THE SHOT — Of course, you could argue the right to life doesn’t include the right to equality, but hey, we’re just in this for the flair. (via, via)
the shot
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Mike L.
This is a waste of material, of course they don’t care. As soon as that baby is born they stop being concerned. That’s why we have legislators wanting to cut free school lunches for kids who have nothing to eat, after school programs to keep kids out of trouble, free daycare, etc they don’t give a flying rat, only when they want to push their beliefs onto ppl do they do something that leads to that.
Cat Walker
this is stupid
Geoff M
Actually, this is rather smart.
eagledancer
There’s a fun short story set in the future where the “gay” gene has been identified. It opens with a young man wearing a t-shirt with a picture of the virgin Mary on it, waiting to meet his “John.” The concept–all the other Christian groups immediately abort if the baby is gay, but the Catholics are not allowed to do so. As a result, Catholic symbolism become what gays wear to identify each other…
oldgayvermonter
Check out a movie called “Twilight of the Golds” for a similar theme.
terrwill
As a Gay, I am quite thankfull the rightwing lunatics have the abortion drama to posture about. Because hating abortion and hating on the Gays are their two favorite pasttimes. If abortion went away all their vile venom would be pointed in our direction……..Mike L hit the nail right on the head. As far as abortion goes who is actually being aborted?? Its mostly lower income minorities, It is actually quite humorus when you think about it. The lunatics carry on their crusades to allow these people to be born, then they wish would go away once they were born,,,,,,,,
Mike L.
@oldgayvermonter: Thanks for that, I found it on youtube :)
dontblamemeivotedforhillary
The Radical Rapture Right-wingers’ mantra: “Save the Fetus but Kill the baby” is widely known.
Mike L.
@terrwill: So true yet so sad.
Latebrosus
@terrwill, you have obliquely revealed the implicit thought of rightwing lunatics: they believe that human sexuality exists principally to procreate. Thus, loud protests against contraception, abortion, and gays. Thus, no loud protests against polygamy, overpopulation, and the horrendous treatment of women around the world.
Fitz
Hey, I think selective abortions based upon sexual orientation are JUST around the corner. Besides… I don’t care about reproductive rights anymore. That’s a woman’s issue, and they voted for that homophobe Obama. Ain’t my problem.
Dingo
@eagledancer: What is the name of that story? Any one know?
Tommy T
If the fetus a woman wants to abort is gay, would you still fight for its right to be born?
mattismyrealname
Disclosure first. I won’t try to be clever or provocative. I’m a Bible believing, Australian Christian man and I’ve voted Labor all my life.
I don’t know what American Christians are taught in their churches, but the clear answer to the question posed, if you asked any Christian that I know, would be yes, of course. If I knew that a fetus would develop to be a gay person, would I defend its right to life, of course. All people are made in God’s image and so have fundamental dignity.
Great way to frame the discussion though. Very thoughtful.
Zé
First of all: there’s no such a thing as a “gay fetus”.
Second: as human beings, both have the same rights. More than that: laws always treat the weaker more carefully. Is there any weaker phase in human life than the one the fetus is in?
(I’m not a native English speaker, so please excuse possible English mistakes)
Angelo
My answer is YES. But how can you fight for their equality rights without fighting for their right to life first?
There can be no equality without life.
john doh
@Angelo: Fight for the rights of people already born. So the future generations (to be born) can enter a world with full rights.
Tony Bullard
This raises an even scarier question:
If we can show that a fetus is gay, would pro-choice folks still defend the choice of a mother who wishes to abort her child because she doesn’t want a gay child?
michael
‘the fetus you save’
When you put it that way, yes.
Realist
This is based on the false premise that being homosexual is genetic. As of yet there is no proof that homosexuality is genetic. Scientists have mixed views between nature vs nurture. My personal opinion is that being homosexual is a choice that you have a right to make. No one is born gay.
romeo
We’re born gay.
Lukas P.
@Realist: Scientists have yet to “prove” that being heterosexual</b" is "genetic."
Tony Bullard
To those arguing that homosexuality is genetic, what is your answer to my question posted above?
“If we can show that a fetus is gay, would pro-choice folks still defend the choice of a mother who wishes to abort her child because she doesn’t want a gay child?”
Promoting the idea of genetic homosexuality AND abortion can lead to some very scary places.
