HereIam also used to go by “blackandHIV positive”. This shit head will do anything for negative attention.
Black Pegasus
How about you just do your job and stop defining yourself by your illness. Millions of people get out of bed each morning with chronic diseases and perform the rituals of their lives without the pomp and circumstance of victimhood. Take your meds and shut up! You are more privileged than the average man or woman living with HIV.
GetOffMyInternets
He’s talking about the assumption that because he has HIV, being asked if you’re clean basically means it’s assumed he’s filth if he’s got HIV. It’s hilarious because those same people asking that question, usually have HPV. If you’ve had sex, most likely you’re a carrier and extremely common. So NO ONE is technically “clean”. Don’t knock him for people’s ignorance dude.
o.codone
The question I have is WHY is this guy advertising his personal business in the workplace? I don’t go to work and tell everyone my cholesterol level or my blood sugar. Not only is that health talk BORING AS FU*CK, it’s nothing anybody at work wants or needs to hear. So, stop putting your boring personal sh*it on the table at work and maybe you’ll be better off for keeping your mouth shut.
Vince
@o.codone. oh gee. I don’t know. Maybe he wants to help others? Dumb.
MarathonBoy
“The stigma associated with HIV is one of the main reasons HIV/AIDS is still spreading at an alarming rate”
No, it’s spreading because people like this guy have anal sex with people who are infected and then, after getting infected themselves, have anal sex with uninfected people. For this to be going on in 2018. when everyone knows how HIV is spread, deserves stigma.
Vince
MarathonBoy. What are you doing besides a keyboard warrior full of bitter and bile? This guy is putting his face and reputation out there. At least he’s doing something. Ending stigma is a worthy cause.
Go back under your rock.
TARDIS75
Dude, have you ever heard of PrEP? If you take PrEP you have a 98% chance of staying HIV negative, and if your partner is HIV Undetectable, then the chance to stay negative is up toward 99.7%!
Get Educated! HIV and those with HIV shouldn’t be stigmatize! And as was mentioned above, some of us have a whole other bunch of issues, not an STD, such as HIV, and we are all stigmatized as well. That’s the way of the world. I’m a white, employed, and happy gay man with no issue with Poz guys…. learn the truth and get yourself educated!
GetOffMyInternets
I’m sure MarathonBoy has STD’s like HPV, as most people do. So quit moralizing dude, you’re a hypocrite.
HereIAm
MarathonBoy’s argument is that this guy should have known better. He is a white educated guy, possibly with a privileged background. The fact that he still became infected with HIV is indicative of a failure on his sex behaviors. Something went terribly wrong and it was not just the fault of the guys he slept with. He actively participated in a lifestyle that’s possibly less than stellar and he most likely had multiple sex partners. So in a way, he asked for it and now he got it. No big deal these days but come on. Own your mistakes.
gymmuscleboy
I agree
gymmuscleboy
@TARDIS75 PREP is very expensive to the taxpayer.
MarathonBoy
Responses to various commenters above:
– I have never had an STI in my life. If I did ever get one, I would see it as a failure on my part. My stupidity or negligence or recklessness would deserve to be stigmatized. And I could learn from the experience and ensure that it was never repeated.
– In response to the query “Well, what are *you* doing?” I respond that I have done and am continuing to do two things. First, I do not get infected with HIV. And second, I do not infect anyone else with HIV. I safeguard my health and those of other gay and bi men.
That places me in the very large majority of gay/bi men. The guy in the story above is in the minority.
– It’s great that we have PrEP now. But here we are talking about people who have become infected with HIV, so clearly they were not taking PrEP at the time they were choosing to have anal sex with infected persons. So yes, their behavior deserves to be stigmatized. Not them as people. But their behavior. It should be seen as something akin to driving drunk.
Also, with regard to PrEP, it should not be forgotten that it came about as the result of vast investment of societal resources – resources which might have gone to other purposes. So don’t pretend that it is a cost-free gift. Sustaining promiscuity is a costly affair. Also, it should be noted that PrEP does not protect against anything other than HIV. All other STIs are still waiting to take up residence in your body.
Jaybyrd53
nicely said!!
Vince
@MarathonBoy. So in other words. Blah, blah, blah. Babble, Babble, Babble. Yes you’re doing so much to help others. Lol
Lacuevaman
roll the tapes, break out the phuck-me-pumps…and gather ’round queens… once again y’all are losing the debate
Yggdrasil
When you fall from that lofty pillar you exist upon, the impact will be devastating and I hope that someone takes pity upon you, and shows you the compassion you lack.
pharaon.em.joe
What you said Marathon makes ZERO sense.
PinkoOfTheGange
That question predates the plague and it wasn’t just about STD’s but drugs too. When did it become unacceptable to ask it of a potential trick? “Clean” and “D&DF” were common personal ad tags.
Anyway the modern answer is, if you are HIV+, “undetectable on my last test…”
Now it might not be your best defense against STDs, but it is starting point.
Maybe I am just old…so get off my dichondra.
o.codone
everybody’s too busy to look that up.
Mr_Heffel
People need to be educated more, your better off knowing someone is undetectable then not knowing someone’s status. Practice safe sex and enjoy the chemistry. Just because someone is positive doesn’t make them filthy. There are plenty of negative assholes that do drugs and aren’t worth the time.
MarathonBoy
You don’t know anyone is undetectable. You only know that they say they are. Or at most, if they show you test results, you know only that they were undetectable as of the time of the test. When you indulge in promiscuity, you are putting yourself at risk. The best way to enjoy sex is in a committed monogamous relationship with an uninfected person.
HereIAm
MarathonBoy, your advice is likely falling on deaf ears. A lot of posters here are hardcore porn watchers and take pride in sleeping with different men with or without protection. I really don’t feel bad if these same guys get HIV or other diseases. You behave badly and God will show you the consequence you may have to deal with for the rest of your life.
Toofie
Marathon Boy likes porn so shouldn’t God smite him like you hope he does everyone else?
Chrisk
@Toofie. Yeah any God that hateful and spiteful I want nothing to do with.
Toofie
Exactly ChrisK
MarathonBoy
For the record, this discussion has everything to do with choosing a path that advances health and long-term happiness for gay and bi men. It is not about “God.” I am an atheist. You don’t need a deity to see that catastrophic consequences of promiscuity or how it takes vast societal resources to mitigate the harms of promiscuity.
This also has nothing to do with porn. Porn doesn’t spread HIV and arguably it can help men stay celibate while the find a relationship in which they can share sex with another person.
It is true that everything I say about monogamy and promiscuity is likely to fall on deaf ears among the dozen or so regular Queerty commenters. Not because they watch porn, but because they are deeply invested in a life of long-term promiscuity. It’s hard to tell men that they have wasted decades of their lives pursuing something that is bad. However, it is still worth commenting on these issues because our discussion will be seen by hundreds or thousands of men – now and over the years in which these threads remain online. They may never comment, but they will absorb from the comments a sense of what is normal and expected in the gay world. It’s important that they know that the dozen or so promiscuous men who comment here do not represent anyone but themselves.
Chrisk
@MarathonBoy. Ha. I just realized who you were. Danny595 or at least it was awhile back.
pharaon.em.joe
Marathon, are you sex shaming? Shame on you!
There are a lot of HIV positive individuals who engaged in “safe” sex and ended up getting HIV for reasons like condoms breakage or an open (unnoticeable) wound. You sound pretty judgemental. You probably think also that anyone who is infected by HIV should just die and not be given medication?
Not everyone is fortunate enough to find a soulmate or a partner to have regular sex with. Not everyone wants a monogamous relationship (this is true in our community and elsewhere).
The message here is that asking people if they are clean is offensive to them and other terms need to be used. The least you can do is respect it, and not judge.
gymmuscleboy
I wonder how many people had comments about this article but, like me, had their comments “moderated” (deleted). I guess we will never know.
iamru2
Maybe a little understanding from all sides is in order. Everyone is so quick to judge , condemn , pick fights, point fingers , it’s exhausting.
Vince
We have two or three trolls that are pigs in slop when it comes to these kind of posts. You just have to get used to it.
GetOffMyInternets
@HereIAm such assumptions, such a piece of garbage you are.