Damien
I will go ahead and reply as a pro-choice person that if a woman wanted to have an abortion because her child would be gay, then so be it. Though unfortunate of her prejudices, she should absolutely still have the choice. The world is over populated enough and with too many children being born with parents who have no love to give or are not ready for them. I don’t think promoting someone to bring a child into this world if they will not love them unconditionally is a right thing to do.
Drew
Short story about this:
http://www.theanti-libertarian.blogspot.com/
JD
Yes – If God allows for your life to come into existence, then you should be allowed to not waste your life and live for Him since He’s the one who even gave you life. Who are we to not give someone the chance to love and be loved by a God who infinitely loves them?
“For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.”
Romans 6:23
“For one will scarcely die for a righteous person—though perhaps for a good person one would dare even to die— but God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.”
Romans 5:7-8
Don’t you see? Our sin’s wage is death. Christ (who had no sin, 2 Corinthians 5:21) took that upon himself in our place so we could be with Him, a perfect God in a perfect Heaven. As it is written, “the just shall live by faith.” So what are you going to do?
Isaiah 53:5-6
John 3:16
Romans 1
Hebrews 9:27
MoonChild02
Everyone deserves to live, no matter who they are! As a pro-lifer and Catholic, if a fetus were found to be gay, I would still support it’s right to life.
However, there is no gay gene. The fact that there are people who are ex-gays shows this. The fact that they found that the brains of gay people looks different from straight people is all because behavior changes how the brain looks. In fact, the doctor who took homosexual behavior off of the list of the APA’s list of mental disorders, Dr. Robert L. Spitzer, M.D., has a newer study that shows that it is possible to become ex-gay through reorientation therapy, “Can Some Gay Men and Lesbians Change Their Sexual Orientation? 200 Participants Reporting a Change from Homosexual to Heterosexual Orientation,” Archives of Sexual Behavior, 2003. However, the APA says that it is “impossible” and “unethical” for a psychologist to help anyone who wants to change their homosexual orientation, and therefore anyone who tries can lose their license.
Furthermore, a person doesn’t have to be straight to be pro-life. Have you ever heard of the Pro-Life Alliance of Gays and Lesbians (PLAGAL)?
A person doesn’t have to be Christian, such as in the case of the Atheist and Agnostic Pro-Life League and the Jewish Foundation for Life. A person doesn’t have to be right-wing, such as in the case of Democrats for Life and Libertarians for Life.
Being pro-life is not about religion or any other ideology. It’s about basic human rights – the right of the child to live and the right of the mother to not have to abort just because they are coerced into it or are not in the right situations in their lives.
However, “pro-choicers” don’t allow pro-lifers to counsel women entering clinics, allow women to be dragged into the abortion clinics against those women’s wills, emphasize abortion to the women in the clinic, try to shut down or stigmatize crisis pregnancy centers, won’t allow pro-lifers to lobby in their own favor, file lawsuits of “discrimination” against pro-life activities and activism on college/university campuses, remove videos from You Tube and other video sites that show stings against abortion clinics that are operating and acting illegally, and even lobby against things such as the Born Alive Infants Act, Silent No More Awareness and pro-life commercials. They also blatantly ignore or try their hardest to discredit studies that show the adverse effects of abortion because they believe that it will take away their “choice”! They also have politicians file injunctions against those who want to prosecute abortionists who have killed women or botched a procedure! If these abortionists were any other kind of doctor, they would have had their licenses taken away after such violent deaths and injuries, like those of the patients of Hodari and Rutland! Rutland should NOT be practicing! Even the California Medical Association says so! However, a pro-choice judge REFUSES to hear about it!
I would think that you all would want women to have the BEST care possible, and allow women to have full information in order to make the choice of life as well! However, you’re all so stuck on your “right to choose” abortion that you go through so many underhanded tactics to stifle the voices of those who have been hurt by abortion those that are trying to help women have the best care possible and help them make the right choices!
Therefore, I believe that the hypocrites are NOT those in the pro-life movement, but those in the so-called “pro-choice” movement. You blatantly promote abortion and ignore life and everyone’s right to have life and choose life, and for that it’s obvious that you’re not “pro-choice”, you’re pro-abortion!
schlukitz
No. 16 · Angelo
There can be no equality without life.
And there can be no meaningful life without equality. Just a poor excuse for it.
schlukitz
No. 26 · JD
Why is it that folks like you can never make an informed and logical contribution to any discussion without dragging religion into it as an excuse to make numerous bible quotations?
Are you even capable of having a rational thought of your own creation?
James
of course…
if we wouldn’t kill them after they are born, they should never be killed before they are born. that’s the standard prolife position.