Jaybyrd53
I just want to say it is everyone’s right to ask that person you want to take home for sex if they are HIV+ or not. In Canada you can be charged for not telling someone about your hiv status especially if your having unprotected sex. It is not “ignorant” or “Offensive” to ask someone their hiv status It is however if you are HIV+ and dont tell someone and they become infected. That is offensive and ignorant. I plan on living for a long time and dont need that screwed up by someone who doesn’t tell they are HIV. Over the years I have had that happen at least 7 times over 20 yrs where I went home with someone and didn’t find out about their status until the next day or through someone who knew them. I am just extremely lucky I didn’t catch anything. Even my last partner lied to me for 5 yrs about his ststus and as soon as I found out I stopped having sex with him and have not had sex with anyone since and thats 7yrs now. I would rather be single for the rest of my life than to have that lie told again.
Vince
So what you’re saying is that you’re a bareback slut or just a complete dumbass. Probably both.
I don’t worry about it because I treat everybody the same as being positive.
pharaon.em.joe
Yes, it is everyone’s right to ask about your status. However the problem is how you ask about it. You either have not really read the thread or you are extremely stupid. On another note, as of 2 weeks ago, Canada’s supreme court is on its way to decriminalize non disclosure of HIV status under certain conditions.
Chrisk
gymmuscleboy
MarathonBoy
o.codone
HereIAm
Lacuevaman
Queerty trolls. My guess is that it’s no more then two posting though.
Creamsicle
Maybe this is me being the dumb one, but I always thought that ‘clean’ was a truncation for the phrase “clean bill of health,” and that it got shortened over time.
PinkoOfTheGange
Me Too.
kevin57
So many of the HIV-shamers miss the main point of the article, that the use of the words “clean” and “dirty” are unnecessary and experienced as painful. Why inflict pain when making such a small change such as a different word could avoid it? I’ve said this many times here (and on other sites), those who contract HIV, yes, generally need to accept some responsibility for having it…but so do those who get cancer, diabetes, and a host of other conditions/illnesses. So many of our medical conditions are caused by our “choices” (what we drink, eat, smoke; how much we sleep or don’t, etc.). Life happens; people make mistakes. Let’s grow our hearts a little. After all, it could be your mother, or yourself, who comes down with cancer. Would you want people judging you as “diseased” and defective for your “choices”?
MarathonBoy
I agree that it is unnecessarily hurtful, but you are talking about people who are seeking out complete strangers for sex in a cold, almost predatory, marketplace. It isn’t kind or humane or caring. Why would you seek out people to use as meat, or who wish to use you as meat, and then expect, in this one particular area, for those same people to treat you as a full person?
GetOffMyInternets
@MarathonBoy You myopic drop of dribble piss. You FLAT OUT are basically saying that people with HIV were promiscuous. I hope you get hit by a bus.
Second you don’t seem to get what I said about HPV. Pretty much ANYONE who has EVER had sex, or done an act of sex pretty much carries the HPV virus. Even mutual masturbation. It transfers. So if you’ve done anything sexual, by your own reasoning you *ARE* an infection. Like HereIAM (Hello Windchime and Castle SF!) you are a miserable self righteous asshat. Here you come moralizing (like that piece of shit) and pointing fingers. So either you’re mentally ill, or you’ve done so many horrible things in your own life that you need to trash others. You’re not perfect, you’re not a saint, and being a piece of merde like you are just proves you BOTH are flawed people. Hypocritical. And as for HereIAm discussing God’s judgement, that’s up to God. Not him, not you, not anyone. So kindly please take your miserable lives elsewhere, like your family we can’t stand you either.
313deny
@hereiam
Your coming off a bit self righteous. You give us two choices Stong or weak . Wow ,
That’s it ? As a gay man just newly 50 , ugh ?. I’ve have lived a much different life and experienced a much different world than you. From your dark judgemental tone I hope you will find some other way to give your options. It’s not helping anyone . And some advice for you comes from my long dead father “ careful to point a finger at another’s faults , because you have three fingers pointing back at you.
GetOffMyInternets
HereIAm is a troll account by some head case who has been banned here repeatedly because he’s a gash. Ban him, and then he comes back under a new name, same old fugly picture.
IanHunter
Seems as if the younger generations are more divided into cliques than a community or family
Mr_Heffel
its sad to read comments that are so negative and all to add fuel to their own self righteous fire.
I take back my comment about we are all adults; some of us are still stuck in high school